Where to get a puppy....please help!

shivs

We have finally decided that our clan are old enough and responsible enough to have a puppy. We have decided that a Cavalier King Charles best suits, BUT WHERE do we go to get one?

I have written on 3 separate occasions to the IKC requesting a list of registered breeders in our area (Cork), but they haven't answered.
I have seen dogs advertised, but am reluctant to go down the donedeal route.

Please, please help....

star-pants

Have you tried ringing the IKC?

Also on their website here if you scroll down there's an entry for the Cavalier King Charles club, the lady in question may be able to help.

fend

http://www.irishdogs.ie

Left hand side, press puppies, and then the centre of a page, "Fine a dog"

andreac

Cavalier King Charles Spaniel Club
Mrs. E. Hurley
14 Grange Park View, Raheny, Dublin 5.
(01-8481621)

Try contacting this lady, her name is Evelyn and she should be able to point you in the direction of some breeders in your area.

EGAR

It may come as a surprise to you but even alot of puppy mill pups are IKC reg'd . If you have done proper research on the breed then you know it is plagued by many genetical diseases and you must get a breeder who does health testing with the parents to cut out some of the problems they have.

Also, make sure the pup is from an epilepsy free line, epi is a curse for that breed.

quinnthebin

shivs wrote: »

We have finally decided that our clan are old enough and responsible enough to have a puppy. We have decided that a Cavalier King Charles best suits, ..

From personal experience - lovely natured dogs but damn difficult to toilet train :eek:

Just to give you a headstart with what to expect

We went the donedeal route but IKC registered, chipped etc

shivs

Thanks for all the replies......that was fast!!!
Really appreciate the advice, will call Evelyn and see how it goes. Seems like a minefield between genetics and toilet training!!!!

lrushe

The IKC is the best route to go down but as mentioned there can be some doggy breeders there too.
I don't want to put you off the breed if this is the one you have your heart set on but as some have already said there are a few health problems associated with the breed so I would implore you to do your research, don't be afraid to ask a million questions of a breeder (a good breeder won't mind) and best of look with your new family member.

shivs

lrushe wrote: »

The IKC is the best route to go down but as mentioned there can be some doggy breeders there too.
I don't want to put you off the breed if this is the one you have your heart set on but as some have already said there are a few health problems associated with the breed so I would implore you to do your research, don't be afraid to ask a million questions of a breeder (a good breeder won't mind) and best of look with your new family member.

Thank you so much for your reply.....Very much appreciated. We ARE open to any recommendations - the only reason we chose the King Charles, was because our neighbour said they were a "grand family dog!"

We need a "grand family dog", who can go for runs with my husband, be playful with the children (who are aged 12-7, so not babies) and who can become part of the clan.

Any suggestions would be most welcome and thank you for your help so far

lrushe

shivs wrote: »

Thank you so much for your reply.....Very much appreciated. We ARE open to any recommendations - the only reason we chose the King Charles, was because our neighbour said they were a "grand family dog!"

We need a "grand family dog", who can go for runs with my husband, be playful with the children (who are aged 12-7, so not babies) and who can become part of the clan.

Any suggestions would be most welcome and thank you for your help so far

Well if you have no preference on a particular breed I'd try a rescue. Your dog will come behaviour checked, spay / neutered, chipped, injected and wormed. The resuce will try their best to match you and the right dog up, you can meet the dog and spend sometime with it before deciding on whether or not the dog is right for you and your family. Plus the added benefit of a mixed breed dog is they are generally healthier, of course resuces often have pure breeds if that is your desire.

shivs

Thanks Irushe,

Maybe we can give that a try. I really appreciate you taking the time to advise me.
My husband has his heart set on a purebred, so he will take a lot of convincing....it's not a snobbery thing, he's just a bit apprehensive re. the parentage of the dogs (esp with the kiddies)

lrushe

shivs wrote: »

Thanks Irushe,

Maybe we can give that a try. I really appreciate you taking the time to advise me.
My husband has his heart set on a purebred, so he will take a lot of convincing....it's not a snobbery thing, he's just a bit apprehensive re. the parentage of the dogs (esp with the kiddies)

I have 3 pure breeds myself so I understand that its not about snobbery. Just a note on parentage though, it will have v.little to do with how your dog turns out, it is 90% about how its raised, this would be the case with both pure and mixeds breeds. Best of luck

Magenta

shivs wrote: »

the only reason we chose the King Charles, was because our neighbour said they were a "grand family dog!"

