Uphill Tips

thecornerboy

I've been getting into shape recently. Doing some pretty decent average speeds over 15-35k (20-23Kmph) on a fairly crappy bike. I manage to maintain my speed and momentum even facing into a strong headwind and from start to finish on the flat but one thing that always kills me are hills. I'm quite a heavy lad, even very gradual uphills always kill me and steep ones I usually have to dismount. Maybe it will come with time but does anybody have any tips for handling hills? Mental tricks or anything. I tried to keep going at a big hill yesterday but got light headed and almost fell off.

Raam

Be stubborn.
Also, you get faster cycling uphill as you get lighter and stronger.

scottreynolds

Search this forum for climbing tips... or go to http://www.cptips.com/climb.htm

Morgan

Get into a manageable gear at the bottom of the hill - don't start in a hard gear and change down halfway up.

Look as far ahead as you can up the hill.

Climbing is hard if you're carrying extra weight - it should get easier in time.

Liamo08

I personally find staying in the saddle and getting into a nice steady rhythm from the start of the climb and try to maintain that all the way to the top is what works best for me. Getting in and out of the saddle generally sends my pulse through the roof and results in a much more painful and slower experience overall. As you get fitter you should be able to get out of the saddle etc more but if you’re just building it up then I think stay in the saddle and conserve your energy as much as possible is a good tip. If you have a pulse meter I’d also try and keep it in a range that you can maintain for the duration of the hill say 170 -180, if you’re having to get off the bike I’d say your pulse is a lot higher on any hills at the minute. Finally I usually keep my cadence steady and adjust for the steepness of the hill or my tiredness by going up the gears.

ednwireland

what gearing do you have on the bike i'm fairly hefty but run a triple with 12-25 on the back and generally dont have a problem spinning up any hills (in donegal but havent been up glengesh was tempted on sunday but bottled it)
the gearing allows me to stay in the saddle i might get out of the saddle a bit just to change body position on long climbs but generally i'm in the saddle

Lumen

Never stop on a hill.

Go more slowly, from the beginning. If going slower doesn't help, consider changing your gearing.

Ride regularly, but take rest days.

Eat less. Embrace the hunger. If your stomach isn't perfectly flat (or preferably concave) you haven't lost enough weight yet.

Aim to achieve a Tyrannosaurus build - big legs and spindly arms. You only need enough arm strength to stop your chin from hitting the stem.

Ryaner

Never underestimate the benefits of loosing a bit of weight. Personally it has made a huge difference to me over the past 6 months with very noticeable increases.

Someone also suggested the HR monitor. This is great for when you want to push yourself somewhat. You'll find the Max that you can sustain for a length of time and then from there you should always make it up the hills.

And don't worry about being slow. There is always someone slower. They may just not be on the hill at the same time

Captain Havoc

Ryaner wrote: »

And don't worry about being slow. There is always someone slower. They may just not be on the hill at the same time

That would be me!!!!!!!!

seamus

Liamo08 wrote: »

I personally find staying in the saddle and getting into a nice steady rhythm from the start of the climb and try to maintain that all the way to the top is what works best for me. Getting in and out of the saddle generally sends my pulse through the roof and results in a much more painful and slower experience overall.

Avoid getting out of the saddle at all unless you're going to significantly increase your pace. Yes, it can give your legs a brief stretch, but there's a slight pedalling delay when you sit back down again which will reduce your speed and make it even harder to get back into the rhythm.

Lumen

seamus wrote: »

Avoid getting out of the saddle at all unless you're going to significantly increase your pace. Yes, it can give your legs a brief stretch, but there's a slight pedalling delay when you sit back down again which will reduce your speed and make it even harder to get back into the rhythm.

I was formerly in the "stay seated" camp.

I now get out of the saddle often, alternating between the two positions every 30 seconds or so. This helps the leg muscles recover, and is definitely faster (at my level of fitness anyway).

There should be no "pedalling delay" if you concentrate on a smooth transition. I usually go up one or two gears before standing up and drop back after sitting down.

Captain Havoc

This is how it's done:

thebouldwhacker

I'd be quite different, I have to get outa the saddle at intervals. Click up one or two gears and lift that ass, you can pedal slower but with more power.

OP speed is completely irrelivant when your goal is to reach the top in one go so take your time and when the day comes that you make a hill you could not before, you own that hill... take a moment and feel it, that is what will drive you to beat the next one too. As above approch the hill slow and steady, use your gears wisely and when you have enough training in, bang! it'll be job done:D

There is hill down here called priests leap... shes a doozy, I'm fighting it at the mo, by the end of the summer I will have conqured it, thats my target, climb that baby non stop, and when I do it the next will be to climb it from the kerry side... no idea what to do then though... might have to check out these wicklow climbs I keep reading about;)

victorcarrera

He died alone in a hotel room as a result a drug overdose. That video clip is just another one of the lows in his life. I wouldn't use that as an example of how to climb. He was on a different fuel mix back then. Iv'e read the books.

