Perpignan vs Munster, Stade Aimé Giral, Sunday 3pm Match Thread

thomond2006

The squads have been announced:

Munster Squad: F Jones, P Warwick, D Hurley, I Dowling, D Howlett, K Earls, J de Villiers, L Mafi, R O'Gara, P Stringer, T O'Leary, J Brugnaut, W du Preez, D Hurley, D Fogarty, D Varley, J Hayes, T Buckley, D O'Callaghan, M O'Driscoll, P O'Connell capt; A Quinlan, N Ronan, D Wallace, D Leamy, D Ryan, N Williams.

Perpignan : Mas, Freshwater, Schuster, Chobet, Pulu, Guirado, Tincu, Tchale-Watchou, Olibeau, Alvarez-Kairélis, Britz, Vivalda, Guiry, Tonita, Parent, Durand, Mélé, Hume, Mermoz, Marty, Grandclaude, Sid, Manas, Porical, Burger

Britz and Tonita are back for USAP, that's 2/3 of their backrow. Bad news for Munster. Henry Tuilagi still out though.

By the look of that squad, it looks like the Catalans are going for this. They will definitely need a bonus point win imo to stay in the hunt.

The team I'd like to see picked:

Warwick
Howlett
Earls
JdV
Hurley
ROG
Stringer
Leamy
Wallace
Quinlan
POC
DOC
Hayes
Varley (won't happen :mad:)
Du Preez

Bench:
Brugnaut
Buckley
Fogarty
MOD
Williams
TOL
Mafi
Jones

Munster aren't playing well but I still believe they have the beating of these guys.

Time to stand up and be counted.

2040

I agree with your selection wholeheartedly. I can unsderstand why people would be iffy about Du Preez's selection, but apparently he's been putting his hand up (munster.ie). That's apparent.

SomeFool

I agree with the selection too, not with the bench though, I'd go with

Brugnaut
Buckley
Fogarty
Ronan
Donnacha Ryan
Williams
TOL
Jones

zenmonk

Warwick for 10 ...oops forgot , we're a fickle bunch.

D-Generate

zenmonk wrote: »

Warwick for 10 ...oops forgot , we're a fickle bunch.

On the back of ROG's performance last week? A few weeks ago I might have agreed with you but if ROG holds his form from last week then he should keep the jersey on.

Cuchulain

On current form I really cant see how Munster can win this. But it would be typical Munster bring in a big performance when people least expect it.

Why drop TOL for Stringer? I thought he has been play relatively good.

toomevara

Cuchulain wrote: »

On current form I really cant see how Munster can win this. But it would be typical Munster bring in a big performance when people least expect it.

Agree, Perpignan by 7-10 on form, with all the usual "never discount Munster" caveats of course....

zenmonk

D-Generate wrote: »

On the back of ROG's performance last week? A few weeks ago I might have agreed with you but if ROG holds his form from last week then he should keep the jersey on.

i was being sarcastic.
Perpignan by 6.

thomond2006

Cuchulain wrote: »

Why drop TOL for Stringer? I thought he has been play relatively good.

Becaue our backline has not been functioning and quicker distribution is needed, which Stringer delivers.

Cuchulain

thomond2006 wrote: »

Becaue our backline has not been functioning and quicker distribution is needed, which Stringer delivers.

Yeah Stringer delivers quicker ball but the SH can only deliver a ball if the forwards clear out the ruck fast enough.
From what Ive seen thus far this hasnt been happening.

PhatPiggins

Cuchulain wrote: »

Yeah Stringer delivers quicker ball but the SH can only deliver a ball if the forwards clear out the ruck fast enough.
From what Ive seen thus far this hasnt been happening.

For me the rucks are ok and the scrums while shaky were'nt bad last weekend.

The big problem I see is the crappy ball we're getting off the lineount. When Flannery is playing quick off the top ball from 4 and 6 is a major attacking weapon for Munster, especially with an at pace hitter like Mafi.
Because of Forgarty's throwing woes most of the ball is to 2 or a scrappy 4 ball that POC has to pull in. As a result O Leary get's the ball and the opposition at the same time and is hurried into a box kick, slow pass or holds onto possesion. Same thing for Mafi, by the time he gets the ball both centres have closed the gap and he's swamped.

People are saying TOL is playing poorly or Mafi should be dropped but there's more to it then their own form.

thomond2006

Same again for Munster.

http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/6913.php

P Warwick; D Howlett, K Earls, L Mafi, D Hurley; R O'Gara, T O'Leary;
W du Preez, D Fogarty, J Hayes; D O'Callaghan, P O'Connell capt; A Quinlan, D Wallace, D Leamy.

