So I'm going to court..

Shaner125

At the very start of august I took responsibility for about €20-ish worth of weed an undercover garda found in our group at a music festival. The guards at the time were very neutral about the whole thing, they confiscated the weed, searched my tent and my belongings, took my details then went on their way. I'd asked them if they'd try to contact me in the near future (as I was going on holidays in a couple of days), and they said it probably wouldn't go any further than that.

So now, nearing the end of september, I come home from college to find my dad waiting for me. He tells me a garda car pulled into the house earlier and a guard came to post a letter through the door. He saw this as it was happening and went out to ask the guard what was up. The guard said he was just dropping a letter in, and when my dad said he didn't look like the usual postman and asked what it was about, the guard proceeded to open my letter and read it out to him. I was shocked when my dad gave me the letter and it said I was due in court in december charged with possession.

I'm pretty annoyed, and wondering a couple of things. Is a court appearance really the normal procedure when somebody is aprehended with a very small amount of cannabis? Also, I am 19 years old and quite annoyed that the guards didn't attempt to contact ME. My dad says the letter wasn't even sealed. I really expected them to be a little more discreet.. as an adult I feel it should be my choice whether or not to tell my parents about what happened.

Lastly (I know this is a long post, please bare with me), my dad knows a guard who is part of the drug-squad, and he has since contacted him trying to see if he can help me in any way. The guard has said that even with a small amount of drugs, since I'm being summoned to court there aer some pretty severe penalties I can suffer if I receive a conviction. Namely I will find it difficult to travel outside the EU, and it could give me problems when trying to get a job later. He advised that I get a solicitor to speak for me, and even offer to pay the court €500 to for there to be no conviction.. This all seems incredibly surreal to me, the most I'd imagined would happen to me if I got caught with such a small amount would be a slap on the wrist, maybe an adult caution. I have friends who have been caught for the same deal, or caught doing stupid/dangerous things while drunk, and they've never been fined or brought to court. Am I just getting a raw deal here? I apologise for the length of the post.. it's late and I'm venting a little bit.

R.D. aka MR.D

Thats awful! You were just unlucky I guess but technically that is the law and surely at 19 you realised that.

Any time i've had any drugs i knew the risk I was taking if caught. Yes a whole lot of people only get a slap on the wrists but there is always the possiblilty.

Definitly get a solicitor and do all that you can.
You will regret getting a crim record before very long especially if you have travelling ambitious.

i'm afraid all you can do is hope for the best and put it in the 'life experience' box. I feel for you OP it really is a crap situation to be in.
Everything always works out in the end, no matter how bad something seems now it'll get better. Just play the hand you've been dealt the best you can.

Dave!

Usually it's just a warning, but yes some people do get dragged into court.

Most people would say that for anything like this you should definitely hire a solicitor. They'll almost certainly get you off with a slap on the wrist, it's presumably your first offense, etc etc, and it always looks more like you're taking it seriously if you hire a solicitor rather than just go yourself.

Splash out the money on the solicitor and put your mind at ease. They've probably done it 100 times and know what to do.

FWIW I agree that it's pretty rough bringing you to court for such a little amount, and rather out of order opening the letter too.

BTW, is it normal for Gardai to deliver letters like that...? Seems a fierce waste of time Obviously you need to know you're being summoned, but I woulda thought they could outsource that sh*t

dcukhunter

I'm not fully sure but I thought it was against the law for anyone to open a letter if it wasn't addressed to them. For sure get a solicitor anyway and bring it up with them as well. It is a bit harsh to happen to you but it does happen to some people they try to make an example of them.

DigiGal

Jaysus I've been caught with way more and just got it taken off me...
Ridiculous..!

kjl

get your dad to ring the cop and it wont even go to court.

minidazzler

dcukhunter wrote: »

I'm not fully sure but I thought it was against the law for anyone to open a letter if it wasn't addressed to them. For sure get a solicitor anyway and bring it up with them as well. It is a bit harsh to happen to you but it does happen to some people they try to make an example of them.

The Letter is faxed to the Garda station and they probably put it in an envelope themselves. Guards regularily give summons' in person, however it technically shouldn't have been read out or opened for his father.

OP, any solicitor worth his salt will get you off on no conviction with maybe a small fine. But really it depends on the judge on the day you will most likely end up with a fine though.

Dress nice for court, there will be plenty of arsehole sham's in there so it will be nice for you to look remorseful.

Get a solicitor and if the judge asks you any questions speak back clearly and be respectful. Yes Judge, no Judge, I'm sorry judge it was my first time I'll never do it again.

He will know you are lying but they tend to like to hear it.

And when you are paying the fine or any solicitor fee's, get your friends to chip in if it was a group bag of weed, your taking the rap for it, they should at least cough up because it could have been anyone of them who had it.

LegacyUser

Was it oxygen? If its court in naas the judge there is a big anti-drug trumpeteer, almost to the point where he considers himself a celebrity on account of it. It doesn't matter if you only had one spliff, you'll be forking out a grand for this but will escape a criminal conviction by doing so.

