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Coding Horror

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 25,933 ✭✭✭✭ GreeBo


    beauf wrote: »
    One company I was in the bean counters got control and shut down the RD unit which was probably about 100 people in it. Strong mix of software engineering and creatives.

    Within a year or two that company was in trouble and within two or three years asset stripped and consumed by a competitor. Without RD they didn't innovate didn't keep their product fresh and lost their competitive edge. They'd also lost all the problem solvers once RD was gone.
    Business and product innovation is typically more valuable than technical innovation.
    Your report example in your previous post probably wasnt even a freckle on a wrinkle of the bigger picture for that company.
    If your R&D is not being productive it's not being managed properly.

    Thats one of the most naive things I've ever read tbh.


  • Registered Users Posts: 25,933 ✭✭✭✭ GreeBo


    but we are MILES off coding horror now!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 22,674 ✭✭✭✭ beauf


    GreeBo wrote: »
    but we are MILES off coding horror now!

    Coding horrors tend to mirror business and management horrors. I can no longer separate them.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 22,674 ✭✭✭✭ beauf


    I like the synergy between complaints about layers of bug ridden code built up over years, being too risky to refactor and R&D not being a productive use of company resources.

    That's not a personal dig. Because I have sat through hundreds of those exact same meetings. Then added my own layer on top of that 20yr code, wondering where it all went wrong.


  • Registered Users Posts: 25,933 ✭✭✭✭ GreeBo


    beauf wrote: »
    I like the synergy between complaints about layers of bug ridden code built up over years, being too risky to refactor and R&D not being a productive use of company resources.

    That's not a personal dig. Because I have sat through hundreds of those exact same meetings. Then added my own layer on top of that 20yr code, wondering where it all went wrong.

    I wouldnt consider refactoring legacy code as R&D or innovation if thats what you are saying?
    Its proactive maintenance or resolving tech debt at best.

    If I gave some work to a jnr developer and they *didnt* automate it I would be having words. I wouldnt be calling them innovative for doing it.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 22,674 ✭✭✭✭ beauf


    beauf wrote: »
    I like the synergy between complaints about layers of bug ridden code built up over years, being too risky to refactor and R&D not being a productive use of company resources.
    ...

    ... both things share a similar "mindset" ...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 22,674 ✭✭✭✭ beauf


    swampgas wrote: »
    It's a good question.

    Massive numbers of man-hours have gone into legacy systems, and quite often the original developers are long, long departed. If those systems are mission-critical then anything to replace them has to "just work" - quite a tall order.

    I worked for years on a telco platform that had it's own proprietary programming language that ran on custom hardware. It turned out to be easier and more reliable to build a fast emulator for the old hardware using modern CPUs, and keep the old software, than it was to convert the existing code to a new language. (They tried ... and ended up with a different product. But that's another story.)

    We did similar, virtualized the old hardware. We bought it though. We are definitely replacing the software next year. Mind you we've said that every year for 20 years apparently.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,595 ✭✭✭ cryptocurrency


    Smart Arse gave me this code instead of the number i required. Said it was a direct translation but as I don't have a clue what they are refering too I am wondering if some wiz here at this knows.

    Binary is a bit of it. Can anyone advise as I would love to be able to answer this, even though I am not sure where to begin


    0b1000 brussels,Belgium 1C20


  • Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 34,593 Mod ✭✭✭✭ AlmightyCushion


    Smart Arse gave me this code instead of the number i required. Said it was a direct translation but as I don't have a clue what they are refering too I am wondering if some wiz here at this knows.

    Binary is a bit of it. Can anyone advise as I would love to be able to answer this, even though I am not sure where to begin


    0b1000 brussels,Belgium 1C20

    Belgium could be BE. Not sure what Brussels would be although a quick Google says the area code for Brussels is 02 so it could be that. Converting all that from hexadecimal gives you 3113816975875104


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,595 ✭✭✭ cryptocurrency


    Belgium could be BE. Not sure what Brussels would be although a quick Google says the area code for Brussels is 02 so it could be that. Converting all that from hexadecimal gives you 3113816975875104

    Thanks, do you have a decent online converter for the letters? or how did you do that?

    Brussels Belguim in Hex


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  • Registered Users Posts: 21,516 ✭✭✭✭ Esel


    I hope it's not your passphrase! :eek: :D

    Not your ornery onager



  • Registered Users Posts: 132 ✭✭ elvis83


    It's no wonder we all get cynical. What's the point improving and learning if you then need to spend far more energy on convincing people who are simply uninformed (which is fine, it's not their role), only for them to always ALWAYS take the path of least resistance. Zero thought about cost. It always baffles me. There's a game being played somewhere that I don't understand.


  • Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 34,593 Mod ✭✭✭✭ AlmightyCushion


    Thanks, do you have a decent online converter for the letters? or how did you do that?

    Brussels Belguim in Hex

    https://www.rapidtables.com/convert/number/hex-to-decimal.html

    I put in 0b100002BE1C20 to get the number I gave you.


  • Registered Users Posts: 135 ✭✭ RurtBeynolds


    Was about to sign up to adverts to make an offer on something, until I saw the password field is just a plain text box!!



    515599.png


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,016 ✭✭✭ antimatterx


    Was about to sign up to adverts to make an offer on something, until I saw the password field is just a plain text box!!



    515599.png

    That's just ****ing lazy!


