Are Metallica the definitive metal band

nyarlothothep

As the beatles are to rock, metallica are to metal? In my opinion I think metallica had the biggest impact on the genre as a whole more than any other metal band. All subsequent metal flows from metallica, they defined the sound of the genre and its subgenres with the chug chug chug guitar style, the semi tone chord shifts and so on. While Black Sabbath feels more like a proto metal band metallica went beyond their peers to capitalize on the essence of metal.

cedomination

I'd say either Black Sabbath or Iron Maiden are the metal equivalent of the beatles.

GLaDOS

nyarlothothep wrote: »

As the beatles are to rock, metallica are to metal? In my opinion I think metallica had the biggest impact on the genre as a whole more than any other metal band. All subsequent metal flows from metallica, they defined the sound of the genre and its subgenres with the chug chug chug guitar style, the semi tone chord shifts and so on. While Black Sabbath feels more like a proto metal band metallica went beyond their peers to capitalize on the essence of metal.

Metallica are possibly the most famous/commercialised metal band and as such are a lot of young peoples first taste of the genre. I'd be hesitant to call them definitive. I certainly wouldn't agree when you say all subsequent metal flows from them, metal is far too varied for everyone to be copying Metallica to make sense.

ride-the-spiral

I wouldn't say Black Sabbath as much, I know alot of people who don't know any Black Sabbath songs apart from Iron Man. Same with Iron Maiden.

I have yet to meet somebody who says they like rock or metal and hasn't heard a good few 'tallica songs though.

robby^5

Well tbh you can thank The Beatles almost directly for heavy metal, Helter Skelter was the starting point imo.

As for Metallica, they most certainly were the definitive thrash metal band but they didnt remain thrash as we all know, they're hard rock these days.

Max Power1

As Deicide are the definitive Death metal band, Black Sabbath are the definitive metal band.

LightofDarkness

I would hardly call Deicide definitive. They are easily eclipsed by the likes of Death and Morbid Angel.

And Black Sabbath aren't really in the running, to be honest. The average man on the street wouldn't be able to name a single Sabbath song, especially not before the release of Iron Man (the movie). However, you'd find plenty who would know of at least Enter Sandman, which speaks volumes. In fairness, Metallica brought hard, edgy metal into the public consciousness, replacing the sex and fashion obsessed image of metal with a gritty, more "underground" appeal. They're pretty much the first metal band people REALLY get into (as in you don't just like one or two songs, you love the albums and buy the t-shirts).

I would say without a doubt that they are the definitive metal band.

Malice

They probably are the definitive metal band as it's difficult to come up with an alternative.

deman

cedomination wrote: »

I'd say either Black Sabbath or Iron Maiden are the metal equivalent of the beatles.

Couldn't agree more.

chin_grin

deman wrote: »

Couldn't agree more.

+1. Also is there a f*cking day that goes by without a thread in the R&M forum without the word "metallica" in the title. They're not the be all and end all FFS.

empirix

Max Power1 wrote: »

As Deicide are the definitive Death metal band, Black Sabbath are the definitive metal band.

they are in their rocks, they are no where near definitive, Death were definitive maybe Obituary, Deicide are actually quite rubbish and rely solely on their controversial lyrics which when you think about it and grow up you will realise that its all blah beside Slayer done the lyrics before Deicide - only a whole lot better. i take it your a teenager!

Id go with Sabbath and then Metallica or Slayer

Arnold Layne

For me, Slayer are the definitive metal band having never sold out to sell records.

However I was blown away after hearing Master Of Puppets for the first time, on vinyl, in the eighties. I thought Metallica were the best ever, and went to their gig in the Top Hat in Dun Laoghaire during the Damaged Justice Tour with Danzig as support. That was some gig, with Hetfield & Hammet coming on for the end of Danzig's performance and Glenn Danzig singing Last Caress during Metallica's.

I find myself these days listening to Slayer's Reign In Blood, South of Heaven, and Seasons In The Abyss more and more, never having a thought of putting on any of Metallica's pre-commercial albums.

My only disappointment is I have never been able to see Slayer live, but hope to in the next few years if and when they come to Ireland. If I need to travel to the UK to see them, then so be it.

Max Power1

empirix wrote: »

lyrics before Deicide - only a whole lot better. i take it your a teenager!

No I amnt and havent been for years!

Id go with Sabbath and then Metallica or Slayer

I'd go with sabbath and then maybe slayer/motorhead but sabbath are the clear number one

Fo Real

This is a question I have spent hours pondering on many a sleepless night.

mayordenis

In order of definativness (I know that shouldn't exist definitive should only be a singular but feck it.)

