US hospital after me

tierno

...
hi sorry first post but long time viewer.
and really have no where to turn. Here's my story...all help and advice really appreciated.

was in the states a few months ago.. a holiday of a lifetime that I was really looking forward to for months. I have just finished college and was really exited about embarking on a trip with my friends to let go of stress and a tough year. But things went bad....really badly...

I was in San Francisco and it was my final night, on a great holdiay. But basically I got hammered, it was the 4th of July and woke up in hospital. Now I know that I wasn't sick/voilent etc. I think it was a case of someone overreacting. I had lost my friends at this stage so there was no-one to stop to just bring me home. So since coming home I have recieved 4 letters from the hospital saying that I owe over 2000 dollars. I have no idea what to do. I don't have the money, to go home and admit I was in there for "alcohol poisioning" is not an option. I really have no idea what to do.

I have no one to talk to about this situation and I have no idea how the US healthcare system works for foreign residents. I was there ona tourist visa and didn't actually want to be admitted. I thought nothing would come of it.

Bascially what I need is some advice on what to do now? Please? I don't really know what my options are and what the worst-case senario is? Will I be refused from the US if I ignore this bill? When does it have to be paid by? Can I ignore it? If anyone has been in a similar situation or knows someone who has that would be fantastic and would really help me as I said, this problem I have been keeping to myself and its really stressing me out.

Thanks for reading.

LegacyUser

Hey,

That is a terrible situation to be in and has happened many people I know. You need to consult FLAC. They offer free legal advice. www.flac.ie

This happened a friend and he ignored all correspondence, eventually they stopped sending bills. I think there is a fund in the US to cover the uninsured when things like this happened but I can't be certain. I am unsure at to what your entry status to the States would be in light of this.

Best of luck, and try not to let it get you down.

Terodil

Sorry if this is not what you want to hear:

You failed to drink responsibly, you now have to assume responsibility. We all make mistakes but it's in how we deal with them that makes the difference.

So as it is absolutely no option to not pay the bill, what are the alternatives? There's none but asking your relatives/friends for support or taking out a loan from the bank.

Your refusal to admit to the alcohol poisoning is a continued denial of responsibility and rather immature. Confess, deal with the consequences, learn, and don't do it again.

Case closed.

Penn

Agreed. You may not have wanted to be admitted to the hospital, but however you got there, someone obviously thought you did, and probably did you a huge favour. You may think it was someone overreacting, but since you can't remember how you got there, I'd take it as given that you did need to go.

I'm not too sure on the laws and whatnot, but did you have travel insurance over there? Either way, it cost the hospital money to treat you, and they are fully entitled to get that money back from you. It is unfair to think you can just ignore it. They obviously know enough about you if they are contacting you back in Ireland. Pay up and avoid hardship down the road

Taltos

OP - do you have VHI / health insurance?
Or are you covered under your parents plans?

If so then they should cover some part of this with you maybe having to pay the excess. Contact them immediately - they may need receipts.
I am not sure what legal recourse they have to chase you for the money over here - or what the implications are if you are ever in the States again and needing aid.

However if you need your folks help I think that you will have to be honest with them. You are not the first guy to go a bit mental and while you might think someone over-reacted - alcohol poisoning is quite serious - and chances are that someone either saved your life or saved your liver (seen the news about that 19yr old recently). Chalk the whole thing up to experience and don't repeat it but you do need to face up to your financial responsibilities now.

prinz

Yup nothing for it but to come clean and pay your bills. You messed up so now you have to assume responsibility. As for the 'ignore it and it will go away idea', it won't. This can actually come against you if you ever want to return to the States.

LegacyUser

This isn't the best advice, but I do know someone who did the same thing and is resolutely ignoring the letters being sent to him......
I doubt you can go back into the states, unless you're prepared to pay. Otherwise, the guy I know, it happened to him a few years ago and nobody has come after him.
Not what I'd recommend.But just to reassure you that the likelihood of the FBI coming knocking at your door, or anything like that, is fairly slim.

LegacyUser

OP-Welcome to the world of the grown up. If you cannot control the amount you are drinking and it is causing you problems like this you have a problem with alcohol. US hospitals are run as businesses-it's a totally different scenario to Ireland or Europe. So if you ran up a bill of $2000 in a bar, shop or restaurant, you shouldn't pay it because you were drunk? Cop on. Who forced you to drink so much?

