US customs can copy your hard drive

biko

Just a heads up for anyone planning to travel to USA. I travel there for business and will maybe have to start mailing myself sensitive corporate information now, or store it on a company server while travelling (probably a good idea anyway...).

The Department of Homeland Security in the US has just issued new guidelines confirming that it can seize and search through files and data on your laptop, mobile or PDA, whenever you pass through customs.

The guidelines go so far as to say that hardware and files can be taken from the airport, the contents copied and the information shared with other US agencies. In fact, border agents don't even need probable cause to do this. Thanks to a court ruling back in April, they can nab your equipment on a whim - although they do have to destroy any copied files if nothing out of sorts is found.

Interestingly, "correspondence contained in a sealed letter class mail" cannot be opened without a warrant - leading some to suggest you should just mail any data you'd rather not fall into the hands of US officials direct to your destination, and then pop it in your laptop when you arrive.

http://www.mobilecomputermag.co.uk/20080801763/us-customs-can-copy-your-hard-drive.html
http://www.nysun.com/national/customs-agents-copy-travelers-laptop-phone-data/80735/

Agent Smith

overheal is Just trying to get his hands on all our bank details.

Wibbs

Jesus, that's mad ted.

Turd Ferguson

USB fobs in the butt FTW!!

dr.bollocko

Turd Ferguson wrote: »

USB fobs in the butt FTW!!

I think I saw you on dragon's den. I think that Deborah Meaden looked interested. Bet she's mad in the sack.

jhegarty

This has been in place for over a year now.

Capt'n Midnight

Yes the CIA & co. have been involved in commercial spying on behalf of American companies before.


In the UK / US you can get done for refusing to reveal the password to encrypted files / disks if authorities request it (might need a warrant in the UK )



TBH both countries have ample bandwidth such that a traveller could download documents after they arrive , so won't stop anyone with something to hide and a few smarts.

Agent Smith

Turd Ferguson wrote: »

USB fobs in the butt FTW!!

feck that


copy to microsd card


Swalllow


travel

If your laptop was in a sealed envelope with stamps etc on it(But you were carrying it) would that be enough I wonder?

Agent Smith

Agent Smith wrote: »

feck that


copy to microsd card


Swalllow


travel

or email to self and not ingest anything? :rolleyes:

Mrmoe

I think this guy has the solution

http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/story?id=7112491&page=1

http://nbnl.globalwhelming.com/2009/03/20/man-uses-2gb-usb-flash-drive-in-place-of-amputated-finger/

Man uses 2GB USB Flash Drive in place of AMPUTATED FINGER.

It’s innovative, but, imagine having to stick your hand in a USB slot and waiting for the files to be transferred.
Or if your colleagues is around, guess what horror they will have to see you remove a usb drive from your finger.

You’ve heard of USB thumb drives, but you likely have not considered the real thing – a lost digit replaced by a USB Flash drive.

A Finnish programmer who lost his finger in a motorcycle accident has now replaced it with a prosthetic finger that has a USB drive built in. Jerry Jalava can now peel back his “nail” and reveal a 2GB “finger drive” for storing photos, movies and software.

alava had his left ring finger amputated last summer after crashing into a deer with his motorbike near the Finnish capital Helsinky. Given his profession as a computer programmer, the doctors treating him joked that he should have a USB “finger drive” and Jalava went for the idea.

Jerry Jalava’s 2GB USB finger looks like a normal finger, but it’s detachable and he leaves it inside his computer’s slot while using it. The Finnish programmer plans to “upgrade” his finger in the future with one that has a removable fingertip, an RFID tag and more storage space.

This time, Jalava’s USB finger is not a hoax, unlike the story of the guy who surgically altered his thumbs two years ago for better use of his phone keyboard. To refresh your memory, that guy whittled his thumbs several times so that he could type faster on his Blackberry and then iPhone — and it proved to be just a PR stunt (or more of a Flat Earth News worthy tale).
[from PCWorld]

Turd Ferguson

Deleted User wrote: »

or email to self and not ingest anything? :rolleyes:

Pussy

Manic Moran

jhegarty wrote: »

This has been in place for over a year now.

I was about to say, it's not new.

There was quite the legal battle a while ago as to whether or not one could be compelled to reveal the password for encrypted files (or just to log into the computer) when entering the country. Can't recall which way the court ruled, there are very good legal arguments on both sides.

