Rain water usage in house

T Corolla

Does anyone on this forum use rainwater in their homes for toilets and showers. I have an idea and I want to get opinions from people in the know.
With the introduction of water metering in 2011 what kind of systems are available for rain water collection and storage and use for toilets and showers
Any help always appreciated thanks again

Nukem

This has come a fair bit in schools in the last few years due to the schools being hit with monumental water usage bills

http://www.rainharvesting.ie/?gclid=CJmh_Oj03Z4CFaBb4wodsznuJg

http://www.rainman.ie/

auerillo

T Corolla wrote: »

Does anyone on this forum use rainwater in their homes for toilets and showers. I have an idea and I want to get opinions from people in the know.
With the introduction of water metering in 2011 what kind of systems are available for rain water collection and storage and use for toilets and showers
Any help always appreciated thanks again

It's possible to collect your own rainwater in a tank, and use it for toilets and showers. it's not a "system" exactly, and you can design it yourself or get a plumber/builder to do it for you.

T Corolla

I thinking of doing it. My idea was to get a 1000L tank and put it in the shed.
Pipe a 3/4 pipe from the shed to the house into the attic and buy a seperate attic tank
How do I connect the rain water to the toilets and shower and washing machine

auerillo

T Corolla wrote: »

I thinking of doing it. My idea was to get a 1000L tank and put it in the shed.
Pipe a 3/4 pipe from the shed to the house into the attic and buy a seperate attic tank
How do I connect the rain water to the toilets and shower and washing machine

Remember, if you put your tank into a shed, you'll have to pump the water from there. If you can manage to collect in it a tank in the attic, no pumps wil be needed as gravity will do the work.

If you need to ask how to connect a tank to you loos, and showers etc, then it's probably best you ask a plumber to do it!

baldieman

We do it in our house. The water is great for washing machines. Currently thats all we use it for though. We have 3 1000L tanks against the back wall. We got them pretty cheap, although I'd have to ask my dad where. They were 40euro each. We have an small tank raised upto just below the gutters. We pump the water from the tanks up to the small tank when it empties. We wrecked our pump by leaving it on for two straight. We're getting a new one that costs 50euro. They use very little electricity anyway.

If you are using it for more than just your washing machine then 1000L will not be enough. You'll need atleast 2000L, depending on how many people live with you.

Thats all the help I can give you right now, sorry, I'm not a plumber. Not much use, all common sense anyha. But I'll be keeping an eye on your progress if you'll be good enough to keep the thread going.

Its a great thing to do. Every house in dublin should be doing it. What I think they should do is include it in the BEA rating, and in turn base the property tax (if it ever comes in) upon that. That would give people the incentive. Its a very small investment and it would totally eliminate the possibility of more circumstances like the contamination in Clare & Galway. I mean everyone would have their own supply, not for drinking (only in emergencies although it would be perfectly safe, if not safer than tap-water) but for everything else. I mean ffs, they've been talking about building a pipe from the Shannon to Dublin because Dublin's water issues are major. This is a much better solution, and its very cheap. I hope the water charges will be a good incentive.

Accidentally used my dads ID, this is Mozart1986.

auerillo

baldieman wrote: »

...If you are using it for more than just your washing machine then 1000L will not be enough. You'll need atleast 2000L, depending on how many people live with you.

This got me wondering how many litres my washing machine uses per wash, as 2000 litres for a washing machine seems excessive.

http://www.uswitch.com/water/how-much-water-use/ suggests that a washing machine uses 65 litres per wash. With 2000 litres in a tank, that suggests it will last for over 30 washes.

baldieman

auerillo wrote: »

This got me wondering how many litres my washing machine uses per wash, as 2000 litres for a washing machine seems excessive.

http://www.uswitch.com/water/how-much-water-use/ suggests that a washing machine uses 65 litres per wash. With 2000 litres in a tank, that suggests it will last for over 30 washes.

