Motion of no confidence

Belfield inside

Did people hear that UCDSU are putting a motion of no confidence to Kim Foy. But due to new information coming to light the motion has being dropped.

I dont know what the information is but i know it has something to do with Paddy. There is no excuse for the fact he is not doing his job and its known in the exec. Worst still when he tries to do something he messes it up for people.

I believe a motion of no confidence should be called on Paddy Ryan, sadly im not a class rep and will not be able to do this.

WeeBushy

I have no idea who Kim Foy or Paddy Ryan are. I've an idea that I won't care when I find out either.

TDOie

WeeBushy wrote: »

I have no idea who Kim Foy or Paddy Ryan are. I've an idea that I won't care when I find out either.

This guy knows things.

WeeBushy

TDOie wrote: »

This guy knows things.

He is, after all, a Belfield insider

Notorious

WeeBushy wrote: »

He is, after all, a Belfield insider

With a username like that, how could we ignore all this prime gossip?!

WeeBushy

Notorious wrote: »

With a username like that, how could we ignore all this prime gossip?!

Someone as to try to replace The Hills.

Mardy Bum

Belfield insider would you like to disclose any information regarding either party?

convert

http://www.ucdsu.ie/about/how-the-union-works/the-executive/ for those who really want to know

WeeBushy

convert wrote: »

http://www.ucdsu.ie/about/how-the-union-works/the-executive/ for those who really want to know

Yep, I was right. I don't care.

mad lad

I also heard about this. Can't believe Paddy Ryan is behind a motion of 'no confidence'. What has he been up to?

There's been no advertisements (posters around campus, mentions on the ucd site) for any of the protests USI & UCDSU have been organising.
http://www.irishpressreleases.ie/2009/10/23/usi-hold-demonstration-in-opposition-to-the-registration-fee/

The only advertising of the Wicklow protest was a note on facebook at 10:53pm, the night before the event itself - http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=160068345769&ref=mf

Then when f.uck all people show up it's USI who get the blame for the incompetence of CO's. There's a poor turnout for protests like this - http://www.indymedia.ie/article/94017 - then the likes of Trinity News publish an article entitled "Dozy USI campaign ignored"

Every year we get manifestoes about 'making the union more visible', a policy which equates to nothing more than bulk buying ucdsu hoodies for hacks. To paraphrase Shakepeare - a hack in a hoodie is still a hack.

gobsh1tes, the lot of 'em.

The Agogo

Browney7

Hmmmm 1 post.... I call shenanigans:pac::pac:

anonymous_joe

Drama in the SU!?

Oh noes, but now who'll do nothing for students other than kick up the registration fees to pay for a white elephant nobody wants?

The Agogo

Yeh I've been in UCD nearly 4 years now

Uses of SU = nearly zero

The one time i did approach them, they ignored my issue

Het-Field

To most, the SU is a hackfest, which does little or nothing to help students.

This assessment is not too far from the truth.

Riamfada

Het-Field wrote: »

To most, the SU is a hackfest, which does little or nothing to help students.

This assessment is not too far from the truth.

Its like every union, everyone is a member, your ****ed if you know what they are doing with your money and you have to give alot of head to get to the top :P

lebowskilite

To all those who don't think the union does anything, while sat on the nice new sofas in arts, or perhaps studying in the library til 11pm, or when listening to your younger siblings say how much they are looking forward to college safe in the knowledge that USI stuck it to the Green Party enough to defeat fees, just as they did in 2003, and when that grant of yours comes through, and when arguing with the Tierney building you realise, "Holy ****! I've got some rights on this campus that I can stick to these people!" and when you're fukd financially and UCDSU suddenly comes to the rescue, maybe you should stop giving out.

The Union doesn't spend most of its resources on singing about its success in every meeting. And if it did, you'd be the first to complain.

But, of course, people actually doing degrees don't go giving out about the union on boards.ie, because people actually out for degrees aren't that cool.

