Would you accept a child molester.

Quality

Heard a story at the weekend from a friend of mine.



Long story short, she was telling me a story of a cousin of hers who is marrying a guy who abused at least 3 kids when he was a teenager.

Seemingly he has a child for this girl he is marrying and that she knows all about his past.

So this guy is basically a paedophile. The youngest kid he abused was 6 and seemingly it didnt matter if they were male or female.


Would you be able to have a relationship with a child molester?

Have children with one?

I felt sick. I think I would be horrified if I met someone and found out that they were a child molester.



Do they deserve a second chance?

Ziggurat

I think it's important to make a distinction between "paedophile" and "child molester".

In the former case I think I'd have no problem, in the latter I would.

Quality

Ziggurat wrote: »

I think it's important to make a distinction between "paedophile" and "child molester".

In the former case I think I'd have no problem, in the latter I would.

Sorry.. Yes To make it clear, this guy has molested children, he acted out on his urges.

Nevyn

It would depend on the circumstances, his age and if he had treatment.

Quality

What sort of treatment?

Is it 100% effective?

midlandsmissus

No I would not give them a second chance. I know the life-long lasting damage it does when a child is abused. The paedophile doesn't stop and think that for his few minutes of pleasure another life is irreversibly damaged.

I'm 25 now and I've never gotten over it and never will. The anger eats away at me when I think of what that b*stard did to me as a defenseless child.It never leaves you.

I have a friend who was abused as well, she spoke about it to me once and broke down hysterically, it severely angered me to see the hurt caused to her aswell, from an incident more than 20 years ago...it never leaves you. So many women have a story.

There was a documentary on a while ago about paedophiles, suggesting that their brains were wired differently. I hadn't seen it but a male acquaintance of mine brought up the subject with me recently (He doesn't know I was abused),and suggested that it wasn't the paedophiles fault, that they couldn't help their urges.
I said to him that that was a load of sh*t because no matter what they felt, they know that they are about to inflict serious pain on a child, they know that they will be seriously hurting another, and if they are the type of person that will go ahead and do it anyway: inflicting pain on a child for their own satisfaction, then I would never ever let that person near a child again.

I am trying very hard lately to forgive the person who did it to me, as the anger and hatred is only hurting me not him, it is the hardest thing I have ever had to do, but I try.

Nevyn

Quality wrote: »

What sort of treatment?

Is it 100% effective?

That would depend on the reason's why it happened, there can be two victims in such cases and there are some cases which a person can get therapy for esp if it was a case where a person is trying to stop a cycle of abuse.

If a person was abused as a kid and becomes a teen and their sexuality as become twisted due to the abuse, they may abuse other children as that is "normal" to them. Such cases are more common then most people know and such people can be helped.

http://www.co.midland.mi.us/presentations/probatejcc/probatejcc.html

Quality

I really cannot see how someone could have a relationship with a child molester, How that girls parents are letting him be a father to their grandchild and to marry him.

Ickle Magoo

The fact they had molested children would instantly make them completely unattractive to me. I couldn't live my life constantly worrying about re-offending, if my kids were safe, if other kids were safe...nope, couldn't do it.

metrovelvet

No way. They cannot be rehabilitated. I dont care what kind of victimisation they went through that they now carry out on the innocent. Absolutely no way. As far as Im concerned with this, Hitler had the right idea but the wrong people. No way no way no way. NO.

Bottle_of_Smoke

Thaedydal wrote: »

That would depend on the reason's why it happened, there can be two victims in such cases and there are some cases which a person can get therapy for esp if it was a case where a person is trying to stop a cycle of abuse.

If a person was abused as a kid and becomes a teen and their sexuality as become twisted due to the abuse, they may abuse other children as that is "normal" to them. Such cases are more common then most people know and such people can be helped.

http://www.co.midland.mi.us/presentations/probatejcc/probatejcc.html

Whilst I might have some sympathy for people liek that I don't think I could ever feel comfortable with them around children.

So no, not a chance

we'llallhavetea_old

absolutely no. never. NEVER.