OP if this is all the research you have done on the King Charles then you should know that they are absolutely riddled with health problems. 50% of them have heart disease by the age of 5 and syringomyelia is rampant. And I'm not just talking about ones from puppy farms- the "top pedigree" ones are just as bad.

I think you should have a look at Pedigree Dogs Exposed (BBC documentary) and see for yourself the problems this breed has. Far too many people buy them because they want a "family pet" and do not research enough into the many health problems this breed has.

shivs

lrushe wrote: »

I have 3 pure breeds myself so I understand that its not about snobbery. Just a note on parentage though, it will have v.little to do with how your dog turns out, it is 90% about how its raised, this would be the case with both pure and mixeds breeds. Best of luck

Really? Oh l had no idea.....that really changes things for us. I will be showing your post to hubbie in the morn. Thanks again! You've been a real help!

votejohn

Hiya,

If your getting a dog as a pup, as long as the kids respect it and handle it gently, chances are it'll grow up as a good family dog.

As others have said, CKC's are one of the breeds with serious health problems, but there are a lot of rescue puppies out there that are pedigrees.

The most striking dogs though are usually cross breeds, and cross breeds are generally healthier, as the dominant healthy genes are more likely to be passed on.

heres a site that only handle pups and young dogs, well worth a look. http://inistiogepuppyrescue.com/


I know everyone on this site is going to encourage you to rescue rather than buy, but I guarantee in the long run you'll be glad you saved your pup from a shelter than forked out big bucks for one!

EDIT: meant to say, if you do keep an eye on the rescue sites, and perhaps send them all an email saying your looking for a pup, when you do find a suitable match bring your hubbie to see it. chances are he wont be able to say no when the pups sitting infront of him!

shivs

votejohn wrote: »

Hiya,

If your getting a dog as a pup, as long as the kids respect it and handle it gently, chances are it'll grow up as a good family dog.

As others have said, CKC's are one of the breeds with serious health problems, but there are a lot of rescue puppies out there that are pedigrees.

The most striking dogs though are usually cross breeds, and cross breeds are generally healthier, as the dominant healthy genes are more likely to be passed on.

heres a site that only handle pups and young dogs, well worth a look. http://inistiogepuppyrescue.com/


I know everyone on this site is going to encourage you to rescue rather than buy, but I guarantee in the long run you'll be glad you saved your pup from a shelter than forked out big bucks for one!

EDIT: meant to say, if you do keep an eye on the rescue sites, and perhaps send them all an email saying your looking for a pup, when you do find a suitable match bring your hubbie to see it. chances are he wont be able to say no when the pups sitting infront of him!

Thank you for your post. Will definitely have a rethink about the rescue. That was my problem initially.....just doesn't feel right charging so much to home a puppy - just feel some are in it for a quick buck - we just need a family friend

suziwalsh

There is also Cavalier King Charles Rescue with tons of information on the breed

http://www.ckcsrescue.com

Also you can find loads of pedigree dogs and pups in rescue and a good site is

www.irishanimals.ie

There are many rescues that have their dogs in foster care homes so they are all very highly temperament tested.

Most important thing if you are buying or rescuing a dog is research!!! Loads of reading etc.

Find out the size of dog you want, exercise needs, food requirements, grooming requirements....etc

Best of Luck

shivs

Magenta wrote: »

OP if this is all the research you have done on the King Charles then you should know that they are absolutely riddled with health problems. 50% of them have heart disease by the age of 5 and syringomyelia is rampant. And I'm not just talking about ones from puppy farms- the "top pedigree" ones are just as bad.

I think you should have a look at Pedigree Dogs Exposed (BBC documentary) and see for yourself the problems this breed has. Far too many people buy them because they want a "family pet" and do not research enough into the many health problems this breed has.

Hi Magenta,

Truly, this isn't the only research we have done. This is the reason that l have asked (in my original post) for a reputable breeder which maybe could advise.

Also, if you can make a suggestion as to another breed we could consider, I'd be most grateful. But, first and foremost, we DO need a family dog and will definitely take health into consideration

Magenta

shivs wrote: »

Hi Magenta,

Truly, this isn't the only research we have done. This is the reason that l have asked (in my original post) for a reputable breeder which maybe could advise.

