Mountain Biking ... will it make me a better roadie?

Caroline_ie

Hi
I just bought a MTB and i was out in the park ( in the muddy trails ) yesterday. I was only in there 1 hour but I felt like I worked a lot more than I would have on the Road bike for the same lengh of time ( sorry ... ) I was out of the saddle most of the time. I didn't do any climbing, as I was just in the Pheonix park ... and only fell once
I am guessing the diffence in terrain and not being used to it is what made my avg HR higher...

Anyway, my question ... will MTB-ing make me a better roadie?

Merci

cantalach

It certainly does wonders for handling skills but I'm not convinced it does anything for fitness. Most pro MTBers seem to do a lot of their training on their road bikes, which tells you a lot!

Lumen

Ryan Sherlock creamed the lot of us up Kippure, so there must be something in the cross-training approach. He is a bit abnormal though.

Idleater

Caroline_ie wrote: »

Anyway, my question ... will MTB-ing make me a better roadie?

I started out (quite a few years ago) mountainbiking only, and only "graduated" to roadbikes when I started commuting to college.

Obviously if you want to cover larger distances quicker there is no question as to which is better for the job.

I've just got myself another mtb again and have taken to the trails once more, and found that i was putting in more effort - both in terms of mental (picking lines) and physical (aiming the bike at the line and [trying to] keep it there).

I would say from this limited experience, that both are complimentary, and for myself, Mountain biking is more a fun enjoyment than a necessity for training if you get me.

Don't get me wrong, I'll still join the local club for the Saturday/Sunday spins, but I'll be out on the MTB too to have a blast.

Nice bike btw.

L.

ryan_sherlock

I think it will help a lot of handling and punchy hard accelerations.

The major reasons we spend a lot of the time training on the road is that it is a lot easier on your body (a two hour XC race is harder than any road race I have done - body tired from head to toe),weather effects you less on the road, or at least, the road conditions change less and it is a lot easier to keep a steady effort on the road for building fitness. I do a lot of my Threshold work on the road because conditions vary very little.

Also, mountain biking (assuming you do the mountain end of things) will make you into a very good climber. Look at any of the MTBers that switch to road... or any Irish road race that has a few hills and a few mountain bikers taking part...

ROK ON

Caroline. When you are out in the forest and undergrowth let me know if you find any truffles. I do like them shaved onto my risotto, and am presently running out.

ryan_sherlock

One other thing that is mentioned above - it teaches great mental awareness and the ability to stay concentrated for hours on end.

One mistake on the trail can leave you very very sore, while on the road bike, it's a little more like driving a car and you can drift along for hours. This becomes useful in race/group rides when you have to stay aware of the riders around you.

blorg

It is more jumpy in terms of the effort, you have more peaks and troughs.

It works the upper body more which will be beneficial there, you don't get much of that at all on a road bike. Swimming helps with that too.

As to handling, could be a benefit, Bananapants was of course a downhill mountain biker and he could certainly descend on the road... To a large extent though I think you could develop these skills through practice on the road bike.

Beyond that I don't know that it will massively- most of the MTB guys use road bikes for the fitness training. From a pure training point of view you would probably get more out of spending time on the road bike. But MTB is a lot of fun and can be done in situations you wouldn't want to be out on the road, when it is icy for example.

If you are an accomplished rider like Sherlock you will perform like that on either MTB or road bike, I wouldn't think his use of a MTB is particularly relevant. If he wants to get up a hill quickly, MTB or road, he is going to basically have to do the same thing. If you are a top MTB rider that is going to transfer to getting up a hill on the road. Note he is a Cat 1 racer on the road as well.

Just my 2c.

Caroline_ie

ryan_sherlock wrote: »

Also, mountain biking (assuming you do the mountain end of things) will make you into a very good climber.

Woohoo!!!

cantalach

blorg wrote: »

It is more jumpy in terms of the effort, you have more peaks and troughs.