Jesus Wept

Ziggurat wrote: »

I think it's important to make a distinction between "paedophile" and "child molester".

In the former case I think I'd have no problem, in the latter I would.

I don't understand the distinction.
Could you explain?

FruitLover

The-Rigger wrote: »

I don't understand the distinction.
Could you explain?

A paedophile is someone who is sexually attracted to pre-pubescent children (not in itself a crime). A child molester is a paedophile who has acted on this attraction (i.e. has actually abused a child).

seahorse

FruitLover wrote: »

A paedophile is someone who is sexually attracted to pre-pubescent children (not in itself a crime). A child molester is a paedophile who has acted on this attraction (i.e. has actually abused a child).

It is not a 'crime' as far as the law is concerned, but it is disturbing and disgusting enough that most people would not want a person with such urges anywhere near them, never mind their kids. Neither active nor inactive pedophiles’ would be welcome anywhere near my home or my child.

I cannot understand what drives any woman to create children with a person sick enough to be sexually attracted to them. In my opinion she’d have to have some serious psychological problems of her own.

Nevyn

With out more info I don't think a proper judgement can be made, there is a different to me at least between a 13/15 year old who'd been sexually abused acting out with other children who's sexuality and moral judgement has been frankly fúcked up and a 19 year old who was never sexually abused and is a classic pedophole and is solely sexually attracted to children.

The former can get help and can to an extent be sorted out and not be a risk and can helped and never feel the urge to touch children again in that manner and eventually heal from the damaged self esteem and self loathing from being a messed up kid who became a juvenile sexual offender and that be the end of it;

Where as the latter will have to fight their sexual preference for the rest of their life.

seahorse

Thaedydal wrote: »

there is a different to me at least between a 13/15 year old who'd been sexually abused acting out with other children who's sexuality and moral judgement has been frankly fúcked up and a 19 year old who was never sexually abused and is a classic pedophole and is solely sexually attracted to children.

I agree that, to someone detached from the situation such as myself, there are differences in these circumstances; but the biggest and most important issue as far as I am concerned is that for the young child being abused, there is no distinction here.

Nevyn

I know but this thread is about the adult in the here and now rather then the child then.
These issues are not always starkly black and white.

Quality

Yes but those actions of him as a teenager have made him the man he is today.

Do you really think that you would be able to see past his past.

I wasnt told of when he made her aware of his past or how that conversation came about... But siren bells would be going off in my head if someone disclosed that info to me.

I would not feel safe having children around a known child molester.

metrovelvet

Thaedydal wrote: »

With out more info I don't think a proper judgement can be made, there is a different to me at least between a 13/15 year old who'd been sexually abused acting out with other children who's sexuality and moral judgement has been frankly fúcked up and a 19 year old who was never sexually abused and is a classic pedophole and is solely sexually attracted to children.

The former can get help and can to an extent be sorted out and not be a risk and can helped and never feel the urge to touch children again in that manner and eventually heal from the damaged self esteem and self loathing from being a messed up kid who became a juvenile sexual offender and that be the end of it;

Where as the latter will have to fight their sexual preference for the rest of their life.

Even if they went through treatment and had the ok would you still feel ok letting him near your kids?

Mackleton

Under absolutely no circumstances would I let someone like that near me, never mind if I had a child :eek: No way, no how, no hope, amen.

Zombrex

Quality wrote: »

Do they deserve a second chance?

For me it would not really be about a "second chance", it would be about the question are they still a danger to children?

Quality

I am sure there are lots of people out there who have relatives who have abused...

How do they deal with it..

If it was your brother who did it or if you found out that your dad had in the past.

Do these people forgive and forget or do they blank them from their lives.

metrovelvet

Quality wrote: »

I am sure there are lots of people out there who have relatives who have abused...

How do they deal with it..

If it was your brother who did it or if you found out that your dad had in the past.

Do these people forgive and forget or do they blank them from their lives.

