Belfast to Porto

Gallant_JJ

As the title of the thread suggests I’m planning on driving to Porto in Portugal, in the middle of January. Going with a group of lads from college, 5 of us in total. Have a big enough car, a S60 D5 so should be a relatively comfortable trip!! It will undoubtedly be a heavy load though, 5 good big lumps of men, a full boot and a full tank.

The plan is to make Porto in 2 days, stay for 3 and then take 4 days meandering through France and Spain on the way back.

Hoping to leave Belfast on the Friday morning, get a ferry from Dublin to Holyhead about 8ish, a ferry from Dover to Calais about 9.30pm and drive solid from Calais to Porto, obviously interchanging drivers, taking about 26hrs, hopefully arriving in Porto for a night on the tear on the Saturday. All subject to change of course!
Have ferries booked home for the following Sunday, but we choose the flexifare option so we are going to play it by ear, and just see where we end up. Have nothing booked accommodation wise, hoping just to stay in youth hostels, wherever we arrive.

Worked out costs at roughly €1000, including return ferry Dublin to Holyhead €350, return ferry Dover to Calais €90, €80 on tolls and roughly €500 for diesel. It’s a journey of approximately 3,400 miles, hopefully achievable doing a minimum of 37mpg, getting diesel at anything under €1.20 a litre. Would anyone have any indication of the cost of diesel in both Spain and France?

Any advice from anyone who has done a similar trip would be greatly appreciated. I know there is a need for hi viz vests for all occupants to be kept in the car, and 2 warning triangles for Spain. Going to bring a spare set of bulbs and a first aid kit too. Is it sufficient to get the headlight stickers for the car or should I get the lights properly readjusted?

Any other tips or advice would be greatly appreciated, thanks.

Mr Benevolent

Bring snow tires if you can and some cold weather gear. Lots and lots of snow in Spain and Portugal in January, not to mention Germany and France. It'll be freezing, much worse than Ireland, with treacherous icy roads etc, especially in Portugal (the economy is dreadful in the non-tourist parts of the country).

Gallant_JJ

Thanks for that. Checking there, of the 1700kms between Calais and Porto, only 60km are non motorway. Should the motorways be ok, or could there be an issue with snow on them too. Unfortunately the budget is tight, snow tyres may be out of the question.

Tragedy

Are you sure 3 big guys will be comfortable in the back of the S60? The middle seat is small enough, and there isn't oodles of legroom to go around to start with

Gallant_JJ

Think width wise it should be ok, but your right about the leg room. It is tight enough, but the other options are a 1.5d clio and a 1.2 clio unfortunately. Originally we had planned to take 2 cars but neither of the above were deemed suitable. Costs work out a lot better with a full car too. Glad I won't be in the back. For such a big car the lack of leg room in the back is extremely annoying.

Victor

Five lads, that far and winter do not sound safe.

You could fly Ryanair via Stansted for half the price and spend more time in Porto chasing girls.

Mr Benevolent

Victor wrote: »

Five lads, that far and winter do not sound safe.

You could fly Ryanair via Stansted for half the price and spend more time in Porto chasing girls.

A very good point, but since it'll be mostly on motorways they might be ok. A lot of mass if the car hits black ice though. An extra four aboard and their stuff will make the mileage a fair bit worse (I'm guessing 10-20% worse), and the back seat of an S60 is not a comfortable place for any 6'+ guys to be for a long time. You probably won't need snow tires on the motorway either and they probably wouldn't be practical anyway.

Overall not the best time of year to be doing it, especially all in one car. If you do attempt it let us know how it goes :eek: See here for a similar thread.

Theta

Make sure you have all your safety gear in your car for going through France. If you are stopped by the plod they will fine you!!!

cascade35

Fair play to ye lads, wish Ye the best of luck on the journey. The french police love on the spot fines, As mentioned you need a car safety kit and driver at least should have a high vis jacket on, not sure about passengers (someone here will know)If you get done for speeding they will escort you to a cash point if you have not enough cash on you to pay the fine.

