Cowen warned of Lenihan 'coup plot'

dixiefly

Could this be true? Surely Lenihan has enough on his mind to be getting involved in this!

http://news.eircom.net/breakingnews/16930876/?view=Standard

Cowen warned of Lenihan 'coup plot'
on 08/12/2009 18:45:57


Taoiseach Brian Cowen was tonight warned of alleged attempts to overthrow him by a senior Cabinet minister as the countdown begins to the most feared Budget in living memory. Taoiseach Brian Cowen was tonight warned of alleged attempts to overthrow him by a senior Cabinet minister as the countdown begins to the most feared Budget in living memory.

In a sensational claim, adding to the woes of the embattled premier as he faces into an unprecedented €4bn cost-cutting plan, it was claimed that Finance Minister Brian Lenihan was hatching a planned coup.

Labour leader Eamon Gilmore said a near deal with public sector unions on €1.3bn of the cutbacks was purposely scuppered last week as part of a behind-the-scenes plot against Mr Cowen.

"The bottom line, Taoiseach, is that you have a Minister for Finance who is now so anxious to get his hands on your job that he was prepared to sink this agreement," he said.

In an outburst that drew breaths in the Dáil, the Labour leader accused Mr Lenihan of lacking political loyalty, claiming he had dispatched allies onto the airwaves to jettison the chances of deal once it looked likely.

"It was stupid and it was short-sighted... it is something that I believe we will all regret next year," Mr Gilmore added.

The Labour leader said a deal was within touching distance that would have made the savings needed, reformed the public sector and secured industrial peace.

Rubbishing the suggestion, the Taoiseach insisted the top Fianna Fáil pair had stood shoulder to shoulder during the negotiations which dramatically collapsed on Friday, after reports of a deal on pay cuts.

Mr Lenihan was tonight putting the final touches to the Budget designed to steady the country's perilous finances ahead of a Cabinet meeting to sign off on the hard-hitting measures tomorrow morning.

Hundreds of thousands of public and civil servants are expecting pay cuts ranging between around 4% on the lowest wages and as much as 20% for the top-earning elite.

The exact details of the salary reductions will be poured over by public sector unions who have threatened long and sustained industrial action after last week's talks failed.

Cuts to social welfare payments, including unemployment and child welfare benefits, as well reduced spending on health and education will also spark controversy.

The Government has already signalled it will not make too many changes to taxes, apart from the introduction of a carbon tax expected to raise the price of petrol, coal and peat briquettes.

Transport Minister Noel Dempsey again issued the Government mantra of recent weeks and months that no-one would escape unscathed from the cutbacks.

"Everybody has to take a hit," he said.

"It's a tough Budget, it's going to be difficult. We have tried to be as fair as we possibly can to everybody but I think a bit like last year it's those who can afford most, will pay most.

"We are going to try and protect the vulnerable as much as we can but we cannot say that anyone is going to escape."

Fine Gael leader Enda Kenny claimed that half of the required savings for the crisis Budget - two billion euro - could be found if social welfare fraud was properly tackled.

"In a draconian Budget, because of Government incompetence, you are going to take away money from people who need it," he said.

But Mr Cowen defended his anxiously-awaited cutbacks as necessary to protect social welfare recipients into the future, adding they come after years of benefits rises against dropping prices.

"We have an unsustainable public finance position and if we are to protect the most vulnerable in our society, as we must and seek to do, we must do so in a way that provides a sustainable way forward," he said.

gandalf

Over the last couple of weeks I have lost all respect for Gilmore as a leader and he and others in Labour will stop me voting Labour ever again, a party I have supported since my student days and one that I was a member of at one stage.

mike65

gandalf wrote: »

Over the last couple of weeks I have lost all respect for Gilmore as a leader and he and others in Labour will stop me voting Labour ever again, a party I have supported since my student days and one that I was a member of at one stage.

You know what they say, if you don't vote socialist at 20 you have no heart, if you are voting socialist at 50 you have no brain*

As for a coup, Cowen deserves to be the victim of one.


