Getting Started in Amateur Radio

xp90

Hey,
Been fascinated by SW radio for years, becoming an experimenter is an ambition of mine, what is the best way to do this?

Fuzzy Clam

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055623305

watty

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055083529

see www.irts.ie get the course material for the Multiple choice exam.

also useful is www.rsgb.co.uk

Any specific questions can be answered here.

xp90

Cheers watty, just wondering are there any good books out there from an irish perspective? also what equipment and band would you recommend for a beginner?

wingknot

xp90 wrote: »

Hey,
Been fascinated by SW radio for years, becoming an experimenter is an ambition of mine, what is the best way to do this?

Look for a radio club thats close to your home and pay a visit,you will be wellcome and it's the best place to start, where are you located.

watty

Bands:
2M FM to chat to others on local repeater. Either a 5W handheld or 10W car mount (either can be used in car, home or portable).

HF Radio will do USB/LSB etc on all bands from 1.8MHz to 28MHz. Unless it's more than 20 years old. Some may be unable to use part of 40m (7.1 to 7.2MHz). 50W to 100W Bench type.

Also worth considering
70cm / 430MHz FM.
6M (50MHz) SSB
2M and 70cm SSB
4M AM/FM/SSB

Books:
Exams: International Amateur Radio Examination Manual
http://www.rsgbshop.org/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_Training_19.html
A generic kind of book relevent to Ireland. IRTS website has more specific material

General Radio Expertise/Info:
http://www.rsgbshop.org/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_Technical_6.html
many good titles. Specifically:
RSGB Radio Communication Handbook
9th edition

also


http://www.rsgbshop.org/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_Microwave_11.html
Microwave Projects
NEW
Edited by: Andy Barter, G8ATD

http://www.rsgbshop.org/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_VHF_UHF_Books_20.html
VHF/UHF Handbook
NEW
Edited by: Andy Barter, G8ATD

An RSGB subscription is worth while for Radcom, one of the few decent technical magasines left. You don't need to be in UK or have a Licence.

The IRTS (the Irish Society) has a Newsletter rather than a technical magasine. But worthwhile for the Bureau Service. (ask if you don't know what that is). Again you don't have to have a Licence or be in Ireland to join.

I also have some ARRL books, but I think the RSGB ones listed are better.

watty

The kind(s)/ Models of Radio to buy or build depends on your interests, bands, New or Second hand, Competition working or not.

My main HF radio is late model FT101ZD MkIII, maybe 22 years old. Not suited to Competition work as it's slow to retune. Partly that's why I like it as my first exposure to Radio was in the late 1960s with ex WWII/1950s Miltary radio. It does all the bands from 1.8MHz to 29MHz. Virtually all of the time it is as likely to give you good DX contacts as a brand new €7,000 radio with 100W. Aerials and Conditions are more important. It even connects to PC for RTTY, PC CW, PSK31, Olivia, WSJT, SSTV etc.

I have also a Military 25W SSB "manpack" radio with internal 24V battery pack and internal 6', 8' or 10' "whip" tuner. With a trailing wire and screwed in whip it covers 1.5MHz to 30MHz contigious via decade rotary switches to enter frequency. Racal Syncal30.

Favorite radio is an FT817ND. A true portable nearly all band all mode 5W radio. Does 100kHz to 500MHz approx receive with a few gaps, but including BandII FM and Airband AM. All bands transmit from 1.8MHz to 440MHz except 70MHz (4m). It can't receive on 4m either. The second gap is from part way in Marine Band 156MHz? to about 420MHz I think.
It has AM, SSB, FM on all bands and connects to laptop for all the Digital modes. The only radio I bought new.
I built the Elecraft T1 Auto ATU/Match box for it, which works well on HF and 6m. I also built an external 80W HF amp with built in 7AH 12V battery and auto bandswitching for the FT817ND. White box on top of PC monitor below.

Also I have a 2m/70m FM only Alinco 5W "handy talkie" I hardly use. In the car I have a 50W/35W 2m/70cm FM radio, with dual band whip, Icom 2800.
You can see some of the radios and aerials here
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=60658456&postcount=19

xp90

Thanks a million for sharing your expertise watty, although I have been reading ameteur magazines for 10 years or so there are still things I wouldnt mind ironed out . I remember borrowing a book from a library before on amateur radio Im pretty sure it was Irish, possibly english geared.