Hey bring some magic tree airfreshners 5 lads in a car for 26 hours lol

alias no.9

Have you considered a ferry from the UK to Spain? Brittany Ferries do Plymouth to Santander in northern Spain, there may be other options too.

edit... scratch that idea, they look like they take January off on that route

Gallant_JJ

Thanks lads for the help and from some, encouragement.

Checked out most other options alright. The Brittany Ferries sailing doesnt go in January from what I can make out, and none of the Ireland to France sailing start till March.

Looking at it as a bit of an adventure, not too pushed on flying because of that.

Are the French cops strict on enforcing speed limits? Likewise the Spanish cops?

bazzachazza

Yes both police forces are tough on speeders, if its a fixed camera you won't get a fine but if they chase you/ stop you they will drag you to cop shop and ATM to pay up.

Be sensible and the trip should be a breeze. Be cautious when driving overnight and around the Pyrenees. If its not cold expect it to be very wet. Snow tyres are useless unless you expect snow all the way. Put on new tyres instead. Make sure you have a high vis jacket for everyone in the car and spare bulbs.

Owldshtok

Going through France I found the police more inclined to check foreign reg. vehicles around the famous wine districts for drink driving,after sampling wines,instead of speeding on motorways in general...and in saying that,it might be a good idea to veer towards wine instead of beer because among five big lads there's bound to be one or two legendary farters.Imagine that with 5 of ye crammed into the car!
Have a great time.Its MUCH BETTER than flying when you have the time and money

bijapos

Motorways are almost always kept free of snow and ice, you would have to be in the middle of a snow storm to be caught out, but in my experience they usually react very quickly.

Consider taking a ferry from portsmouth (or elsewhere) to Cherbourg, did this route from Malaga to Dublin via the Uk a couple of months ago and its good motorway or dual carraigeway all the way. Might save you some time.

bazzachazza

He's a student and Cherbourg costs money and time. Its about €300 and a 6 hour crossing. https://www.brittany-ferries.co.uk/index.cfm?st=f4

Stick with Dover its only 5-6 hours from Holyhead. When you leave Holyhead go passed Chester towards Manchester on the M56 and join the M6 south. Go clockwise around the M25 around London the roads tend to be clearer that way. Be advised there are loads of speed cameras on the back of the overhead motorway signs all the way around the M25.

For petrol prices see here http://www.aaireland.ie/petrolprices/

and I use this website for routeplanning their tolls are very accurate. http://www.viamichelin.com/

Friend of mine in work when he goes on holiday usually drives to south of France and into Italy. He always says the late Dublin ferry after 9pm getting in after midnight is great for driving in England as the roads are dead you will be in France by 9ish am. He also says take your spare tyre out fill the spare tyres space with bags and put the tyre and kit in a Black bag on top of everything in the boot. Much easier to get too and saves you emptying the boot on the side of a motorway in the rain. Now he usually has a roof box and puts it in there but this way will work.

c4cat

Gallant_JJ wrote: »

As the title of the thread suggests I’m planning on driving to Porto in Portugal, in the middle of January. Going with a group of lads from college, 5 of us in total. Have a big enough car, a S60 D5 so should be a relatively comfortable trip!! It will undoubtedly be a heavy load though, 5 good big lumps of men, a full boot and a full tank.

The plan is to make Porto in 2 days, stay for 3 and then take 4 days meandering through France and Spain on the way back.

Hoping to leave Belfast on the Friday morning, get a ferry from Dublin to Holyhead about 8ish, a ferry from Dover to Calais about 9.30pm and drive solid from Calais to Porto, obviously interchanging drivers, taking about 26hrs, hopefully arriving in Porto for a night on the tear on the Saturday. All subject to change of course!
Have ferries booked home for the following Sunday, but we choose the flexifare option so we are going to play it by ear, and just see where we end up. Have nothing booked accommodation wise, hoping just to stay in youth hostels, wherever we arrive.

Worked out costs at roughly €1000, including return ferry Dublin to Holyhead €350, return ferry Dover to Calais €90, €80 on tolls and roughly €500 for diesel. It’s a journey of approximately 3,400 miles, hopefully achievable doing a minimum of 37mpg, getting diesel at anything under €1.20 a litre. Would anyone have any indication of the cost of diesel in both Spain and France?

