Is it time to Take to the streets and remove this Government

seangal

Sorry if I am repeating a thread but just wondering what is the opinion if Irish people were to take to the street and remain there till this Government step down.
Take the following issues
1) If you work in FAS and are get caught doing wrong don’t worry u will get a big pay off
2) We have back bench TD’S who think we should put social issues or publicans before saving lives on our roads
3) Brendan drum get big bonus for F*****G up the health service
4) The banks made S**T of our County, we bail them out and they give pay increase to there staff
5) Out Taoiseach think it is a good idea to keep the Seanad which is just a place for jobs for the boys
How much more are we going to take ?????????????
we have the chance on the 6th of November to make a Stance

CerebralCortex

We had a chance in the last three general elections.

Tricity Bendix

seangal wrote: »

Sorry if I am repeating a thread but just wondering what is the opinion if Irish people were to take to the street and remain there till this Government step down.
Take the following issues
1) If you work in FAS and are get caught doing wrong don’t worry u will get a big pay off
2) We have back bench TD’S who think we should put social issues or publicans before saving lives on our roads
3) Brendan drum get big bonus for F*****G up the health service
4) The banks made S**T of our County, we bail them out and they give pay increase to there staff
5) Out Taoiseach think it is a good idea to keep the Seanad which is just a place for jobs for the boys
How much more are we going to take ?????????????
we have the chance on the 6th of November to make a Stance

IF Irish people took to the streets and remained there i sufficient numbers the government would fall. But they won't.

dan_d

Is the 6th NOV not more to do with the issue of pay cuts etc? Which are unfortunate but necessary?
I'll happily be on the streets to protest against how Roddy Molloy, Sean Fitzpatrick etc etc got away with their behaviour.But I'm afraid I won't protest against cuts in public service pay among other things. The reasons for which are irrelevant here.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

seangal

but no other country would allow a goverement like this to go on
I put my had up and say i was foolish as i voted them in to power but i do think the FG would bring fresh thinking to the problems we have
All the groups will protest and we can give out about public sector all we want and i think it should be a 10% cut but if they go all out on strike and close schools, colleges, wards on hospital, social welfare offices, cops go on a blue swine flu we will then have chaois.
Cowen is not the man to lead us out of this and he is to thick to see that

squonk

seangal wrote: »

but no other country would allow a goverement like this to go on
I put my had up and say i was foolish as i voted them in to power but i do think the FG would bring fresh thinking to the problems we have
All the groups will protest and we can give out about public sector all we want and i think it should be a 10% cut but if they go all out on strike and close schools, colleges, wards on hospital, social welfare offices, cops go on a blue swine flu we will then have chaois.
Cowen is not the man to lead us out of this and he is to thick to see that

In fairness, the time for serious complaint was at the last election. What happened there was, in my opinion, collective neglect of the highest order. Now I'm not an FF supporter and their candidates would not be high on my preference list but even so, it was obvious enough to anyone who looked that there were problems coming up ahead that were not catered for.

What happened subsequently was a bigger shock than I expected and I'd say most other people would say that too. My take on the last election was that people just didn't give a crap and were happy to listen to the oul' guff put about by Bertie, take the election bribes from FF and do what they were told.

I think Cown is capable but he was landed in the **** by Bertie and the major failing he does have is that he's not communicative enough. Lenihan is getting more exposure right now because of the post he has. It wouldn't harm Cowen to cme out and let us know what he's doing.

