Manny Pacquiao v's Miguel Cotto 14/11

siochain

Right folks didn't notice a tread started on this yet.

For me this has the potential to be one of the best fights of the year, can Cotto’s strength and body work slow down the relentless pace of Pac man?

If you were to make a decision based on HBO’s 24/7 Cotto is definitely having a tougher and more focused training camp. But who know's what gets left on the editors floor.

At this stage giving a close call to Cotto.......

walshb

I've been bouncing back and forth on this one. Now, I'm going for Cotto via 10th or 11th rd KO. I just think that he will present style problems, strength problems and power problems for Pac. He should be a far tougher test than Hatton or Oscar.

Cotto's camp seems more focused and with less division. Pacman doesn't seem to have the same mental focus this time around.

If the weight is not a problem for Miguel, remember, he hasn't been as low as 145 lbs in about 3 years, and he is maturing every day, hence, even 147 is becoming more and more difficult, then I see him having too much fluidity and all around game for Pacman.

Also, would Pac have beaten a Mosley or Margarito or even A Clottey?

Now, Cotto beat two and lost to one, (who possibly had an illegal edge).
None really really hurt Cotto, So, I am guessing that if Mosley
couldn't get the trick done, and Clottey couldn't, then Pac won't either

Boooourns

He was 146 for the Clottey fight and to be honest he was lucky to get away with that, Clottey left him away with that one.
I hope he's at his best for this one as he's going to have to be, he has the power and the chin but if his defence is suspect then Manny will wear him down with his speed and power.
Can't wait for this one.

bamboozler

been watchin both 24/7. i think pacman might be playin mind games and be tryin to make out he isnt prepared for this one, afterall its clear both camps hav a fair degree of control on what the show can broadcast.

im goin for pacquiao but the negative person i am i think cotto might be too powerful, but then again i thought the same bout hatton

joepenguin

If that was actual sparring footage when he was getting picked off by Castillo and if that is what most of his sparring was like Cotto will win. If either figthter isnt mentally ready they are gonna lose at this level.

However I think that could be mind games. When DLH was having real problems in sparring they didnt even hint at it in 24/7 so why would they with the pac?

TechnoPool

anyone got any links for the episodes please?

bamboozler

TechnoPool wrote: »

anyone got any links for the episodes please?

ill try to post them as i watch them. at the moment.......


official hbo youtube site here wit full official 24/7 in v.good quality
24/7 episode 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SB4IEQzm7uE

they're not putting up anymore episode and making youtube take down episode 2 when its put up but this link ive used myself is outside youtube so hopefully should stay up

24/7 episode 2
http://itsmorethanmusic.tv/2009/11/247-pacquiaocotto-episode-2/



episode 3 sat 7th Nov
episode 4 fri 13th Nov

joepenguin

TechnoPool wrote: »

anyone got any links for the episodes please?

Heres episode one in full:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SB4IEQzm7uE


Heres episode 2: part one
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bt3uNnddquM

episdode 2 part 2:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSkZ9K-5YII&feature=related


episode 2 part 3:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUddGj3tRHc


I think they air on hbo on saturdays so check out youtube afterwards. Also www.hbo.com/boxing but they only ever seem to have the first episode and a highlight vid of each fighter right up until fight night. Worth a look though.

bamboozler

snap mr. penguin.

scruff321

bamboozler wrote: »

been watchin both 24/7. i think pacman might be playin mind games and be tryin to make out he isnt prepared for this one, afterall its clear both camps hav a fair degree of control on what the show can broadcast.

im goin for pacquiao but the negative person i am i think cotto might be too powerful, but then again i thought the same bout hatton

Yea id agree with you here, i mean why would Freddie Roach have any other reasons to allow HBO to televise the distractions and fall outs in Pacquiao's camp??

Pal

I predict that the Pacman will knock him out.

Johner

Cotto late stoppage.

Devastator

fantasic quality!


I'm going for a Manny win.

Seemed to many outside distractions just at the times when camera's were filming. Why should there be a fight between 2 'potential' cornermen, that seemed quite a ridiculous and childish act between them.

keane=cock

a mate of mine is gonna be in vegas at he time of the fight. any one got a link or anything as to where he could try get a ticket?