We only use it for our washing machine currently. He was thinking of using it for his toilets/showers. You wouldn't have had to go find that link if yo'd have read the post:p. No offense, just bein' sarcy. For a single washing machine you could get away with a 750L tank I'd say, and it'd never empty.

T Corolla

Would it be better to build a concrete tank underground 3000L capacity.
I did not realise that I would need that much water. My idea was to dig a hole and build a tank similar to a septic tank and pumping it into the attic into a smaller tank
Expensive in the short term but would pay for itself

auerillo

T Corolla wrote: »

Would it be better to build a concrete tank underground 3000L capacity.
I did not realise that I would need that much water. My idea was to dig a hole and build a tank similar to a septic tank and pumping it into the attic into a smaller tank
Expensive in the short term but would pay for itself

If you want it to supply a washing machine and two or three loos, you can work out how much you will need quite simply. Each loo needs 8litres x 35 flushes per week ( ie 280 litres per loo per week), and if you use the washing machine 7 times per week you will need 455 litres for the washing machine.

If you have 3 loos and 1 washing machine you'll need 1295 litres per week. then you'll have to assume you don't have any rain for 2 or 3 weeks so 3000 or 4000 litres storage capacityseems a good rule of thumb.

Remember, you should have the ability to switch back to mains water in the event of your tank drying up.

baldieman

T Corolla wrote: »

Would it be better to build a concrete tank underground 3000L capacity.
I did not realise that I would need that much water. My idea was to dig a hole and build a tank similar to a septic tank and pumping it into the attic into a smaller tank
Expensive in the short term but would pay for itself

http://www.shaymurtagh.ie/Rainman.aspx
Thats a company that do concrete underground tanks. They pipe is to the bottom so the ingoing water stirs the bottom water and stops sediment build-up. To use it for showers you may have to think about putting chlorine in it. I personally wouldn't, as I think its a load of nonsense, but there can be bacteria in the water that comes off your roof from bird-****. There would only be trace amounts so I think that just nonsense, but you'd have to decide for yourself. Anyway, you can use it for your toilet and washing-machine regardless.

Mozart1986 again.

Auerillo has it about right anyha. With 4,000 you should be fine, but you might still need the mains just in case. It also depends on how many people you are living with.

I built my house three years ago and planned a rainwater harvesting system right from the start, basically I have a tank in the loft feeding the toilets and two inlet pipes to it one from the mains and another from the rainwater underground tank.

A pump would be used to transfer the water from the underground tank to the loft tank.

At the moment the system is not completed, the plumbing in the house is ready to go but the tank and the feed pipes from the gutters are yet to be installed, other projects were of a higher priority. The introduction of water charges will push this up the list to get completed.

I did consider the idea of making it completely passive, but that would have required a tank located about 1.2metres above the floor (just above the toilet cisterns) and all the rainwater filtering just below the gutters and the pipework from the gutters at head height! With the right type of house design it could be perfectly possible to do.

baldieman

Deleted User wrote: »

I built my house three years ago and planned a rainwater harvesting system right from the start, basically I have a tank in the loft feeding the toilets and two inlet pipes to it one from the mains and another from the rainwater underground tank.

A pump would be used to transfer the water from the underground tank to the loft tank.

At the moment the system is not completed, the plumbing in the house is ready to go but the tank and the feed pipes from the gutters are yet to be installed, other projects were of a higher priority. The introduction of water charges will push this up the list to get completed.

I did consider the idea of making it completely passive, but that would have required a tank located about 1.2metres above the floor (just above the toilet cisterns) and all the rainwater filtering just below the gutters and the pipework from the gutters at head height! With the right type of house design it could be perfectly possible to do.

Its funny how the so-called "sceptics" are actually the most active greens:rolleyes:. Maybe being sceptical is, along with the benefits of being practically green, a tad closer to reality?!?

Mozart1986 again

baldieman

baldieman wrote: »

Its funny how the so-called "sceptics" are actually the most active greens:rolleyes:. Maybe being sceptical is, along with the benefits of being practically green, a tad closer to reality?!?

Mozart1986 again

It's because I actually look into the science and try to understand what is going on and also knowing that man does have an effect and trying to personally reduce that effect.