Iron Maiden
Black Sabbath
Slayer
Metallica

They would be the only ones in the debate for me - with maiden really defining metal for such a long time, they have to shade it.

projectmayhem

I wouldn't hold Metallica up on that kind of mantle myself, but I do think they reached more people then Maiden or anyone else, thus being representative of the genre outside of the genre, just like the Beatles.

Definitive? Probably not. The easiest example? Yes.

OakeyDokey

nyarlothothep wrote: »

As the beatles are to rock, metallica are to metal? In my opinion I think metallica had the biggest impact on the genre as a whole more than any other metal band. All subsequent metal flows from metallica, they defined the sound of the genre and its subgenres with the chug chug chug guitar style, the semi tone chord shifts and so on. While Black Sabbath feels more like a proto metal band metallica went beyond their peers to capitalize on the essence of metal.

I some what agree with you, they definatley go down in the hall of fame for most inspriational metal band, their accomplishments alone spea for themselves.:)

Twilightning

No mention of Judas Priest?

Kess73

Would the Definitive metal band be one that you could pick up any album by them and it would recognised as being metal through how it sounded and how it contained things expected in a metal album?

Metallica would defo not fall under that heading, not even close.


They would however most likely be the example of a metal band given by non metal fans if asked to name a metal band. So they would be a great example of the most mainstream metal band in a way as they would be known to pop fans, rap fans etc.


As for the most definitive metal band... I think bands like Judas Priest, Testament, and Iron Maiden would be in with a shout, but bands like Manowar and Thor would too as they would tick all the cliched boxes of what the stereotype of metal would sound like.

Kess73

Crazymoo! wrote: »

I some what agree with you, they definatley go down in the hall of fame for most inspriational metal band, their accomplishments alone spea for themselves.:)

I don't think they could be regarded as anything like being the most inspirational metal band.


Listen to new metal these days, there are more bands coming out with sounds that are inspired and influenced by the older metal and rock bands than by Metallica.


If you meant inspirational in terms of crowds at gigs or albums sold, then they fall behind many other metal bands too.

The likes of Maiden and AC/DC are playing to huge crowd numbers again despite being in the twilight of their careers, with Maiden's last tour breaking attendence records in many countries.

And I don't take album sales as being a sign of being inspirational as the Black album sold 24 to 25 million copies to date worldwide, but so has Linkin Park's Hybrid Theory and I would not call LP uber inspirational.

nyarlothothep

Kess73 wrote: »

I don't think they could be regarded as anything like being the most inspirational metal band.


Listen to new metal these days, there are more bands coming out with sounds that are inspired and influenced by the older metal and rock bands than by Metallica.


If you meant inspirational in terms of crowds at gigs or albums sold, then they fall behind many other metal bands too.

The likes of Maiden and AC/DC are playing to huge crowd numbers again despite being in the twilight of their careers, with Maiden's last tour breaking attendence records in many countries.

And I don't take album sales as being a sign of being inspirational as the Black album sold 24 to 25 million copies to date worldwide, but so has Linkin Park's Hybrid Theory and I would not call LP uber inspirational.

All subjective at the end of the day but Linkin Park aren't as credible as Metallica who have a deeper cultural reach in the public consciousness. I don't know the album sales of Tool but I bet they will be remembered more favourably and more often than Limp Bizkit in 30 years.

Kess73

nyarlothothep wrote: »

All subjective at the end of the day but Linkin Park aren't as credible as Metallica who have a deeper cultural reach in the public consciousness. I don't know the album sales of Tool but I bet they will be remembered more favourably and more often than Limp Bizkit in 30 years.

What do you mean 30 years? They already are remembered more often than Limp Bizkit.

o1s1n

Never got the big deal about Metallica. Always found them fairly meh. I really don't think their accessibility defines them as definitive.

It has got to be Black Sabbath.

Also, your average person doesn't know any black Sabbath Songs? I'm fairly sure the Paranoid riff would disagree!

ride-the-spiral

o1s1n wrote: »

Never got the big deal about Metallica. Always found them fairly meh. I really don't think their accessibility defines them as definitive.

It has got to be Black Sabbath.

Also, your average person doesn't know any black Sabbath Songs? I'm fairly sure the Paranoid riff would disagree!

No really, they wouldn't know any riffs apart from Iron Man, and that's because of cultural references really.

GLaDOS

I think to non-metal heads they might be. How many times have you heard "Oh you like metal, yeah I love Nothing Else Matters" or something similar?

But how many people would say Metallica defines what they listen to? I don't think it's really possible to have a definitive metal band, as there are so mang different genres, compare for example, progressive to grindcore. Hard to pick a band that would be definitive for both of them.

ride-the-spiral

ScienceNerd wrote: »

I think to non-metal heads they might be. How many times have you heard "Oh you like metal, yeah I love Nothing Else Matters" or something similar?