Replacements: D Varley, D Hurley, T Buckley, M O'Driscoll, D Ryan, N Ronan, P Stringer, J de Villiers.

Disappointed that Fogarty and Mafi are still there.

I also can't see the point of a 5-2 split. If JdV has to come on early, we'll have no 11-15 cover for impact.. McGahan did not bring on MOD, Ryan or Ronan last week so why are they all there again? Take out Ryan and Ronan and put Williams and Jones for FB cover ffs. :mad:

I can't see that backline do much with our very own Andy Powell at 12.

Stev_o

They won't win, when's the last time the Catalans have lost at home?

buck65

16 months ago. They have only lost twice in the HCup to Leicester and Wasps who both went on to win.
Really this is a tough group compared to some others.

thomond2006

Stev_o wrote: »

They won't win, when's the last time the Catalans have lost at home?

Perpignan are no Clermont.

Risteard

thomond2006 wrote: »

Perpignan are no Clermont.

Yeah, they're Top14 champions.

thomond2006

Risteard wrote: »

Yeah, they're Top14 champions.

We were far superior to them last week. They got 2 freak tries that Munster won't concede again.

My point was they can't the play the rugby that Clermont can.

If Clermont didn't have their annual T14 final **** up, they would be champions.

Risteard

thomond2006 wrote: »

We were far superior to them last week. They got 2 freak tries that Munster won't concede again.

My point was they can't the play the rugby that Clermont can.

If Clermont didn't have their annual T14 final **** up, they would be champions.

Alleged 'quality of rugby' means nothing. A team that can maul and ruck the best is just as good, if not superior to one that can run in tries from 50m out. And I'm sick to death of hearing things to this effect. When we won the Heineken Cup both times, we couldn't play the rugby Clermont could, we still can't btw, we won it playing the rugby that Perpignan are playing.

Added to the fact that they're playing at home in front of a hostile crowd, they will be a different team. they will try to out-muscle us and suffocate us and the way our pack is performing then we're in great danger of that happening.

As for the 'If Clermont didn't have their annual T14 final **** up, they would be champions' comment, if we didn't lose to Leinster we'd have been in the final and if we beat Leicester then we'd have been champions and if RoG's kick had gone over in 2000 we would have won it then. If Poitrenaud didn't **** up against Wasps then Toulouse would be 4 time champions.

Ifs mean nothing in sport. And who says we won't concede them again? We conceded soft tries against Northampton twice and Treviso twice.

thomond2006

Risteard wrote: »

Alleged 'quality of rugby' means nothing. A team that can maul and ruck the best is just as good, if not superior to one that can run in tries from 50m out. And I'm sick to death of hearing things to this effect. When we won the Heineken Cup both times, we couldn't play the rugby Clermont could, we still can't btw, we won it playing the rugby that Perpignan are playing.

Added to the fact that they're playing at home in front of a hostile crowd, they will be a different team. they will try to out-muscle us and suffocate us and the way our pack is performing then we're in great danger of that happening.

As for the 'If Clermont didn't have their annual T14 final **** up, they would be champions' comment, if we didn't lose to Leinster we'd have been in the final and if we beat Leicester then we'd have been champions and if RoG's kick had gone over in 2000 we would have won it then. If Poitrenaud didn't **** up against Wasps then Toulouse would be 4 time champions.

Ifs mean nothing in sport. And who says we won't concede them again? We conceded soft tries against Northampton twice and Treviso twice.

All true.

Munster have the pedigree and the experience to win this game.

Bar the scrum and maul, Munster are superior. We have a better fly-half, better back three and better second row. The centres and scrum half are even.

Risteard

I'm not saying we can'r win, I'm pointing out that this will be a lot tougher challenge than Clermont.

Stev_o

thomond2006 wrote: »

All true.

Munster have the pedigree and the experience to win this game.

Bar the scrum and maul, Munster are superior. We have a better fly-half, better back three and better second row. The centres and scrum half are even.