Also, if you can make a suggestion as to another breed we could consider, I'd be most grateful. But, first and foremost, we DO need a family dog and will definitely take health into consideration

Hi,
I would have to agree with everyone else and recommend a rescue. Any dog that is treated well and trained properly will be a good family pet. Dogs are brought to shelters/pounds for all kinds of reasons- their owner may have died, owner may be pregnant and decide they don't want the dog anymore, owner may buy a large breed puppy and then leave it to the pound because it "got too big", owner may have lost their job and no longer has the resources to care for the dog. Many rescues place dogs in foster homes so the fosterer can tell you exactly what kind of personality the dog has.
It's a great feeling to rescue an animal and it usually means you don't have to housetrain them either

shivs

Magenta wrote: »

Hi,
I would have to agree with everyone else and recommend a rescue. Any dog that is treated well and trained properly will be a good family pet. Dogs are brought to shelters/pounds for all kinds of reasons- their owner may have died, owner may be pregnant and decide they don't want the dog anymore, owner may buy a large breed puppy and then leave it to the pound because it "got too big", owner may have lost their job and no longer has the resources to care for the dog. Many rescues place dogs in foster homes so the fosterer can tell you exactly what kind of personality the dog has.
It's a great feeling to rescue an animal and it usually means you don't have to housetrain them either

Hi again....you have summed up exactly how l feel regarding a rescue dog. I DON'T want to be the one handing back a dog because they've grown too big/bit the postman/a child/become aggressive
Am actually beginning to feel really apprehensive about this....considering 'Sea Monkeys' LOL!

Do you know if there's a person to call who can help....we live in Cork. Thanks a million and apologies for the detail.......am more cautious than pre-babies!!!

Steve30x

I have a Cavalier King Charles and I would suggest thinking of another breed (Cross breeds are better health wise) She is only four months old and is already showing signs of Syringomyelia. She is scratching her head a lot. I thought her ears needed cleaning so I bought ear drops and cleaned her ears twice in the past week but she is still scratching so I am going to call the Vets for an appointment either thursday or friday to get her checked out.

Also 50% of Cavalier get heart problems by the ge of five and 80% of them have herart problems by the age of ten. This breed is riddled with problems and if you can deal with it or have enough money to keep the dog going to the vets or pay for constant treatments later on in its years then you wont be too bad in picking one up.

Magenta

Steve30x wrote: »

I have a Cavalier King Charles and I would suggest thinking of another breed (Cross breeds are better health wise) She is only four months old and is already showing signs of Syringomyelia. She is scratching her head a lot. I thought her ears needed cleaning so I bought ear drops and cleaned her ears twice in the past week but she is still scratching so I am going to call the Vets for an appointment either thursday or friday to get her checked out.

Also 50% of Cavalier get heart problems by the ge of five and 80% of them have herart problems by the age of ten. This breed is riddled with problems and if you can deal with it or have enough money to keep the dog going to the vets or pay for constant treatments later on in its years then you wont be too bad in picking one up.

Thats horrible. It's not just the money, it's the heartbreak of watching your dog suffering too.

OP you could have just the same problems with a puppy you buy as with a rescue dog. A lot of the reasons people hand in dogs are reasons that could easily have been resolved.

"We bought a new house"- take the dog with you. Most of them fit in cars.
"My landlord found out I bought a puppy and says I have to get rid of it"- you should have thought to mention it to your landlord BEFORE getting the puppy.
"I bought this dog when I was 6 months pregnant, I'm due soon and I can't have a dog around the new baby"- these are the ones that really annoy me.
"The dog got too big"- Well why did you buy a Labrador then?

As I say, most of the time, a dog comes into a rescue through no fault of his own.

You could talk with the rescues in your area and just explain what type of dog you are looking for. They are experienced in matching dogs with owners so should be able to help you pick a nice one

AddictedToYou

If you want a dog that the other half can go for a run with, and also good with kids, one idea would be a Labrador. Full of energy and excellent temperament. However, be prepared that Labradors will not stop eating if food is there, so you need to watch their weight. Had a black labrador myself for years and she was an amazing dog. Everyone who came to the house liked her best out of our three dogs.

We have a Springer Spaniel, Jack Russell, and had a German Shepherd too so ask away if you're considering any of these.

I'd also like to give another vote to getting a dog from an animal shelter..

shivs

Steve30x wrote: »

I have a Cavalier King Charles and I would suggest thinking of another breed (Cross breeds are better health wise) She is only four months old and is already showing signs of Syringomyelia. She is scratching her head a lot. I thought her ears needed cleaning so I bought ear drops and cleaned her ears twice in the past week but she is still scratching so I am going to call the Vets for an appointment either thursday or friday to get her checked out.