But I don't buy the carbon tax!!! nor do I want to pay so that others can pollute unessessarily.

Also I still believe that the majority of climate change is natural variation, but at the same time I want to minimise ny contribution!

pinc

Why is assumed that rainwater isn't good enough to drink? The group water scheme water here in Galway isn't drinkable without a filter so I assume water from the sky should be better if a covered guttering system is used??

Mozart1986

pinc wrote: »

Why is assumed that rainwater isn't good enough to drink? The group water scheme water here in Galway isn't drinkable without a filter so I assume water from the sky should be better if a covered guttering system is used??

I would drink it. But we live in a highly regulated system. If a company was aloud to advertise and install systems that weren't 100% safe, then whiners would be up on the Joe Duffy Show complaining about tummy aches and other such maladies. I think its BS, and all you need to do is to run the water through the some fine stones, occasionally emptying & washing the stones. There are, obviously, even more simple ways of filtering the water, but you really don't need to go to much effort.

T Corolla

I would not drink it for the fact there are chemicals in the roof tiles and slates.

T Corolla

T Corolla wrote: »

I would not drink it for the fact there are chemicals in the roof tiles and slates.

The tiles and slates are quite benign compared to the lead flashing!

Mozart1986

T Corolla wrote: »

I would not drink it for the fact there are chemicals in the roof tiles and slates.

The tiles and slates are quite benign compared to the lead flashing!

This is the kind of nonsense I'm talkin' about. Panicky whining about health and safety.

1) We were talkin' about showering/bathing, so unless you ingest a lot of water during your showers then thats not really an issue.

2) As far as drinking it is concerned I mentioned it as a reserve supply, so unless you believe in homeopathy then the trace amounts on a short term basis would make no effect.

Dublin's water supply is precarious. When you look at the issues that Clare & Galway had in seperate incidents in recent years, and you compare their populations to that of Dublin, you can see the problems that those responsible for Dublin's water supply have.

Re-reading my post, I realise it may have been misleading. I didn't mean that I would drink it all the time, but that it would not be dangerous to drink it if need be. Long term those trace amounts might effectual. Even so, thats being cautious - maybe reasonably cautious, but cautious.

Mozart1986

Mozart1986 wrote: »

This is the kind of nonsense I'm talkin' about. Panicky whining about health and safety.
.

I was highlighting the fact that there is nothing to really worry about in the tiles and slates, but I wouldn't drink unfiltered water that has been through lead!

PS: my first house had lead pipes and the very first job I did on it was replace the plumbing.

Mozart1986

Deleted User wrote: »

I was highlighting the fact that there is nothing to really worry about in the tiles and slates, but I wouldn't drink unfiltered water that has been through lead!

PS: my first house had lead pipes and the very first job I did on it was replace the plumbing.

Yeah, sorry, I should'nt have been so dramatic. Lead pipes is one thing though. That has a long term effect. I would always drink mains supply, but it would always be good to have a reserve supply in a crisis. Dublin council know that they are seriously stretched and if one reservoir had a problem then hundreds of thousands of people would be screwed. Thats why they wanted to build a pipe-line to the shannon.

Mahatma coat

At a few of our locations here in Australia rainwater is the ONLY option. we dig large Dams and pomp and filter it to the houses and livestock.

the main farmhouse in the forest is fed by a 10000 litre tank which collects rainwater from the macninery shed roof and is about 3M above the floor level of te house, took a while to Fill at first but its decent for a shower now so all good.

ccsolar

I Have a 400 gallon stainless steel tank collecting rain water from gutter.
i also connected the mains supply 3/4 of the way down the tank,with ball cock fitted, this only works if the tank runs low of rain water,
I then pump the water to the attic with a 1.5 hp pump,
The water is way better than the mains supply and even in summer if the water is off we can manage with the tank for up to 5 days without rain.
Have to recommend it even for drinking with the right filters.
The cost of running the pump is very low also and you can use 2 twypes of systems for the pump, 1 is pressurised and the other is a float in your attic tank with a switch.