Aside from that I'm sorry the head hasn't been handed out in an egalitarian manner but I suppose that's just rampant capitalism for ya!

passive

lebowskilite wrote: »

or when listening to your younger siblings say how much they are looking forward to college safe in the knowledge that USI stuck it to the Green Party enough to defeat fees, just as they did in 2003,

Yay, those 6 people who took a day off college to hold a banner by the lake last year stopped the fees, and now we all have plenty of cash to piss away in the student bar while the university gets zero funding. Thank you Green party, for your courageous and noble act, that wasn't about appeasing the middle class and saving your own necks when everybody ****ing hates you.

WeeBushy

lebowskilite wrote: »

To all those who don't think the union does anything, while sat on the nice new sofas in arts, or perhaps studying in the library til 11pm, or when listening to your younger siblings say how much they are looking forward to college safe in the knowledge that USI stuck it to the Green Party enough to defeat fees, just as they did in 2003, and when that grant of yours comes through, and when arguing with the Tierney building you realise, "Holy ****! I've got some rights on this campus that I can stick to these people!" and when you're fukd financially and UCDSU suddenly comes to the rescue, maybe you should stop giving out.

So the achievements of the SU are: a few sofas, an extra hour to study, helping to bankrupt the governemt by keeping free fees, and sticking it to the man... They must be so proud of themselves.

mad lad

Who cares about the Union supporting Brady on introducing health service charges when we have sofas and fatman scoop. :rolleyes:

Time Magazine

I know neither of these people. I love the internet.

Riamfada

My eyes!! Where was the NSFW tag!


lebowskilite fyi I have been involved in the union and I still have friends in the union, Id count Paddy a friend also. I wasnt bitching about the Students Union, I dislike all Unions by definition dont even get me started on SIPTU. The point is the Union in UCD is largely powerless to affect any real change in UCD. It is payed lip service by Brady and everyone knows that UCD undergrads are there to bring in some cash while HB really gives a toss about the research aspect to UCD and teh big juicy grants it brings in. Anyway this is off topic

I think what most people in this thread and in UCD would say. Who the fcuk are Kim and Paddy and why should anyone care that there is a vote of no confidence in a position that no one really gives a toss about anyway. (proved by the voter turnouts in class rep and sabat elections) and for those who say the Union throws great parties and they are always well attended. If NAzisoc were putting on a drinks promotion in D2 im pretty sure it would be packed out.

El Siglo

lebowskilite wrote: »

To all those who don't think the union does anything, while sat on the nice new sofas in arts, or perhaps studying in the library til 11pm, or when listening to your younger siblings say how much they are looking forward to college safe in the knowledge that USI stuck it to the Green Party enough to defeat fees, just as they did in 2003, and when that grant of yours comes through, and when arguing with the Tierney building you realise, "Holy ****! I've got some rights on this campus that I can stick to these people!" and when you're fukd financially and UCDSU suddenly comes to the rescue, maybe you should stop giving out.

You do know that FF only went with the Greens on that one because they're scared out of their balls of a general election. And that the Greens are crippled and need to tarry the support of their loyal middle-class electorate => No fees... for now! Wait until:
Fine Gael;
Fine Gael-Labour Coalition;
IMF intervention.
Fees will come back, because we're fucked financially in this country, we're more fucked than we were in the 1950s, it really is a case of not 'if' but 'when'. Anyway, that's beside the point, the UCDSU didn't (I must stress that didn't) stop the reintroduction of fees. The other stuff, well we're giving ye enough money in our registration fees, how much does a couch cost these days?;)

The Union doesn't spend most of its resources on singing about its success in every meeting. And if it did, you'd be the first to complain.

No, I don't suppose it does, but there's plenty of gullible fools to that for it anyway.

But, of course, people actually doing degrees don't go giving out about the union on boards.ie, because people actually out for degrees aren't that cool.

What a ridiculous argument to make, I've never heard something so absurd in my life. Seriously, that actually is a stupid statement to make, so by us complaining about the union we're just little trolls that have nothing better to do? That level of argument is shockingly poor so it is.