Also 50% of Cavalier get heart problems by the ge of five and 80% of them have herart problems by the age of ten. This breed is riddled with problems and if you can deal with it or have enough money to keep the dog going to the vets or pay for constant treatments later on in its years then you wont be too bad in picking one up.

Steve30x.......Thank you for the input-I really appreciate your complete honesty. I really hope that your dog is doing better by the time you read this. Sounds like you are doing all you can do for your dog. You have really highlighted the whole issue of owning a dog.

We would love a pup, we thought it would be simple, but reading your post, and your issues/concerns, it doesn't seemed so straightforward. (I'm not sure we put as much thought into our kids!!!!!!!)

OK.....HELP! A FAMILY/CHILD-FRIENDLY 12ISH-WEEK-OLD
ABOUT THE SIZE OF A KING CHARLES
NON-KID/POSTMAN BITER


STEVE30X- good luck and thank you!

Magenta

shivs wrote: »

OK.....HELP! A FAMILY/CHILD-FRIENDLY 12ISH-WEEK-OLD
ABOUT THE SIZE OF A KING CHARLES
NON-KID/POSTMAN BITER


STEVE30X- good luck and thank you!

You won't be able to tell if a 12 week old pup is going to bite children or the postman, it's how you raise it that counts

There's not that many puppies that young in rescue but there's so many that are 6-12 months.

shivs

AddictedToYou wrote: »

If you want a dog that the other half can go for a run with, and also good with kids, one idea would be a Labrador. Full of energy and excellent temperament. However, be prepared that Labradors will not stop eating if food is there, so you need to watch their weight. Had a black labrador myself for years and she was an amazing dog. Everyone who came to the house liked her best out of our three dogs.

We have a Springer Spaniel, Jack Russell, and had a German Shepherd too so ask away if you're considering any of these.

I'd also like to give another vote to getting a dog from an animal shelter..

Hi ya....thank you....love labs, but way too big for us (3-bed).V v V scared of German Shepherds, as was bitten by one-couldn't even be near one-am sure the dog would sense my lunacy!!!!

Does the Springer need loads of space?

Magenta

OP here is a link to IrishAnimals.ie they have a Homes Needed Section
This is for dogs in Cork & Kerry, you can also search by bred e.g. Spaniels, terriers

http://www.irishanimals.ie/corkkerry_homes.html

mymo

Would you consider a cocker?
Not much bigger and well able for the running, and the playing with kids.
We had one growing up and they're great dogs. Again you have to be careful with health checks(not as many problems as KC), but thats the same with all pedigree's these days.

cucoigcrice

Hi, just thought i would add to all the folks recommendations- if your are thinking about a cKC which are beautiful dog but as some1 already said have health problems get it insured asap as alot of them can run up big vet bills with medications.
On the other hand a rescue dog would be great as you are giving a dog whom could be put to sleep a 2nd chance.
I recommend a golden retriever i think they are a great family dog. i know alot of people may disagree but staffies can also make good family pets. Alot of people will say they have got bad press recently but believe me its not staffies, it is irish staff's which are actually pit bulls. but then again any dog can be aggressive it all depends on the owners.:D

AddictedToYou

shivs wrote: »

Hi ya....thank you....love labs, but way too big for us (3-bed).V v V scared of German Shepherds, as was bitten by one-couldn't even be near one-am sure the dog would sense my lunacy!!!!

Does the Springer need loads of space?

You gotta be able to handle the GSDs alright! Ours passed away at the end of December but getting another one soon hopefully, so on the hunt like you!

In general, Springers are known to be very energetic and require a good deal of exercise, but our Springer is ridiculously lazy:D I can't see any problem in them being kept in a three-bed, but do need to be taken on long walks everyday. They love playing fetch as it is their natural instinct as gundogs, and love walks in woods where they can sniff around. Excellent temperament too.

Also, maybe check out West Highland Terriers and Bichon Frises if you want a small dog. No personal experience to help you with though, but just came into my head as friends of mine have them.

