Should we pay carbon taxes?

GatePost

So to supposedly please the greenies who have the support of a massive 2.5% of the population, we are going to get a carbon tax.

Well I don't believe the hype about global warming.

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/damianthompson/100013173/the-bbcs-amazing-u-turn-on-climate-change/

bizmark

no

token56

I do not mind paying a carbon tax if there is a clear plan also outlined which details exactly how the money gained from this tax will be used to help develop green energy or sustainable energy sources, and create jobs in this sector etc. The development of this sector is important, however given the current economic climate and the exchequer returns I do not see it being used in this manner for the moment anyway.

So unless they can give us a detailed plan of how this will actually develop the sector and create jobs, and I do not mean an outline of a plan, before they implement the tax, then I will have to say no.

GatePost

Sorry, does anybody know where the comedy forum is, I just seen this video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w62gsctP2gc&feature=player_embedded#

thomond2006

/Awaits fart jokes.

Dyr

I think we should use the greens and their voters as a fuel source

thomond2006

Bambi wrote: »

I think we should use the greens and their voters as a fuel source

Yep, they're oily characters.

mikom

Bambi wrote: »

I think we should use the greens and their voters as a fuel source

Soylent greens if you like.

TheZohanS

GatePost wrote: »

Sorry, does anybody know where the comedy forum is, I just seen this video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w62gsctP2gc&feature=player_embedded#

Here you go.

themadchef

GatePost wrote: »

Well I don't believe the hype about global warming.

Yeah, bet you thought the bubble would never burst either.

Celtic tiger / global warming... "never going to happen" Sure...

GatePost

mikom wrote: »

Soylent greens if you like.

Good film.

There are benefits to global warming !! There should be a carbon subsidy
During the holocene optimum the temp was warmer than it is now. This was the warmest period since the ice age. The Sahara was green and forests in Russia extended 200km further North than they do now. A bad thing?

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2009/07/090731-green-sahara_2.html

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/Earth/Computer_simulations_reveal_three_green_Sahara_episodes_over_120000_years/rssarticleshow/3549438.cms

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn14536-stone-age-mass-graves-reveal-green-sahara.html?feedId=online-news_rss20

GatePost

themadchef wrote: »

Yeah, bet you thought the bubble would never burst either.

Celtic tiger / global warming... "never going to happen" Sure...

And what do speculative bubbles and global warming have to do with eachother??

Nothing new about people getting greedy

http://www.amazon.com/Extraordinary-Popular-Delusions-Madness-Crowds/dp/051788433X

twinytwo

GatePost wrote: »

So to supposedly please the greenies who have the support of a massive 2.5% of the population, we are going to get a carbon tax.

Well I don't believe the hype about global warming.

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/damianthompson/100013173/the-bbcs-amazing-u-turn-on-climate-change/

You can also find research thats says milk can cause cancer.

the fact is weather caused by man kind or not the planet is heating up... as clearly evident for example mountain peaks that have had snow on them constently for 100's of years up until now... i mean billions of tons of snow dosent just vanish for no reason... thats said the planet is also long over due another ice age.

bizmark

The planet always heats and cools its not a reason to get saddled with another tax / power grab by people who just wish to tell you how to live your life

GatePost

bizmark wrote: »

The planet always heats and cools its not a reason to get saddled with another tax / power grab by people who just wish to tell you how to live your life

"sir, we've got a live one"

twinytwo

Bambi wrote: »

I think we should use the greens and their voters as a fuel source

Problem is the greens lost any back bone they had and came up with some utter ****e just to stay in goverment i mean who would want to give up the gravey train that is the government.. all they have to do is complete one term and they get their nice fat pensions

GatePost

twinytwo wrote: »

You can also find research thats says milk can cause cancer.

the fact is weather caused by man kind or not the planet is heating up... as clearly evident for example mountain peaks that have had snow on them constently for 100's of years up until now... i mean billions of tons of snow dosent just vanish for no reason... thats said the planet is also long over due another ice age.

100's of years is nothing in the overall context of things.

The fact is that the earth is not warming, the IPCC have even admitted this and they are the drum beaters of the whole movement.

Blazer

I'd quite happily pay a carbon tax if I could burn the Green Party and their numbskull followers...lot of fúcking CH4 though but worth it

GatePost

twinytwo wrote: »

Problem is the greens lost any back bone they had and came up with some utter ****e just to stay in goverment i mean who would want to give up the gravey train that is the government.. all they have to do is complete one term and they get their nice fat pensions

Good point. I hear all these people saying, "the greenies are going to pull out of government".

Are you 'avin a laugh? The whole aim is to get into power, and yet the greenies are going to pull out, some chance, as we have seen.

8k2q1gfcz9s5d4

GatePost wrote: »

So to supposedly please the greenies who have the support of a massive 2.5% of the population, we are going to get a carbon tax.

