Setanta on The Brink.

toomevara

It appears that Setanta may be about to go to the wall;

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/media/article6445881.ece

I wonder what ramifications this will have for the ML. Will Sky take it up, or will we actually see some rugby back on terrestrial?

Nelson Muntz

That would suck big time. Setanta show the Aussie rules & rugby league here as well.

toomevara

Nelson Muntz wrote: »

That would suck big time. Setanta show the Aussie rules & rugby league here as well.

Yep, bye-bye NRL,Origin and AFL.....not good

Trojan

That would really suck. I was wondering how tf they could afford everything they were buying. Simple answer: they couldn't.

Of all the things to go under for though, the fscking SPL?!

The broadcaster has until tomorrow to pay the Scottish Premier League (SPL) £3m as part of its £31m a year deal.

toomevara

Trojan wrote: »

Of all the things to go under for though, the fscking SPL?!

Jaysis, what a balls-up! I mean who watches that ****e (apart from the old firm?)..also their customer service was absolutely appalling....Rumours that ESPN may come into the Euro market if Setanta go under...

zAbbo

Trojan wrote: »

That would really suck. I was wondering how tf they could afford everything they were buying. Simple answer: they couldn't.

Of all the things to go under for though, the fscking SPL?!

If they can't pay that, there's not much chance they'll be able to pay the Premier League £35m next Monday...


They've bought rights to everything, F1, Rugby, Football, Rugby League, Golf... all on the projection of hitting more customers than they're getting.

RuggieBear

sounds a bit like the leeds fc business model

the_syco

Odd. They must not be getting so much untaxed monies from the "man at the door" in Irish pubs in the USA...

EdgarAllenPoo

Good enough for them, over priced shower of $#!T€$.

[Jackass]

The real factor that crippled Setanta was trying to break the monopoly that Sky hold over the English Premier League.

They went unchallenged for so long with exclusive rights, that more or less every one of the millions of English soccer fans had to either subscribe to Sky, or go to a pub with a "public viewing" subscription, which costs the pub tens of thousands per year to hold, more or less having the same impact of these people subscribing anyway.

For a very heavily backed network and with a very agreeable attitude towards, risk, it just goes to show that it's a closed market.

Setanta simply couldn't afford to pay for the football packages it won with the English premier league as Sky drove the bidding up to a level they know would be unsustainable for a broadcaster like Setanta.

As a result, they lose all liquidity and can't afford the peanuts such as £3million for SPL mid-term payments.

It's a damn shame and something should be done about it, or at least from our perspective, there should be a channell dedicated to rugby only, buying up the far more sustainable Guninness Premiership rights, the Heineken Cup rights, the Magners League rights, some broadcasting rights to top14 and European Super14 rights. All of this could be bought at an absolute fraction of the cost Setanta plowed into English soccer rights. They could even buy up international rights to Irish interntional rugby for example. If a channell held all of that, they would have the niche in the market to survive and would become a dedicated sports channell...maybe then after time they could start to compete for other markets, but Setanta just how too much low quality crap spread accross their books, poor production of the Magners Leauge coverage and tried to take on too much without enough quality to justify subscription costs.

Ironically, their most sucsessfull endevour was more than likely Scottish football, where costs would be reasonable and they would hold a niche, and for a while it was the jewl in their crown before they attempted to expand kamakazie like.

Magners coverage wasn't handled well as Irish viewers had a free to air channell which satisfied a good chunk of Irish rugby coverage without the need to pay. Plus free delayed coverage of matches which weren't live, so the Irish rugby market wasn't too willing to pay the large subscription fees, the welsh rugby market had S4C which held the rights to Welsh rugby derbies and Scottish rugby doesn't quite yet have the following to bring in enough subscriptions. Plus they weren't helped by the boom of the dodgey box, which allowed free digital accsess to all their channells, which has only very recently been snuffed out. All in all, a bit of a disastor.

It's been on the cards for some time now that Setanta will fold, and even if they get through this, yet another "skin of their teeth" moment, it's only a matter of time before they're gone.