This is a wake-up call for you-you need to grow up. I presume you are over 21 (so you were able to get hammered in USA) so you are an adult. This means taking responsibility for your actions and paying your bills. You have to pay this bill or it will be on your record and you may be denied entry to the US in the future. America has a long memory about not taking responsiblity for your actions-a friend of my father's dodged the Vietnan draft in th 60s without going through the proper conscientious objector channels and still can't get a tourist visa to visit.

iguana

Did you fly with Aer Lingus? If so, when you booked your flights do you remember if you checked the box for insurance? It's usually about €30 and it generally covers emergency medical care as well as missed flights, cancellations etc. If you can't remember check all of the emails you received when you booked your flights. And if you flew with another airline check their emails too as I'm sure they have similar policies.

You will have to pay this, and while I can't say for sure, my gut feeling is that this will impact negatively on you being allowed back to the US if you don't pay it.

It must have been pretty bad if someone brought you to the hospital and you weren't even aware enough to stop it happening. Surely you know that being passed out drunk in public is not the norm over there? Someone obviously felt concerned enough to take the time to help you. As for the money, you received a service and you will be expected to pay for it. Why shouldn't you? The whole situation is entirely of your own doing. You say you don't know how the system works and you don't know when you need to pay? Well, why don't you look it up online? There is no excuse for burying your head in the sand at this point. You are coming across like a child.

gypsy777

Hey man

That really sucks. No travel insurance im guessing?

If you dont have the money then jump on the plane home and pray they cant track you down.

LegacyUser

Look he already feels bad, no point in making him feek worse!!! This can happen to ANYONE especially when you are young and not used to drinking so come down off your high horse.....we all have a story or two from our youth!
For a start, the healthcare system over there is completely overpriced, if you have no money or insurance you are completely screwed. You could have been charged 2000 dollars for a doctor to look briefly look over you, this I know for a fact.
So like most people in similar situations you could:
a) Ring them from a private number, tell them you cannot afford to pay, you have no money and see what happens.
b)you can return the mail to sender (not at this address).
c)Do nothing and see what happens

If it's any consulation I have never heard of anyone getting into trouble over this, they do have a fund there for this very reason and millions of americans cannot afford their own bills not to mind visitors. And I have never heard of anyone having trouble getting back in, I don't think it goes in as breaking the law as such you may have to check that out. Did you show them your passport??
You are lucky, bills are usually 10,000 and more.

The choice has to be your own, but good luck.

tierno

thanks for your replies.

i know i should clarify a few points and hope i can. im not by any means a raging alcoholic. this doesnt happen to me and that is one of the reasons i am freaked out about what happened. i know that it was irresponible to get drunk but id like to think that no one can throw stones in that regard. i ended up in hospital in a foreign country where anything could have happened me. it is scary to think and wouldnt wish it on anyone. but i am holding up my hands and admiting it.

there was no sick/stomach pump/tubes i know that for a fact. and i also know there was no violence.. not too happy with the assumption that there was. the cops would have been called for one point.

i know it is a difference of cultures when someone gets admitted for being drunk over there as opposed to overhere. i was hoping it was a bad dream but like was said i have to face up to it now. and thats why i came on for advice. ive had lectures since coming home - alot of which i have given myself. this wasnt a drink fuelled holiday ibiza, i got separated from my friends and ended up in hospital.

the letters are coming to my home house and thats why i have biggest issue - it will completely worry my parents. and i dont want that.

i have no source of income otherwise i would pay the thing and try and forget the whole thing. but having no money i dont know what to do.

i will take everything that was written into account.including my responsibilty when it comes to drink. thanks again for replies.

prinz

Unregistered wrote: »

If it's any consulation I have never heard of anyone getting into trouble over this, they do have a fund there for this very reason and millions of americans cannot afford their own bills not to mind visitors. And I have never heard of anyone having trouble getting back in, I don't think it goes in as breaking the law as such you may have to check that out. Did you show them your passport??
You are lucky, bills are usually 10,000 and more.
The choice has to be your own, but good luck.

Er, who do you think contributes to the "fund".... . Yes they can hold this against you if you ever apply to return to the States, I know this. In fact many countries operate on this basis. American hospitals as someone pointed out are operated as business, so walking out on a bill does consitute breaking a law, just as anyone who walks into a shop and orders €2000 worth of stuff and then fecks off home without paying for it. Sure shops have insurance etc against loss of stock but it's still thieving... If I nick your car tomorrow, and tell you the insurance will cover it, it's not my problem would you be as quick to shrug it off I wonder.