NTM

ScumLord

It's times like these I'm almost glad I'm not aloud to travel to the US.

ScumLord

ScumLord wrote: »

It's times like these I'm almost glad I'm not aloud to travel to the US.

awh.. did you fail the spelling test at customs?

DublinWriter

Truecrypt people, Truecrypt.

ScumLord

Deleted User wrote: »

awh.. did you fail the spelling test at customs?

You don't need to be able to spell to enter the states, in fact literacy is frowned upon.

Donny5

Turd Ferguson wrote: »

Pussy

That'd be a good place to hide it, too.

touché scumlord

buynow

Does anyone know whether Irish customs are allowed to search hard drives entering the country?

This mentions indecent video recordings, so they must have the power to look at what is on it? http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/travel-and-recreation/travel-to-ireland/customs_regulations_for_travellers

Gummy Panda

Can't they download their own porn?

This reminds me of that film Johnny Mnemonic. I wish it didn't, that film sucked!!

procure11

Magnus wrote: »

Just a heads up for anyone planning to travel to USA. I travel there for business and will maybe have to start mailing myself sensitive corporate information now, or store it on a company server while travelling (probably a good idea anyway...).



http://www.mobilecomputermag.co.uk/20080801763/us-customs-can-copy-your-hard-drive.html
http://www.nysun.com/national/customs-agents-copy-travelers-laptop-phone-data/80735/

At least they admit it publicly.Are you sure this has not being the case for a lot of countries for sometime?

I have nothing to worry about anyway!!...I am a legit Man!

Corkfeen

They'll have a might porn collection.

ScumLord

Did you ever see that Australian customs show, they actually do search peoples laptops for porn. :eek:

blubloblu

Get a hard drive full of random data. Pass the real data against it using XOR. Mail yourself one drive, bring the other. Both are useless alone.

Zillah

Some lunatics fly a plane into a building and a nation gives away its freedom.

Terrifying.

Corkfeen

blubloblu wrote: »

Get a hard drive full of random data. Pass the real data against it using XOR. Mail yourself one drive, bring the other. Both are useless alone.

Thats just making you look suspicous tbh.

biko

About how you close an open society to win control over the citizens
Godwin warning

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RFYZDVUVQ1U

Stephen

DublinWriter wrote: »

Truecrypt people, Truecrypt.

They can "compel" you to decrypt your stuff for them too.

Donny5

blubloblu wrote: »

Get a hard drive full of random data. Pass the real data against it using XOR. Mail yourself one drive, bring the other. Both are useless alone.

Why not just bring a hdd full of random data by itself, even if you don't travel with a laptop. It'd be fun watching them try to decypher it.

Professey Chin

Turd Ferguson wrote: »

USB fobs in the butt FTW!!

What what in the butt?

Ghost Train

Stephen wrote: »

They can "compel" you to decrypt your stuff for them too.

well with truecrypt you can have hidden containers inside your encrypted containers, offering you plausible deniablity...because the hidden container looks like random data would inside the outer container

but best to wipe your laptop before you travel and have a clean setup. Make sure anything you'll need is available over the internet through secure connections

FearDark

FTW!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acVc6H7wYbA

netwhizkid

Just do what the South Africans do and use the latest Pigeon net. They are collecting the worlds biggest prawn collection for BHO.

ScumLord

FearDark wrote: »

FTW!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acVc6H7wYbA

that's actually worth loosing a finger for.

Guy:Incognito

Deleted User wrote: »

or email to self and not ingest anything? :rolleyes:

Wheres the fun in that?

Hal1

Pr0n at his finger tips. :pac:

biko

Or create a super virus, store it on your lappy and start travelling back and forth to US with a fake beard.

artielange

Magnus wrote: »

Or create a super virus, store it on your lappy and start travelling back and forth to US with a fake beard.

That would'nt work you would never be stopped, but if your old or have an infant with you or have the countrys' highest military award or a US senator.:)

http://archives.cnn.com/2002/US/02/27/war.hero.cnna/


http://leahy.senate.gov/press/200803/030408b.html fourth paragraph down

petes

Or you could just buy an 'off the shelf' internet program, hack into the military servers and claim you were looking for aliens.


I swear I didn't know that was on my laptop!!

Fulton Crown

Turd Ferguson wrote: »

Pussy

He hasn't got one ..has to injest (piles).

OK ?

