Dragongate USA Thread

EdK

Enter the Dragon PPV - Awesome!!!

flahavaj

Have you seen it? Looking forward to having a look at it soon and indeed seeing them live in Oxford next month. Was it your first experience of Dragon Gate and what did you make of it more detail!? Alvarez said it was as good as any PPV ever in terms of consistent high quality of matches.:eek:

EdK

Lets face it, the whole show was spotomania but I love it like that sometimes, every match was great, they have an abundance of talent, Doi, Yoshino,Dragon Kid, Cima,Shingo etc etc

Seem all the guys above wrestle for ROH and they are immense

EdK

I wanted to go see them in Oxford too but with another Wrestlemania trip and a couple of TNA shows i'm stretched thin as it is, But if they do another show i'd love to go

Machismo Fan

I haven't had too much exposure to DG but I was familiar with most of the talent. Match by match: Yamato vs. BxB Hulk was a great opener (though I hated the lack of selling of the leg half way through the match). The Chikara was an insane blend of high spots and fast paced technical wrestling and was a great intro for me to the Chikara style.

Kid vs. Yoshino was really fast paced and had a bit of psychology with Yoshino keeping Dragon down which was good. The Bucks vs. CIMA and Yokosuka was a fantastic match which really put over The Bucks. TNA should snap them up instantly to feud with The Guns but this was really, really great. Main event was match of the night for me as I love a good (more) heavyweight style with Doi and Shingo. Great match with great high spots and it doesn't hurt that I'm a huge Doi mark. Overall PPV of the year so far.

flahavaj

Whetting my appetite to see this and the live show in a few weeks men, thanks!

Young Bucks are by far the most improved team I've seen in forever, they literally get better everytime I see them wrestle. While Doi is awesome, I have to admit to being a massive Shingo mark and have been for ages. Hes been sensational for about 18 months now and has a definite claim to being amongst the elite workers in the world.

EdK

Shingo is a great all round type he's a heavyweight who's got good speed and agility and can mix it up in most wrestling styles, learn a lesson WWE, boring heavyweights facing each other over and over

Machismo Fan

flahavaj wrote: »

Whetting my appetite to see this and the live show in a few weeks men, thanks!

It's most certainly worth doing anything necessary to see the show. It is awesome. Doi and Shingo did a heavyweight style match the way it should be done with some really great power moves and high spots, not the WWE style rest-hold filled heavyweight match. Dragon Gate is everything wrestling should be.

EdK

Fear not people there is still great wrestling out there if you broaden your horizons, Brainwashed its WWE or nothing no matter what types anger me

flahavaj

Machismo Fan wrote: »

It's most certainly worth doing anything necessary to see the show. It is awesome. Doi and Shingo did a heavyweight style match the way it should be done with some really great power moves and high spots, not the WWE style rest-hold filled heavyweight match. Dragon Gate is everything wrestling should be.

I've adored Dragon Gate for a good few years now. I couldn't care less that for the most part its just a bunch of spots strung together and after a while it all blends into one big sprint: when the spots are this innovative, perfectly executed and done at such a fast pace, I couldn't give a sh*te!

For a real treat look up some Toryumon, Ultimo Dragon's company that was the precursor to Dragon Gate, it was absolutely fantastic and way way way ahead of its time. I can only imagine what people thought around 1999/2000 when they saw these young guys doing this incredible struff for the first time, must've blown their minds. There was also a spin off promotion Toryumon X I think it was called in a 6-sided ring, with some of the most fantastic submission and chain wrestling you'll ever see. The likes of CIMA and Dragon Kid were literally just kids and were every bit as good as Rey was at that age.

EdK

flahavaj wrote: »

I've adored Dragon Gate for a good few years now. I couldn't care less that for the most part its just a bunch of spots strung together and after a while it all blends into one big sprint: when the spots are this innovative, perfectly executed and done at such a fast pace, I couldn't give a sh*te!

Spot on analysis there man, I agree 100%

Machismo Fan

Spotfests rule!!! Especially the innovation of Dragon Gate spot fests.

flahavaj

Machismo Fan wrote: »

Spotfests rule!!!