VaioCruiser

tierno wrote: »

...
hi sorry first post but long time viewer.
and really have no where to turn. Here's my story...all help and advice really appreciated.

You had enough money to go on holiday ...

You should get a grip on this ... write to them now ... tell them you cannot pay all in one go... but you can pay over a period.

That will get them to relax for a while.

Get a job and pay them in installments. You owe them and it is your responsibility to pay. Do you want this to hang over you the rest of your life ?

Do what you need to do and free yourself.

All the best.

Taltos

prinz wrote: »

Er, who do you think contributes to the "fund".... . Yes they can hold this against you if you ever apply to return to the States, I know this. In fact many countries operate on this basis. American hospitals as someone pointed out are operated as business, so walking out on a bill does consitute breaking a law, just as anyone who walks into a shop and orders €2000 worth of stuff and then fecks off home without paying for it. Sure shops have insurance etc against loss of stock but it's still thieving... If I nick your car tomorrow, and tell you the insurance will cover it, it's not my problem would you be as quick to shrug it off I wonder.

+1
Also keep in mind that if not already they may soon start adding interest.
Do you really want to try to enter the country in say 5 yrs and be arrested for owing thousands in interest???...

Again - look to the health insurance / travel insurance.
Failing that think you might need to get a loan or agree a repayment schedule with them.

iguana

tierno wrote: »

i have no source of income otherwise i would pay the thing and try and forget the whole thing. but having no money i dont know what to do.

Are you 100% sure that you do not have insurance? That you didn't buy it with your plane tickets or that your parents don't have a family policy which includes you?

If you aren't insured take a look on the American Hospital Association site, especially the billings and collection page for more information; http://www.aha.org/aha_app/issues/BCC/index.jsp

I know there are charities which will help uninsured patients pay their bills, but I suspect they prioritise cancer patients and the like over alcohol poisoning.

prinz

If you went on a student visa it's possible you went via USIT or some other body? Often times insurance is built in. Again however from my own experience a few years back anything self inflicted is not covered IIRC from the induction course.

starchild

the health charges in the US are ludicrous, something very similar happened to me, and i got a bill for 4700 dollars for 2 days (one night) in hospital, no scans, no x rays, just bed for night and couple painkillers. I had no insurance.

I am a big believer in paying my bills and i am always happy to do so but in this case i believed it was way over the top, i wasnt drunk so remembered everything.

I got the bills when i got back, i rang them and we argued it out for a while, it ended up going to a debt colection agency in the UK, i settled with them for 850 dollars. Even the guy in the Uk said it was a joke how much they charge

Get in touch, dont avoid it but dont be afraid to argue your case, ask for a detailed bill to see what the charge is for. Just because they are a hospital doesnt mean its accounting dept wont screw you

Firetrap

If you're not covered by insurance, can you not just go to your local credit union and get a loan. If you think your ignoring this will make it all go away, you're mistaken. In a worst case scenario, it could stop you getting back into the U.S. again.

Devious

starchild wrote: »

the health charges in the US are ludicrous, something very similar happened to me, and i got a bill for 4700 dollars for 2 days (one night) in hospital, no scans, no x rays, just bed for night and couple painkillers. I had no insurance.

I am a big believer in paying my bills and i am always happy to do so but in this case i believed it was way over the top, i wasnt drunk so remembered everything.

I got the bills when i got back, i rang them and we argued it out for a while, it ended up going to a debt colection agency in the UK, i settled with them for 850 dollars. Even the guy in the Uk said it was a joke how much they charge

Get in touch, dont avoid it but dont be afraid to argue your case, ask for a detailed bill to see what the charge is for. Just because they are a hospital doesnt mean its accounting dept wont screw you

This. The US health care system is corrupt beyond belief - the amounts being charged are sickening. Argue them down to something approaching a sane amount, don't listen to some of the sheep on here telling you to just go ahead and pay the full amount.

LegacyUser

starchild wrote: »

the health charges in the US are ludicrous, something very similar happened to me, and i got a bill for 4700 dollars for 2 days (one night) in hospital, no scans, no x rays, just bed for night and couple painkillers. I had no insurance.

I am a big believer in paying my bills and i am always happy to do so but in this case i believed it was way over the top, i wasnt drunk so remembered everything.