Any advice from anyone who has done a similar trip would be greatly appreciated. I know there is a need for hi viz vests for all occupants to be kept in the car, and 2 warning triangles for Spain. Going to bring a spare set of bulbs and a first aid kit too. Is it sufficient to get the headlight stickers for the car or should I get the lights properly readjusted?

Any other tips or advice would be greatly appreciated, thanks.

Why drive down to Dublin? take the ferry over to Scotland from Belfast, You got Tolls to pay for in ROI, Ferry from Dublin is more expensive and the roads through wales are not the best either. Where as you have motor way all the way down from Scotland

bazzachazza

roads through wales are not the best either

A5 is top notch, I agree on the price of the ferry.

Stranraer to dover is 493 miles

Belfast-Dublin-Dover is 476 miles

Google maps directions says go Belfast-Stranraer

http://maps.google.co.uk/

Winty

Porto is a great town the people and food is top class, stay in the Guest House Douro

http://www.guesthousedouro.com/

We had our honneymoon there

Alun

c4cat wrote: »

Why drive down to Dublin? take the ferry over to Scotland from Belfast, You got Tolls to pay for in ROI, Ferry from Dublin is more expensive and the roads through wales are not the best either. Where as you have motor way all the way down from Scotland

There's quite a considerable stretch of single carriageway road (A75) from Stranraer to the M6, a good 150km IIRC. Give me the A55 dual-carriageway along the North Wales coast any time!

ToxicPaddy

Dropped you a pm..

Tox

Cionád

This handy website gives up to date fuel prices for France: http://www.prix-carburants.gouv.fr/

I'd recommend a Sat-nav that maps the speed cams - came in handy

And don't try to smuggle anything back, we were searched last year on the motorway by 'Douane' (Customs), and then again at the port! - Wasn't helped by the Moroccan stamp in my passport

Gallant_JJ

Thanks for that lads, thanks too Tox. Never did french but i'm guessing from the above website the price of diesel ranges from .99 to 1.20 cent/lt. Not too bad at all, presuming I'm looking at the right digit! Have a newish Garmin sat nav. It has the average speed cameras in aound Newry on it as far as I recall, so I presume it may contain some of the ones in England. If you get flashed in France is it possible for the authorities to catch up with you?
Car has just been serviced too and fitted with 4 new tyres so hoping for a nice smooth trip!

antomorro-sei

Although I've no advice or anything to ad here, I think that's epic what you lot are doing. I'd love to go on a drive through Europe.

Cionád

Gallant_JJ wrote: »

Never did french but i'm guessing from the above website the price of diesel ranges from .99 to 1.20 cent/lt. Not too bad at all, presuming I'm looking at the right digit!

Yep, Gazole is diesel, supermarkets will have cheaper fuel, and the most expensive will be on the motorways. - The motorways rest areas are great for rest stops though.

Have a newish Garmin sat nav. It has the average speed cameras in aound Newry on it as far as I recall, so I presume it may contain some of the ones in England. If you get flashed in France is it possible for the authorities to catch up with you?

I had an oldish Garmin and that did the job with the camera detection. Not sure if they can catch up to you if your photographed but the fines are steep if you are caught by a handheld (and they will bring you yo an ATM if you don't have the money). Garmin should also warn you of mobile camera zones.

dingding

Also you will need sterling on you to pay for the dartford tunnel on the M25.

Think it is only a couple of quid.

bazzachazza

Is it not the Queen Elizabeth bridge you cross on the M25.

I heard the French police can get a live link to the fixed speed cameras and have cop cars up the road to stop you or so a bloke on the ferry said on the way back in march after he got pulled.

bazzachazza

The Dartford Crossing, which consists of two tunnels and the QE2 (Queen Elizabeth II) bridge, is named Canterbury Way

Ah there is two methods we took the bridge

rugbyman

your estimate of the tolls could be doubled. about 70 through France, calais to Bordeaux, one way. i know nothing of spanish tolls. My estimate for whole trip 220 plus.

your plan to drive non stop means you will all arrive knackered in Porto. Can you not leave earlier. France has plenty of cheap Hotels . approx 40 euro for a three people room, .they are at junctions of the motorway.

one person on here recommended shipping out of Dublin on the night boat to Holyhead. this is an excellent idea, the run through the UK at night is a doddle.

there is no need to speed on French motorways. the speed limit is 130 km( approx 79 mph).

regards, rugbyman

Victor

bazzachazza wrote: »

Ah there is two methods we took the bridge

The tunnels were there first. When the bridge was built, the tunnels became northbound and the bridge southbound.