*not suggesting you are 50, needless to say!

gandalf

gandalf wrote: »

Over the last couple of weeks I have lost all respect for Gilmore as a leader and he and others in Labour will stop me voting Labour ever again, a party I have supported since my student days and one that I was a member of at one stage.

I was close to joining them twice since the summer ended. Don't think I'll ever consider it again since my love for them being against NAMA was offset by their love of welfare recipients and the PS.

Why can't there just be a sensible party that wants nothing but sensible fiscal policy? Probably due to the nature of the electorate I would guess...but it's very disappointing that for someone who never has and probably never will vote for FF, they seem to be the only party with any testicles left.

mike65

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31FFTx6AKmU

Seth Brundle

viva la revolution

irish_bob

mike65 wrote: »

You know what they say, if you don't vote socialist at 20 you have no heart, if you are voting socialist at 50 you have no brain*

As for a coup, Cowen deserves to be the victim of one.


*not suggesting you are 50, needless to say!

+1 , go lenny , stick the knife in

sceptre

mike65 wrote: »

You know what they say, if you don't vote socialist at 20 you have no heart, if you are voting socialist at 50 you have no brain*

That's not even anywhere near what the original quote is supposed to be...:) Mind you, "they" say a lot of things...

I'm confused about the word "warned". Who warned Cowen? Was it Gilmore? Because it looks like a post-event warning if it was, which is less of a warning and more of a "you might have missed this mate but..." while having a good auld laugh about it.

If Lenihan's actually doing this and more besides - by setting extra fires on the ship before becoming captain, he's more of a wally than even the FF-haters here give him credit for (and whether or not you agree with the talks collapse or not, Gilmore's contention is that their success would be good and their failure would be bad so that's the basis of the allegation).

It smells like a Labour PR attempt - ascribing to malice that which they should be able to explain by what from their point of view is stupidity. It doesn't wash much with me - Lenihan is neither that smart nor that dumb. Having said that, if there's going to be a coup, I'd prefer Brian Lenihan over Conor Lenihan to be leading it.

jackthekipper

Go on the other Brian, maybe you and your brother kebabs can make your Aunt proud.

mikemac

jackthekipper wrote: »

and your brother kebabs .

Are people still dragging up that quote from Conor Lenihan? Years after it happened?
What relevance has it now?

jackthekipper

mikemac wrote: »

Are people still dragging up that quote from Conor Lenihan? Years after it happened?
What relevance has it now?

Don't care when it happened, it reeked of snobbery when he said it, back when we thought we were the richest country.

Liam Byrne

Has Lehihan even read a report on Ireland's current status before bidding to take it on ?

Given his past reputation, I'd doubt it.

dixiefly

jackthekipper wrote: »

Don't care when it happened, it reeked of snobbery when he said it, back when we thought we were the richest country.

What quote was this? I cannot remember it.

gandalf

dixiefly wrote: »

What quote was this? I cannot remember it.

Read this article for the background. It was a reference to GAMA's workers who were Turkish towards Joe Higgins in the Dail who was standing up for the workers. Borderline racist muppetry.

jackthekipper

dixiefly wrote: »

What quote was this? I cannot remember it.

Can't remember the exact story but the bones of it was that I think there was a Labour (may have been an independent) TD involved in a dispute where Turkish workers were getting paid sh1t money, he was arguing with Conor Lenihan over something and Lenny the Lesser told him to go back to the kebabs. Great coming from someone who got through life based on his surname.

Hillel

mike65 wrote: »

You know what they say, if you don't vote socialist at 20 you have no heart, if you are voting socialist at 50 you have no brain*

As for a coup, Cowen deserves to be the victim of one.

Eamon Gilmore is putting party and personal interests ahead of the country.
Disappointing, I thought he was better than that.

As for a coup, yes, yes, yes. Bring it on!

I would readily vote for Brian Lenihan for Taoiseach.
He has the intellectual capability and leadership capacity.

jackthekipper

Hillel wrote: »

Eamon Gilmore is putting part and personal interests ahead of the country.
Disappointing, I thought he was better than that.