CC

M_Cannon

Hi All,

I put in a rainwater harvesting system about a year ago and am very happy with it. We use it for toilets, showers, washing machines & outdoor use. The soft water is great and does not corrode the showers etc. It also significantly cuts down on the amounts of mains water we use, which will be very useful when the meters kick in.

If you install the system when you are building the house you cut down significantly on the installation cost. My plumber installed the system for no extra cost (he plumbed the house as well) and all it really cost me was €200 for backfill pea gravel.

I went for the plastic tank because on the basis of the research I did, concrete tanks have potential leaching issues - where chemicals from the concrete leach into the water and could cause skin rashes etc. I purchased <snip> and I would recommend them to anyone else considering rainwater harvesting.

Modnote: No shilling allowed, I'm afraid.

BostonB

How does it work, the general gist of it? How does it integrate with the mains feed?

Pete M.

I also have RWH.
Underground 10,000L tank, feeding jax & washing machine.
Works fine, even drank some during cold spell when mains was frozen and still not dead
Submersible pump in tank, pressure controlled feeds header tank in attic which in turn feeds toilets and WM.
Can cross over also to use all mains or all RW.
Tank was empty for a while in mid March, quite remarkable I thought.
Twas only the second time in three years that it emptied.
Tis no biggie though, can just switch over easily to mains.
Highly recommended.

John Mason

i was talking about this last week.

is there a company who do this kind of thing ? in my head it seems simple enough but ..............

i would like to get started on this summer before the charges are brought in and the cost of everything would go through the roof.

so has anyone any ideas where i should start ?


up until about 4 years ago my gran had a big oil type plastic container that collected rain water and she would just use a bucket to lift water out to fill toilets, cooking etc. during the summer months, water the garden - she wasnt a green nut or anything but thats what she had always done and hated waste - probably the farm girl in her. it got me thinking when everyone ran out of water in january, that gran would have been fine.

i want to get a bit of self sufficentnacy back. when all the people in work lost water, i asked them if they had left their wheelie bins open to catch the rain and snow and they all looked at me as if i was some looney

Just start simple by putting waterbutts under your rainwater downpipes.
Very low tech, and very cheap if you can get the barrels surplus from a local industrial unit.

Pete M.

My tank has been empty for the past 6 weeks at least and the wee drop of rain there's been in the interim wouldn't fill a tea cup really.

Gets me to thinking that one should consider strategically using the water in it.
But I suppose that's what experience teaches one.

There has been some significant concern in my part of the world lately with regard to the public water supply too.
Local reservoirs are lower than they've been for years, the water that does get supplied is very coloured, bottom of the barrel stuff, supply is turned off between 8pm and 8am.
And imagine how much of that reservoir went out through leaks:eek:

Mahatma coat

Deleted User wrote: »

Just start simple by putting waterbutts under your rainwater downpipes.
Very low tech, and very cheap if you can get the barrels surplus from a local industrial unit.

Good Idea, but I'd be wary about using Industrial Barrels to catch water for Domestic use, Its worth springin a few quid for some decent containers, this is afterall gonna be consumed by you and your family.

those 55L Plastic dustbins would be a start,

altho if you look around there are a few barrel type thingys with screwtop sealable lids

Mahatma coat

Ohhhhh, AND , Make sure to clean yer Gutters regularly

aah yes

Rain water is a handy back up to mains or well fed water, and really only needs a bit of carbon scavenging to polish it up, and ultraviolet treatment to kill the bird poo and algae, etc.

Use RO for lead issues and as a belt and braces back up, if other problem parameters exist, if you want to drink the pre-treated water after. Check for pH reductions in rainwater, sometimes they are an issue and can be quite low, affecting pipes etc.