Gallant_JJ

Thanks again lads for your help. One more quick question, is driving soild for 20hrs plus bad for the car? Overheating etc. She has had a full service within the last 1000 miles and and a full Volvo service history to date.

Mr Benevolent

Thanks again lads for your help. One more quick question, is driving soild for 20hrs plus bad for the car? Overheating etc. She has had a full service within the last 1000 miles and and a full Volvo service history to date.

Not at all, in fact it'll probably be good for the car.

Victor

Of course, its sensible to take a break every 2 hours and to check the vehicle for oil, water, tyres, lights, etc. every few hundred km.

Oh, gerry can!

antodeco

Sounds like a great idea! You should try and get a camera mounted on the dash for the trip and then speed it up superfast when you get back. Would like kinda cool. Just make sure your insurance covers you for when you are abroad and that the others in the car have open drive to drive the Volvo. Bring all paperwork with you aswell, just in case.

Bring some thermal blankets (just in case) and a jerry can of petrol.
Bring some spare oil
Make sure you have all the gear for changing the tyres.
Possibly no harm to get a can of tyreweld just in case.
Bring plenty of water for yourselves, and coolant for the car.
Check tyre pressures after any of the long stints just in case.
Keep to the speed limit! - You will be a bit giddy from the journey, so more likely to get a bit "wild" whilst driving.

Drive safe and have fun!

Matt Simis

bazzachazza wrote: »

Be sensible and the trip should be a breeze. Be cautious when driving overnight and around the Pyrenees. If its not cold expect it to be very wet. Snow tyres are useless unless you expect snow all the way. Put on new tyres instead. Make sure you have a high vis jacket for everyone in the car and spare bulbs.

Sigh, what is it with Boardies and the anti Winter tyres slant all the time? I assume you are refering to Winters, not actual Snow tyres.
Braking in the Wet at 2c outside (at best?) with a car overloaded on totally unsuited Summer tires is going to be a hair raising experience. It would be alot safer with Winters, nothing do with Snow, its the temp is the issue for Summers.

As said before, Winter tyres outperform summers in all conditions when ambient temp is 7degrees Celsius and below. And Im guessing its going to be below 7c across Europe, inc here, in January.

Tragedy

I don't think most boardsies know the difference between snow, winter and summer tyres to be honest.

bazzachazza

Matt Simis wrote: »

Sigh, what is it with Boardies and the anti Winter tyres slant all the time? I assume you are refering to Winters, not actual Snow tyres.
Braking in the Wet at 2c outside (at best?) with a car overloaded on totally unsuited Summer tires is going to be a hair raising experience. It would be alot safer with Winters, nothing do with Snow, its the temp is the issue for Summers.

As said before, Winter tyres outperform summers in all conditions when ambient temp is 7degrees Celsius and below. And Im guessing its going to be below 7c across Europe, inc here, in January.

Whats with boardsies and not reading the OP's post he is a STUDENT so unless you are paying for him to buy WINTER tyres I somehow doubt he can afford to change them.

Del2005

antodeco wrote: »

Sounds like a great idea! You should try and get a camera mounted on the dash for the trip and then speed it up superfast when you get back. Would like kinda cool. Just make sure your insurance covers you for when you are abroad and that the others in the car have open drive to drive the Volvo. Bring all paperwork with you aswell, just in case.

The driving other peoples car extentsion on most policies only applies in the country of issue. I called my insurance co about driving in NI and was told I wasn't covered. Make sure all drivers are on the Volvo's policy or have a letter from each insurance company saying thet are covered.

Also get your insurance company to send you a Spainish bail bond so you don't get lifted if in an accident.