When they're done well and kep trying new things which are hit cleanly, a la Dragon Gate, they're f*cking fantastic.

When they're poorly thought out and executed badly, a la most CZW stuff, they're awful.:pac:

EdK

Machismo Fan wrote: »

Spotfests rule!!!

Only when they are not poor class backyard wrestlers who botch everything like CZW wrestlers

flahavaj

Scary EdK.:eek:

EdK

Voodoo haha

orestes

Haven't seen any Dragongate stuff at alll, but judging by the stuff in this thread I'm definitely gonna keep an eye out for it, sounds awesome!

Machismo Fan

I hate CZW with such a deep, intense passion it's not even funny. They kill themselves and each other for no reason, in a field in the middle of nowhere, in front of nobody, for no money and as long as they continue to wrestle (in fact wrestle is far, far too generous) that way they'll never get near WWE or TNA. And the only attention they ever get is when one of them does nearly kill themselves and has to be air lifted out of the field in the middle of nowhere to the nearest hospital because after he nearly killed himself he insisted on finishing the match that nobody saw and very few people cared about. But it's OK because he's 'hardcore', isn't it?

They do nothing but discredit the name of the wonderful thing we all know as Pro Wrestling.*rant over*

flahavaj

Machismo Fan wrote: »

I hate CZW with such a deep, intense passion it's not even funny. They kill themselves and each other for no reason, in a field in the middle of nowhere, in front of nobody, for no money and as long as they continue to wrestle (in fact wrestle is far, far too generous) that way they'll never get near WWE or TNA. And the only attention they ever get is when one of them does nearly kill themselves and has to be air lifted out of the field in the middle of nowhere to the nearest hospital because after he nearly killed himself he insisted on finishing the match that nobody saw and very few people cared about. But it's OK because he's 'hardcore', isn't it?

They do nothing but discredit the name of the wonderful thing we all know as Pro Wrestling.*rant over*

You're totally correct, or at least 95%.

They have had some good non hardcore stuff over the years in fairness. The Super Dragon feud with Steen/Generico was bloody brilliant around 2002-2004 and they had some unreal matches. A lot of guys like Sonjay Dutt, Claudio Castagnoli, the Briscoes and others got their first shot in CZW long before ROH ever heard of them. Also some of the Cage of Death Matches were insane, at least they had a build and storylines attached to the insanity.

I don't mind hardcore wrestling when theres a reason behind it or its buolt up in a storyline, like in the Cage of Death matches. But hardcore stuff just for the sake of it is as meaningless and unnecessary as it is utterly stupid, like those IWA:MS deathmatch tournaments. F*ck off like.

Machismo Fan

I agree but for as long as they're throwing themselves from ridiculous heights and breaking lighttubes off each other I'll never take it seriously nor care for it in the slightest. For me, all that 'hardcore' rubbish drowns out the anything positive that happens in these garbage promotions. Thank God, IWA:MS has shut up shop.

flahavaj

This thread and chat with you lads gives me an idea as per the instructions of the bauld Gerard C.

*Rushes off to start new thread*.

Machismo Fan

I just read the results of their latest PPV taping and it certainly looks like something to look forward to.

michael.etc...

The Dragon Gate Live in LA DVD can be bought in the current ROH 25% off sale if anyone's interested. Bit of a bargain.

Love me's a bit of DG myself. It's not generally my sort of thing, but it's just executed so well (mostly anyhows), it's hard to quibble- their shows are so refreshing. flahavaj already said all there is really though...

flahavaj

Watching PPv now

Early thoughts.......Was Dawn Marie really necessary?

And those dancers aren't a patch on BXB Hulks usual routine.

And Yamato is one of my favourite heels at the moment.

