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Peter King's All-Decade Team

  • 09-12-2009 12:56pm
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,444 ✭✭✭


    I was on SI earlier and saw this piece. King picked his all-decade team. What does everyone think of it? A few deserving players were left out but mostly I was nodding away in agreement.

    Obviously there is going to be agruments about Brady and Manning at QB, but I was shocked with Hines Ward at reciever. As good as Ward is(and King wanted to create a complete team as he says at the start of his article) but Harrison, TO or Tory Holt were all amazing this decade leading their teams to the Superbowl etc.

    RB, FB, TE and O-line I would agree with.

    On defence there some notable absentees-Strahan, Sapp(how is he not in it!), I'd have John Lynch at safety with Ed Reed for his ball hawking. I wouldnt have Winfield how about Charles Woodson, or Ty Law?


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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,260 ✭✭✭jdivision


    I'm glad he put in London Fletcher who is unlikely to ever make a Pro Bowl but has been a beast for years.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,179 ✭✭✭RichTea


    There is nobody better in the game than Peter King.


    But, Michael Strahan and Warren Sapp should be there surely. I can see why TO isn't there with Randy Moss already fulfilling that sort of role for his 'complete team'.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,436 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Well for me it has to be Brady and its about winning it all, Manning hasn't been good enough in the playoffs.
    Marvin Harrison has to be on that team and Hines Ward being ahead of him is laughable.
    LT has been very, very good, but I'd have AP even though its only his 3rd year in the league.
    I'll take Tom Nalen as the Center.
    They are the ones that just stand out to me on offense immediately.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 64 ✭✭Si Conando


    Disagree EE on AP over LT:)

    LT was probably more statistically dominant in his position, over the full decade, than any other player on the team king chose.

    Obviously AP has only had 3 years, so disregarding that, AP has already lost as many fumbles as LT in his career. LT has proven himself to be incredibly durable for a back(having only missed 2 regular season games in his career from injury), whereas AP has had some injury troubles, even this early in his career. I will admit that AP is as exciting a pure runner as ive seen, but he has had perhaps the best oline in the league for his 3 years. LT has also proven himself to be a great blocker, and one of the best receiving backs ever. His total scrimmage yards are immense, and his 150 TDs in 137 games isnt bad either:)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,436 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    On the defense, Charles Woodson has to be there with Champ.
    I was expecting to see Rodney Harrison there when I looked at it, but in fairness you cannot complain with Ed Reed he has been outstanding all his career and deserves that spot.
    Pretty much the same as LT and AP for me with Brian Dawkins a great player but Troy Polamalu has just been outstanding since he came into the league and I'd have him over Dawkins.
    As much as I love Mike Vrabel he does not deserve to be on that team, I'd have Julian Peterson instead of him.
    Richard Seymour should be on that team also and Dwight Freeney in place of Kevin Williams and Aaron Smith.

    And finally Devin Hester has to be the kick/punt returner imo.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,444 ✭✭✭frostie500


    eagle eye wrote: »
    LT has been very, very good, but I'd have AP even though its only his 3rd year in the league.

    Are you serious? In an all decade team you'd take Peterson over Tomilson? Whatever about Manning and Brady but there is no doubt that LT has been the most productive back in the NFL since he came into the league in 2001. He could do it all, run through the tackles, get to the outside and was a great pass catcher.
    If youre only looking at players who only played some of the decade then you'd have to go for another player with 28 on his chest....Marshall Faulk


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,179 ✭✭✭RichTea


    Cannot believe that anyone would take Peterson over LT. It's an all decade team! Peterson hasn't enjoyed the same domination over a position that LT has.

    With regard to the Charles Woodson thing, as much as I think he's been the best cornerback over the past few years, his career only really took off in the pros when he left the Raiders. His productivity increased dramatically since he joined the Packers. Definitely worthy of consideration though.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,444 ✭✭✭frostie500


    RichTea wrote: »
    With regard to the Charles Woodson thing, as much as I think he's been the best cornerback over the past few years, his career only really took off in the pros when he left the Raiders. His productivity increased dramatically since he joined the Packers. Definitely worthy of consideration though.

