€150 million plus spent on housing travellers over 5 years

The_Minister

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/councils-forking-out-e500000-on-halting-bays-for-travellers-1991584.html

MOST of them come with just a bathroom, toilet, kitchen, living area and no bedrooms -- but some councils have spent as much as €500,000 on halting bays for individual Traveller families.

Typically, a bay consists of a parking space for caravans or vans as well as a separate building, described by some housing officers as a "tigin" like structure which doesn't have any bedrooms.

Huge variations have been discovered in spending by local authorities, figures obtained by the Irish Independent reveal.

But while some have achieved value for money, others are guilty of excessive spending.

The new figures reveal that 25 of the county and city councils spent €121m accommodating Travellers in halting sites and in houses over the past five years.

Details were not available for the remaining nine primary local authorities, meaning that the total spend is likely to top €150m.

Town councils such as Tullamore, Mullingar and Letterkenny, manage their own budgets, which means that the total is likely to be higher again. Galway City Council emerged as one of the most generous of all local authorities, spending €10m over the past five years.

The council also spent over €1.56m on five bays in a halting site in Doughiska, working out at around €300,000 each.

In South Dublin, the council went even further -- shelling out over €500,000 per bay in a 10-bay site in Rathfarnham. At current market prices, €500,000 would buy a comfortable four bed semi-detached house in the Rathfarnam area.

The total cost of building the homes at Stocking Hill was €5,075,879.

The site in Rathfarnam was already council-owned, which means that South Dublin County Council did not have to pay for the land which it built the bays on. The site at Doughiska in Galway was also council owned.

Occupiers

In total, South Dublin was by far the highest spending council, forking out €40.3m on Traveller accommodation since 2005. Occupiers of halting sites pay rent to the local council, but the amount is understood to vary according to circumstances.

Elsewhere, Cavan County Council spent a total of €886,965 over five years. Cavan's thrifty total worked out at an average of €80,663 per permanent house and €105,362 per halting bay.

Differing costs from council to council can be put down to the level of work that needs to be carried out.

The level of needs of those who have to be housed also has to be taken into consideration.

A spokesman for Traveller group Pavee Point was not contactable last night.

Labour's housing spokesman Ciaran Lynch said that the emphasis of local authority spending needed to be on permanent social housing rather than transient halting sites.

"In view of the fact that there are now 100,000 people on social housing lists across the country, the priority needs to be on longer term housing needs," Mr Lynch said.

- Fiach Kelly

€500,000 per unit:eek:


I doubt any of the travellers getting those houses ever paid tax, but they get a house while people who did pay a little tax are still waiting.

Fago!

I'm on the housing list for ages and now I learn those smelly bastids, who more likely will start trouble, are getting one before me and my TAX PAYING family?

****in not on.

Hey that's the government for ya. Corrupt **** who don't give a labrador's ballbag about us honest guys.

Ostrom

The_Minister wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/councils-forking-out-e500000-on-halting-bays-for-travellers-1991584.html

€500,000 per unit:eek:


I doubt any of the travellers getting those houses ever paid tax, but they get a house while people who did pay a little tax are still waiting.

Do they have any data on occupancy?

Riamfada

Saying anything negative about the travelling community on this thread will be considered an extreme form of racism. I say more money to our noble traveller friends because im not a racist, but can one be racist towards travellers? They are Irish. Can I have a house

arybvtcw0eolkf

Fago_25 wrote: »

Scumbags

Who?.

NotInventedHere

Money well spent I say. this is so much better than travellers being on the side of the road.

WIZE

Its not the travellers fault . Its the tossers who charge the Government €500,000 to build the ****e

genericguy

they should send a hi-vis vest and a sweeping brush to the occupants of those houses so they can give something back to the country. i sincerely doubt blackie and miley would be so keen on getting a free gaff if they had to get off their holes and do some work for it. and while they're at it, the leaving cert should be compulsory for their kids, might help get rid of the itinerant culture we all hate and know is wrong but aren't allowed to talk about.

Riamfada

genericguy wrote: »

they should send a hi-vis vest and a sweeping brush to the occupants of those houses so they can give something back to the country. i sincerely doubt blackie and miley would be so keen on getting a free gaff if they had to get off their holes and do some work for it. and while they're at it, the leaving cert should be compulsory for their kids, might help get rid of the itinerant culture we all hate and know is wrong but aren't allowed to talk about.

Oh no he did'en

genericguy

Grimes wrote: »

I say more money to our noble traveller friends because im not a racist, but can one be racist towards travellers? They are Irish.

because they are a community of people who remain insular and have a persecution complex they are entitled to exemption from general racism guidelines.

galwayrush

Oh dear, what's wrong with housing them?, next people will want to stop the dole on the ones making lots of money on the side, after that people will want them to pay tax on their earnings.:eek:

TheZohanS

genericguy wrote: »

leaving cert should be compulsory for their kids, might help get rid of the itinerant culture we all hate and know is wrong but aren't allowed to talk about.

It's not the itinerant culture that most people are against, most travellers no longer follow that culture.