Machismo Fan

For me Dawn Marie was the only bad part of the show. As a ring announcer she was dreadful. She came across as bored, unenthusiastic and without any (or at least very much) knowledge of the product

EdK

Machismo Fan wrote: »

For me Dawn Marie was the only bad part of the show. As a ring announcer she was dreadful. She came across as bored, unenthusiastic and without any (or at least very much) knowledge of the product

Nods in agreement

flahavaj

It warms the cockles of my heart to see Chikara, and in particular, Quack getting exposure on PPV.:D

And I'm glad to see Jigsaw wearing his mask again, horrible idea having him take it off in ROH, he looks like a prawn,

EdK

flahavaj wrote: »

It warms the cockles of my heart to see Chikara, and in particular, Quack getting exposure on PPV.:D

And I'm glad to see Jigsaw wearing his mask again, horrible idea having him take it off in ROH, he looks like a prawn,

Quackenbush is a really good wrestler unfortunately he looks like a hdip maths teacher lol

flahavaj

EdK wrote: »

Quackenbush is a really good wrestler unfortunately he looks like a hdip maths teacher lol

Sadly his look has definitely held him back. Hes a really really different and innovative guy to watch though. Anything he and Claudio ever did was magic. Had a wildly entertaining World of Sport match against a 60+ year old Johnny Saint last year thats well worth tracking down.

EdK

flahavaj wrote: »

Sadly his look has definitely held him back. Hes a really really different and innovative guy to watch though. Anything he and Claudio ever did was magic. Had a wildly entertaining World of Sport match against a 60+ year old Johnny Saint last year thats well worth tracking down.

He's trained some good talent too, His commentary aint half bad either

michael.etc...

Quack is a great, great man, in truly hideous clothes. It's a shame he was never able to commit to a proper run in ROH, but his contributions to the business are fricking huge.

There's a quality six man he was in in ROH that's worth watching. can't remember when from for the life of me.

flahavaj

michael.etc... wrote: »

Quack is a great, great man, in truly hideous clothes. It's a shame he was never able to commit to a proper run in ROH, but his contributions to the business are fricking huge.

There's a quality six man he was in in ROH that's worth watching. can't remember when from for the life of me.

I remember a tag match I think the oipener from one of the ROH PPV's, he tagged with Jigsaw against M-Dogg 20 and Erick Stevens (the Resilience or whatever sh*tty name they came up with). It was a stormer.

michael.etc...

flahavaj wrote: »

I remember a tag match I think the oipener from one of the ROH PPV's, he tagged with Jigsaw against M-Dogg 20 and Erick Stevens (the Resilience or whatever sh*tty name they came up with). It was a stormer.

That does ring a bell indeed...................
He was in a blinding tag gauntlet as well at some point (that's not part of the same match is it?). And he was great in the Race to the top tournament they did in 07.

flahavaj

michael.etc... wrote: »

That does ring a bell indeed...................
He was in a blinding tag gauntlet as well at some point (that's not part of the same match is it?). And he was great in the Race to the top tournament they did in 07.

I remember M-Dogg reversing the Jig-N-Tonic into something ridiculous in mid air as the finish. It could even be a tag guantlet, the aul memory is fairly hazy.

Such a pity as you say Quack didn't get booked fulltim in ROH. Wasn't he meant to be in from the start but had some dispute with Gabe over his booking which meant it took 5 years before getting booked again? Imagine the matches we missed out on over all that time, by the time they finally nabbed him again he was too busy with Chikara to be used as a regular.:(

michael.etc...

flahavaj wrote: »

I remember M-Dogg reversing the Jig-N-Tonic into something ridiculous in mid air as the finish. It could even be a tag guantlet, the aul memory is fairly hazy.

Such a pity as you say Quack didn't get booked fulltim in ROH. Wasn't he meant to be in from the start but had some dispute with Gabe over his booking which meant it took 5 years before getting booked again? Imagine the matches we missed out on over all that time, by the time they finally nabbed him again he was too busy with Chikara to be used as a regular.:(

I think there's an element of myth there. I believe Gabe when he says that he really wished he could use Quack more. There may have been some issues, but I'm sure they arose from Quack's other commitments, and there t'was never bad blood there. If Quack had been in there in the early days in those stiff-fests with the Briscoes and Ki etc though, he probably would't be wrestling today. It's obviously all good now though!