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Joking apart, why would anybody carry sensitive or confidential data on a laptop? I keep it on the company server and log in whereever I travel.

Gone Drinking

Avah Deep Ghetto wrote: »

Joking apart, why would anybody carry sensitive or confidential data on a laptop?

Why would anyone try and suck their own penis? I dunno, its human nature i guess.

Manic Moran

Zillah wrote: »

Some lunatics fly a plane into a building and a nation gives away its freedom.

Terrifying.

Unrelated. It's an issue of border security: Until you're admitted into the country, you have no freedoms afforded by that country. This is very long-standing policy, goes back well beyond 2001.

On a related note, for example, INS and Border Patrol have enhanced powers within a reasonable distance of the border. (30 miles or so) Searches and detentions which would be unConstitutional in the rest of the country are given far greater leeway in the border area. Again, this is long-standing and settled law unrelated to 9/11.

NTM

artielange

Manic Moran wrote: »

Unrelated. It's an issue of border security: Until you're admitted into the country, you have no freedoms afforded by that country. This is very long-standing policy, goes back well beyond 2001.

On a related note, for example, INS and Border Patrol have enhanced powers within a reasonable distance of the border. (30 miles or so) Searches and detentions which would be unConstitutional in the rest of the country are given far greater leeway in the border area. Again, this is long-standing and settled law unrelated to 9/11.

NTM

That's fine for all you tourist's:) but when the government uses these powers to circumvent laws that protect an American citizen's rights thats something else.



http://www.aclu.org/privacy/spying/areyoulivinginaconstitutionfreezone.html

Overheal

Magnus wrote: »

Just a heads up for anyone planning to travel to USA. I travel there for business and will maybe have to start mailing myself sensitive corporate information now, or store it on a company server while travelling (probably a good idea anyway...).



http://www.mobilecomputermag.co.uk/20080801763/us-customs-can-copy-your-hard-drive.html
http://www.nysun.com/national/customs-agents-copy-travelers-laptop-phone-data/80735/

because mailing it will protect it..

Customs has more important things to do than pour over your profit and loss reports. Or my 1/2 illegal music collection. Beside the inconvenience of waiting while your drive is copied I dont see the worry.

Joking apart, why would anybody carry sensitive or confidential data on a laptop? I keep it on the company server and log in whereever I travel.

Especially this. How many stories have I read with white knuckles where a financial institution has let their lackey run around the streets of NYC carrying 250,000 social security records and credit card numbers in his hard drive? It is a very, very stupid way to transport sensitive data.

Sparky

make sure to clear any 4chan temp internet files before you travel

But in seriousness. Don't carry sensitive data.

Manic Moran

artielange wrote: »

That's fine for all you tourist's:) but when the government uses these powers to circumvent laws that protect an American citizen's rights thats something else.

Just because one is an American citizen should not grant one immunity from customs enforcement or any other law. Most Constitutional rights (with regards law enforcement, particularly the 4th, 5th and 14th Amendments) are granted to anyone in the country, legal or otherwise.

NTM

Capt'n Midnight

artielange wrote: »

That's fine for all you tourist's:) but when the government uses these powers to circumvent laws that protect an American citizen's rights thats something else

There are no laws to protect an American citizen's rights.
IIRC the president can revoke your citizenship.


Back here, customs can enter your house any time they like.

artielange

Manic Moran wrote: »

Just because one is an American citizen should not grant one immunity from customs enforcement or any other law. Most Constitutional rights (with regards law enforcement, particularly the 4th, 5th and 14th Amendments) are granted to anyone in the country, legal or otherwise.

NTM

I did not say they should be granted immunity but they should not be subjected to unconstitutional laws in the first place. Being stopped 100 miles from the border and having your car searched is so anti- 4th amendment.(unless your a tourist or terrorist):)And American citizen or other wise isn't provided that right.

Back to the laptop

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2008/10/aclu-assails-10/


The ACLU hopes that Congress will include changes to the border zone in traveler privacy protection bills that focus on prohibiting suspicion-less searches and seizures of laptops at the border. Congress is currently out of session and would not move on any legislation until sometime in 2009 at the earliest.

artielange

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

There are no laws to protect an American citizen's rights.
IIRC the president can revoke your citizenship.


Back here, customs can enter your house any time they like.

Thats what the 2nd amendment is for.

Very hard to lose US citizenship

Thats why I leave the door open.

I really have to learn how to multi-quote:)