Secular Festive/Happy Holiday cards?

Red Sleeping Beauty

Hiya, does anyone know what shops (if any) do secular non-Christmas festive/holidays cards?

I had a look in a few card shops and the usual places but just about every card I looked at has Christmas on it.

muppeteer

You can order some from www.humanism.ie
order form is about half way down the page.

pH

Yea, it's probably asking too much to walk into your local newsagent and pick them up, but with a little forethought, there are plenty for sale on the net, and plenty more "make your own" places, I designed and ordered my cards on vistaprint.ie earlier (not specifically for *this* purpose - I just wanted cards with a specific image on them).

MagicMarker

Since when has xmas had anything to do with religion?

Dades

muppeteer wrote: »

You can order some from www.humanism.ie
order form is about half way down the page.

It says on the form you can just send them €10 via paypal also (to [email]members AT humanism.ie[/email] - use proper @), mentioning "cards" and including your address as part of the message.

Now I just have to decide who to risk sending one to.

artyeva

can understand if your local newsagent doesn't stock them but think outside the box - i got great ones in Next last year. No religious iconography and they were blank inside. Ikea if you're ever there have great cards. Abstract designs, again blank inside. If you're looking for ones specifically ''happy holidays'' on them i know my mum got some in either lidl or aldi last year.

krudler

Like this one

drkpower

Alan Rouge wrote: »

Hiya, does anyone know what shops (if any) do secular non-Christmas festive/holidays cards?

I had a look in a few card shops and the usual places but just about every card I looked at has Christmas on it.

Isnt a card with Santa or Rudolph or a tree (minus the star of course:D) secular?

If you are worried about the symbolism of the word Christmas, you probablyu shouldnt be sending any cards at this time of year.

SarahChambers

Noooooooooooooooooo

One of the best parts about being a non believer is not having to be involved in all this garbage! Why don't you just go to mass too.

Goduznt Xzst

In the true spirit of Atheism around this time of year I send people empty envelopes.

philologos

Alan Rouge wrote: »

Hiya, does anyone know what shops (if any) do secular non-Christmas festive/holidays cards?

I had a look in a few card shops and the usual places but just about every card I looked at has Christmas on it.

What's the big deal with it having "Christmas" on it?

Sam Vimes

Jakkass wrote: »

What's the big deal with it having "Christmas" on it?

Would you send this card:

Dades

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

In the true spirit of Atheism around this time of year I send people empty envelopes.

Reflecting the meaninglessness of your life, I presume?

Turtwig

Jakkass wrote: »

What's the big deal with it having "Christmas" on it?

Because it's derived from zombie worship.

philologos

Sam Vimes: Why would I send that on Christmas?
If it were FSM day I might.

Turtwig

Jakkass wrote: »

Sam Vimes: Why would I send that on Christmas?
If it were FSM day I might.

It is FSM day everyday:).

ShooterSF

Malty_T wrote: »

It is FSM day everyday:).

Happy FSM day Malty!

Turtwig

ShooterSF wrote: »

Happy FSM day Malty!

Happy FSM day Shooter.

Sam Vimes

Jakkass wrote: »

Sam Vimes: Why would I send that on Christmas?
If it were FSM day I might.

And why would he send a card with a reference to Christ on it when his reason for sending the card has nothing to do with Christ?

Although the FSM card wishes the receiver to have happy holidays which is one possible reason for you to want to send it. You have more reason to send the FSM card than he has to send a card celebrating the birth of someone who afaik was born in September, that is if he existed

MrPudding

Sam Vimes wrote: »

Would you send this card:

Hmmm, is there not some law against producing images of his noodley appendages?

MrP

robindch

MrPudding wrote: »

Hmmm, is there not some law against producing images of his noodley appendages?

No, the FSM's appendages (noodley and otherwise) are entirely copyright free.

And in the spirit of the season:

liamw

http://www.lasttrumpetministries.org/tracts/tract4.html

ChocolateSauce

MrPudding wrote: »

Hmmm, is there not some law against producing images of his noodley appendages?