Well I don't believe the hype about global warming.

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/damianthompson/100013173/the-bbcs-amazing-u-turn-on-climate-change/

we live in ireland, compared to china and the US our carbon contribution is nothing. why should we pay?

i dont believe in global warming either, its called "climate change" now because the warming has stopped.

GatePost

Jaelyn Freezing Snobbishness wrote: »

we live in ireland, compared to china and the US our carbon contribution is nothing. why should we pay?

But is this really about "climate change"??

Look at the effects of these taxes, it will de-industrialise the western world, along with crippling the developing nations. That is the ultimate aim, forget about all this "save the whales" stuff.

bizmark

GatePost wrote: »

But is this really about "climate change"??

Look at the effects of these taxes, it will de-industrialise the western world, along with crippling the developing nations. That is the ultimate aim, forget about all this "save the whales" stuff.

That will never happen though people will only tolerate this stuff till it effects them in their pocket and choice's which is fast approaching, The possibility of global cooling over the next few years will also open eye's plus for all their lip service and opportunity's to get more tax money governments aren't that self destructive nor would their people allow them to be...one would hope anyway

twinytwo

GatePost wrote: »

100's of years is nothing in the overall context of things.

The fact is that the earth is not warming, the IPCC have even admitted this and they are the drum beaters of the whole movement.

for example they all say that " CO2 is not a pollutant" it is not co2 we have to worry about but cfc's etc. Anyway there is evidence for and against global warming.. i however would rather we changed our ways thatnto not do anything and find out we are neck high in the doo doo

GavRedKing

Carbon tax = run out of ideas to charge us for something

walshb

Yes, Ireland is such a massive massive polluter with hundreds of sky scrapers illuminated every second of the day and million of homes with lights on every day.:rolleyes:

Our pollution contribution is next to zero and this is another loony policy from a
loony party

Climate change, global warming, how about plain Nature?

bizmark

twinytwo wrote: »

for example they all say that " CO2 is not a pollutant" it is not co2 we have to worry about but cfc's etc. Anyway there is evidence for and against global warming.. i however would rather we changed our ways thatnto not do anything and find out we are neck high in the doo doo

What utter nonsense we should totaly change the way we live now based on dodgy science, what might happen's , and the word of our religious leader al gore ? :rolleyes:

GatePost

bizmark wrote: »

That will never happen though people will only tolerate this stuff till it effects them in their pocket and choice's which is fast approaching,

I hope you are right. But remeber they are targeting the children at school, they are being taught environmentalism as a religion.

twinytwo wrote: »

i however would rather we changed our ways thatnto not do anything and find out we are neck high in the doo doo

I'll take my chances.

The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.
H. L. Mencken

gavredking wrote: »

Carbon tax = run out of ideas to charge us for something

There is a lot more to it than that.

twinytwo

bizmark wrote: »

What utter nonsense we should totaly change the way we live now based on dodgy science, what might happen's , and the word of our religious leader al gore ? :rolleyes:

when i say change are ways i mean our dependence on fossil fuels etc..there is no need for ignorance

bizmark

That's grand and all in theory but seeming that there's no reliable alternatives apart from nuclear power which is another massive bug bear for the green's taxing the balls off us now and trying to scare tactic us into installing god awful unreliable wind turbines and solar panels isn't going to do anything.

BTW I'm not against new tech to replace the current oil dependent but there's no alternative, In time when there's a real reason for it market force's and human ingenuity will produce one might be 30-50 year's down the road though seeming that oil is still cheap. In the end in my opinion a goverment trying to create make beleave demand will only end up as a failure costing us money.

twinytwo

bizmark wrote: »

That's grand and all in theory but seeming that there's no reliable alternatives apart from nuclear power which is another massive bug bear for the green's taxing the balls off us now and trying to scare tactic us into installing god awful unreliable wind turbines and solar panels isn't going to do anything.

BTW I'm not against new tech to replace the current oil dependent but there's no alternative, In time when there's a real reason for it market force's and human ingenuity will produce one might be 30-50 year's down the road though seeming that oil is still cheap

Ireland is one of the most ideal locations on the planet for wind farms... an investment of 1 billion euro which taking into account the amount given to the banks and to bail out the developers is not a huge amount would generate more than enough energy to meet the countries needs.. also considering wind turbines have a life span of 20-25 years i said that is an alternative option to going nuclear

Prof.Badass

We know that carbon dioxide is a greenhouse gas and we know that we're pumping ****loads of it into the atmosphere. It's a simple case of putting 2 and 2 together.

If you're going to deny this you belong in the CT forum.

That being said a carbon tax will do absolutely nothing to stop CO2 emmisions. It just means more money for the government. To stop global warming we'll need concrete physical solutions such as carbon traps, nuclear power and renewable energy. Not some bullshít tax.

twinytwo

vinylmesh wrote: »

We know that carbon dioxide is a greenhouse gas and we know that we're pumping ****loads of it into the atmosphere. It's a simple case of putting 2 and 2 together.