Del2005

bazzachazza wrote: »

Whats with boardsies and not reading the OP's post he is a STUDENT so unless you are paying for him to buy WINTER tyres I somehow doubt he can afford to change them.

He's a student who's going on a long journey in the depth of winter across mainland Europe. The posters here are trying to get them all back safely and if they are willing to spend a couple of thousand Euro on the trip 4 proper winter tyres will only cost them less then 100 pounds each.

Matt Simis

Del2005 wrote: »

He's a student who's going on a long journey in the depth of winter across mainland Europe. The posters here are trying to get them all back safely and if they are willing to spend a couple of thousand Euro on the trip 4 proper winter tyres will only cost them less then 100 pounds each.

I totally agree that just because the OP is a student (and assumed to be some sort of begger) that it doesnt magically make his off the shelf Summers perform safely on a cross continent Winter trip. You would get there and the better educated locals would rightly assume you are some sort of motoring retard.

If cost drives you over safety:
The beauty of Winters is you downsize them vs your Summers (ie narrower), so they are cheaper than one might think:
http://ssl.delti.com/cgi-bin/rshop.pl?suchen=Ordern&cart_id=13644103.124.2340&ranzahl=4&Breite=215&Quer=45&Felge=17&Speed=H&Transport=P&dsco=124&sowigan=Wi&kategorie=6&Ang_pro_Seite=20&sort_by=preis
[Im just guessing an appropiate wheel/tyre size for the Volvo, OP can price the correct set]

From EUR63 per wheel (budget) to EUR150 ish (start of brand names) its not expensive at all to get 4 Winters. They would obviously easily last the trip and he could put them on next Winter too, extending the life of his Summers and having the safest and best performing driving experience here and abroad.



I feed like a broken record here, its not rocket science, why are people so god damn stuck in this anti-Winter tyres mentality here (UK and Ireland)? There is no "justification" for putting heads in sand. Winters are better for Winter, anywhere in Europe, its a fact, not an argument. Does no one actually research before opening mouth?

Gallant_JJ

Right Lads, off in the morning wish me luck. Here's hoping there's no snow!

Mr Benevolent

Gallant_JJ wrote: »

Right Lads, off in the morning wish me luck. Here's hoping there's no snow!

Good luck, enjoy the experience!

antodeco

Good luck and safe journey!

rok

sounds like a good Road Trip! bon voyage

Gallant_JJ

Well Lads, some trip, 4001 miles exactly, 67:39 hours of driving, 59mph average, 10.5 days. Phenomenal craic. Would hit the road again in the morning.

Managed to hit Leon, Porto, Bilbao, Vitoria, Mincioux, Toulouse, Millau, Firminy, St Etienne, Lyon, la Tourette, Paris, Cambridge and Birmingham.

Stayed 1 night in Leon, 3 in Porto, 2 in Bilbao, 1 in Tolouse and 1 in St Etienne. The first and last nights we just kept motoring.

Firstly must commend the Volvo, took all in its stride. I never really appreciated the quality and power of the car till now. Extremely comfortable ride, little or no complaints from anyone. Complaints usually were resolved by an air change!! Kept the two front seats slightly further forward than usual. Ample leg room in the back. Loads of boot space for luggage. Between car, passengers, baggage and fuel, I’d say it wasn’t far from carrying 2.5 tonnes. The pulling power the car has is savage, had no trouble with the load. It sat at 85mph comfortably at 2500rpm. No bother to it either to sit well over 100 when pushing it on. It really excelled on some of the inclines we faced in the French mountains, savage torque. Fuel economy too was good, even when pushing it on. Worked it out roughly at in around 39/40mpg. The onboard computer says 43.9mpg. The one fill of diesel took the car from 100 miles north of Paris, the whole way home. Only attention the car needed the whole trip was a parking light bulb and washer fluid, hardly even used a drop of oil. Great car for the journey!


