AFTER HOURS DOUBLE STANDARDS

johnny_knoxvile

I was banned from After Hours for allegedly "Trolling", merely because I made a cynical comment about corporate America in the following thread:

Pixar does decent by a dying 10yr old girl

My posts are there for everyone to see.

I made a valid point, I was at no time offensive or insensitive, I merely expressed a point of view.

The Moderator that banned me, in a thread about the Air France crash, made the following comment:

'My first thought was to mail people the link saying "May contain lost spoilers."
Now they all think I'm a callous bastard'.

When another Boards user (Fink Goddie) stood up for me and pointed out the hypocracy of the banning she too was banned and had her posts removed.

I've seen a lot worse said than what either of us said on a daily basis in AH and it is not banned. Suddenly people get over emotional over a certain subject matter and a little close knit group on AH close ranks and start deciding to ban anyone who's opinion differs.

Fair play to "stevie cakes" and "handsomecake" for also pointing out the double standards at the risk of getting banned. And to the moderator "Piste" who seemed to be the only moderator with an objective view.

Thank you for your reading.

Mr. Knoxvile

Fajitas!

Rabies' post > Your argument.

Ponster

Post #7 was an on-thread warning. Had this not been posted then maybe you would have been ok but the fact that it was there meant that it was no longer a typical AH thread.

Boston

You were warned.

Sharpshooter

My take on this is, there was a warning given on the first page of the thread and you ignored it.

The Mod Rabies said he would ban anyone posting AH crap in the thread.

johnny_knoxvile wrote: »

like newspapes wouldnt try capitalise on a missing Maddie or a dying Jade Goodie. Im not sure i have faith in corporate morals. But i hope you are right.

The thread had nothing to do with either.
So you were off topic there.

johnny_knoxvile wrote: »

as i said i hoped the poster was right when they said they didnt believe it was a publicity stunt. Its a tragic story no doubt.

They dont have to comment to get a story to spead. Internet, chat forums. I repeat i hope it isnt, i just said i dont have faith in corporate America.

Again, off topic.
Not only was there a warning given by the Mod of the forum, poster Oubliette asked you to stop.

0ubliette wrote: »

Oh STFU. This isnt a thread about corporate america and you shouldve been banned for your first post anyway.

back on topic:

johnny_knoxvile wrote: »

i dont doubt its tragic.

Rather than remove my paranoid self or over sensitive people get upset, would it not be better to post the thread in a forum other than After Hours where you get a certain responce?

The OP was getting the correct response from all who posted until you derailed it with the above posts.

johnny_knoxvile wrote: »

yep, where did i not accept others view? I didnt call for anyone to be banned, or tell anyone to STFU or otherwise.

I made a point and a few people got touchy. How is this anymore "heartfelt" than child abuse or plane cashes? All of which attracts off topic comment.

It was an uplifting Thread because something could and was done to grant a dying child's wish.
It was about Pixar rather than the child, you can see that in the way the OP worded the Thread title.

After your post the thread was brought off topic by another poster following in your footsteps.
See below.

handsomecake wrote: »

one of the most pertinent posts ive seen on boards .the double standards are disgusting in here. i recognise half these user names from jade goody dying/ air france threads and they all took the piss.

heres my pun.
i wonder did she watch it in "colby" surround sound.
insert thanks in the box below.

handsomecake wrote: »

double standards. you mods seem to pick and choose when you want ah to be serious. i didnt see you telling people to pipe down during the air france thread?? even though a poster's cousin was on the plane. that thread was wall to wall puns yet he gets banned for coming up with a pun of his own (an absolute gem i might add) .

what was the difference between the girls cousin on boards.ie who died in the ocean and this girl who died of cancer.