    The only other cornerback is Nnamdi Asomugha, who I cant believe I forgot about! He has to be in contention. He has been dominant for a few years now


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,436 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    LT has averaged 4.4 ypc over his career. Over 8 full seasons he has averaged 1476 yards per season.

    AP is in his third year, over his first two full seasons he has averaged 5.1 ypc and averaged 1550 yards per season.

    The figures will be even more in AP's favour after this season with AP already on over 1100 yards on the season, and LT on 561 and averaging only 3.3 ypc.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,436 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    frostie500 wrote: »
    The only other cornerback is Nnamdi Asomugha, who I cant believe I forgot about! He has to be in contention. He has been dominant for a few years now
    Yeah he is a class act too, I'd have him just behind Woodson right now.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,179 ✭✭✭RichTea


    eagle eye wrote: »
    LT has averaged 4.4 ypc over his career. Over 8 full seasons he has averaged 1476 yards per season.

    AP is in his third year, over his first two full seasons he has averaged 5.1 ypc and averaged 1550 yards per season.

    The figures will be even more in AP's favour after this season with AP already on over 1100 yards on the season, and LT on 561 and averaging only 3.3 ypc.

    Dominancy is more about just yards. LT was, without any question, the best running back in the league over a 6 year period. AP has been the best back in the league for two years, he's not even the best back now (Chris Johnson). LT's breaking records and his touchdown to game ratio set him apart if you're looking for statistics.

    Best running back of the decade - no question.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,436 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    RichTea wrote: »
    Cannot believe that anyone would take Peterson over LT. It's an all decade team! Peterson hasn't enjoyed the same domination over a position that LT has.

    With regard to the Charles Woodson thing, as much as I think he's been the best cornerback over the past few years, his career only really took off in the pros when he left the Raiders. His productivity increased dramatically since he joined the Packers. Definitely worthy of consideration though.
    Woodson was a star at the Raiders, he got to 4 pro bowls while he was there.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,444 ✭✭✭frostie500


    eagle eye wrote: »
    LT has averaged 4.4 ypc over his career. Over 8 full seasons he has averaged 1476 yards per season.

    AP is in his third year, over his first two full seasons he has averaged 5.1 ypc and averaged 1550 yards per season.

    The figures will be even more in AP's favour after this season with AP already on over 1100 yards on the season, and LT on 561 and averaging only 3.3 ypc.

    I was doing a bit of digging and the only comparable time I can find is Earl Campbell in the 70's All Decade Second team. The NFL all decade teams all carry two running backs not like King's with only one. Campbell only played three years that decade but his numbers are suberb-7000 yards rushing, and he didnt get into the first team that decade with Hall of Famers ahead of him who performed consistently over the entire decade. AP is terrific over a three year period, LT has been great over the decade and will win out. As the above example shows though AP will get consideration for the NFL all decade team


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,436 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    RichTea wrote: »
    Dominancy is more about just yards. LT was, without any question, the best running back in the league over a 6 year period. AP has been the best back in the league for two years, he's not even the best back now (Chris Johnson). LT's breaking records and his touchdown to game ratio set him apart if you're looking for statistics.

    Best running back of the decade - no question.
    I don't agree and tds to game ratio is pretty much irrelevant as far as I'm concerned, if you are going that way then you are saying that Mauric Jones Drew is the best back in the league for the last few years.

    Edit: Just to be clear its an either/or thing as far as I'm concerned between those two, I just feel that what AP has done in three years is just remarkable. Barry Sanders is my all time favourite NFL player and I liken AP to him so much, so maybe I'm a bit biased because of that.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,179 ✭✭✭RichTea


    eagle eye wrote: »
    Woodson was a star at the Raiders, he got to 4 pro bowls while he was there.

    He was a star but the remarkable productivity that he's now associated with only really started when he made the move to Green Bay.

    In the 8 seasons he had with Oakland - Woodson had 17 interceptions. In the close to 4 seasons at Lambeau Field - Woodson has 26 interceptions.