I got the bills when i got back, i rang them and we argued it out for a while, it ended up going to a debt colection agency in the UK, i settled with them for 850 dollars. Even the guy in the Uk said it was a joke how much they charge

Get in touch, dont avoid it but dont be afraid to argue your case, ask for a detailed bill to see what the charge is for. Just because they are a hospital doesnt mean its accounting dept wont screw you

Yes, healthcare in the US is expensive, but if you avail of it you have to pay for it. Would you go into an expensive store and take something without paying for it, and then claim you just didn't know the rules? The OP is an ADULT. He made poor choices about how he spent his evening and has to pay up. Simple. Others and the OP have said he shouldn't be judged and we all make mistakes. Not one person I know has ended up in a hospital in the US because they couldn't control their alcohol consumption. He can afford to drink and take a holiday, so he can afford to pay this-might need to work overtime or get a loan but its a bill that must be paid like any other.
AFAIK This is a not a forum to debate the flaws of the US healthcare system. The OP availed of a service, be it from a flawed system or not, and as an adult he has to face the outcomes of his actions.

Hazys

Devious wrote: »

This. The US health care system is corrupt beyond belief - the amounts being charged are sickening. Argue them down to something approaching a sane amount, don't listen to some of the sheep on here telling you to just go ahead and pay the full amount.

Maybe get them to throw in a few free crutches and bed pans in the deal :rolleyes:

You messed up, do the right thing and pay up. $2000 might seem a lot now but in a few years its going to be a lot greater and may ruin your opportunities of getting a job in the US.

Firetrap

Firetrap wrote: »

If you're not covered by insurance, can you not just go to your local credit union and get a loan. If you think your ignoring this will make it all go away, you're mistaken. In a worst case scenario, it could stop you getting back into the U.S. again.

"in the worst case scenario"
"it could"

care to add anything else worth nothing?


O.P don't worry about it.. wait for it to reach the debt collection agency. normally i wouldn't advise this but there's no benefit paying now and it will give you time to save for it if needed

kelle

My cousin spent a year in the US, and he was a bit of a latchyco when he was out there. He spent about a year there.

Two years later, he decided to return. On arrival there, his passport was read and immediately all his unpaid fines were displayed. He was refused entry.

I would advise you to take out a Credit Union loan and pay it off, especially if you ever want to return to the US.

Overheal

Traveling uninsured: don't.

The 2 grand may be marked up a bit. But you will still end up paying a fair amount of it, wether it goes to collections or not. Go to FLAC and see what they tell you. You might be able to get someone to argue down the cost, but don't count on it.

tbh

insurance is irrelevant. Even if the OP had the most comprehensive policy in the world, it wouldn't cover this. OP, probably nothing is going to happen. You probably wouldn't be stopped going into the states, but I doubt I'd risk it. If you did get stopped, it would not be pleasant. If I were in your shoes I'd bite the bullet and tell your parents, but if you ignore that advice, most likely nothing bad will happen.

Xiney

It's highly unlikely you'd be stopped getting back into the states.

What will probably happen, if you don't pay, is that they will sell your debt to a debt collection agency who will then attempt to get the money off you. It's not the government and it's not the hospital that you'll owe money to then, it's this agency. And they don't really have much pull on letting you in or out of the country, you don't even have a SSN for them to ruin a credit rating on (although I'm not sure if they would be able to link up your credit rating here. Unlikely but possible if they sold it to an Irish debt collector)


Anyway, you do have a duty to pay since you used the service, whether you were aware of it or not. However, you can and should ask for an itemized bill. And you should let them know that you are uninsured, this sometimes gets the price down (they jack up the prices for insurance companies to compensate for this). Finally you should organize a payment plan, whatever you can afford: 20 euro a week is better than nothing in their mind.


(As an aside, my mother had two c-sections in the states. My family moved back to Canada and they stopped paying the bills eventually. The collections agency eventually gave up. My parents have had no problems going back to the states, although I'm not sure what their credit rating is like over there. I suspect it's no longer relevant since it was over 20 years ago, but hey)

Zaph

Xiney wrote: »

Finally you should organize a payment plan, whatever you can afford: 20 euro a week is better than nothing in their mind.

Only problem with drip payments to the States is that bank charges would eat up the amounts being paid and you'd end up paying a lot less off each week/month than you thought you were paying. You'd be far better off trying to get some money together and making a single or a couple of larger payments, the charges wouldn't be that much higher.

