Are you thinking of leaving the Catholic Church?

MrMatisse

Just wondering is anyone thinking of doing this given the recent revalations?

If you do want to:

http://www.countmeout.ie/

Theres also a pre written email if you wanna just say your not happy at what went on.

Handsome Bob

I'm not a religious man, but all the same I don't see why people should give up on their religion just because of the disgraceful behaviour of the Catholic Church hierarchy.

preilly79

how does one leave the church? as far as the church is concerned, that countmeout.ie thing doesn't 'disjoin' you.




... don't say by the door.

connundrum

I was listening to an interview with a man who went through the entire process. Apparently it took him years and cost a few bob.

I've better things to be doing with my life tbh, like sleeping and taking dumps.

MrMatisse

If you want to leave go to

http://www.countmeout.ie/

and read how. It doesnt cost anything.

rejkin

No. You can't blame the religion on the faults of a few people. Those priests where assholes for what they did and they shouldn't have covered it up but I'm still not going to do something as drastic s leaving the religion because of it.

BraziliaNZ

I kind of like the whole Catholic thing but I don't believe in God so it's weird. I wouldn't christen my kids if i ever had any though.

Xluna

LZ5by5 wrote: »

I'm not a religious man, but all the same I don't see why people should give up on their religion just because of the disgraceful behaviour of the Catholic Church hierarchy.

Because they can still count heads in the churchs and that gives them power to get away with aiding and abetting priests who rape little kids and nuns who beat seven shades of crap out of little girls.

prinz

Why would I? People have abused lots of organisations and beliefs to get into positions that could exploit. The Catholic Church is no different. For ever abuser (and those who enabled them) there were and are countless members who haven't done a thing wrong.

prinz

Xluna wrote: »

Because they can still count heads in the churchs and that gives them power to get away with aiding and abetting priests who rape little kids and nuns who beat seven shades of crap out of little girls.

Most physical and sexual abuse is perpetrated by a family member or a friend of the family.... should we stop associating with them too?

stovelid

I'm in work at the moment so it's not currently possible.

MrMatisse

prinz wrote: »

Why would I? People have abused lots of organisations and beliefs to get into positions that could exploit. The Catholic Church is no different. For ever abuser (and those who enabled them) there were and are countless members who haven't done a thing wrong.

Because the leadership at the top is rotten, and wont change unless there is no bums on seats.

Xluna

rejkin wrote: »

No. You can't blame the religion on the faults of a few people. Those priests where assholes for what they did and they shouldn't have covered it up but I'm still not going to do something as drastic s leaving the religion because of it.

I'd agree with you if the church hierarchy acted responsibly but no-they aided and abetted child rapists to save money and face.

MrMatisse

prinz wrote: »

Most physical and sexual abuse is perpetrated by a family member or a friend of the family.... should we stop associating with them too?

Well you wouldnt expect your friends to go see them every week after they did it

Xluna

prinz wrote: »

Most physical and sexual abuse is perpetrated by a family member or a friend of the family.... should we stop associating with them too?

Errmmm....YES!

prinz

Really-Stressed wrote: »

Well you wouldnt expect your friends to go see them every week after they did it

Sorry mate but not every priest was involved :rolleyes:

Twin-go

prinz wrote: »

Why would I? People have abused lots of organisations and beliefs to get into positions that could exploit. The Catholic Church is no different. For ever abuser (and those who enabled them) there were and are countless members who haven't done a thing wrong.

I can think of 2 reasons:

1. The rotten core of the church its abuse and cover up,
2. There is no God

Xluna

Really-Stressed wrote: »

Well you wouldnt expect your friends to go see them every week after they did it

And you certainly would'nt expect them to be Gods mouth piece.

prinz

Xluna wrote: »

Errmmm....YES!

So you don't visit your family anymore?

Handsome Bob

Xluna wrote: »

Because they can still count heads in the churchs and that gives them power to get away with aiding and abetting priests who rape little kids and nuns who beat seven shades of crap out of little girls.

Well, if one was a practising Catholic, why would they be against having their heads counted as part of that religion? However what you have suggested above is perfectly relevant for atheists who are still "officially" a part of the church so I'd urge them to take action.

Religious people don't have to leave their church to take action on these disgraceful and tragic events. They can simply join together with people of all beliefs in this country and demand that the government take action.

MrMatisse

LZ5by5 wrote: »

Well, if one was a practising Catholic, why would they be against having their heads counted as part of that religion? However what you have suggested above is perfectly relevant for atheists who are still "officially" a part of the church so I'd urge them to take action.

Religious people don't have to leave their church to take action on these disgraceful and tragic events. They can simply join together with people of all beliefs in this country and demand that the government take action.

Its nothing to do with the governement. Church and state are separate. If there is a problem the members of the Church should change it. The governement should just be rounding them up for mountjoy.

Xluna

LZ5by5 wrote: »

Well, if one was a practising Catholic, why would they be against having their heads counted as part of that religion? However what you have suggested above is perfectly relevant for atheists who are still "officially" a part of the church so I'd urge them to take action.

