Buggies not allowed in Restaurants

Kimono-Girl

I don't know if any of you in cork are listening to 96fm at the moment but they are talking about restaurants and pubs refusing buggies/prams due to health and safety, i tried googling it and i cant find anything on it, there are a few places in my locality which have been named as not allowing buggies and as a new mom i'm not sure what my rights are here.

anybody here have any clue what the regulations are? and has anyone here ever encountered this/ how did you handle it?

Nevyn

A lot of places simply do not have the room for a buggy esp one which can not be folded down in thir dinning areas and yes if a pram/buggy is in the way of serving staff or may block a fire exit it can be said to be a health and safety hazzard.

bcirl03

candlelover wrote: »

I don't know if any of you in cork are listening to 96fm at the moment but they are talking about restaurants and pubs refusing buggies/prams due to health and safety, i tried googling it and i cant find anything on it, there are a few places in my locality which have been named as not allowing buggies and as a new mom i'm not sure what my rights are here.

anybody here have any clue what the regulations are? and has anyone here ever encountered this/ how did you handle it?

Name and shame.....

Cabaal

bcirl03 wrote: »

Name and shame.....

I don't see why, affectingly the premises have limited space and buggy's take up room so allowing them creates a danger to people in the premises.

I'd also imagine that initially you might have got irresponsible parents affectingly ruining it for everyone else by leaving buggy's in stupid places and not moving them out of the way when people try pass....thus in some instances forcing places to bring in this rule to protect themselfs.

Some parents just don't think when it comes to buggys, we've all seen examples of this during our day to day lives...one prime one is the "my buggy is indestructible and I can force myself to cross a busy road as its infront of me" mentality by some parents...crazy tbh, especially when more often then not there's a proper crossing point not a few meters away

kmart6

bcirl03 wrote: »

Name and shame.....

No shame if there is an actually health and safety aspect to it!

stovelid

I tend to steer clear of places that you can't fit the buggy into. And that includes most restaurants and cafes.

To be honest, a buggy can be an irritant to others and even a hazard in such places.

siobhank

OP do you think the policy is maybe to excluse noisy children or something? I reckon some places might be using the sneak health and safety excuse for that one. But some small places can't handle buggies etc in the aisle so I guess that's only fair.

Cabaal

In fairness the best way you can deal with such places is vote with your feet and euros for that matter,

Zulu

Just leave the buggy outside, like you are requested to.

It's not a "rights" issue. :rolleyes:

run_Forrest_run

Yeah OP, maybe chill a bit about the rights thing! I have one child and another one the way and yes, there are places that will not allow buggies. At first I was furious about it but over time I've come to realise:

1. If the place will not allow buggies then they don't want me or my custom so why would I want to eat in a place where I am not wanted?

2. Buggies are quite annoying for other patrons indeed, I can see that myself now.

3. I couldn't be bothered going into restaurants anymore with a child anyway, it's not worth the money or hassle!! Eat at home whilst plonking the buggy in the middle of the room:D

In relation to the health and safety reason, I feel this is just an excuse on behalf of such restaurants but no one can challenge it, because it's health and safety, a bit like 'Insurance reasons'...pathetic but true I'm afraid.

Dfens

candlelover wrote: »

I don't know if any of you in cork are listening to 96fm at the moment but they are talking about restaurants and pubs refusing buggies/prams due to health and safety, i tried googling it and i cant find anything on it, there are a few places in my locality which have been named as not allowing buggies and as a new mom i'm not sure what my rights are here.

anybody here have any clue what the regulations are? and has anyone here ever encountered this/ how did you handle it?

Yes, agree with a lot of the above posters comments about small premises, blocking access/egress etc. and also about voting with your feet by no frequenting these places. By any chance did you happen to ask to see their written policy on this, or ask if this policy also applies to wheelchair users ?