I wouldnt let them near my child. I dont care who they are. If it were my father or brother, I would still be sickened.

seahorse

Thaedydal wrote: »

I know but this thread is about the adult in the here and now rather then the child then.
These issues are not always starkly black and white.

I understand that Thaedyal, but my perception of the adult in the here and now would be very much shaped by the devastation he had caused to children.

seahorse

Quality wrote: »

I am sure there are lots of people out there who have relatives who have abused...

How do they deal with it..

If it was your brother who did it or if you found out that your dad had in the past.

Do these people forgive and forget or do they blank them from their lives.

If a family member of mine did this they would be immediately disowned and I wouldn’t give a shyte if they went out and hung themselves. The world could do with one less child molester as far as I'm concerned.

Far too many people are prepared to pontificate about sympathy and compassion when they have no personal experience of the sheer devastation, the suicide, addiction, self-mutilation, and crippling depression this depravity is responsible for.

Nevyn

I am aware of the devestation and how it ruins and splits up families, I have experience that in my own extended family.

They weren't a teen, they weren't sexually abused they just has a thing for post pubesent young girls and is a sexual predator and never admitted what they was doing was seriously wrong and never got help so and was disowned by the bulk of the family.

But again the thread says this about someone who did something they should not of as a teen and thats all the info given and that is too vauge.

seahorse

I get where you’re coming from here Thaedydal, but there is one factor which is principal above all others in the assessing of evil intent, and that is whether or not a person knows what they are doing is wrong.

If a person has sexually abused others and made efforts to conceal it then they knew what they were doing was wrong, which makes them culpable in my eyes and in the eyes of the law, (regardless what abuses they’d suffered themselves in the past) and certainly no fit company for children.

I have to say I really dislike the term ‘acting out’ here in relation to teenagers abusing younger children. I think it is a term which seeks to sanitise the sexual molestation of minors. I am not talking about your attitude here Thaedydal, I am talking about the term itself.

Goduznt Xzst

You could never truly trust the individual. I don't believe sexual attraction is something that can be easily turned off. If I was to look at a picture of someone I found sexually attractive there is no way of mentally disable that response.

He might have his urges under control, but they are still there. A moment of weakness, maybe under the influence of alcohol, could ruin the wifes and the child's life.

Also, normal parental contact with their children would instantly be viewed as sinister, even if it wasn't. Would the wife allow the child to crawl into bed with them on a stormy night? Go camping alone together? Shower the child?

Nevyn

seahorse wrote: »

I have to say I really dislike the term ‘acting out’ here in relation to teenagers abusing younger children. I think it is a term which seeks to sanitise the sexual molestation of minors. I am not talking about your attitude here Thaedydal, I am talking about the term itself.

I don't think it should be sanitised and I don't think that it should be ignored,
I do think it should be spoken about so parents can be aware and those who are effected by it get the help and treatment they need.

Tbh it starts with awareness and education both of which has been sorely lacking in this country and still is but while I do no condone the actions of anyone who sexually abuses anyone at any age, if we don't deal and educate
children about their emerging sexuality playing "dr and nurses" and "Mammys and Daddys" can and will go on as minors explore with out information and boundaries.

But I totally see that as separate from someone who knows damn well better
preying on an innocent and their ignorance to sexually abuse them.

nacho libre

Wicknight wrote: »

For me it would not really be about a "second chance", it would be about the question are they still a danger to children?

unless sciences advances to the point where we can change or neutralise a person's orientation then the answer to that question must be yes in many cases. however, that said for some the shame of being convicted is enough to deter them for reoffending.

What really gets to me is the thinking of people like Stephen Fry and Alan Bennett on this subject. These are highly intelligent men who really should know better. Their ambivalence towards this issue is disturbing.

Bottle_of_Smoke

Thaedydal wrote: »

With out more info I don't think a proper judgement can be made, there is a different to me at least between a 13/15 year old who'd been sexually abused acting out with other children who's sexuality and moral judgement has been frankly fúcked up and a 19 year old who was never sexually abused and is a classic pedophole and is solely sexually attracted to children.