If you're going to deny this you belong in the CT forum.

That being said a carbon tax will do absolutely nothing to stop CO2 emmisions. It just means more money for the government. To stop global warming we'll need concrete physical solutions such as carbon traps, nuclear power and renewable energy. Not some bullshít tax.

its ireland.. we cant even manage our roads.. would i trust them with a nuclear power plant.... eh.. no

GatePost

vinylmesh wrote: »

We know that carbon dioxide is a greenhouse gas and we know that we're pumping ****loads of it into the atmosphere. It's a simple case of putting 2 and 2 together.

If you're going to deny this you belong in the CT forum.

It is all relative, and define "loads". And also break down the other greenhouse gases and their various % of the overall total.

vinylmesh wrote: »

That being said a carbon tax will do absolutely nothing to stop CO2 emmisions.

What is this. When you can't afford to fill the car up, or heat the house, it will stop emmissions.

POWER OF THE PURSE.

twinytwo

GatePost wrote: »

It is all relative, and define "loads". And also break down the other greenhouse gases and their various % of the overall total.



What is this. When you can't afford to fill the car up, or heat the house, it will stop emmissions.

POWER IF THE PURSE.

http://www.epa.gov/climatechange/emissions/globalghg.html

GatePost

twinytwo wrote: »

http://www.epa.gov/climatechange/emissions/globalghg.html

That is a trick.

What about the overall make up, not the emmissions.

Water vapour is by far the man green house gas.

bizmark

As of November 2007, the CO2 concentration in Earth's atmosphere was about 0.0384% by volume according to wiki

As for wind farms they are not effective you will need to build back up generators for the times theirs no bloody wind and i seriously doubt it will be possible to build enough of them really who wants a giant 20 ton spinning blade in their back yard? more than likely end up like dam's for future generations it can be a part of the energy to power our country but it will never be anything like 100% or even 10 me thinks

twinytwo

GatePost wrote: »

That is a trick.

What about the overall make up, not the emmissions.

Water vapour is by far the man green house gas.

Major Greenhouse Gas % of Greenhouse Effect Water vapor

36% to 66%

Water vapor & Cloud droplets

66% to 85%

Carbon dioxide

9% to 26%

Methane

4% to 9%

Ozone

3% to 7%

Prof.Badass

GatePost wrote: »

What is this. When you can't afford to fill the car up, or heat the house, it will stop emmissions.

POWER OF THE PURSE.

I don't think they'll ever raise taxes high enough to actually prohibit people from driving. By the time drivers are hit by this extreme tax, thousands of people too poor to afford cars will be forced to skimp on heating and whichever party promises to reverse the carbon tax will get voted in.

WeeBushy

GatePost wrote: »

What is this. When you can't afford to fill the car up, or heat the house, it will stop emmissions.

POWER OF THE PURSE.

I really don't think that's the point of carbon tax...

1. It will discourage people from using cars for unnessecary journeys (lazy w*ankers like myself might stop driving to the local shops) and promote the use of public transport. We will stop lashing on the heating for the craic and turn off lights that don't need to be on. etc etc

2. The money raised can then be used to promote/research greener energy sources.

twinytwo

WeeBushy wrote: »

I really don't think that's the point of carbon tax...

1. It will discourage people from using cars for unnessecary journeys (lazy w*ankers like myself might stop driving to the local shops) and promote the use of public transport. We will stop lashing on the heating for the craic and turn off lights that don't need to be on. etc etc

2. The money raised can then be used to promote/research greener energy sources.

Just like the money given to fas was supposed to benefit the people... before anything gets done in the country we need to remove the greed and corruption

thatsa spicy

Scaremongering about global warming is for times of economic security, when theres nothing else for us pathetic and weak-minded human beings to fcuking whinge about.
If it is actually the case that the greens are more concerned about the enviroment than the economy then they are very much out of touch.

How would a carbon tax even be implemented?

WeeBushy

twinytwo wrote: »

Just like the money given to fas was supposed to benefit the people... before anything gets done in the country we need to remove the greed and corruption

That's an argument against the current inept, corrupt government and their abilty (or lack there of) to govern, not the merits of carbon tax. Would you be against carbon tax if an honest, accountable government was in charge?

Min

There has been no global warming for the past 11 years, if anything we are heading into a period of global cooling.

WeeBushy

Min wrote: »

There has been no global warming for the past 11 years, if anything we are heading into a period of global cooling.

lol

AckwelFoley

we should have to pay no tax at all.

That would suit me fine.


Of course i would still insist on health care services, and other infrastructure services.

Min

WeeBushy wrote: »

lol

You can lol, on the BBC they say there has been no global warming for 11 years.....

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/8299079.stm

TheMorningLine

No we shouldnt pay