I think as an electorate, we are pretty tame and I sometimes wonder what exactely has the government to do before we get up off our arses and protoest and oust them. It's not going to happen though.

right now the only ousting that's going to happen is if the independents take some sort of stand.

bamboozle

seangal wrote: »

Sorry if I am repeating a thread but just wondering what is the opinion if Irish people were to take to the street and remain there till this Government step down.
Take the following issues
1) If you work in FAS and are get caught doing wrong don’t worry u will get a big pay off
2) We have back bench TD’S who think we should put social issues or publicans before saving lives on our roads
3) Brendan drum get big bonus for F*****G up the health service
4) The banks made S**T of our County, we bail them out and they give pay increase to there staff
5) Out Taoiseach think it is a good idea to keep the Seanad which is just a place for jobs for the boys
How much more are we going to take ?????????????
we have the chance on the 6th of November to make a Stance

re point 4, did the banks make sh1t of the country, or did the financial regulator, central Bank & Dept of Finance make sh1t of the country by failing to regulate the banking industry?

I dont work for a bank and never have but all the banks were doing was lending money within the constrains which were set by the Central Bank & Financial Regulator. The onus was on the state appointed bodies to do their bl00dy job and tighten up the banking industry, but nothing ever happenend.

it continues to shock me how Patrick Neary the disgraced former Financial Regulator knew of Sean Fitzpatrick's loans being switched off the Anglo books at year end and not only did he fail to act but in retirement he gets a pension which is greater than the salary of the current head of the US Fed Reserve Ben Bernanke.....

Money Shot

There has been no greater critic of this government and in particular bertie ahearn over the last 10 years, but the populist, idiotic guff coming out of Fine Gael and Labour does make me wonder what the alternative would bring.

Labour seem incapable of doing what should have been done on day one - tackle the public service pay bill and to a lesser extent areas of social welfare. Fine Gael coming out with the most ludicris idea of writing off domestic Mortgage debt and bringing it under NAMA. I don't even think I need to write down any reasons why this is such a stupid idea as it's so obviously an unworkable and idotic idea.

Given the situation of a dysfunctional government and only one inept and disjointed alternative, I think we need to look at reforming the whole political system in this country.

Euro_Kraut

How does 'taking to the street' remove the Government?

loveissucide

Well,considering how Irish Governments,in particular Fianna Fail ones, have a long tradition of not caring what people think, and Irish people have a long history of self-interest,the two deserve each other and I'd say the government will hold out till 2012.

Money Shot

Euro_Kraut wrote: »

How does 'taking to the street' remove the Government?

He must mean with pitch forks and shovels and having a national revolution

seangal

Euro_Kraut wrote: »

How does 'taking to the street' remove the Government?

do u not think that if u had a mass protest say 100k people on the streets around the dail and refusing to go away the goverement would have to go???
The problem is that irish people are hopless at making a stance or complaining
Look at how we have being ripped off as consumers in the last 10 year and it is still going on

Rb

November 6th? A chance to take a stance? Are you serious?

All it will comprise of is mopey union workers moaning about having their Celtic Tiger salary slashed a bit. They all cry "No" at having to face a pay cut, while a ton of private sector staff who were already paid less than them on average, have already faced paycuts and layoffs. The public sector needs to be sliced up and the dead, rotten parts thrown away and I will in no way rally against such an action.

Also, out of curiosity, please outline your understanding of the senate and it's role in the state, and why exactly you're opposed to it. Also, while you're at it, please do provide a brief overview of how Brendan Drum has "fucked up" our health service, more so than it was prior to his appointment there? You've made quite a few brash statements, so I'd like to see you back them up with coherent reasoning lest they be dismissed as an uninformed, ignorant rant.

Rb

seangal wrote: »

do u not think that if u had a mass protest say 100k people on the streets around the dail and refusing to go away the goverement would have to go???
The problem is that irish people are hopless at making a stance or complaining
Look at how we have being ripped off as consumers in the last 10 year and it is still going on

Why would they? They were democratically elected in this country, why would 100k people who might not even vote be allowed influence who we have in power? Those who will turn up on the 6th of November certainly do not represent my views or hopes for this country and its economy, why would even they be allowed choose who runs the show? Why should they be allowed?