Good luck!

shivs

Thanks so much guys for your input. We really appreciate your advice...am boggled! Still non the wiser....We don't need designer-dog, just a family pet, we can love.
Friendly/won't bite the postman/the kids/ can be left alone for 4 hours a day-3days a week/not too big

lrushe

I always fly the flag for the Japanese Spitz, not just because I own one but because imo they are a highly under rated family dog. My fella is almost 9 years old and is still full of beans so well up to going running still. I have my guy obedience trained which I found easy enough. They are a medium sized breed and compared to most breeds they are more or less illness free, other than a cut paw and his yearly check up I've never had Ben in a vet. They love their family, though they can be a bit stand offish with strangers. My fella loves to chase a ball and go swimming and is an all round smashing dog.:)
Some pics to give you an idea of how they look, Ben's the white one:
Brook & Ben1.JPG

Brook & Ben3.JPG

votejohn

lrushe wrote: »

I always fly the flag for the Japanese Spitz, ]

I walk a jap spitz and im absolutely in love with her, she's my only experience of the breed and she is just a joy! The most loving, friendly little doggie, trots along by my feet the whole time and gets on fab with every dog she meets!

Edit: those pics!! I dont know which dog i want to steal from you more!!!

Heres lilly, the little one I walk (loves to get dirty) http://www.creedonsdoggiedaycare.com/index-6.html

And another with a Samoyed I walk (little and large) http://www.creedonsdoggiedaycare.com/index-6.html#

Magenta

lrushe wrote: »

I always fly the flag for the Japanese Spitz, not just because I own one but because imo they are a highly under rated family dog. My fella is almost 9 years old and is still full of beans so well up to going running still. I have my guy obedience trained which I found easy enough. They are a medium sized breed and compared to most breeds they are more or less illness free, other than a cut paw and his yearly check up I've never had Ben in a vet. They love their family, though they can be a bit stand offish with strangers. My fella loves to chase a ball and go swimming and is an all round smashing dog.:)
Some pics to give you an idea of how they look, Ben's the white one:
Brook & Ben1.JPG

Brook & Ben3.JPG

Oh my god they are so beautiful!!!!!!!

Steve30x

shivs wrote: »

Thanks so much guys for your input. We really appreciate your advice...am boggled! Still non the wiser....We don't need designer-dog, just a family pet, we can love.
Friendly/won't bite the postman/the kids/ can be left alone for 4 hours a day-3days a week/not too big

How about a border collie. I know they arent lap dogs , but they dont get too big , they are very easy to train , they are very affectionate , theyre medium sized (Most of them grow no bigger than 18 inches) , theyre very loyal and they wont bite unless they are seriously provoked. I also have a Border collie and had one before. I can say they are very healthy and in my experience they are fantastic dogs.

looserock

Try a few sites like these,http://www.dogsindepth.com/index.html OR http://www.canadasguidetodogs.com/index.htm

The Canadian one is good, choose a breed, when the page comes up you have to click "Breed description and information" at the top of the page and you're off.

When you find a breed that suites, check out all the health issues etc and then you'll be more informed when you find a breeder.

lrushe

Steve30x wrote: »

How about a border collie. I know they arent lap dogs , but they dont get too big , they are very easy to train , they are very affectionate , theyre medium sized (Most of them grow no bigger than 18 inches) , theyre very loyal and they wont bite unless they are seriously provoked. I also have a Border collie and had one before. I can say they are very healthy and in my experience they are fantastic dogs.

My only gripe with a Border Collie is that they can be a little too intelligent for the average household. In novice hands and not properly simulated they can became distructive and even start to nip. Collies imo are more suited to a working or agility lifestyle, something that will challenge them daily. Again just my opinion!

Magenta

lrushe wrote: »

My only gripe with a Border Collie is that they can be a little too intelligent for the average household. In novice hands and not properly simulated they can became distructive and even start to nip. Collies imo are more suited to a working or agility lifestyle, something that will challenge them daily. Again just my opinion!

I agree, Border Collies in general are not suited to pet homes. Look up Border Collie rescues- they are VERY strict about who they home to because the dogs go mad with boredom- they are the most intelligent breed in the world- some rescues will not home them to people who do not own sheep.

animalcrazy

I have two terriers, one a jack russell, and the other a jack mix. I love them, best dogs ever. The mix loves kids, loves other people, adores all other animals, she is as ould as the hills now. The Jack Russell also loves kids sooo much, as soon as a kid comes into the house she wants them to play, she is energetic and loves walks, a little shy with adult strangers, but never barks at them, she has no problem with cats, but she will try and chase my rabbits, she is also good with poultry because she was raised with them.

