Lifting Efficiently

itsallaboutheL

If i'm very wrong here feel free to tell me to jump!

I've had thoughts on this subject for a while and TBH could be well off buuut..

theres a lot of people doing PLing programs at the moment, i would question how efficient they are for someone lifting below a high intermediate to advanced level. Westside is probably my prime example, i spent ages trying to convince a buddy not to do it because i cant see DE speed days being of any help to some one who is squating 110kg or benching a hundred or whatever. I'm having a little trouble vocalising my thoughts atm! but you get my drift?

Basically at what level do you think one should start hitting for pure PLing or BBing workouts etc, ?
and what should the progreesion be thru workouts from day one?

Personal experience or what you would recommend to someone over the course of two yrs.



I think its a waste getting hung up on assistance exercises and % this foam that, extend the other if your your not lifting bloody hard in the big three......


Hanley, Kev, Podge and Drifter before he got skinny, G'em, Roper etc what was yeer progression from beginner to intermediate to advanced, and what did it look like program wise.... what would you change if you could go back

EDIT: Mike Cravez and Mickk, Celestial, Amazingment i'd be really interested in gettin a BBers perspective

podge57

i think i agree with what youre saying (but im not exactly sure if i know what youre saying :pac:)

cant remember who said, but i once heard someone say something along the lines that there is no point trying to target weakpoints if you are just weak, because you dont have weakpoints and just need to focus on getting stronger.
I suppose it would be the same for bodybuilding, where there is no point trying to isolate a lagging bodypart if you are just small

as for when to start training for pling, if you want to compete, then the most efficient way to do that is through a powerlifting programme which matches your strength/experience level.

Im no-where near advanced, but i do regret doing westside training, because i still couldnt squat or bench properly, and i wasnt doing the movements enough. When i switched to a simple 5x5 programme, my form improved, which added more to my lifts than any amount of de squatting or box squats could ever do

Hanley

VERY roughly....

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Pre-Log:
Typical BB split when I first started, got MEGA fortunate and got to know a competitive bodybuilder and amazing personal trainer who hooked me up in an unreal way. Aidan Carroll was his name. I'd love to get in contact and thank him if anyone knows him, one of the first guys to bring Krav Maga to Ireland afaik.

Then generic full body workouts for about a year, focusing mainly on compound movements - that was first year of college.

Then onto Hercs were I did the typical western periodisation approach for 6- 9 months I think.

Westside came and went, couldn't apply it, got burned out and went no where.

Got talking to a pretty successful PL coach in America and learned a lot from him, again mostly traditional western periodisation, but with some exercise variables on top as well.

Westside again... saw better gains this time, but couldn't consistently train around ppl so I couldn't make it work.

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Logged: (and working off memory so I could be wrong)
Sheiko... I attribute my squat to that, not much else happened there.

Hybrid/bastardized WSB style training

Sheiko/other high volume stuff for a while

Hybrid/bastardize WSB training focusing on big lifts and weak points - worked well

Doggcrapp - gains of my life, seriously. AMAZING cycle, but since I'm trying to come down in weight now I just wouldn't be able to recover

5/3/1 w/ conditioing, cardio and rehab/prehab training (attempts anyway) - seems to be going well so far, the next 2 cycles will be make or break I think, should be near where I want to be bodyweight wise then. If things aren't going well, back to DC I'll go!

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That's my evolution, or very top level view of it anyway.

EDIT: Biggest regret = not fighting thru the hard reps... taking a "high volume/medium intensity" approach where I never really worked balls out. I think that's the biggest benefit behind DC. You've one exercise per bodypart, and you either sh!t or get off the pot.

kevpants

Is DC a good strength builder Hanley yeah? I thought it was originally just a hypertrophy program then you started doing it. I tried reading up on it on intensemuscle.com but you have to wade through post after post of people caling eachother dude and licking Dante's balls.

Must get around to reading up on it.

I kinda agree with you L. Westside worked great for me but only because I dropped all the speed work and box squatting and I was a total beginner, I'm only doing this stuff for roughly 12 months. If you just look at the basic westside principal of lifting heavy singles a few times each workout and trying to make the heaviest of those singles a little bigger each week I think it will work for a beginner because you're going to force your body to respond to heavy weight.

Podge's point on not doing the lifts enough rings true but I think your second day of upper or lower per week should involve 5 -12 reps of either squats or bench anyway.

I actually think if you modify it right Westside is better suited to beginners than advanced, like Hanley said if you lift too heavy you get burned out. There's no way I could squat 200kg+ every week and make progress. It's grand if Louie Simmons is injecting you in the ass on the way in the door but not drug free.

I'm far from advanced but I think I'm beyond being able to handle Westside.

The 5/3/1 I'm doing isn't really a pure powerlifters program. For one it's not designed with suits or shirts in mind. It's just a strength program. I think the progression and how you add weight gradually would work for most. It's intense enough so lower poundages should still be effective but not too intense that you get burned out if you lift moderately heavy weight.

Once again I have rambled.

My point is I reckon Westsides principles rather than copying what your favourite powerlifter does will work when you're starting out.

the drifter

i dunno this is a though one...i spent ages on an adapted westside style program doing DE this and DE that ang getting no where fast...but i was told to stick at it and it would come together...my biggest regret was doing this...if somethings not working you need to sit down and see why...coming into sept last year id been spending alot of time with OY lifters both in and out of the gym and was learning more to the background to some of there traing...from there my Russian phase began origionally with squats but the results was so good i adapted it into a 3 day 3 lfit cycle...and i loved it!

im going to agree with what kev and L has said...westside is good...and ill admit it did work a bit for me... but its not going to be everyones cup of tea. i dont the DE work is going to provide dbenifit to everyone and im prob going to get shot down her but think its geared more twoards equipped lifting...

i think for efficent lifting your going to have to try alot of programs and adapt to suit... i mean look back through hanleys log he has various parts of different programs in it