Some "interesting" videos...

K.O.Kiki

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DkBemRKgTOc

K.O.Kiki

Plinking is a definite help, but lots of players do 1f links just fine on pad without.
You know yourself; it's just an issue of practice.

K.O.Kiki

It's possibly a hardware issue since you're on keyboard, so multiple keypresses aren't registering/being overridden.

Doctor DooM

RopeDrink wrote: »

Whats the general consensus on combos here? You guys plink and all that? I don't know how one could achieve that on keyboard, have to do them from muscle memory and just regular timing.


Tips welcome - It's about time I stop relying on ****ty jab BnB's and get out some bigger damage since the general nerfs and Balrog changes. Watching the above vid of the Keyboard Balrog (Guy who had a clip of Ramza) doing all that fancy stuff got me all depressed

If you wanna hit them one framers you have to hit the training room and just practice plinking. I can do it near 100% of the time now but it did take some time and adjustment. It's now muscle memory for me to plink links.

I assume you know how to check if a plink is working in training?

UberPrinny_Baal

Doctor DooM wrote: »

I assume you know how to check if a plink is working in training?

I've been actually practicing this myself and not having much luck.

For plinking Deejays crouching jab x 2, into cr.mk, the display input in training mode should be (as displayed in game):

down, LK, MK
down, MK
down, LP
down, LP

Right?

I can get this input very consistently on the display, but mostly I seem to get crouching lk instead of crouching mk as the thing that comes out.

Ramza

You're doing it too early then

Doctor DooM

UberPrinny_Baal wrote: »

I've been actually practicing this myself and not having much luck.

For plinking Deejays crouching jab x 2, into cr.mk, the display input in training mode should be (as displayed in game):

down, LK, MK
down, MK
down, LP
down, LP

Right?

I can get this input very consistently on the display, but mostly I seem to get crouching lk instead of crouching mk as the thing that comes out.

That doesn't make too much sense, unless you're hitting the plink too early and hitting LK aft the MK or LK has some crazy property which over rides the MK.

Remember even though plinking makes it easier, you still have to be accurate to within 1/30 of a second. If I start missing a combo with a plink in it the first thing I do is go to the training room and just hit the plink a few times on it's own to make sure I'm not messing that up, before doing the whole combo.

GorySnake

Doctor DooM wrote: »

That doesn't make too much sense, unless you're hitting the plink too early and hitting LK aft the MK or LK has some crazy property which over rides the MK.

Like Ramza said, hitting the plink too early, which causes a chain from lp to lk rather than a link

Doctor DooM

GorySnake wrote: »

Like Ramza said, hitting the plink too early, which causes a chain from lp to lk rather than a link

Ah ok, obviously I'm just too gdlk for that to have ever happened to me.

UberPrinny_Baal

Thanks guys, I'll try and relax a little on the inputs.

I forgot the maths advantage behind plinking: that it only makes my odds of hitting the combo go from 1/60 to 2/60 or 1/30. It was so long since I read up on how to do it, I think I got the mistaken impression it was magical in the time since.

I presume that double-plinking is only going to make it more likely I get the LK link by accident?

Ramza

I double plink on stick when I can, it's helpful, especially after Ryu's f+fierce link to cr.fierce, but I'd say sticking with normal plinking is fine too, up to you

GorySnake

UberPrinny_Baal wrote: »

I forgot the maths advantage behind plinking: that it only makes my odds of hitting the combo go from 1/60 to 2/60 or 1/30. It was so long since I read up on how to do it, I think I got the mistaken impression it was magical in the time since.

Changing a 1f link into a 2f link is actually a huge difference.

UberPrinny_Baal

Ramza wrote: »

I double plink on stick when I can, it's helpful, especially after Ryu's f+fierce link to cr.fierce, but I'd say sticking with normal plinking is fine too, up to you

I'll try that too then, see how I get on.

GorySnake wrote: »

Changing a 1f link into a 2f link is actually a huge difference.

Once I have it down I'm sure I'll agree with you. Having a cr.LK come out instead of nothing ain't bad either.

Doctor DooM

Just thinking, you could probably option select a light sobat after the lk which means you'd get a knock down whether the mk comes out of not as light sobat causes knock down

Ramza

UberPrinny_Baal wrote: »

I'll try that too then, see how I get on.



Once I have it down I'm sure I'll agree with you. Having a cr.LK come out instead of nothing ain't bad either.

I'm sure you could option select that by inputting a special after you hit the plink, so if you get cr.lk you cancel to special and if you get sweep you get the hard knockdown (since afaik cr.mk is not special cancellable ith deejay)

Edit : Just seen Doom's post, great minds and that :pac:

UberPrinny_Baal

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Just thinking, you could probably option select a light sobat after the lk which means you'd get a knock down whether the mk comes out of not as light sobat causes knock down

Ramza wrote: »

I'm sure you could option select that by inputting a special after you hit the plink, so if you get cr.lk you cancel to special and if you get sweep you get the hard knockdown (since afaik cr.mk is not special cancellable ith deejay)

Edit : Just seen Doom's post, great minds and that :pac:

Your ideas intrigue me, and I would very much like to subscribe to your newsletter(s).

So the input for this option select would be:

(Hold downback) cr.lp, cr.lp, cr: lk/lk+mk plink, forward lk

Sorry not too sure of button notations in SF.

My main question is when do I press forward, and am I negative edging the lk sobat from the lk button press in the plink?