We elect our Governments through democratic referendums, not third-world-esque behavior, if you're unhappy with the democratic system here I'd suggest heading over to, and becoming politically active, in a state such as Zimbabwe.

paulocon

seangal wrote: »

do u not think that if u had a mass protest say 100k people on the streets around the dail and refusing to go away the goverement would have to go???
The problem is that irish people are hopless at making a stance or complaining
Look at how we have being ripped off as consumers in the last 10 year and it is still going on

The Dail would just have to frequent the bar until Saturday afternoon when 50% of the protestors would head off to watch the footie on Sky/Setanta/ESPN on their Harvey Norman finance-deal 52inch Widescreen TV. The other 50% would hang around a bit longer but would need to head off in time to get home for X-factor. Speaking of which, maybe they could get those twins to record a 'protest song' - anyone got Simon Cowell's number?

Taxipete29

Rb wrote: »

Why would they? They were democratically elected in this country, why would 100k people who might not even vote be allowed influence who we have in power? Those who will turn up on the 6th of November certainly do not represent my views or hopes for this country and its economy, why would even they be allowed choose who runs the show? Why should they be allowed?

We elect our Governments through democratic referendums, not third-world-esque behavior, if you're unhappy with the democratic system here I'd suggest heading over to, and becoming politically active, in a state such as Zimbabwe.

The Government is elected for a MAXIMUM term of 5 years. They were elected in 2007, this is 2009 and they no longer have a mandate for whatever cuts or changes have to be made. They were elected on the promise of a better health service, better education etc. They were not elected on the basis of the implementation of NAMA or major cutbacks in vital areas. If they wish to procede let them go to the people and get that mandate. Thats what democracy is.

optocynic

Tricity Bendix wrote: »

IF Irish people took to the streets and remained there i sufficient numbers the government would fall. But they won't.

But it's getting cold out there!!!

Tyrant^

donegalfella wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

QFT !

We dont care about others really. We all just want our own piece of the pie and couldnt give two f**ks if they other guy didn't get his.

A new party of politicians wont change a damn thing. There will still be f**k ups, corruption, greed, wars, recessions, depressions... and all the rest.

If we want to live our lives without suffering and torment.... it is only a choice.

J. Krishnamurti - The Real Revolution

seangal

Rb wrote: »

Why would they? They were democratically elected in this country, why would 100k people who might not even vote be allowed influence who we have in power? Those who will turn up on the 6th of November certainly do not represent my views or hopes for this country and its economy, why would even they be allowed choose who runs the show? Why should they be allowed?

We elect our Governments through democratic referendums, not third-world-esque behavior, if you're unhappy with the democratic system here I'd suggest heading over to, and becoming politically active, in a state such as Zimbabwe.

You are so out of touch with the feeling and anger of the Irish people
I would even go as far as to say you are a FF member
After the budget you might just find out that due to protest by Irish people this government will fall

Rb

seangal wrote: »

You are so out of touch with the feeling and anger of the Irish people
I would even go as far as to say you are a FF member
After the budget you might just find out that due to protest by Irish people this government will fall

Ah, so I take it since you didn't address my questions regarding your rant, it means that it in indeed a shallow, ignorant, uninformed rant (at best). It's akin to something you'd have blared at you by a taxi driver on a Saturday night.

I'm an Irish person so please do not speak on my behalf, the majority of other Irish people that I know don't hold your sentiment either and most, as they should, laugh at the moany, mopey public servants who are going to be out on the 6th of November, along with their People Before Profit comrades. What a spectacle that should be, given the absolute state of that People Before Profit present themselves in.

Out of touch? Really? I don't believe so, last time I checked most here are glad to be part of a democracy and will use their democratic rights to express their discontent with the Government at the next General Election, whenever that may be.

Also, for what it's worth, dodging questions entirely casts you in a worse light than answering them incorrectly.

Lame Lantern

I took to the streets yesterday when I burned my toast and again at lunch when some dude spilled coffee on me.