The real concern is what will happen to Magners League coverage?

Unless it goes to a dedicated sports channell then forget about it. If it goes to terestial TV, then feck all matches will be shown live, there'll probably only be a half hour highlights package a week, and coverage will be largely divided (i.e. away games will only be shown on S4C, BBC Scotland / Wales) so we wont have any coverage, likewise, for Scottish & Welsh Magners fans, they wont be able to get their matches played over here, which will more than likely be shown on TV3, RTE or, worse yet, back to TG4.

I wouldn't mind seeing it go to Sky for the quality of coverage, but a Setanta type channell, not too big that Magners can be given preference would be nice, maybe ESPN or something.

Who's on board to set up our own Sports Network? Boards.TV.

We can have Juevenial giving big game lead ups and analysis, Ruggies half time tactical view, with a panel headed up by Thomond which will include Steve_O, zAbbo, Toomevara & Podge giving it the Popey / Hooke back and forth banter.

I'm in for €20.

Crash

I was about to say "I bags being Tulsten Tollet!" - then I thought about it.

No.

toomevara

[QUOTE='[Jackass]
Who's on board to set up our own Sports Network? Boards.TV.

We can have Juevenial giving big game lead ups and analysis, Ruggies half time tactical view, with a panel headed up by Thomond which will include Steve_O, zAbbo, Toomevara & Podge giving it the Popey / Hooke back and forth banter.

I'm in for €20.[/QUOTE]

Don't know, I'd have to talk to my agent..there's the D&G underwear modelling contract to think of, and of course Lester Bangs will be devastated if he realises I can no Longer stunt-shag for him...still I'll have a think about it....

budhabob

[Jackass] wrote: »

It's a damn shame and something should be done about it, or at least from our perspective, there should be a channell dedicated to rugby only, buying up the far more sustainable Guninness Premiership rights, the Heineken Cup rights, the Magners League rights, some broadcasting rights to top14 and European Super14 rights.

Thats what i've been quietly hoping for since i initially heard about this a few months back.It'd be fantastic, but what are the chances. At least if Sky were to take up the ML i'd have only one subscription.

Nilther

Didn't they have the rights to the next world cup too?

Hopefully RTE(Ironically also heading towards bankruptcy) will get the rights back for it now, well Irish games anyway. After the last time trying to pick between tv3, setanta and utv was worse than picking how you wanted to die..

NickNolte

Hopefully Sky will buy up rights for the Magners League. I'm already subscribing so it'll be nice to be able to cancel my UPC Sports Extra package just to watch the odd match. Delighted Setanta are gone to the wall to be honest. Was tired of being raped by them.

Tim Robbins

NickNolte wrote: »

Hopefully Sky will buy up rights for the Magners League. I'm already subscribing so it'll be nice to be able to cancel my UPC Sports Extra package just to watch the odd match. Delighted Setanta are gone to the wall to be honest. Was tired of being raped by them.

I thought their rugby coverage was the best by far. Emmet Byrne and Reggie Corrigan are very insightful.

Stealdo

[Jackass] wrote: »

The real concern is what will happen to Magners League coverage?

I think worrying about coverage is missing the main concern a little. How much money do you reckon Setanta owe the Celtic League over the next couple of years? How much do you think Sky will be willing to pay for a competition that no one else will pay a penny for and that their main audience has no interest in? And what knock on effect will this have on the various branches here?

anonymous_joe

I refuse to endorse Jackass's plan unless we've a guarentee that thehighground can be one of the pundits.

And find rugbyfanatic too!

zAbbo

It'll be a shame of it does sink, especially to those who will be out of a job (not the presenters etc. - the real staff)

I think the pricing increases have made it more expensive to watch live sport.

They're currently E21.99 per month, and unless you have an interest in more than one sports - it's expensive.