Religious people don't have to leave their church to take action on these disgraceful and tragic events. They can simply join together with people of all beliefs in this country and demand that the government take action.

Good luck. From the past twelve years it seems this government rewards crime.(Cough, NAMA cough.)

prinz

Really-Stressed wrote: »

Its nothing to do with the governement..

If the government had done it's job back in the day Mountjoy is exactly where they would all be.

philologos

Another thread!

I guess I shouldn't vote on this poll as I have nothing to leave.

Twin-go wrote:

There is no God

That's as much a faith statement as saying Jesus Christ is Lord. You believe it, that's fine, it doesn't make it a factual reason.

Run_to_da_hills

There should be another poll opion for "already left". It didn't take a danming report for some of us to tell how corrupt ths organisation was. BTW I am out of it over 20 years now.

MrMatisse

prinz wrote: »

If the government had done it's job back in the day Mountjoy is exactly where they would all be.

They didnt always know. The priests didnt tell them and played it down. They held such respect this was allowed.

Obviously they dont deserve it.

prinz

Really-Stressed wrote: »

They didnt always know. The priests didnt tell them and played it down. They held such respect this was allowed.
Obviously they dont deserve it.

I take it you haven't actually read the report itself then or the Ryan report, why am I not suprised..

Handsome Bob

Really-Stressed wrote: »

Its nothing to do with the governement. Church and state are separate. If there is a problem the members of the Church should change it. The governement should just be rounding them up for mountjoy.

You're telling me the government can't take action on people who covered up child sex abuse? Or that, if there is enough public outrage that's more than just armchair ranting towards the church, that this government can't lean heavily on the church to rethink their role within the education system?

MrMatisse

prinz wrote: »

I take it you haven't actually read the report itself then or the Ryan report, why am I not suprised..

No it was published yesterday and its not something I would want to read either.. Dont try and deflect the blame from the church. The men at the top are sick and defending the organisation by slight is disgusting.

Xluna

Jakkass wrote: »

Another thread!

I guess I shouldn't vote on this poll as I have nothing to leave.



That's as much a faith statement as saying Jesus Christ is Lord. You believe it, that's fine, it doesn't make it a factual reason.

You could'nt be more wrong. You're making the false assumption that the odds of God existing and not existing are equal. The burden of belief rests on the believer.

What you said makes as much sense as saying there is equal chance that there is no God as the flying spaghetti monster lives inside the mansion house and secretly controls the country. If you look at the evidence you will see the universe looks as it would be were there no God.

MrMatisse

LZ5by5 wrote: »

You're telling me the government can't take action on people who covered up child sex abuse? Or that, if there is enough public outrage that's more than just armchair ranting towards the church, that this government can't lean heavily on the church to rethink their role within the education system?

No im saying they should be locked up by the government.

Handsome Bob

Really-Stressed wrote: »

No im saying they should be locked up by the government.

So we agree so.

MrMatisse

LZ5by5 wrote: »

So we agree so.

I have no idea what you are on about tbh

MrMatisse

The parents should chuck them out of the schools.

Handsome Bob

Really-Stressed wrote: »

I have no idea what you are on about tbh

You want those who are guilty locked up. So do I. All I was merely saying is the best way for this to be achieved is for people to mobilise and put immense pressure on the government to take the action of putting those who are guilty on trial. Do I need to clarify any further?

Max Power1

wow, oh its another thread on leaving the church!! (theres lods more but i really couldnt be arsed linking them)

To answer the OP, yes i left months ago. No point being a statistical member of something whose beliefs contradict proven fact, and when that organisation also covers up for child rapists

MrMatisse

LZ5by5 wrote: »

You want those who are guilty locked up. So do I. All I was merely saying is the best way for this to be achieved is for people to mobilise and put immense pressure on the government to take the action of putting those who are guilty on trial. Do I need to clarify any further?

No thats splendid

prinz

Really-Stressed wrote: »

No it was published yesterday and its not something I would want to read either.. Dont try and deflect the blame from the church. The men at the top are sick and defending the organisation by slight is disgusting.

There you go, case closed tbh. Go away and read the report. Think about it and then make an informed opinion before you start absolving people of blame. Everyone played a role in what went on, Church, State and the Irish people. Yes it was published yesterday and yes I have read a good proportion of it. Pity you can't say the same.

MrMatisse

Max Power1 wrote: »

wow, oh its another thread on leaving the church!! (theres lods more but i really couldnt be arsed linking them)

To answer the OP, yes i left months ago. No point being a statistical member of something whose beliefs contradict proven fact, and when that organisation also covers up for child rapists

Its interesting to see though if the feeling is getting stronger.

philologos

Xluna wrote: »

You could'nt be more wrong. You're making the false assumption that the odds of God existing and not existing are equal. The burden of belief rests on the believer.

