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Dana White overrated?

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    #32
    Mellor
    Registered Users Posts: 39,106 ✭✭✭✭Mellor


    AARRRGH wrote: »
    The only bit of evidence was the quote from Lorenzo. It's a nice quote but again he was hardly going to say he's not good at his job. Come on, you know that.
    He could of said nothing at all about his ability??
    My argument has been I do not know if he is a business great as I do not have enough proof. I do not consider his high media presence as any sort of sign that he is a business great.
    no body said media presence was proof. It was the turn-around of the UFC that people referred to.
    For example, George Bush was the president of a successful country, and I could find a million quotes which state how brilliant he was. But you and I know better.

    First of all. the USA under G.W. Bush (I assume you refer to the younger) was hardly sucessful. In fact it was a pretty terrible period.

    Secondly, I doubt you could find many quotes saying he was great. At lest not from people who could be doing so for political means. There would be more bad quotes, and its not even close.


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    #33
    rovert
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,089 ✭✭✭✭rovert


    AARRRGH wrote: »
    But you know what? Let's agree to disagree. We don't have to have the same opinion on this (insignificant) matter.

    Your opinion isnt backed up by anything. Merely you are being a contrarian about the particulars of a unique job in a private company in a fairly unique industry.

    Find me evidence on anything which Ive said about Dana that isnt true.

    My opinion isn’t influenced by Dana’s media presence merely by the statements made those in the company and those who deal with the company on a regular basis. I do follow the industry a great deal Im less swayed by Dana's public persona then you think.


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    #34
    AARRRGH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,382 ✭✭✭✭AARRRGH


    rovert wrote: »
    So what is the point arguing with you?

    Exactly, you don't need to constantly argue with people. It's not very nice.

    Mellor wrote: »
    no body said media presence was proof. It was the turn-around of the UFC that people referred to.

    I agree the UFC turnaround has been impressive.

    Mellor wrote: »
    First of all. the USA under G.W. Bush (I assume you refer to the younger) was hardly sucessful. In fact it was a pretty terrible period.

    Secondly, I doubt you could find many quotes saying he was great. At lest not from people who could be doing so for political means. There would be more bad quotes, and its not even close.

    In fairness, George Bush was leader of the US during many years of amazing economic success, and the US is a very successful country.

    There are many good and bad quotes about George Bush, just like there are many good and bad quotes about Dana White.

    I really don't think we have enough proof to give the "business great" title to Dana. If he was a one man band, maybe, but he is part of a very large organisation, and he isn't the decision maker, Lorenzo is.


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    #35
    rovert
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,089 ✭✭✭✭rovert


    AARRRGH wrote: »
    Exactly, you don't need to constantly argue with people. It's not very nice.

    Well done on ignoring the rest of my posts.
    AARRRGH wrote: »
    he is part of a very large organisation, and he isn't the decision maker, Lorenzo is.

    Source please on all of this, please.


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    #36
    AARRRGH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,382 ✭✭✭✭AARRRGH


    rovert wrote: »
    Your opinion isnt backed up by anything.

    I don't know anything about you, but I have been quite senior in the business world, so I know from experience that successful companies are not necessarily (and oftentimes aren't) run by people with good business skills.

    We don't work within the UFC, so we just don't know how good or bad he is. And he's not even the decision maker. Yes, he's not even the decision maker. You need to think about the significance of that fact.


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    #37
    AARRRGH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,382 ✭✭✭✭AARRRGH


    rovert wrote: »
    Well done on ignoring the rest of my posts.

    Source please on all of this, please.

    Couldn't be bothered. I have better things to do with my time than argue with you. I assume you do too.


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    #38
    rovert
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,089 ✭✭✭✭rovert


    AARRRGH wrote: »
    Couldn't be bothered. I have better things to do with my time than argue with you. I assume you do too.

    You havent for the past hour or so, why now when Im asking you for proof? Please tell me how UFC is a large organisation and that Lorenzo is the decision maker.


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    #39
    Roper
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,448 ✭✭✭Roper


    What have the operations of a company got to do with MMA? Do I come on here and talk about who owns and manages the Fairtex factory?

    This is why this board is clogged with rubbish.


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    #40
    rovert
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,089 ✭✭✭✭rovert


    AARRRGH wrote: »
    I don't know anything about you, but I have been quite senior in the business world, so I know from experience that successful companies are not necessarily (and oftentimes aren't) run by people with good business skills.

    We don't work within the UFC, so we just don't know how good or bad he is.