Ludo

You would think with the recession and all that, these places would be more than happy to get customers in regardless of whether they have a buggy or not. If the place is really busy, fair enough, but most places are not except at peak times. If they object to getting money paying customers in the door just coz they have a kid in a buggy with them, then they are shooting themselves in the foot as they are just costing themselves money. Anyone refused entry will almost certainly never go back to the establishment even when they don't have a kid with them.

stovelid

Most places that are awkward for buggies tend to be places that I steer clear of anyway as they are the kind of places that I dreaded encountering crying infants in before I had an infant myself.

The idea that your human rights are in some way being compromised because not everywhere is child-friendly is a little silly. Not everyone has kids, and buggies can be very cumbersome.

Leaving them outside (as suggested) isn't really an option.

bcirl03

If a simple buggy can cause 'health and safety' issues then they should not be open in the first place.

It's just an excuse in my opinion.

Name and shame so we can find out they are.

MagicMarker

Why bring a buggie, or baby for that matter, to a restaurant?

Do I even need to mention pubs? Bring your kid to the park ffs.

bcirl03

MagicMarker wrote: »

Why bring a buggie, or baby for that matter, to a restaurant?

Do I even need to mention pubs? Bring your kid to the park ffs.

Whilst I don’t agree with children in pubs, families are entitled to go out and socialise like others. Just because they have a buggy doesn’t mean they have to stay in like hermits or just go to parks. No harm in going to a restaurant for the evening with the family.

Ever been to the continent where they welcome families into restaurants?

How many kids do you have MagicMarker? My guess is zero.

MagicMarker

bcirl03 wrote: »

Whilst I don’t agree with children in pubs, families are entitled to go out and socialise like others. Just because they have a buggy doesn’t mean they have to stay in like hermits or just go to parks. No harm in going to a restaurant for the evening with the family.

Ever been to the continent where they welcome families into restaurants?

How many kids do you have MagicMarker? My guess is zero.

That's right, and I don't particularly want to have to climb over your buggies. If you're going out specifically to a restaurant, then just don't bring a buggie.

bcirl03

MagicMarker wrote: »

That's right, and I don't particularly want to have to climb over your buggies. If you're going out specifically to a restaurant, then just don't bring a buggie.

I'll bring what I like, get used to it - and enjoy your dinner for one.

The thread is about buggies not being allowed into establishments, you seem to be hell bent on turning this into an anti buggy \ family\ kiddie thread.

Just as well you have no kids.

Ludo

Ignore him...already reported for trolling. Let the mods deal with it.

bcirl03

Ludo wrote: »

Ignore him...already reported for trolling. Let the mods deal with it.

Thanks Ludo.

God help us if he ever has kids.

Zulu

bcirl03 wrote: »

I'll bring what I like, get used to it

Well, if the establishment doesn't welcome buggies, it's YOU that need to get used to it. I really don't see the problem: they take up loads of room and get in everyones way. Leave it outside as requested. Whats the problem?

and enjoy your dinner for one.

So, so arrogant. :rolleyes:

ntlbell

bcirl03 wrote: »

Whilst I don’t agree with children in pubs, families are entitled to go out and socialise like others. Just because they have a buggy doesn’t mean they have to stay in like hermits or just go to parks. No harm in going to a restaurant for the evening with the family.

Ever been to the continent where they welcome families into restaurants?

How many kids do you have MagicMarker? My guess is zero.

People who don't bring kids to restaurants, pub etc are also entitled to enjoy that meal in peace without screaming kids in their ear.

so there should be a happy medium, If I'm bringing my daughter with us we choose places that cater for kids and tends be more families.

If we're going out on our own we choose places that tend to be less family friendly as we want to enjoy the meal without the racket of kids.

surely everyone is entitled to be catered for?