    8 seasons at Oakland - 8 forced fumbles. 4 at Green Bay - 8 forced fumbles.

    The sacks, tackles (since they've been become statistics), pass defences, touchdowns etc all point to him reaching a new plane of productivity since joining the Packers.

    He was a great corner at Oakland, he's somehow managed to become even better since moving to the midwest.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,001 ✭✭✭Royal Seahawk


    I would have Brady in instead of P Manning. Sports aren't about stats, they're about winning trophies.
    January is when it counts, not September, October, November or December.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 64 ✭✭Si Conando


    eagle eye wrote: »
    LT has averaged 4.4 ypc over his career. Over 8 full seasons he has averaged 1476 yards per season.

    AP is in his third year, over his first two full seasons he has averaged 5.1 ypc and averaged 1550 yards per season.

    The figures will be even more in AP's favour after this season with AP already on over 1100 yards on the season, and LT on 561 and averaging only 3.3 ypc.

    You're disregarding every other facet of being a running back. LT is better at blocking, receiving and getting in the end zone. In his first 8 years he has averaged 1950 scrimmage yards a year, which is more than ANY other back in history.

    Your part about TD to game ratio is something i agree with somewhat, but some of the things LT has been able to do around the goalline have been spectacular


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 19,341 ✭✭✭✭Chucky the tree


    Chris Johnson is a better running back the AP.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,444 ✭✭✭frostie500


    I would have Brady in instead of P Manning. Sports aren't about stats, they're about winning trophies.
    January is when it counts, not September, October, November or December.

    Cant really pick a undeserving one between the two can you though! Two things that I think will sway the voters on the NFL all decade team is that Manning has played two full seasons more then Brady and when Brady was injured last year the Pats didnt miss a beat with Matt Cassel at qb. As I said I dont think theres anything between them but Manning will probably edge it when the real voting is done


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,179 ✭✭✭RichTea


    frostie500 wrote: »
    Cant really pick a undeserving one between the two can you though! Two things that I think will sway the voters on the NFL all decade team is that Manning has played two full seasons more then Brady and when Brady was injured last year the Pats didnt miss a beat with Matt Cassel at qb. As I said I dont think theres anything between them but Manning will probably edge it when the real voting is done

    Exactly. If you looked at what quarterback means more to their team...it's gotta be Manning.

    There are no wrong answers in choosing between Brady and Manning really.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,436 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    frostie500 wrote: »
    Cant really pick a undeserving one between the two can you though! Two things that I think will sway the voters on the NFL all decade team is that Manning has played two full seasons more then Brady and when Brady was injured last year the Pats didnt miss a beat with Matt Cassel at qb. As I said I dont think theres anything between them but Manning will probably edge it when the real voting is done
    They went from 17-0 to 11-5, they failed to make the playoffs which they had succeeded in doing the previous five seasons with Tom Brady as starter.

    Is that not missing an enormous beat?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,287 ✭✭✭davyjose


    I would have Brady in instead of P Manning. Sports aren't about stats, they're about winning trophies.
    January is when it counts, not September, October, November or December.
    How many rings does Randy Moss have? In fact, take a look at the list there, and tell me how many rings do any of the players have. Tony Gonzalez? LT?

    Seriously, there has to be a point where people stop handicapping Manning's incredible achievements week-in, week-out because he has only one ring.
    I believe Brady is a phenomenal QB. One of the best ever. And if someone wants to argue away that he's better than manning in terms of ability, I have no problem, but bringing in the "rings" argument doesn't alone make him better. Brady today is a more impressive QB than the guy who won all those rings back then, anyway. So the argument doesn't even wash for that reason alone.

    Also, there's no way peterson is the RB of the decade, I'm afraid. he might have a better Yardage per Carry, but i'd be interested to see what that number is when he's LT's age. Heck, he's not even the best running back in the league today, 3 years in, at what should be approaching the peak of his abilities.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,287 ✭✭✭davyjose


    eagle eye wrote: »
    They went from 17-0 to 11-5, they failed to make the playoffs which they had succeeded in doing the previous five seasons with Tom Brady as starter.

