Emptying Sandbags

Jo King

How come there are no volunteers from the reserve offering to empty sandbags onto the roads to alleviate the effects of the freeze? There were seemingly endless numbers who were willing to fill sandbags when the TV cameras were around. No that it comes to emptying them all is quieter than the western front in December 1918.

minidazzler

Jo King wrote: »

How come there are no volunteers from the reserve offering to empty sandbags onto the roads to alleviate the effects of the freeze? There were seemingly endless numbers who were willing to fill sandbags when the TV cameras were around. No that it comes to emptying them all is quieter than the western front in December 1918.

How come none have been asked to?

Boston

You realise that the RDF isn't a volunteer organisation, they get paid.

concussion

Jo King wrote: »

How come there are no volunteers from the reserve offering to empty sandbags onto the roads to alleviate the effects of the freeze? There were seemingly endless numbers who were willing to fill sandbags when the TV cameras were around. No that it comes to emptying them all is quieter than the western front in December 1918.

I haven't seen any news reports of Civil Defence and PDF being called out to help with the roads. If they haven't been requested, why would the RDF be needed? I'd be more than glad to help if needed, however, I didn't know that I, as a Reservist, was required to make a public statement to that effect everytime the weather changed.

As for your reference to the TV cameras, there has been extensive media coverage about road conditions for the last two weeks, your inference that we just want to do it to get on TV doesn't hold up.

Boston wrote: »

You realise that the RDF isn't a volunteer organisation, they get paid.

Not for everything. Field days, weekend exercises and range days are generally unpaid. Range for the purpose of ARP's is definately unpaid, as are weeknight training parades.

Boston

concussion wrote: »

Not for everything. Field days, weekend exercises and range days are generally unpaid. Range for the purpose of ARP's is definately unpaid, as are weeknight training parades.

What a useless reply. They get paid when they're called up. Are you unable to grapse the context of the thread.

concussion

Why the hostility Boston? I grasp this thread perfectly as is happens.
It's not a useless reply - yes we get paid when (if) we are called up. Calling out the reserve howeverm, is a different thing to asking units to provide personnel and it's quite reasonable to assume that Reservists could be requested to provide assistance without being paid. Just as it's equally reasonable (and more probable if Reservists are required for more than a day or two) that this assistance would be provided on a paid basis. This was done to death in the other thread anyway.

As for the use of the word 'volunteer'. It has many interpretations and this can cause confusion. The Minister of Defence has publically stated that Reservists are volunteers and can choose their own level of commitment (which is a sad, sad thing). However, PDF are not conscripts and can also be termed volunteers, even though they are subject to military law 24/7, unlike RDF volunteers.

In my opinion

Jo King wrote: »

How come there are no volunteers from the reserve offering to empty sandbags onto the roads to alleviate the effects of the freeze? There were seemingly endless numbers who were willing to fill sandbags when the TV cameras were around. No that it comes to emptying them all is quieter than the western front in December 1918.

Maybe Reservists realise that
1. sandbags do not contain the elements to make roads safer or prevent freezing of road namely course grit and rock salt.
2. military does not have the capacity to offer any real assistance.

In addition many Reservists were involved locally in their own community capacity, it was the army that made the effort to claim the glory in front of the camera,(well done Pat and Gavin ) however it was the non paid volunteers of the civil defence who actually were the hero's.

Don't worry lots of ATCA operations coming up in 2010, at least most of the refuse collections have been privatised.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

Boston wrote: »

You realise that the RDF isn't a volunteer organisation, they get paid.

You realise, that's not what he is implying?

Boston wrote: »

What a useless reply. They get paid when they're called up. Are you unable to grapse the context of the thread.

It is quite obvious to me who lacks the ability to grasp the context of the thread...

gunnerfitzy

Jo King wrote: »

How come there are no volunteers from the reserve offering to empty sandbags onto the roads to alleviate the effects of the freeze? There were seemingly endless numbers who were willing to fill sandbags when the TV cameras were around. No that it comes to emptying them all is quieter than the western front in December 1918.

i'm sure if you head over to your local council and offer your services they will be glad of your patriotism :rolleyes:

In my opinion

Boston wrote: »

You realise that the RDF isn't a volunteer organisation, they get paid.