    Despite Lorenzo's glowing statement about his performance and influence on the success of the company.....
    AARRRGH wrote: »
    And he's not even the decision maker. Yes, he's not even the decision maker. You need to think about the significance of that fact.

    This statement continues to amaze me.


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    #41
    AARRRGH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,382 ✭✭✭✭AARRRGH


    rovert wrote: »
    Please tell me how UFC is a large organisation and that Lorenzo is the decision maker.

    UFC had a quarter of a billion revenue in 2006.

    Dana has stated on TUF that Lorenzo is the decision maker and has the final say on things.

    Dana has also stated that his "only" job is to promote fights.

    It is a fact that UFC is a large organisation, and it is a fact that Lorenzo is the boss.


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    #42
    AARRRGH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,382 ✭✭✭✭AARRRGH


    rovert wrote: »
    This statement continues to amaze me.

    Why?

    Do you know what decision maker means?


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    #43
    AARRRGH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,382 ✭✭✭✭AARRRGH


    Roper wrote: »
    What have the operations of a company got to do with MMA? Do I come on here and talk about who owns and manages the Fairtex factory?

    This is why this board is clogged with rubbish.

    The title is "Dana White overrated". It's pretty obvious what the thread is about. You didn't have to read it.


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    #44
    Roper
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,448 ✭✭✭Roper


    yes but I do want to read about MMA on an MMA board. I come here to read about MMA not who does what job on a board of management.


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    #45
    AARRRGH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,382 ✭✭✭✭AARRRGH


    Roper wrote: »
    yes but I do want to read about MMA on an MMA board. I come here to read about MMA not who does what job on a board of management.

    Yeah, I agree it's a silly thread, but it was just a bit of fun until the usual suspect got angry, as usual.


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    #46
    rovert
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,089 ✭✭✭✭rovert


    AARRRGH wrote: »
    UFC had a quarter of a billion revenue in 2006.

    But what does this got to do with size of the organisation itself. You are confusing terms here.
    AARRRGH wrote: »
    Dana has stated on TUF that Lorenzo is the decision maker and has the final say on things.

    As he is the CEO! There isnt one sole decision maker in the company the way you have been talking it is that every decision goes Lorenzo which isnt true. Dana as the President decides over the day to day running of the company. There isnt one decision maker which decides every thing as you seem what to portray.


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    #47
    rovert
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,089 ✭✭✭✭rovert


    AARRRGH wrote: »
    Why?

    Do you know what decision maker means?

    Someone that makes decisions, there is normally than just one a company btw. You make it sound like Lorzeno sits in a King's chair and decides on how many Bic pens to order.
    Roper wrote: »
    yes but I do want to read about MMA on an MMA board. I come here to read about MMA not who does what job on a board of management.

    Go to another thread or start one.
    AARRRGH wrote: »
    Yeah, I agree it's a silly thread, but it was just a bit of fun until the usual suspect got angry, as usual.

    Im not angry just bemused.


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    #48
    Roper
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,448 ✭✭✭Roper


    AARRRGH wrote: »
    Yeah, I agree it's a silly thread, but it was just a bit of fun until the usual suspect got angry, as usual.

    LOL.


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    #49
    rovert
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,089 ✭✭✭✭rovert


    Roper wrote: »
    LOL.

    Serious thread is serious


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    #50
    AARRRGH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,382 ✭✭✭✭AARRRGH


    rovert wrote: »
    But what does this got to do with size of the organisation itself. You are confusing terms here.

    I don't know anything about you, but if you have ever worked in a company with revenues of a quarter of a billion, then you can take it for granted it's a large organisation.

    rovert wrote: »
    Dana as the President decides over the day to day running of the company.

    That's not what a president does. That's what a COO does, and the UFC already has a COO.

    rovert wrote: »
    Someone that makes decisions, there is normally than just one a company btw. You make it sound like Lorzeno sits in a King's chair and decides on how many Bic pens to order.

    In the context of this thread, I think it's pretty obvious that "decision maker" is not referring to the person who orders pens.

    If Lorenzo is the decision maker, it means he is responsible for the direction for the company, not Dana.

    But saying all that, I am willing to give Dana credit, and I haven't shut the door on him being a "business great", but considering how little we know of his day to day job (and he admits himself he only promotes fights), and the fact that he is not responsible for the direction of the company, I think it is very generous to label him a business great.

    rovert wrote: »
    Im not angry just bemused.

    Well you're coming across as very angry. And I've seen you constantly piss off people in this forum. It's bad.

    And honestly I don't think you know anything about the business world. If you don't believe me, re-read this post.

    I've said all I am going to say on this topic.