    Is that not missing an enormous beat?

    What'll they finish at this year? 11-5 is the best they can do, if they go unbeaten from here.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,436 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    davyjose wrote: »
    How many rings does Randy Moss have? In fact, take a look at the list there, and tell me how many rings do any of the players have. Tony Gonzalez? LT?

    Seriously, there has to be a point where people stop handicapping Manning's incredible achievements week-in, week-out because he has only one ring.
    I believe Brady is a phenomenal QB. One of the best ever. And if someone wants to argue away that he's better than manning in terms of ability, I have no problem, but bringing in the "rings" argument doesn't alone make him better. Brady today is a more impressive QB than the guy who won all those rings back then, anyway. So the argument doesn't even wash for that reason alone.

    Also, there's no way peterson is the RB of the decade, I'm afraid. he might have a better Yardage per Carry, but i'd be interested to see what that number is when he's LT's age. Heck, he's not even the best running back in the league today, 3 years in, at what should be approaching the peak of his abilities.
    Its not just the rings, its his playoff record.

    Manning's postseason record: 7-7
    Manning's postseason passer rating: 84.4
    Manning's postseason comp%: 61.8

    Manning's posteason opponents' winning percentage (regular season): .728



    Brady's postseason record: 14-2
    Brady's postseason passer rating: 88.5
    Brady's posteason comp%: 62.7

    Brady's postseason opponent's winning percentage (regular season): .779


    Brady has put up better numbers, against better competition, and has won far more often. Brady is clutch, Manning is not. Thats what counts at the end of the day.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,608 ✭✭✭themont85


    eagle eye wrote: »
    They went from 17-0 to 11-5, they failed to make the playoffs which they had succeeded in doing the previous five seasons with Tom Brady as starter.

    Is that not missing an enormous beat?

    How many wins do you honestly think the Colts accumelate without Manning? Matt Cassell has proven himself to be an okay QB but he walked into a team with not being a starter since High School. They still won 11 games. I don't see the Colts getting near that number minus Manning. They have something like 7 12 plus game winning seasons in a row mostly down to Manning. I'd have Brady in any other decade but not this one, Manning is a phenom as a franchise QB.

    Suprised with Sapp and Harrisons exclusions. Personally whilst Randy Moss is a better player than TO I have to say I like TO over Hines. He has had numerous very good seasons with 3 teams (I'm leaving Buffallo till the year end where I think he'll end with okay numbers not great ones). If I want a team mate its Hines Ward/Harrison option but its kind of hard even if you hate TO to say he hasn't performed. He's been good everywhere, in multiple situation despite being an asshole.

    /we should have a Manning/Brady stickied thread...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,287 ✭✭✭davyjose


    eagle eye wrote: »
    Its not just the rings, its his playoff record.

    Manning's postseason record: 7-7
    Manning's postseason passer rating: 84.4
    Manning's postseason comp%: 61.8

    Manning's posteason opponents' winning percentage (regular season): .728



    Brady's postseason record: 14-2
    Brady's postseason passer rating: 88.5
    Brady's posteason comp%: 62.7

    Brady's postseason opponent's winning percentage (regular season): .779


    Brady has put up better numbers, against better competition, and has won far more often. Brady is clutch, Manning is not. Thats what counts at the end of the day.

    I disagree. I think to assess someone's ability, you can't disregard their entire body of work. It's a team sport, and in most of the Play-off losses I've seen manning play in, he has not underperformed. But again, if you want to pin all the Pats success on Brady's shoulders, and all the Colts' relative lack of success on manning's, then you're argument to make Brady the QB of the decade is a poor one in my book.

    And to say Manning is not clutch actually means you know very little about the man.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,444 ✭✭✭frostie500


    eagle eye wrote: »
    They went from 17-0 to 11-5, they failed to make the playoffs which they had succeeded in doing the previous five seasons with Tom Brady as starter.