Shaner125

R.D. aka MR.D wrote: »

Thats awful! You were just unlucky I guess but technically that is the law and surely at 19 you realised that.

I know, I guess I just didn't feel very vulnerable. I've known plenty of people who have been caught before with alot more than me, and nothing has happened to them.

dcukhunter wrote: »

I'm not fully sure but I thought it was against the law for anyone to open a letter if it wasn't addressed to them.

I thought so aswell.. I would reaaally have preferred to tell my dad myself, and not have him hear it from a guard at the doorstep, I'm so lucky my mother wasn't home.. she'd have died. I don't even know if my name was on the envelope, the fact that it wasn't sealed is worrying enough.

kjl wrote: »

get your dad to ring the cop and it wont even go to court.

He has already done so, and the guard has gotten back to him with the advice about the solicitor. The guard my dad knows, says he knows the guard in that arrested me, and he'll ring their station. But since it's already been processed and I've been given a court date, it's pretty unlikely I'll be able to get out of it.

minidazzler wrote: »

And when you are paying the fine or any solicitor fee's, get your friends to chip in if it was a group bag of weed, your taking the rap for it, they should at least cough up because it could have been anyone of them who had it.

The situation basically was, my group of friends asked me to get some for the festival. I was able to get a bag a few days before, and we'd had some then. We had less than half of it left going to the festival, and when we were caught, it was actually a friend of mine's girlfriend that had the joint in her hand. I felt responsible for 'supplying' it, so when the guard asked who owned it and nobody answered, I told them it was mine. The girl was only 17, and she would really have gotten in **** with her parents if she was caught on this one. At the time I didn't feel I was making a big sacrifice as I really didn't think it would reach court.. guess I was wrong there. I've told a couple of my friends what's happened but unless they offer I'd feel pretty weird asking them to pitch in.

unreg240909 wrote: »

Was it oxygen? If its court in naas the judge there is a big anti-drug trumpeteer, almost to the point where he considers himself a celebrity on account of it. It doesn't matter if you only had one spliff, you'll be forking out a grand for this but will escape a criminal conviction by doing so.

This was the castlepolooza festival in tullamore. I've actually been summoned to the courthouse in tullamore, hopefully the judge there isn't such a big anti-drug trumpeteer.

kayos

So the guard came to your home to serve a summons on you and then gave it to your father? So in other words the guard never served the summons on you?

Being caught for as little as a gram can bring pain and is against the law. BUt honestly you would think they have better things to be doing in court than trying to convict someone for having a tiny amount of a relatively harmless drug.

Christ if you were caught coming back from Amsterdam in a UK airport with more than you had they just take it and give you a wrist slap.

LegacyUser

Heya Shane!

I've had to go to court a few times for reckless behaviour when I was younger so I can help you out. First thing to do is relax

O.K so essentially you will be called to the district court where they deal with small matters mainly public order offences. Just so you know you will be in a full courthouse and the judge reads peoples names one by one and you walk in front of the judge (Do not miss your call up!) You don't need to get a lawyer in advance as there are lawyers hanging around that defend anyone that asks in the district court and the best thing is you can apply for your money back. Now for small posession of cannabis you will more than likely be asked to simply pay some money into the poor box so bring money! (it can be anywhere between 50-250euros) It is highly likely the arresting garda will not show up and in that case the judge will not give you a conviction (your lawyer should get it struck out)


DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES MISS YOUR CALL UP BECAUSE THE COURT WILL SIMPLY CARRY ON, I MISSED MINE AND HAD A WARRANT OUT FOR MY ARREST (MY FIRST TIME IN COURT AND REALLY DIDNT UNDERSTAND THE DEALINGS) BASICALLY 2 MONTHS LATER THE GUARDS TURNED UP AT THE HOUSE AND ARRESTED ME ALONG WITH ALL THE OTHER WARRANTS AROUND DUBLIN CITY AND I WAS PUT IN A HOLDING CELL WITH COMPLETE AND UTTER SCUMBAGS FOR THE WHOLE DAY WHILE THE COURT WAS TRYING TO GET THROUGH THE BACKLOG, YOU DO NOT WANT THIS SO LISTEN VERY CAREFULLY FOR YOUR CALL UP!)

grahamr

Just have to say that is so $hitty. This kind of stuff does the guards no favours.
He shouldn’t have done anything for such a small amount, I think there are bigger fish to fry then a few lads having a spliff at a festival.
Have they nothing better to do? Well yes the do! But the guards would far rather deal with the easy option of slapping fines on some harmless guys then chasing little scumbags driving around a field in a stolen car.

Best of luck in court mate hope the Judge has a bit more sense

G

JonathanAnon

I wouldnt be worried about this at all. Just go to court, dont bother with a solicitor, just apologise and they will probably just give you a fine. And hold your head up high in court, you have nothing to be ashamed of.

The guards do nothing about serious criminals and it's a good lesson for you at an early age as to how the wheels of "justice" actually turn in this country. It's really just an money making exercise, and dont believe that the guards are really there to protect and serve. They are there to protect and serve their own interests.