As long as you don't live near a farm where people own chickens and such, I recommend a Jack Russell.

shanagarry

OP, the West Cork Animal Welfare Group is based in Clonakilty. Why don't you and your other half (leave the kids at home for the first trip, they will want every dog!) make an appointment to go see them and talk through your needs? They will be able to make targeted suggestions based on the individual dogs they have, rather than you having to go on various breeds' typical traits.

I would go with the recommendations above for a rescue, for the reasons mentioned, and also I think it's much better not to get a puppy as your first dog as it's a lot to take on. As others have mentioned, given your fears about safety etc, a lot more will be known about an older dog's temperament and it is likely to be a better fit for you.

Doc Farrell

wow, there's some great advice here! this is my first post on this particular forum so i hope you don't mind if i give u my thoughts.?

I can't own a dog at the moment but I help out my sister who has three and a cat! But i've had four dogs for their full lifespan. so here goes.

the temperment of the dog is the most important thing to you. the range in dog temperments is as wide as in humans. so if i was you i'd...

get a female, they are better around children, especially when they get older.

get a dog from a rescue centre, it will save you a fortune in bills as the dog will be spayed, most likely chipped, and will be in good health.

get a mongrel as they are more intelligent than pedigrees (thats just my opinion, every dog differs) i had a pedigree springer spaniel as a child and it needed a lot of exercise and wasn't very sharp, and it kept straying. in fact, i found a beautiful English setter deep in the wicklow hills a couple of years ago that had strayed or had been dumped. while i was getting him a home i'd take him for walks and he'd set off over the hills, it took me hours to get him back (well, at least an hour)

its important that both adults like dogs and that the dog likes you! why not go as a couple to a rescue centre and then use your intuition when meeting the dogs?

many breeds are trained wrongly and have bad reps! jack russells and other terriers! but they can be great around children if properly treated and trained (the males can be difficult when older) my girlfriend has two dogs, a crossbreed irish setter and a highland terrier, both terrific dogs but badly trained (i.e. not!) and viciously territorial!

if i had a choice i'd get two dogs because they like company but since u have kids one may be enough! i'd get a collie crossbreed, incredibly intelligent, my mum has a terrier mongrel and that dog, female, can almost speak! it certainly understands many different commands and is a great watchdog.

as this is my first post here I just want to say to those who help rescue and foster dogs here that you are the finest people in the world. and i haven't had anything to drink! this forum fills me with hope!

as the last poster said, there's a place in clonakilty, which, as you know as a Corkman, is one of the most beautiful corners in ireland. wonderful beaches around there, make a day of it! good luck!

edit: i'd personally get a collie crossbreed if i had a choice, hopefully in 12 months, but it may be too much for a family, sometimes a lazy dog is a good choice!

star-pants

Welcome to the forum, and I agree with some of your points but I must respond to the following

Doc Farrell wrote: »

get a female, they are better around children, especially when they get older.

Not always true actually, can depend on the dog itself. In fact some breeds are just generally better around children than others.

Doc Farrell wrote:

get a dog from a rescue centre, it will save you a fortune in bills as the dog will be spayed, most likely chipped, and will be in good health.

Yes rescue route is always encouraged, but - if money is an issue you shouldn't be getting a dog, they do cost a lot no matter how you get them. And you have to pay a fee/donation to rescue a dog, insurance, and so forth.

Doc Farrell wrote:

get a mongrel as they are more intelligent than pedigrees (thats just my opinion, every dog differs) i had a pedigree springer spaniel as a child and it needed a lot of exercise and wasn't very sharp, and it kept straying. in fact, i found a beautiful English setter deep in the wicklow hills a couple of years ago that had strayed or had been dumped. while i was getting him a home i'd take him for walks and he'd set off over the hills, it took me hours to get him back (well, at least an hour)

No offence, and obviously that's your opinion, but a LOT of people here will disagree with you. Certain dogs (mixed or pure) need a lot of exercise. Certain dog (mixed or pure) may not be overly bright. I've two pure bred Lhasas and I tell you they're very quick.
Regarding the English Setter, you let it off the lead in a large open area (without knowing if it was trained or not) and expected it to just know to come back to you? Not really his fault.

Dogs don't automatically know everything you want them to. You have to train them, this takes time and patience.