Otis Driftwood

This PPV sounds like something I both need to see and would HUGELY enjoy.I sure wish i could find a way to see it, the links in the youtube channel in the other thread arent working.:mad:

Bounty Hunter

Yesterday I said i would look into the rules with regards to linking to streams, due to copyright reasons we are not allowed to do so. Asking for such information to be PMd to you on the forum is also not allowed as it still means boards is facilitating the passing of links to streams of copyrighted material. Therefore im asking that anyone who has done so remove theirs now, there will be no repucussions as I had not previously stated this (altho i did delete a few posts on this topic inc one by myself and pmd the posters about it) but I have now, so in the future im sorry no asking for such links to be pm'd to you

NeilFrenzy4Ever

Wasn't mad on this at all. Really enjoyed the Chikara six man, but the Young Bucks match was tripe. When I saw them on ROH TV a couple of months ago they blew me away, but here I just couldn't suspend my disbelief as within the context of a wrestling match, all four wrestlers should have been KILLED with the amount of finishers they hit on each other, but no one sold anything and the match ended up lasting about 5 minutes longer than it should have, IMO.

Otis Driftwood

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

Yesterday I said i would look into the rules with regards to linking to streams, due to copyright reasons we are not allowed to do so. Asking for such information to be PMd to you on the forum is also not allowed as it still means boards is facilitating the passing of links to streams of copyrighted material. Therefore im asking that anyone who has done so remove theirs now, there will be no repucussions as I had not previously stated this (altho i did delete a few posts on this topic inc one by myself and pmd the posters about it) but I have now, so in the future im sorry no asking for such links to be pm'd to you

Duly noted.

Bounty Hunter

nedtheshed wrote: »

Duly noted.

wasnt just you tbh but yeah you gave me the excuse to say what needed to be stated which personally i find unfortunate as id love if streams were allowed, but they aren't.

back on topic: This show is seemingly good enough to have inspired a former PW Mod to want to learn about a whole new type of pro-wrestling so thats as good a reccomendation as i can think of for it so if you do get a chance to check it out it would probably be worth your while. I haven't seen it myself though and as in the other thread it seems that this companys wrestlers ring psychology is questioned by some but if numerous mad as fup moves being preformed in a madcap match is what you like then this is prob for you.

Otis Driftwood

I do have a soft spot for the very fast paced stuff alright.

I remember a match between Angle and Raven during the Invasion angle.

It was ridiculously fast paced and I feckin loved it.

gimmick

Getting a copy of this later. Hopefully will see before the weekend is over.

jaykhunter

So Japanese promotion Dragon Gate have gone & hired themselves internet darling Gabe Sapolski (former ROH booker) & decided to try to break into the American wrestling market by having their first ever PPV outside of Japan. This show was filmed in front of the old ECW faithful at the Arena in Philadelphia & consisted of 6 matches (only 5 made it onto the PPV, they must be saving the last match as a DVD extra) featuring talent from Dragon Gate, CHIKARA, ROH & other independent promotions across America. Let’s see how it got on then:

Before I go into the matches themselves I want to talk about other aspects of the show first. The production values are above other indy promotions & about on par with ROH dvds (not the HDnet shows) & unfortunately Dragon Gate suffers the same fate as other indy shows when it comes to sound editing. They use the mics in the cameras to pick up the entrance music & mic work so it all sounds a bit **** & muffled. In the future I hope they hook the sound set up to a mixer or recorder so we get to actually hear the music for a change.

One other thing I would like to point out is that the promo videos were terrible & for some reason were being played at either x1.5 or x2.0 normal speed which is just unnecessary & there were some obvious edits during some matches (which weren‘t too bad & were probably due to the 2 hour time limitation).

So with Dawn Marie handling the announcing & Lenny Leonard & Chikara san on commentary we finally Enter the Dragon…………….