In both cases, taking to the street did little but enable me to show off my incredible wit in the form of my "careful now" sign.

starbelgrade

Yes.

thebman

loveissucide wrote: »

Well,considering how Irish Governments,in particular Fianna Fail ones, have a long tradition of not caring what people think, and Irish people have a long history of self-interest,the two deserve each other and I'd say the government will hold out till 2012.

I don't think the Irish are so special.

I think the main difference between us and other countries is the number of special interest groups at our protests is smaller so the message gets lost as the special interest groups all try to steal it and there are only a few thousand at the protest out of a million people in the capital.

Compare that to another country with a much bigger population than Dublin and of course more people are going to attend and the special interest group messages get lost because there are too many of them so it becomes harder to hijack the protest.

In Ireland, it is too easy to hijack the protest. Everyone in the world is in a position of self-interest.

dvpower

No. The're isn't an election scheduled for another two years.

douglashyde

donegalfella wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Brilliant!!

douglashyde

While I know this point is abit of topic, I cant help but post it after reading through this thread.

While I'm a 20 year old working student, which make's me a little less able to comment on such matters, I must first agree that the "publics" voice seems only to come special interest groups... for example, student protests on fees and public sector pay cuts. Which brings me onto my point:

The public sector unions and its members will strike. The students will strike....and what will seem like the general public striking will infact be special interest groups. So while the general public look on, who will defend the goverment and say "NO!! We support your public sector pay cuts" " we support some form of fees" " Hell, some of use support NAMA"

Without the general public's help and support how can we expect the goverment we elected to do its job.

And to finish of, I have a question, Why cant the goverment hold a vote to see the public want pay cuts etc....

Liam Byrne

Yes.

Even the dogs on the street knew that the Greens did not act in the interests of the country this month, and that is not on.

And that's even blaming them a little too much, since McDowell & Harney were the first people with the opportunity to put things right, and failed miserably by choosing to believe Ahern's so-called "explanations".

Marshy

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Even the dogs on the street knew that the Greens did not act in the interests of the country this month, and that is not on.

How so?

Its fairly widely accepted that the last thing the country needed was an election at this juncture. I'll admit I wouldn't agree with a lot of what was on the Greens' "shopping list" but before now they've been criticised for not standing up for themselves.

It makes me sick to see all this talk of protests from the unions etc. Got a letter in the door from ICTU telling me to stand up against the government and nonsense like this is only going to slow down any possible recovery. Public sector workers and their unions need to show some cop and get over this notion that they're being scapegoated. The majority of people in the private sector had nothing to do with causing the recession either and yet many of them have been hit severely in the last year or so. The best thing to come out of the recession in my view is the sudden urgency to get some sort of value for money from the public coffers, especially in terms of cutting the fat off the civil service.

mike kelly

The only hope for the economy is to bring back bertie ahearn.

Liam Byrne

mike kelly wrote: »

The only hope for the economy is to bring back bertie ahearn.

It's bad enough to have that ****e spouted in another thread without it showing up here as well.

bmaxi

Is it not remarkable though, that we can find time and temper to chuck eggs at Tony Blair, while Cowen et all remain egg free?

digme

bmaxi wrote: »

Is it not remarkable though, that we can find time and temper to chuck eggs at Tony Blair, while Cowen et all remain egg free?

Great point. It's strange isn't it?Maybe the crowd in Dublin are too cosy to do such a thing as they might get into a bit of trouble.

scr123

Ireland is a democracy. I am a democrat. If us democrats do not see the government as suitable we wait for the next election and vote them out. We do not take to the streets because we know protests can become violent and these protests are usually led by people of a fanatical disposition. We democrats prefer the power of the ballot box as against the alternative which more often than not results in death and injury and usually to innocent people. Anytime between now and mid 2012 the people of Ireland will pass judgement on the present government and will pass judgement on those who believe they are the alternative government.

When I see calls for taking to the streets I instantly become fearful of a dangerous lunatic in our midst.

Callan57

mike kelly wrote: »

The only hope for the economy is to bring back bertie ahearn.

