Middle of the road Windows 7 PC

kleefarr

Looking for your recommendations on a medium spec Windows 7 Home PC.

The only defining requirements are wireless keyboard/mouse and must be able to dual boot with Win 95.

I was thinking that it would be easier to have two HDDs for the two OSs.

Must be easily upgradeable in the future.

TIA

Deano12345

kleefarr wrote: »

Looking for your recommendations on a medium spec Windows 7 Home PC.

The only defining requirements are wireless keyboard/mouse and must be able to dual boot with Win 95.

I was thinking that it would be easier to have two HDDs for the two OSs.

Must be easily upgradeable in the future.

TIA

Whats your budget ?

It would be easier to just run 7 and then run 95 in a virtual machine

Leman_Russ

Deano12345 wrote: »

Whats your budget ?

It would be easier to just run 7 and then run 95 in a virtual machine

This ^^^

For a Super Easy Virtual Machine program, use VirtualBox, an Open Source Virtual machine Program that makes it as easy as pie I use it to run Various Linux Flavours

kleefarr

Budget as close to €400 but under if possible.

Would that Virtual Box be able to run DOS programs in Win '95?

Leman_Russ

kleefarr wrote: »

Budget as close to €400 but under if possible.

Would that Virtual Box be able to run DOS programs in Win '95?

Yes. It runs a complete instance of Win 95. The Win 95 doesn't even realise it's on a virtual Machine. For all intents and purposes, it thinks it's doing its own thing.

kleefarr

Had a quick read up on that.
Looks like install Win 7, then install Virtual Box and load Win 95 into it?
I have downloaded VirtualBox-3.0.10-54097-Win.exe in readiness.

Just need to get all the other stuff together now.

Deano12345

kleefarr wrote: »

Budget as close to €400 but under if possible.

Would that Virtual Box be able to run DOS programs in Win '95?

*Wrings T-shirt neck*

Give me till the morning and I'll have a build for ya

alanucc

Leman_Russ wrote: »

The Win 95 doesn't even realise it's on a virtual Machine. For all intents and purposes, it thinks it's doing its own thing.

It's like Windows 7 is the matrix and Windows 95 is Keanu Reeves

Deano12345

Alright,check this build out :

http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=445791&view=detailed#ProductTabs - €55

http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=496058 - €90

http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=353921 - €53

http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=404889 - €66

http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=347261 - €67

http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=496258 - €67

http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=452346 - €20

Total -€418

This should pack a nice punch,quad core for under €450

Jock Strap

Deano12345 wrote: »

Alright,check this build out :

http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=445791&view=detailed#ProductTabs - €55

http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=496058 - €90

http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=353921 - €53

http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=404889 - €66

http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=347261 - €67

http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=496258 - €67

http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=452346 - €20

Total -€418

This should pack a nice punch,quad core for under €450

Granted, it's modular, but isn't the power supply just a bit superfluous? and costly.

Leman_Russ

Jock Strap wrote: »

Granted, it's modular, but isn't the power supply just a bit superfluous? and costly.

Well get a cheap one then and cry when it fries your PC or only delivers 60% of its supposed wattage and makes your PC unstable.

Corsair = THE BEST when it comes to power supplies. Not only do they rate their PSU at a high operating temperature (compared to Brandless ones which are rated at 25C, which it will never, EVER be) and in fact rate their PSUs at a LOWER Wattage than they can handle. On average, the 450W ones can actually handle anywhere from 460-490W. They also come with an excellent warranty.

The PSU is THE MOST IMPORTANT part of a PC. Skimp on that and you might as well not bother.

Deano12345

Leman_Russ wrote: »

Well get a cheap one then and cry when it fries your PC or only delivers 60% of its supposed wattage and makes your PC unstable.

Corsair = THE BEST when it comes to power supplies. Not only do they rate their PSU at a high operating temperature (compared to Brandless ones which are rated at 25C, which it will never, EVER be) and in fact rate their PSUs at a LOWER Wattage than they can handle. On average, the 450W ones can actually handle anywhere from 460-490W. They also come with an excellent warranty.

The PSU is THE MOST IMPORTANT part of a PC. Skimp on that and you might as well not bother.

Thanks for saving me a few lines of typing.Dont skimp on that PSU,its worth every cent,I even ran my rig with it before I got my HX850

Leman_Russ

I recently got me a HX650. Love it to bits

Deano12345

Leman_Russ wrote: »

I recently got me a HX650. Love it to bits

Corsair upgraded the aul HX620 ?

Nice one

Jock Strap

Leman_Russ wrote: »

Well get a cheap one then and cry when it fries your PC or only delivers 60% of its supposed wattage and makes your PC unstable.

Corsair = THE BEST when it comes to power supplies. Not only do they rate their PSU at a high operating temperature (compared to Brandless ones which are rated at 25C, which it will never, EVER be) and in fact rate their PSUs at a LOWER Wattage than they can handle. On average, the 450W ones can actually handle anywhere from 460-490W. They also come with an excellent warranty.