Also there production and presentation leaves a lot to be desired, but for rugby they were generally OK with people like Ciaran Fitzgerald, Liam Toland, Reggie Corrigan and Emmet Byrne, but would occasionally add in Neil Francis and the likes which would be an instant disaster.

Actually, thinking back - most of the RWC07 was woeful from them.

I'm cancelling shortly anyway.

themont85

Sky would not put anywhere near the effort into the ML, in fact i'd be suprised if it was worth their while. Most Irish rugby supporters would already subscribe for the Heineken Cup, they'd hardly cancel then. Unless the Ml was dirt cheap there would be no point for them unless they used it was ''filler'', ie just something to show when there is nothing else on of importance. There wouldn't be anywhere near the same number of games.

We'd also lose some of the Ireland games they show and the schools rugby. And thats just rugby, if you are a fan of more than one sport.

[Jackass]

anonymous_joe wrote: »

I refuse to endorse Jackass's plan unless we've a guarentee that thehighground can be one of the pundits.

And find rugbyfanatic too!

All of this is open to negotiation, we can have a whole variety of shows, after all Joe, if you're willing to come on board, we are looking for a host of the Sunday evening week in review programme...a match of the day type programme, but with Magners League

Stealdo wrote:

I think worrying about coverage is missing the main concern a little. How much money do you reckon Setanta owe the Celtic League over the next couple of years? How much do you think Sky will be willing to pay for a competition that no one else will pay a penny for and that their main audience has no interest in? And what knock on effect will this have on the various branches here?

Yeah it's an interesting point, according to Wikipedia, the deal with Magners League is due to expire after next season anyway, and as it was a 3 year deal, I doubt the package was worth a massive amount of money anyway, as the stock of Magners League has risen significantly year on year.

You can't help but feel that the introduction of Play-offs and Italian teams was neatley introduced in time for re-negotiating of the coverage package. I can't find the worth of the Magners League coverage anywhere on the internet, but the Guinness Premiership coverage Setanta held was worth £54 million over 3 years, in conjunction with the Sky Sports deal, so GP rights are worth £18 million per year, all in, I wouldn't say Magners League coverage was anywhere near that.

I always feel though that Celtic Rugby, the management board of the Magners League is absolutely atrocious at promotion and marketing of the league. They failed to secure sponsors for years, Magners has a fairly handy deal with the league, cheap as chips, and the coverage is sold cheap as chips...this made teams like Borders unsustanable, Connacht is propped up by the union, and Edinburgh & Glasgow are unsustainable on their own and need union help, which really does hold back the league quite a lot, when you consider that GP teams are all getting the guts of £1 million each per year in TV money and probably a couple of million more in prize money and free marketing through a massive sponsor and massive tv company.

I'd imagine Setanta may be able to hold on for another season and fulfill it's rights to next season coverage, but after that I doubt they'll be able to come back on board. Maybe it would be a good time to re-negotiate, but as someone said, the Sky wont be willing to pay big bucks for the league as they already hold Heineken Cup coverage and international coverage, so most will be subscribed anyway...so HOPEFULLY there will be someone willing to come in and do a deal, and hopefully a good price can be gotten.

The management of the league has been so poor that as far as I'm aware there isn't even any prize money for winning it.

GiftofGab

Seriously Sky Sports are sh1t!! The only thing the cover is football and cricket (even thou im a fan of football). There was absolutely no hype about this lions tour on Sky and there's barely any talk about the highlights. At least Setanta show a wide variety of sports. I really dont hope they go under. I heard that they lost the rights to the Premier League (dont know if its true), cant see them surviving if they do.

To the guy who mentioned there should be a channel dedicated to rugby. 100% agreed. It would gain a bigger audience if more coverage was shown.

Stealdo

[Jackass] wrote: »

Yeah it's an interesting point, according to Wikipedia, the deal with Magners League is due to expire after next season anyway, and as it was a 3 year deal, I doubt the package was worth a massive amount of money anyway, as the stock of Magners League has risen significantly year on year.

