Compulsory voting?

CountingCrows

Pardon my ignorance, but I just discovered that voting is compulsory in Australia. Can't think of any good reason why we don't have a similar system.

bluto63

And if you don't vote, what are the consequences? Cause I could see there being a few problems in compulsory voting

Xavi6

bluto63 wrote: »

And if you don't vote, what are the consequences? Cause I could see there being a few problems in compulsory voting

Fines at the very least, and if you don't pay them it's court, jail time etc. So I'm told anyway.

Easy way around it - just don't register.

CountingCrows

Xavi6 wrote: »

Easy way around it - just don't register.

Or just vote? You can always spoil it to register a protest

bluto63

I think it's a fairly bad idea, some people just don't believe in what they're voting for or don't know enough about the subject. Why should they have to come in and spoil their vote or else face fines? It's wasting their time and everyone elses

Mark200

CountingCrows wrote: »

Can't think of any good reason why we don't have a similar system.

Because then even more idiots would be voting

Xavi6

CountingCrows wrote: »

Or just vote? You can always spoil it to register a protest

But that involves the effort of having to go down to spoil it

AnonoBoy

bluto63 wrote: »

And if you don't vote, what are the consequences?

You have to vote twice in the next election. That's why the long-term non-voter is such a valuable market in Australian politics, they have loads stored up and can decide whole elections single-handedly.

IvyTheTerrible

The government would raise voter turn out a lot easier if they just made voting more convenient, like having voting over two days on the weekends.

I don't think voting should be compulsory. While i think it's silly not to use/spoil your vote, I think we have the right not to.

IvyTheTerrible

AnonoBoy wrote: »

You have to vote twice in the next election. That's why the long-term non-voter is such a valuable market in Australian politics, they have loads stored up and can decide whole elections single-handedly.

is that true? That's crazy!

It's a right but also privilege to vote and I think everyone should do it, however, it is your right to choose not to vote too and that right should not be taken away from anyone.

gerTheGreat

I've always felt that it's a civic responsibility to vote and like others have already said, you could spoil your vote if you were unsure what way to vote.

CountingCrows

Deleted User wrote: »

It's a right but also privilege to vote and I think everyone should do it, however, it is your right to choose not to vote too and that right should not be taken away from anyone.

Can't see the logic behind making the census compulsory but not voting?

The_Minister

If you don't know anything about politics, then you shouldn't vote.

Democracy is not improved by people getting elected because someone was forced to vote and put 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8... down the ballot paper.

IvyTheTerrible

CountingCrows wrote: »

Can't see the logic behind making the census compulsory but not voting?

Because in the census you're trying to get solid info on the entire country. If you don't take part, then the stats are worthless.

Voting counts the people that participate.

Prof.Badass

If you are not infomed come election time, it is your civic duty not to vote rather than make an ill-informed choice or vote for someone based on them having a funny name or large breasts ect.

Spoiling your vote is also just as good (and more fun ).

Krieg

Its a bad idea to implement it here id say.

Imagine the cost involved in finding people who didn't vote and fining them.
Id be curious about the specific penalty for not voting in Australia

CountingCrows

Krieg wrote: »

Id be curious about the specific penalty for not voting in Australia

Initially the Australian Electoral Commission will write to all apparent non-voters requesting that they either provide a reason for their failure to vote or pay a $20 penalty.

If, within 21 days, the apparent non-voter fails to reply, cannot provide a valid and sufficient reason or declines to pay the penalty, then prosecution proceedings may be instigated. If the matter is dealt with in court and the person is found guilty, he or she may be fined up to $50 plus court costs.

Lollipops23

I've always believed that if you choose not to vote you cannot complain about education, healthcare, unemployment, infrastructure, taxes, minimum wage and a whole host of other stuff that,let's face it, every one of us bitches about daily.