MrP

No but images of his noodlyness offend my unfounded belief that it is an offence depict Him/Her/It in such a silly manner, so I might write to Dermot Ahern and see if he can help...

dvpower

robindch wrote: »

No, the FSM's appendages (noodley and otherwise) are entirely copyright free.

And in the spirit of the season:

He looks like He's enjoying that foot action too much. I feel a scandal coming on.

Plowman

This post has been deleted.

Red Sleeping Beauty

artyeva wrote: »

can understand if your local newsagent doesn't stock them but think outside the box - i got great ones in Next last year. No religious iconography and they were blank inside. Ikea if you're ever there have great cards. Abstract designs, again blank inside. If you're looking for ones specifically ''happy holidays'' on them i know my mum got some in either lidl or aldi last year.

Cheers, I'll have a browse in there. Abstract stuff with snow flakes or whatever would be grand. Just as long as it's not a baby in a manger or the word "Christ" anywhere.

krudler wrote: »

Like this one

Well, eh, yeah something like that!

drkpower wrote: »

Isnt a card with Santa or Rudolph or a tree (minus the star of course:D) secular?

If you are worried about the symbolism of the word Christmas, you probablyu shouldnt be sending any cards at this time of year.

Ah yeah. I'd accept general festive images like the above.

I'm just trying to find specifically non-religious cards for the festive season that's all.

SarahChambers wrote: »

Noooooooooooooooooo

One of the best parts about being a non believer is not having to be involved in all this garbage! Why don't you just go to mass too.

Eh.... people had been celebrating festivities around the end of the year for centuries before someone named Jesus claimed to "die" for our "sins".

I hope you're being sarcastic.

Jakkass wrote: »

What's the big deal with it having "Christmas" on it?

Ah here... c'mon Jakkass, if I went in to the Christian forum and asked a similar question we both know what would be the outcome!!!

You're posting a message in the Athiest&Agnostic forum and I'm asking where I can find a "Happy Holidays" style card without the word "Christmas" on it.

Exactly why do you THINK I don't want the word Christmas on it? Just hazzard a guess. Don't clog up the thread with your proselytizing. If you wish, you may PM me but don't drag it out here. Please.

Plowman wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Ye know... I think calling it "Paddy's Day" and getting absolutely blotto is enough of an anti-Catholic statement for me thank you very much.

Also, Halloween was about burning Catholics.

Sam Vimes

Plowman wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

St. Patricks day is already called Paddy's day by pretty much everyone and I doubt most people even know the religious origins of Halloween. I don't mind religious holidays existing mind you, the point of this thread is that the festival at the end of the year where people send cards and presents to each other doesn't necessarily have anything to do with some Jewish guy that got nailed to a stick 2000 years ago. For lots of people it's just a bit of time off to spend with their family and friends

philologos

Alan Rouge wrote: »

Ah here... c'mon Jakkass, if I went in to the Christian forum and asked a similar question we both know what would be the outcome!!!

You're posting a message in the Athiest&Agnostic forum and I'm asking where I can find a "Happy Holidays" style card without the word "Christmas" on it.

Exactly why do you THINK I don't want the word Christmas on it? Just hazzard a guess. Don't clog up the thread with your proselytizing. If you wish, you may PM me but don't drag it out here. Please.

It's hardly proselytising to suggest that it isn't a big deal to refer to Christmas, as well Christmas. There are still ways you can celebrate without engaging in religious observances. However, by and large on an international scale, this is a Christian festival. I don't suggest turning Channukah into anything but Channukah, in the same way I don't suggest turning Christmas, into anything but Christmas.

Flamed Diving

SarahChambers wrote: »

Noooooooooooooooooo

One of the best parts about being a non believer is not having to be involved in all this garbage! Why don't you just go to mass too.

You just want to suck the life out of everything, don't you?

Sam Vimes

Jakkass wrote: »

It's hardly proselytising to suggest that it isn't a big deal to refer to Christmas, as well Christmas. There are still ways you can celebrate without engaging in religious observances. However, by and large on an international scale, this is a Christian festival. I don't suggest turning Channukah into anything but Channukah, in the same way I don't suggest turning Christmas, into anything but Christmas.

Yeah I suppose atheists should work through the winter festival that predates christianity, shred any good wishes they receive on cards and refuse to wish anyone a good winter festival because it's been usurped by the christians :rolleyes:

Obni

Jakkass wrote: »

However, by and large on an international scale, this is a Christian festival.

The term 'holiday season' may sound like politically correct Californian waffle, but it quite accurately reflects the fact that around the winter solstice just about every northern hemisphere civilisation had some sort of celebration. The fact that the date chosen for Christmas was smack bang in the middle of mid-winter has meant that after centuries of the church's cultural domination, most Europeans can't separate Christmas from all of the Yuletide and Saturnalian trappings that it borrowed. Nobody is suggesting that the 'Christ' be taken out of Christmas. The OP is just looking for a card to send to family and friends at this traditionally festive time of year, that doesn't endorse one of the many cultural events that occur at that time (albeit the largest one 'round these parts).

Flamed Diving

Happy Dies Natalis Solis Invicti Day!

philologos

Sam Vimes: If you want to live in an age other than the current. Feel free. History's legacy has been that after Charlemagne Christmas gained prominence, that's the way it's been ever since. (Christmas has been practiced since the 3rd century however).

Obni: I think it is politically correct waffle. The mere desperation that some people have towards secularising Christian observances is getting absurd. Nobody is saying that atheists or agnostics cannot celebrate Christmas, but recognise it for what it is rather than what it isn't.

Flamed Diving

Jakkass wrote: »

Sam Vimes: If you want to live in an age other than the current. Feel free. History's legacy has been that after Charlemagne Christmas gained prominence, that's the way it's been ever since. (Christmas has been practiced since the 3rd century however).

Obni: I think it is politically correct waffle. The mere desperation that some people have towards secularising Christian observances is getting absurd. Nobody is saying that atheists or agnostics cannot celebrate Christmas, but recognise it for what it is rather than what it isn't.

I agree, we should all recognise our goldy fireball in the sky this Dies Natalis Solis Invicti Day and be grateful for its "magic" rise in the sky, next year.

All hail!

Plowman

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robindch

Jakkass wrote: »

Obni: I think it is politically correct waffle. The mere desperation that some people have towards secularising Christian observances is getting absurd.

I'm sure we discussed the same thing last year, but by religious standards, the festival currently known as "Christmas" originally was a secular festival. Up until the Emperors of Rome turned it into what christians think it is today.

There's nothing desperate (possibly even helpful, I'd have thought) in pointing out that the understanding of most religious people of the history of their own religion is simply flat-wrong.

Flamed Diving

Past Xmas discussions on A&A:

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/search.php?searchid=9424137

Sam Vimes

Flamed Diving wrote: »

I agree, we should all recognise our goldy fireball in the sky this Dies Natalis Solis Invicti Day and be grateful for its "magic" rise in the sky, next year.

All hail!

What he said. The fact that christians also have a festival at this time of year doesn't mean that no one else is allowed celebrate anything. Although that is why these festivals were made overlap with the currently existing in the first place.
Christians still give each other easter eggs even though that has nothing to do with christianity

Plowman wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

How is not partaking in a religious holiday stifling it? Do you stifle Chanukah by not giving dradles as presents

philologos

robindch wrote: »

I'm sure we discussed the same thing last year, but by religious standards, the festival currently known as "Christmas" originally was a secular festival. Up until the Emperors of Rome turned it into what christians think it is today.

Originally it was a pagan festival. Then as Christianity took influence it was used to honour the birth of Christ. That's the current context we are in.

robindch wrote: »

There's nothing desperate (possibly even helpful, I'd have thought) in pointing out that the understanding of most religious people of the history of their own religion is simply flat-wrong.

It's absolutely desperate. Why not be a part of Christmas instead of making attempts to water it down?

I've made a clear account of what happened. From 200AD onwards Christians in Egypt used the day to honour the birth of Christ having believed He was conceived in spring. Post-Charlemagne this became common in Europe. This is where we are today.

Why does everything have to be an assault on what festivals we already have rather than being a part of it?

Sam Vimes wrote:

How is not partaking in a religious holiday stifling it? Do you stifle Chanukah by not giving dradles as present.

You do take part in Christmas, that's the point here, but you want to deny it's Christian significance. I don't deny the significance of Channukah to the Jewish people. Indeed, restoring the Temple from the Greeks is a notable event in Jewish history when Yehuda HaMaccabi restored the State of Israel prior to being conquested by Rome. I don't wish to change that meaning however. You and others do want to change the meaning of Christmas.

Flamed Diving

Jakkass wrote: »

Originally it was a pagan festival. Then as Christianity took influence it was used to honour the birth of Christ. That's the current context we are in.

Excuse me! On the 25th of Dec I shall be celebrating Dies Natalis Solis Invicti Day.

Sam Vimes

Jakkass wrote: »

Originally it was a pagan festival. Then as Christianity took influence it was used to honour the birth of Christ. That's the current context we are in.

Jakkass wrote: »

It's absolutely desperate. Why not be a part of Christmas instead of making attempts to water it down?

So it's fine for christians to come in and "water down" a pre-existing pagan festival but not for atheists to use the winter festival to celebrate in the way they want

Sure why don't we all just become christians? It'll be much easier that way instead of having all these people around who want to celebrate with their family and friends but don't want to mark the birth of Jesus. And we should all celebrate Chanukah and Ramadan too, lest they get watered down.

Sam Vimes

Jakkass wrote: »

You do take part in Christmas, that's the point here, but you want to deny it's Christian significance.

My "Christmas" is about spending time with and exchanging presents with my loved ones. It has nothing to do with Jesus. And during the festival after the vernal equinox I will give my loved ones easter eggs but I'm not actually celebrating the god Eostre

Jakkass wrote: »

I don't deny the significance of Channukah to the Jewish people. Indeed, restoring the Temple from the Greeks is a notable event in Jewish history when Yehuda HaMaccabi restored the State of Israel prior to being conquested by Rome. I don't wish to change that meaning however. You and others do want to change the meaning of Christmas.

Just like Christians changed the meaning of Yule and Easter

philologos

Sam Vimes wrote: »

Sure why don't we all just become christians? It'll be much easier that way instead of having all these people around who want to celebrate with their family and friends but don't want to mark the birth of Jesus. And we should all celebrate Chanukah and Ramadan too, lest they get watered down.

If you want to celebrate Christmas without believing in God, that is fine! However don't make pretence that you aren't celebrating Christmas. I don't get why people can't just respect Christmas for what it is currently.

If I want to celebrate Chanukah I'll celebrate it in a way that respects it for what it is. The same is true of Ramadhan. Currently I opt out from both, although I do appreciate the sentiments of the message of Chanukah. Refinding God in a society that wishes to have nothing to do with Him.

Easter is celebrated around the time when Jesus was crucified. It is historically verifiable to around that time due to the fact that Jesus was crucified during the Passover festival.

Sam Vimes wrote:

My "Christmas" is about spending time with and exchanging presents with my loved ones. It has nothing to do with Jesus. And during the festival after the vernal equinox I will give my loved ones easter eggs but I'm not actually celebrating the god Eostre

If you want to regard Christmas in that way that is your choice. However, there is absolutely no reason to attempt to change it for everyone else.

Obni

Jakkass wrote: »

If you want to celebrate Christmas without believing in God, that is fine! However don't make pretence that you aren't celebrating Christmas. I don't get why people can't just respect Christmas for what it is currently.

Did you actually read the OP's question?
It was a query regarding "secular non-Christmas festive/holidays cards".
So someone wants festive/holiday cards, of a secular nature, and given the location of the OP in a location where mid-winter shenanigans are synonymous with Christmas, specifically non-Christmas.