Kimono-Girl

Zulu wrote: »

Well, if the establishment doesn't welcome buggies, it's YOU that need to get used to it. I really don't see the problem: they take up loads of room and get in everyones way. Leave it outside as requested. Whats the problem?
So, so arrogant. :rolleyes:

just to clarify a few points made here, i myself had not encountered any problems yet its just a few local places (i would be attending at some point) were mentioned as not allowing buggies due to health and safety, despite one being a hotel restaurant where i know space wouldn't be an issue, i was taken aback slightly as i wouldnt be one of those parents who would leave a screaming child just sit there and i would be very quick to move the buggy and apologise if it were in someones way half way through my dinner or not, although i have when out and about been doing my best to place it out of the way.

with a newborn it would be practically impossible to sit my daughter in a provided highchair and anyway i would worry about theft in leaving the buggy outside. i need the buggy to transport her. i just assumed that a buggy would be no more an inconvenience than a wheelchair and as was mentioned wheelchairs have to be allowed due to discrimination rights, i was wondering is it not discrimination against mothers and babies to refuse buggies?

i know people say vote with your feet but occasionally you have to frequent some places, i just never thought this was an issue! i was wondering if others had issues like this as its one parents are not warned about.

ntlbell

candlelover wrote: »

just to clarify a few points made here, i myself had not encountered any problems yet its just a few local places (i would be attending at some point) were mentioned as not allowing buggies due to health and safety, despite one being a hotel restaurant where i know space wouldn't be an issue, i was taken aback slightly as i wouldnt be one of those parents who would leave a screaming child just sit there and i would be very quick to move the buggy and apologise if it were in someones way half way through my dinner or not, although i have when out and about been doing my best to place it out of the way.

with a newborn it would be practically impossible to sit my daughter in a provided highchair and anyway i would worry about theft in leaving the buggy outside. i need the buggy to transport her. i just assumed that a buggy would be no more an inconvenience than a wheelchair and as was mentioned wheelchairs have to be allowed due to discrimination rights, i was wondering is it not discrimination against mothers and babies to refuse buggies?

i know people say vote with your feet but occasionally you have to frequent some places, i just never thought this was an issue! i was wondering if others had issues like this as its one parents are not warned about.

a lot of places use the aul health and safety issue when the crux of it is the regulars don't want kids in the place and for most it's the regulars who keep them in business. I know when I'm out for a pint I don't want them anywhere in sight and in a lot of locals what the regulars says goes, because at the end of the day, no regulars no business.

there's not a whole lot you can do about it really bar choosing to eat/drink in places that cater for kids.

BostonB

This is very simple.

If you don't like kids don't go to family friendly restaurants.
If you need a buggy go to a resturant that has the space for them.

How hard is that.

No point debating buggy use with people who have zero experience with using them.

The Big Red Button

candlelover wrote: »

i was taken aback slightly as i wouldnt be one of those parents who would leave a screaming child just sit there and i would be very quick to move the buggy and apologise if it were in someones way half way through my dinner or not, although i have when out and about been doing my best to place it out of the way.

Well it's great that you have consideration for other diners and for the staff, but there are plenty of parents that don't and are happy to leave the child screaming, ruining every other customer's meal. And the staff aren't going to know by the look of you whether you're one of "those" parents or not, so it's easier for them just to enforce a non-child-friendly policy (using H&S as an excuse.) I know I personally would far rather eat in an adults-only establishment, and plenty others would feel the same.

There are lots of child-friendly places, would you not rather give your hard-earned cash to one of those?

ntlbell

BostonB wrote: »

This is very simple.

You'd think so.

Zulu

I don't understand where all the "screaming kids" have come from. We are discussing buggies right?

I don't assume that buggy = screaming baby. I do however acknowledge that buggies take up a sizable amount of space. Generally speaking a table will fit chairs around it. When these chair are not in use, they get tucked in under the table out of the way. Tables do not generally accodomate for buggies. When the buggy is not in use, it doesn't get tucked away.

So the establishment don't allow them. Proper order. I get really pissed off when some inconsiderate parent happlessly abandons their oversized maclauren contraption in everyones way, so I can only imagine how the staff feel. Leave it outside. It's not in the way. Everyone is happy.