What is the relevance of this post? It's a useless post, it says that RDF isn't a volunteer organisation and then you say they get paid! What is the relevance of this.

By the way it is a volunteer organisation as it is made up of volunteers. The point you may have wished to make is that it is not a voluntary organisation and you would find that even more difficult to properly prove.
A volunteer
Military. a person who enters the service voluntarily rather than through conscription or draft, esp. for special or temporary service rather than as a member of the regular or permanent army.
Reference http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/volunteer

However in the context proffered by Jo King he appears to be asking why no reservist has offered his/ her services without having been asked.

Boston you appear to have an issue with members of the Army Reserve or maybe with the concept of the reserve.

First time I have ever said a post was useless but as you hit off the ball I just returned the favour.

ejmaztec

Wouldn't the military emptying sandbags be classed as desertion?:pac:

cork1

Jo King wrote: »

How come there are no volunteers from the reserve offering to empty sandbags onto the roads to alleviate the effects of the freeze? There were seemingly endless numbers who were willing to fill sandbags when the TV cameras were around. No that it comes to emptying them all is quieter than the western front in December 1918.

well if i get the call ill put on my uniform right now and go. i think you are another anti recession guy who is just looking for more reasons to put down the reserve if im right then take it somewhere else.

Boston

Riya Enough Minus wrote: »

You realise, that's not what he is implying?

Never said it was. But considering the problem is the the county councils can't afford to buy the grit to give to the people they're already employing to grit the roads, I don't see where they'd get the money to pay the modest cost of calling up the RDF

Riya Enough Minus wrote: »

It is quite obvious to me who lacks the ability to grasp the context of the thread...

Is it you?

In my opinion wrote: »

By the way it is a volunteer organisation as it is made up of volunteers. The point you may have wished to make is that it is not a voluntary organisation and you would find that even more difficult to properly prove.
A volunteer
Military. a person who enters the service voluntarily rather than through conscription or draft, esp. for special or temporary service rather than as a member of the regular or permanent army.
Reference http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/volunteer

1) If you want to be a pedant about it, yes every organisation paid or otherwise which doesn't force people to be member is a volunteer organisation. Army, Police, Fire service, Ambulance service, Civil Service.
2) You realise if you want people to be able to read what you type you shouldn't change from the default font and colour?

Heres some text in white, see how you like it./

In my opinion wrote: »

Boston you appear to have an issue with members of the Army Reserve or maybe with the concept of the reserve.

Thats some logical jump. Jog on mate.

cork1

Boston wrote: »

Thats some logical jump. Jog on mate.

well im inclined to agree with him. youve obviously got a problem with some part of it

Boston

In what way have I a problem with it mr telepath?

In my opinion

Boston wrote: »

Never said it was. But considering the problem is the the county councils can't afford to buy the grit to give to the people they're already employing to grit the roads, I don't see where they'd get the money to pay the modest cost of calling up the RDF



Is it you?



1) If you want to be a pedant about it, yes every organisation paid or otherwise which doesn't force people to be member is a volunteer organisation. Army, Police, Fire service, Ambulance service, Civil Service.
2) You realise if you want people to be able to read what you type you shouldn't change from the default font and colour?

Heres some text in white, see how you like it./




Thats some logical jump. Jog on mate.

Sorry if you feel I am being pedantic but the fact remains that reservists are volunteers, Gardai are not, members of the Permanent Defence Forces are not either by the definition I offered.

An ambulance driver employed by HSE is not a volunteer but a Civil Defence one, Order of Malta, Red Cross etc would in my book be a volunteer regardless if they were paid or not.

Believe it or not, it's actually not a financial issue primarily but rather a forward planning issue. The fact that local authorities are carrying a lower level of gritting material is partly because not as much was required in previous years and also that there has been a need to grit continuously since Saturday 19th of December in Roscommon, Sligo, Longford, Leitrim, Galway, Mayo, Donegal Westmeath, Clare and some other counties.

I am sorry if you found it hard to read my post but that was because of me trying to copy and paste to the reply box. Point noted.

Now I still feel that you have an issue with the concept of the Army Reserve.

Jog on mate? Explain please.