Steve30x

lrushe wrote: »

My only gripe with a Border Collie is that they can be a little too intelligent for the average household. In novice hands and not properly simulated they can became distructive and even start to nip. Collies imo are more suited to a working or agility lifestyle, something that will challenge them daily. Again just my opinion!

Magenta wrote: »

I agree, Border Collies in general are not suited to pet homes. Look up Border Collie rescues- they are VERY strict about who they home to because the dogs go mad with boredom- they are the most intelligent breed in the world- some rescues will not home them to people who do not own sheep.

Theyre not all that bad. The Guy I had before as a puppy done a bit of digging (Dont most puppies do that anyway) but grew out of that after two months. Once I brought him for an hour long walk every day and played ball with him in the back garden a few times during the day he was not destructive or nippy. The only time he nipped is if you seriously provoked him and let me tell you it took a lot to get him to nip at you. My sister had her kids (2 and 4 years old) over and they pulled and tore at him and he never once nipped one of them. He was a great guard dog though , but once he got to know you he would be a great friend.

Doc Farrell wrote: »

get a female, they are better around children, especially when they get older.

get a mongrel as they are more intelligent than pedigrees (thats just my opinion, every dog differs) i had a pedigree springer spaniel as a child and it needed a lot of exercise and wasn't very sharp,

Female or male dog , doesnt matter. Itsa how they are reared that matters. If the dog is reared wrong then they wont be great around kids.

As for your mongrel statement. In many cases you are right but some cases you are wrong. Mongrels are generaly healthier than a pure breed dog but for instance a Border Collie is one of the sturdiest dogs you can get. Also I dont agree with the Intelligence of all pure breed dogs not being intelligent. The Cavalier King Charles isnt the brightest of pure breed dogs but they are intelligent or the best breed you can get for brains is a border collie which is almost human like with their intelligence.

I got a second hand Play Pen for dogs and it had a bar missing under the door big enough for my cavalier to go through. The first night I got the play pen last week I had both puppies in there so that I could eat my dinner in peace , I was eating my dinner and next thing my Cavalier was over my dinner , so I picked her up and put her back in the play pen, ten seconds after I sat down I saw her getting out of the play pen again. She is very clever.

I saw a program called the secret life of dogs that shows a pure breed border collie that know the difference between 400 different commands. The dog was so intelligent that they had toys in another room and they showed the dog a picture of the toy , they sent the dog off to the other room and the dog brought back the toy that was in the picture from the other room. So you cant say all pure breed dogs are as clever as a breeze block. Yes cross breed dogs can be better sometimes but when it comes to the border collie you are wrong.

--amadeus--

In a not totally different set of circs to the OP so here's my take...

You are looking for quite a lot in your dog - for example one that will be active enough to run with your OH but be quiet around kids and ok in a normal sized house. I really think you should have a sit down as a family and decide on teh priorities. Likewise if you both work outside the home then that needs to be considered.

In our case we live in a semi with a pretty big garden. I run a lot and I wanted a dog that would be smart, good with kids and energetic enough to come with me but ok in the garden on his own occasionally during the day and that would be tough enough to be mainly an outside dog.

We got a lab/collie cross at about 6 mths old from rescue. He cost around €80 (donations and what have you) and is a total joy. Great with the kids (8 and 6 now but a lot smaller when we got him!), smart enough to be trained and trusted to run off lead and just a really well mannered, even tempered dog. He is a big lump of a dog, incredibly strong and muscular without any fat. And he eats a LOT. Good quality dog food for an active larger dog is pricey. If your OH runs a lot (4 - 6 days a week, 30+ miles) then thats a hefty workload for a dog and you'd be looking at a working or gundog breed. Remember that until a dog is 2 years old you can't run with it as teh joints are still forming.

We now have a baby springer spaniel, this time (for my wife) we went the breeder, pedigree route. Ironically the dog has more health problems than a dog from rescue and being significantly younger we're doing all of teh house training now, which is a pain. Likewise a slightly older dog tends not to cry as much at night (a big consideration if you have neighbours).

Research, research, research is the key to it all - because no matter how much you do (as I have now found out) committing to an animal is a complicated and serious commitment and there will be unexpected surprises. The more you know going in the smaller those surprises will be!

cazmcco

Hi!!

First off I would like to say that NO dog is born vicious, it is the way they are treated by humans that will decide that. So if you treat it well (which i have no doubt that you will) then you will have very little problems in that regard.