Sorry but it doesn't work like that. Leicester hammered and i mean absolutely hammered Perpignan at home last year and were far superior in every area to them. A week later we were away to them and we were never in contention in the game , complete disaster. How exactly will Munster, who weren't great themselves last week, raise their game to the level which is a required to beat a unstoppable team at home?

buck65

I think Clermont are a superior team to Perpignan too. We went there twice and came home with a bonus point so I reckon we can again.
Saying that, Clermont are going to take serious beating in this tournament. Sure they have lost 13 super finals but they have been consistently the best team in France for the past 3 years.
Who puts 40 points on Leicester?!
I agree that we are a match for perpignan but the home factor will be worth at least 9 points to them especially if the crowd get to the ref as happened in Thomond a few times last week. (Notwithstanding Barnes' reluctance to go for the yellow card for some reason)

thomond2006

Stev_o wrote: »

Sorry but it doesn't work like that. Leicester hammered and i mean absolutely hammered Perpignan at home last year and were far superior in every area to them. A week later we were away to them and we were never in contention in the game , complete disaster. How exactly will Munster, who weren't great themselves last week, raise their game to the level which is a required to beat a unstoppable team at home?

"Munster were never based on logic, George."

I don't think they will be unstoppable. What Leicester did last year is irrelevant to be fair.

Perpignan will have to get a BP win in this game to stay in the hunt, this will play right into Munster's hands.

Perpignan and Munster have excellent home records because 90% of the time, the visiting team believe they don't have a chance. The game is over before a ball is kicked

Munster WILL believe, that's the difference. That gives them a chance.

Last week, after Perpignan got the wonder try, you could argue that they lost the game because they didn't believe they could do it. Same for Montauban last year and possibly Clermont.

If Munster get wiped off the field, I will gladly admit my stupidity on this forum.

Stev_o

I agree that we are a match for perpignan but the home factor will be worth at least 9 points to them especially if the crowd get to the ref as happened in Thomond a few times last week. (Notwithstanding Barnes' reluctance to go for the yellow card for some reason)[/QUOTE]

Barnes was horrendous in that regard, seems to be a problem going around referees at the moment with regards to be reluctant to giving yellow cards. That said Perpignan won't change their tactics in terms of going off their feet etc and chances are they ll get further lenience off the ref thanks to that home factor.

Risteard

thomond2006 wrote: »

"Munster were never based on logic, George."

I don't think they will be unstoppable. What Leicester did last year is irrelevant to be fair.

Perpignan will have to get a BP win in this game to stay in the hunt, this will play right into Munster's hands.

Perpignan and Munster have excellent home records because 90% of the time, the visiting team believe they don't have a chance. The game is over before a ball is kicked

Munster WILL believe, that's the difference. That gives them a chance.

Last week, after Perpignan got the wonder try, you could argue that they lost the game because they didn't believe they could do it. Same for Montauban last year and possibly Clermont.

If Munster get wiped off the field, I will gladly admit my stupidity on this forum.

The same way what happened in Clermont is irrelevant?

Also the belief thing is getting a bit annoying at this stage. Professional teams of the calibre of Perpignan and Clermont believe they are in with a chance of winning, of course they do. You could argue that last season Clermont lost because their idiotic second-row got himself sent off so early, meaning they had to do more work than is normally required of them and eventualy fatigue took over. That is a far better explanation as to why they lost as opposed to lack of belief.

Perpignan didn't lose because of disbelief, they lost because of terrible discipline.

If a team that loses a game by one point in a place like Thomond Park, 'without believing they can' as you say, then what does that suggest will happen in their home ground where they have just as good a record as us?

anonymous_joe

thomond2006 wrote: »

Perpignan are no Clermont.

Risteard wrote: »

Yeah, they're Top14 champions.

God damn it Risteard, I had a 'yeah, they actually win competitions' all lined up.

Risteard wrote: »

Alleged 'quality of rugby' means nothing. A team that can maul and ruck the best is just as good, if not superior to one that can run in tries from 50m out. And I'm sick to death of hearing things to this effect. When we won the Heineken Cup both times, we couldn't play the rugby Clermont could, we still can't btw, we won it playing the rugby that Perpignan are playing.

Pretty much. Munster's strength has always been the pack. However, despite being a primarily international pack, Perpignan have a far superior front row, and a back row that competed gamely against Munster's despite being down a lot of players through injury. It's only in second row that Munster are clearly superior, so the pack battle has to be won. Otherwise, Munster can write off the HC.

Added to the fact that they're playing at home in front of a hostile crowd, they will be a different team. they will try to out-muscle us and suffocate us and the way our pack is performing then we're in great danger of that happening.

It'll take a monumental performance to overcome this. Fcuk all the clichéd bullshít, this is going to be a tough game. Almost impossible. Munster will need every aspect of their traditional game here, and they'll need them to put in their best performances of recent years.

thomond2006 wrote: »

All true.