    Is that not missing an enormous beat?
    Bradys stat lines:
    Year % yds TD int att
    2001 63.9 2843 18 12 413
    2002 62.1 3764 28 14 601
    2003 60.2 3620 23 12 527
    2004 60.8 3692 28 14 474
    2005 63.0 4110 26 14 530
    2006 61.8 3529 24 12 516
    2007 68.9 4806 50 08 578
    2009 65.7 4848 29 13 611***projection

    Average:63.3 3901 28 12 531
    Cassel : 63.4 3693 21 11 516
    To give a fuller picture of how small the differences are between these stat line this one is done using a projection for Cassel with 531 attempts, Brady's seasonal average:
    63.4 3801 22 11

    I dont view his stat line to be an enormous difference to Brady's. The team went 11-4 in the games Cassel started and became one of only three teams to miss out on the playoffs after winning 11.

    Bear in mind I'm not saying 'Cassel is nearly as good as Brady' just that Manning has been durable, prolific and in all liklihood Indy couldnt replace him with someone that would nearly match his career averages


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,436 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    themont85 wrote: »
    How many wins do you honestly think the Colts accumelate without Manning? Matt Cassell has proven himself to be an okay QB but he walked into a team with not being a starter since High School. They still won 11 games. I don't see the Colts getting near that number minus Manning. They have something like 7 12 plus game winning seasons in a row mostly down to Manning. I'd have Brady in any other decade but not this one, Manning is a phenom as a franchise QB.
    So then if you are saying that all them winning seasons are mostly down to Manning, then you agree that most of them losses in the playoffs are mostly down to Manning who is therefore not a clutch quarterback?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,146 ✭✭✭Morrisseeee


    Lets forget about stats for a moment (they lie don't they:p) but I'm just wondering if you switched both QB's from their respective teams (years ago), would you reckon Manning would have won a few more SB's and would Brady have been as successfull ??


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,287 ✭✭✭davyjose


    eagle eye wrote: »
    So then if you are saying that all them winning seasons are mostly down to Manning, then you agree that most of them losses in the playoffs are mostly down to Manning who is therefore not a clutch quarterback?

    That makes no sense eagle eye. You know that.

    look, I'm done with the argument. Manning game on game has for a decade, produced consistently brilliant football. Per game, his yardage and TD's are in a league of their own.
    Brady has the greatest single season of all time, and an incredible Play-off record.

    Take your pick. Either player would deserve the title as QB of the decade, but yeah, i'd have personally gone for manning.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,608 ✭✭✭themont85


    Lets forget about stats for a moment (they lie don't they:p) but I'm just wondering if you switched both QB's from their respective teams (years ago), would you reckon Manning would have won a few more SB's and would Brady have been as successfull ??

    Yes and no.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,436 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    frostie500 wrote: »
    Bradys stat lines:
    Year % yds TD int att
    2001 63.9 2843 18 12 413
    2002 62.1 3764 28 14 601
    2003 60.2 3620 23 12 527
    2004 60.8 3692 28 14 474
    2005 63.0 4110 26 14 530
    2006 61.8 3529 24 12 516
    2007 68.9 4806 50 08 578
    2009 65.7 4848 29 13 611***projection

    Average:63.3 3901 28 12 531
    Cassel : 63.4 3693 21 11 516
    To give a fuller picture of how small the differences are between these stat line this one is done using a projection for Cassel with 531 attempts, Brady's seasonal average:
    63.4 3801 22 11

    I dont view his stat line to be an enormous difference to Brady's. The team went 11-4 in the games Cassel started and became one of only three teams to miss out on the playoffs after winning 11.

    Bear in mind I'm not saying 'Cassel is nearly as good as Brady' just that Manning has been durable, prolific and in all liklihood Indy couldnt replace him with someone that would nearly match his career averages
    The difference is that Brady gets it done, he makes the playoffs and he wins in the playoffs.
    Thats been my point all along.
    You also have to remember that until 2007 Brady was throwing to David Givens, David Patten, Deion Branch, Reche Caldwell, and Jabar Gaffney, none of whom has any chance of making the HOF.
    Manning was throwing to Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Dallas Clark and Edgerrin James.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,287 ✭✭✭davyjose


    eagle eye wrote: »
    The difference is that Brady gets it done, he makes the playoffs and he wins in the playoffs.
    Thats been my point all along.
    You also have to remember that until 2007 Brady was throwing to David Givens, David Patten, Deion Branch, Reche Caldwell, and Jabar Gaffney, none of whom has any chance of making the HOF.
    Manning was throwing to Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Dallas Clark and Edgerrin James.