TechnoPool

thanks alot lads


id love a ward - gatti saga between these two

Captain Furball

Have a look 5 minutes into the fight how zab judah goes to cottos left and puts him off balance while throwing his jab.
Would pac get away with landing a straight left there?Cotto it seems would be blind to that punch given pacs speed.

4:17 watch ricky transfer his weight to throw his left hook and bam pac gets there first.


Speed and footwork, fast in and fast out, keep him off balance to neutralise his power, keep turning him and don't let yourself be cornered.Pacman has his work cut out for him.I hope he doesn't get demoralised because cotto can take a good shot and not look hurt at all.

Devastator

Captain Furball wrote: »

Pacman has his work cut out for him.I hope he doesn't get demoralised because cotto can take a good shot and not look hurt at all.

thanks for vid's. I think Manny has plenty of experience not to get demoralised during a fight. He didn't look like it against Marquez

joepenguin

bamboozler wrote: »

snap mr. penguin.

lol.

3hn2givr7mx1sc

I think Cotto will do the job on Manny, I think he has the technique and strength to slow him down.
I hope he wins as well, because I have a double on a Cotto and Haye win.:p

walshb

Well, it seems official now that the bout is on Sky Sports 1. It is not a BOX office event, so normal channel 401... Programme starts at 0200hrs and ends at 0500hrs

bamboozler

last nights 24/7 episode 3
in full here, quality only ok
http://itsmorethanmusic.tv/2009/11/247-pacquiaocotto-episode-3/]

youtube 3 part vids wit better quality below but they might be taken down

same rip but slighlty better quality
pt1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAETm6MoO-w
pt2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JiGTHiwC1iA
pt3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uaIGyOJK4ho

or

pt1. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nX1NwShWXMc
pt2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgynDwPU4P8
pt3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZs_QBjceE8


roach says he has foundout cottos habits, not mistakes, and seems confident hes got something on cotto like he had for hatton. after all the pretending pacman was having bad preparation looks like the camp are really confident

fuzzy12

Lads,

Just go here: www.boxing-core.com

all the episodes of 24/7 are there and quality is excellent.

--Kaiser--

Pac-man to win by KO in the 7th round

Captain Furball

Something to think about.
5:10 it's round 7 Watch it and ask yourself can pacquaio do this to Cotto?Cotto as you know made it through to round 11.

DiscoHugh

Broadcast starts at 2 so I'm assuming main event kicks off at around 4?? I always have troubel timing these Vegas fights!

I find it very hard to bet against pac because he's never "not shown up" before but for my money Cotto will be his biggest challenge to date. a genuine top class welter weight at or near his prime.

One minute I think "his speed will be too much" then I think "well mosely and judah couldn't get the job done". Every arguement has a counter argument for this one.

The fact that they're 2 of my favourite fighters will also make it hard for me to watch. can't wait though. The only safe bet with these two is that it will definitely be brilliant fight

clubwelly

Thanks for all the 24/7 links guys. It was mentioned in one of the episodes that Manny would be were he is today without Freddie Roach. Anyone agree with this? I don't when looking at some of manny's early fights

bustertherat

just threw 200 on cotto. 540 back on betfair. those odds are crazy. all the media hype from the hatton and dlh victories. i reckon they may level off after the weigh in tho, or else skew even further. pacquiaos good, but he hasnt been hit clean since marquez at 130lbs. cotto's a hard hitter and itll be interesting to see how manny copes.

joepenguin

clubwelly wrote: »

Thanks for all the 24/7 links guys. It was mentioned in one of the episodes that Manny would be were he is today without Freddie Roach. Anyone agree with this? I don't when looking at some of manny's early fights

The statement i agreed with most is that roach wouldve been regarded as a great trainer without pac, and pac would have been a great fighter without roach but its likely that neither of them would have gotten as far as they have without each other.

Captain Furball

PP.com
Manny Pacquiao - Points or Decision 7/2
Miguel Angel Cotto - Points or Decision 15/2

These odds are crazy.

nacho libre

i've still no clue who is going to win this fight

does speed kill- the idea that you can't hit what you can't see

or will cotto surprise everyone just as he did Mosley

my gut tells me pacman will just be too quick and cotto will take a huge amount of punishment before the fight is stopped due to cuts in the mid to late rounds.

blackbetty69

man this is gonna be one hell of a fight, i cant wait!:D

Pacman to win with a late knockout imo

Rob113

anyone know what time they are expected in the ring. ill be setting an alarm for it.

blackbetty69

hopefully its late enuf.. god knows what time i could get home at 2mro nite:o

horizon26

I thought Pacquiao would win about a month ago.As the fight draws nearer I am having doubts.Cotto looks respectful but quietly confident.Pacquiao looks over confident and his preparation is not good,he is not fighting Ricky Hatton.This is Pacquiao's hardest fight by a long way,only if he is 100% can he win this fight.I dont think he is 100% and Cotto win be,or is the build up just a mind trick.If so I dont think it will effect Cotto either way.Cotto is a really cool guy as is the pac man,I think Pacquiao to win but only just.It would not surprise me if Cotto wins either.Ok Pac man early, Cotto maybe late its 55/45 to Pacquiao

walshb

I have heard it all now. Hatton was just interviewed and asked aboy Pac-Cotto and he said he thinks Cotto can do it. His reasoning: "Well, I had a dreadful start to my first rd vs Pac and until the final KO shot in rd 2, I was winning it by a country mile.":eek:

Is this guy punch drunk?

I tell you one thing, Ricky doesn't look well. Very bloated, as per ususal.
I think he should never come back.

Matthew came a across as a real sore loser. He gets a draw in a fight that he did well in, but I gave it to Ndou. Matthew was such a sore loser after the fight

scruff321

horizon26 wrote: »

I thought Pacquiao would win about a month ago.As the fight draws nearer I am having doubts.Cotto looks respectful but quietly confident.Pacquiao looks over confident and his preparation is not good,he is not fighting Ricky Hatton.This is Pacquiao's hardest fight by a long way,only if he is 100% can he win this fight.I dont think he is 100% and Cotto win be,or is the build up just a mind trick.If so I dont think it will effect Cotto either way.Cotto is a really cool guy as is the pac man,I think Pacquiao to win but only just.It would not surprise me if Cotto wins either.Ok Pac man early, Cotto maybe late its 55/45 to Pacquiao

if your basing your assumptions of Pacquiao not been ready from watching 24/7 your wrong,its all hype bull****.

scruff321

walshb wrote: »

I have heard it all now. Hatton was just interviewed and asked aboy Pac-Cotto and he said he thinks Cotto can do it. His reasoning: "Well, I had a dreadful start to my first rd vs Pac and until the final KO shot in rd 2, I was winning it by a country mile.":eek:

Is this guy punch drunk?

I tell you one thing, Ricky doesn't look well. Very bloated, as per ususal.
I think he should never come back.

Matthew came a across as a real sore loser. He gets a draw in a fight that he did well in, but I gave it to Ndou. Matthew was such a sore loser after the fight

Totally agree, i gave it to Ndou aswell, and yet Sky commentary had him two rounds clear, i cant fuppin stand Sky commentary havent a clue just a bunch of biased sh/tebags

walshb

Just watched a stunning 3 rd war with Paul Samuels stopping Celo Renda (prizefighter winner). My god, what a fight. There was a double knockdown in rd2. Amazing scrap.

Johner

*Off Topic

N'dou by 3 rounds for me. Hatton did well in the last 3 rounds that was all.

Captain Furball

walshb wrote: »

I have heard it all now. Hatton was just interviewed and asked aboy Pac-Cotto and he said he thinks Cotto can do it. His reasoning: "Well, I had a dreadful start to my first rd vs Pac and until the final KO shot in rd 2, I was winning it by a country mile.":eek:

Is this guy punch drunk?

I tell you one thing, Ricky doesn't look well. Very bloated, as per ususal.
I think he should never come back.

Matthew came a across as a real sore loser. He gets a draw in a fight that he did well in, but I gave it to Ndou. Matthew was such a sore loser after the fight

Ricky was half loaded

nacho libre

Well the weight drain excuse should not be a factor - as Cotto, at 145, looked lean, ripped, and in good shape. I expect him to come in close, but not over 160 come fight time. Pacman came in at 144.

At one stage it looked like Roach and Santiago might go at it.

Captain Furball

nacho libre wrote: »

Well the weight drain excuse should not be a factor - as Cotto, at 145, looked lean, ripped, and in good shape. I expect him to come in close, but not over 160 come fight time. Pacman came in at 144.

At one stage it looked like Roach and Santiago might go at it.

Anywhere i can see this nacho?

Johner

Just played it out on Fight Night 4.

Cotto wins by 4th round KO after scoring a knockdown in the 3rd. You heard it here first lads.

TheBastard

any one have any opinions on the Pacmans 3 losses and 2 draws? Does it show he has a weakness?

Captain Furball

TheBastard wrote: »

any one have any opinions on the Pacmans 3 losses and 2 draws? Does it show he has a weakness?

He's human - I think!

nacho libre

Captain Furball wrote: »

Anywhere i can see this nacho?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KrF-F4oPkFE

sorry not great quality at all.

TheBastard

Captain Furball wrote: »

He's human - I think!

Cotto seems unbeatable. his only loss might be that magarito had his handy plaster of paris gloves on;).

Its shaping up to be fight of the year.

Captain Furball

Thanks nacho.
Freddie looked pissed off al right at cottos trainer.
Ya cotto is as tough as they come.God help pacquiao,he has a hard fight tomorrow.

consultech

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yPQ6IlWDEM

Think this one's a wee bit better, not much though.

Roach and Santiago seem to go at it a bit... Roach pushed Santiago out of the way when Cotto was on the scales, and Santiago was getting in Roach's face with "How do you like 145lbs" etc etc as Roach thought Cotto would struggle. Roach obviously reacted. Was funny when Manny didn't realise any of it was goin on and as he hooked his Nikes into the crowd!

consultech

scruff321 wrote: »

if your basing your assumptions of Pacquiao not been ready from watching 24/7 your wrong,its all hype bull****.

lol, I know. People thinking that ANYTHING they see on 24/7 is anything more than maybe 20% truth is fairly funny. All these Pacquiao camp "interuptions" btw? Bull dung. I didn't think so before, it's worth considering as true, but ultimately, prob shite. They are a very professional outfit, and Roach being involved with the management of ANYTHING fight-camp related means Manny is ready... very ready.


The following is paraphrasing of a piece I wrote for a magazine, which originally references (which I've snipped, along with about half the article which dealt with Margarito/Mosley/Manny's (limited) flaws, losses/draws) a number of writers' opinions, as well as my own:

Well, it's finally upon us. This "superfight", as it's being billed, has the potential to be an absolute stomper... but ultimately, won't be. The ever-couragious Miguel Cotto will this Saturday night/Sunday morning fall spectacularly to the challenge of not just the best P4P fighter on the planet, but an all-time great. We're talking about a man who is likely going to become a champion at his 7th(!!!) weight. This in itself is a ridiculous achievement, and anyone putting money on Cotto seriously needs to stop and think.

Cotto, a heroic "meet-all-comers" fighter, is a guy you can't help but get behind. Cut from the same cloth as true warriors like Roberto Duran, and more locally and on a lesser-scale, Ricky Hatton; Cotto will be undone in similar soul-destroying style as both those men, and many of the great "heart"-fighters of all time were. Unfortunately, for me at least, this will be another fight where I'm agonising over watching another never-say-die underdog being severely outclassed by a far superior fighter. I just can't help myself! Notable recent fights I - and a lot of other couragious underdog followers - have had to endure in this vein were Mayweather v Marquez / Pacquiao v Hatton / Poonsawat V Dunne etc.

Miguel Cotto has apparently been sparring with an eyepatch over his right eye. This is for the following reason: His right eye will be closed by round 6 or 7. ... This is going to happen because Cotto is by far the weaker on his right side. Because Cotto is (unusually for an orthodox fighter) stronger on his lead left side; Manny will spin to his right all night, taking away Cotto's one major weapon: his strong, short left. Instead he'll see Manny land left jab after left hook after left straight after left uppercut... Well, you get the picture. Expect to see Cotto one-eyed by Rd. 6 or 7.

Manny's far superior footwork, ridonkulous breakneck speed, and natural southy stance just compound this problem. The latter is going to position Cotto in a world of hurt, as his weak side meets an all-time-great's killer left arsenal. I don't think I'm making too much of this; I literally think this single dynamic will result in a catastrophic mis-match (for Cotto at least). In this regard at least; Cotto is tailor-made for Pacman, probably only a shade less than Hatton was, and this is probably the reason Freddie Roach jumped at taking this fight. Manny has historically only run into trouble against dominant right lead fighters such as Juan Manuel Marquez, as he was left far more open to a close-quarters jab. He won't have any such problems against Cotto as he will fade off to his left, away from Cotto's hooks, loading up with counters galore of his own.

Pacquiao is going to land at will, often, and very accurately. Compounding this problem is Cotto's guard style, which leaves yards of space straight down the middle open as he holds his gloves 45 degrees above his eyes. I fear for Miguel as Manny is so quick, and will shove straights and uppers right into this gap all night, with connection ratios reminiscent of his huge punch count against David Diaz. I expect to see Miguel bloodied because of this very early-on. This is another weakness that fighters such as Margarito and JOshua Clottey (one-eyed or not) were able to pick up on, so expect at least one of the masterful minds of Freddie Roach or Manny himself to have a plan to exploit this gap. This twin-pronged analysis and gameplan formation is another big factor working against Miguel; Essentially seeing Cotto out on his own with a very inexperienced trainer, squaring off against two boxing masterminds in Roach and Pacquiao.

My prediction is Pacquiao by stoppage (potentially even corner-stoppage) in 9, or thereabouts.


(Not in article) Some points to note which don't really fit anywhere above are:

1) Cotto can win this fight. He can do this by doing something so ridiculous, yet obvious at the same time... Switch. If Miguel chose to come in fighting natural southpaw, or maybe even from Rd 2 or 3, he could cancel out a lot of Pacman's natural advantages, without losing any of the power. It seems so fantastical, like something straight out of Rocky, but the shock factor alone for the round he chose to do it in could open Pacquiao up before Roach has a chance to come up with a counter-strategy. Cotto can fight southpaw effectively as seen previously against fighters like Demetrio Ceballos (who he knocked out in 2003 by switching up repeatedly), but generally only does it to get out of trouble or to break up the other fighters' rhythm. I think if he stuck with it for a prolonged period, it'd be something that could really work.

2) Pacquiao's camp looks a bit of a shambles on 24/7. This obviously could be clever marketing to give Cotto more of a chance than he really has in the public eye in order to sell more PPV... but Roach has always run a very tight and professional camp, apparently in stark contrast to the one being portrayed in 24/7 with it's frequent re-locations, squabbling, and extra-curricular actiivites. It doesn't look like Roach has control of proceedings this time round at all. As said though, the more I se, the more I fel it's marketing to give Miguel every chance possible in the public's mind.

3) This is a Top Rank-only promoted event. Bob Arum has full access to the ring with whoever he wants to let in there. Cameo interview interuptions are very possible from the ever-desperate Shane Mosley, or much less-likely (as he's afraid to fight Manny), Floyd Mayweather Jr. Something similar to the Mayweather/Marquez post-fight handbags could well go down. Would be worth it to at least see Max Kellerman girl-out of taking mic control again!

EDIT: 4) As decent a guy as Miguel Cotto seems; Low-blows are a distinct possibility as he gets more desperate/demoralised. Something to watch for as it could be all he has left to take the wind out of Manny's sails.

ps. I'm aware I refer to Ricky Hatton as a warrior.

chiefwiggum

any idea what time the main event starts at..alarm clock will be set...missus wont be impressed