You can't help but feel that the introduction of Play-offs and Italian teams was neatley introduced in time for re-negotiating of the coverage package. I can't find the worth of the Magners League coverage anywhere on the internet, but the Guinness Premiership coverage Setanta held was worth £54 million over 3 years, in conjunction with the Sky Sports deal, so GP rights are worth £18 million per year, all in, I wouldn't say Magners League coverage was anywhere near that.

I always feel though that Celtic Rugby, the management board of the Magners League is absolutely atrocious at promotion and marketing of the league. They failed to secure sponsors for years, Magners has a fairly handy deal with the league, cheap as chips, and the coverage is sold cheap as chips...this made teams like Borders unsustanable, Connacht is propped up by the union, and Edinburgh & Glasgow are unsustainable on their own and need union help, which really does hold back the league quite a lot, when you consider that GP teams are all getting the guts of £1 million each per year in TV money and probably a couple of million more in prize money and free marketing through a massive sponsor and massive tv company.

I'd imagine Setanta may be able to hold on for another season and fulfill it's rights to next season coverage, but after that I doubt they'll be able to come back on board. Maybe it would be a good time to re-negotiate, but as someone said, the Sky wont be willing to pay big bucks for the league as they already hold Heineken Cup coverage and international coverage, so most will be subscribed anyway...so HOPEFULLY there will be someone willing to come in and do a deal, and hopefully a good price can be gotten.

The management of the league has been so poor that as far as I'm aware there isn't even any prize money for winning it.

All good points - I wouldn't say there was a huge amount in the contract. Unfortunately though from the point of view of the club and the spectator Setanta was the little bit of competition Sky had. We'll be back to Sky being able to dictate both how much they pay the league and how much they charge the subscriber without any outside hindrance.

justsomebloke

trithfully the timing of this probably couldn't be any worse for setanta as alot of people subscriptions will be finishing up in the next while as the period just before the start of the season will be when most people get their subscription. So alot of people will probably hold off renewing their subscription and thus putting an even bigger nail in their coffin.

Truthfully it will be sad to see setanta go they were masters of their own downfall as they tried to get muscle in on Sky and Sky just priced them out of existance

thomond2006

Yay!!!

No more Franno!!

sock puppet

thomond2006 wrote: »

Yay!!!

No more Franno!!

I'm sure RTE will snap him up if Setanta go under.

[Jackass]

thomond2006 wrote: »

Yay!!!

No more Franno!!

Now just to figure out how to get his newspaper article cancelled and the world will be free of that clown!!

ongarite

GiftofGab wrote: »

Seriously Sky Sports are sh1t!! The only thing the cover is football and cricket (even thou im a fan of football). There was absolutely no hype about this lions tour on Sky and there's barely any talk about the highlights. At least Setanta show a wide variety of sports. I really dont hope they go under. I heard that they lost the rights to the Premier League (dont know if its true), cant see them surviving if they do.

To the guy who mentioned there should be a channel dedicated to rugby. 100% agreed. It would gain a bigger audience if more coverage was shown.

Is this a poor attempt at sarcasm or just trolling?

I've have never seen as much hype and build-up on Sky Sports for the Lions with previews & documentaries of past tours. They were always talking about during the Heineken Cup coverage.

Sky Sports also show loads of golf, tennis & NFL, etc..

ALH-06

[Jackass] wrote: »

You can't help but feel that the introduction of Play-offs and Italian teams was neatley introduced in time for re-negotiating of the coverage package. I can't find the worth of the Magners League coverage anywhere on the internet, but the Guinness Premiership coverage Setanta held was worth £54 million over 3 years, in conjunction with the Sky Sports deal, so GP rights are worth £18 million per year, all in, I wouldn't say Magners League coverage was anywhere near that.