Penn

grahamr wrote: »

Just have to say that is so $hitty. This kind of stuff does the guards no favours.
He shouldn’t have done anything for such a small amount, I think there are bigger fish to fry then a few lads having a spliff at a festival.
Have they nothing better to do? Well yes the do! But the guards would far rather deal with the easy option of slapping fines on some harmless guys then chasing little scumbags driving around a field in a stolen car.

Best of luck in court mate hope the Judge has a bit more sense

G

Unless the guards actually knew some people were driving around a field in a stolen car at that point, what do you expect them to do? They saw someone breaking the law, and is punishing them for it. Regardless of how minor the crime was, it was likely the only crime the guards saw at that point, so they had to act.

OP, the important thing is to remain calm and just handle it like an adult. If it does get to court, dress smart and answer politely. The fact you are nervous about the consequences will show the judge that you're not the typical scumbag that they probably see every other week. You were caught with a small amount, and the punishment will likely reflect that. Just get a good lawyer or whatever and do what they say.

I agree though that the letter being read to your father is very odd, although your father likely would have opened it anyway if it was addressed to you and a guard dropped it off personally. Most parents would probably do the same

Sonderval

While understandably surreal, you *did* break the law by taking possession of illegal drugs. Your going to have to take your knocks and now and hopefully be more aware of the consequences of your actions going forward.

Terodil

Sonderval wrote: »

While understandably surreal, you *did* break the law by taking possession of illegal drugs. Your going to have to take your knocks and now and hopefully be more aware of the consequences of your actions going forward.

+1M.

I fail to understand what the personal issue is here.

- You broke the law.
- You got summoned.
- There are some irregularities about the summons -- so what, if you feel your rights have been infringed upon, then talk to a solicitor -- might be helpful in any case

You're an adult, you bear the consequences of your actions. End of, IMO.

Shaner125

kayos wrote: »

Christ if you were caught coming back from Amsterdam in a UK airport with more than you had they just take it and give you a wrist slap.

Well, that makes me feel better

beentheremate wrote: »

Heya Shane!

I've had to go to court a few times for reckless behaviour when I was younger so I can help you out. First thing to do is relax

O.K so essentially you will be called to the district court where they deal with small matters mainly public order offences. Just so you know you will be in a full courthouse and the judge reads peoples names one by one and you walk in front of the judge (Do not miss your call up!) You don't need to get a lawyer in advance as there are lawyers hanging around that defend anyone that asks in the district court and the best thing is you can apply for your money back. Now for small posession of cannabis you will more than likely be asked to simply pay some money into the poor box so bring money! (it can be anywhere between 50-250euros) It is highly likely the arresting garda will not show up and in that case the judge will not give you a conviction (your lawyer should get it struck out)


DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES MISS YOUR CALL UP BECAUSE THE COURT WILL SIMPLY CARRY ON, I MISSED MINE AND HAD A WARRANT OUT FOR MY ARREST (MY FIRST TIME IN COURT AND REALLY DIDNT UNDERSTAND THE DEALINGS) BASICALLY 2 MONTHS LATER THE GUARDS TURNED UP AT THE HOUSE AND ARRESTED ME ALONG WITH ALL THE OTHER WARRANTS AROUND DUBLIN CITY AND I WAS PUT IN A HOLDING CELL WITH COMPLETE AND UTTER SCUMBAGS FOR THE WHOLE DAY WHILE THE COURT WAS TRYING TO GET THROUGH THE BACKLOG, YOU DO NOT WANT THIS SO LISTEN VERY CAREFULLY FOR YOUR CALL UP!)

Thank you, very helpful advice.

grahamr wrote: »

Just have to say that is so $hitty. This kind of stuff does the guards no favours.
He shouldn’t have done anything for such a small amount, I think there are bigger fish to fry then a few lads having a spliff at a festival.
Have they nothing better to do? Well yes the do! But the guards would far rather deal with the easy option of slapping fines on some harmless guys then chasing little scumbags driving around a field in a stolen car.

Best of luck in court mate hope the Judge has a bit more sense
G

While I wish I'd received lighter punishment, this isn't a garda hate thread.. They're doing the job the were assigned to do (attend the festival and sniff out drugs/ keep the peace) and I was unlucky enough to get stung. Thanks for the reply and wishing me luck though, hopefully I don't need it.

JonathanAnon wrote: »

I wouldnt be worried about this at all. Just go to court, dont bother with a solicitor, just apologise and they will probably just give you a fine. And hold your head up high in court, you have nothing to be ashamed of.

The guards do nothing about serious criminals and it's a good lesson for you at an early age as to how the wheels of "justice" actually turn in this country. It's really just an money making exercise, and dont believe that the guards are really there to protect and serve. They are there to protect and serve their own interests.