  • Registered Users Posts: 26,449 ✭✭✭✭ Creamy Goodness


    The only thing starring out password is to stop someone shoulder surfing it. The form is still sent over https. I’ve seen this becoming more popular.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,700 ✭✭✭ tricky D


    In a signup, the placeholder is better used providing password advice. Nor should a placeholder be a substitute for a form label, unless there is a particular UX requirement - unlikely here though.


  • Registered Users Posts: 488 ✭✭ the-island-man


    In a major multinational medical devices company. About 6 documents required to make any change to existing "validated" systems in production. Even more documents to introduce new systems. Absolutely zero documents that will give any idea to future developers about how the f*** the code is structured. No input on assignment of work and no influence on timelines.

    How the f*** did I end up here!


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 19,233 Mod ✭✭✭✭ L.Jenkins


    In a major multinational medical devices company. About 6 documents required to make any change to existing "validated" systems in production. Even more documents to introduce new systems. Absolutely zero documents that will give any idea to future developers about how the f*** the code is structured. No input on assignment of work and no influence on timelines.

    How the f*** did I end up here!


    Worked in the manufacturing end of a well known multinational before it split into 2 companies. The Software I had worked on, was managing the flow of data from manufacturing equipment to an enterprise level DB, contributed to by multiple regions/countries the company operated in.


    The code had no structure, no documentation, no other developer working on it or developers who was still employees of the company, sections of it were up to 20 years old and it was comprised of at least 4 programming languages.


    Now, when I say it had no structure, that's an understatement. Unlike your usual Linux/Unix app that might have a user account or its own directory, this living nightmare was spread among as many as 7 to 10 random folders. I spent 1 month, yes, 1 month tracing my way through the code to figure it out and document the mess, before putting a plan in place to clean it up.


    As for languages, it comprised of C, C++, Python, Perl and of all the languages you could use for data flow from manufacturing equipment, the hideous hell beast that is Javascript. When I discovered that mess, you could imagine I wanted to tear anyone's hair out besides my own.


    So about 3 months later when all was done and in testing on live machines, I could eventually get stuck into condensing all that **** into something cleaner and more efficient.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,275 ✭✭✭ bpmurray


    In a major multinational medical devices company. About 6 documents required to make any change to existing "validated" systems in production. Even more documents to introduce new systems. Absolutely zero documents that will give any idea to future developers about how the f*** the code is structured. No input on assignment of work and no influence on timelines.

    How the f*** did I end up here!

    Presumably a medical device company uses formal methods to prove the code: I would be rather concerned if this was not the case, but it explains the red tape to make any changes.


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  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 84,758 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Capt'n Midnight


    9462_ea99_700.jpeg


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 19,233 Mod ✭✭✭✭ L.Jenkins


    9462_ea99_700.jpeg


    That's just some lad now taking the absolute piss.


  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 84,758 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Capt'n Midnight


    L.Jenkins wrote: »
    That's just some lad now taking the absolute piss.
    From 2005 https://en.uncyclopedia.co/wiki/AAAAAAAAA!


  • Registered Users Posts: 768 ✭✭✭ 14ned


    L.Jenkins wrote: »
    That's just some lad now taking the absolute piss.

    You can do some truly evil with the C preprocessor. You can examine the source code for:

    100% conforming C preprocessor, both of them!

    Niall


  • Registered Users Posts: 244 ✭✭ handofdog


    This perl camel code is also pretty cool: https://gist.github.com/cgoldberg/4332167


  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 84,758 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Capt'n Midnight


    Reminded me of this

    Worst Abuse of the Rules:
    early every year, one or more people would submit what they claimed
    was the world's smallest self reproducing program. While the sizes
    of these submissions varied, a quick glance would reveal that they
    were too big, until this entry came along.

    ...


    Selected notes from the author:

    The world's smallest self-replicating program. Guaranteed.
    Produces a listing of itself on stdout.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,334 ✭✭✭ Wombatman


    "one line (of code) out of 50,000 lines had a mistake in it."

    So most of the application was correct.......yeah. What a wonderful way to evaluate software quality.

    Works every time, 70% of the time.

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40057475.html


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,315 ✭✭✭ iLikeWaffles


    Would be way more than 1 line of code!
    The system was meant to draw on the core subjects of Irish, English and Maths and their two strongest non-core subjects, instead, it combined the weakest non-core subjects.

    It would have had to find the minimum grade and the second second minimum grade. These functions are separate lines of code! Further more the minimum grade would likely be stored somewhere removed from the array of grades in order to find the second minimum.

    Reasonable and likely speculation would be that the company responsible were given the wrong instructions from the DoE. As in: combine the 2 minimum grades instead of the 2 maximum non-core subjects!


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,334 ✭✭✭ Wombatman


    Would be way more than 1 line of code!



    It would have had to find the minimum grade and the second second minimum grade. These functions are separate lines of code! Further more the minimum grade would likely be stored somewhere removed from the array of grades in order to find the second minimum.

    Reasonable and likely speculation would be that the company responsible were given the wrong instructions from the DoE. As in: combine the 2 minimum grades instead of the 2 maximum non-core subjects!

    I donno. I sometimes mix up my greater than and less than symbols or my ascending and descending sorts.

    In any case it is more of a testing failure than an implementation one. I mean it would have been so easy to unit test assuming the functional spec was correct.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,752 ✭✭✭✭ partyjungle


    Begs the question was there any testing at all. Seems trivial


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