The PSU is THE MOST IMPORTANT part of a PC. Skimp on that and you might as well not bother.

Deano12345 wrote: »

Thanks for saving me a few lines of typing.Dont skimp on that PSU,its worth every cent,I even ran my rig with it before I got my HX850

Did i say anything about skimping? I said it was more than what was required. The Corsair CX400 is more suitable for this build! €46 vs. €66. Also, I think the case might be OTT as well. This is a budget build after all.

kleefarr

Thanks for that Deano.

Unfortunately I will be needing a monitor with this. Don't need anything special so will have to compromise on the CPU/Mobo/PSU if possible. Smaller HDD would be ok as well.

Will bump it up to the €450 mark.

A Core 2 Duo would do for now.

Oh and the wireless Keyboard/mouse.

Deano12345

Jock Strap wrote: »

Did i say anything about skimping? I said it was more than what was required. The Corsair CX400 is more suitable for this build! €46 vs. €66. Also, I think the case might be OTT as well. This is a budget build after all.

What if he wants to add anything he will need to change his PSU.

That CX400 only has one 6 pin connector.Even then,I'd still go with the HX450 for its superior warranty (7yrs vs. 3yrs)

Deano12345

kleefarr wrote: »

Thanks for that Deano.

Unfortunately I will be needing a monitor with this. Don't need anything special so will have to compromise on the CPU/Mobo/PSU if possible.

Will bump it up to the €450 mark.

A Core 2 Duo would do for now.

Oh and the wireless Keyboard/mouse.

Core 2 duo will probably be more expensive.

Change out that quad core for an Athlon II X2 will save you 30 quid and you can save another €20 by going with a 500GB Samsung F3

Then you could get this

http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=436582

And look around for a cheap/second hand monitor

Check out adverts.ie for a deal there,you should be able to find something

Jock Strap

Deano12345 wrote: »

What if he wants to add anything he will need to change his PSU.

That CX400 only has one 6 pin connector.

That's one more than he needs, with no graphics card :P

kleefarr

I'll have to add Win 7 to that as well. :rolleyes:

Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium EN

32bit or 64bit??

Looking more like €500ish now.

Leman_Russ

Get the 64 Bit one. IMO it's criminal M$ are even making a 32 bit version but that is just me.

Deano12345

kleefarr wrote: »

I'll have to add Win 7 to that as well. :rolleyes:

Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium EN

32bit or 64bit??

Looking more like €500ish now.

64 Bit,incase you want to add more Ram in a while

kleefarr

Ok guys...

Here's the low down. Bit more than I anticipated, but..

Komplett price Zoom in

Dabs price Zoom in

No brainer really.
It's even cheaper to post to Ireland from UK.

Have I got the CPU/Mobo/Ram compatibility correct?

AlmightyCushion

Why are you getting 8500 ram? Just stick with bog standard 6400, you won't notice the difference and save a few quid.

Leman_Russ

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

Why are you getting 8500 ram? Just stick with bog standard 6400, you won't notice the difference and save a few quid.

This.

Also, check out eBuyer. I bet they will be even cheaper

Deano12345

Leman_Russ wrote: »

This.

That

Look into the 500Gb Samsung F3,it will kick that Barracuda around and costs a few quid less

kleefarr

Have been trying to check the memory compatibility list for 6400 ram, but can't get it open.

http://uk.asus.com/product.aspx?P_ID=daNjn5iQIh14MVvN

Anyone else have the same problem?

Will check Ebuyer and look into that 500Gb Samsung F3.

kleefarr

Do you mean this Samsung Deano?

Samsung F3

kleefarr

Just one last question...

Will the AMD ATHLON II X2 240 2.8GHZ AM3 come with a heatsink and fan?
It's not clear on the Dabs site.

I'm going for Dabs for everything apart from the PC6400 RAM which I'll get from Crucial.

Deano12345

kleefarr wrote: »

Do you mean this Samsung Deano?

Samsung F3

Thats the one

And

kleefarr

Great!

Thanks Deano.
Reading up on the VirtualBox now.
I'll give you guys an update when it's assembled and running. (Fingers crossed) :rolleyes:

craddy96

Deano12345 wrote: »

Whats your budget ?

It would be easier to just run 7 and then run 95 in a virtual machine

windows 7 would work with one GB of ram on a virtual machine but 1GB is a little Small, with virtual machine try giving 2-3GB:D

Leman_Russ

I think you have it backwards, we are saying run Windows 7 as the Main os then run Windows 95 as a Virtual Machine.

kleefarr

That's the idea. Run 7 as the main and run 95 in VB.
Will have two GB of ram and was thinking about allocating 512mb for '95 in VB.
That would be ok wouldn't it?

Deano12345

kleefarr wrote: »

That's the idea. Run 7 as the main and run 95 in VB.
Will have two GB of ram and was thinking about allocating 512mb for '95 in VB.
That would be ok wouldn't it?