4zn76tysfajdxp

genericguy wrote: »

they should send a hi-vis vest and a sweeping brush to the occupants of those houses so they can give something back to the country. i sincerely doubt blackie and miley would be so keen on getting a free gaff if they had to get off their holes and do some work for it. and while they're at it, the leaving cert should be compulsory for their kids, might help get rid of the itinerant culture we all hate and know is wrong but aren't allowed to talk about.

Miley wasn't a traveller.

omahaid

Why aren't they buying their own houses?

genericguy

TheZohan wrote: »

It's not the itinerant culture that most people are against, most travellers no longer follow that culture.

i suppose throughout the country as a whole that may be true. however, i grew up in west dublin, and it's still rife there. although to be fair i'd like to correct my statement and say that the leaving cert should be compulsory for all, to get rid of the culture of lying on one's hole all day waiting till tuesday to collect the scratch. i'm fcuking sick of it. council housing should, in this day and age, be in lieu of half of all the occupants' dole.

genericguy

Julius Huge Smoker wrote: »

Miley wasn't a traveller.

the three i know are.

Fago!

NotInventedHere wrote: »

Money well spent I say. this is so much better than travellers being on the side of the road.

Good point.

btw op, can you shorten that long ass post to the jist of the story. Most of it's crap anyway.

monellia

Can you really say you're ok with travellers?

TheZohanS

genericguy wrote: »

although to be fair i'd like to correct my statement and say that the leaving cert should be compulsory for all, to get rid of the culture of lying on one's hole all day waiting till tuesday to collect the scratch.

A lot of people that have lost their jobs have degrees and masters etc.

I don't think the government should be buying houses for anybody. However I don't disagree with the government subsidizing the cost of a home for people with disabilities (not able to work not included) and people who work but simply can't afford to buy overpriced homes. If they earned enough throughout life, I'd hope they would eventually pay back the government.

genericguy

TheZohan wrote: »

A lot of people that have lost their jobs have degrees and masters etc.

in fairness i find that those people are not the ones lying about on their arses, spawing children who suffer from congenital unemployment.

genericguy

monellia wrote: »

Can you really say you're ok with travellers?

on boards you have to.

Dotsie~tmp

Thats €30 mln a year divided among the travellers who arent settled. There are 30,000 travellers here? Lets say 50% settled. Thats €2,000 per man woman and child. None of this includes social welfare payments which we all are entitled to or I think housing of travellers who are settling.

Its generous no doubt but not the real problem. Multiple dole claims (4 or 5 one traveller told me) and other social welfare fraud is. Travellers arent the only ones at this. Its just very prevelant there. Biometric signing on is needed to collect dole. The level of fraud is crippling us.

dsmythy

NotInventedHere wrote: »

Money well spent I say. this is so much better than travellers being on the side of the road.

€500,000 on what amounts to a shack? Money well spent? Why not give them an actual home for that price! It might be of more benefit to them than a glorified shack.

TheZohanS

genericguy wrote: »

on boards you have to.

No you don't.

Follow these simple rules and you can say what you want:

• Don't generalise
• Don't call them names
• Speak from your own experience of travellers
• Follow the Charter

genericguy

TheZohan wrote: »

No you don't.

Follow these simple rules and you can say what you want:

• Don't generalise
• Don't call them names
• Speak from your own experience of travellers
• Follow the Charter

sorry zohan, i forgot terry was gone.

homerjay2005

shocking. they could have bought some poxy island out in the atlantic for bout 250,000 and put them all out there instead, then pumping the remaining money they wasted on healtcare and education.

Amalgam

TheZohan wrote: »

It's not the itinerant culture that most people are against, most travellers no longer follow that culture.

If that isn't generalising, what is?

---

What is the problem with exposing certain sections of society to, 'life risk'?

Basically, in old saying terms, make one's bed and lie in it.

TheZohanS

Fago_25 wrote: »

I'm on the housing list for ages and now I learn those smelly bastids, who more likely will start trouble, are getting one before me and my TAX PAYING family?

• Don't call them names
• Don't generalise
• Follow the Charter

You missed all three.

genericguy

TheZohan wrote: »

• Don't call them names
• Don't generalise
• Follow the Charter

You missed all three.

Ha, trying to not get castigated whilst discussing the travelling community is the best game on this site.

Hootanany

Is there any crime statistics on the Travelling Community

Ickle Magoo

If you really want to have a go at council or government wastage then the housing for travellers is the more savoury tip of a truly disgusting ice-berg - John O'Donoghue or Mary Coughlan among others spring to mind. What about the astronomical costs of renting schools or translating everything in the Dail into Irish or the €52 million spent on voting machines that cost €800k per annum to store or the glut billions wasted in out-dated and inefficient HSE administration - at least someone benefits from housing or halting sites, it's not just p*ssing it against the wall.

Cookie_Monster

Hootanany wrote: »

Is there any crime statistics on the Travelling Community

No, they've been stolen

jimmycrackcorm

I'd love to see a cost breakdown so that we could start a dozen new threads on how much money was spent on concrete / toliet seats / showers and lino.

jumpguy

What to do with the travelling community has become a complicated issue in Ireland, made alot more complicated that now we have to be PC and can't say anything for fear of offense. From my experience, I see alot of good in travellers, have played many a game of soccer with them in the local pitch. I have seen alot of bad too though, but for fear of being accused of any infringement of the charter, I won't go into that. Then again, it's not alot of the traveller's fault. They were born into their ways, and their children will, and their's, and so on.