The only thing I'm ashamed about it upsetting my mother. I'm not a big cannabis smoker at all, but I do view it as a relatively harmless drug. As for not getting a solicitor, I'd love to save that cash.. but I'd REALLY kick myself if I ended up getting a conviction.. it's worth getting one just to be sure, or at least to know I did everything I could.

paddyirishman85 wrote: »

OP, the important thing is to remain calm and just handle it like an adult. If it does get to court, dress smart and answer politely. The fact you are nervous about the consequences will show the judge that you're not the typical scumbag that they probably see every other week. You were caught with a small amount, and the punishment will likely reflect that. Just get a good lawyer or whatever and do what they say.

I agree though that the letter being read to your father is very odd, although your father likely would have opened it anyway if it was addressed to you and a guard dropped it off personally. Most parents would probably do the same

Thank you for the advice. I agree that my dad probably would have opened it. For all I know he could have made up the part about the guard reading it for him, which is one of the reasons I mentioned it..

Sonderval wrote: »

While understandably surreal, you *did* break the law by taking possession of illegal drugs. Your going to have to take your knocks and now and hopefully be more aware of the consequences of your actions going forward.

Well it's certainly brought me down to earth.. I just hope one of these knocks doesn't come in the form of a conviction.

Shaner125

Terodil wrote: »

+1M.

I fail to understand what the personal issue is here.

- You broke the law.
- You got summoned.
- There are some irregularities about the summons -- so what, if you feel your rights have been infringed upon, then talk to a solicitor -- might be helpful in any case

You're an adult, you bear the consequences of your actions. End of, IMO.

First off, I'm sorry this thread has annoyed you, I'm not so familiar to boards.ie so I posted in the most relevant forum I could find. This is the first time I've ever been in the deep end and I thought I'd see what information I could get from anybody here. I did feel there was irregularities about my summons, so I wanted to know what other people thought, and if it is worth bringing up later.

I'm already glad I wrote this thread, it has helped clear my head when yesterday it was just a jumble of randomn thoughts and anxieties.

BumbleB

I've twice done jury duty and just to let you know be very well prepared mentally, the barristers will attempt to rip you to shreds and always face the judge when addressing him, Play the game ,put on a show, pretend your in hollywood, act repentant,it's been an embassement to you and your family and,since it happened you've realised the errors of your way and you should be fine .






I wish you the very best of luck with everything.

Sleipnir

BumbleB wrote: »

I've twice done jury duty and just to let you know be very well prepared mentally, the barristers will attempt to rip you to shreds and always face the judge when addressing him,

There won't be a jury, especially as the OP admitted the crime.

obladee

I feel for you. All you can do is get a solicitor and hope it all goes as well as possible.

The whole situation is retarded. Usually i find the Gardi to be quite reasonable but not so here.

Amazed there have not been more "you reap what you sow" posters.


Good Luck

spongeman

That guard needs retraining, clogging up the courts where a warning would be suffice.

They must be afraid to go after the real pushers.

LegacyUser

kjl wrote: »

get your dad to ring the cop and it wont even go to court.

Agree with above comment, exact same thing happened me as happened you to a tee. Got caught with 20 quids worth at the time, thought nothing would come of it, came home from college 2 months later with both parents sitting in the kitchen glaring at me, police dropped letter to house and they opened it!!..not good

anyway Dads cousin was good mates with a detective so it all disappeared..scared the sh*te out of me to be honest, considering i knew guys getting caught with alot more at the time and nothing happening to them, they were even laughing at me over it!..

anyway get your Dad on the case, last thing you want is that stuck on your record

Sonderval

That guard needs retraining, clogging up the courts where a warning would be suffice.

They must be afraid to go after the real pushers.

The guard did his duty, enforced the law as it has been set out by our society. He does not need 'retraining' - law should be enforced at every level of society otherwise your sitting on a situation where one level of our country can deteriorate into a lawless state.

To the OP, hope the court case goes well for you, theres some good advice in the thread - I think if your smart and lucky you should escape a conviction, but let this be a lesson for you (and don't do anything as silly as what you did again).

Boskowski

Shaner125 wrote: »

First off, I'm sorry this thread has annoyed you...

Never mind him. You always get that kind of rabble, the 'serves you right' fraction if you like. Why would you apologize even?

Of course it's a personal issue as you're distraught over it and like you said just exchanging opinions and being made aware of what to do and what not to do has helped you a lot even for your peace of mind. I mean it's not that you're saying you've been treated wrongly or that you're looking for legal advice or something.

By the way, reading the summons out to your father is totally out of order if not plain illegal and I would seek legal advice on that bit for sure.

paperclip2

realcam wrote: »

Never mind him. You always get that kind of rabble, the 'serves you right' fraction if you like. Why would you apologize even?

:rolleyes:
Take that attitude with the judge and see just how far you go. Shaner125 a bit of remorse is good thing under the circumstances. The judge will be looking for it.

Boskowski

paperclip2 wrote: »

:rolleyes:
Take that attitude with the judge and see just how far you go. Shaner125 a bit of remorse is good thing under the circumstances. The judge will be looking for it.

I'm referring to post #16 not to how he should behave in front of the judge...