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    #51
    rovert
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,089 ✭✭✭✭rovert


    AARRRGH love that you were giving out about people giving out being influenced by media presence but then later cited TUF, a reality TV show as proof of something.
    AARRRGH wrote: »
    I don't know anything about you, but if you have ever worked in a company with revenues of a quarter of a billion, then you can take it for granted it's a large organisation.

    I don’t think you understand what the word organisation means it doesn’t relate to revenue.
    AARRRGH wrote: »
    That's not what a president does. That's what a COO does, and the UFC already has a COO.

    I guess you missed that I said Dana as the President decides over the day to day running of the company. I previously posted he micro-manages everything.

    Anyway COO monitors operations he doesnt run them, there is a difference.
    AARRRGH wrote: »
    In the context of this thread, I think it's pretty obvious that "decision maker" is not referring to the person who orders pens.

    Point still stands you make out that "decision maker" is a unitary position in the organisation. It isn’t.
    AARRRGH wrote: »
    If Lorenzo is the decision maker, it means he is responsible for the direction for the company, not Dana.

    Never said he wasn’t,, being CEO is just the formulisation of the decision making process of the company the reality can be completely different. Generally speaking it is possible for CEO to abdicate their responsibilities onto a subordinate.
    AARRRGH wrote: »
    But saying all that, I am willing to give Dana credit, and I haven't shut the door on him being a "business great", but considering how little we know of his day to day job (and he admits himself he only promotes fights), and the fact that he is not responsible for the direction of the company, I think it is very generous to label him a business great.

    You are throwing around the word “fact” a lot without backing it up. The label of business great is your own invention with an ever evolving criteria. No one has called him that here.
    AARRRGH wrote: »
    Well you're coming across as very angry. And I've seen you constantly piss off people in this forum. It's bad.

    Trust me dude I’m not angry at all. You are making me lol if anything with how evasive you are.
    AARRRGH wrote: »
    And honestly I don't think you know anything about the business world. If you don't believe me, re-read this post.

    I know what an organisation is and how to make an argument based on facts at least.
    AARRRGH wrote: »
    I've said all I am going to say on this topic.

    And here I was waiting for you to present the AARRRGH Business Great Award 2010 :(


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    #52
    RNCFAN
    Closed Accounts Posts: 161 ✭✭RNCFAN


    AARRRGH wrote: »
    You can start here:

    Tell me what Dana does for a living, and provide some sort of proof for your answers.

    This comment below is full of inacurracies-enough that I cared not to comment but seen as we are here...

    I keep hearing he's some promoting god but all he ever did was steal ideas from Don King and Vince Mcmahon, (What ideas did he "steal" other than promoting fights with hype and PR as you would expect from the....promoter!) I mean any hack could do this (Really? Sakakibara, Gary Shaw, Kurt Otto, Garab Shamus all fell short with their respective promotions ) I respect what he done with UFC like, nobody watched that ****, and it wasn't succesful but he turned it around with the ultimate fighter ( He didn't, White was dead against the TUF show at first but was persuaded otherwise) but i think a lot of people don't watch ufc (PPVs rising steadily and the UFC brand becoming synonimis with MMA) and prefer better mma promotions like in japan that stay true to their origins. opinions? i really dislike ufc even tho i'm trained in mma and pretty good.)


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    #53
    Utopia Parkway
    Registered Users Posts: 17,328 ✭✭✭✭Utopia Parkway


    Dana White is certainly a great promoter. Is he a great businessman? I don't know to be honest. I don't doubt that he has a lot of influence within the organisation but at the end of the day the Fertitta's are the money men behind the UFC and ultimately the big business decisions come down to them although Dana obviously has their ear.


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    #54
    rovert
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,089 ✭✭✭✭rovert


    Utopia Parkway wrote: »
    Dana White is certainly a great promoter. Is he a great businessman? I don't know to be honest. I don't doubt that he has a lot of influence within the organisation but at the end of the day the Fertitta's are the money men behind the UFC and ultimately the big business decisions come down to them although Dana obviously has their ear.

    Great business man is a talking point AARRRGH invented. Dana is a great promoter and entrepreneur.


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    #55
    vasch_ro
    Registered Users Posts: 1,432 ✭✭✭vasch_ro


    Roper wrote: »
    yes but I do want to read about MMA on an MMA board. I come here to read about MMA not who does what job on a board of management.

    in fairness I do think there is some general interest in People of Interest in the MMA scene whether it be in a business or strictly sporting sense, but this thread has got a little tiresome


This discussion has been closed.
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