judging by your modding you value the little girls life more

handsomecake wrote: »

i wonder did she watch it in colby surround sound.puntastic

handsomecake wrote: »

are you stupid??? i campaigned in helpdesk to have more seroius discussion in AH.i got shot down by all and sundry.
jade goody died and was pilloried on here.
couple of hundred people died in air france crash.........mass punning piss taking ensues? if i go trawling into either of those threads will i find a post from you in there calling for people to stop???? why the moral high ground with my post?

to quote what gets said on here every day " sure its after hours ,what dya expect?" . now off with you to humanities.by the way people related to me(one particularly close) died from cancer.so dont give me this courage bull****.she was probably afraid of the dark and tarantulas. she is not john mclane

handsomecake wrote: »

exactly my point. im not usually like this. im acting the arse hole to highlight the point. yeah the story was heart warming,yeah she was young,yeah she was innocent,yeah she had cancer which was not her fault.

people on boards could be related to a person from one or more of the following categories
a rape victim
an alcholic
a drug addict
a cancer patient
a non nuclear family
adopted
disabled etc etcetc

people make light of all the above every day on here despite the fact it could(more then likely) upset readers. dont pick and choose which stories warrant respect or not. either have a forum(moral) charter or not.

i remember a story of a disabled boy. think his second name was baxter and his mother wanted to get him a grilfriend to sleep with him.and ye all took the piss.short memories on here

Again there was a warning on the first page of Thread as to the way the Mod wanted it to go.

stepbar wrote: »

Ah, 9 pages later and the thread has turned into the cesspit of sh1te AH is. Well done folks.

Here the other poster thanks the above post thus agreeing that he is partly responsible for the way it went off topic.

handsomecake wrote: »

cheers thanks:D

eagle eye

Sharpshooter wrote: »

The OP was getting the correct response from all who posted until you derailed it with the above posts.

WAT?????????????????????

You can only post 'the correct response' in a thread now?

Sharpshooter

eagle eye wrote: »

WAT?????????????????????

You can only post 'the correct response' in a thread now?

That's not what I said and you know that.
That was in reply to johnny_knoxvile when he said would it not be better to post the thread in a forum other than After Hours where you get a certain responce
The thread was in the correct forum imo.

The response that was asked for by Rabies on the first page of the thread was to keep it nice.
Or to put it another way, he asked for no crap to be posted.

brummytom

johnny_knoxvile, I (as I hope/presume many others did) reported your posts after several unneccessary posts.

Rabies warned at the start of the thread

If anyone throws in typical AH comments in to this thread I'll ban their ass. Try to have serious thread for once.

Your posts weren't constructive, or sensitive.

The Jade Goody/Air France Crash threads have nothing to do with this.

Tristram

I'm confused... was this or was it not in AH? If so the whole point is that it you don't have to be serious.

Ass

Fight the good fight OP.

mgsrocks

Tristram wrote: »

I'm confused... was this or was it not in AH? If so the whole point is that it you don't have to be serious.

I completely agree with you. If the mods wanted a serious talk then they could have moved it. I dont think the posters comment was out of place in AH and a permanent ban is to harsh.

Rabies

eagle eye wrote: »

WAT?????????????????????

You can only post 'the correct response' in a thread now?

No.

I asked that the typical asshat AH response (I'm guilty of it at times) be kept out of that thread. This is because of the reaction to the Air France thread.

If someone can't keep the childish comments at bay in one thread then there is no hope for them.

AH isn't the complete free for all that some of you think. We do have standards, but a little lower than most place but we can scrub up clean.

Why have people think its the dark pit of Boards all the time.

Ass

Rabies wrote: »

Why have people think its the dark pit of Boards all the time.

in fairness, it is

Sleipnir

This guy didn't get banned for calling someone "a prick"

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=60787589&postcount=115

That would earn anyone a banning on any other thread but it would appear that since he was "on-side" with the mods; no problem!

Ass

all mods = nazis

Gordon

Sleipnir wrote: »

This guy didn't get banned for calling someone "a prick"

Why do you presume he wasn't banned?

He was.

Sleipnir

Gordon wrote: »

Why do you presume he wasn't banned?