That's very true - I have very poor anaerobic power so I tend to find MTB very tiring because of all the peaks and troughs. So I suppose if you go hard enough on the peaks, MTB might be a fun way to work on that most neglected aspect of roadie fitness.

thebouldwhacker

Caroline_ie wrote: »

will MTB-ing make me a better roadie?

yes:)

Gavin

It will make you a better person.

Drapper

a few of us meet in the park on Tuesday and sometimes thursday for offraod stuff, nice place to start or just pelt around! give us a shoult if you'd like! what bike you go for?

btw Sherlock could climb a wall he's Irelands best climber on an mtb I think! :-)

1hour for me on mtb = about 1.45 on a roadbike (depending on trerraine etc.)

Diarmuid

Have to say I always though Ireland was better for mtb than road. With the crap roads and the sh1t weather, staying upright is a battle on a road bike. Tearing around the woods in wicklow seemed a better option to me.

Flame on

Caroline_ie

Diarmuid wrote: »

With the crap roads and the sh1t weather, staying upright is a battle on a road bike.

Denis ??? is that you?

:P

blorg

Diarmuid wrote: »

With the crap roads and the sh1t weather, staying upright is a battle on a road bike.

I like to pretend I am doing Paris-Roubaix. Works for me anyway.

rottenhat

blorg wrote: »

I like to pretend I am doing Paris-Roubaix. Works for me anyway.

Hah...I do that too. In extreme circumstances I pretend I am Sean Kelly in this picture:

Drapper

looks like a CX race?

rottenhat

Drapper wrote: »

looks like a CX race?

...but is in fact Paris-Roubaix.

Lumen

rottenhat wrote: »

...but is in fact Paris-Roubaix.

Looks like Barrabus in the background.

Caroline_ie

@Drapper -> I see you in the park or leaving the it on a regular basis, what trails do you use when you're out there? I know you can go ' anywhere' on a MTB ... just to get an idea.

Drapper

ok (have a google kml file if you need it!)
I enter the whites gate go right along the wall to mountsackville coss over to the wodded area where all the "men" stand around and follow wood there around to the track down to the lake in the furey glen. ALong the lake trail (nice and rough). If stong up the side of the steps or continue on about 500m and up thorugh the trees
Cross the road and along the ledge above the road in the furrey road.
Around the back of St Marys - over to the 40 acres there is a trail along the side of the tress and the old houses.
A loop of the kyber offroad its a mini circle - taking in the magazine fort ect and tree area on eaither side.
Over by the Popes cross and along the embassey wall and back aournd by the OSI.
Repeat. About 10km (do it 2 or 3 times).

CAn do the above in reverse, going down the steps etc.

Love the park cause it so close 5km frm my house, but love the hills for the climbing!

blorg

KML would be great, I would be keen to head out on a few MTB evenings to the park myself, what with it being nearby and my MTB sitting there getting a bit rusty.

davgtrek

MTB'ing gives you better capabilities for bursts and recovery etc.
seemingly DH Mtb'ers are fairly sought after by clubs getting them over to pursuit racing for their abilities to explode out of the saddle etc.

i reckon why MTB heads train over winter on road is that they can more accurately shift into different training levels and intervals on a good 3-4 hour spin which is ideal for their prep.

You'd bearly get a chance to look at your HRM on MTB trails...

They are both very complimentary to each other and a mix of both is perfect IMHO.

So again YES MTB'ing will definitely make you perform better on road.

In fact I am disappointed at the number of roadies that will refuse point blank to trying MTB'ing. They honestly don't know what they are missing... a nice XC trail in crisp autumn sun, crunching through forests and crossing mountains.... heaven.

Caroline_ie

blorg wrote: »

KML would be great !

Yes please

Blorg - let me know if you want to try the park one evening
I am also just a few Km's from the park. i am sure I wouldn't the only one joining you.

OuterBombie

I got burnt out putting in the miles on crap roads in crap weather and getting abuse from crap-eating drivers.

I moved away from the saddle for over a year and that was after nearly 10 years of road and triathlon racing.

From left of field some of my surfing mates bought mountain bikes and started getting out and about. I tried a few trails on my pos commute bike and was hooked, deciding to upgrade to a decent hardtail.