I also believe that it is not only your civic duty to vote, but also to educate yourself as much as possible about who and what you're voting for.

cooperguy

Compulsory voting is a terrible idea. Nothing worse than people who havent a clue what they are voting on making decisions for the country. If anything it should go the otherway and you should have to prove you have a basic knowledge of the issue you are voting on or people you are voting for before your allowed vote.

AckwelFoley

Its a privledge and a right in every democracy to have a vote.

Everyone should use it.

Im glad everyone doesnt.

Leixlip_Red

Krieg wrote: »

Its a bad idea to implement it here id say.

Imagine the cost involved in finding people who didn't vote and fining them.
Id be curious about the specific penalty for not voting in Australia

Some type of electronic voting system would work well... why hasn't anyone thought of it?

AckwelFoley

Lollipops23 wrote: »

I've always believed that if you choose not to vote you cannot complain about education, healthcare, unemployment, infrastructure, taxes, minimum wage and a whole host of other stuff that,let's face it, every one of us bitches about daily.

I also believe that it is not only your civic duty to vote, but also to educate yourself as much as possible about who and what you're voting for.

You can stand on a stool and preach that.

I can tell you something else for free, the "I wont vote - A sur there all corrupt" excuse doesnt cut it with me.

Dyr

The real problem is that the people who don't vote wouldn't be voting for the larger parties, especially Fianna Fail, if they were compelled to vote. The people who run this country don't like the idea of the great unwashed actually voting...would'nt look good for the banana republic if the majority of votes in an election were spoiled

mathie

IvyTheTerrible wrote: »

is that true? That's crazy!

Facicus Palmicus.

Riddle101

I don't think people should be forced to vote. It just seems to me like a disregard to demoracy since we don't have to freedom to choose. Also I don't think the Government would want to force people since if people didn't vote then they'd have to start looking for all the ones who didn't vote and if let's say 1,000,000 people didn't vote then it would be a real strain for them to track down all those voters. At the end of the day I don't think they're going to really concern themselves with enforcing compulsory voting.

AckwelFoley

Riddle101 wrote: »

I don't think people should be forced to vote. It just seems to me like a disregard to demoracy since we don't have to freedom to choose. Also I don't think the Government would want to force people since if people didn't vote then they'd have to start looking for all the ones who didn't vote and if let's say 1,000,000 people didn't vote then it would be a real strain for them to track down all those voters. At the end of the day I don't think they're going to really concern themselves with enforcing compulsory voting.

Not voting is a passive way of supporting the government.

I didnt vot for you, but i didnt vote against you either.

If we lived in a sh1thole of a country ruled by a dictator- we'd all want to vote

genericguy

Mark200 wrote: »

Because then even more idiots would be voting

yep, the fact that voting isn't compulsory keeps a lot of simpletons out of the polling booth.

fcuk you and your idiot supporters joe higgins!

Mr_Roger_Bongos

If voting was made compulsory in this country, Sinn Fein would get a MUCH bigger chunk of the votes.

citizen_p

tatll only make more stupid people vote on subjects they have no interest in

ScumLord

People should be free to not vote if they don't want to. It's their choice. It's always good to see how many people bothered to vote. If they where forced to vote you'd lose that.

Mike 1972

If voting were compulsary what would be acceptable excuses for not voting ?
e.g. Out of country/in another part of country on polling day. Sick, Berevement, Caring for sick relatives, no means of getting to polling station, (theyre not always within walking distance) detained in police custody, in hospital, kidnapped, insanity, death ?