LegacyUser

BumbleB wrote: »

I've twice done jury duty and just to let you know be very well prepared mentally, the barristers will attempt to rip you to shreds and always face the judge when addressing him, Play the game ,put on a show, pretend your in hollywood, act repentant,it's been an embassement to you and your family and,since it happened you've realised the errors of your way and you should be fine .






I wish you the very best of luck with everything.

He'll be in district court, there won't be any prosecuting barristers or a jury. The offence will be read out and if the garda turns up (unlikely) the garda might say a few words. It's between the judge and the defendant.

OP to be honest I disagree with this advice, let your solicitor do the talking. Your solicitor will mention how you come from a good family, are in third level education etc. and the judge will factor all of this in and be lenient.

skooterblue

You know the fire triangle? Air, heat, fuel, Remove one and the Triangle collapses. Where did you think Festival drugs and Cops were a good idea. Why did think accepting responsibility for someone else drugs would be good idea?

minidazzler wrote: »

The Letter is faxed to the Garda station and they probably put it in an envelope themselves. Guards regularily give summons' in person, however it technically shouldn't have been read out or opened for his father.

OP, any solicitor worth his salt will get you off on no conviction with maybe a small fine. But really it depends on the judge on the day you will most likely end up with a fine though.

Dress nice for court, there will be plenty of arsehole sham's in there so it will be nice for you to look remorseful.

Get a solicitor and if the judge asks you any questions speak back clearly and be respectful. Yes Judge, no Judge, I'm sorry judge it was my first time I'll never do it again.

He will know you are lying but they tend to like to hear it.

And when you are paying the fine or any solicitor fee's, get your friends to chip in if it was a group bag of weed, your taking the rap for it, they should at least cough up because it could have been anyone of them who had it.

You think of making a complaint because the letter wasn't sealed, it wouldnt even raise an eyebrow with the judge. In fact your parent's opening it is between you and them. If you value your name get a solicitor, you will get creamed you and you with no understanding of law will be defenceless.

beentheremate wrote: »

OP to be honest I disagree with this advice, let your solicitor do the talking. Your solicitor will mention how you come from a good family, are in third level education etc. and the judge will factor all of this in and be lenient.

Too right dont try defend yourself or your actions. You will just end up looking like an arrogant prick.

Lastly You took responsibilites for someone else actions, Did they thank you for it?
When were not warned about the legal implications of the possessions of drugs?
You were caught with an Illegal substance, in a place crawling with Cops, and took responsibility for it: Didn't Alarms start ringing at any time?

MyPeopleDrankTheSoup

What the fcuk were you doing admitting you owned the weed?! Just always keep your mouth shut, you can't incriminate yourself by saying nothing.

I know this is no help, sorry!

juke

OP - get legal advice.

You're young. If there's any possibility you'll want to get a visa to work in the future, in the US, Canada for example, a conviction like this (even if the conviction is just the probation act) could be a problem.

Shaner125

skooterblue wrote: »

Where did you think Festival drugs and Cops were a good idea. Why did think accepting responsibility for someone else drugs would be good idea?

I wasn't really thinking at the time to be honest.. we got ambushed the guards and before anybody had a chance to think he was saying somebody had to take responsibility for it.. The weed wasn't somebody else's, it was as much mine as it was anyones.. I felt I had to say it was mine, as it was me who got it in the first place.

You think of making a complaint because the letter wasn't sealed, it wouldnt even raise an eyebrow with the judge. In fact your parent's opening it is between you and them. If you value your name get a solicitor, you will get creamed you and you with no understanding of law will be defenceless.

My parents didn't open the letter, the guard opened it and read it to my dad.

Lastly You took responsibilites for someone else actions, Did they thank you for it?

Numerous times.. I've spoken to my friends since and they all feel terrible, and are willing to split all legal costs + fines.

When were not warned about the legal implications of the possessions of drugs?

Not entirely sure what your question is here..

You were caught with an Illegal substance, in a place crawling with Cops, and took responsibility for it: Didn't Alarms start ringing at any time?

It's very easy for me to look back and think of all the things I'd do differently if given the chance.. I wish things hadn't gone the way they had, but there's no helping that, so I'm now looking forward, and proactively trying to sort this court appearance in my head, which making this thread has really helped in doing.

.

Splendour

Hey Shaner,

my niece was in similar position you're in last year; guards called to the house with summons etc.(Altough in her case the envelope was sealed) Anyway, she went to court and was merely given a fine. TBH, I don't think convictions are given for possession of a bit of weed.

LegacyUser

Splendour wrote: »

Hey Shaner,

my niece was in similar position you're in last year; guards called to the house with summons etc.(Altough in her case the envelope was sealed) Anyway, she went to court and was merely given a fine. TBH, I don't think convictions are given for possession of a bit of weed.

If your niece was fined, that means she was convicted. A conviction on someone's record can have a lot of adverse consequences. entry in to other countries, jobs in the public service and others. Sometimes with small amounts of cannabis, judges can be persuaded to use the poor box mechanism as an alternative to recording a conviction.

spongeman

Sonderval wrote: »

The guard did his duty, enforced the law as it has been set out by our society. He does not need 'retraining' - law should be enforced at every level of society otherwise your sitting on a situation where one level of our country can deteriorate into a lawless state.