But how many people would say Metallica defines what they listen to? I don't think it's really possible to have a definitive metal band, as there are so mang different genres, compare for example, progressive to grindcore. Hard to pick a band that would be definitive for both of them.

I agree, metal is just such a huge genre with such a wide array of sounds that you can't pinpoint a band.

But i suppose that happens in every genre, like The Beatles aren't really the definitive Rock band either. There are so many bands that are classified as Rock that have gone way beyond what the Beatles were doing.

SirLemonhead

Twilightning wrote: »

No mention of Judas Priest?

They're the Connoisseur's choice :pac:

Motley Crue

I'd say the OP makes a fair comment. I often wonder, if Metallica were seen like Trivium are now in 1983/4, except because we already have Metallica then Trivium are just seen as copycats and rip off merchants today?

There was no denying the genius of Dave Mustaine for example, that's why even his exit from Metallica could never hold him back, and he founded Megadeth.

Non metal heads credit Metallica as being THE Metal band, whereas Metal fans think that there is a wider argument to the case...Metallica apparently "sold out" in 1992 when they toured with the likes of Guns N Roses and played these massive arena shows in the US and then "jumped the shark" in 1996 when they released Load

Having said that, there are few bands around from Metallica's generation (Slayer being the only one perhaps) that have stayed consistent with their sound and lineup and kept their reputation intact as a result

o1s1n

ride-the-spiral wrote: »

No really, they wouldn't know any riffs apart from Iron Man, and that's because of cultural references really.

I suppose it would all depend what age generation you're talking about.

Maybe not the kids today, but certainly previous generations would recognise Paranoid as being Black Sabbath song fairly instantly. It was a huge hit and had a much bigger impact on the general public than the song Iron Man being used in one film.

metzengerstein

nyarlothothep wrote: »

As the beatles are to rock, metallica are to metal? In my opinion I think metallica had the biggest impact on the genre as a whole more than any other metal band. All subsequent metal flows from metallica, they defined the sound of the genre and its subgenres with the chug chug chug guitar style, the semi tone chord shifts and so on. While Black Sabbath feels more like a proto metal band metallica went beyond their peers to capitalize on the essence of metal.

they did until slayer showed up and and took the spotlight
:cool:

they did have there own sound in the early years but i think there new albums from reload on are just rubish (not that i liked there early stuff either) and death magnet sounds like they sampled some of deep purple and iron maiden songs they lost there way .if mustaine was still in that band they would be awesome

Mental Mickey

metzengerstein wrote: »

they did until slayer showed up and and took the spotlight
:cool:

they did have there own sound in the early years but i think there new albums from reload on are just rubish (not that i liked there early stuff either) and death magnet sounds like they sampled some of deep purple and iron maiden songs they lost there way .if mustaine was still in that band they would be awesome

At least get the album name right....?:rolleyes:

GLaDOS

Motley Crue wrote: »

Having said that, there are few bands around from Metallica's generation (Slayer being the only one perhaps) that have stayed consistent with their sound and lineup and kept their reputation intact as a result

Not really, and that's the problem a lot of people have with them (e.g. KEA - AJFA = good, everything else = bad)

Mental Mickey

ScienceNerd wrote: »

Not really, and that's the problem a lot of people have with them (e.g. KEA - AJFA = good, everything else = bad)

Are you including MOP and TBA in that too?

GLaDOS

Mental Mickey wrote: »

Are you including MOP and TBA in that too?

I am including MOP (I was saying from KEM to AJFA, including MOP and RTL). TBA is debatable for a lot of people whether they'd include it in the same calibre as the previous 4 . I wasn't necessarily giving my own opinion, just giving one of the popular ones.

Mental Mickey

ScienceNerd wrote: »

I am including MOP (I was saying from KEM to AJFA, including MOP and RTL). TBA is debatable for a lot of people whether they'd include it in the same calibre as the previous 4 . I wasn't necessarily giving my own opinion, just giving one of the popular ones.

IMO Load is a decent album. Okay, its completely different to anything they'd done previous, but it's still a good one!? Everything after that has been meh.

GLaDOS

Mental Mickey wrote: »

its completely different to anything they'd done previous

That was my original point That their sound hasn't stayed consistent and a lot of peolpe have a problem with this

Kess73

Motley Crue wrote: »

Having said that, there are few bands around from Metallica's generation (Slayer being the only one perhaps) that have stayed consistent with their sound and lineup and kept their reputation intact as a result

Testament would be another in my eyes. Their sound has been pretty consistent.

Kess73

ScienceNerd wrote: »

That was my original point That their sound hasn't stayed consistent and a lot of peolpe have a problem with this

I think more people had a problem with their quality not being consistent rather than their sound not being consistent.