The former can get help and can to an extent be sorted out and not be a risk and can helped and never feel the urge to touch children again in that manner and eventually heal from the damaged self esteem and self loathing from being a messed up kid who became a juvenile sexual offender and that be the end of it;

I'm not so sure about that. Lets say theres someone like that, was abused as a child and then in adulthood went on to abuse a child. Even if they'd had treatment could you really let them look after children alone, say children your children are friends with?

kowloon

Agree with Thaedyal, there's a difference between a 12 year old teen being messed up and an adult doing the same. I'm sure it makes no difference for the victims though.

Ickle Magoo

There is a difference but it makes no difference to me in terms of having a relationship with them - which was the question the OP asked...

kowloon

You could argue though, that a 12 year old abusing a child is an event much further in the past and less representative of the persons character than if they had done it as an adult, and hence it's more forgivable.

I'm thinking this is just scales of crime though, neither being acceptable.

metrovelvet

kowloon wrote: »

You could argue though, that a 12 year old abusing a child is an event much further in the past and less representative of the persons character than if they had done it as an adult, and hence it's more forgivable.

I'm thinking this is just scales of crime though, neither being acceptable.

I still wouldnt take the risk and let them near my son though. Ever.

Ickle Magoo

kowloon wrote: »

You could argue though, that a 12 year old abusing a child is an event much further in the past and less representative of the persons character than if they had done it as an adult, and hence it's more forgivable.

I'm thinking this is just scales of crime though, neither being acceptable.

You could argue that, I still wouldn't want them anywhere near me or my kids...millions of children are abused, they don't all go on to become child abusers, as a 12 year old or an adult. I wouldn't want a relationship with anyone that has abused a child, whatever the circumstances, whatever their age, period.

metrovelvet

kowloon wrote: »

You could argue though, that a 12 year old abusing a child is an event much further in the past and less representative of the persons character than if they had done it as an adult, and hence it's more forgivable.

I'm thinking this is just scales of crime though, neither being acceptable.

I remember all too well an incident that happenned in my living room one evening when we were left with a 12 year old boy who was minding us. Back then it was acceptable for a child this age to babysit. My brother was about 2 and I was about 6. He stripped my brother down and tied him to a chair. I didnt know quite was wrong but I knew it was wrong so I booted him out of the house and waited for my mother to come home.

I found out years later that this boy had been tied to a chair and raped as a child and he was smack in the middle of a re-enactment with my little brother.

I am absolutist about it. NO NO NO.

SweetDreamer

i was molested by my cousin for years up until the age of about 10 ro 11. i am now 18 and have thought about it everyday since. If my cousin was getting engaged, i would tell his fiancee exactly what he did to me and tell her for her own sake to leave him. To think that my cousin would ever have his own children makes me feel faint. I've only every told my boyfriend about what happened me, and have no intention of every telling anyone else. But putting him in charge of kids is just sick and i couldnt just stand around and watch him raise a family in fear that he'd do the same to them. he was only 15 or 16 when he did it to me but i still see him the same way as i always did.

metrovelvet

A friend of mine was raped every night for a year by a twelve year old. She was eight. He snuck in from upstairs. They were stationed in India, and I guess left the windows open. I dont know the logisitics. But I know enough that I would never trust anyone with that history.

--Kaiser--

Would you be able to have a relationship with a child molester?

No, I would not even speak to one, or p1ss on them if they were on fire for that matter.

midlandsmissus

SweetDreamer wrote: »

i was molested by my cousin for years up until the age of about 10 ro 11. i am now 18 and have thought about it everyday since. If my cousin was getting engaged, i would tell his fiancee exactly what he did to me and tell her for her own sake to leave him. To think that my cousin would ever have his own children makes me feel faint. I've only every told my boyfriend about what happened me, and have no intention of every telling anyone else. But putting him in charge of kids is just sick and i couldnt just stand around and watch him raise a family in fear that he'd do the same to them. he was only 15 or 16 when he did it to me but i still see him the same way as i always did.