Ramza

You can negative edge if you like, personally I wouldn't since there is no real benefit, you don't know whether cr.mk or cr.lk is going to come out so there is no benefit with negative edge here unless it makes it more comfortable for you, try it out

And yeah your inputs are correct, although the SF4 engine only allows cancels if the last two normals are linked, so make sure your cr.mk plink is done during that time frame, to allow for the option select to happen

You can also do the upkicks too if you like (dunno if it works, you can cancel to anything at all really )

UberPrinny_Baal

Just thinking about it in my head without having a fightstick in my hand, I was thinking maybe negative edging that last part might be easier. Not too sure. My concern about doing a special after a plink would be accidentally doing an EX special I didn't want.

The main disadvantage of upkicks would be the fact it whiffs on crouchers.

Ramza wrote: »

And yeah your inputs are correct, although the SF4 engine only allows cancels if the last two normals are linked, so make sure your cr.mk plink is done during that time frame, to allow for the option select to happen

Not sure what you mean here by the SF engine/2 linked normals requirement.

Ramza

You can only cancel to a special if the last two normals in a combo are links. For example with Akuma if you try and cancel rapid fired cr.jabs into tatsu it wont work, you need to make sure at least the last two cr.jabs are linked, same with any character. Another recurring example is boxer's cr.lp, cr.lk. People cancel it and rush the input and complain they can't cancel the cr.lk after, you need to link it and then it works

What I meant was, if you rush the plink and get cr.lk, you might not be able to cancel the cr.lk if it's not linked from a cr.jab, rendering the OS useless. I'm pretty sure the timing for cr.jab -> cr.mk link is the same for cr.jab -> cr.lk link, so find a universal timing for the option select to work off, thus if you mess up your plink you still get the option selected special cancel

You will get an EX special if you plink then take both fingers off mk + lk simultaneously after the special input, which is why I said negative edging might be awkward in this situation but whatever is comfortable for you

UberPrinny_Baal

Cool thanks Ramza!
Didn't know that about the engine.

blag

Yuuvega...what a guy!

Ramza

Look how hard that Devil's reverse is to block!!

Dreddybajs

UberPrinny_Baal wrote: »

The main disadvantage of upkicks would be the fact it whiffs on crouchers

If they're sitting there crouching then the OS won't come out anyway as they'll block/get hit by the lk. I dunno if it would be very useful as an OS apart from that anyway though.

Ramza

Dreddybajs wrote: »

If they're sitting there crouching then the OS won't come out anyway as they'll block/get hit by the lk. I dunno if it would be very useful as an OS apart from that anyway though.

Yeah like I said OSing an axe kick (or sobat w/e its called) would be better, although I think I'm misunderstanding what you're saying Dreddy?

I could be totally wrong but in my head I thought for the cr.jab - > cr.mk link you could os a special from the plink in the case cr.lk gets linked from the cr.jab in the event of a mistaken plink, and cr.mk is not cancellable, I could be wrong like I said

Dreddybajs

Oh right, I thought it was a chain os for against backdashes. Yeah still no point using upkicks in that situation then tho

blag

Ramza wrote: »

Look how hard that Devil's reverse is to block!!

You always seem to block it when we play, speaking of which, we should have a ggpo session soon

Doctor DooM

RopeDrink wrote: »

Eek, seems my late-morning rant about plinks made things a bit OT.

I'm sure there's plenty of interesting vids about OS and Plinks/Combos anyways

I'll have to hit the Balrog Combo's thread / Plinking thread and get a general idea but aye, Kiki is probably right that the Keyboard struggles with multiple inputs.

Here's a weird one - Since SF4AE it's now impossible for me to use Light Headbutt - You'd think that was a non-issue but no, it just wont come out, you'll get a CJab or a Jumping Jab which makes no sense. This is a gaming keyboard so I thought it would cure issues not make more - In addition SF4AE when it was released had a major incompatability issue with Keyboards - They patched it AFAIK but it didn't seem to make much difference... Either way the Keyboard worked for me after install but apparrently not for everyone else.

*shrug* May have to stick to basic BnB's.

I vaguely recall Azza saying there was some problem with delay on inputs in general in AE on PC. Could be that.

Plinking isn't hard once you get used to it, and it's pretty easy to test in training mode, so unless yuo've tried it don't poo poo it. It also makes you sound way more bad ass when your playing as it it makes this lovely musical double- input sound when you do a long combo

And I've never minded a bit of OT chat on this forum as long as it stays relative to the game, things always work back to the original topic.

UberPrinny_Baal

Dreddybajs wrote: »

Oh right, I thought it was a chain os for against backdashes. Yeah still no point using upkicks in that situation then tho

My original problem was that I'm going for a combo ending in cr.MK, but regularly missing my plink and getting cr.LK.

I think Ramza and Doom's original suggestion was that I could put an OS into my combo, so that IF I get the cr.LK, it's cancelled into a lk sobat, and I get the knockdown anyway.

So it would be an option select against my own error, rather than my opponent's choices.

Da Bounca

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVglJYvDsnA

Ramza

UberPrinny_Baal wrote: »

My original problem was that I'm going for a combo ending in cr.MK, but regularly missing my plink and getting cr.LK.

I think Ramza and Doom's original suggestion was that I could put an OS into my combo, so that IF I get the cr.LK, it's cancelled into a lk sobat, and I get the knockdown anyway.

So it would be an option select against my own error, rather than my opponent's choices.

It's also good to OS sweep (in deejay's case cr.mk) to catch backdashers, it's a win win situation but might be a bit much if you're still learning to implement the the OS DooM/I suggested

You do cr.jab, then cr.jab + mk. The game lists chain normals as having priority over normal button priorities (where kicks have priority over punches), so on block/hit the game sees one cr.jab, then takes cr.jab + mk as a cr.jab as it is impossible to rapid fire a cr.jab to a cr.mk

On backdash(whiff), the opponent gets swept, hard knockdown, go figure

So ultimately you could use two OSes in one string using the above examples