To the OP, hope the court case goes well for you, theres some good advice in the thread - I think if your smart and lucky you should escape a conviction, but let this be a lesson for you (and don't do anything as silly as what you did again).

He does need retraining and that young lad should have been sent packing with just a warning.

I am fully confident that the Judge will give him a slap on the wrist, Its nothing to do with being lucky.

Judges are better judges of character than the police.

LegacyUser

I have a similar conviction for a pitiful amount of cannabis (2 grams, I **** you not, a UAE amount imo) which in hindsight I should have fought tooth and nail to avoid as I believe I wasn't guilty under law. I'm 90% sure I would have won it but I was young and stupid and didn't want to involve my parents. My advice is to fight it if you believe you have a case.

I've travelled to certain areas outside the EU on multiple occasions, including getting a work visa, with no comeback whatsoever. I understand that relatively minor offences such as these are highly unlikely to ever come back to haunt you in these cases. Seemingly minor disorder offences involving violence and/or drunkenness might but for some reason non-custodial personal drugs offences are often overlooked. Bill Clinton, Barack Obama have admitted taking small personal amounts of drugs and George Bush is alleged to have taken drugs. I'm hoping authorities in some states take a common sense approach to similar offenders (that said, not filling out any forms accurately can always result in getting you in trouble).

<snip - take it to ranting & raving please >

That said, it hasn't hindered me in my employment or travelling (yet), let's hope this South American common sense revolution reaches here before long.

CDfm

OP - you got caught.

I have no real sympathy and you being embarressed in front of your ma is very touching.

Do get a solicitor and a good one as it is a criminal issue and a conviction stays on your record and can affect you in later life especially visa applications and career options.These can be far reaching and affect

There are specialist solicitors that deal with certain types of cases , some drink driving others drugs and who know the law and proceeedures for certain crimes. As for getting you off on a technicality that is your best bet. If a garda cautioned you and led you to believe that he was cautioning you may have some mileage. So find a specialist solicitor.

The costs will be fairly steep so maybe you need to start job hunting to pay for this as it is much an investment in your future as your college course.

Welcome to Grown Up Land.

jeckle

Terodil wrote: »

I fail to understand what the personal issue is here.

->The OP feels that he has let his parents down.
->The OP is 19 years of age & feels apprehensive about a forthcoming court appearance.
->The OP doesn’t quite know what to expect & reached out via this forum for any advice that people might have.
->The OP is concerned that he will have a conviction on his name & is worried that this may affect his entire future.
->The OP is confused as to why on the one hand he was treated like a child with regard to his father being served his summons, but yet is being treated like an adult with regard to a court appearance.

It seems to me that there are more than enough personal issues there

He has made a silly mistake. He knows he was in the wrong. It sounds as if he has learnt from his mistake, which, when all is said & done is what really matters.

Luckily he has been given some very sound advice here & I applaud him for being forthright about what he has done. At least he is not burying his head in the sand about the entire situation, which many of his age would be prone to do.

Most people have a skeleton in their cupboard, or make a silly mistake at some stage of their lives.

I wish him all the best.

skooterblue

Shaner125 wrote: »

.

[quote=[Deleted User];62278878]And again just to point out the fact the gard read the summons to the OPs father. Just to put it in perspective, if the OPs father had done something and the gard met OP in the driveway and read the summons out? Or read it out to a neighbour etc. I mean OPs over 18 I assume so with all due respect and apart from the fact it will probably be his father paying for the solicitor WTF has it to do with the father? Id like to know what a solicitor says about this part.[/QUOTE]

I Think the letter wasn't seal and the OP's father got suspicious and opened it. I dont believe a Guard would read it aloud to the Op's father. Yes the letter should have been sealed but it wouldn't make a bit of difference to the Judge, in fact he may look at it as you are wasting his time.


Quote:
Originally Posted by skooterblue View Post
Where did you think Festival drugs and Cops were a good idea. Why did think accepting responsibility for someone else drugs would be good idea?

I wasn't really thinking at the time to be honest.. we got ambushed the guards and before anybody had a chance to think he was saying somebody had to take responsibility for it.. The weed wasn't somebody else's, it was as much mine as it was anyones.. I felt I had to say it was mine, as it was me who got it in the first place.

Lastly You took responsibilites for someone else actions, Did they thank you for it?

Numerous times.. I've spoken to my friends since and they all feel terrible, and are willing to split all legal costs + fines.

When were not warned about the legal implications of the possessions of drugs?

Not entirely sure what your question is here..

You were caught with an Illegal substance, in a place crawling with Cops, and took responsibility for it: Didn't Alarms start ringing at any time?

It's very easy for me to look back and think of all the things I'd do differently if given the chance.. I wish things hadn't gone the way they had, but there's no helping that, so I'm now looking forward, and proactively trying to sort this court appearance in my head, which making this thread has really helped in doing.
.