By all means celebrate Christmas, and I hope you have a joyful and peaceful one, but do allow others to celebrate this time of year in their own way.

Sam Vimes

Jakkass wrote: »

If you want to celebrate Christmas without believing in God, that is fine! However don't make pretence that you aren't celebrating Christmas. I don't get why people can't just respect Christmas for what it is currently.

Could you tell me what giving my Dad a new jumper, eating a big turkey dinner and going out on the piss has to do with Jesus Christ?

Also, I'd like to point out that your fellows christians did not respect the currently existing pagan festivals for what they were.

Jakkass wrote: »

If you want to regard Christmas in that way that is your choice. However, there is absolutely no reason to attempt to change it for everyone else.

WTF does me sending a card to a friend with Happy Holidays on it have to do with how you celebrate the birth of some guy you think was the son of god and also god and also a ghost all at the same time?

robindch

Jakkass wrote: »

Originally it was a pagan festival. Then as Christianity took influence it was used to honour the birth of Christ. That's the current context we are in.

Er, yes, that's the point I was making. It's not "politically correct" -- and I really have no idea what you mean by that -- to say that the current context is wrong. As I said above, on the contrary it seems quite honest to point this out.

Jakkass wrote: »

Why not be a part of Christmas instead of making attempts to water it down?

I'm not watering down christmas. I see nothing to celebrate about the man who has caused (intentionally or otherwise) more misery and ignorance in more people in more places in more times than any other human in history.

Yes, I'll be having a laugh this christmas with the best of them, but it's not to honor Jesus. My celebration will be far more upon the lines of the Saturnalia.

Jakkass wrote: »

Why does everything have to be an assault on what festivals we already have rather than being a part of it?

Why do you assault the Saturnalia and the Holy Feast of Sol Invictus? Why do you not take part in that?

robindch

Jakkass wrote: »

If you want to celebrate Christmas without believing in God, that is fine! However don't make pretence that you aren't celebrating Christmas. I don't get why people can't just respect Christmas for what it is currently.

Or, with the same logic, why don't you ask muslims to respect god for what you think he/she/it is, and stop the pretense of praying to the wrong god.

Jakkass wrote: »

However, there is absolutely no reason to attempt to change it for everyone else.

Jakkass -- seriously. Are you actually responding to anybody's posts, or are you simply getting annoyed that people aren't respecting your beliefs enough?

Unlike your wish to change our views of 25th December, we do not wish to change how you do your christmas. All the OP wanted to do is to buy some seasonal cards without the usual religious stuff on them. Not all that easy to do, I have to say. At least, not if you want something above the Hallmark(tm) level.

And as Obni says above, and on behalf of the forum, I hope you have a good and peaceful 25th, and spend it as you wish.

robindch

Sam Vimes wrote: »

Could you tell me what giving my Dad a new jumper,

Gift-giving was part of the Roman Saturnalia.

Sam Vimes wrote: »

eating a big turkey dinner

A fairly recent American tradition.

Sam Vimes wrote: »

and going out on the piss

Back to Rome again for that one.

Sam Vimes wrote: »

has to do with Jesus Christ?

Nothing. As an orthodox jew, Jesus would not have taken part in the Saturnalia and so wouldn't probably have done the gift-giving; as North America was unknown to the Roman world, he'd never have heard of turkeys; and again as an orthodox jew, he certainly wouldn't have been celebrating a pagan festival by getting hammered.

.

TheCandystripes

Talk about pedantic. I have no time for religion but why go through that bother. 2 euro for a pack of 20 cards works a treat.

Extravagant!

Ditto.

If you're going to send a card for christmas, it might as well be a christmas card(!)

..gotta say I also like the FSM one though...

Flamed Diving

TheCandystripes wrote: »

Talk about pedantic. I have no time for religion but why go through that bother. 2 euro for a pack of 20 cards works a treat.

You gotta love this resistance to social convention.

There, there sheep. It will be alright...