As for a coup, yes, yes, yes. Bring it on!

I would readily vote for Brian Lenihan for Taoiseach.
He has the intellectual capacity and leadership capacity.

He's good at reeading reports apparently. Let's not forget taht people thought Cowen was going to be great also.

Mr.Micro

I would love to know what is so great about Lenihan? What has he actually done to warrant some posters positive opinion of him?

jackthekipper

Mr.Micro wrote: »

I would love to know what is so great about Lenihan? What has he actually done to warrant some posters positive opinion of him?

Me too, but I think I see a trend,
Bertie, hero to zero, Cowen steps in
Cowen, hero to zero Lenihan steps in
Lenihan, hero to zero, Coughlan steps in

murphaph

I personally think lenihan is more ready than Cowen to make the necessary cuts. Others may disagree. If it came down purely to one person, I'd prefer Lenihan than Kenny (and obviously any champagne socialist in Labour) to be it. Cowen seems to be just so completely out of his depth here.

DublinWriter

The Taoiseach is dead, long live the Taoiseach.

*yawn*

ninty9er

Lenihan is the only reason the government hasn't fallen yet. His ability to heal splits is apparently extraordinary, he doesn't need the distraction of the big job.

Bigdeadlydave

Im still waiting for Willie to open up with a machine gun one day in the dail and set up a military dictatorship.

who_ru

gandalf wrote: »

Over the last couple of weeks I have lost all respect for Gilmore as a leader and he and others in Labour will stop me voting Labour ever again, a party I have supported since my student days and one that I was a member of at one stage.

totally agree - they have lost my vote too.

Dannyboy83

sceptre wrote: »

I'm confused about the word "warned". Who warned Cowen?

Bertie most likely, given his rentless promotion of our indigenous bluebell industry and "they're out to get me" spiel.
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2009/1130/1224259709843.html

Dannyboy83

ninty9er wrote: »

Lenihan is the only reason the government hasn't fallen yet. His ability to heal splits is apparently extraordinary, he doesn't need the distraction of the big job.

Micheal Martin has been extremely quiet recently (read 2 years).
Obviously he doesn't want to be associated with this government and I'd say himself and Lenihan are on the same page (famous last words:D).

Anyway, there are options.

I just hope Cowen will use WillieO'Gee as a human shield as he flees home to Offaly.

Hillel

Mr.Micro wrote: »

I would love to know what is so great about Lenihan? What has he actually done to warrant some posters positive opinion of him?

His breadth and depth of knowledge is exceptional. His performance during the extended NAMA legislation debate was a "Tour De Force". He was able for all comers, working mainly from memory. He has shown courage and backbone, in the face of very considerable adversity. I also believe that he has demonstrated integrity and consistency, since this whole crisis started.

In my entire adult life I have never voted for FFail. However, I truly believe that Brian Lenihan is the main driving force behind the current government and the best hope the country has for a successful longterm outcome.

nacho libre

Hillel wrote: »

He has the intellectual capacity and leadership capacity.

I might agree about Lenihan if he was prepared to stand up to the likes of Jackie Healy-Rae. It would be a radical departure for Fianna Fail to risk
losing power for the greater good.
As it is the minister for health couldn't find money for a cervical cancer vaccine, yet seemingly, when there are to be cuts all around, money can be found for projects in South Kerry. Maybe it is just what any political leader would do, so perhaps it is unfair to single out Gilmore for putting personal interest ahead of the country.

Rebelheart

mike65 wrote: »

You know what they say, if you don't vote socialist at 20 you have no heart, if you are voting socialist at 50 you have no brain*

As for a coup, Cowen deserves to be the victim of one.


*not suggesting you are 50, needless to say!

Not as much as Patrick Bartholomew Ahern needs to be prosecuted and prevented from becoming President.

Liam Byrne

Hillel wrote: »

His breadth and depth of knowledge is exceptional.

THAT must be why he didn't bother his arse reading a critical report detailing the cesspit that was Anglo Irish before selling our future to guarantee them!!!