Friends feeling sorry wouldnt help you when you are filling out an application form and they ask have you ever been convicted of a crime. On the other hand I work with one person who is a convicted Murderer and another a serial killer (South African Army), who makes no apologies. What do you really think your "friends" think? if it was your friend who got caught what would you think? "Poor X, got caught with a fine and legal fees and conviction that will follow him" or "Thanks be to god that wasnt me". I know if one of my friends were caught it would be the first one that would spring to mind.

Did any one sit you down and say to you if you take drugs you may get addicted. If you get addicted you may have a hard time getting off them, legal or other wise (I know from experience, legally perscribed I may add). Sorry If I sound pissed off cos I lived with stoners and have had stuff robbed by them. I think a little brush with Johnny Law will alter your perspective.

CDfm

skooterblue wrote: »

I Think the letter wasn't seal and the OP's father got suspicious and opened it. I dont believe a Guard would read it aloud to the Op's father. Yes the letter should have been sealed but it wouldn't make a bit of difference to the Judge, in fact he may look at it as you are wasting his time.

Like it or not the justice system is public. The OP got caught and I wonder why they picked on him for the search. In Ireland the guards only search for a reason.

I would think the Dad got curious and worried and the Guard ended up explaining the summons to him.

jeepers101

Splendour wrote: »

Hey Shaner,

my niece was in similar position you're in last year; guards called to the house with summons etc.(Altough in her case the envelope was sealed) Anyway, she went to court and was merely given a fine. TBH, I don't think convictions are given for possession of a bit of weed.

A fine is a conviction, unless its called a 'donation to the charity box'.

Shaner, I was in the same situation as you back in 2002. I was caught with less than half an ounce. Ended up in court eight months later, I was terrified of getting a conviction. Didn't get a solicitor (for reasons I don't have time to go in to), got convicted and fined about a hundred euro. Since then I've done a bit of research on convictions and for one as small as you're facing, it has no big implications. It won't ruin any job prospects or travel prospects (unless you're looking for a visa, in which case it will be tougher but not impossible to get one). Furthermore, convictions can now be wiped from your record after seven years if you do not re offend.

My advice is to firstly, if you have connections with the Gardaí, try and make sure the arresting Garda doesn't turn up, plead not guilty and it will be thrown out. If that fails, don't worry too much about the conviction, the prospect of having one is a lot harder to deal with than actually having one.

Best of luck!

CDfm

Some countries do take convictions seriously for visa purposes and the public service and some occupations etc do check convictions.

Certainly some visa applications ask for details of criminal convictions so its self disclosure and if there are career plans and travel plans like even a J1 Visa these can be affected.The OP would be better trying to get the judge to dismiss the charge in return for a charitable contribution.

This is the real world.

LegacyUser

CDfm wrote: »

Some countries do take convictions seriously for visa purposes and the public service and some occupations etc do check convictions.

Certainly some visa applications ask for details of criminal convictions so its self disclosure and if there are career plans and travel plans like even a J1 Visa these can be affected.The OP would be better trying to get the judge to dismiss the charge in return for a charitable contribution.

This is the real world.

Yeah and your not living in it. I have a minor drug conviction and have gotten a working visa to Australia, have been to America numerous times and have even travelled to Dubai (UAE) with absolutely no problems. Something as minor as what the OP has simply won't come up. They are looking for people who have actually been incarcerated not those who got a fine for a minor offence.

Clueless09

Terodil wrote: »

+1M.

I fail to understand what the personal issue is here.

- You broke the law.
- You got summoned.
- There are some irregularities about the summons -- so what, if you feel your rights have been infringed upon, then talk to a solicitor -- might be helpful in any case

You're an adult, you bear the consequences of your actions. End of, IMO.

So helpful both of you. Bear in mind, 19 maybe technically an adult but they lack life experience. OP-i hope everything works out for you. It is very harsh, i know people who have got off drink driving cause they have friends who are guards-system is a joke

hullaballoo

Surely everyone knows at this stage that the DS get their full quota of convictions and then some from festival seizures? If you're going to smoke drugs, don't do it at Oxegen/EP/whatever.

Unfortunately, OP, the DS will not just let this go because this is bread-and-butter stuff for them. Festivals are how they earn their crumbs. They'll push for a conviction and the only thing you can do is get legal representation who will hopefully be able to argue that a donation is more appropriate in your circumstances.

A couple items of misinformation have been thrown around here, so I want to clear them up:

1. There are no "irregularities" with the summons. Forget about that. Even if the Garda came to your house, beat you around the head and fed you the summons, you still got the summons and for the court, that's what matters. There are only a few grounds on which you can contest a summons and some bland story about your dad reading it before you is not one of them. Seriously, forget about it.

2. A fine IS a conviction. A fine is different from a donation to the poor box. You can only be fined on foot of a conviction.

3. If you have no previous convictions, the court MIGHT feel you are entitled to the benefit of the Probation Act. That can mean that (a) you don't get a record, or (b) you do get a record, depending on the court's view of things. It is more likely, in these circumstances that you will not get a criminal record and will simply face a donation to the poor box.