MagicMarker

bcirl03 wrote: »

I'll bring what I like, get used to it - and enjoy your dinner for one.

The thread is about buggies not being allowed into establishments, you seem to be hell bent on turning this into an anti buggy \ family\ kiddie thread.

Just as well you have no kids.

lol, how am I hell bent on anything after only two posts?

It seems I've touched a nerve. All I said was if you're going to a restaurant, don't bring a buggy. You're the one who's being personal here, it's uncalled for and rather petit, being a parent you should know better.

ntlbell

Zulu wrote: »

I don't understand where all the "screaming kids" have come from. We are discussing buggies right?

I don't assume that buggy = screaming baby. I do however acknowledge that buggies take up a sizable amount of space. Generally speaking a table will fit chairs around it. When these chair are not in use, they get tucked in under the table out of the way. Tables do not generally accodomate for buggies. When the buggy is not in use, it doesn't get tucked away.

So the establishment don't allow them. Proper order. I get really pissed off when some inconsiderate parent happlessly abandons their oversized maclauren contraption in everyones way, so I can only imagine how the staff feel. Leave it outside. It's not in the way. Everyone is happy.

The buggy is a front to make the place family unfriendly, they know you could come in without it but most people won't.

screaming kids/babies etc go hand in hand with buggies (usually)

it's a topic that gets done to death a week hardly goes by when some bright spark is on joe duffy ranting and raving about some place that wouldn't allow it

they don't want your business, so go elsewhere.

simu

During his buggy days, anytime I went to a restaurant with my son, I left the buggy at home or in the car. It's obvious that most restaurants don't have much room for buggies. I don't think that anti-buggy is anti-kids tbh.

Wantobe

If you really want to go to a place that doesnt allow buggies with a new born then I'd suggest a baby sling.

Speaking for myself once I had kids I no longer wanted to visit restaurants that weren't child friendly when they were with me. There is nothing worse than sitting in a cafe or restaurant with people all around you trying to enjoy their coffee or meal while your baby or child is bawling. It's not the other peoples fault, it's not ( always ) your fault and it ain't the child's fault! Children cry sometimes.

On the other hand, in a restaurant with other kids, it doesnt matter if your child cries. All the other parents are deafened from sustained exposure and are just delighted their own off spring aren't howling too. So they don't care. Therefore the pressure is off. And you can relax ( which funnily enough usually means the kids don't cry as much anyway).

I'd be more exercised about a restaurant or cafe that didn't allow breastfeeding. Something in our culture seems to mean that a fair amount of people aren't comfortable with it, are embarrassed by it and really it's such a natural thing!

BostonB

Can't imagine too many would leave a buggy outside for it to be nicked. You'd spend the whole time watching it.

nesf

MagicMarker wrote: »

Why bring a buggie, or baby for that matter, to a restaurant?

Do I even need to mention pubs? Bring your kid to the park ffs.

Why even bother posting in this forum? Seriously, any more crap and it's a ban.

Nevyn

and ntlbell is banned, permantly from the forum as we have had more then enough of his trolling.
Trolling and flaming is no tolerated here repeat offenders will be permabanned.
Issues or complaints about mod actions are to be taken to feedback/helpdesk.

Dudess

Breasts should be seen only in a sexual context, but not in the context of what they were intended for - yep, that does seem to be a widespread outlook unfortunately.

bcirl03 wrote: »

If a simple buggy can cause 'health and safety' issues then they should not be open in the first place.

Interesting logic, but...

Buggies take up space. Taking up space is a health and safety issue. It's really quite straightforward.

bcirl03 wrote: »

Ever been to the continent where they welcome families into restaurants?

Do they not welcome families into restaurants here?

Nevyn

It depends on the restruant tbh, fine dining and children for the most part do not mix but there are plenty of restruants which do welcome families and children.