I always feel though that Celtic Rugby, the management board of the Magners League is absolutely atrocious at promotion and marketing of the league. They failed to secure sponsors for years, Magners has a fairly handy deal with the league, cheap as chips, and the coverage is sold cheap as chips...this made teams like Borders unsustanable, Connacht is propped up by the union, and Edinburgh & Glasgow are unsustainable on their own and need union help, which really does hold back the league quite a lot, when you consider that GP teams are all getting the guts of £1 million each per year in TV money and probably a couple of million more in prize money and free marketing through a massive sponsor and massive tv company.

Some of the English clubs are in dire financial straits as well. Look at what's happening to Bristol. In fact, I read that Leicester were the only GP club to remain in the black last year. Irish rugby is in sound financial health at the moment, but the mony problems of Scottish and some of the Welsh teams are definitely being encountered in England as well. Professional rugby is proving to be very financially precarious!

The stock of the ML is improving year on year, but I'd agree that it still has massive image problems. It doesn't promote itself well at all, and the league itself is followed closely only be a small number of core supporters to be honest. Leinster and Munster enjoy sizeable support and Ulster's may be solid, but it's a different story in other areas - In my experience, the league is virtually ignored in Scotland, and often even by massive rugby fans too, bizarrely. I don't know how closely it's followed in Wales, but the regions can't seem to fill their stadiums either...

It'd be interesting to see viewing figures for the ML compared to the GP wouldn't it? I think the play-offs will do wonders for the profile of the ML next year but beyond that, how can the product be made more attractive to Celtic / foreign audiences?

Stev_o

ALH-06 wrote: »

Some of the English clubs are in dire financial straits as well. Look at what's happening to Bristol. In fact, I read that Leicester were the only GP club to remain in the black last year. Irish rugby is in sound financial health at the moment, but the mony problems of Scottish and some of the Welsh teams are definitely being encountered in England as well. Professional rugby is proving to be very financially precarious!

The stock of the ML is improving year on year, but I'd agree that it still has massive image problems. It doesn't promote itself well at all, and the league itself is followed closely only be a small number of core supporters to be honest. Leinster and Munster enjoy sizeable support and Ulster's may be solid, but it's a different story in other areas - In my experience, the league is virtually ignored in Scotland, and often even by massive rugby fans too, bizarrely. I don't know how closely it's followed in Wales, but the regions can't seem to fill their stadiums either...

It'd be interesting to see viewing figures for the ML compared to the GP wouldn't it? I think the play-offs will do wonders for the profile of the ML next year but beyond that, how can the product be made more attractive to Celtic / foreign audiences?

Rugby Club did a interview with Wasps owner earlier this year and he said "If you come into rugby looking to turn a profit you might aswell give up as it can't be done. What we try to do is the limit the damage in the books done" or something on the lines of that and he's right to. Have the IRFU ever published their financial reports because i dunno about you but how a sports org can be in the green despite only having 3 grounds that have 10,000 plus and having huge player/tour/coaches etc expenses just seems strange.

Junior

Jackass, any chance of a role as a fluffer or something ?

anonymous_joe

Stev_o wrote: »

Rugby Club did a interview with Wasps owner earlier this year and he said "If you come into rugby looking to turn a profit you might aswell give up as it can't be done. What we try to do is the limit the damage in the books done" or something on the lines of that and he's right to. Have the IRFU ever published their financial reports because i dunno about you but how a sports org can be in the green despite only having 3 grounds that have 10,000 plus and having huge player/tour/coaches etc expenses just seems strange.

Yeah, the IRFU breaks even.

Very very very few teams, and a lot of money from international games and some of teh provincial games. Pays for pretty much everything.

Stev_o

anonymous_joe wrote: »

Yeah, the IRFU breaks even.

Very very very few teams, and a lot of money from international games and some of teh provincial games. Pays for pretty much everything.

Sarcasm joe? Im too tired to work out whether you are or not

anonymous_joe

Stev_o wrote: »

Sarcasm joe? Im too tired to work out whether you are or not

Not at all sarcastic for once.

Someone posted the IRFU Annual Report a while back. They're about breaking even, other than some unusual outlays, such as Thomond Park.

It's the advantage of being so small though - we probably make as much money as England do except for the tv deals, but it's spread a lot less thinly than their money.