LegacyUser

I think people should get off his back a bit. He clearly knows he did wrong but is shocked and upset at the size of the bill. We've all travelled and had bad things happen to us ( self inflicted or not) and I don't think the OP came here for judgement, just advice, which is what boards does best. It's really disheartening to see people make outlandish assumptions about him and his life. All we know is what he wrote, he was hospitalized, stupidly and now has bills. Plenty of people I know have been landed in dire situations because of The way US healthcare works. Its not uncommon.

As for the bill. Dont pay if full. Ring them, negotiate, question it. From your post it sounds like they admitted you, and then not much else. This has happened people I know, who have been seen by a doctor given a painkiller and then charged 2000 dollars for the priveledge. TBH is right, your debt will go to a debt collection agency. Its in their hands then. But you wont be dissallowed from the states.

My advice, negotiate. But whatever happens, im sure you've beaten yourself up enough without me casting another stone. Best of luck.

LostinKildare

tbh wrote: »

insurance is irrelevant. Even if the OP had the most comprehensive policy in the world, it wouldn't cover this.

What do you mean? Of course it would.

I go back home to the U.S. twice a year, always covered by a travel insurance policy I get through the credit union. 50 euros covers the whole family for all trips everywhere for a year.

We've had to avail of it several times, including on one trip when all three of us were struck by the Norwalk virus and had to be taken to hospitals for treatment (my son in a posh Virginia hospital, OH and I a few days later in the Newark NJ A&E hellhole). Medical bills from that trip were well into the five figures.

OP if you were admitted to a hospital and it cost only $2000 you got off lightly. But ring them and tell them you're unemployed and can't pay and they'll likely reduce the amount significantly -- after all, getting something from you is better than getting nothing. And never go to the U.S. again without travel insurance!

LegacyUser

ok
first - travel insurance usually has to be pre-approved. i.e. when going to the hospital u have to rignt he insurance company to tell them about it and get approval. stupid but true
second - I'd be much more worreid about getting a bad credit rating then not getting back into the country
third - call them, ask for the break down. argue them down. pay it. u don't want to find out you have a poor credit rating when you go to buy a house or something
four - maybe tell your folks. I'd tell mine - they'd be mad but get over it. better than them finding out by stumbling into one of your letters

whislt $2000 is alot of money I'm kind of surpirsed its not more given its the us we are talking about

iguana

LostinKildare wrote: »

What do you mean? Of course it would.

I go back home to the U.S. twice a year, always covered by a travel insurance policy I get through the credit union. 50 euros covers the whole family for all trips everywhere for a year.

We've had to avail of it several times, including on one trip when all three of us were struck by the Norwalk virus and had to be taken to hospitals for treatment (my son in a posh Virginia hospital, OH and I a few days later in the Newark NJ A&E hellhole). Medical bills from that trip were well into the five figures.

I think tbh means that the insurance may not cover it because it was hospital care due to alcohol abuse, which is entirely different from getting a virus as it's self-inflicted.

LostinKildare

iguana wrote: »

I think tbh means that the insurance may not cover it because it was hospital care due to alcohol abuse, which is entirely different from getting a virus as it's self-inflicted.

Well I wouldn't have thought that would matter, but I checked my policy and I see that it does exclude "expenses arising from the treatment of alcohol abuse." Pardon me, tbh.

bSlick

Whatever about how you ended up in this situation op, the question is how to deal with it now. I know you have already got several reples giving you the usual guilt trip and "its your fault now pay the 2K" type stuff. I however am gong to give you a real world answer.

In the real world if someone owes 2K to a faceless organisation worth millions in a country thousands of miles away that cannot prosecute them or negatively impact on them in any way, that person will not pay the 2K. It's all well and good to say take the responsibility and pay, but the op will not feel any better about the whole thing if he pays, he'll actually feel alot worse as he would be 2K poorer and with nothing to show for it at all. Maybe some of you have such a conscience that if you were in this position yourselves you wouldn't be able to sleep at night and your every waking moment would be spent terrorised with thoughts of guilt at not paying over the 2K to some faceless organisation worth millions in a country thousands of miles away. If however op, you are not one of these people, just forget about the whole thing and get on with your life. By the way, the hospital obviously don't have much of a conscience charging 2K for a bed for a night...everyone knows the US health care system is a total rip-off, but that doesn't stop some people here from giving out to you and patronising you about ending up in this situation and telling you to pay the (extortionate) 2K. :rolleyes:


Also there is no chance in hell you will be stopped going into the US if you dont pay. The most the hospital can do is pass the debt to a collection agency who actually cant do anything to you other than send letters asking for the money. I highly doubt any US collection agencies would take this debt off their hands anyway as it is much costlier/much more effort required to chase down a debt from a foreigner, and there chances of success are much reduced aswell. I can't see any agency taking on this kind of debt when its only for 2K.

The people who are saying you won't be allowed back in are way off. The only way you don't get back in is if you have a criminal conviction in the US or Ireland or you own the US state itself money for a fine or something. Having a debt with a private company has nothing to do with getting into the US, its ludicrous to even suggest it, goes to show you how much nonsense some people here talk. The system would be open to huge abuse if private companies were allowed to stop people entering the country due to a debt.


In summary, don't be a complete fool and let yourself get ripped off for 2K by some faceless organisation worth millions and based three thousand+ miles away. Bin any letters you get from them and get on with your life.

bSlick

Also to all the people giving OP grief over getting drunk...for god sake get a life. Talk about being uptight....these kind of incidents happen to everyone one time or another.

iguana

bSlick wrote: »

Also there is no chance in hell you will be stopped going into the US if you dont pay......... Having a debt with a private company has nothing to do with getting into the US, its ludicrous to even suggest it, goes to show you how much nonsense some people here talk.

You have no idea if they could be stopped going into the US or not so don't state conjecture as fact. US hospitals aren't all private concerns many are partially state controlled, you haven't a clue how their system works, so can't state for sure if it will lead to the OP having problems entering the US in future. And there are different procedures for entering the US, the standard being the VWP for holidays from waiver agreement countries. But the OP may need to enter from a non waiver country at some point or need a work visa. All of these have different systems and rules and if a credit check is done it could have a negative impact on the decision. Saying it absolutely won't when you have no idea is very irresponsible.

Terodil

bSlick wrote: »

I however am gong to give you a real world answer.

:rolleyes:

bSlick wrote: »

In the real world if someone owes 2K to a faceless organisation worth millions in a country thousands of miles away

So, given that it's 'a faceless organisation' far away, it's suddenly ok to default on a debt? I find it hard to believe that somebody would openly advise such an immoral procedure.

bSlick wrote: »

that cannot prosecute them or negatively impact on them in any way, that person will not pay the 2K.

Maybe. There are people who realise though that it's not a faceless organisation, it's countless people who put their hard-earned money in. And now some foreigner stumbles into the country, drinks himself to oblivion, needs medical attention, and just because it's difficult to reach out to him, he should rather watch his own pocket?

Sorry bSlick, but if you are going to argue that way, then I think we will need some real guilt-tripping here to re-calibrate the moral compass.

bSlick wrote: »

It's all well and good to say take the responsibility and pay, but the op will not feel any better about the whole thing if he pays, he'll actually feel alot worse as he would be 2K poorer and with nothing to show for it at all.

What about moral integrity? fefs, you don't run around stealing money from people just because they have no way of getting back at you... I hope.

bSlick wrote: »

Also there is no chance in hell you will be stopped going into the US if you dont pay.

As long as no criminal charges are brought against the OP, that's true. There's no link between the debt and immigration.

If, however, the hospital decides to press charges, and they can, it will end up in the OP's record. It's probable they won't, but it's a risk.

But all this consequence talk is sh*t anyway. You could advocate anything arguing that you can get away with it, that doesn't make it right. The OP should man up and do the right thing.

iguana

bSlick wrote: »

these kind of incidents happen to everyone one time or another.

No they don't, I'm willing to bet that the majority of people never, ever get hospitalised for alcohol poisoning. Especially when they are in a foreign country where they are unaware of the healthcare system and are, in effect, ambassadors for their country.

Wagon

Don't pay it. Just ignore them.

tierno wrote: »

there was no sick/stomach pump/tubes i know that for a fact. and i also know there was no violence..

So to clarify, you were admitted to A&E by soime paranoid git, nothing whatsoever was done when you got there and now you are being demanded to pay 2000 dollers for it?

Fúck them. I always pay my bills but this is a joke. If you are worried get to a debt agency and see if they can arrage something but don't pay what they are demanding.

Overheal

iguana wrote: »

You have no idea if they could be stopped going into the US or not so don't state conjecture as fact. US hospitals aren't all private concerns many are partially state controlled, you haven't a clue how their system works, so can't state for sure if it will lead to the OP having problems entering the US in future. And there are different procedures for entering the US, the standard being the VWP for holidays from waiver agreement countries. But the OP may need to enter from a non waiver country at some point or need a work visa. All of these have different systems and rules and if a credit check is done it could have a negative impact on the decision. Saying it absolutely won't when you have no idea is very irresponsible.

hell, i dont know, and i live here. Again, I would advise getting your Real Advice, from the FLAC or a private solicitor who actually knows.

Cuddlesworth

kelle wrote: »

My cousin spent a year in the US, and he was a bit of a latchyco when he was out there. He spent about a year there.

Two years later, he decided to return. On arrival there, his passport was read and immediately all his unpaid fines were displayed. He was refused entry.

I would advise you to take out a Credit Union loan and pay it off, especially if you ever want to return to the US.

iguana wrote: »

You have no idea if they could be stopped going into the US or not so don't state conjecture as fact. US hospitals aren't all private concerns many are partially state controlled, you haven't a clue how their system works, so can't state for sure if it will lead to the OP having problems entering the US in future. And there are different procedures for entering the US, the standard being the VWP for holidays from waiver agreement countries. But the OP may need to enter from a non waiver country at some point or need a work visa. All of these have different systems and rules and if a credit check is done it could have a negative impact on the decision. Saying it absolutely won't when you have no idea is very irresponsible.

Its a civil matter. And he can't get a court order taken against him as they can't subpoena him. But as above, if he ever needs to go to a bank there, odds are his credit history is screwed. But there is a time limit on it.

I wouldn't pay.

cafecolour

Practically speaking, there's not any criminal charges for not paying it - tons of folks in the US have outstanding medical debts. Eventually (perhaps already), it'll get passed to a debt collection agency, who work for a percentage of the debt and will send threatening letters and phone calls from call centers in India and the like. They may also add additional fees for going to collection/late payment, etc.

In the US it can possible ruin your credit rating (ie make it more difficult/impossible to get bank loans, credit cards, mortgage). I don't know if Irish banks check a US credit rating though - I'd say it's unlikely at this point, but I would say it's more likely in the future that these things are unified.

I don't know if it would affect your next visa. I know they sometimes look at if you have enough money to live during your stay, etc. but I don't know if they count outstanding debts in that.

Generally medical bills are happy if they are getting a bit, so maybe you should send them 50 a month or so until it's paid off.

JONJO THE MISER

Just ignore it O.P nothing will come of it, your in Ireland now so dont worry about it, it would be diffrent if you were living in the states but you were only there on Holiday.

bSlick

iguana wrote: »

You have no idea if they could be stopped going into the US or not so don't state conjecture as fact. US hospitals aren't all private concerns many are partially state controlled, you haven't a clue how their system works, so can't state for sure if it will lead to the OP having problems entering the US in future. And there are different procedures for entering the US, the standard being the VWP for holidays from waiver agreement countries. But the OP may need to enter from a non waiver country at some point or need a work visa. All of these have different systems and rules and if a credit check is done it could have a negative impact on the decision. Saying it absolutely won't when you have no idea is very irresponsible.

Unless they take him to court which they can't and won't it won't on his record with US state. Why would he need to enter from a non waiver country anyway when he is an Irish citizen?

Overheal

bSlick wrote: »

Unless they take him to court which they can't and won't it won't on his record with US state. Why would he need to enter from a non waiver country anyway when he is an Irish citizen?

Think with both hemispheres for a second people: why dont we all just run up huge debts and then skip town?

Think McFly.

metrovelvet

iguana wrote: »

You have no idea if they could be stopped going into the US or not so don't state conjecture as fact. US hospitals aren't all private concerns many are partially state controlled, you haven't a clue how their system works, so can't state for sure if it will lead to the OP having problems entering the US in future. And there are different procedures for entering the US, the standard being the VWP for holidays from waiver agreement countries. But the OP may need to enter from a non waiver country at some point or need a work visa. All of these have different systems and rules and if a credit check is done it could have a negative impact on the decision. Saying it absolutely won't when you have no idea is very irresponsible.