Aside from that I'm sorry the head hasn't been handed out in an egalitarian manner but I suppose that's just rampant capitalism for ya!

What head? What the hell are you talking about? Again, alluding to the fact that some posters here are critical of the union and said posters are essentially posting less valid criticisms is such a manner is pretty stupid. This is the kind of shite that alienates students from the union, because it's always a dicothomy, "you're either with us or against us" kind of shit. Seriously, this 'union' is just like every other fecking union in this God forsaken country; nepotism and cronyism personified!

gubbie

lebowskilite wrote: »

To all those who don't think the union does anything, while sat on the nice new sofas in arts, or perhaps studying in the library til 11pm, or when listening to your younger siblings say how much they are looking forward to college safe in the knowledge that USI stuck it to the Green Party enough to defeat fees, just as they did in 2003, and when that grant of yours comes through, and when arguing with the Tierney building you realise, "Holy ****! I've got some rights on this campus that I can stick to these people!" and when you're fukd financially and UCDSU suddenly comes to the rescue, maybe you should stop giving out.

The Union doesn't spend most of its resources on singing about its success in every meeting. And if it did, you'd be the first to complain.

But, of course, people actually doing degrees don't go giving out about the union on boards.ie, because people actually out for degrees aren't that cool.

Aside from that I'm sorry the head hasn't been handed out in an egalitarian manner but I suppose that's just rampant capitalism for ya!

It reminds me of my friends argument to why America is the greatest
"Sure you have to pay for your health and education but where else in the world can you get a double cheeseburger for $1?"

You've only had one year's (or less) involvement in the union haven't you?

Riamfada

ran into a sabat officer tonight and mentioned this thread and laughed when I mentioned the gist of lebowskilite post. Seems only low level unionites take it so seriously, sabats seem down to earth

lebowskilite

El Siglo wrote: »

You do know that FF only went with the Greens on that one because they're scared out of their balls of a general election. And that the Greens are crippled and need to tarry the support of their loyal middle-class electorate => No fees... for now! Wait until:
Fine Gael;
Fine Gael-Labour Coalition;
IMF intervention.
Fees will come back, because we're fucked financially in this country, we're more fucked than we were in the 1950s, it really is a case of not 'if' but 'when'. Anyway, that's beside the point, the UCDSU didn't (I must stress that didn't) stop the reintroduction of fees. The other stuff, well we're giving ye enough money in our registration fees, how much does a couch cost these days?

Yeh, the strategy that UCD spearheaded last year of targeting the greens didn't pull off at all. I remember fees being well on the agenda beforehand. Sure, wasn't it constantly making frontpage news.

Oh ****, wait a second, it was only on the agenda because of the SU campaigns! Newsflash, the population doesn't like students!

No, I don't suppose it does, but there's plenty of gullible fools to that for it anyway.

"What a ridiculous argument to make, I've never heard something so absurd in my life. Seriously, that actually is a stupid statement to make, so by us complaining about the union we're just little trolls that have nothing better to do? That level of argument is shockingly poor so it is." :D

What a ridiculous argument to make, I've never heard something so absurd in my life. Seriously, that actually is a stupid statement to make, so by us complaining about the union we're just little trolls that have nothing better to do? That level of argument is shockingly poor so it is.

What head? What the hell are you talking about? Again, alluding to the fact that some posters here are critical of the union and said posters are essentially posting less valid criticisms is such a manner is pretty stupid.

Erm, get a sense of humour? Giving head to get to the top was mentioned, which was hardly valid, and rather than being a complete sap about it, I made a lickle jokie. Sorry I demeaned your "side" of the argument.

This is the kind of shite that alienates students from the union, because it's always a dicothomy, "you're either with us or against us" kind of shit. Seriously, this 'union' is just like every other fecking union in this God forsaken country; nepotism and cronyism personified!

I respond with a defence of the union, and therefore I'm attacking you, labelling you as some kind of enemy? I don't see the causal relationship there.