BxB Hulk v Yamato:
This match is honestly one of the best openers to a PPV I’ve ever seen & at 20 mins long it was given ample time to impress us first timers & leave a lasting impression. BxB Hulk got a somewhat elaborate entrance featuring some slappers (Daisy Haze & Bobby Dempsey's sister) trying to do a sexy dance but it just came off looking bush-league & a bit pathetic (although one of them is a bit fit). I had never seen Hulk wrestle before that but I had heard many a thing about the lad. I had seen his opponent Yamato wrestle in this years Super Juniors tournament & he looked very good in that but he completely exceeded my expectations in this match.
This match was basically set up to get Hulk over as a super athletic face by pitting him against a solid but mostly ground based heel (but stiff as hell to boot) & I gotta say that it worked! Hulk took off to a flyer showing some of his aerial manoeuvres high spots before being grounded by Yamoto who basically kicked the **** out of Hulk before he made his eventual comeback………. Rinse repeat, mark out!!!!!!
I’m gonna keep this review spoiler free but all I’ll say about the finish is that it’s awesome. So good start all round then.

Amasis, Icarus, Gran Akuma & Hallowicked v Fire Ant, Soldier Ant, Jigsaw & Mike Quackenbush - All CHIKARA match:
This match, which featured all CHIKARA talent who are all trained by Quackenbush was my first taste of the CHIKARA style of wrestling too & I gotta say that it blew me away. It’s like a hybrid of Lucha Libre (which I hate as I feel it looks too fake. You can see the wrestlers help each other out far too much) & American style wrestling (which I love) & the result is a breathtaking 8 man tag match.
My only gripes with this match are Amasis & his ****ing dancing, I hate that crap & Icarus who kinda sucks. Everything else about the match was pretty awesome, especially the Ants, those guys are amazing.
Anyway this match is pretty much just a blur of spots featuring all 8 men for about 15-20 minutes. If you’re into the X-Division style multi-man openers then you’ll love this match & the PPV for that matter, if not then………. Sorry bout your damn luck!
One last thing……. Quackenbush is probably the best technical wrestler I’ve ever seen. The sheer amount of holds & counters he breaks out is outstanding.

So after the match they play a terrible tribute video to Jorge Rivera(???) & then Quack challenges any Dragon Gate wrestler to take on any Chikara wrestler & Yamato makes his return & kicks Quackenbush in the balls & accepts his challenge. This was a poor segment I gotta admit.

Masato Yoshino v Dragon Kid:
SSSSSPEEEEEEEEEEEEEED MMMMMMMMMMUSCLLLLLLLLLE!!!!!!!!! So in case you haven’t copped on yet, I’m very excited about this match as it’s one half of Speed Muscle (or Muscle Outlaws if you watch ROH or Dragon Gate) taking on another internet darling in Dragon Kid (who is a more awesome version of Ultimo Dragon). These guys have been feuding for 2 years in Japan & I’ve heard great things about their matches so I had set the bar very high before this match even kicked off.
Top say that this match kicked off quickly would be a HUGE understatement. Holy crap Yoshino is quick!!! He was buzzing around the ring doing crazy Lucha style moves & both men were doing some of the fastest chain wrestling I’ve ever seen.
Then they slowed down for a few minutes which I felt really hurt the match. You could see Yoshino gassed REALLY badly & had to sit on the turnbuckle for a few minutes & have Dragon Kid waste a lot of time, but they flew back into form with the biggest hurricanrana I’ve ever seen (you’ll know when you see it, believe me!).
So after taking a breather for a few minutes they flew around the ring for a few more minutes before going to finish to end what was a fantastic match, but the worst of the PPV so far.

I also have to say that this is where wrestling fatigue set in on both watches & is the reason the review is so late being put up, as I needed to take a break after watching the previous 3 matches.. While I think these matches are all incredible, the style of wrestling all melts into a blur of spots with no real form or structure. Imagine watching a TNA ppv filled with 6 multi man X-Division spot fests & imagine how tired you’d be after watching a few of them & I think you’ll get what I mean.