Quite a large chunk of the IRFU's revenue goes towards paying all of our pros.

Stev_o

anonymous_joe wrote: »

Not at all sarcastic for once.

Someone posted the IRFU Annual Report a while back. They're about breaking even, other than some unusual outlays, such as Thomond Park.

It's the advantage of being so small though - we probably make as much money as England do except for the tv deals, but it's spread a lot less thinly than their money.

Quite a large chunk of the IRFU's revenue goes towards paying all of our pros.

See what i forget is that the IRFU benefit from internationals while since the English clubs are separate entities from the RFU that get only small % of the money generated, well i think that's how it works So i guess thats where the IRFU makes up the loose ends i guess.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

anonymous_joe

Stev_o wrote: »

See what i forget is that the IRFU benefit from internationals while since the English clubs are separate entities from the RFU that get only small % of the money generated, well i think that's how it works So i guess thats where the IRFU makes up the loose ends i guess.

Yeah. Think of it this way - 80,000 in Croke Park paying an average of €80 for a ticket. €6.4 million a match, pay €1 million a game or so to the Gah, then you've got around 3 or so AIs and 2 or 3 6 Nations games. You're talking about serious money there. ^^

Very few of the rugby clubs would survive otherwise, because the fanbase is tiny compared to that of football in pretty much all the European countries.

Stev_o

anonymous_joe wrote: »

Yeah. Think of it this way - 80,000 in Croke Park paying an average of €80 for a ticket. €6.4 million a match, pay €1 million a game or so to the Gah, then you've got around 3 or so AIs and 2 or 3 6 Nations games. You're talking about serious money there. ^^

Very few of the rugby clubs would survive otherwise, because the fanbase is tiny compared to that of football in pretty much all the European countries.

Wonder how long before the RFU deicides to buy the various sinking clubs then to make sure everything doesn't go bust.

@Dave: We all just want to see Franno fired

GiftofGab

Stev_o wrote: »

Rugby Club did a interview with Wasps owner earlier this year and he said "If you come into rugby looking to turn a profit you might aswell give up as it can't be done. What we try to do is the limit the damage in the books done" or something on the lines of that and he's right to. Have the IRFU ever published their financial reports because i dunno about you but how a sports org can be in the green despite only having 3 grounds that have 10,000 plus and having huge player/tour/coaches etc expenses just seems strange.

That guy is a champ. He owns some other football team aswell (cant remember who, it could be Millwall) So much respect for him, he bought the club knowing he was going to make a loss but did it for his love of rugby.

He also made a interesting comment on the H Cup. He said winning the H Cup is more expensive than losing it. The lack of prize money does not compensate for player bonuses etc.

anonymous_joe

Stev_o wrote: »

Wonder how long before the RFU deicides to buy the various sinking clubs then to make sure everything doesn't go bust.

@Dave: We all just want to see Franno fired

I'd say they'd love to.

I don't hate Franno, I think he's a divvil for foot in mouth syndrome, but he knows a decent bit about the game. He needs to stop being so sensationalist.

GiftofGab

You got to take your hats off for Sky Sports News thou.......them presenters are HOT!!!!

thomond2006

GiftofGab wrote: »

You got to take your hats off for Sky Sports News thou.......them presenters are HOT!!!!

Is it just me or do most of those pics look like the work of Photoshop?

GiftofGab

thomond2006 wrote: »

Is it just me or do most of those pics look like the work of Photoshop?

Yeah a few of them do but I think they look much better when your watching them live. They don't look that good in these pics.

Paulie907

I really like setanta's coverage of the magners league, and with the basic ntl its free, i hope they stay, sky needs someone to be a competitor, cant have it all themselves!

toomevara

Setanta have stopped accepting new customers as of today...methinks the end is nigh.