He was.

Ah, sorry then!

[Doffs hat, withdraws]

javaboy

Sleipnir wrote: »

This guy didn't get banned for calling someone "a prick"

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=60787589&postcount=115

That would earn anyone a banning on any other thread but it would appear that since he was "on-side" with the mods; no problem!

He was banned as was another poster for calling handsomecake names. I would normally note that on thread. I forgot to in this case which admittedly added to the confusion. Will do now.

dublintuition

Ponster wrote: »

Post #7 was an on-thread warning. Had this not been posted then maybe you would have been ok but the fact that it was there meant that it was no longer a typical AH thread.

Should it not have then been moved to a more appropriate forum?

If I posted in motors looking for fashion tips, my post would be moved.

Quazzie

dublintuition wrote: »

Should it not have then been moved to a more appropriate forum?

If I posted in motors looking for fashion tips, my post would be moved.

Move to where? LTI, perhaps, but why rob AH of any decent thread that is in the place. AH is a general forum, not a feedbag for trolls.

Nick_oliveri

Bleeding Heart Forum FTW TBH..
ETA: Poor form boyo's, poor form indeed.

Free Johnny and Cake!
(not a profalactic or sexual innuendo!)

Gummy Panda

johnny_knoxvile,

I refer you to this

AH charter wrote:

Making the natives restless
- This is a catch-all rule for general trolling, bitching and similar. Certain posters have an ability to piss off large quanties of regulars on here. If a moderator feels that said poster is doing this intentionally or is the cause of the mess, then the poster can and will be banned. If this poster was being goaded by others, then they'll be the ones getting banned. This rule will hopefully put an end to the bitching going on in here of late.

Your comment below, did not come across as a constructive argument to the thread.

johnny_knoxvile wrote: »

Some awsome marketing. Im going to sit down and watch it with a nice COKE da da da da da im loving it!

If you felt there was a topic discuss on Corporate America using sick kids as PR stunts, then you could have started your own thread e.g.

Example thread opening post

After reading the thread on pixar, I wonder do these corporations really care or do they see this children as cheap and effective marketing PR.. [example] [example]. What are your opinions on this?

I see your point on the banning though but with AH, always view it as sitting in a bar having a pint after work. Sometimes your mates just don't want to talk about a subject and will tell you to shut up. AH is the same.

Sparky

Apart from everyone getting a warning by rabies here: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=60770961&postcount=7, you decided to troll that thread.

So what if you thought it was in after hours style! You were warned along with everyone else reading that thread and chose to ignore it.
There is no double standards. There is however punishments for ignoring something that you were told not to do.
So cop the fcuk on please!

faceman

Its pretty clear OP, an AH mod clearly warned posters not to do what you did. If you had issues with AH double standards etc, why didnt you PM the mods or start a Feedback thread instead of getting yourself banned? It certainly would have given you more credibility.

From reading Rabies posts it looks like the AH mods are taking a stricter line with threads like this in AH, and rightly so.

Hagar

OP take a look at the number of times the OP of the Pixar thread was thanked. Use that as a yardstick to gauge the empathy felt by the forum users towards the unfortunate child and the support for the actions of Pixar in doing a decent human act. Now look at the number of times that Rabies warning against muppetry on that thread was thanked. Again a good indication that the regulars agreed that this was an exceptional thread.

You stepped out of line and got the ban that everyone else knew would happen.

Pay attention to Mods on thread directions in future and life will be much simpler for everybody.

kumate_champ07

"If anyone throws in typical AH comments in to this thread I'll ban their ass."

thread should have been moved to the humanties forum or somewhere else then.
i made this joke-
pixar's new movie has just been announced, 'finding chemo'

and was banned for 10days. i think thats unfair. are people in the air france thread being banned now too?