Most small cáfe's are not going to have honestly the room for a buggy and if they choose not to cater to parents with kids then that is thier choice.

rainny

I work in a restaurant that welcomes families, buggies & children. The parents must fold up the buggies and put them in a small area at the front of the shop. It works very well and lots of families are return customers. However, at the weekends we can get a huge amount of families coming in and it's first come first served. I can't hold a never ending buggy pile at the front of my shop as other customers cannot get around them. So I tell some families that they will have to wait for a free space. The abuse I get because of this as I am trying to ensure 1. families are provided for and 2. other customers can move freely around the restaurant but some of the people with buggies don't care.

The parents complain the children need food / the buggy wont take up room / they need the buggy with them etc. So many times, buggies will be placed in front of my 2 emergency exit doors...When I ask them to move them, Oh, the hassle...

I have no problems with buggies in restaurant's, but it's not a 'right' to be able to bring it into the restaurant...

AckwelFoley

Irish society seems to hate children in public places, it seems more of a product of our "nouveau riche" snobby arse culture we developed.

The previous poster made some good points and i can understand their frustration, and yes trying to meander around a isle full of buggies can be less simple than not having them there, however.. its not something i lose sleep over. If i want to have a child free night, we get a babbysitter and got to a meal after 8 or 9pm.

As for the breast feeding, well.. there is nothing wrong with it, i dont take any notice of it, i think however its a cultural thing that we dont seem to be comfortable with.

Personally i find any discomfort rather immature.

BostonB

Some people obviously don't "get" why you'd need a buggy. Obviously because they've no experience of kids. Sometimes you use a buddy to restrict a childs movement, so they can't run all over the place. High chairs are often in very poor shape in many restaurants/cafes and often not an alternative. Also sometimres a child is actually asleep. Moving them out of the buggy wakes them, and perhaps you are taking advantage of them being asleep. Also sometimes a buggy is holding all the gear you need with the kids, change bag, distractions, coats etc. Not all kids need this, some do some don't. Personally I only go to certain restaurants with the kids.

Lots of restaurants/cafes are in small premises and there simply isn't room for buggies. Thats fair enough. I don't see what the fuss is. Either a place wants your custom or it doesn't. That applys to both sides of the debate. Vote with your wallet by not going there. How hard is that.

amdublin

I think this restaurant is right. I hate buggies in small spaces parked in the way of everything. Like I don't mind if there is a proper space for the buggy. But some people think that they have the right to put their buggy anywhere they like.

Imagine if I just parked myself in a spot where there is no room, like people do with their buggies. Very annoying eh?!

If there is no room for a buggy you probably should go to a different restaurant where there is room for the buggy. The restaurant is well justified saying no buggies and I for one thank him/her.

2SWEET

For the few that don't get buggies in restaurants as beening a health and safety issue here is a prime example, customer parks a buggy in a walkway for both staff and customers, a member of staff ask customer to move to a larger area more suited to parking buggy and the customer declined. A while later another customer or indeed a member of staff tries to walk passed the buggy with hot drinks on a tray, loses there footing and contents of the tray ends up on top of the child in the buggy.
Who do you think is going to be blamed.. you can be sure it won't be the parent!
Some parents need to cop on and realise restaurants are not only thinking of themselves in these situations, but more so the safety of the child and indeed the other customers.
If there is an area provided for buggy then use it, if there is not then just go elsewhere!

WindSock

One of the silliest things I have seen while out was a couple trying to get into a small restaurant with one of those giant SUV type buggies. They actually got angry at the fact the buggy simply wouldn't fit in the aisles and they had to leave. Wtf did these people expect? Go to a spacious restaurant that caters for children. There is also nothing more annoying for other diners than having to put up with a squeeling baby throughout the meal.

bcirl03

WindSock wrote: »

One of the silliest things I have seen while out was a couple trying to get into a small restaurant with one of those giant SUV type buggies. They actually got angry at the fact the buggy simply wouldn't fit in the aisles and they had to leave. Wtf did these people expect? Go to a spacious restaurant that caters for children. There is also nothing more annoying for other diners than having to put up with a squeeling baby throughout the meal.