Boston

I'm not going to get into an argument over semantics, the RDF would have to be paid if called into service to grit the roads.

In my opinion wrote: »

Now I still feel that you have an issue with the concept of the Army Reserve.

Jog on mate? Explain please.

What do you feel is that issue mr freud

In my opinion

Boston wrote: »

I'm not going to get into an argument over semantics, the RDF would have to be paid if called into service to grit the roads.

Army reserve will not be called nor will the Army read my first post it should explain it. It's a non argument.



What do you feel is that issue mr freud

An inferiority complex, maybe your guns are smaller than theirs? Maybe you fire blanks? Not sure, but there is an issue!

Boston

In my opinion wrote: »

An inferiority complex, maybe your guns are smaller than theirs? Maybe you fire blanks? Not sure, but there is an issue!

I see. When you have something beyond gibberish to post, come back to me.

minidazzler

Lads, there is nothing here that Boston said that even remotely insinuates he has a problem with the RDF.

I've read the thread a few times trying to find what ye are on about, can someone show where?

In my opinion

minidazzler wrote: »

Lads, there is nothing here that Boston said that even remotely insinuates he has a problem with the RDF.

I've read the thread a few times trying to find what ye are on about, can someone show where?

Minidazzler you are probably right. It was the attitude that was annoying me especially insulting the young fella in the early posts.

Also possibly since the downfall of the Pd's I am now closer to Berlin than Boston!!

Local-womanizer

Just to be on topic, sand is not used for gritting roads,as already been pointed out. There is also a severe shortage of materials used in the gritting of roads, or do you want the RDF to go out to mine the salt needed. And finally,are we to stand in the back of a truck while we shovel sand on to the road or are we to adjust the trucks we have to properly distrubute the grit on the roads?

The most stupid thread I have read in awhile.

martinr5232

Why in the name of god would the RDF be out gritting roads.

1)Rock salt is deliverd to council depots by fourty foot trucks from up north.

2)It is then loaded into gritting lorries by loading shovel.

3)The gritting lorry then drives around the roads distributing the grit out the back.

4)It then returns to the depot to be filled up again.

So where do either the PDF or the RDF come into this three drivers per machine for a 24 hour period I think the local authorities can cope.

And another thing how many DF personell would be quilified to operate the equipment above considering any member with a civilian EC licence still cant drive a Nissan in the DF without a 154 for said vehicle.

I can only assume the OP intended this thread as another RDF bashing thread.

BigDuffman

Ignoring the handbags about sandbags filled with sand, blood, sh!te or otherwise. And in response to the OP. The job of the reserve is to support the PDF if necessary. The PDF are not needed...ergo the reserves are definitely not needed.

What do you expect them to do? Drive the grit trucks? Put sandbags on the ice (insert tongue and cheek reference to an ice skating green bereted panto)...

While your at it...the current state of the country is in "crisis" so by your thinking we should all be asking to go in and sort things out in the Dail as that would definitely give an opportunity to get on TV wearing a uniform?

The reason no-one has volunteered is quite obvious and logical. How you fail to see this is beyond me unless trolling is your intention?

However another issue that has been on my mind is why would an RDF person bother publicizing their good intentions here anymore. When the immediate result is to be blasted and put down by some chap wearing a black hat? Tarring any effort or gesture of volunteerism as a cheap bid to wear a uniform. The novelty of wearing a uniform wears off pal..just like in the PDF the honeymoon period does wear thin, albeit it may take longer in some reservists.

Boston

In my opinion wrote: »

Minidazzler you are probably right. It was the attitude that was annoying me especially insulting the young fella in the early posts.

Also possibly since the downfall of the Pd's I am now closer to Berlin than Boston!!

Oh I see, it was an unsubstantiated accusation based on nothing. Well that's just racist.

gunnerfitzy

Local-womanizer wrote: »

The most stupid thread I have read in awhile.

+1

perhaps as the DF were utilised during the floods there is an feeling amongst some that they should be utilised for every crisis that befalls the country.

I'm looking forward to the next suggestion on what to deploy the DF for!

Boston

gunnerfitzy wrote: »

+1

perhaps as the DF were utilised during the floods there is an feeling amongst some that they should be utilised for every crisis that befalls the country.