Should they be given houses? Well, they should have the same priority as everyone else and have to wait like everyone else. Social housing is another issue. It creates "rough" areas and kinda runs down the place. But you can't have people living on the streets either. Social housing to me seems to tackle to symptoms, but not the source of the problem and hence the problem persists.

4zn76tysfajdxp

genericguy wrote: »

the three i know are.

Well Holy God.

Quint

NotInventedHere wrote: »

Money well spent I say. this is so much better than travellers being on the side of the road.

Anyone else that decides to live in a caravan has to pay to stay in a caravan park. They don't get a house built for them.

Cookie_Monster

Julius Huge Smoker wrote: »

Well Holy God.

Holy travelling communities Batman!
:eek:

g-whizz

galwayrush wrote: »

Oh dear, what's wrong with housing them?

They don't want they houses they are given. In my locality, they were given a house, brand-new 4 bed bungalow, so they parked the caravan in the drive, boarded up the windows and put the horses in the front door. I'll never forget that horse with its head stickin' out of the front doorway eating a bucketful o' shít.

omahaid wrote: »

Why aren't they buying their own houses?

Who knows, they have more money than most of us. Sure why would anyone when they get the house free, free L&H and the rest?
Last year another crowd, close relatives of the boyos up there ^ who have a free house etc bought a top of the range high spec Focus ST and the higher spec Nissan Navaro.
Poor bastárds hove nothing!

Ulysses Gaze

Brilliant...and yet the "Government" couldn't, at one stage, find €10 million for Cervical cancer vaccines or to save Scoliosis wards closing.

Amalgam

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

Brilliant...and yet the "Government" couldn't, at one stage, find €10 million for Cervical cancer vaccines or to save Scoliosis wards closing.

A lot of the interesting money uses come from local government. Many local councils are quite happy to have the plebs focused on the, 'Government', thank you very much.

In many cases, it goes unnoticed and unchallenged.

Sea Sharp

E500,000 per unit could mean that a south Dublin county council member was overpaying to a close friend/contractor.
To me this indicates corruption of county council members as opposed to travelers being given houses that are worth E500,000 on the housing market.

Hootanany

GaNjaHaN wrote: »

E500,000 per unit could mean that a south Dublin county council member was overpaying to a close friend/contractor.
To me this indicates corruption of county council members as opposed to travelers being given houses that are worth E500,000 on the housing market.

Corruption in the County Councils well i never:eek:

ShooterSF

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't think the government should be buying houses for anybody. However I don't disagree with the government subsidizing the cost of a home for people with disabilities (not able to work not included) and people who work but simply can't afford to buy overpriced homes. If they earned enough throughout life, I'd hope they would eventually pay back the government.

No. No. No. No . NOOOO.

How will house prices drop if the government subsidises them? All that means is your tax money going right into the developers pocket. Have we learned anything from stephen?

Professey Chin

ShooterSF wrote: »

Have we learned anything from stephen?

I learnt a couple of days ago that his celebration night gets me very drunk

PLIIM

dsmythy wrote: »

€500,000 on what amounts to a shack? Money well spent? Why not give them an actual home for that price! It might be of more benefit to them than a glorified shack.

Because when they did give them houses, they toke everything that wasnt cemented down and sold it. Then demanded free replacements from the council again.
One family moved into a house across the road from my parents house and even sold the roof tiles.

Massive Muscles

Hootanany wrote: »

Is there any crime statistics on the Travelling Community

Yes and you would not believe them if I told you. Same for Romanians.

clancyoo7

PLIIM wrote: »

Because when they did give them houses, they toke everything that wasnt cemented down and sold it. Then demanded free replacements from the council again.
One family moved into a house across the road from my parents house and even sold the roof tiles.

Maybe the goverment are buying votes from the travellers and puttin money into their new found friends in the travelling community. Lets face it who else will vote for them.
According to the the Pavee Point website
The 'Traveller Economy' is the term used to describe work the Travellers initiate themselves. Scrap metal recycling, market trading and horse dealing would be examples of this type of work.

The celtic tiger maybe dead. The celtic tinker, might just save this country yet.

Mars Bar

Up my street, there are a load of new houses that have been built for the travelers, most of them have the double-glazed windows smashed in and are lying idle whilst the families live in their caravans on the driveway. It's ridiculous. They don't know how to care for what they are given and we, the private house owners with mortgages, are trying to get a petition set up so that the council will come out and clean it up.

I don't want to say anything bad about the travelers coz if it wasn't for them, Dad wouldn't have been able to pull the car out of the ditch he slid into on Christmas Day! They just don't know how valuable property is and what tax is.

R0ot

Thieving tinkers, they along with scumbags and knackers should all be shot.

Hootanany

Massive Muscles wrote: »

Yes and you would not believe them if I told you. Same for Romanians.

Go on i have a strong stomach