Basically left Belfast at half 12 on the Thursday and had made Leon on Spain by half 10 on the Friday. 22hrs inclusive of the ferries, 17.5hrs driving. Went on the tear there, seen a few buildings on the Saturday morning and finished the last 270 miles, arriving in Porto about 2ish. Road conditions couldn’t have been better the entire journey. Some remaining snow along roads in north Wales, but the roads were fine. The sun was splitting the stones the majority of the way through France. Beautiful drive meandering through the mountains around San Sebastian in particular.

Stayed in Porto till the Tuesday morning. Porto is a fabulous city, lovely people, cheap accommodation, very cheap drink and some wonderful modern architecture. Leon too is a lovely city, quite cheap, great tapas. From the wee bit I seen it seemed like a real Spanish city.

On the Tuesday morning we hit the road for Bilbao. Took about 7 hours. Bilbao too has some great buildings, but the night life seemed quite sleazy, it could have been just the areas we happened to hit upon though! Drink unfortunately was by no means cheap.

On the Thurday morning we to the relatively short skip across the border to Toulouse, stopping in a lovely wee village, Mincioux for refreshments en route. I think approximately a 4.5 hr drive.

The drive on Friday was absolutely stunning. We wanted to hit roughly for Lyon taking in the Millau Bridge along the way. We wanted to approach the bridge from the valley below, instead of taking the motorway. Unbelievable drive meandering through the French countryside. It took about 3 hours to reach Millau where we spent about 2 hrs checking out the bridge, crossing it twice. It took another 4.5hrs cross country to reach St Etienne. Some of the mountains and valleys we crossed on this journey were stunning. In a few of the higher regions the roads were still covered in snow but only for short stretches. , It was a little hairy driving across frozen roads with 2.5 tonnes of car, men, baggage and fuel and 300m crevices to one side. Had to pull in on one occasion to let the brakes cool. Well worth it though, the bridge itself is magnificent.

Stayed that night in St Etienne. Visited loads of buildings around Firminy, Lyon and la Tourette. Hit the road late that evening for Calais with the intention of getting a hostel somewhere along the journey. The journey was expected to be about 8 hrs. Instead of sleep we decided to hit into Paris for a few hours to see the usual stuff, the Eiffel Tower, the Louvre, Pompidou Centre etc. 4 of us had never been in Paris before so it was a great experience. Seeing the Eiffel tower at midnight was nice. Would have been great to have a cailin deas under the arm though instead of 4 men!!
Got the Dover – Calais ferry at 6.30am. Didn’t have to be in Holyhead till 8 that evening so stopped in Cambridge for a couple of hours and had a brief detour into Birmingham to see the Walsall Gallery and Selfridges.

Overall it was an unbelievable experience, can’t wait for the next trip across the continent, I just love driving, of the 4000 miles I’d say I drove over 3000. Minor issue with insurance meant we were limited to 3 pilots. It was a first time for us all driving on the continent, so to come back without the slightest scratch is a sucess in itself! The road infrastructure across that part of Europe was something to behold. First time in the Port Tunnel too, was very impressed, great piece of infrastructure. Was only €3 for the car on a Thursday afternoon, presumed it would be dearer.

On a side note, never once on the journey were we asked for I.D./passports or stopped by customs, waved through on every occasion. Thought it was peculiar. Stopped once by the Gendarmerie at a toll both when re entering France, but when we explained our journey, she just thought it was hilarious and wished us luck! Thanks again to all for the advice and help.

CharlieCroker

sounds class. Glad ye made it make on one piece

patrickc

wow what a journey, good aul volvo too:D

well done sounds like it was amazing

Mr Benevolent

Fair play to you, must've been great. Thanks for coming back to let us know how it went. Good on the 'ol Volvo too!

dingding

Well done, sounds like a great trip.

markok84

well done Gallant JJ, I'm just still a little pissed ye didn't kidnap me for the journey.... maybe next time.

ToxicPaddy

Nice journey lads, good to see you got back in one piece.. like yourself I love driving and when we did the rally to the Arctic, there was a few days when I was happy to do most if not all of the driving, especially over the mountains in Norway

Must look into holiday like that. Might be cheaper than the usual package tours especially if I can get a few lads to do it.

So what do you reckon the whole journey cost you? Ferries, fuel, tolls etc?

Tox

Big Nasty

Well done lads!;)