The Young Bucks v CIMA & Susumu Yokosuka:
There’s not much to say about this match other than HOLY ****!!!!!!! This is possibly the best tag team match I’ve ever seen (yes even better than MCMG v Apollo55 from NJPW this summer!!!) It started off strong, had a strong middle & the end was absolutely thrilling. WOW
I’d live for the young bucks to get picked up by TNA as they have a good tag team division & they could have incredible matches taking on the Guns but just one thing. Lose the tassels lads, it looks pathetic.
How does one follow this masterpiece………

Naruki Doi v Shingo Takugi:
………….With this match! Oh yeah this match was a brilliant main event. Possibly not as awesome as some of the other matches on the card, but the fact that it felt completely different & fresh after watching 4 spot fests was very refreshing & it was the stiffest match by a mile. I gotta say that this was my favourite match of the night although the Young Bucks v CIMA & Yokosuka could easily take the prize, but it was hampered by it’s similarity to other match.
Anyway this was a super strong Japanese style main event & I wouldn’t be surprised to see it rise high on the wBw top 10 list at all. AWESOME!

So in conclusion this was a breathtaking ppv in terms of match quality, work rate & mark out factor but in my mind it‘s slightly held back by the fact that most of the matches were spot fests which after a while melted into each other & caused a degree of wrestling fatigue.
But each match taken on it‘s own is incredible & quite simply this is a must see PPV & despite being a spot fest it‘s one of the greatest spot fests of all time.

======

If you enjoyed the review, I'd urge you to come join wBw Ringside ! We review every PPV we watch; WWE, TNA, ROH, NJPW and now DGUSA! We're irish lads who love discussing wrestling, especially with other irish! Go on, click the pic!

gimmick

Watched this fully last night. It is incredible. An brilliant brillaint show. I was a little let down by the Chikara effort, but Quack, as always, stood head and shoulders above anyone else. The Kid V Yoshino match here was the best of the lot. The speed of it was crazy.

Not a bad match in sight. Make sure youget to see this.

I was delighted to see Dawn Marie at the start, but good grief, she was hopeless as an announcer.

EdK

Absolutely amazing,go out of your way to see this 3 classic matches (Shingo vs Davey Richards,Bryan Danielson vs Naruki Doi and The Youngbucks vs Horiguchi and Saito) with a few good matches in between

Must try to sleep after that, not bloody likely haha

flahavaj

Cannot wait to see this. The UK show last week was something else, seeing these guys do their stuff at close hand is an absolute pleasure. Dragon gate is rapidly becoming my favourite promotion, I've been looking at some of their 2008 Japanese PPV's over the weekend, great stuff.

Danielson/Doi should be sensational.

EdK

Definitely buying my Dragon gate tickets for Phoenix on Thursday it could very well be the highlight of the weekend

flahavaj

As a straight choice between DG and ROH this year at Mania, Dragon gate would be the easy choice for me. They've even gotten Davey Richards to commit to them for the weekend ahead of ROH.

EdK

flahavaj wrote: »

As a straight choice between DG and ROH this year at Mania, Dragon gate would be the easy choice for me. They've even gotten Davey Richards to commit to them for the weekend ahead of ROH.

Luckily I don't have to make a choice I get to do both, which will be amazing, ROH are in negotiations with AAA and Dragon gate have a great roster with great outside talents like Richards and the Youngbucks

gimmick

Watched the first half of this last night.

DragonKid Vs Yoshino was predictly fast paced and very good. Seen numerous matches with these 2 and the innovation and pace they bring is just unbelievable

The 2nd match between Yamato & Gran Akuma Vs Quack and Jigsaw. Wasn't much into this to be fair, mostly as I despise Jigsaw and to a lesser extent Akuma. Quack makes me smile though. he makes his offense make sense, unlike his partner.

Naruki Doi Vs Bryan Danielson is incredible. What a match. Dragon brings his bets stuff here and his concentration on working certain body parts is a class above anyone else on the scene at the moment. One thing which annoyed me was the lack of psychology on Dois behalf, especially after the repeated ankle locks. Still, this match is a must see if you are either looking to be introduced to either of these two, or are a Dragon mark.

Ill hopefully watch the rest tonight.

gimmick

Only just got around to the 2nd half of this the other night. All in all, apart from the throwaway CIMA/Kendrick match, it is a top notch effort.

The YoungBucks continue to impress me.