ROK ON

Lumen wrote: »

Embrace the hunger. If your stomach isn't perfectly flat (or preferably concave) you haven't lost enough weight yet.

Life would not be worth it without cake.

seamus

thebouldwhacker wrote: »

OP speed is completely irrelivant when your goal is to reach the top in one go so take your time and when the day comes that you make a hill you could not before, you own that hill... take a moment and feel it, that is what will drive you to beat the next one too.

Actually, that's probably the best point. It doesn't matter how slow you go, so long as you get there in the end without leaving the bike. I managed to climb Stocking Lane up to viewpoint over the weekend without stopping. As a teenager, I'd never been able to do that, despite going that route every other weekend. And I did it on a 20kg full sus MTB. Didn't exactly fly up it, but I was delighted to have made it.

Once you can solidly make it up without stopping, every time, then you can work at getting up it faster.

Chips Lovell

1. Drop the weight. This will make by far the biggest difference than any alteration of technique.

2. Start a hill slowly. Get down into a nice easy gear, one that feels too easy for the hill and just start spinning in that. If you still feel OK later on you can shift up and speed up a little.

2. Don't stop on hills. It breaks your rhythm and you'll end up feeling worse.

ROK ON

Last few posts are what its all about.
The enjoyment of climbing comes in besting a hill that has always caused you trouble.

For light folk/natural climbers there are probably very few climbs in Ireland that are in this category, but for us fatties, there are challenges everywhere.

The only reason I like the hills (cause its not as if I am any good at them), is the sense of achievement.

dub_skav

I just reintroduced myself to the hills up to Johnnie Fox's, Boharnabreena and Sally gap over the last 2 weeks. hadn't climbed a proper hill on a bike in a year and I really suffered.

I am a big lad too - over 16 stone - so not a natural climber. What the others have said is the key; Take it as slow as you need to and just keep going. It's not meant to be enjoyable, it's hard work. But once you get to the top you get a great sense of achievement which will keep you coming back and it gets easier every time.

DBCyc

A question for climbers...

When you are pushing yourself up a hill, do you feel your legs struggling first or your heart rate pumping too fast (or both )? From my experience, when I am struggling up a hill, my heart rate is pounding but my legs feel okay. I usually try to stay seated and spin in a low gear.

Does this mean that I should try a slightly higher gear up the hills & get out of the saddle sometimes, i.e. use my leg muscles a bit more?

Chips Lovell

DBCyc wrote: »

A question for climbers...

When you are pushing yourself up a hill, do you feel your legs struggling first or your heart rate pumping too fast (or both )? From my experience, when I am struggling up a hill, my heart rate is pounding but my legs feel okay. I usually try to stay seated and spin in a low gear.

It depends. Usually its the lungs that go first. But when I give up the fags, it's the legs that hurt.

thebouldwhacker

My legs are far stronger than my lungs (used to be on 20/40 dunhill a day) but its changing slowly:D

Thats why one should approach a hill at a proper pace, If you know your legs can do it but your fitness will let you down slow it down, make an O shape with your mouth (this makes your breathing much more efficient) and breath as deep as possible, get the O2 to the legs and allow them to do their work.

DBCyc

Yeah I just need more practice on my technique I suppose. I also do a bit of running and when I am pushing hard, my legs struggle and my lungs/heart are relatively okay. But when climbing on the bike, my heart/lungs are in bits! I suppose I need to get out more in the hills and learn how to pace myself.

Wez

Some great tips here already, thought I'd stick in my own to add to it..

I find scraping the soles of my feet and focusing on the circular roatation, rather than just mashing the pedals makes a huge difference uphill/into wind.

Hitting it at about 60-70% (varies depending on length/angle of hill) works for me, on a fixed gear, gives me a good blast up the bottom of the hill and most of the hard work is done (with speed built up on the flats) already.

I alternate from saddle to standing depending on the speed I'm going at, how much energy I have left etc. but I thought it was interesting to see other people noticing the loss of rythm when sitting down again.. Thought it was just me!

Captain Havoc

I'm shocked at the number of smokers!!!!!

DBCyc

jerseyeire wrote: »

I'm shocked at the number of smokers!!!!!