If you are courteous, polite, visibly shaken and sorry for what you did, you have a better chance. If you go in head-strong and telling the judge that the summons was all wrong, you'll end up getting more than you should.

Cliff notes: get a solicitor; don't ask for legal advice on the Internet; don't believe anyone who tells you what will happen to you - unless they can see the future, how the fukk would they know; don't be cocky about this, and; DON'T BRING DRUGS TO FESTIVALS.

Shaner125

Thanks for the replies guys. I'm just going to get a solicitor, forget about the summons, and make sure we do everything we can to grant me a charitable donation instead of a fine. As for legal costs I've been saving for a good while now to buy something, it hurts but there's no way I'm asking my parents to pay for any of this.. My family have just recently booked a holiday to Dubai in which I'm included, hope that isn't affected if I'm given a fine..

LegacyUser

[quote=[Deleted User];62272394]A fine does not mean a conviction. You can be given a fine, or ordered to make a donation to charity etc but you dont get a conviction unless the judge says so. They do it all the time, 100euro fine no conviction?[/QUOTE]

Judges never do that because they can't. A fine is a punishment. A punishment can only be imposed upon conviction. What is sometimes done is the judge says "if x amount is paid to charity", I will not convict. There is thus no fine.

CDfm

The difference is that the OP has something to loose a bit greater and is expected to obey the law. The consequences of a conviction are therefore greater.

jeepers101

[quote=[Deleted User];62284343]I could swear a hole through a bucket the last time I saw someone in court for drugs, was a young lad with 4 "oner bags" of cocaine. He said they were "50" bags and that he was going through a tough time, his mother had cancer etc etc he had been to rehab and the judge said 400 euro fine, no conviction. Now I could be wrong but I am almost sure thats what happened, he defo got no conviction. It was quite obvious the lad was dealing, but he pleaded guilty to possesion, not guilty to possesion with intent to supply and it worked. Some times the judges need a slap around the ear. Bit of a tangent but maybe someone can clear it up.[/QUOTE]

To reiterate what has been said more than once, A FINE IS A CONVICTION, no matter what way it comes. If the judge told the defendant to make a donation to charity, thats a different story but even still, the judge would not say "no conviction", in fact they never mention anything about a conviction. In the circumstance you described, it would be next to impossible to be caught with that much cocaine and not receive a conviction.

LegacyUser

Agreed. **** happens. This is life. Ignore the Talibans comments. I'm the same as you, minor conviction and been to all these places with absolutely no comeback. If you call a technical on yourself in visa and job forms in 9/10 cases nothing will happen. People are reeasonable. You'll get extra points for being honest. For everybody but the drugs Taliban who'd the hands off anybody who has smoked a joint (seems to be a very high percentage of these extremists posting on internet forums) at a music festival this is an inconsequential conviction. If you don't call it on yourself for some reason these type of offences don't seem to have any comeback. Maybe if you were convicted of dealing or had some violent offence against your name it might but I know loads of people who have had zero troubles going anywhere in the world. There's a reasonable chance that in 5-7 years the law might catch up with reality around the world and good citizens kicking back at music festivals won't be set upon by Gardai with clipboards and targets.

Best of luck with it. Fight it but it's not the end of the world if you get a conviction.

Alias G

beentheremate wrote: »

Heya Shane!

I've had to go to court a few times for reckless behaviour when I was younger so I can help you out. First thing to do is relax

O.K so essentially you will be called to the district court where they deal with small matters mainly public order offences. Just so you know you will be in a full courthouse and the judge reads peoples names one by one and you walk in front of the judge (Do not miss your call up!) You don't need to get a lawyer in advance as there are lawyers hanging around that defend anyone that asks in the district court and the best thing is you can apply for your money back. Now for small posession of cannabis you will more than likely be asked to simply pay some money into the poor box so bring money! (it can be anywhere between 50-250euros) It is highly likely the arresting garda will not show up and in that case the judge will not give you a conviction (your lawyer should get it struck out)


DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES MISS YOUR CALL UP BECAUSE THE COURT WILL SIMPLY CARRY ON, I MISSED MINE AND HAD A WARRANT OUT FOR MY ARREST (MY FIRST TIME IN COURT AND REALLY DIDNT UNDERSTAND THE DEALINGS) BASICALLY 2 MONTHS LATER THE GUARDS TURNED UP AT THE HOUSE AND ARRESTED ME ALONG WITH ALL THE OTHER WARRANTS AROUND DUBLIN CITY AND I WAS PUT IN A HOLDING CELL WITH COMPLETE AND UTTER SCUMBAGS FOR THE WHOLE DAY WHILE THE COURT WAS TRYING TO GET THROUGH THE BACKLOG, YOU DO NOT WANT THIS SO LISTEN VERY CAREFULLY FOR YOUR CALL UP!)

Yep, very easy to miss your name being called out in a crowded court room. Happened to me and 10 years later the guards arrived at my front door with an outstanding bench warrant.