And how much of your taxes/police time would you be willing to see spent on chasing up people who turn out to fall into one of the above categories

fizzynicenice

Lollipops23 wrote: »

I've always believed that if you choose not to vote you cannot complain about education, healthcare, unemployment, infrastructure, taxes, minimum wage and a whole host of other stuff that,let's face it, every one of us bitches about daily.

thats complete crap, once you pay your taxes you have every right to say whatever you want about it all.
This notion that failing to vote is wrong or unpatriotic has been spread for years by politicians looking for the undecided votes, and its horseshit.

argolis

I believe it would be a great thing for this country. In the existing system, you can't differentiate between the people not arsed and people abstaining. The government would be under a lot more pressure to perform if people under a new system could turn up and deliberately spoil their vote. It would be an international embarrassment to have a large chunk of votes spoiled in order to show a lack of faith in the entire political system. :mad:

As for people you don't want voting, some people will turn up and mark the card randomly because they haven't a bean, but statistically it should even out across all candidates (except for the one with hilarious names). Politicians will be quick enough to cotton onto a new segment of voters they previously didn't give a toss about. They would then be trying to win votes from, and working for, all segments of society instead of concentrating on the few current beneficiaries.

Australia hasn't fallen to pieces with everyone voting and I'm sure it has around the same number of idiots and nutters as we have. After all, a lot of them originated here :pac:

argolis

argolis wrote: »

I believe it would be a great thing for this country. In the existing system, you can't differentiate between the people not arsed and people abstaining. The government would be under a lot more pressure to perform if people under a new system could turn up and deliberately spoil their vote. It would be an international embarrassment to have a large chunk of votes spoiled in order to show a lack of faith in the entire political system. :mad:

So you think people should be forced to vote so as to internationally embarrass our country? That's intelligent.

Mr_Roger_Bongos

argolis wrote: »

I believe it would be a great thing for this country. In the existing system, you can't differentiate between the people not arsed and people abstaining. The government would be under a lot more pressure to perform if people under a new system could turn up and deliberately spoil their vote. It would be an international embarrassment to have a large chunk of votes spoiled in order to show a lack of faith in the entire political system. :mad:

As for people you don't want voting, some people will turn up and mark the card randomly because they haven't a bean, but statistically it should even out across all candidates (except for the one with hilarious names). Politicians will be quick enough to cotton onto a new segment of voters they previously didn't give a toss about. They would then be trying to win votes from, and working for, all segments of society instead of concentrating on the few current beneficiaries.

I'd agree with the above, it would simply be a matter of adding the preference 'None of the Above' below the candidate list, or 'abstain'.

It sounds ridiculous that people have to go to a polling station and exercise their right not to vote, but it would force the parties to make a more convincing argument one way or another. Plus to field strong candidates across all voting districts.

ANXIOUS

CountingCrows wrote: »

Pardon my ignorance, but I just discovered that voting is compulsory in Australia. Can't think of any good reason why we don't have a similar system.

We're you watching nothing to declare this afternoon? I just found out when they talked about it. Who said you don't learn stuff from tv.

Lollipops23

fizzynicenice wrote: »

thats complete crap, once you pay your taxes you have every right to say whatever you want about it all.
This notion that failing to vote is wrong or unpatriotic has been spread for years by politicians looking for the undecided votes, and its horseshit.

it's not "unpatriotic",you just veto your chance to voice your opinions regarding the country.

and regarding taxes; you're voting for the people who decide how high the taxes are and how they're spent.you can't complain if you didn't vote and the government decide to spend them on frivilous crap like manicures instead of school. you may not have voted for them but you didn't vote against them either.

Kev_ps3

There should be compulsory voting imo but only when ever political viewpoint is represented. I would rather pay a fine then vote for the current crop of political party's.

AckwelFoley

Kev_ps3 wrote: »

There should be compulsory voting imo but only when ever political viewpoint is represented. I would rather pay a fine then vote for the current crop of political party's.

Thats a utopia

Political ideals are as varied as opinions.

drkpower

fizzynicenice wrote: »

thats complete crap, once you pay your taxes you have every right to say whatever you want about it all.
This notion that failing to vote is wrong or unpatriotic has been spread for years by politicians looking for the undecided votes, and its horseshit.