    Manning's throwing to Collie and Garcon this season. Let's not forget that.

    My other argument for Manning would be what he has between his ears. His reading of defenses, implementing the "no-huddle". Whereas the Brains behind the Pats is more down to the Coach.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,436 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    davyjose wrote: »
    Manning's throwing to Collie and Garcon this season. Let's not forget that.

    My other argument for Manning would be what he has between his ears. His reading of defenses, implementing the "no-huddle". Whereas the Brains behind the Pats is more down to the Coach.
    I've never said anything against Manning's regular season record, its his postseson record that is terrible.
    He could never be rated on the same level as the greats with that record.

    And it all comes back to the same thing, people keep harping on that the Colts would not be nearly as good without Manning, but that also means that he has to take all the blame for all their poor performances in the playoffs.

    He has thrown 22 tds and 17 ints. to Harrison, Wayne, Clark and James.

    Brady has thrown 26 tds and 12 ints.

    Clutch is clutch and its what its all about at the end of the day. There must be something wrong between Manning's ears at playoff time.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,444 ✭✭✭frostie500


    davyjose wrote: »
    Manning's throwing to Collie and Garcon this season. Let's not forget that.

    My other argument for Manning would be what he has between his ears. His reading of defenses, implementing the "no-huddle". Whereas the Brains behind the Pats is more down to the Coach.

    yeah Manning has to get a hell of a lot of credit for his productivity with this group, and remember that he has also had to play numerous linemen over the last few years because the Colts let them go in post seasons. Last year when Saturday was injured Manning got the line to still function as a top unit.

    I wouldnt really say that there is too much difference 'between the ears.' I do think that Manning is probably the best player ever at dissecting a defence and its intentions etc but Brady is no slouch in that game either


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,444 ✭✭✭frostie500


    eagle eye wrote: »
    I've never said anything against Manning's regular season record, its his postseson record that is terrible.
    He could never be rated on the same level as the greats with that record.

    And it all comes back to the same thing, people keep harping on that the Colts would not be nearly as good without Manning, but that also means that he has to take all the blame for all their poor performances in the playoffs.

    You've said things like that a few times, does Manning have to take responsibility for a pathetic defence that the Colts had for most of this decade? Is it coincidental that the only year they had a good defence and a leader on that side of the ball on a par with Manning on the offence(Bob Sanders) that they won the Superbowl?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,608 ✭✭✭themont85


    eagle eye wrote: »
    I've never said anything against Manning's regular season record, its his postseson record that is terrible.
    He could never be rated on the same level as the greats with that record.

    And it all comes back to the same thing, people keep harping on that the Colts would not be nearly as good without Manning, but that also means that he has to take all the blame for all their poor performances in the playoffs.

    He has thrown 22 tds and 17 ints. to Harrison, Wayne, Clark and James.

    Brady has thrown 26 tds and 12 ints.

    Clutch is clutch and its what its all about at the end of the day. There must be something wrong between Manning's ears at playoff time.

    Must have been something wrong with Brady too the last two playoff runs when he had the ball in his hands with probably one and definately another SB at stake. Then again he didn't have automatic Adam or a defence at its peak behind him.

    Clutch isn't a playoff run its a moments, game winning drives. The Patriots have been better drilled and an overall better team than the Colts in the playoffs, obviousely this has an effect on stats.