Buck_Rodgers_

HI , Also a company called <ahem, no shilling please - taconnol>

congo_90

interesting thread and replies. something that's been on my mind lately. I have 2mains fed tanks in the attic which supply all water appliances. how would I go about integrating my current gutters back in and to the tanks. the gutters are approx .5m below level of tanks so gravity is ruled out? the water from the tank is pumped to appliances etc. thanks!

aah yes

Get feeds from all sides of the roof gutters, and divert into a central collection point at ground level, via a sand trap (big 100 Litre size collection pit filled with layeres of chippings and sand) to filter out large particulates like moss, bird poo and other environmental dusts that collect on the roof.

Channel into a 1000 litre tank next to and below sand trap outside of house, with float level switch in second attic tank to activate a 0.5 HP pump which then sends water to the second attic tank from the 1000 litre tank.

Arrange ballcock feed from mains water feed lower down in the first attic tank so the 1000 litre raintank gets priority in the fill water to the second attic tank which should be cross fed from the first attic tank and has the plumbed feeds to bathrooms and appliances, and starts to empty first out of the two attic tanks.

If a lot of water is used at any point and both tanks start to lower in their fill levels, there will be an offset delay in the first tank to the second tank in the water level dropping and finally the mains will kick in on the re-positioned mains ballcock if a lot of rainwater re-fill is being used.

Look at geting a carbon gac in out cylinder to polish up the rainwater before being fed to attic tanks. Weigh up the use of a 5 gpm ultraviolet lamp after the carbon cylinder, or a submersible ultraviolet lamp in the second attic tank, or both.

Mahatma coat

Mahatma coat wrote: »

Good Idea, but I'd be wary about using Industrial Barrels to catch water for Domestic use,

Depends what they had in them before, mine had orange juice.

Feargal as Luimneach

I use my water butt to collect water for my ponds. The water flow from water butt keeps the water quality good in pond (have newts and frogs:)).
Here's some photos from a different thread.http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055899571&highlight=photographic+pond&page=3

recedite

If you have, or can have, a well on the property, then that is in effect a rainwater harvester. Using the ground as a filter.

recedite

recedite wrote: »

If you have, or can have, a well on the property, then that is in effect a rainwater harvester. Using the ground as a filter.

Interesting idea, do you mean by having a soakaway adjacent/above to the well?

recedite

Not necessarily, there would be a soakaway near the house alright, but where does a well get its water from? Rainfall in the surrounding areas.

210

I saw water quality test results from roof water which was being harvested and used as the main water supply for a house a few months back. The level of bacteria was very high - coming I assume from bird droppings. The owner had then to install a system for purifying the water to allow for safe use for drinking & washing. The water would be fine for toilets or watering the garden but I would be very wary of using it for showers or washing with.

looksee

Fifty-odd years ago I lived in a council house in England and we had three taps in the kitchen. The normal hot and cold and an extra one that took rainwater from a tank on the roof and was used for hair washing etc, as the mains water was very hard and unpleasant to use for washing. It was a very simple system - in an area with very dirty air, before any clean air acts - and I do not recall any fuss about cleaning and filtering

recedite

It probably strengthened your immune system

duffman21

Hi All,

I am planning on starting my build in March and i am serioucly thinking about using rain water harvesting. I think it is a no brainer due to the introduction of water charges and due to the fact the water is alot softer (mains water is extremely hard in my area).

I would like to know what type of systems people went for. I have heard mixed opinions about plastic, concrete and steel tanks and would like to hear from anyone who has installed them and what they think (good, bad etc)

I have spoken to a few companies and they differ in opinion on whether rwh should be used for showers (toilets, washing machine and outide taps where the recommended uses). Has anyone setup there system to use rain water in their showers and if so what were the results?

congo_90

sorry to drag up an old thread but this is still on the board. I don't want a ground based system. I ideally I want to collect to the tanks in the attic directly
from the gutters as water in a barrel at ground level requires further plumbing and pumping and complications to make the tank feed off of it until empty then feed off mains.

some noted problems;

Its frosty out and outdoor pipes/water supplies are liable to freezing.

cost of system including low water sensor in barrel.

in my case of direct feed unless the water is in use it must drain via overflow which despite being put in wrong as per regulations I cannot touch.