What kind of budget would I require for a decent setup? Bearing in mind Im a studenet

Also just out of curiosity, do many people use OSCARs any more or is that a thing of the past?

Im located in galway city, anyone know of any clubs around? Also anyone have any info on when exams are held?

watty

Galway club

http://www.galwayradio.com/info.html

Yes. Satellites still used. Use Tracking Software.

http://www.stoff.pl/ Orbitron
Select Amateur satellites.

Also
http://www.ham-radio-deluxe.com/Downloads/tabid/54/Default.aspx Version 4.
Select Demomatic Radio, as you don't have a real CAT or CIV radio.
A subwindow does tracking and another DX cluster.

Decide your budget and then search for S/H gear. Don't buy aerials or Aerial tuner/Match units, make them.
Visit the Cork & Mayo rallies this Autumn. (see news / events sticky)

The IRTS does the exams. check their webside periodically. We'll try to highlight next one here. Last was in June 2009.

fatboymsport

How much it costs will all depend on what you want to do.

my advice would be not to spend too little at the start as you wont see the real possabilites of the hobby if you just get a simple 2m rig.

and on the other side dont go and blow a few K on a all singing and dancing top of the range rig.

get something that will get you active on as many bands as possible.

look for a icom 706/7000 7400 or yaesu 857/897 the 817 is a handy little rig but 5w is not enough power and i know watty will disagree but in my opinion unless you have a super antenna or are only intrested in short range contacts (in Europe) you need at least 100w to make the Qso's easier.

the rigs i mentioned all cover HF and VHF and some do UHF so you can work dx all over the world on 20m work all over Ireland and the UK on 80m and then you can monitor your local repeater or Net on 2m/70cms.

and you should have change from 500-700 euro.

If that seems like alot of money then you need to be looking at older rigs that dont cover as many bands.

Best of luck and feel free to ask any questions you have.

watty

I advised a 100W, if you read my post

The 706 tends to be pricey S/H and even pricer New. You need the MkIIG at least. Earlier ones much less VHF/UHF power or no UHF

You can get a S/H bargain from around €200 for 100W HF if you hunt around.

New the FT857 is best value do everything approx 100W, but the FT897 is superior and more flexible as "shack" or "portable". The FT857 is designed more for the car/van, but can be used at home of course.

xp90

Lets say i plan to put about three hundred into a rig of any description,what u suggest?

watty

Second hand bargains. Older radios.
Google the model for details before buying.

Dundalk EI7DAR

Anthony in the North East has a good blog in relation to the exam he is sitting in Oct, well worth a look.
http://hamradioireland.blogspot.com/

snowman707

xp90 wrote: »

Lets say i plan to put about three hundred into a rig of any description,what u suggest?

Having tried many rigs over the years,.....I think the best all round rig would be Ft897, I presently have the 857. 897, & 706G mk2, while the 857 is a good rig it doesn't match either of the other 2.

Seeing you a student & I am always glad to hear of young blood on the hobby, I have a copy of "Advance the full License manual" yours for free if you send me a strong A4 Addressed envelope & €2 in stamps.

PM your details & I will reply with mine.

fatboymsport

funny how a 857 cant match a 897 ??? as the are the same radio only in a different box ????

I had a 817 and while it did a lot of stuff for the price it did none of it very well. so that has put me off that line of rigs.

its going to be hard to get a good rig for 300 quid but im sure you will find something.

watty

Bigger heatsink, internal battery option. Better duty cycle. Not same radio. Only similar.
It's true:
IC857 < IC706 MkIIg <= FT897

People that design radios think this.

snowman707

fatboymsport wrote: »

How much it costs will all depend on what you want to do.

my advice would be not to spend too little at the start as you wont see the real possabilites of the hobby if you just get a simple 2m rig.

and on the other side dont go and blow a few K on a all singing and dancing top of the range rig.

get something that will get you active on as many bands as possible.

look for a icom 706/7000 7400 or yaesu 857/897 the 817 is a handy little rig but 5w is not enough power and i know watty will disagree but in my opinion unless you have a super antenna or are only intrested in short range contacts (in Europe) you need at least 100w to make the Qso's easier.

the rigs i mentioned all cover HF and VHF and some do UHF so you can work dx all over the world on 20m work all over Ireland and the UK on 80m and then you can monitor your local repeater or Net on 2m/70cms.

and you should have change from 500-700 euro.