Munster have the pedigree and the experience to win this game.

Bar the scrum and maul, Munster are superior. We have a better fly-half, better back three and better second row. The centres and scrum half are even.

Hang on. Their back row was missing most of its first choice, and while Munster's was clearly superior last week, it wasn't dominating.

If Meyer's back, he's a good player, and given O'Gara's recent form, proclaiming him clearly superior is risky. Even so, Munster do edge the half backs.

However, Clermont's centres piss all over yours. By a mile. As for the back three, I haven't seen Munster's back three do anything since the start of the season. Howlett looks slow and confused, Earls looks like he's dying for a position and Hurley/Jones/Dowling all look solid. Munster's back three look like they don't know what's expected of them. The game plan isn't doing them any favours at all.

Stev_o

thomond2006 wrote: »

"Munster were never based on logic, George."

I don't think they will be unstoppable. What Leicester did last year is irrelevant to be fair.

Perpignan will have to get a BP win in this game to stay in the hunt, this will play right into Munster's hands.

Perpignan and Munster have excellent home records because 90% of the time, the visiting team believe they don't have a chance. The game is over before a ball is kicked

Munster WILL believe, that's the difference. That gives them a chance.

Last week, after Perpignan got the wonder try, you could argue that they lost the game because they didn't believe they could do it. Same for Montauban last year and possibly Clermont.

If Munster get wiped off the field, I will gladly admit my stupidity on this forum.

Montauban lost last year because of lack of experience not belief, in fact they had more belief then Munster that day. The only reason they lost and Munster lost was because like Bath they failed to hoof the ball 80 meters and defend the last 30 seconds and win the game.

Look don't believe that whole "belief" crap, no modern term plays a game thinking they ll loose it just doesn't happen. It's just a term now it given by pundits to give rugby a more romantic and majestic look.

Podge_irl

thomond2006 wrote: »

Bar the scrum and maul, Munster are superior. We have a better fly-half, better back three and better second row. The centres and scrum half are even.

As mentioned, Perp were missing their top six backrow players. I think two of them are back for this game, it'll be a completely different game.

As regards the centres, Perp's centres are so much better its not even funny. Munster's have the potential to be good obviously but Mafi is playing poorly and no one outside of him is seeing any ball.

bleg

joke viat mafi is still there. Majorly pissed off with his selection.

chupacabra

bleg wrote: »

joke viat mafi is still there. Majorly pissed off with his selection.

I wont be too pissed off if he is told to just play rugby this time. Himself and Earls can be a lethal combination if the basics are done right. I agree however that an Earls De Villiers center partnership was the best call for this weekend.

twinytwo

Stev_o wrote: »

Sorry but it doesn't work like that. Leicester hammered and i mean absolutely hammered Perpignan at home last year and were far superior in every area to them. A week later we were away to them and we were never in contention in the game , complete disaster. How exactly will Munster, who weren't great themselves last week, raise their game to the level which is a required to beat a unstoppable team at home?

because they are munster and if anyone can do it they can.

damoz

twinytwo wrote: »

because they are munster and if anyone can do it they can.

thats the spirit. i wll carry this quote to Sunday ! Cmon Munster.

thomond2006

Perpignan: 15 P Burger, 14 F Sid, 13 D Marty, 12 M Mermoz, 11 C Manas, 10 G Hume, 9 D Mele, 1 J Schuster, 2 M Tincu, 3 N Mas [capt], 4 O Olibeau, 5 R Tchale Watchou, 6 Y Vivalda, 7 B Guiry, 8 O Tonita.

Replacements: 16 G Guirado, 17 P Freshwater, 18 K Pulu, 19 R Alvarez Kairelis, 20 N Durand, 21 J Grandclaude, 22 J Porical, 23 Y Parent

Interesting selection.

Can't understand the omission of Freshwater and Durand from the starting XV. Both had a blinder last week.

Have Perpignan conceded defeat in this pool?

The mercurial try scorer starts though.

2040

thomond2006 wrote: »

The mercurial try scorer starts though.

I'd prefer him to be playing than Porical, as good as that try was.

danthefan

thomond2006 wrote: »

All true.

Munster have the pedigree and the experience to win this game.

Bar the scrum and maul, Munster are superior. We have a better fly-half, better back three and better second row. The centres and scrum half are even.

You are really underestimating Perpignan. They are as good as any team in Europe at home, the stats are scary. 'Pedigree' is a nice idea but form is far more important, along with facts like Perpignan have lost 1 of their last 35 home games or somesuch.