My point was that the SU does a whole lot for students behind the scenes. If you don't think it does enough then here's the killer counter-argument: It's a democratic organisation, so get involved!

To say its cronyist is kinda odd. Anyone can get involved, and no one is shunned if they show an interest. Its true that to get elected to a sabbat position ppl will willingly be social whores for an entire year, and thus it'll seem like cronyism when they get elected. The fact is in those cases they got elected because they made a lot of friends who campaigned for them. That isn't cronyism, it's democracy, and every democratic institution has that feature.

Someone also mentioned class parties. Note that I never mentioned class parties, and never defended the union on those grounds.

Also the concentration on research was mentioned. I completely agree that UCD concentrates on research, using undergrads for status and non-research masters students for income. I hardly see how this is a reflection on the union, though.

You may have seen an email from Martin Butler today about the return of the no. 10 bus to campus. In it he mentions it was a 3-way negotiation. In reality, the SU were the only party interested in bringing it back to campus, and they did. Is there a poster telling ppl it's back? No.

So all I'm saying is, the union does do a lot, and people often write it off simply because it's an easy target. It's much easier to burn a house down than to build one, and if you think the union is shite, you should probably bring that up at council, or in a referendum, or with a sabbat, or with your rep, etc.
Chances are you won't make a massive difference, but that's not the fault of the union, that's the balance of power in ucd.

Mick27

tbh Paddy doesn't seem to be doing the best of all jobs,

the newman games, road safety week etc have all flopped.

he's taking credit for other people's work and and is getting along that way.

I don't think that that is acceptable for someone who is earning €400 a week plus expenses of students money.

Colin1986

Browney7 wrote: »

Hmmmm 1 post.... I call shenanigans:pac::pac:

I love the way that no matter what anyone says as a first post on here, they get accused as of trolling! You've absolutely nothing to go on there..

dajaffa

Word on the street - motion of no confidence is to free up the job so a potential presidential candidate has a better platform. Which it very possibly is, explains the early in the year nature of it especially when there wasn't an effort to give the officer a few mandates before the no confidence motion.

Het-Field

lebowskilite wrote: »

To all those who don't think the union does anything, while sat on the nice new sofas in arts, or perhaps studying in the library til 11pm, or when listening to your younger siblings say how much they are looking forward to college safe in the knowledge that USI stuck it to the Green Party enough to defeat fees, just as they did in 2003, and when that grant of yours comes through, and when arguing with the Tierney building you realise, "Holy ****! I've got some rights on this campus that I can stick to these people!" and when you're fukd financially and UCDSU suddenly comes to the rescue, maybe you should stop giving out.

The Union doesn't spend most of its resources on singing about its success in every meeting. And if it did, you'd be the first to complain.

But, of course, people actually doing degrees don't go giving out about the union on boards.ie, because people actually out for degrees aren't that cool.

Aside from that I'm sorry the head hasn't been handed out in an egalitarian manner but I suppose that's just rampant capitalism for ya!

That must be the funniest post I have ever read. In fact, it almost makes the embittered ramblings of the OP (we know who it is) look somewhat relevant.

The SU movement had little or nothing to do with the decision to roll back on fees. It is simply off the table for the time being. It was a sweetner for the Green Party. A similar thing occured when the PDs went on the offesnive against Dempsey in 2002. I have several posters and cards which were created by the YPDs around the time, along with quotes from Mary Harney who was in Enterprise Trade and Employment at the time. She stated that fees would be re-introduced "over her dead body". This quote was used, and the PDs ended any chance Dempsey had. CFE, FEE, USI etc can all beat the drum about winning the war on fees, however, public pressure was not what has caused the issue to be shelved.

UCDSU rarely, if ever articulates "rights". When active, many of the protests were attended by the internal activists, while the other 21,900 students went along their merry way.

The Unions have also been seeking to centralise the grants mechanism for years. When speaking to various USI presidents, they articulated the negligible cost for such a service. There have been protests, there have been represenations made to the HEA, and HETAC. They have never listened, and almost four years on from my last grants protest, the system is not reformed, nor will it be for the forseeable future.