Sharpshooter

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

"If anyone throws in typical AH comments in to this thread I'll ban their ass."

thread should have been moved to the humanties forum or somewhere else then.
i made this joke-
pixar's new movie has just been announced, 'finding chemo'

and was banned for 10days. i think thats unfair. are people in the air france thread being banned now too?

You have said it all right there imo.
You saw the warning, we all did and yet you chose to ignore it.

Tell me, what else did you expect?

Ponster

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

and was banned for 10days. i think thats unfair. are people in the air france thread being banned now too?

You seem to be unhappy with your 10 days. Looking for more maybe?

As was already mentioned but you seemed to miss, Air France was incorrectly modded; mods are now trying their best to not let the same mistakes happen; your ban (only 10 days) is part of making things better.

kumate_champ07

Sharpshooter wrote: »

You have said it all right there imo.
You saw the warning, we all did and yet you chose to ignore it.

Tell me, what else did you expect?

the warning was not valid. you cant tell people not to make 'after hours' comments in an 'after hours' thread. thats when a mod should move the thread somewhere else. i made a joke with a pun. i didnt say anything bad about the little girl. if mods werent doing their job right in the air france thread what punishment do they get?

kumate_champ07

Ponster wrote: »

You seem to be unhappy with your 10 days. Looking for more maybe?

whats your motivation for making a comment like that?

brummytom

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

the warning was not valid. you cant tell people not to make 'after hours' comments in an 'after hours' thread.

Yes, Mods can.

thats when a mod should move the thread somewhere else.

AH isn't just the 'anything goes' people seem to think it is. Recently it's had a number of threads on serious issues that have gone well (On suicide, abortion etc.) Unfortunately, often, threads get ruined by certain people trying to drag them down.

I didnt say anything bad about the little girl

.
A warning was made at the start, the "joke" you hilariously made didn't add anything to the thread and was very insincere after the previous responses, the vast majority of people were moved by the story

if mods werent doing their job right in the air france thread what punishment do they get?

They've admitted themselves many times that that thread wasn't modded great.. we all make mistakes, get over it.


Just for the record - I'm not trying to backseat mod, but some of the comments and attitudes in that thread really irritated me, and I don't think the mods should be hounded for banning people who's common sense seems to go awry in AH

javaboy

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

if mods werent doing their job right in the air france thread what punishment do they get?

We were all docked a week's wages.

Sharpshooter

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

the warning was not valid. you cant tell people not to make 'after hours' comments in an 'after hours' thread. thats when a mod should move the thread somewhere else. i made a joke with a pun. i didnt say anything bad about the little girl. if mods werent doing their job right in the air france thread what punishment do they get?

The warning was indeed valid as it was made by one of the Moderators of After Hours.

It was clear as to what he wanted and that was no messing about or posting crap.
Even I could see that and I am always punning.

The thread was fine where it was, no one objected to it, why would they?

AHs posters like a nice story too.

Sully

Jesus lads, we all make mistakes. Mods and non mods. We learn from our mistakes. The mistakes were not critical or worthy of calling of an independent enquiry to the actions of the mods. Instead, the mods listened to the Feedback and acted in a different manner when a similar thread appeared. This is what was drawn from previous complaints, so the mods improved, and yet you have people having a go because they changed? That just proves that mods do listen, and that we work on improving based on what our users tell us is wrong. If we didn't, we would have a repeat of complaints like we did with the other thread. Instead, we don't, we have users who have failed to learn from their mistakes.

Warnings were issued in the thread. Its obvious from the first post, and since it received the most thanks today, it was an emotional topic. Any type of trolling/pun comments would be out of order considering its sensitive nature. Even if you were blind to that, mods gave warning that the thread was to be granted "Serious" mode - ie no stupid posts, else, get lost. Folks ignored it and got banned.