I SO know what you mean. I've never told anyone about it either, except a boyfriend and a close friend. It's so very hard to talk about it. I only got to the stage a short while ago that I could talk about it on an anonymous internet forum, as I thought that somebody might recognise me. That's bad isn't it? It's that I still feel 'dirty' and I don't want some-one to know it about me.

With regards to the abused going on to be abusers, I think some abusers use that as an excuse.

I was abused, and I could never even contemplate inflicting pain on a small child. In fact I think that the effect my experience had on me was to make me more empathetic with other people's suffering.

So being abused hasn't made me want to abuse, maybe that excuse is a way for abusers to try and justify their behaviour to themselves?

elexes

these people can never be trusted.

Denerick

Thaedydal wrote: »

I know but this thread is about the adult in the here and now rather then the child then.
These issues are not always starkly black and white.

Yes, thank you! It always enrages me when society get their pitchforks out over the 'paedo' threat. Chris Morris dealt with it in such a profound way it makes all of our back and forths rather pointless. The fact of the matter is that its a horrible crime, but when I see things like 'Hitler had the right idea, just the wrong people', my blood boils, it really does.

Trouser_Press

Quality wrote: »

Do they deserve a second chance?

Personally, I could never give a second chance to someone who abused children in the past, no matter how long ago it was. Even if I was certain - and I doubt that's possible - that they would never reoffend, I could never forgive them for the damage they had already done to their victims.

But while I wouldn't denounce our legal system for giving people second chances, the recidivism rates among abusers appears to be disturbingly high, ranging from 30% to 45% in any studies I've read - and bear in mind how many incidents of child abuse go undetected/unreported.

For that reason, in my humble opinion, any adult who chooses to give a 'second chance' to someone guilty of such abuse in the past, and brings them in to a home with children, is selfish and contemptible. It's the ultimate definition of 'child endangerment'. You don't take 'chances' with children's safety.

Trouser_Press

Denerick wrote: »

The fact of the matter is that its a horrible crime, but.....

There's always a but.

Black Magic

Reading some posts here is it fair to say that a paedophile is selected but a child molester would not?

Denerick

Black Magic wrote: »

Reading some posts here is it fair to say that a paedophile is selected but a child molester would not?

What do you mean? The difference between a paedophile and a child molester is rather stark. Paedophilia is beyond the paedophiles choice but he can choose on whether he should act on it or not. I have absolutely no sympathy for someone who acts on their impulses but you have to remember that paedophilia is a sexual disorder, that thousands upon thousands of men and women keep to themselves and never act out on. It simply isn't a black and white case of paedophile=evil.

Personally, I wouldn't countenance entering a relationship with a paedophile, whether he/she acted out on it or not, because it wouldn't be fair to that person or the future child to have that person anywhere near children. But the reality is that they cannot help how they think or what they are attracted to, and are not immediately evil as a result of this fact. What makes these people evil is when they act on their impulses. But we never hear of the paedophile who lived his entire life without ever resorting to these evil measures, why do you think that is? Its all a media driven universe of fear, hyped beyond all proportion (Not that this takes away from victims of child sexual abuse in the slightest)

junder

Quality wrote: »

Heard a story at the weekend from a friend of mine.



Long story short, she was telling me a story of a cousin of hers who is marrying a guy who abused at least 3 kids when he was a teenager.

Seemingly he has a child for this girl he is marrying and that she knows all about his past.

So this guy is basically a paedophile. The youngest kid he abused was 6 and seemingly it didnt matter if they were male or female.


Would you be able to have a relationship with a child molester?

Have children with one?

I felt sick. I think I would be horrified if I met someone and found out that they were a child molester.



Do they deserve a second chance?

how could he ever be trusted around the young daughter in this marrage

The Corinthian

junder wrote: »

how could he ever be trusted around the young daughter in this marrage

Had he committed murder as a teenager could he be trusted?

midlandsmissus

The Corinthian wrote: »

Had he committed murder as a teenager could he be trusted?

Paedophiles have a very high rate of reoffending.