Man am I stoked, spending three hours offroad, closer to nature, through the mud, sweating bullets on ascents that would put any road to shame, white knuckle hanging on down descents, this stuff is the business. Its safe to say it's re-ignited my passion for biking. I even dusted off the road bike and got back out there.

MTB saved my life, oh, it will probably make you a better roadie too.

Drapper

i'll be at whites gate at 7.30pm this eve for a 1hour blast! ;-) need to shake a bit of stress off!

big groups not adivsed with wardens (however, one of the wardens sons is in in madmtb lol , 2-3 is fine)!

i'll send kml this eve lads!

again the park is no substitute for a mountain grovel ;-)!

ryan_sherlock

To his credit, David O'Loughlin turned up to the National XC Champs the other week. I think the trails got the better of him but he looked comfortable.

blorg

Thanks for that Drapper- Thursday evenings aren't possible for me as my club league races are on then but any other evening would be good if you do it more than once a week.

ROK ON

Hi. Would it be possible to do some of the trails in the Phoenix Park on a crossbike (Spesh Tricross to be exact).
If so I may just put the knobbly tyres back on and give it a shot.

Drapper

sure it would be grand on a CX bike, single speed, fixie!! as I said it fairly easy stuff!

thebouldwhacker

OuterBombie wrote: »

I got burnt out putting in the miles on crap roads in crap weather and getting abuse from crap-eating drivers.

I moved away from the saddle for over a year and that was after nearly 10 years of road and triathlon racing.

From left of field some of my surfing mates bought mountain bikes and started getting out and about. I tried a few trails on my pos commute bike and was hooked, deciding to upgrade to a decent hardtail.

Man am I stoked, spending three hours offroad, closer to nature, through the mud, sweating bullets on ascents that would put any road to shame, white knuckle hanging on down descents, this stuff is the business. Its safe to say it's re-ignited my passion for biking. I even dusted off the road bike and got back out there.

MTB saved my life, oh, it will probably make you a better roadie too.

+1

cantalach

We haven't touched on the most important question that arises when roadies take to the trails: is it ok to wear roadie gear on the mtb?

Drapper

cantalach wrote: »

We haven't touched on the most important question that arises when roadies take to the trails: is it ok to wear roadie gear on the mtb?

sure its grand! the top XC racers in ireland, like Sherlock and Seymour all wear lycra!

baggies/lyscra for me 50/50

Lumen

cantalach wrote: »

We haven't touched on the most important question that arises when roadies take to the trails: is it ok to wear roadie gear on the mtb?

Only the crap stuff, since crashing seems inevitable.

Caroline_ie

cantalach wrote: »

We haven't touched on the most important question that arises when roadies take to the trails: is it ok to wear roadie gear on the mtb?

I wear lycra ... but I ve only been out on the MTB once. and I have SPDs and a MTB dorky helmet.

I have to say the camelback water pack thing is great! I think I will take it with me everywhere ... shops, work, movies ( just not on the Road bike ) .... Imagibe that filled with tea or .... beer

Drapper

Caroline_ie wrote: »

I wear lycra ... but I ve only been out on the MTB once. and I have SPDs and a MTB dorky helmet.

I have to say the camelback water pack thing is great! I think I will take it with me everywhere ... shops, work, movies ( just not on the Road bike ) .... Imagibe that filled with tea or .... beer

camelback, they are great for long spins (spares etc... insode) ! i like bottles on short ones, however, in very muddy weather I use my backpack too as a mouth full of muck ain't nice :-)

Caroline_ie

Drapper wrote: »

camelback, they are great for long spins (spares etc... insode) ! i like bottles on short ones, however, in very muddy weather I use my backpack too as a mouth full of muck ain't nice :-)

A bottle does not fit in my frame ...

cantalach

Caroline_ie wrote: »

I wear lycra ... but I ve only been out on the MTB once. and I have SPDs and a MTB dorky helmet.

Is that an mtb helmet that just happens to be dorky or a helmet that is inherently dorky because it is an mtb helmet?

thebouldwhacker

cantalach wrote: »

is it ok to wear roadie gear on the mtb?