If your looking for a small family dog then you should prob be looking at a terrior mix. We have had two terrior mongrels for years (the mother is almost 12 and the daughter is 7 yrs old) and they were class growing up! Perfect for the house, unbelievibly intelligent (the mother loves going for drives and knows the sound of my keys over anyone elses in the house as im the only one that brings her!) and they have a lovely mix of being very energetic when we need company, but eqaully as quite when evening comes!

I dont know your family situation, but I would recommend two dogs regardless of how many children you have or how many hours they will be left alone (as long as you can afford them) simply becasue the are wonderful company for each other. We had the mother for a number of years before she had pups, she was the center of the family (even came on holidays with us ) and was rarely left on her own, but since we kept one of the pups shes like another dog and we wonder how she managed before!!

If your husband wants to bring it for runs etc then I would also recommend a lab.They may be on the big side, but if your husband runs regularily then alot of their energy will be spent on that. In my experience they are perfect for a family, energetic but also very very gentle and can be the laziest lumps when they feel like it !!!

good luck with your search!!!

Mollywolly

Can I just throw in my views on the CKC please? Everything I've read so far has been quite negative and the OP doesn't seem to have been given the positives - yet!

I've had mine, Molly, for just over eight years and I wouldn't part with her for all the money in the world. She is just about the most loving dog I've ever known and has never caused me a minute's worry. Yes, I am very aware of the genetic problems that this particular breed has and, yes, I did see the BBC programme which highlighted these - scared me half to death - but as long as you are aware of these difficulties at the outset and are prepared to take them on if, or when, they happen, then I don't see what the problem is?

At her last check-up, our vet said that she's starting to show signs of a heart murmur but is nothing to worry about so far. I should have had her insured when she was a pup, but never got round to it, and would highly recommend it to anyone now.

I've had so much pleasure, companionship and love from my own dog that I would recommend them to anyone - despite their problems! If you truly have your heart set on a CKC, then my advice would be to try and find a reputable dealer who tests for syringomyelia. It's not easy, but they are out there.

Good luck with your search OP and I hope you find the dog that's best for you

irish horse

i have bred cavas for the last twenty years with no complaints. my girls get more Christmas cards than i do.the are bred as companion dogs and that is what the are
the love company all pedigree dogs have different problems but as a family dog the are hard to beat.look around if you dont like the set up walk away

Carina

Ref CKC's We have a 6 year old, sister in law has a 7 year old & brother has 2. None of us have had any problems with them. Very loving dogs & as said great with kids. Have to say I grew up with larger dogs but bought the CKC as the wife & kids wanted a small dog - best move ever ! Good luck with your search

lrushe

irish horse wrote: »

i have bred cavas for the last twenty years with no complaints. my girls get more Christmas cards than i do.the are bred as companion dogs and that is what the are
the love company all pedigree dogs have different problems but as a family dog the are hard to beat.look around if you dont like the set up walk away

Carina wrote: »

Ref CKC's We have a 6 year old, sister in law has a 7 year old & brother has 2. None of us have had any problems with them. Very loving dogs & as said great with kids. Have to say I grew up with larger dogs but bought the CKC as the wife & kids wanted a small dog - best move ever ! Good luck with your search

CKC's are lovely dogs when bred properly, I don't think anyone would dispute this, its not the breeds fault that greedy people have taken advantage of their cute face and gentle disposition for their own gain. That said I think the OP should be made aware of the numerous health problems the breed suffers from to make an informed decision.

Molberts

OP, I would just like to say fair play on researching before buying, I know it can be tough if your kids are begging for a pup so really, well done.

I would second Shanagarry's post and recommend actually going to visit a rescue and get to know some of the dogs they have available for homing. They can also advise you on what type of dog will be suited to your family's lifestyle.

My boyfriends parents had a beautiful CKC who sadly died of heart complications at just 5, we still miss him so much We have three rescues ourselves and they are in great health luckily. If you have your heart set on a CKC this site provides a wealth of information not just on SM but on what to look for when getting a Cavalier pup too: http://sm.cavaliertalk.com/

Personally, I could never hand over money to a breeder for a dog when there are so many awaiting homes in rescue, but honestly I would never judge someone who loves a particular breed for going to a responsible breeder.

Responsible breeders who genuinely care about the improvement, preservation and good health of their breed should be applauded and supported. If this means waiting for a puppy for 2 years, so be it. I wish there was more of them though I've seen far too many sick puppies go early or get sick.

Good luck with your search OP