Ah, I see, paying one's taxes is the pre-requisite to complaining.
So if you dont pay your taxes (unemployed, too low an income, stay at home mum etc..), do you not have a right to say whatever you like about it all.....?

cooperguy

fizzynicenice wrote: »

thats complete crap, once you pay your taxes you have every right to say whatever you want about it all.
This notion that failing to vote is wrong or unpatriotic has been spread for years by politicians looking for the undecided votes, and its horseshit.

Thats the crap im afraid unless you vote for an alternative or you voted for somebody and they didnt do what they promised then you cannot complain. They set the taxes too. Your endorsing how they are collected and spent without voting.

Kev_ps3

snyper wrote: »

Thats a utopia

Political ideals are as varied as opinions.

Im sure it could be done.

Jesus Wept

CountingCrows wrote: »

Pardon my ignorance, but I just discovered that voting is compulsory in Australia. Can't think of any good reason why we don't have a similar system.

You are pardoned.
It's an awful idea, people have the right to not vote and if voting was compulsory there had better be a none of the above/re-open nominations option or I'd go postal.

I wouldn't be forced to choose between a useless shower of cúnts.

wudangclan

i've never voted once in my 33 years.
i'm still trying to figure out the difference between fianna fail and fine gael.
i had a vague notion of voting for the green party but after seeing them abandoning their ideals as soon as getting into government they now merit my non-vote also.
i would accept a fine rather than vote in the case of compulsory voting.

drkpower

wudangclan wrote: »

i've never voted once in my 33 years.
i'm still trying to figure out the difference between fianna fail and fine gael.
i had a vague notion of voting for the green party but after seeing them abandoning their ideals as soon as getting into government they now merit my non-vote also.
i would accept a fine rather than vote in the case of compulsory voting.

By not voting all of these years, you have been giving about 70% of your support to FF and FG. Well done.

You might want to go and find out what seperates them given your overwhleming support for them over the past 2 decades.

wudangclan

drkpower wrote: »

By not voting all of these years, you have been giving about 70% of your support to FF and FG. Well done.

You might want to go and find out what seperates them given your overwhleming support for them over the past 2 decades.

i don't support any of them therefore i don't vote,thank you very much.
how did you figure the maths?

drkpower

wudangclan wrote: »

i don't support any of them therefore i don't vote,thank you very much.
how did you figure the maths?

You are giving FF-FG de facto support (approxiamtely 70% support, given the two parties' share of the vote over the last 15 years.) by not voting.

You may not intend to tacitly support them but that is what you have been doing.

Mrmoe

Voting should be made compulsory but you should be given the option of voting for none of the options on the list. Apathy and stupidity has got us to where we are now. Here is what I would do:

1. Compulsory voting.
2. Option on ballot paper to not vote for any of the politicians.
3. Voting over more than one day and for extended hours.
4. If you do not vote you will be denied social welfare, use of the health service, denied any official documentation of any sort, passport/drivers licence etc.
5. Allow people a half day from work to go and vote or alternatively they can still work and vote but receive half a days pay in lieu of a half day off.
6. A minimum number of polling stations per area/head of population to minimize delays/queues.
7. Abolition of Seanad Éireann
8. Direct election of An Taoiseach (This might lead to problems though).
9. Poster campaigning abolished/banned.
10. All people running for election will be required to submit a manifesto.
11. Ability of the public to recall a TD and hold a local election if enough petition signatures are received and verified.
12. Transport to be provide for the elderly/infirm or postal voting to be made more accessible.

wudangclan

well then they can continue to enjoy my support.

drkpower

wudangclan wrote: »

well then they can continue to enjoy my support.

That's fine, as long as you are happy to support those parties. I dont know why, but I got the impression that you may not actually support their policies and record.

Perhaps it was when you said that you couldnt "figure out the difference between fianna fail and fine gael".

Of course you are also supporting Sinn Fein a bit and, up until recently you were supporting the PDs a little also. But Im sure you are happy with that scenario also.