Size=everything

thomond2006 wrote: »

Perpignan: 15 P Burger, 14 F Sid, 13 D Marty, 12 M Mermoz, 11 C Manas, 10 G Hume, 9 D Mele, 1 J Schuster, 2 M Tincu, 3 N Mas [capt], 4 O Olibeau, 5 R Tchale Watchou, 6 Y Vivalda, 7 B Guiry, 8 O Tonita.

Replacements: 16 G Guirado, 17 P Freshwater, 18 K Pulu, 19 R Alvarez Kairelis, 20 N Durand, 21 J Grandclaude, 22 J Porical, 23 Y Parent

Interesting selection.

Can't understand the omission of Freshwater and Durand from the starting XV. Both had a blinder last week.

Have Perpignan conceded defeat in this pool?

The mercurial try scorer starts though.

Maybe they simply don't rate the Heineken Cup as highly in France as we do in the UK and Ireland.

danthefan

Size=everything wrote: »

Maybe they simply don't rate the Heineken Cup as highly in France as we do in the UK and Ireland.

There's no way Perpignan will take this game lightly. They were disgusted at losing the game last weekend.

Tim Robbins

danthefan wrote: »

There's no way Perpignan will take this game lightly. They were disgusted at losing the game last weekend.

Can someone please alleviate my complete ignorance and tell me how close to a 1st team Perpignan are playing?

Thanks.

PhatPiggins

Tim Robbins wrote: »

Can someone please alleviate my complete ignorance and tell me how close to a 1st team Perpignan are playing?

Thanks.

They're about six short of the full first team but two of them are on the bench. To be honest bar Henry Tuialigi(spelling!) the guys they have brought in are nearly as good.

Tim Robbins

PhatPiggins wrote: »

They're about six short of the full first team but two of them are on the bench. To be honest bar Henry Tuialigi(spelling!) the guys they have brought in are nearly as good.

Thanks. don't think I'll put money on it so. Cheers. Much appreciated.

shanagarry

Very disappointed to see the same team line out again. It didn't work last week, why's it suddenly going to work on Sunday? McGahan never seems to have a Plan B, and when Plan A doesn't work then we end up in trouble.

Crash

Tim Robbins wrote:

Thanks. don't think I'll put money on it so. Cheers. Much appreciated.

Wouldn't go near it last week, won't this week. Couldn't believe people saying they were putting cash on Munster -9 at 10/11 for the home leg.

Judgement Day

Crash wrote: »

Wouldn't go near it last week, won't this week. Couldn't believe people saying they were putting cash on Munster -9 at 10/11 for the home leg.

Well it's called gambling and sometimes it comes off and sometimes it doesn't. The bookies have Perpignan as favourites to win the match at 4/9 on, so that isn't very tempting, whereas Munster to win by more than 4 is available at 9/2. While the prospects are bad for Munster especially with their unchanged team and Perpignan's home record I'll still give it a lash. More than 18-19 points in the 1st half will probably be available on P.Power tomorrow and should be safe enough. If ROG's game continues to improve and Peter Stringer gets onto the pitch early enough we may still carry the day!

I had Connacht to win by more than 7 tonight so a good start to the weekend.

On RTE's post Leinster programme tonight Hook promised to eat his tie if Munster win and Popey reckons that they are in with a shout.....I believe!!

Hyperbullet

Judgement Day wrote: »

On RTE's post Leinster programme tonight Hook promised to eat his tie if Munster win and Popey reckons that they are in with a shout.....I believe!!

How I would love to see Hook eating his tie. Might shut him up for 10 minutes.

We're up against it today, there's no doubt. I was suprised at Mafi getting a start. Then again if he gets the feet moving again rather than always taking the ball into contact his selection will be justified, then again I may just be biased towards a JDV/Earls combination.

Trotter

Is it just my TV or is the Sky Sports picture very blurry?!

I'm quietly confident here. I think we need ROG to have his place kicking boots on if we're to get anything from the game.

Hyperbullet

Looking for a good all round performance today.

G'WAN MUNSTER!!!

RuggieBear

What's the weather like?

Chucky the tree

RuggieBear wrote: »

What's the weather like?

Suns out but it looks cold and most of the stadium is in a shadow anyway, seems to be very little wind so conditions are very good.

SomeFool

great scrum!!

Insect Overlord

SomeFool wrote: »

great scrum!!

Great try!

Roanmore

Great Try! Fogarty.