I'm looking forward to the next suggestion on what to deploy the DF for!

A police force when the gardi strike.

OS119

a sex-worker strike.

BigDuffman

OS119 wrote: »

a sex-worker strike.

I would like to now put my name forward for the relief effort as a result of that strike. But due to my current work commitments I can only service females between ages of 18-40. To be as efficient as possible I will be able to deal with 3 victims at a time

concussion

Maybe we could volunteer to clear the masses of dead Christmas trees which are about to be unleashed on a refuse collection network which is already at breaking point??

OS119

BigDuffman wrote: »

I would like to now put my name forward for the relief effort as a result of that strike. But due to my current work commitments I can only service females between ages of 18-40. To be as efficient as possible I will be able to deal with 3 victims at a time

i'm not sure that attractive women aged between 18 - 40 have much need to avail themselves of comercial services - i fear your enthusiastic young RDFer is more likely to find himself puckering up in a cheap hotel room while a fat, ugly, socially unskilled and aging man unzips his fly...

concussion

That's why I ain't putting my name down!!!

iceage

Tut tut. Never volunteer for anthing, you should know that by now!

Mahatma coat

I thought this thread would be about the atrocious Sh!tter-Soldier ratio in the Curragh billets.

Seriously like Y'd be queing for half an hour if ya needed a poo in the mornins

gunnerfitzy

Mahatma coat wrote: »

I thought this thread would be about the atrocious Sh!tter-Soldier ratio in the Curragh billets.

Seriously like Y'd be queing for half an hour if ya needed a poo in the mornins

some may argue that there is an excessive amount of poo in this thread :rolleyes:

iceage

gunnerfitzy wrote: »

some may argue that there is an excessive amount of poo in this thread :rolleyes:

Bravo that man!! So.....about this lack of bogs in the Curragh......:pac:

oncevotedff

Jo King wrote: »

How come there are no volunteers from the reserve offering to empty sandbags onto the roads to alleviate the effects of the freeze? There were seemingly endless numbers who were willing to fill sandbags when the TV cameras were around. No that it comes to emptying them all is quieter than the western front in December 1918.

I'm not sure that sand would do much good. Sand would surely just freeze over. Isn't salt required to melt the ice? In addition, the sandbags are now frozen solid, and they probably wouldn't yield that much sand anyway.

OS119

as an aside, i've 'bulked-up' my limited supplies of rock/salt with sand to help with traction, but its not a lot of use on its own - it certainly helps to turn snow brown, but it doen't melt snow or ice.

thread fail...

BigDuffman

OP your wish may come true yet! The powers that be (rte radio) are calling for the DF to come out with 4x4's!

gunnerfitzy

Indo recalling the last major winter chill where DF personnel were deployed.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/storm-troopers-fought-1982-freeze-2002695.html

concussion

BigDuffman wrote: »

OP your wish may come true yet! The powers that be (rte radio) are calling for the DF to come out with 4x4's!

OH...MY....GOD!!!! Where's my uniform? What boots should I wear? I really should wear ski-gloves but my tac-gloves go better with my gaiters. I wanna bring my 1 litre thermos but it's silver and my smaller one fits perfectly into my ammo pouch. What time do we have to report at?


On a serious note, unless the OP comments on the thread he's created, I'm calling TROLL!!!

Hard Larry

gunnerfitzy wrote: »

Indo recalling the last major winter chill where DF personnel were deployed.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/storm-troopers-fought-1982-freeze-2002695.html

An Ex-Sgt I know told me about that day in 1982 and how the Army ended up breaking ice.

He was a Pte. at the time in Collins Barracks, Dublin and basically the main entrance into the barracks was frozen solid so vehicles couldn't get up the hill and they were having trouble exiting aswell

So a CS in his infinite wisdom ordered his troops to start breaking up the ice with picks and shovels, they did such a good job that the CS decided 'a sure keep going and clear the ice on the street outside'

By 1800hrs they had reached O'Connell Street.

Jo King

concussion wrote: »

OH...MY....GOD!!!! Where's my uniform? What boots should I wear? I really should wear ski-gloves but my tac-gloves go better with my gaiters. I wanna bring my 1 litre thermos but it's silver and my smaller one fits perfectly into my ammo pouch. What time do we have to report at?