Indeed I'm being extremely diplomatic. I think it is more probable that God exists than not :pac:

I still withhold the right to call people out when they say:
God doesn't exist instead of I believe that God doesn't exist or I don't believe that God exists.

This is more honest, would you be in agreement.

Xluna wrote: »

What you said makes as much sense as saying there is equal chance that there is no God as the flying spaghetti monster lives inside the mansion house and secretly controls the country. If you look at the evidence you will see the universe looks as it would be were there no God.

This is nonsense. If anything the evidence leaves a lot of room for speculation as to whether or not God exists. It certainly doesn't imply that there isn't a God. In fact, IMO it often implies that God could very well exist. Check my signature for more information, I'm not going to get into a huge debate on this one. I wasted my entire energy doing so before. Unfortunately not many people want to consider the possibility.

Edit: This poll should have been public!

MrMatisse

prinz wrote: »

There you go, case closed tbh. Go away and read the report. Think about it and then make an informed opinion before you start absolving people of blame. Everyone played a role in what went on, Church, State and the Irish people. Yes it was published yesterday and yes I have read a good proportion of it. Pity you can't say the same.

Well father, the stuff I heard on the news was enough. I didnt need to delve into it so I could find something to justify my beliefs.

Your like one of the old biddys from 50's Ireland who thought they could do no wrong and stand up for them whatever they do,

If we were all like you it would still be going on ( I hope it isnt)

They were in charge of the whole thing through brainwashing the populace and its their fault.

Xluna

prinz wrote: »

So you don't visit your family anymore?

My family have never aided and abetted child rapists.:rolleyes:

Dont be at yourself

Most physical and sexual abuse is perpetrated by a family member or a friend of the family.... should we stop associating with them too?

If they lied, denied it, actively tried to cover it up and yet still expected to be worshipped and paid, then yes, yes I would.

And hey, even if they didn't do all that, they still ruined the lives of thousands of people.

prinz

Xluna wrote: »

My family have never aided and abetted child rapists.:rolleyes:

And most of the Catholic clergy have never done it either :rolleyes:

Lux23

I never attend services anymore unless someone had died or married, wouldn't even go at Christmas.

However, I do think that the fall of the Catholic Church in Ireland has created a moral vacumn there is no one to look for guidance anymore and kids worship at the altar of celebrity. So its not necessarily a good thing for people to turn their backs on the church in my eyes. We should all become good protestants or something.

prinz

Really-Stressed wrote: »

Well father, the stuff I heard on the news was enough. I didnt need to delve into it so I could find something to justify my beliefs.
Your like one of the old biddys from 50's Ireland who thought they could do no wrong and stand up for them whatever they do,
If we were all like you it would still be going on ( I hope it isnt)
They were in charge of the whole thing through brainwashing the populace and its their fault.

No need to say anything, I'll let you off on your ill informed rant so.

TheZohanS

Really-Stressed wrote: »

If you want to leave go to

http://www.count meout.ie/

and read how. It doesnt cost anything.

What a ridiculous site.

Read some of the reasons why you should consider leaving the church

:rolleyes:

A silly website telling you why you should leave the church, as if people have no mind of their own.

Xluna

Jakkass wrote: »

Indeed I'm being extremely diplomatic. I think it is more probable that God exists than not :pac:

I still withhold the right to call people out when they say:
God doesn't exist instead of I believe that God doesn't exist or I don't believe that God exists.

This is more honest, would you be in agreement.



This is nonsense. If anything the evidence leaves a lot of room for speculation as to whether or not God exists. It certainly doesn't imply that there isn't a God. In fact, IMO it often implies that God could very well exist. Check my signature for more information, I'm not going to get into a huge debate on this one. I wasted my entire energy doing so before. Unfortunately not many people want to consider the possibility.

Edit: This poll should have been public!

O.K. when you say God I assume you are talking about a Deistic God rather than a specific Deity(Theism),as there's thousands of them. I don't believe that it's impossible that Deism is true,but I believe it to be unlikely and a very intellectually lazy explanation. I.E. God of the Gaps.
Before Darwin explained evolution Deism was put forward as an explanation but we no longer need it. I see no reason to think that some physicist will do the same for physics as Darwin did for biology. After all,science has a pretty good track record.

Xluna

TheZohan wrote: »

What a ridiculous site.

:rolleyes:

A silly website telling you why you should leave the church, as if people have no mind of their own.

Oh the irony.:eek:

Handsome Bob

Really-Stressed wrote: »

Well father, the stuff I heard on the news was enough. I didnt need to delve into it so I could find something to justify my beliefs.

Your like one of the old biddys from 50's Ireland who thought they could do no wrong and stand up for them whatever they do,

If we were all like you it would still be going on ( I hope it isnt)

They were in charge of the whole thing through brainwashing the populace and its their fault.

That kind of attitude is not going to get you very far on here, just a word of advice.

MrMatisse

LZ5by5 wrote: »

That kind of attitude is not going to get you very far on here, just a word of advice.

Sorry for my being a rambunctious young ruffian in the refined confines of after hours.