So you made a mistake, like the AH mods did in the past. What are you going to do about it? Build a bridge, get over it and learn from your mistakes so you don't run down the same lane again and hit another brick wall throwing you further back in the direction you came from. Its time you learned from your mistakes like the AH mods did. If you show that, you wont have the same problems you have here today.

kumate_champ07

Sully wrote: »

Jesus lads, we all make mistakes. Mods and non mods. We learn from our mistakes. The mistakes were not critical or worthy of calling of an independent enquiry to the actions of the mods. Instead, the mods listened to the Feedback and acted in a different manner when a similar thread appeared. This is what was drawn from previous complaints, so the mods improved, and yet you have people having a go because they changed? That just proves that mods do listen, and that we work on improving based on what our users tell us is wrong. If we didn't, we would have a repeat of complaints like we did with the other thread. Instead, we don't, we have users who have failed to learn from their mistakes.

Warnings were issued in the thread. Its obvious from the first post, and since it received the most thanks today, it was an emotional topic. Any type of trolling/pun comments would be out of order considering its sensitive nature. Even if you were blind to that, mods gave warning that the thread was to be granted "Serious" mode - ie no stupid posts, else, get lost. Folks ignored it and got banned.

So you made a mistake, like the AH mods did in the past. What are you going to do about it? Build a bridge, get over it and learn from your mistakes so you don't run down the same lane again and hit another brick wall throwing you further back in the direction you came from. Its time you learned from your mistakes like the AH mods did. If you show that, you wont have the same problems you have here today.

if we made a mistake and get banned, and the mods made a mistake, what do the mods get?

kumate_champ07

brummytom wrote: »

Yes, Mods can.


the "joke" you hilariously made didn't add anything to the thread

yes it did, it was funny. so what did u want, a thread where every single comment is "oh thats so sad, poor girl, pixar are awesome"?

Sully

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

if we made a mistake and get banned, and the mods made a mistake, what do the mods get?

Depends entirely on the mistake. Bans aint issued at ease.

Iv seen mods who have made big mistakes get a serious talking to (its a little harder to use the ban approach, so a formal warning is a lot more serious for them then a forum ban). Sorry but I cant see how the mods dealt with the Air France thread being a big mistake - most people would have said "Ah sure, its AH - leave em be" as did the mods. It wasnt until after they realised people actually wanted it to be taken seriously. So, learning from that minor mistake, they moved onto applying the feedback on other threads.

Its a bit like if a user makes a cock up, they get a yellow card infraction, red card infraction of forum ban depending on the seriousness of the cock up. The process is repeated for each mistake you make after that and is usually more serious then the last as its being used to point "You aint learned the last time, so you can take a little longer to think about your mistake and hopefully come back a new character".

KnifeWRENCH

johnny_knoxville, you can't complain about your ban because you did ignore Rabies' warning in Post #7. Personally, I didn't particularly agree with that warning (or the modding of that thread in general) but nonetheless it was there and you continued to ignore it.
I think both yourself and handsomecake had valid points, but you didn;t put them across the right way.

Red Sleeping Beauty

I'd like to talk about the absurdity of this story gaining such coverage but which forum is appropriate ?

There's the secret funny forum where there's some comments might fit in , fair enough.
Humanities isn't much more than a sort of dumpin' ground for stray threads that no one wants.
After Hours has put the fut down (and I'm not complaining btw)
Politics won't want to broach such a thorny issue I don't think.


I think it is ridiculous that some dying 10 yr old gets shown a DVD and then it's worldwide news and there's a kid dying every three seconds according to Bonio and they don't get DVDs.

Red Sleeping Beauty

Knife-WREEENCH wrote: »

johnny_knoxville, you can't complain about your ban because you did ignore Rabies' warning in Post #7. Personally, I didn't particularly agree with that warning (or the modding of that thread in general) but nonetheless it was there and you continued to ignore it.
I think both yourself and handsomecake had valid points, but you didn;t put them across the right way.

I'd agree with this but I don't know if there's much point in putting any points that aren't "oh my god I'm crying this is so sad and heart warming".