Should be alright,W95 was hardly the worlds most demanding OS :P

Leman_Russ

Deano12345 wrote: »

Should be alright,W95 was hardly the worlds most demanding OS :P

It was at the time But yes, 512mb of ram for a 95 VM is fine. And you wont be running the VM all the time, just when you need it, so that 512 is used by Windows 7 when the VM is not running.

kleefarr

All of the gear arrived yesterday. Was a bit late ordering and had to wait a couple of days for the case as they were out of stock. Only took five days including waiting for the case. €488. Happy.
Have put it all together this afternoon and now have Windows 7 (very nice) running and updated. All systems running fine, so far.
Am about to try Virtual Box, so may be back with a couple of questions, but I have read up on the VB info, so fingers crossed.

Thanks for everything so far anyway.

Leman_Russ

kleefarr wrote: »

All of the gear arrived yesterday. Was a bit late ordering and had to wait a couple of days for the case as they were out of stock. Only took five days including waiting for the case. €488. Happy.
Have put it all together this afternoon and now have Windows 7 (very nice) running and updated. All systems running fine, so far.
Am about to try Virtual Box, so may be back with a couple of questions, but I have read up on the VB info, so fingers crossed.

Thanks for everything so far anyway.

Glad to hear it's all working out Feel free to ask any VirtualBox Questions or ask for help with any problems you might have

kleefarr

Oh well, didn't take long to run into problems.

I seem to have installed VB ok..


But I'm getting and couple of warnings..


And a fatal error..


I seem to have the CD/DVD mounted but can't workout why Win '95 won't install when I try via VB.

I didn't register, would that have anything to do with it?

I could also do with increasing the size of the VB disk. I can do that in settings can I?

duffman85

Tutorial on installing Win 95 in virtualbox:
http://forums.virtualbox.org/viewtopic.php?t=9072

seems like you have to install dos first.

kleefarr

Still not having much luck.
I have manged to increase the size of the Virtual Hard drive easily enough, but it's still not reading the CD in the drive. Have given up for the weekend and will try again Tuesday. Will need to read up on a bit more I think.

Leman_Russ

kleefarr wrote: »

still not reading the CD in the drive.

That is your problem methinks

Download ImgBurn and convert the CD into an ISO and try and install it from the ISO file. Should be faster and less trouble prone.

kleefarr

Was thinking just the same thing about half an hour ago. I've got Nero, that should do it.
I don't suppose it matters where I place the ISO as long as I can navigate to it via VB?

Leman_Russ

kleefarr wrote: »

Was thinking just the same thing about half an hour ago. I've got Nero, that should do it.
I don't suppose it matters where I place the ISO as long as I can navigate to it via VB?

True. Though to keep it simple, you may as well just put it in the root folder of the C: drive.

kleefarr

Placed the ISO of Windows 95 in the root folder of C: and have attached the ISO to the Virtualbox VM HDD called 'Windows '95', but it still would not 'Read' when I started the VM, same error as before. (Actually had to use imgburn in the end as the Nero file ext was .nrg so not sure if that would work.)
I have made sure that the settings for the VM HDD are via SATA port 0 (also tried port 1) but no change.
Does the Virtualbox VM HDD not have to be formatted into a FAT partition as well. I know that this probably wouldn't make any difference to the VM running, but was just wondering.

I'll check the Virtualbox forums and see if I get any ideas. But if anyone has any others I would gladly try them out as I'm desperate to get this going.

Leman_Russ

Ya know, I just realised something...

Didn't Win95 have to be installed with Floppys, thus the Win95 disk is not actually bootable?

You'd have to copy the contents of the Win95 Disk to a folder, then select the "Create Image from Files/Folders" then under "Advanced" go to Bootable Disk, Make Image Bootable then choose a floppy emulation (the 1.44mb one IIRC), rhen use the image file from here:
http://www.allbootdisks.com/download/95.html
(Diskette Images, no idea if you need a or b, try both!) and use the ISO created from that.

kleefarr

The copy of Win '95b I have never used floppies when I installed it before.
But I'll look into anyway.

Would it make any difference which copy of VBox I use? Using Ver 3.0.10-54097. Maybe the newer ones aren't very good with Win '95.

Leman_Russ

kleefarr wrote: »

The copy of Win '95b I have never used floppies when I installed it before.
But I'll look into anyway.

Hmm, well, try recreating the bootable CD anyway and try that

kleefarr wrote: »

Would it make any difference which copy of VBox I use? Using Ver 3.0.10-54097. Maybe the newer ones aren't very good with Win '95.

Nah, it'll be the same either way.

kleefarr

Leman_Russ wrote: »

Hmm, well, try recreating the bootable CD anyway and try that

Just redo the iso image of the disk again you mean? Or make a new copy of the CD?

Leman_Russ

kleefarr wrote: »

Just redo the iso image of the disk again you mean? Or make a new copy of the CD?

Copy all the files and folders from the CD into a new folder, then create an ISO from that folder, using the 95b boot image i linked there in the "make bootable" with the floppy emulation, and see if that works.

kleefarr

Ok. Will try that tomorrow.
Thanks for the suggestion.