There was a big dip in quality after Load, some might even say after the Black album.

I think if the quality of music had stayed high after Load, then the change in sound would not have been as much of an issue.

GLaDOS

Kess73 wrote: »

I think more people had a problem with their quality not being consistent rather than their sound not being consistent.

There was a big dip in quality after Load, some might even say after the Black album.

I think if the quality of music had stayed high after Load, then the change in sound would not have been as much of an issue.

That's a fair point, plenty of metal bands have changed style but kept the quality up, Metallica didn't

ride-the-spiral

Testament don't seem to get enough credit. I'm not that big of a thrash fan but from what I can tell, they're much higher regarded than Anthrax.

nyarlothothep

You can't really hold it against them though. I've noticed artists in the music industry tend to dip in quality around 34-35, especially if they've had huge success as they have nothing really to prove to anyone.

bigeasyeah

No such thing.This question annoyed me.

PretentiousApe

I'd say that Master Of Puppets is the definitive metal album, rather than Metallica are the definitive metal band. They've changed styles quite a bit over the last decade and a half, so ya have to take that into consideration.

brendansmith

ride-the-spiral wrote: »

I wouldn't say Black Sabbath as much, I know alot of people who don't know any Black Sabbath songs apart from Iron Man. Same with Iron Maiden.

Liar! Ironman went out and bought the entire back catelog after Black Sabbath wrote that song about him.

Kess73

ride-the-spiral wrote: »

Testament don't seem to get enough credit. I'm not that big of a thrash fan but from what I can tell, they're much higher regarded than Anthrax.

To be fair I think Anthrax are regarded less highly than they should be as well.

As for Testament, they never broke out of the metal market and as such never drew the attention of anyone but metal fans.

They came close to breaking out when they released Souls Of Black and the excellent The Ritual on the strength of the reception and tv play that Practise What You Preach got . Even their most recent album, The Formation Of Damnation, rode a wave of critical acclaim, and is a top class metal album that blows Death Magnetic out of the water, but seems to barely get a mention amongst metal fans.

TFOD easily sits as one of Testament's best albums despite it being from a thrash metal band that have been around since the early 80's

3suns

it has to be black sabbath.

everything you hear today in metal can be traced back to some part of a black sabbath tune.

elements of nearly every single metal sub-genre can be heard in black sabbath records. death, doom, trash, whatever. its all there. bands just took one tiny bit of sabbaths wide range sound and expanded it into a genre

Catari Jaguar

PretentiousApe wrote: »

I'd say that Master Of Puppets is the definitive metal album, rather than Metallica are the definitive metal band. They've changed styles quite a bit over the last decade and a half, so ya have to take that into consideration.

Totally agree with this. Metallica are definitely the most commercial metal band and most heard of because of their sell out, headline grabbing tendencies...

For me, the definitive metal band is Black Sabbath. Apparently the term "heavy metal" stemmed from them. An adjective used to described their type of sound in an article about them. Even the metal style you see on any fan at any metal concert today, Black Sabbath was doing that back in the 1970s (way before Metallica). Long hair, chains/crosses, black clothes. And the "metal" lifestyle too: drink & drugs, tattoos, interest in the occult etc.

If you don't know Black Sabbath, then you're not a metal fan. Listening to Metallica doesn't make you a metal fan. (It does however make you a Metallica fan)

The reason more non- metal listeners have heard of Nothing Else Matters than say, War Pigs, is that NEM is radio friendly and it is more of a ballad really.

Black Sabbath helped pioneer the music to become one of the first metal bands, and I would have to say Alice Cooper created the definitive live metal show (and introduced the idea of shocking people). Since them there has been lots of copying and morphing of styles, sounds and trends in Metal.

Metallica: Accesible and widespread; yes. Popular; definitely. Definitive: 'fraid not.

Star Bingo

absolutely not OP. they are soft/country rock chart-toppers that r to metal what Green Day are to 'Punk' .. u know u get them open minded chavs with an eclectic collection of chart topping chuck n Metalikur is the only metal band the have? .. damn.
i see theyr selling their concerts now via an iPod app.. look out they'll criminalize u for owning bootlegs next.

facepalm/FAIL. someone's doing it sooo f'n wrong

cournioni

Black Sabbath are the definitive metal band.

metzengerstein

Mental Mickey wrote: »

At least get the album name right....?:rolleyes:

doesnt matter what way its spelled its rubish,


if they had stayed the way they started in the 80s they may have made a much bigger impact .

but it has to be black sabbath,and id have to say iron maiden aswell and there are so many others who are and will always be on top of metalica

Catari Jaguar

Mental Mickey wrote: »

At least get the album name right....?:rolleyes:

BOO! :rolleyes:.......:rolleyes: