Why would someone buy a Mac?

gimme5minutes

As the title says, I've been wondering what motivates people to go out and spend a ton of money on a vastly overpriced machine - a Mac desktop/laptop - when they can get a 'windows' machine with the same specs (or better) for literally half the price.

So who are the demographic that buy Macs? And why do you think they buy them instead of a regular pc/laptop?

mehmeh12

I'm thinking getting a mac due to the lack of viruses. Security is **** in windows. And i think the white exterior is quite nice compared to the standard black/grey pc look.

PCPhoto

most macs are aesthetically pleasing and operate virtually virus free.

I have both PC and Mac and prefer my mac.

YES - PC's are cheaper and as fast if not faster....but for start up time - macs are much faster and as I mentioned earlier virtually virus free.

hshortt

Probably for Simplicity.

That said I prefer PCs.

Tallon

Design, design, design, if you work in the movie business, photography, video editing, eb design etc. they are essential and very easy to use

damienmcd

I'm a web designer and that's what I bought mine for.

Of course the lack of viruses and the fact that it works straight out of the box were significant positives in my choice.

Even high-end windoze machines find it hard to cope with processor / memory intensive apps that are the basis of web design / dev such as the Adobe suites and any video / music editing software.

They look better too.

lightening

I work on one, so it was natural that got one for home. I find them better for CS and graphics.

mehmeh12

Can you play many pc games on a mac?

3House

Yes you can on the newer intel based one. You have to use bootcamp and install windows XP, But I ask you why would you bother, That's what xboxes and the like are for.

caffrey

lots of good answers here. I use one for work. Great for programming and all/most opensource linux/Unix programs are portable. There is an app for almost anything which is downloadable free. A lot of scientific software is developed for linux/Mac only and that is what I need. I had pcs previously and had various linux distros on them over the years but none of them have the ease of use that OS X has, granted you can get said distros to do anything but it can be a hassle.

mehmeh12

But would windows XP under bootcamp on a mac still be virus resistant like the mac OS?

mtarmey59

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Sad Professor

I disagree that Macs are "vastly" overpriced. I mean they certainly aren't cheap so obviously if you are on a budget they aren't for you. But a computer is an investment and you get what you pay for. If you were to compare a PC notebook of similar spec and design with a Macbook there isn't a huge amount in the difference. You are, of course, also paying for the OS. Even if you are only buying for OS X, Macs are worth every penny imo.

There is an lot of ignorant nonsense about Macs out there being spread by people who have never used them. They are very user friendly and reliable, and they hold their value really well. Over the years I've encouraged many people to switch over and none of them had any regrets.

Voodu Child

Ah they are overpriced for sure.

I mean, look at the laptops. 15.4" is a pretty mainstream size, I wouldn't use any smaller unless portability was a concern. Yes, ive owned 13.3" laptops (and smaller) before but my eyes would not thank me if they were to be my main laptop.

So I decide I want a laptop with 15.4" screen - what is the cheapest 15.4" Mac Laptop you can buy? - €1649

The feckin things start at €1649. How is that not overpriced, you can buy quality 15.4" machines from other manufacturers for €600, €700, all day long. Frankly ridiculous.

trihead

I think one of the main reasons people invest in a mac is that they are far superior and more suitable for working with Design software/ 3d/ Video editing/ sound etc than a pc laptop.:)

mehmeh12

Ok explain to me why mac's are more suited for design/ graphic stuff?

aidan_walsh

I think that an opinion that hasn't changed much since the 90s. Macs are used by a great many more people for day to day activities than for music editing.

Sad Professor

Voodu Child wrote:

Ah they are overpriced for sure.

I mean, look at the laptops. 15.4" is a pretty mainstream size, I wouldn't use any smaller unless portability was a concern. Yes, ive owned 13.3" laptops (and smaller) before but my eyes would not thank me if they were to be my main laptop.

So I decide I want a laptop with 15.4" screen - what is the cheapest 15.4" Mac Laptop you can buy? - €1649

The feckin things start at €1649. How is that not overpriced, you can buy quality 15.4" machines from other manufacturers for €600, €700, all day long. Frankly ridiculous.

I said of similar design and spec. Apple could offer a cheap 15 inch Macbook in plastic minus a whole bunch of components (webcam, bluetooth, multi-touch trackpad, etc) if they wanted to. But they don't. Just because they aren't competing with Dell doesn't mean they are overpriced.

You need to look at more than just the price. What are you getting for it? Is a user friendly and reliable operating system worth spending extra on? Is a 7 hour battery life, unibody design, etc? Apple deal in fully featured computers. They don't leave out a bunch of stuff or cut corners on the design to make the price look better.

melekalikimaka

mehmeh12 wrote: »

Ok explain to me why mac's are more suited for design/ graphic stuff?

they arent really, up til recently pc had the edge as there was no 64bit photoshop on mac, think there might be now... i use macs in college, top spec ones for photogrphy, and i have my laptop at home and prefer my laptop, with windows 7 and a boot of ram, and gfx support now in ps, there is no advantage really, cept that the commands are different in macs and they are prettier

gimme5minutes

mehmeh12 wrote: »

I'm thinking getting a mac due to the lack of viruses. Security is **** in windows. And i think the white exterior is quite nice compared to the standard black/grey pc look.

Better security, that's a fair enough reason.

Tallon wrote:

Design, design, design, if you work in the movie business, photography, video editing, eb design etc. they are essential and very easy to use

What difference do they make if you work in one of the areas you listed? All the industry standard apps used for those areas are available on windows - Photoshop and Illustrator for graphic/photography work, Maya/3DS Max for movies/computer games. I'm sure there are plenty of industry standard video editors for windows too. If you're using these apps for work you will be spending 95%+ of your time inside them where the OS is irrelevant. So what is the big advantage with macs for design work?

damienmcd wrote:

I'm a web designer and that's what I bought mine for.

Of course the lack of viruses and the fact that it works straight out of the box were significant positives in my choice.

Lack of viruses fair enough. I don't get what you mean by "works straight out of the box"...any pc/laptop you buy in a shop or online will also be working fine straight out of the box so I can't see how you can list that as an advantage for macs.

Even high-end windoze machines find it hard to cope with processor / memory intensive apps that are the basis of web design / dev such as the Adobe suites and any video / music editing software.

If you spend as much on a windows machine as you do on a mac it will cope alot better with intensive apps than the mac due to having a massively improved spec. You get far more bang for your buck with a regular pc/laptop.

They look better too.

I think that is most people's primary reason for buying them. They pay a huge premium for looks/brand. The same thing happens in the mp3 player market, people shell out a premium for a ipod when at the end of the day there are lots of other players they could buy that are way cheaper and will play mp3's just as well.

Sad Professor wrote:

I disagree that Macs are "vastly" overpriced. I mean they certainly aren't cheap so obviously if you are on a budget they aren't for you. But a computer is an investment and you get what you pay for. If you were to compare a PC notebook of similar spec and design with a Macbook there isn't a huge amount in the difference. You are, of course, also paying for the OS. Even if you are only buying for OS X, Macs are worth every penny imo.

If you were to compare a pc notebook of similar spec and design with a Macbook there will be probably 100% or more difference in price. If you leave out looks/branding, OSX is basically what you are paying the extra cash for. It's a better OS but to charge what they do for it is a straight up rip off. Most people spend most of their time on the net or in an app/game where the OS makes no difference.

There is an lot of ignorant nonsense about Macs out there being spread by people who have never used them. They are very user friendly and reliable, and they hold their value really well. Over the years I've encouraged many people to switch over and none of them had any regrets.

Windows pcs are user friendly these days too, every piece of hardware is plug and play. And I cant speak for vista having never used it but XP is very easy to use. My main OS is linux mint but XP is a very user friendly os and is more than enough for all but the top end of power users. And these days reliablity is not really an issue for pcs. Unlike the old windows 98 days where you could crash the computer typing in word, these days it is very rare to have a crash. I cant remember the last time Ive seen a bsod of death on xp and it probably crashed less than 4 times for me over the last 3 years and that was not actually down to the OS, it was down to fault in my factory outlet laptop that made it prone to overheating.

I can imagine the people you recommended a mac too were quite happy with it, but the issue is the price. They are good machines, I'm not questioning that, I'm merely pointing out the fact that they are a complete ripoff.

Discodog

I changed a while ago from Pc laptop to Powerbook & I love it. It's just so much nicer to use, never crashes, & no virus issues.

The resale value is really relevant - they fetch a fortune second hand compared to PC's

ant043

gimme5minutes wrote: »

As the title says, I've been wondering what motivates people to go out and spend a ton of money on a vastly overpriced machine - a Mac desktop/laptop - when they can get a 'windows' machine with the same specs (or better) for literally half the price.

So who are the demographic that buy Macs? And why do you think they buy them instead of a regular pc/laptop?

I have been using apple laptops for the last three years and would never switch back to vista again. I recently bought a 13 inch macbook pro and the build quality on this thing is amazing. You really get what you pay for when purchasing a notebook. Apple's customer service is also top notch compared to pc manufacturers particularly Dell. The resale value on apple products is fantastic. I've lost very little cash on each machine that i upgraded from by selling them on ebay. Finally there is the matter of the os itself. In my opinion leopard is light years ahead of any windows operating system. Vista is a heap of junk. Microsoft has even resorted to copying aspects of leopard in windows 7. They can make windows 7 more visually appealing but as long as windows still has that incomprehensible database that is the registry then it's still rotten at the core in my opinion.

Sad Professor

Have you ever used a Mac, gimme5minutes? What experience do you have with them?

And can you actually find me a PC notebook that's comparable to a Macbook for a half the price?

caffrey

Ok lets compare:

Dell M1530 seems a lot cheaper than the macbook pro 15inch, but on looking deeper it wont seem that clear cut.

When you customise the Dell to the same specs as the macbook, they work out at roughly the same price.

1699 for the mac with the standard specs.
you need to upgrade the processor, ram in the 1530 to get the same specs. Unfortunately with the dell you cannot upgrade the graphics card sos it stays on 1466, however the mac has a (much) better graphics card. I admit the dell has 70GB bigger HDD but thats nothing really.

I chose the Dell M1530 as it is the nearest "sleek looking" to the mac.

How is the mac much cheaper? half the price? I think not

gimme5minutes

Sad Professor wrote: »

I said of similar design and spec. Apple could offer a cheap 15 inch Macbook in plastic minus a whole bunch of components (webcam, bluetooth, multi-touch trackpad, etc) if they wanted to. But they don't. Just because they aren't competing with Dell doesn't mean they are overpriced.

You need to look at more than just the price. What are you getting for it? Is a user friendly and reliable operating system worth spending extra on? Is a 7 hour battery life, unibody design, etc? Apple deal in fully featured computers. They don't leave out a bunch of stuff or cut corners on the design to make the price look better.

What are you getting for your money? Here is a comparison I've done with a MacBook Pro and a Dell.

MacBook Pro
2.53Ghz Core 2 Duo
4GB 1066Mhz DD3 SDRAM
250GB Hard Drive
256MB Nvidia 9400M
MacBook Pro 15-inch Glossy Widescreen Display

Cost: €1649

Dell Inspiron 17
2.4Ghz Core 2 Duo
4GB 800Mhz DD2 SDRAM
500GB Hard Drive
512MB ATI Mobility 4330
17.3" WLED High Definition TFT Display with TrueLife™

Cost: €891.03

The Dell works out at 54% of the Mac. And it's not missing a whole bunch of components, I didn't bother listing them there but this Dell has a webcam and bluetooth. I left out the additional warranties on both machines, these are both with just basic warranties. Here's how the components break down -

CPU: Both Intel, Mac is slightly better

RAM: Both 4Gb's but Mac is a bit better

Hard Drive: Dell hard drive is double the size of the Mac.

Gfx Card: The ATI 4330 is more powerful than the Nvidia 9400M and that is with both having the same RAM, in this case the 4330 has double the RAM.

Screen: Dell is 17.3", Mac is 15", speaks for itself. I personally would never buy less than a 17" screen as once your used to 17 it's impossible to go back.

So I don't think there can be any doubt that the Dell is the better machine here. negligible difference in CPU and RAM, moderate difference in Gfx card, and very big difference in Hard Drive and Screen. And it only costs 54% the price of the mac.

One thing I noticed while doing this is that to upgrade the Mac from 4 to 8 gigs of RAM you pay €900. To upgrade the Dell from 4 to 8 you pay €298. That is some joke, if that doesn't tell you that Apple are rip off merchants nothing will. This is 2009, it shouldn't cost anything near €900 to put an extra 4 gigs of RAM into a laptop.

gimme5minutes

Sad Professor wrote:

Have you ever used a Mac, gimme5minutes? What experience do you have with them?

And can you actually find me a PC notebook that's comparable to a Macbook for a half the price?

caffrey wrote: »

Ok lets compare:

Dell M1530 seems a lot cheaper than the macbook pro 15inch, but on looking deeper it wont seem that clear cut.

When you customise the Dell to the same specs as the macbook, they work out at roughly the same price.

1699 for the mac with the standard specs.
you need to upgrade the processor, ram in the 1530 to get the same specs. Unfortunately with the dell you cannot upgrade the graphics card sos it stays on 1466, however the mac has a (much) better graphics card. I admit the dell has 70GB bigger HDD but thats nothing really.

I chose the Dell M1530 as it is the nearest "sleek looking" to the mac.

How is the mac much cheaper? half the price? I think not

See my above post for a detailed price matching comparison. A Dell with the same specs, actually better specs, doesn't not work out at roughly the same price, it works out at 54% of the price.

poppy123

Macs are so much more user friendly. They do not get virus's they way other pcs do and they dont crash or act up. I have an old G4 and it is still way better than the much newer pc that my husband has. Im just going into my final year of a BA hons in Art and am saving (very unsucessfully) to get a second hand mac book. I think id rather get one than anything else. Once you've used macs its very hard to go back to a normal pc as they are so much nicer to use. The graphics are far superior

oneofakind32

gimme5minutes wrote: »

As the title says, I've been wondering what motivates people to go out and spend a ton of money on a vastly overpriced machine - a Mac desktop/laptop - when they can get a 'windows' machine with the same specs (or better) for literally half the price.

So who are the demographic that buy Macs? And why do you think they buy them instead of a regular pc/laptop?

Several reasons!
Build quality - you'd be surprised at the punishment a macbook can take. A college lecturer told the story of how he watch his Macbook pro bounce down the road went back flipped it open and it worked. I have let mien fall on a few occasions and still works perfectly. All my friends who bought low end laptops havn't got much more 1 year to 18 months use of them before something went terminally wrong. Power adapters and battery seems to be a frequent problem for them
Software - OSX just dosen't require as much maintenance as windows (Vista or XP). Software and firmware updates from apple every month or so keep my mac running at top speed and I have never once had any sort of virus that I have noticed. Windows requires regular scanning with 3rd party software thats not even included with the OS (If it is, you uaually have to pay to register it). Start up and shutdown time is always very fast! We are not talking about hibernation here, we are talking complete restart (shutdown and start up) in sub 2 minutes on my 2 year macbook
Fashion - Mac people may not like to admit but Macs look cool and are fashionable and that is a lot of the reason why people buy them weather they admit it or not!
Patented features - Mag safe power adapters, multi touch track pads, this stuff just isn't available anywhere else!

All these arguments relate more to mac books. Having owned mac for 2 years while my fiends got through dell's and toshiba's I know I'v made the right choice and I would never consider buying a PC again unless Apple go horribly wrong somewhere down the line!

caffrey

gimme5minutes wrote: »

See my above post for a detailed price matching comparison. A Dell with the same specs, actually better specs, doesn't not work out at roughly the same price, it works out at 54% of the price.

These 2 laptops are not comparible. for one thing you must compare the same size laptop, it is easy to fit larger components of the same spec into a larger laptop. along with this it is good to note that this is not the sleekest style of dell. Inspiron is the basic package. like comparing to the macbooks. you are not comparing like for like, you are comparing apples and oranges

Edit:Even on the site Dell describes inspiron as affordable and the 1530m as "sleek"

gimme5minutes

caffrey wrote: »

These 2 laptops are not comparible. for one thing you must compare the same size laptop, it is easy to fit larger components of the same spec into a larger laptop. along with this it is good to note that this is not the sleekest style of dell. Inspiron is the basic package. like comparing to the macbooks. you are not comparing like for like, you are comparing apples and oranges

Why would I be using a Dell XPS as a sample laptop for a windows machine in this comparison??? Along with Macs and Sonys, Dell XPS are the most overpriced heavily rmarketed machines going, they're nearly as much a rip off as MacBook.

'Even on the site Dell describes inspiron as affordable and the 1530m as "sleek"

Basically what Dell are saying there is that if you are dumb enough to fall for the marketing then this is the laptop for you. They are for people who automatically think XPS means power when in fact entry level xps's are plain weak. The XPS 1530m is a joke of a laptop price wise. Anyone with half a clue about laptops would never consider buying an XPS.

This talk of sleekness has no relevance to any serious pc/laptop user or a user who doesn't care about image. I don't care how a machine looks, I care about the power. Your talk of sleekness as big factor in the price of the Mac just illustrates my point that most people buy them do so because they've bought into the branding and marketing.



You say the comparison is invalid because the Dell is larger? Well if I switch to the Dell Inspiron 1545 with the exact same components the price comes to €824.01, which is almost exactly half the price of the Mac.

Voodu Child

Okay, so we've said that the cheapest 15" Macbook is €1650. Here's a compareable Dell:
Studio 15
-2.4GHz dual core
-15.6" 1920x1080 LED-backlit screen
-4GB ram
-500GB HDD
-lower/mid GPU (HD4330, equal or better than 9400M)
€800

So I am under half the price of the cheapest 15" Macbook. You can argue about the spec - the Dell CPU is a 0.1GHz below the 2.5GHz in the Mac, but the screen res is much higher, the HDD is bigger, the GPU is a touch better. Its got some stuff that the Macbook doesnt have (eSata, HDMI, VGA, Expresscard) but we won't split hairs for now.

You can't argue about the savings, that's €850 quid in my pocket, and i've still got a fast, useable, quality 15" laptop. Is an Aluminium body, 'fashionability', and long-lasting (but not easily-replaceable) battery worth €850 quid. Maybe it is, maybe it isn't. I guess value is in the eye of the beholder.

Personally i'll pass, i'll take that €850 quid and buy a new laptop again in two or three years time.

gimme5minutes

oneofakind32 wrote: »

Several reasons!
Build quality - you'd be surprised at the punishment a macbook can take. A college lecturer told the story of how he watch his Macbook pro bounce down the road went back flipped it open and it worked. I have let mien fall on a few occasions and still works perfectly. All my friends who bought low end laptops havn't got much more 1 year to 18 months use of them before something went terminally wrong. Power adapters and battery seems to be a frequent problem for them

Well my Dell Precision M90 laptop that eventually died due to a hardware problem that I knew about when I bought it (because I got an 80% discount) took a serious beating over the last three years and never failed me until the graphics card burned out due to the aforementioned problem. It had fallen off the table numerous times and had been kicked around at parties (cd drive was literally kicked off), etc.... So Macs aren't the only machines with good build quality, and for the 100% price premium you pay for them it's the least they could do.

Software - OSX just dosen't require as much maintenance as windows (Vista or XP). Software and firmware updates from apple every month or so keep my mac running at top speed and I have never once had any sort of virus that I have noticed. Windows requires regular scanning with 3rd party software thats not even included with the OS (If it is, you uaually have to pay to register it). Start up and shutdown time is always very fast! We are not talking about hibernation here, we are talking complete restart (shutdown and start up) in sub 2 minutes on my 2 year macbook

I use Linux and I get basically all the benefits of a well designed, efficient OS, OSX, without paying a massive premium for a machine to run it on. Unfortunately linux is still not suitable for the general public, maybe eventually it will get mass take up from the general public if google do a good job on making their chrome operating system as user friendly as windows/osx.

Fashion - Mac people may not like to admit but Macs look cool and are fashionable and that is a lot of the reason why people buy them weather they admit it or not!
Patented features - Mag safe power adapters, multi touch track pads, this stuff just isn't available anywhere else!

I agree on this, I think most people buy them because they are cool and look cool. It's definitely not for the power. Apple have spent an absolute fortune placing their machines in every Hollywood movie going and that is a major part of the cost of their pcs/laptops, they need to make back the money they spent on advertising.

caffrey

gimme5minutes wrote: »

Why would I be using a Dell XPS as a sample laptop for a windows machine in this comparison??? Along with Macs and Sonys, Dell XPS are the most overpriced heavily rmarketed machines going, they're nearly as much a rip off as MacBook.

Basically what Dell are saying there is that if you are dumb enough to fall for the marketing then this is the laptop for you. They are for people who automatically think XPS means power when in fact entry level xps's are plain weak. The XPS 1530m is a joke of a laptop price wise. Anyone with half a clue about laptops would never consider buying an XPS.

This talk of sleekness has no relevance to any serious pc/laptop user or a user who doesn't care about image. I don't care how a machine looks, I care about the power. Your talk of sleekness as big factor in the price of the Mac just illustrates my point that most people buy them do so because they've bought into the branding and marketing.



You say the comparison is invalid because the Dell is larger? Well if I switch to the Dell Inspiron 1545 with the exact same components the price comes to €824.01, which is almost exactly half the price of the Mac.

You are again not comparing like for like. The inspirons are the low end model made of flimsy plastic. Compared to a lightweight, durable metal which works well as a heat sink preventing overheating.

A similar computer with a nice design and "durable outer casing to prevent fall-apart" is what the XPS is. You say this and sony are over-priced, well you pay for what u get. you dont have to buy it and I dont have to buy it, not gonna argue with you but i compare inspiron to the macbook and xps to the macbook pro. Take it or leave it.

gimme5minutes

caffrey wrote: »

You are again not comparing like for like. The inspirons are the low end model made of flimsy plastic. Compared to a lightweight, durable metal which works well as a heat sink preventing overheating.

Of course it's like for like. The specs are the same. What makes a laptop low/high is the components, not the casing. This is a laptop we are talking about, not a car, who cares if it's metal or plastic? It's not designed to be thrown around. What practical difference does metal make anyway other than somebody wouldn't be able to saw it in half? Metal casing doesn't make any difference to the outcome if you drop it on the floor, the damage there doesn't come from the laptop falling apart it comes from component/screen inside getting rattled. And there is no danger of a mac overheating with such a weak spec.

A similar computer with a nice design and "durable outer casing to prevent fall-apart" is what the XPS is. You say this and sony are over-priced, well you pay for what u get. you dont have to buy it and I dont have to buy it, not gonna argue with you but i compare inspiron to the macbook and xps to the macbook pro. Take it or leave it.

I have yet to see any laptop fall apart. You would throw it at the ground/wall at a serious force to make it actually fall apart or crack the casing, be it metal or plastic.


When Im buying a laptop I dont make a decision based on if its metal, plastic or carbon fibre I check the specs. I have never heard of anyone basing their decision to buy an inferior machine before based on the fact that it has metal casing.

caffrey

gimme5minutes wrote: »

I have yet to see any laptop fall apart. You would throw it at the ground/wall at a serious force to make it actually fall apart or crack the casing, be it metal or plastic.


When Im buying a laptop I dont make a decision based on if its metal, plastic or carbon fibre I check the specs. I have never heard of anyone basing their decision to buy an inferior machine before based on the fact that it has metal casing.

Firstly the fall-apart bit is a joke, you know what they are right? its a reference to the simpsons.

Secondly of course you wanna get good specs, I however want a comp that will last a few years. I am actually typing this on an inspiron which has a battery that needs to be charged non-stop, the power adapter has been replaced twice, the keyboard is falling apart and it gets overheated if I run anything tasking. Its only 3 years old.

my bottom line is you get what you pay for. This was cheap and it sucks. you really feel stronlgy about this, I am coming from experience and you seem to just be coming blindly about not liking macs

Sad Professor

Sorry, gimme5minutes, but you can't compare a Macbook to an Inspiron. Have you ever even seen or used a Macbook? The Inspiron is a cheap piece of crap in comparison. Your dismissal of the appeal of the Mac's design and build quality as being shallow marketing doesn't hold up to scrutiny either.

I don't care what your personal criteria for assessing a computer's value is. In the real world things like aluminium cases cost money to make. Design is important, especially on a laptop. You have to carry the thing around, things like size and weight matter. A multi-touch trackpad makes it easier to use. A Magsafe adapter could save your laptop from a nasty fall. A 7 hour battery life will save you having to carry another battery around. Can an Inspiron offer any of these things?

In addition there are numerous other features in a Macbook which I doubt that Inspiron price you quoted includes. Gigabit ethernet? 802.11n wireless card? Sudden motion sensor? Backlit keyboard? These are high quality components. Apple didn't just slap a logo on a cheap case and double the price. Okay so you don't need or want any of these things. A plastic suitcase with a great processor and graphics card rattling around inside will do you grand. That's fine. But you cant say that a Mac is a rip-off just because you only value raw computing power.

Do these Macbook features make games play better or increase your benchmark results? No. But they are not there for fashionable purposes either, they add something substantial to the computing experience. And this is the key thing about the Mac. Comparing specs misses the point. Dell just slap a bunch **** in a box, fill it with trial-ware to subsidise the price and sell it. But Apple offer an entire computing experience which is user friendly and intuitive and integrated across the board.

Not everyone is a gamer, not everyone cares what spec your computer is or how fast it is. Some people treat computing generally with distaste and want a computer that will do what they want with a minimal amount of fuss. They don't want to waste away their life away trying fix the various inexplicable incompatibilities that might pop up between Windows and whatever Dell threw together.

How long do you expect to get out of a computer? 3 years plus? How many hours a day might you use it? Is spending a bit more for a better quality experience really a rip-off?

Sad Professor

gimme5minutes wrote:

One thing I noticed while doing this is that to upgrade the Mac from 4 to 8 gigs of RAM you pay €900. To upgrade the Dell from 4 to 8 you pay €298. That is some joke, if that doesn't tell you that Apple are rip off merchants nothing will. This is 2009, it shouldn't cost anything near €900 to put an extra 4 gigs of RAM into a laptop

That's DDR3 RAM in the Macbook. You'll find it's quite a bit more expensive than DDR2. But generally I advise people not to buy RAM from Apple.

It's a better OS but to charge what they do for it is a straight up rip off. Most people spend most of their time on the net or in an app/game where the OS makes no difference.

The operating system ALWAYS makes a difference. Every time I use Windows I'm reminded of this.

Voodu Child wrote:

and long-lasting (but not easily-replaceable) battery

Replacing the battery is easy. You remove a few screws, lift the bottom case off and disconnect it. Apple just insist on doing it for you.

NilByMouth

3House wrote: »

Y But I ask you why would you bother, That's what xboxes and the like are for.

Obviously never played a machine built for gaming then have you:rolleyes:

Mac's have always been used professionaly for video/music production and CAD..and they do look nicer:)but would I Pay for one?nah

Also 1 point about the mac being virus free(and the same can be said for linux machines too)is simple numbers.Windows dominates the os market,with millions of machines using it worldwide.Why write virus,malware or spyware etc for a smaller market such as OSX and linux when you can cause a lot more mayhem if you just target windows systems

Dont be at yourself

You can look at clock speed, harddrive space and display resolutions, but at the end of the day, it's a tiny part of the bigger picture. You don't interact with the processor, you interact with the actual laptop, through the operating system.

As such, things like the backlit keyboard, magsafe adaptor, ambient light sensor and so on have a big impact on the user experience.

The operating system, too, plays a big part. On any modern mac, OS X runs perfectly, it's quick, responsive and almost bug and virus free. Most importantly, are the little design choices - everything just works as you'd expect it to. The operating system never hinders you or gets in the way of what you're trying to do.

At the end of the day, the proof of the pudding is in the eating. I'll never buy a Windows PC again. Nor will my girlfriend, my brothers, or anybody else I know who has bought a recent mac.

For me, it is the Operating System.

Voodu Child

As such, things like the backlit keyboard, magsafe adaptor, ambient light sensor and so on have a big impact on the user experience.

Magsafe is shoddy crap tbh, im holding a magsafe adaptor in my hand right now, and the cable is very light-guage, flimsy, won't stand up to regular use. These things have been melting and fraying en masse if I recall.

yoyo

My m8 has a mac and uses it for Vista exclusively :rolleyes::rolleyes:, He hates OS X and its not "compatible", now I know OS X would do most of the stuff hes looking for, but thats his words. Also on the security front, Vista and 7 are as secure as Mac if you leave UAC on, Vista requires admin approval for installations, so does linux OS's. I've yet to get a virus on Vista, in fact I can't remember the last time I got one when using XP!

Nick

Dont be at yourself

Magsafe is shoddy crap tbh, im holding a magsafe adaptor in my hand right now, and the cable is very light-guage, flimsy, won't stand up to regular use. These things have been melting and fraying en masse if I recall.

I can only speak from personal experience. I've owned three mac laptops, and have never had a problem with the magsafe. It's probably saved my machines from a nasty fall on more than one occasion.

This contrasts with my experience with Dell laptops, where the power cable broke within a year of usage. The same thing happened to my brother's laptop cable only a few months ago.

oneofakind32

NilByMouth wrote: »

Also 1 point about the mac being virus free(and the same can be said for linux machines too)is simple numbers.Windows dominates the os market,with millions of machines using it worldwide.Why write virus,malware or spyware etc for a smaller market such as OSX and linux when you can cause a lot more mayhem if you just target windows systems

I think your forgetting that mac's software is built for the hardware it uses leaving less gaps for hackers to exploit. Also mac's regular software updates seem to be enough to keep them virus free. Every so often Mac's will also automatically update the systems firmware. Thats not something Iv ever herd of being done on a PC.

AlmightyCushion

oneofakind32 wrote: »

I think your forgetting that mac's software is built for the hardware it uses leaving less gaps for hackers to exploit. Also mac's regular software updates seem to be enough to keep them virus free. Every so often Mac's will also automatically update the systems firmware. Thats not something Iv ever herd of being done on a PC.

That really has nothing to do with it. Having a very secure os and having an os that isn't exploited are two different things. I remember seeing an article (can't find a link so I maybe wrong) that showed that osx had more security holes than windows vista. So technically speaking vista is the more secure os but it's just that osx has less people developing visuses and malware for it.

Anima

The only reason I can see someone buying a Mac in this day and age is because they like OSX or have no clue about computers and want the simplest option. OSX is a very nice operating system to use, I'll admit, but it does feel like fischer price computing sometimes due to the lack of options it provides. In which case you have to resort to the terminal window to make critical alterations, which is the same as using Linux in the end and thats free.

Any XP or Vista machine with a proper firewall and anti-virus program (along with the OS updates) will be just as reliable as an OSX machine in my opinion. I've been using my current install of XP for 2+ years now. I haven't done much to maintain it at all, I'm really lazy. I download lots of stuff but have never had an issue in these past 2 years and I'm sure plenty of users are the same.

The hardware in a Mac is the same as a PC. The Mac no longer uses a PowerPC processor, it uses an Intel one. You can install OSX on the vast majority of regular Intel PCs today (even AMD processors with the right patches). So why pay a premium on the hardware when its the same?

That just leaves OSX that differentiates a Mac from a regular PC. What games run on OSX? None worth mentioning. What programs run on OSX? Some important ones (Final Cut Pro, Logic) but these are a very select few. Day to day programs? Nothing that isn't already on Windows or any other platform.

So for the average user I really don't understand why they would get a Mac for twice the cost of a regular PC/Laptop. These little features that people mention, such as the MagSafe adaptor... thats not even technology! Its a magnet built into the power connector. How is that worth twice the cost?

Dont be at yourself

The hardware in a Mac is the same as a PC. The Mac no longer uses a PowerPC processor, it uses an Intel one. You can install OSX on the vast majority of regular Intel PCs today (even AMD processors with the right patches).

I use a mac because Mac OS X will install on every regular Intel mac. I don't need to sniff around and find patches, look for drivers or make do with unsupported hacks or missing features. It just works. I know the same results can be achieved on a Hackintosh, but I don't want the effort. Some people like tinkering around with all of that, I don't.

That just leaves OSX that differentiates a Mac from a regular PC. What games run on OSX? None worth mentioning. What programs run on OSX? Some important ones (Final Cut Pro, Logic) but these are a very select few. Day to day programs? Nothing that isn't already on Windows or any other platform

Obviously, the mac isn't for everyone. It's not a gaming machine. For me, with a PS3, xb360 and a Wii, that's not what I want a laptop for. Apart from that though, it runs everything I could want, including some very neat apps that I wouldn't have found on Windows.