Can we set the record straight here - not all babies scream when they are out!

A lot of the replies here seem to assume that once a baby is out, in a restaurant it will scream. However, they are prone to screaming I will admit.

amdublin

On the subject of screaming babies. (And those kids who run around like a crazed lunatics in restaurants)

I always wonder just why do their parents bring them to restaurants anyway??? It is surely not nice for the parents, it doesn't seem enjoyable for the babies/kids and it is definitely not nice for the rest of the patrons.

bcirl03

amdublin wrote: »

On the subject of screaming babies. (And those kids who run around like a crazed lunatics in restaurants)

I always wonder just why do their parents bring them to restaurants anyway??? It is surely not nice for the parents, it doesn't seem enjoyable for the babies/kids and it is definitely not nice for the rest of the patrons.

Speaking from experience it can be difficult to get babysitters and families are entitled to go out and enjoy themselves as a unit just like people who don’t have children. Our kids love to go out for dinner from time to time.

As for the mad kids running around I don’t allow mine to behave in that way and would let them know if they even started to run around.

Enii

bcirl03 wrote: »

Speaking from experience it can be difficult to get babysitters and families are entitled to go out and enjoy themselves as a unit just like people who don’t have children. Our kids love to go out for dinner from time to time.
.

That's all fair enough, but I guess problems arise if the children are noisy and disturbing others around them. Couples on their own don't tend to be noisy and cause interference to others around them.

In relation to the OP's post..... if restaurants are truly banning buggies on health and safety issues - well you can't really have a prob with that. If they were banning babies, it would certainly be discrimination against families and a case could surely be made. Check out the equality tribunal websites for info.

In essence, bring the child in to the restaurant but leave the buggy outside. Not difficult!

amdublin

Enii wrote: »

In essence, bring the child in to the restaurant but leave the buggy outside. Not difficult!

But if the baby is a screaming/crying baby please don't bring it to a restaurant. Imo it is not fair on the rest of the patrons trying to enjoy their meal in peace.

taram

amdublin wrote: »

But if the baby is a screaming/crying baby please don't bring it to a restaurant. Imo it is not fair on the rest of the patrons trying to enjoy their meal in peace.

Babies I will forgive because babies cry over all sorts of things. Recently out for a meal and a child who was at least 8 or 9 came up to our table, took the present I had at the side of the table (waiting for birthday girl to arrive) and ran off with it, ripping it open as he went! It's behaviour like that from children who are old enough to understand it's quiet time, and who have parents who allow this behaviour that should be discouraged from public places :P

Where I work we have an aisle to a back part of the shop that is easily 6-7 meters across, two double buggy Xtreme :P types both trying to get past today, was hysterical, neither woman would reverse her buggy, my manager had to intervene in the end

Cabaal

MagicMarker wrote: »

That's right, and I don't particularly want to have to climb over your buggies. If you're going out specifically to a restaurant, then just don't bring a buggie.

Very single minded view and for that matter selfish, while I don't have any kids myself I can fully understand why parents need buggys.

While pubs are not the places parents are fully entitled to go out for food, the very fact your saying they should go out without buggys suggests you've never even looked after a kid in your life.

Anyway as suggested before the best way for parents to deal with this is vote with their feet

Cabaal

taram wrote: »

Where I work we have an aisle to a back part of the shop that is easily 6-7 meters across, two double buggy Xtreme :P types both trying to get past today, was hysterical, neither woman would reverse her buggy, my manager had to intervene in the end

Sadly many parents act like alot of people when they use shopping trolleys,
- they think they have right of way no matter what
- they think they can fit through small spaces
- they think its indestructible

The unfortunately thingis there's a kid in a buggy so they can endanger someone elses life by acting the muppet