On a serious note, unless the OP comments on the thread he's created, I'm calling TROLL!!!

It is interesting to note all the excuses.
1. We haven't been asked. Neither were you asked to help in the flood. didn't stop people demanding to be asked.

2. We'ed have to be paid. No you wouldn't.

3. The sand in the bags is no good.
I am sure that many elderly people who the members would have hauled out through the floods while posing for the cameras, would be equally grateful for a bit of sand on their driveway, and on the footpath outside the house so they could walk to the shop.

All in all the excuses were pathetic and show what glory hunters some people are.

gunnerfitzy

Jo King wrote: »

It is interesting to note all the excuses.
1. We haven't been asked. Neither were you asked to help in the flood. didn't stop people demanding to be asked.

2. We'ed have to be paid. No you wouldn't.

3. The sand in the bags is no good.
I am sure that many elderly people who the members would have hauled out through the floods while posing for the cameras, would be equally grateful for a bit of sand on their driveway, and on the footpath outside the house so they could walk to the shop.

All in all the excuses were pathetic and show what glory hunters some people are.

Did someone in the Army jump into bed with a relative of yours? Is that why you have these anti-df issues?

BigDuffman

Jo King wrote: »

3. The sand in the bags is no good.
I am sure that many elderly people who the members would have hauled out through the floods while posing for the cameras, would be equally grateful for a bit of sand on their driveway, and on the footpath outside the house so they could walk to the shop.

All in all the excuses were pathetic and show what glory hunters some people are.

I'm sorry but I really am trying to find the logic in your post. First of all the PDF are on stand by in 17 barracks to help where necessary. Who exactly is making excuses or looking to pose for cameras?????

Jo King

I was talking about the reserve. Read all of a thread not just the last post in it!

Local-womanizer

Read all the replies,I would have thought you would have got a sufficent answer tbh. Manpower is not the issue, lack of supplies is. Your grips is with the council authorities.

Jo King

Local-womanizer wrote: »

Read all the replies,I would have thought you would have got a sufficent answer tbh. Manpower is not the issue, lack of supplies is. Your grips is with the council authorities.

I have no gripe with the council authorities. I am commenting on how certain individuals who post on this forum were aggrieved that they were not used in the flood operation. They were anxious to travel to flooded areas and do the divil and all. My view at the time was that there was no need for it. Now that there is another alleged crisis there is no sign of these people volunteering to do anything. Maybe the lack of camers has something to do with it.

Fuinseog

Jo King wrote: »

How come there are no volunteers from the reserve offering to empty sandbags onto the roads to alleviate the effects of the freeze? There were seemingly endless numbers who were willing to fill sandbags when the TV cameras were around. No that it comes to emptying them all is quieter than the western front in December 1918.

how come there are so may helpess hannahs in this country? i mean people exepect the corpo to grit their driveways for them and the soldiers to do their shopping for them. listening to Joe duffy you would think we have a catastrophe on our hands instead of a bit of snow.

Local-womanizer

Jo King wrote: »

I have no gripe with the council authorities. I am commenting on how certain individuals who post on this forum were aggrieved that they were not used in the flood operation. They were anxious to travel to flooded areas and do the divil and all. My view at the time was that there was no need for it. Now that there is another alleged crisis there is no sign of these people volunteering to do anything. Maybe the lack of camers has something to do with it.

There is a bloody huge difference between your house having a few feet of water in it and snow. FFS Donegal has been doing grand for the past 3 weeks with the snow,sure its a balls getting every where,but its never going to get to the stage we we resort to eating the neighbours. And who are you to say RDF members are not out helping, anybody who has needed help in my area has got it, and I cant see Eilleen Magner strutting about with her camera crew ffs.

Crisis me hole :rolleyes:

In my opinion

Fuinseog wrote: »

how come there are so may helpess hannahs in this country? i mean people exepect the corpo to grit their driveways for them and the soldiers to do their shopping for them. listening to Joe duffy you would think we have a catastrophe on our hands instead of a bit of snow.

Not the Corpo maybe county council but there are people isolated since December 19th in rural Ireland. Fact. Just as well there is a bit of snow in Dublin now so we will see action.