If that seems like alot of money then you need to be looking at older rigs that dont cover as many bands.

Best of luck and feel free to ask any questions you have.

Good advise there, buy it once & buy it right, have a read through other peoples thoughts
http://www.eham.net/reviews/products/14

fatboymsport wrote: »

funny how a 857 cant match a 897 ??? as the are the same radio only in a different box ????
.

No, this is a general consensus, however as watty mentioned there are many differences, in fact the boards are completely different, I have found the speaker far superior in the 897.

I have never used the 897 on vhf but have found the 857 to be deaf compared to the ic706.

Don't get me wrong, I am not knocking the 857, it is a good rig but at the end of the day you get what you pay for.

fatboymsport

if it was me i would get a Icom 7000 I had one and sold it and every day i regret it. Even more now that I cant afford to buy a new one

watty

Next exam announced

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=61428521&postcount=17
6th Oct 2009

xp90

Think i've got enough time to study for it?

watty

yes

xp90

What do you guys think of these? Seem pretty cheap to me:

http://cgi.ebay.ie/Yaesu-FT-270R-5W-VHF-frequency-2m-70cm-Handheld-Radio_W0QQitemZ110419955065QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_ConsumerElectronics_SpecialistRadioEquipment_SM?hash=item19b58acd79&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14

http://cgi.ebay.ie/ICOM-IC-H16-VHF-HANDHELD-2M-RADIO-TRANSCEIVER_W0QQitemZ330345267508QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_ConsumerElectronics_SpecialistRadioEquipment_SM?hash=item4cea1cc134&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14

watty

a) They are VHF FM only.
b) Could be fakes.

You can get quite cheap VHF-FM only handhelds. They are mostly only good for chatting on the local repeater.

xp90

Sorry i should have mentioned,thats what i wanted it for,to access the galway repeater,could i expect many contacts on it?

watty

make sure the radio has DTMF and CTCSS, otherwise useless for Gateways.
You chat to more people on Skype. Repeaters is 99% local traffic

xp90

Though I thought a 2m rig was part of everyones set up? what should I be looking for then? Sorry for all the questions!:D

watty

Only SSB 2M with a big Yagi is much good for Simplex contacts. 2M FM is 99% repeater access.

many repeaters now need CTCSS tones to access and All gateways (IRLP or Echolink) need DTMF control tones.

I have a 2m/70cm rig for car (50W FM recommended) for Mobile repeater access and a very old 2M Icom car Mobile mounted in shack. It's 10W, but connected to a whip (watson 300 colinear 2m/70cm) on a 40ft pole. I need to retro fit CTSSS module and DTMF shortly. It can access Cork, Limerick, Galway and used to do Helvic Head/ Dungarvin. The 50W in Car in driveway can only access Cork & Limerick on the Magmount. The 5W on Alinco 2m/70cm handheld or FT817 multiband can only access the Limerick repeater on the clip on portable "rubber duck" Aerials and only at front rooms of house or outside.

A typical 5W handheld does 3W to 4.5W and gets very hot on a long converstion. It will usually still work with a Local Repeater at 1W if you are in a suitable location and then talk time is about 6 to 8 times longer on a charge.

The FT817 on SSB on 5W on 50MHz Mobile Whip on car has about 4 times range of 2m SSB and 10 to 20 times range of 2M FM simplex.

With 5W on HF you need the 17m to 10m bands to be open and a 1/4wave whip at least. With a large aerial you can use CW (morse) or PSK31 even on 80m or 40m with only 5W.

For Voice on 160m to 20m (1.8MHz to 14MHz) you need bigger aerials (at least 20m of space in one direction at least) and 100W to 50W mimimum depending on Aerial "goodness".