No. not unless are racing. Its beyond fred, you just look like an ass (edit; not you, I mean anyone)

Caroline_ie

cantalach wrote: »

Is that an mtb helmet that just happens to be dorky or a helmet that is inherently dorky because it is an mtb helmet?

I think the 2nd one ... it's a bit Lance Armstrong-ish
( that photo is great, it looks like he's giving all he's got to beat that slow older than him man )

cantalach

Caroline_ie wrote: »

I think the 2nd one ... it's a bit Lance Armstrong-ish
( that photo is great, it looks like he's giving all he's got to beat that slow older than him man )

I wonder if doesn't-like-to-come-third will win Leadville this year? Sorry, that's more than a bit OT.

blorg

cantalach wrote: »

I wonder if doesn't-like-to-come-third will win Leadville this year? Sorry, that's more than a bit OT.

Well he has been making noises on his twitter feed already on how he is training for it, so it looks like a target... You would have to imagine he is going to be fitter for it this year and he didn't seem to have any technical problems last year AFAIK, he was just tired towards the end.

ryan_sherlock

cantalach wrote: »

We haven't touched on the most important question that arises when roadies take to the trails: is it ok to wear roadie gear on the mtb?

My MTB gear = my Road gear. Although I do where MTB specific shoes (unless I'm pretty sure I don't have to put a foot down and it's dry where I'll wear my road shoes - lighter/stiffer)

Wearing roadie gear on the mtb just makes you look like an elite MTBer... best not let the guys in baggies pass you climbing/descending

Drapper

As promised for blorg and caroline

LINK REMOVED ;-) i've too many bikes i my shed........ pm me if you need it

hope that works loop is easy but nice to start with.....

DirkVoodoo

I would not wear lycra on the MTB unless I was racing. Learning to fall around the slopes of Ballinastoe I think you should get baggies. Plus they are better at coping with the odd tumble, you don't want to put tears in all your road gear!

Has anyone quoted the "mountain bikers have better pedaling technique" one yet? That's another reason to do it, apparently.

tunney

Lumen wrote: »

Ryan Sherlock creamed the lot of us up Kippure, so there must be something in the cross-training approach. He is a bit abnormal though.

Probably because you all span out your 34x28s.

silvo

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

I would not wear lycra on the MTB unless I was racing. Learning to fall around the slopes of Ballinastoe I think you should get baggies. Plus they are better at coping with the odd tumble, you don't want to put tears in all your road gear!.

Yeah I would definitely agree with this. Get yourself a nice set of baggies that you can hose down with the bike afterwards. Most baggies are super-durable, rarely tear and save you from minor scrapes from gorse/rocks/muck/branches/trees/thorns etc etc. Here are a couple of nice cheapy ones that I would recommend:

Loeka Tech Shorts (friend of mine has these and raves about them)
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=28167

RaceFace DIY Shorts (RaceFace make great clothes, very durable)
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=39443

Endura Ladies Singletrack 3/4 (3/4 lengths are great for the winter.)
http://www.wiggle.co.uk/p/Womens/11/Endura_Ladies_Singletrack_3~4_Baggy_Short/5360041158/

I tend to wear a set of 3/4 length cycling leggings with baggies over most days but I know loads of people in the club would only wear lycra. Each to their own, but I have an deep-seated aversion to lycra on its own on me.

blorg

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

Has anyone quoted the "mountain bikers have better pedaling technique" one yet? That's another reason to do it, apparently.

I think there is something in that, they have to develop a very smooth technique so as to maintain traction over loose or slippy ground. If you have ever cycled on ice or snow it becomes clear how important an utterly smooth application of power is.

blorg

tunney wrote: »

Probably because you all span out your 34x28s.

34? Lumen had a 30x27 (my old bike.)

blorg

I am very good at falling off and I have thus far just worn my lycra, although it is true I did manage to create a hole in one pair of tights... Not 100% sure that wasn't on the road now that I think of it though. Maybe I will try out baggies, see if they are comfortable.