I thought that it was perfectly normal behaviour

Liamo08

el tonto wrote: »

2. Start a hill slowly. Get down into a nice easy gear, one that feels too easy for the hill and just start spinning in that. If you still feel OK later on you can shift up and speed up a little.

100% agree with this one, if you start off in too big a gear at the bottom you can easily blow up very quickly. Getting that nice rhythm going early will make it much easier and has always resulted in faster times when I've timed myself going over hills.

thebouldwhacker

ex-smoker:D (ish)

3 months off the fags bought me my roadie:D

jimshady101

I am relatively new to road cycling. I am also a bit on the big side, I am 5ft 11, 13.5 stone but I can bench 80Kgs so not all fat:D.

I did the ROK cycle last weekend and I found the best method of getting up the big hills is stay at a consistent pace, choose a manageable gear and stay in the saddle for as long as possible. I also found that doing some thing like counting back from 200 while cycling up the hill takes my mind off the pain in my quads.
I am from killarney so I try to go up Moll's gap at least once a week to help myself improve. Very important to be well hydrated too!

As previously mentioned, body weight is a big factor when it comes to climbing hills, I am in the process of trying to loose a stone without losing muscle. Taking a supplement called CLA which in short stops fat cells from storing fat from blood stream.At the same time CLA also stimulates the breakdown of stored body fat.

FrankGrimes

el tonto wrote: »

1. Drop the weight. This will make by far the biggest difference than any alteration of technique.

2. Start a hill slowly. Get down into a nice easy gear, one that feels too easy for the hill and just start spinning in that. If you still feel OK later on you can shift up and speed up a little.

3. Don't stop on hills. It breaks your rhythm and you'll end up feeling worse.

+1. That's it in a nutshell right there. First time tackling a particular climb, just aim to get up it. Once you know you can beat it, next time worry about speed but still apply step 2 here - forget the ego and drop to an easy gear right at the start and build it up from there. It's a lot easier to increase speed if you think you are cycling within yourself than it is to recover while still climbing if you over-exert yourself early in the climb.

I'm a big lad suited to using my power on rolling terrain so I used to think that pounding a big gear up the climb would be the best way to go until I followed advice in a very similar thread on here and now go to my easiest gear and just focus on cadence at the start and then up the pace and gearing from there while staying within my limits.

thebouldwhacker

I take back everything I said in this thread, nearly got beaten last night by a climb.
I went out yesterday, two climbs to start followed by 40 minutes up/down but battling a fierce headwind and died on the last climb a long drawn out 8km 125meter drag, I blame it on the wind (nearly got knocked off the bike with one gust) anyway I thought that I'm not fast but I have the perseverance sorted. maybe not...

If there was a broom-wagon last night I'd have taken it...

Hills suck, wind sucks, pricks in D reg cars suck.

pburns

Lumen wrote: »

Eat less. Embrace the hunger. If your stomach isn't perfectly flat (or preferably concave) you haven't lost enough weight yet.

Aim to achieve a Tyrannosaurus build - big legs and spindly arms. You only need enough arm strength to stop your chin from hitting the stem.

Concave stomach and spindly arms? :eek:

If you really believe that you're taking the whole thing FAR too seriously. I'm scared by the anti-weight zeal displayed here sometimes (not aimed personally as you Lumen, I mean generally).

I'd sacrifice speed on a bike for general health/aestheics any day of the week...

Lumen

pburns wrote: »

Concave stomach and spindly arms? :eek:

If you really believe that you're taking the whole thing FAR too seriously. I'm scared by the anti-weight zeal displayed here sometimes (not aimed personally as you Lumen, I mean generally).

It's all a bit of fun. Like anything on the internet, take with a pinch of salt/Alli.

That said, there does seem to be a tendency for the sprinters to get very defensive when their burger/cake supply is threatened.

pburns wrote: »

I'd sacrifice speed on a bike for general health/aestheics any day of the week...

That's loser talk. ;)

Nietzschean

pburns wrote: »

I'd sacrifice speed on a bike for general health/aestheics any day of the week...

Which is the way to be normally, but if you want to climb mountains/hills at speed, less weight is obviously a big bonus... you don't need to go overboard but every little helps....

Chips Lovell

I don't know a single cyclist, and that includes a lot of good racing cyclists and climbers, whose weight is so low to be considered unhealthy.

Lumen

el tonto wrote: »

I don't know a single cyclist, and that includes a lot of good racing cyclists and climbers, whose weight is so low to be considered unhealthy.

It's probably impossible/contradictory to be unhealthily thin and competitive in an endurance event.

I think there are cultural norms involved too.