If they let Gerry Adams in, I doubt they wouldnt let the OP in. The debt is a write off.

OP can always he he wasnt concious to give consent to be admitted.

bSlick

Terodil wrote: »

:rolleyes:

:rolleyes:

So, given that it's 'a faceless organisation' far away, it's suddenly ok to default on a debt? I find it hard to believe that somebody would openly advise such an immoral procedure.

Yes. I think he would be mad to throw away money like this. What will he get out of it anyway...a clear consciene??? Maybe he's not even feeling guilty about it, I certainly wouldn't be. So in that case he would be getting absolutely nothing for it. 2K is alot of money to many people now in the recession. The only reason you have for him to pay it is that it is 'the right thing to do morally'. I personally would have no issue with not paying it if I was in the op's position. It wouldn't bother me in the slightest that I didn't pay it. That's because Im living in the real world and I realise life isn't fair. Just like the hospital know that life isn't fair when they billed the op for 2K for basically bed and breakfast (did you even get breakfast for you 2K op?). 2K is seriously outrageous, you would expect to be getting some kind of surgery for 2K, not an overnight stay.

Maybe. There are people who realise though that it's not a faceless organisation, it's countless people who put their hard-earned money in. And now some foreigner stumbles into the country, drinks himself to oblivion, needs medical attention, and just because it's difficult to reach out to him, he should rather watch his own pocket?

Sorry bSlick, but if you are going to argue that way, then I think we will need some real guilt-tripping here to re-calibrate the moral compass.

What about moral integrity? fefs, you don't run around stealing money from people just because they have no way of getting back at you... I hope.

It is a faceless company, you can't get much more of a faceless company than a US hospital. As for moral integrity...I'm going to give you a good example of the way moral integrity works in the real world - how many people on this thread who are advising the op to pay this 2K have downloaded free music/movies/tv shows off the net...it's highly likely that the answer is most of them, because thats the way things work in the real world. I would imagine you have done so yourself...if not, congratulation you are one of the 5% these days who hasn't downloaded copyrighted material off the net. It is common knowledge that everyone is downloading this stuff these days, and the reason they are doing it is because they can get away with it and the only loser in this situation is the big faceless music corporations/movie studios.

As long as no criminal charges are brought against the OP, that's true. There's no link between the debt and immigration.

If, however, the hospital decides to press charges, and they can, it will end up in the OP's record. It's probable they won't, but it's a risk.

We both know well that a big business isn't going to bother it's hole filing a lawsuit against an individual for a mere 2K. When a hospital calls in the legal deparment you can be sure that there will be several hundred K, minimum, at stake.

But all this consequence talk is sh*t anyway. You could advocate anything arguing that you can get away with it, that doesn't make it right. The OP should man up and do the right thing.

I can agree on that - do the right thing. And in this case the right thing is not to be chump and pay 2K to a US hospital that has come to a figure of 2K for an overnight stay. If you dont have a guilty conscience over it op, you stand to gain exactly nothing by paying.

bSlick

Overheal wrote: »

Think with both hemispheres for a second people: why dont we all just run up huge debts and then skip town?

Think McFly.

Yes, huge debts...why don't you try thinking with both hemispheres for a second...this is 2K we are talking about, not 200K. This is not a huge debt. It might be big to the OP, but to a company this money is nothing, they probably spend alot more annually on paper clips. If you skip town owing several hundred thousand dollars/euros you can be sure that it will be pursued. And it will go to court and you will be convicted. What happens if you owe 2k? Well worst case scenario a debt collection agency takes the debt and sends you a couple of letters, that is if the hospital can find an agency dumb enough to take on a debt owed by a person thousands of miles away.

iguana

bSlick wrote: »

Unless they take him to court which they can't and won't it won't on his record with US state. Why would he need to enter from a non waiver country anyway when he is an Irish citizen?

Because at some future point he could end up living in a country that is not a member of the visa and want/need to take a trip to the US. It happens all the time. And it doesn't matter that you are from a VWP country, if you are not travelling on specific routes you need to get a non-immigrant visa.

VaioCruiser

OP.

There is such a thing as personal integrity and honesty.

There is also such a thing as being 'smart'.

You have no idea what might happen to you in the future - who you may meet and where you may wish to travel or work.

Do the right thing and get this sorted. It is not a lot of money and I believe you CAN come to an arrangement about paying it off. You will have amuch happier and more content life if you do.

All the best.