If the Bert is the answer then the question must be fairly stupid

hobochris

scr123 wrote: »

Ireland is a democracy. I am a democrat. If us democrats do not see the government as suitable we wait for the next election and vote them out. We do not take to the streets because we know protests can become violent and these protests are usually led by people of a fanatical disposition. We democrats prefer the power of the ballot box as against the alternative which more often than not results in death and injury and usually to innocent people. Anytime between now and mid 2012 the people of Ireland will pass judgement on the present government and will pass judgement on those who believe they are the alternative government.

When I see calls for taking to the streets I instantly become fearful of a dangerous lunatic in our midst.

The real question is, which is worse for us, the damage that would be done by protests that would probably turn violent or the damage done by your party at the reigns & remaining there?

caseyann

hobochris wrote: »

The real question is, which is worse for us the damage that would be done by protests that would probably turn violent or the damage done by your party at the reigns & remaining there?

When it is highly unlikely it will turn violent.Only the few scuffles and idiots who arent there for the right reasons.
I would say the latter sounds better.Make them see Ireland is not their toy box :mad:

Irish people are afraid.

scr123

hobochris wrote: »

The real question is, which is worse for us, the damage that would be done by protests that would probably turn violent or the damage done by your party at the reigns & remaining there?

News for you, dead people do not come back to life

mike kelly

Callan57 wrote: »

If the Bert is the answer then the question must be fairly stupid

These are desperate times. Each day ireland is losing credibility on the financial markets. Given that Charlie Haughey is no longer with us, Bertie is the only man who can save the country now.

hobochris

scr123 wrote: »

News for you, dead people do not come back to life

Not sure what you mean, Please elaborate?

bmaxi

mike kelly wrote: »

These are desperate times. Each day ireland is losing credibility on the financial markets. Given that Charlie Haughey is no longer with us, Bertie is the only man who can save the country now.

Now I know you're trolling.

Callan57

bmaxi wrote: »

Is it not remarkable though, that we can find time and temper to chuck eggs at Tony Blair, while Cowen et all remain egg free?

You said it .... as always the easy & simplistic option for us

mike kelly

scr123 wrote: »

Ireland is a democracy. I am a democrat. If us democrats do not see the government as suitable we wait for the next election and vote them out. We do not take to the streets because we know protests can become violent and these protests are usually led by people of a fanatical disposition. We democrats prefer the power of the ballot box as against the alternative which more often than not results in death and injury and usually to innocent people. Anytime between now and mid 2012 the people of Ireland will pass judgement on the present government and will pass judgement on those who believe they are the alternative government.

When I see calls for taking to the streets I instantly become fearful of a dangerous lunatic in our midst.

France is also a democracy but that does not stop people protesting. right now all the lunatics are in the dail so you will be quite safe

mike kelly

bmaxi wrote: »

Now I know you're trolling.

I'm quite serious. We need strong leadership. Who in the current Dail can provide that?

irishh_bob

mike kelly wrote: »

I'm quite serious. We need strong leadership. Who in the current Dail can provide that?

agree but bertie was a follower , not a leader

mike kelly

irishh_bob wrote: »

agree but bertie was a follower , not a leader

I see him as the best of a very bad lot

caseyann

mike kelly wrote: »

I see him as the best of a very bad lot

Bertie would sell you to gain

bamboozle

mike kelly wrote: »

I see him as the best of a very bad lot

????????

Annual expendite on public services in 2000 = 4 billion
Annual expenditure on public services in 2007 = 19 billion

thanks Bertie!

bmaxi

mike kelly wrote: »

I'm quite serious. We need strong leadership. Who in the current Dail can provide that?

Hitler was a strong leader, Kim Jong Il is a strong leader.
It's the path they lead you down that matters.

mike kelly

Ronald Regan and Thatcher were strong leaders. So was Roosevelt

bmaxi

mike kelly wrote: »

Ronald Regan and Thatcher were strong leaders. So was Roosevelt

Q.E.D.