Your younger sister should not "sleep safe in the knowledge" that she is on her way to enjoying a "free" third level education. Once the matter has died down, it will be back on the agenda.

lizzyvera

lebowskilite wrote: »

Tierney building you realise, "Holy ****! I've got some rights on this campus that I can stick to these people!" and when you're fukd financially and UCDSU suddenly comes to the rescue, maybe you should stop giving out.

Why would anyone want to "stick it" to admin? They're just doing their jobs, they're not out to get us. They are overworked and understaffed, have some respect. Get a job to make money and work hard in college to pass your exams like most people- no need to stick it to anyone or milk any systems.

In my experience, most people who get very involved in the SU either drop out and do an easier degree or fail their exams. Both the last two science pros (for example) are very, very behind in college, having acheived nothing for students in the meantime. People like that are one of the main arguments FOR the reintroduction of fees- it is not worth thousands of euro to the taxpayer for these dim witted slackers to scrape through college on extenuating circumstances, arts electives and sob stories. I'm not for fees, but I can see why people would be.

lebowskilite wrote: »

But, of course, people actually doing degrees don't go giving out about the union on boards.ie, because people actually out for degrees aren't that cool.

What?

fillefatale

This is all most interesting, when does this motion get heard?

I've met PR, not a pleasant person and lax about his 'campaigns'. KF, well, I never hear about anything shes done.

Chucky the tree

I heard Kim promised paddy a blowjob downstairs in the arts block just around the corner from the observer "office" if he put back the motion. Purple monkey dishwasher.

Like A Fox

lebowskilite wrote: »

To all those who don't think the union does anything, while sat on the nice new sofas in arts, or perhaps studying in the library til 11pm, or when listening to your younger siblings say how much they are looking forward to college safe in the knowledge that USI stuck it to the Green Party enough to defeat fees, just as they did in 2003, and when that grant of yours comes through, and when arguing with the Tierney building you realise, "Holy ****! I've got some rights on this campus that I can stick to these people!" and when you're fukd financially and UCDSU suddenly comes to the rescue, maybe you should stop giving out.

USI had sweet fook all to do with fees being defeated. You should thank the Young Greens for that.

Red Alert

The postgraduate officer has certainly not bothered with postgrads - never even got a circular email from her. Paddy's a nice guy, he certainly does seem to be doing his job.

Riamfada

Red Alert wrote: »

The postgraduate officer has certainly not bothered with postgrads

everyone knows its a step up position, alternatively if you want to stay in the Union and dont get elected to Education why not just take a career launching exec position. Sure they arnt expected to do anything.

Now where is the next USI pissup?

Red Alert

Why am I not surprised?

El Siglo

lebowskilite wrote: »

Yeh, the strategy that UCD spearheaded last year of targeting the greens didn't pull off at all. I remember fees being well on the agenda beforehand. Sure, wasn't it constantly making frontpage news.

Oh ****, wait a second, it was only on the agenda because of the SU campaigns! Newsflash, the population doesn't like students!

Yes I'm sure images like this had something to do with it alright...

"What a ridiculous argument to make, I've never heard something so absurd in my life. Seriously, that actually is a stupid statement to make, so by us complaining about the union we're just little trolls that have nothing better to do? That level of argument is shockingly poor so it is." :D

Erm, get a sense of humour? Giving head to get to the top was mentioned, which was hardly valid, and rather than being a complete sap about it, I made a lickle jokie. Sorry I demeaned your "side" of the argument.

You're so funny, ever considered career with an RTE comedy programme?;)

I respond with a defence of the union, and therefore I'm attacking you, labelling you as some kind of enemy? I don't see the causal relationship there.

I wouldn't expect you to see the relationship.

My point was that the SU does a whole lot for students behind the scenes. If you don't think it does enough then here's the killer counter-argument: It's a democratic organisation, so get involved!

This is what gets me, everything is "behind the scenes", ever hear of tranparency? Democratic my left one, its about as democratic and the Afghan elections. I won't get involved, because I'm already involved as a member, how much more involved should one get to actually see some dividend?

To say its cronyist is kinda odd. Anyone can get involved, and no one is shunned if they show an interest. Its true that to get elected to a sabbat position ppl will willingly be social whores for an entire year, and thus it'll seem like cronyism when they get elected. The fact is in those cases they got elected because they made a lot of friends who campaigned for them. That isn't cronyism, it's democracy, and every democratic institution has that feature.

As Robert Fisk said last night regarding the media, I'm going to say it to you; you're living in disneyland if you believe that. It's cronyism, because you're making friends with the same kinds of people and because of general apathy towards the union, it's not that difficult to get elected if you've "made friends" with enough knobs.

Someone also mentioned class parties. Note that I never mentioned class parties, and never defended the union on those grounds.

Your point being?

Also the concentration on research was mentioned. I completely agree that UCD concentrates on research, using undergrads for status and non-research masters students for income. I hardly see how this is a reflection on the union, though.

So what the hell is the union there for? It's a university, people come to learn, how the feck can the union not involve itself in how it's members (every single one of them) are there to learn. This is ridiculous, one of the original foundation of the union was based on teaching quality and the poor infrastructure available to students in the Terrace, now times have changed but we're still facing the same problems. I don't care about buses and shite but the shear poor quality of undergraduate education has to be addressed, especially now with unemployment facing every student. Is the union only there for us students to make sure we have agood time?

You may have seen an email from Martin Butler today about the return of the no. 10 bus to campus. In it he mentions it was a 3-way negotiation. In reality, the SU were the only party interested in bringing it back to campus, and they did. Is there a poster telling ppl it's back? No.

You have, and personally I don't care for the 10, it's a rotten slow bus that takes an incredibly convulted route. However, it would be nice for the union to deal with the problem of binge drinking and violence etc... as a result as opposed to lumping Dublin Bus with the problem every night. Can you imagine what it must be like to drive a bus with drunken abusive louts every night, often at risk of personal attack?

So all I'm saying is, the union does do a lot, and people often write it off simply because it's an easy target. It's much easier to burn a house down than to build one, and if you think the union is shite, you should probably bring that up at council, or in a referendum, or with a sabbat, or with your rep, etc.

Nobody is burning the union house down, it's called criticism, people learn from criticism, if there was no criticism then there would be no change, however even criticising the union on boards I can see none of points will make a scrap of difference given the level of inertia exhibited by your defensive posts.

Chances are you won't make a massive difference, but that's not the fault of the union, that's the balance of power in ucd.

Yes it is the fault of the union, I was told myself and in fact have experienced it before: students have more power than they think. Again you've just written off any chance of change because of a 'power balance', amazing isn't it. The world can have a; female PM, black president, same-sex marriage, a cancer cure from curry, and yet trying to change UCD seems to be impossible. I think Chris Rock had a rather apt observation a few years back which might be applicable:
"You know the world is going crazy when the best rapper is a white guy, the best golfer is a black guy, the tallest guy in the NBA is Chinese, the Swiss hold the America's Cup, France is accusing the U.S. of arrogance, Germany doesn't want to go to war, and the three most powerful men in America are named 'Bush', 'Dick', and 'Colon.' Need I say more?"

errlloyd

While taking neither side let me add to this.

Everyone on the "Anti-SU" side seems to be saying the SU can't do anything of power and therefore why should we care, thats fine. However some of the "Anti-SU" side are saying "The SU can't do anything so we should oppose it's existence" that isn't fair. The SU is probably just as frustrated by its lack of power as you are.

The SU does some pointless things, I think the training weekend is a pharce. And the bus from town to campus costs 15,000 grand a year and I am willing to bet benefits the same 30-60 people each night it runs, is that fair?