THAT must be why he had to introduce an early budget that was so rubbish that he hit us with a second a few months later!!!!!

He's an incompetent idiot who doesn't do his job!

Whatever "depth" his knowledge has (and given that it's FF, there's no depths they won't sink to) it's nothing to do with what's best for the country, that's for sure!

nacho libre

Liam Byrne wrote: »

THAT must be why he had to introduce an early budget that was so rubbish that he hit us with a second a few months later!!!!!

!

i think that's more an indictment of his advisers in the department of finance than Lenihan, considering he had no background in finance. I believe McWilliams was telling the truth when he said Lenihan being given the job of minister for finance at the time, would be akin to him(McWilliams), who having no background in law, being asked to be attorney general in a constitutional crisis. Lenihan is a clever man, i'd say at this stage he is able to challenge the minds advising him on fiscal policy. I doubt this was the case for the first few months he was minister for finance.

Liam Byrne

nacho libre wrote: »

i think that's more an indictment of his advisers in the department of finance than Lenihan, considering he had no background in finance.

You don't need a background in finance to cop-on that you don't buy a pig in a poke! You need some common-sense!!

nacho libre wrote: »

I doubt this was the case for the first few months he was minister for finance.

That fits better after my sentence above than after yours.

If he didn't have the cop-on to do the job, he shouldn't have been given it.

I've no "background in finance", but if someone came up to me and said "Liam, someone wants you to invest €10 billion in something", I'd bloody well read the report!

And if I didn't (and still invested) I'd be fired on the spot! And rightly so!

prinz

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

Micheal Martin has been extremely quiet recently (read 2 years).
Obviously he doesn't want to be associated with this government and I'd say himself and Lenihan are on the same page (famous last words:D)..

I would agree with this. There are a few FF's left who are decent Martin being one of them. Brian Lenihan being another.

I predicted a few months ago a split in the FF party, I am going to stick with that prediction.

This story on the other just smacks of Gilmore trying to throw a spanner in the works coming up to the budget. Useless pr*ck. I'd rather he kept his mouth shut and kept some dignity for himself.

Pride Fighter

gandalf wrote: »

Over the last couple of weeks I have lost all respect for Gilmore as a leader and he and others in Labour will stop me voting Labour ever again, a party I have supported since my student days and one that I was a member of at one stage.

Dont believe everything you read. I would not believe this. Even if true, it would make me not vote for FF ever again. If they are so fractured, we will never have stable government with them at the helm.

gandalf

I have never voted for FF and I will never vote for them. I remember that crook Haughey on TV telling people to tighten their belts when my father was at the pin of his collar trying to feed us.

Stark

Last week when it looked like Cowen would cave into the unions, Gilmore said it was a disgrace and demanded we go even further and demand €1.6bn in cuts from the public sector. Now that that's not the case, Gilmore is saying we should have heard them out?

Stark

jackthekipper wrote: »

Me too, but I think I see a trend,
Bertie, hero to zero, Cowen steps in
Cowen, hero to zero Lenihan steps in
Lenihan, hero to zero, Coughlan steps in

When was Cowen ever a hero?

nacho libre

Liam Byrne wrote: »

I've no "background in finance", but if someone came up to me and said "Liam, someone wants you to invest €10 billion in something", I'd bloody well read the report!

And if I didn't (and still invested) I'd be fired on the spot! And rightly so!

but in fairness given you don't have a background in finance, you'd hardly be expected by the finance department of your company to read a report on something like quantitative easing and comprehend the report in full and its implications. Though, this just highlights the ridiculousness of minisiterial appointments.
As I can't think of many other jobs, where could you land a well-paid position despite having absolutely no revelant qualification for the position.
With this in mind I still think it was up to his advisers to make him aware of the salient points of the report and what needed to be done.
if he ignored the advice he was given by his advisers in the department of finance concerning his first budget then i fully agree with you. However I get the distinct impression, that they were, in fact, as clueless as he was about the gravity of the situation the country was facing.

By the way i'm not related to him:P