It's grand that natives and mods there want to keep things away from "ah let the bitch rot" but there's a decent discussion to be had I think.

kumate_champ07

Alan Rouge wrote: »

It's grand that natives and mods there want to keep things away from "ah let the bitch rot"

what about 'finding chemo'?
an animated story about a fish named mack(tom hanks) that is coming to terms with cancer and goes on a journey of self discovery. his father(robert de niro) goes looking for him but mack is looking for himself and will be found when he is ready. the main character keeps having flashbacks of his mother(voiced by susan sarandon) during her last few weeks before she died of cancer of the gills.

Sharpshooter

Alan Rouge wrote: »

I think it is ridiculous that some dying 10 yr old gets shown a DVD and then it's worldwide news and there's a kid dying every three seconds according to Bonio and they don't get DVDs.

Hardly worldwide news, a nice thread and a nice response in AHs is a good thing, no?

People die every three seconds, not just children but the fact that one child in particular was granted a dying wish was applauded in AHs.
There is nothing wrong with that.

The warning was given on the first page and ignored by the posters who got banned.

It is as simple as that.

kumate_champ07

Sharpshooter wrote: »

Hardly worldwide news, a nice thread and a nice response in AHs is a good thing, no?

People die every three seconds, not just children but the fact that one child in particular was granted a dying wish was applauded in AHs.
There is nothing wrong with that.

The warning was given on the first page and ignored by the posters who got banned.

It is as simple as that.

and in iran the protestors have been warned

netwhizkid

Can I firstly compliment the mods the way the handled that thread and rightly banned the offending individuals. There was warnings given and the way some people behaved on it was quite terrible. I would also like to point out that thanks to recent good moderating that the "yore ma" nuisance appears to have disappeared.

The mods accepted that other threads in question may not have been handled most appropriately but the way posters behaved in that thread totally contradicted themselves and proved themselves to be no better than those they were trying to ridicule. AH has been debated several times and while subjects discussed there are varied it also appears to be a dumping ground for trolling (I too was guilty in my time:o) but there is trolling and just plain bullying and the way I think the mods got treated was horrible and nobody has a right to say anything they wish on this site as it is a privately owned entity and as such libel and defamation laws apply. I often think that alot of users here must think this place is a public website and they can say whatever when the opposite is true. They can't have their cake and eat it as much as they'd like.

Mods, Smods, admins etc. keep up the good work and keep the keyboard warriors at bay!

kumate_champ07

wow, lame.

Sharpshooter

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

and in iran the protestors have been warned

Seriously, you are doing yourself no favours with that reply.

EDIT:
I have just seen your post above mine and you actually seem to be trolling this thread.

kumate_champ07

Sharpshooter wrote: »

Seriously, you are doing yourself no favours with that reply.

im simply stating that people in control cant change how the rules are played, on the fly.

kumate_champ07

Sharpshooter wrote: »

Seriously, you are doing yourself no favours with that reply.

EDIT:
I have just seen your post above mine and you actually seem to be trolling this thread.

eh not really. just because i dont agree with you doesnt make me a troll.

Sharpshooter

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

im simply stating that people in control cant change how the rules are played, on the fly.

They can, because they are in charge of the Forum.
Rabies didn't change any rules.

He simply gave a direction on how the thread should continue.

The few posters that ignored that were banned.

Red Sleeping Beauty

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

what about 'finding chemo'?
an animated story about a fish named mack(tom hanks) that is coming to terms with cancer and goes on a journey of self discovery. his father(robert de niro) goes looking for him but mack is looking for himself and will be found when he is ready. the main character keeps having flashbacks of his mother(voiced by susan sarandon) during her last few weeks before she died of cancer of the gills.

I laughed at that one but it was the wrong place for it. Considering the firm warning from Rabies you'd have to be a fish to not know you'd get in trouble for it.

kumate_champ07

if you cant have a laugh in an after hours forum than whats the point. i cant be arsed going back there. too heavily modded, its like chinese myspace