But some of things they do are good. I personally am up for free condoms whenever they're going, but as you're mostly hardcore boardsies I'd say you don't benefit too much, cough pot calling kettle Obama cough.

Anyway absolutely all of that is irrelevant, literally the only power the SU has is as a "Students Union", I.E we're meant to be united by it. If it doesn't unite us its pointless, and if you refuse to work with it it will never unite us.

So in conclusion, its not Brady or Redmond that makes it set sail for phail, its all you dissenters who spite the SU cause it wastes a bit of money here and there.

WeeBushy

errlloyd wrote: »

While taking neither side let me add to this.

Everyone on the "Anti-SU" side seems to be saying the SU can't do anything of power and therefore why should we care, thats fine. However some of the "Anti-SU" side are saying "The SU can't do anything so we should oppose it's existence" that isn't fair. The SU is probably just as frustrated by its lack of power as you are.

I think people are less anti-SU and more "nothing"-SU. I don't oppose them, I just couldn't give a rashers about them.

errlloyd wrote: »

But some of things they do are good. I personally am up for free condoms whenever they're going, but as you're mostly hardcore boardsies I'd say you don't benefit too much, cough pot calling kettle Obama cough.

Ah yes, anyone who posts on the internet is a geek who has never had sex. Forgot that. And what did you just do btw :rolleyes:

errlloyd wrote: »

Anyway absolutely all of that is irrelevant, literally the only power the SU has is as a "Students Union", I.E we're meant to be united by it. If it doesn't unite us its pointless, and if you refuse to work with it it will never unite us.

So in conclusion, its not Brady or Redmond that makes it set sail for phail, its all you dissenters who spite the SU cause it wastes a bit of money here and there.

You're working under the premise that all students want to be united under some sort of union.

errlloyd

WeeBushy wrote: »

You're working under the premise that all students want to be united under some sort of union.

Yeah, its based on the pretense that we all have some common aims. A nice campus, discounts on stuff we need and health support?

Do you agree with this pretense.

WeeBushy

errlloyd wrote: »

Yeah, its based on the pretense that we all have some common aims. A nice campus, discounts on stuff we need and health support?

Do you agree with this pretense.

Sure I do, doesn't mean I support (or oppose) an ineffective SU to try and get it for me though.

Het-Field

Like A Fox wrote: »

USI had sweet fook all to do with fees being defeated. You should thank the Young Greens for that.

I thank them for nothing. What campaign did they engage in ???? At waht Oireachtas meeting, or cabinet meeting did they speak. At what point did John Gormley come out against 3rd Level Tuition fees ? It was only under the new programme for Government that they took the populist route to curry public favour.

The Young Greens are supporting incompetence, and cronyism. They are the youth wing of a party which supports "Planet Bertie", while having a leader who first too the piss out of it. They have sat back and watched the development of NAMA, the Anglo Irish scandel, the reticenece to cut expenditure, the advocacy of anti competitive carbon taxes to satisfy their climate change agenda. They have also stood over the costly decisions to raise VAT, ignore the need to ajust corporation taxes, offered no solutions or alternatives to the mess that is FAS, offered no alternative financial document to the cohorts in crime in FF,and have been silent on issues like public sector unrest.

Its no wonder they are going the way of the PDs, and they were corrupted far faster. They are a waste of space party who should be ashamed.

Riamfada

Het-Field wrote: »

I thank them for nothing. What campaign did they engage in ???? At waht Oireachtas meeting, or cabinet meeting did they speak. At what point did John Gormley come out against 3rd Level Tuition fees ? It was only under the new programme for Government that they took the populist route to curry public favour.

The Young Greens are supporting incompetence, and cronyism. They are the youth wing of a party which supports "Planet Bertie", while having a leader who first too the piss out of it. They have sat back and watched the development of NAMA, the Anglo Irish scandel, the reticenece to cut expenditure, the advocacy of anti competitive carbon taxes to satisfy their climate change agenda. They have also stood over the costly decisions to raise VAT, ignore the need to ajust corporation taxes, offered no solutions or alternatives to the mess that is FAS, offered no alternative financial document to the cohorts in crime in FF,and have been silent on issues like public sector unrest.