Serenity Now!

anonymous_joe wrote: »

Yeah. Think of it this way - 80,000 in Croke Park paying an average of €80 for a ticket. €6.4 million a match, pay €1 million a game or so to the Gah, then you've got around 3 or so AIs and 2 or 3 6 Nations games. You're talking about serious money there. ^^

Attendance minus rental is not the total cost of running a game at a hired venue.
For a start, if the gate money is over a certain amount then it becomes a percentage. There is also fixtures (which must be GAA contracted), staffing and hospitality expenditure to consider.

anonymous_joe

Serenity Now! wrote: »

Attendance minus rental is not the total cost of running a game at a hired venue.
For a start, if the gate money is over a certain amount then it becomes a percentage. There is also fixtures (which must be GAA contracted), staffing and hospitality expenditure to consider.

I know, I know. But then there's ancillary profits, like the sponsors hoardings, beer, etc. We could argue for hours about the various minutiae. ^^

ALH-06

Apparently the SPL is seriously in trouble now that Setanta appear to be going under. Analysts are saying three top flight Scottish clubs are immediately in danger of following them... The fate of Setanta will be decided at some point tomorrow (Wed), according to Scottish news.

I'm seriously worried for the Magners League. It is reasonably new and still growing, and it's yet to nurture the widespread support that make the GP / Top 14 such valuable and sustainable products.

Who's going to take up the ML if the worst happens to Setanta?

chupacabra

ALH-06 wrote: »

Apparently the SPL is seriously in trouble now that Setanta appear to be going under. Analysts are saying three top flight Scottish clubs are immediately in danger of following them... The fate of Setanta will be decided at some point tomorrow (Wed), according to Scottish news.

I'm seriously worried for the Magners League. It is reasonably new and still growing, and it's yet to nurture the widespread support that make the GP / Top 14 such valuable and sustainable products.

Who's going to take up the ML if the worst happens to Setanta?

RTE or TV3 hopefully. Wales already have enough coverage between BBC Wales and S4C. I dont see why RTE or TV3 could buy up the irish games rights and throw together a panel every weekend.

gcgirl

[Jackass] wrote: »

The real factor that crippled Setanta was trying to break the monopoly that Sky hold over the English Premier League.

They went unchallenged for so long with exclusive rights, that more or less every one of the millions of English soccer fans had to either subscribe to Sky, or go to a pub with a "public viewing" subscription, which costs the pub tens of thousands per year to hold, more or less having the same impact of these people subscribing anyway.

For a very heavily backed network and with a very agreeable attitude towards, risk, it just goes to show that it's a closed market.

Setanta simply couldn't afford to pay for the football packages it won with the English premier league as Sky drove the bidding up to a level they know would be unsustainable for a broadcaster like Setanta.

As a result, they lose all liquidity and can't afford the peanuts such as £3million for SPL mid-term payments.

It's a damn shame and something should be done about it, or at least from our perspective, there should be a channell dedicated to rugby only, buying up the far more sustainable Guninness Premiership rights, the Heineken Cup rights, the Magners League rights, some broadcasting rights to top14 and European Super14 rights. All of this could be bought at an absolute fraction of the cost Setanta plowed into English soccer rights. They could even buy up international rights to Irish interntional rugby for example. If a channell held all of that, they would have the niche in the market to survive and would become a dedicated sports channell...maybe then after time they could start to compete for other markets, but Setanta just how too much low quality crap spread accross their books, poor production of the Magners Leauge coverage and tried to take on too much without enough quality to justify subscription costs.

Ironically, their most sucsessfull endevour was more than likely Scottish football, where costs would be reasonable and they would hold a niche, and for a while it was the jewl in their crown before they attempted to expand kamakazie like.

Magners coverage wasn't handled well as Irish viewers had a free to air channell which satisfied a good chunk of Irish rugby coverage without the need to pay. Plus free delayed coverage of matches which weren't live, so the Irish rugby market wasn't too willing to pay the large subscription fees, the welsh rugby market had S4C which held the rights to Welsh rugby derbies and Scottish rugby doesn't quite yet have the following to bring in enough subscriptions. Plus they weren't helped by the boom of the dodgey box, which allowed free digital accsess to all their channells, which has only very recently been snuffed out. All in all, a bit of a disastor.