The FT817 was bought primarily for 6M to 70cm SSB (50Mhz to 440MHz) as no other current production truly portable (big pockets?) VHF/UHF SSB radio was available. But I never really use the Alinco Handy Talky 2m/70cm anymore as a result. I built a 80W self powered PA for the FT817 on HF (1.8Mhz to 30MHz aka 160m to 10m) as they are not worth buying, for 100W Mobile/Portable HF an FT857 is better value than buying a new 100W add-on HF PA. (Filtering is a lot of the cost). The FT101ZD is great for the shack but not practical for field/portable/Mobile use, though I have done it with a generator and there is an insane DC adaptor available (over 22A current on TX from your car battery!).

For Mobile HF aerial I have a 10m/6m dual band Magmount that can be tuned down to 40m perfectly on the Elecraft T1 Auto ATU, or down to 160m on the Racal 25W military Manpack (built in 24V NiMh back).
Also a Modified CB "silver stick" type aerial (about 5.5m long) with matching coil for 27MHz removed it tunes from 80m to 6M with the T1 Auto match and 160m upto 17m on the Manpack (it can't tune an aerial longer than 8ft /2.5m on 10m!). Teh "Stick" is telescopic with hose clamps. I mount it to rear towing eye an throw out about 10m of earth wire as a counterpoise when parked.

I have also for Portable use a Miltary "biconical" type aerial that has a tent pole like 3m ish support. The four pole guys are insulated at bottom with synthetic tent style cord and fastened with tent style pegs. The collapsible manpack 2.5m whip is screwed in at a corner on top along with 3 others to make an upside down pyramid or primitive cone. It works 40m to 4m with no tuning and good SWR. 80m & 2m SWR without tuning is poor but usable. The feed cable is short enough in relation to 160m and 80m that it can be matched using a Aerial Match/"Tuner" unit.

It's great with the FT817 without the 80W PA and fabulous on 40m/80m with the portable PA (12V 7AH battery inside PA). Works with the Racal Syncal30 , though with original built in Tuner via BNC rather than Whip connector, the power could easily reach 45W and blow the PA transistors Since Repair I added a BNC that by passes the internal Whip Tuner for aerials that don't need matched.

I also have a pair of clothes lines with nylon cord at ends and transformer for Coax. These can be deployed as endfed wire + counterpoise, Inverted L, V or Dipole and matched via ATU from 160m to 10m. Throw board that nylon + wire is stored on into a tree or tie cord to a suitable pole.




This forum exists largely for questions

snowman707

xp90 wrote: »

Sorry i should have mentioned,thats what i wanted it for,to access the galway repeater,could i expect many contacts on it?

Answer your last question .NO

you are far better off to wait & buy something like a 857/897 or ic706.

contact this club some of the members may be able to help you

Club: Carndonagh Amateur Radio Club
Call Sign: EI0CAR
Venue: Tullyarb, Carndonagh, Co. Donegal
Meetings: First Tuesday of every month at 19:00
Contact: Peter Homer EI4JR peter@ei4jr.com
Updated: 23-May-2008


BTW also check your pm.s

experimenter

Also worth mentioning is the 144/432MHz you can operate Amateur Satellites.. Also monitor 145.800MHz FM for ISS Space Ops...

Several year ago I worked the Russian Space station on many occasions on a simple 145Mhz FM setup..so don't go to too much expense.

HF wires antennas are simple if you are into that kind of stuff....There are many aspects to the hobby.

Don't bother with those ageing valve yokes, or those 5Watt rigs, get something like a 706MKII! (Shack in a box)

There's load of rigs out there, check out www.eham.net for reviews.

I didn't realise that this thread was for describing your shack :mad:

fatboymsport

I dont think Watty is happy until he gets the words "military" and "Manpack" into every reply on this forum

experimenter wrote: »

I didn't realise that this thread was for describing your shack :mad:

xp90

So guys i have the advance manual what next?

Dankoozy

which bands would have the most users on them in ireland? the most randomers to talk to..

fatboymsport

for a normal chat 80m would be the best. around 3.650-3.800 mhz on LSB. Might not be lots of Irish Stations but during the day you will find loads of UK stations and into the early evening you will get mainland Europe.

2m is the best for local work but it can be hard to find people at times.