Its no wonder they are going the way of the PDs, and they were corrupted far faster. They are a waste of space party who should be ashamed.

Completely off topic but I have to say this post makes sense. Anyone who dosnt see the logic behind this post is chosing not to. I think everyone is this country is waiting for the Greens to go and its suprising for such a self righteous group not to have fallen on their swords by now but when they do fees will be back on the table because students will not save them and as Het Field has pointed out, they have proved themselves incapable of living in the same country as us.

fillefatale

Het-Field wrote: »

I thank them for nothing. What campaign did they engage in ???? At waht Oireachtas meeting, or cabinet meeting did they speak. At what point did John Gormley come out against 3rd Level Tuition fees ? It was only under the new programme for Government that they took the populist route to curry public favour.

The Young Greens are supporting incompetence, and cronyism. They are the youth wing of a party which supports "Planet Bertie", while having a leader who first too the piss out of it. They have sat back and watched the development of NAMA, the Anglo Irish scandel, the reticenece to cut expenditure, the advocacy of anti competitive carbon taxes to satisfy their climate change agenda. They have also stood over the costly decisions to raise VAT, ignore the need to ajust corporation taxes, offered no solutions or alternatives to the mess that is FAS, offered no alternative financial document to the cohorts in crime in FF,and have been silent on issues like public sector unrest.

Its no wonder they are going the way of the PDs, and they were corrupted far faster. They are a waste of space party who should be ashamed.

Ridiculous statement, the YGs spoke out against fees all this time and got it passed in the new programme for govt, just because it originated from a party you dislike you can't accept that.

El Siglo

fillefatale wrote: »

Ridiculous statement, the YGs spoke out against fees all this time and got it passed in the new programme for govt, just because it originated from a party you dislike you can't accept that.

This is the problem with having an affiliation or some loyalty to a political party, it blurs the facts. The facts were the Greens and FF were desperate to stay in power and need to maintain their middle class base (which is nearly all of the country since the mid '90s), it was tokenism on the part of FF in taking the issue of fees out of the new programme for government. Frankly arguing the effect of YG on this is like arguing for everyone to not eat meat so that you limit CH4 as a greenhouse gas, it's not going to make a difference if everyone still drives SUVs, YG's effect was minimal to say the least. Fees were abandoned by a government desperate to stay in power, it helped both sides to take them off, it was by no means anything due to the USI, YG etc... just a group of old farts wanting to keep power. I would have respected the Green Party prior to 2007 but since then, they've sold themselves out and by the next general election they will go the way of the dodo and the PDs, kaputt!

Riamfada

Im by no means a mod here. But this thread took a turn off topic about 10 posts ago. Can we please get back to giving out about unionites :D

El Siglo

Grimes wrote: »

Can we please get back to giving out about unionites :D

Damn unions!
"You can't treat the working man this way. One day, we'll form a union and get the fair and equitable treatment we deserve! Then we'll go too far, and get corrupt and shiftless, and the Japanese will eat us alive!" Can't beat classic Simpsons!

Het-Field

fillefatale wrote: »

Ridiculous statement, the YGs spoke out against fees all this time and got it passed in the new programme for govt, just because it originated from a party you dislike you can't accept that.

When the hell did the Young Green's speak out ? I dont recall any national press releases ? I dont recall hearing Barra Rowntree talk about anyrthing other then temporary nationalisation of the banks. What was done by the Young Greens is of negligible importance. I suggest you look at the facts. I somehow doubt you could find me any press coverage that the young greens got for the fees issue. The facts speak for themselves, and are not in your favour.

The new Progreaame For Government was a FF exercise. They took it off the table in a populist move. I suggest you talk to the Young PDs, who used a Harney statment to browbeat the PD Parlimentary Party of the day to remove the issue.

Raphael

This is all very interesting, but the point stopped being discussed days ago. Locked.