It's been on the cards for some time now that Setanta will fold, and even if they get through this, yet another "skin of their teeth" moment, it's only a matter of time before they're gone.

The real concern is what will happen to Magners League coverage?

Unless it goes to a dedicated sports channell then forget about it. If it goes to terestial TV, then feck all matches will be shown live, there'll probably only be a half hour highlights package a week, and coverage will be largely divided (i.e. away games will only be shown on S4C, BBC Scotland / Wales) so we wont have any coverage, likewise, for Scottish & Welsh Magners fans, they wont be able to get their matches played over here, which will more than likely be shown on TV3, RTE or, worse yet, back to TG4.

I wouldn't mind seeing it go to Sky for the quality of coverage, but a Setanta type channell, not too big that Magners can be given preference would be nice, maybe ESPN or something.

Who's on board to set up our own Sports Network? Boards.TV.

We can have Juevenial giving big game lead ups and analysis, Ruggies half time tactical view, with a panel headed up by Thomond which will include Steve_O, zAbbo, Toomevara & Podge giving it the Popey / Hooke back and forth banter.

I'm in for €20.

Can i do the Sinead Kissane bit when she ask's managers really arkward questions just as a springboard for my media carrier just before i up sticks to further my carrier on Xpose!!

themont85

ALH-06 wrote: »

Apparently the SPL is seriously in trouble now that Setanta appear to be going under. Analysts are saying three top flight Scottish clubs are immediately in danger of following them... The fate of Setanta will be decided at some point tomorrow (Wed), according to Scottish news.

I'm seriously worried for the Magners League. It is reasonably new and still growing, and it's yet to nurture the widespread support that make the GP / Top 14 such valuable and sustainable products.

Who's going to take up the ML if the worst happens to Setanta?

We are unsure of exactly how much Setanta pay for the ML rights for Scotland and Ireland(Welsh rights are BBC and S4C). However, I do remember Gerry Thornley writing that it was quite small. Since the last tv deal, the league has a sponsor and is growing year on year.

For new support of the league this could be quite good. Quite good you say? In no way do I want Setanta to fold as an Irishman and avid rugby supporter. It would be very difficult to see the same number of games live on tv. For instance almost every Munster, Leinster and Ulster game is shown. I see no way this would continue. BBC NI would no doubt pick up a good few Ulster games with RTÉ taking some Munster, Leinster and the odd Connacht one.

The financial hit of less games shown could be offset by the fact that; a new deal would include playoffs. With RTÉ losing live HC and the Magners credibility growing, i would be positive RTÉ would show the playoffs and at least the interpros live. The Magners could definately get nearly as much money out of those as the Setanta deal. RTÉ are crying out for Munster/Leinster, they have no live games currently and are missing out on a rapidly growing professional sport in Ireland.

Also I could imagine the BBC(all over the UK) taking the playoffs live which would be a decent revenue source. Next year they lose all live rugby barring the Autumn Internationals and the XI nations.

I don't see Sky taking it on for a number of reasons. Firstly, the Welsh market is tied up with S4C and the BBC. Secondly rugby in Scotland ain't exactly hot property and I doubt it would drive subs up. Thirdly, particularly in Ireland, the HC rights are tied up. Most rugby supporters who would subscribe already do for the HC. A waste of fees for rights, technical ect. And lastly with Setanta gone, Sky would pick up the Guinness Premiership they had lost to them, that would fill more airtime than before. No room for more expensive rugby cost games with times as they are and in a country obsessed by football and cricket.

I don't see anybody else personally. TG4? Maybe a game or two but can hardly afford the coverage needed and RTÉ would definately want any playoffs. TV3? Next. Unless ESPN come in and buy them out or they salvage their Irish Setanta operation somehow, personally, I see us hardcore rugby fans missing out. Might not be bad for new fans though.