    One thing that characterised the difference in Manning and Brady in the playoffs this decade was the 2001 Raiders game and the 2005 Steelers game for each respective player. In both those games both players got huge slices of luck to keep them in the game. The difference was that after both set their things up for FG, their respective kickers did different things. One in a ridiculous snow storm and the other a highly makeable kick. Who missed?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,179 ✭✭✭RichTea


    Brady v Manning threads are awful.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,436 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    frostie500 wrote: »
    You've said things like that a few times, does Manning have to take responsibility for a pathetic defence that the Colts had for most of this decade? Is it coincidental that the only year they had a good defence and a leader on that side of the ball on a par with Manning on the offence(Bob Sanders) that they won the Superbowl?
    Did you know that the year they won the Superbowl that Manning threw 3 tds and 7 ints. and had a horrendous QB rating of 70.5 in the playoffs?
    Are you saying that Manning was the reason they won it that year?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,444 ✭✭✭frostie500


    eagle eye wrote: »
    Did you know that the year they won the Superbowl that Manning threw 3 tds and 7 ints. and had a horrendous QB rating of 70.5 in the playoffs?
    Are you saying that Manning was the reason they won it that year?

    Are you saying Manning was the reason they lost it the other years?


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,067 ✭✭✭tallaghtoutlaws


    Can we have one thread that doesn't turn into a Brady V Manning thread or Pats V Colts thread please? Im a Pats fan and think the world of Brady but I let him do the talking on the field rather than me arguing about his abilities. I have the greatest respect for both QBs and besides every body has their own opinion to a team of the decade hence Peter Kings opinion that started this thread.

    The Peterson/LT debate is much better than Brady/Manning at this stage. LT would clearly be in my team of the decade. Peterson hasn't been around long enough to warrant it. Although in 10 years time he clearly will be in the team of the decade.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,436 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    frostie500 wrote: »
    Are you saying Manning was the reason they lost it the other years?
    Yes.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 19,341 ✭✭✭✭Chucky the tree


    eagle eye wrote: »
    Yes.


    :pac: You never fail eagle eye.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,260 ✭✭✭jdivision


    eagle eye wrote: »
    LT has averaged 4.4 ypc over his career. Over 8 full seasons he has averaged 1476 yards per season.

    AP is in his third year, over his first two full seasons he has averaged 5.1 ypc and averaged 1550 yards per season.

    But he can't block, isn't a receiving threat out of the backfield and fumbles too much


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,500 ✭✭✭ReacherCreature


    eagle eye wrote: »
    LT has been very, very good, but I'd have AP even though its only his 3rd year in the league.

    It's based on a decade in the league. Who knows if Peterson'll last that long eg if he gets an injury. A Vikings fan was telling me that he's brilliant no doubt but if he keeps getting hit and fumbles that coupled with his workload, he'll be diminished in no time. Of course, we'll have to wait and see.

    Looking at that OL, he didn't get it wrong, it's top class.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,260 ✭✭✭jdivision


    LT in his prime was one of the best players I've ever seen, he didn't run, he glided, even in Wembley you could see that element of greatness and he didn't play that well that day.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,500 ✭✭✭ReacherCreature


    jdivision wrote: »
    LT in his prime was one of the best players I've ever seen, he didn't run, he glided, even in Wembley you could see that element of greatness and he didn't play that well that day.

    I don't think anyone here will disagree. Tomlinson is probably the best choice for the decade team.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,608 ✭✭✭themont85


    Running backs have been a bit lean this decade. Last decade we had Emmet Smith, Sanders, Terrell Davies and Thurman Thomas 3 of which were HoF and TD has a shout down the line but injury may cost him. This decade we had Tiki Barber, Tomilson and laterly guys like AD and now Johnson. I don't think it is a stellar as the 90s as AD and Johnson will likely do their best in the 10s. A guy overlooked possibly because he spanned two decades-Marshell Faulk would get into my team. The problem is that he only was great at the end of the 90s and at the start of the decade.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,639 ✭✭✭LightningBolt


    Richard Seymour surely deserved to be picked at DE over Aaron Smith? The guy was a workhorse although injuries probably stopped him from being picked.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,260 ✭✭✭jdivision


    Curtis Martin and edge were fairly special, Ricky Watters was too but walked away too early in the noughties. The Bus provided some magic at times and Priest was spectacularly efficient


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