Billy Whizz

Weight is not an issue in racing in Ireland, there aren't enough climbs and they aren't long enough. Improve you power and forget about your weight, it'll take care of itself through smart training and a balanced diet.

On a side note about embracing the hunger, I know a lad who did exactly that and went from ~63kg to ~60kg to "get faster on the hills". His body fat increased, his muscles atrophied and his sustainable power plummeted.

Chips Lovell

Billy Whizz wrote: »

Weight is not an issue in racing in Ireland...

I think that depends on your weight. If you're heavy enough, you'll suffer on any kind of a hill in a race.

ROK ON

el tonto wrote: »

I think that depends on your weight. If you're heavy enough, you'll suffer on any kind of a hill in a race.

You'll also suffer on the hills when not in a race!
In fairness Tonto, what is your technique. I dont mean to personalise things, but like many of us, you are not a small lad, you run a double not compact (AFAIK), but you seem to just get on with the hills.
Is it practice or a high pain treshold (or just medication!!!).

Billy Whizz

el tonto wrote: »

I think that depends on your weight. If you're heavy enough, you'll suffer on any kind of a hill in a race.

If you are heavy, untrained and carrying excess body fat yes. However I'm sure a lack of sustainable power is still the primary limiter. But amongst trained cyclists, differences in weight aren't that big a deal. The bigger riders (well, still <80kg) can just tough it out and power up the short hills.

Lumen

Billy Whizz wrote: »

On a side note about embracing the hunger, I know a lad who did exactly that and went from ~63kg to ~60kg to "get faster on the hills". His body fat increased, his muscles atrophied and his sustainable power plummeted.

Thanks, I finally have a non-theoretical example of this

FWIW, I think there is a strong case for lower weight even on rolling terrain (as opposed to proper hills). Physiological stress is related to variability; every cyclist I've ridden with pushes harder on inclines than declines; therefore by minimizing weight you flatten out the effort and are able to sustain greater average power, and go faster/burn fewer matches.

thebouldwhacker

I'm not sure I follow, If cyclist A is 50kg and he's energy output is X, cyclist B is 100kg and his energy output is also x then rider A will always win (half the weight to propell).

I asume there is a law of diminishing return which dictates an ideal formula regarding weight/pwer ratio for indivduals...

niceonetom

Billy Whizz wrote: »

On a side note about embracing the hunger, I know a lad who did exactly that and went from ~63kg to ~60kg to "get faster on the hills". His body fat increased, his muscles atrophied and his sustainable power plummeted.

Surely the moral of that story is not "weight loss is bad" but "muscle loss is bad". Which isn't controversial at all. He probably could have lost 3kgs without drop in power (if he's got a tiny frame) but it would have been harder and slower - he still might have had to "embrace the hunger" a little though. It's pretty hard to loose weight without experiencing hunger somwhere along the line.

If he lost weight but his body-fat percentage went up he was obviously going abou t it the wrong way. Anyway, unless he was 5 foot nothing 60kg sounds pretty extreme.

I think I'll try to cultivate an obsession with this stuff as I've been inspired by the Marmotte thread.

Chips Lovell

ROK ON wrote: »

In fairness Tonto, what is your technique. I dont mean to personalise things, but like many of us, you are not a small lad, you run a double not compact (AFAIK), but you seem to just get on with the hills.
Is it practice or a high pain treshold (or just medication!!!).

Yep, I've got a standard double. Hills are all about power to weight. I'm not so hot on the weight side of the equation, but would have better power than a lot of people. I'm not a great climber by any means though.

Lumen

I have actually investigated getting a DEXA scan, but apparently it requires GP approval, and this is queued behind "what's my hematocrit level?" on my wishlist of mad things to ask my doctor.

Raam

Lumen wrote: »

I have actually investigated getting a DEXA scan, but apparently it requires GP approval, and this is queued behind "what's my hematocrit level?" on my wishlist of mad things to ask my doctor.

He must love when you book an appointment.

Chips Lovell

Lumen wrote: »

I have actually investigated getting a DEXA scan, but apparently it requires GP approval, and this is queued behind "what's my hematocrit level?" on my wishlist of mad things to ask my doctor.

I got my hct as part of a medical checkup once. I think it was 43.

Raam

el tonto wrote: »

I got my hct as part of a medical checkup once. I think it was 43.

You ain't gonna win any races with that. I know how you can increase it. PM me.

Chips Lovell

Raam wrote: »

You ain't gonna win any races with that. I know how you can increase it. PM me.

Are you trying to sell me your own blood?

Raam

el tonto wrote: »

Are you trying to sell me your own blood?

It's a recession, gotta pay da bills.

scottreynolds

may be the two of you could clone a child.