The bundled software, for a start, is superb. A fully featured mail client in Mail, a lightening quick web browser in Safari, excellent photo management in iPhoto, staggeringly intuitive DVD and Movie editing apps in iDVD and iMovie, then there's Time Machine, Address Book, iChat, Front Row... all free on a new mac.

The development community is vibrant. Really useful apps like Growl and Quicksilver really embrace Apple's approach to software. Delicious Library, Aperture, Transmission, Handbreak, Appfresh, Perian, etc are more examples of well-designed, useful apps, that you often won't find anywhere else.

So for the average user I really don't understand why they would get a Mac for twice the cost of a regular PC/Laptop. These little features that people mention, such as the MagSafe adaptor... thats not even technology! Its a magnet built into the power connector. How is that worth twice the cost?

The magsafe is an example of the numerous tiny design choices in both their hardware and software design that are often ignored in these kind of comparisons. By itself, it's not a huge thing - though it may very well save your laptop from a nasty fall - but there's so many little touches that makes the overall experience much more pleasurable than using a similarly specced Dell.

jahalpin

mehmeh12 wrote: »

I'm thinking getting a mac due to the lack of viruses. Security is **** in windows. And i think the white exterior is quite nice compared to the standard black/grey pc look.

The Mac OS is not really more secure than Windows, the main reason that there are fewer viruses etc for Macs is due to the fact that such a small percentage of people use Macs so it's not really worth the hastle of writing viruses for it.

There are several different anti-virus products for Mac OS X, which shows that most people realize the potential for viruses on a Mac

ob

I too used to wonder why anyone would buy a Mac, they always seemed so expensive compared to a PC. After years of PC use and never once having used a Mac or OSX, I recently got a 24" iMac.

I have to say, the whole package just screams of quality. When you open the box, there's just the unit itself, the mouse and keyboard and a power cable. The beauty of it is in it's simplicity, it's just so neat and tidy on the desk, you don't have cables everwhere, or a box on/under the desk. The display quality is fantastic as well.

At the moment, I'm working from home a lot, so I'm using Vista x64 almost all the time on it (for Visual Studio) . I find OSX is ok, but I could take it or leave it.

You do pay a premium for a mac, but the build is pure quality, so much so that I think I might get a macbook pro to replace my laptop, even with no intention of running OSX.

jahalpin

NekkidBibleMan wrote: »

I use a mac because Mac OS X will install on every regular Intel mac. I don't need to sniff around and find patches, look for drivers or make do with unsupported hacks or missing features. It just works. I know the same results can be achieved on a Hackintosh, but I don't want the effort. Some people like tinkering around with all of that, I don't.



Obviously, the mac isn't for everyone. It's not a gaming machine. For me, with a PS3, xb360 and a Wii, that's not what I want a laptop for. Apart from that though, it runs everything I could want, including some very neat apps that I wouldn't have found on Windows.

The bundled software, for a start, is superb. A fully featured mail client in Mail, a lightening quick web browser in Safari, excellent photo management in iPhoto, staggeringly intuitive DVD and Movie editing apps in iDVD and iMovie, then there's Time Machine, Address Book, iChat, Front Row... all free on a new mac.

The development community is vibrant. Really useful apps like Growl and Quicksilver really embrace Apple's approach to software. Delicious Library, Aperture, Transmission, Handbreak, Appfresh, Perian, etc are more examples of well-designed, useful apps, that you often won't find anywhere else.



.

The lowest Intel Mac is based on an Intel Core CPU, Windows will install on all PC's with this kind of chip.


The Mac downloads a lot of patches and updates, probably more than Windows. Windows Vista can automatically download drivers for most hardware automatically and gives you a faar bigger choice of hardware than a Mac

As for the bundled apps on a Mac, Vista comes with comparable apps for most of these by default. I personally find Safari to be a terrible browser and much prefer IE 8, I use Firefox on my Mac Mini as it is far superior to Safari.

30ferry

I have a Dell Latitude X300 (5yrs) and a Macbook Air (1yr). The Dell cost 2,500 when bought and the Mac 1,700. I primarily use for email; reports and Visio. Found it hard to change from PC to Mac as brain was programmed to Microsoft. Initial reason for buying Airbook was design out and out. Its as slim as anything; its all metal and the screen resolution is amazing. Working off both machines, I much prefer the Mac at this stage. Its power supply is tiny; it charges in super fast time and holds for six hours. It turns on in seconds and moves between programmes with ease. While I dont have a problem with virus on the Dell, it will freeze; close IE and want to send messages to Microsoft and it drives me nuts. Its slow between programmes and this is not just being old - it always was. Net analysis, in my ungeek like state, I love the design; the speed and the ease of use of the Mac - well worth the extra IMP but it does take time to retrain the brain!!!!