EIRCOM PHONE WATCH

c.a.r.l

Hi Guys,
I have an eircom phone watch alarm and I think the service is very basic for the following reason:
When the alarm is activated eircom just contact the key holders, the same as any alarm with a dialer! The monthly fee is crazy for this dont you think?
My question is as I can cancel my eircom subscription but keep the alarm can I connect a dialer as per any alarm to contact a key holder should the alarm activate?
Thanks Guys.

northdublin

depends what system you have, if its a wired system then its probably a hkc and using a hkc dialer which is easilly re-configured to dial your keyholder numbers.
however it becomes a bit more tricky if its a wireless system especially if its the simon system as they are a 6 volt system. they can be reconfigured but you have to have good knowledge of the system to do it. if its their concord system then its a bit easier to program but will only take one number but as this sytem is a 12 volt system its easier to install a stand alone dialer.

bushy...

Those Eircom phone watch alarms were always very bad imho.

Maybe ask someone on here to have a look at it ?

Links to some profiles :

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/private.php?u=45958

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/member.php?u=78653

2011

I think the service is very basic for the following reason: When the alarm is activated eircom just contact the key holders, the same as any alarm with a dialer!

This in itself does not make it basic, it makes it normal for a domestic installation with a monitored alarm system.
The alarm is not allowed to phone the Gardai directly, if so it would be against Garda policy. The monitoring station will ring the gardai if the correct conditions are met. This generally requires more than 1 alarm activation on at least 2 zones and an agreement that the keyholder will be present when the gardai arrive.

This is why some people opt for a dialler that rings keyholders (friends/neighbours) directly rather than getting a monitoring station to ring them.

My question is as I can cancel my eircom subscription but keep the alarm can I connect a dialer as per any alarm to contact a key holder should the alarm activate?

In short yes. It could be straight foward, or may need a bit more effort it depends on the system. Post the details of the system, make model etc. and I am sure someone here will help you out.

KoolKid

c.a.r.l wrote: »

When the alarm is activated eircom just contact the key holders, the same as any alarm with a dialer!

What makes you think Eircom should be doing any more than that?
Thats what monitoring is.

c.a.r.l wrote: »

The monthly fee is crazy for this dont you think?

Depends on how much you are paying. Eircom PW prices vary a lot

c.a.r.l wrote: »

My question is as I can cancel my eircom subscription but keep the alarm can I connect a dialer as per any alarm to contact a key holder should the alarm activate

Please explain what you mean by as per any alarm..

altor

c.a.r.l wrote: »

Hi Guys,
I have an eircom phone watch alarm and I think the service is very basic for the following reason:
When the alarm is activated eircom just contact the key holders, the same as any alarm with a dialer! The monthly fee is crazy for this dont you think?
My question is as I can cancel my eircom subscription but keep the alarm can I connect a dialer as per any alarm to contact a key holder should the alarm activate?
Thanks Guys.

all phonewatch systems can be self monitored, the hkc digi can be reprogrammed to text your phone.
the cs250 you will need a voice dialer installed to ring your phone.
the concord can be programed to ring one phone.
the simon can be programed to also ring one phone.
it just depends on how long of a contract you have with them phonewatch with regards to cancelling..

jamesbond

altor wrote: »

all phonewatch systems can be self monitored, the hkc digi can be reprogrammed to text your phone.
the cs250 you will need a voice dialer installed to ring your phone.
the concord can be programed to ring one phone.
the simon can be programed to also ring one phone.
it just depends on how long of a contract you have with them phonewatch with regards to cancelling..

you can fit a voice dialer to any of the phonewatch systems or any alarm system out there

c.a.r.l

koolkid wrote: »

What makes you think Eircom should be doing any more than that?
Thats what monitoring is.
They claim to call to Guards when the alarm activates which is not totally true, I just think the same monitoring can be done for free.

Depends on how much you are paying. Eircom PW prices vary a lot

Please explain what you mean by as per any alarm..

Any alarm can have a dialler installed within it.

KoolKid

Yes any alarm can have a dialler,
But Central station monitoring with Garda response is a service you must pay for.
You never answered what service you expect or what you are paying.
They claim to call the Guards if needed.
They are oblidged to conform to Garda policy on this.
I think you need to read the T & C you signed up to before complaining.

c.a.r.l

WHATS YOUR PROBLEM?
If you read the posts you wouldn't ask silly questions! The reason I asked the question was because I didn't believe eircom gave a service that I couldnt get from a dialer. As Eircom dont actually call the Guards unless you meet many conditions should the alarm activate. Where as if the dialer contacted me I could ring the Guards straight away...unlike Eircom!!
Jesus dont take it to heart, you must have a soft spot for Eircom!!!!

c.a.r.l

Oh Sorry before you have a break down I pay €300 per year.

northdublin

to the op there are not many conditions that you have to conform to prior to any monitoring company calling the gaurds. with yours or any other alarm system the quicker the alarm is verified the quicker the gaurds will be called.
so idealy the more sensors inc pirs you have on your premises the better.
the main reason for verification imo is to stop the time of the emergency services being wasted. the main benefit of this is a quicker response time to real situations. imo eircom phonewatch provide a comprehensive monitoring service as do a lot of the companys in this country.
i would also like to point out that it is my opinion that you ringing the gardai yourself in the event of an activation from your premises will not incur the same response by the gardai then that incured by a reputable monitoring service and the last time i checked your monitoring fee also entitles you to 2 services a year.
its also my opinion that phonewatch will not reprogram your system with the numbers of you or your keyholders but they will only remove the numbers used to contact their monitoring station so unless your familiar with the system you have you will have to call on a 3rd party to reprogram the system.

fred funk }{

c.a.r.l wrote: »

WHATS YOUR PROBLEM?
If you read the posts you wouldn't ask silly questions! The reason I asked the question was because I didn't believe eircom gave a service that I couldnt get from a dialer. As Eircom dont actually call the Guards unless you meet many conditions should the alarm activate. Where as if the dialer contacted me I could ring the Guards straight away...unlike Eircom!!
Jesus dont take it to heart, you must have a soft spot for Eircom!!!!

The Gardai won't respond to your alarm on foot of the alarm ringing you. Thats why every alarm thats monitored by a central station needs to be certified by a registered alarm company before the Gardai will respond to an activation.
The rules are the same for every company, including Eircom. The Gardai will only be called if there is a second zone activated after the initial activation. This is called verification. Only the keyholders are contacted when the initial activation happens.

Pablod

Am I right in saying (could be wrong) -
But you are paying €300 per year becuase you are paying for the Alarm system itself and the monitoring service ??

I myself took out the Phonewatch just over 2 years ago., i'm paying €40 a month, but that is only for 3 Yrs to pay off the Alarm system, once that 3 years is up, I will only pay approx €10 a month for monitoring.

But, on the main point, there is a certain amount of time allowed or conditions as to why the garda would be called out.
I still have certain doubts about the monitoring service myself, theres the odd time the alarm has gone off by accident and is only disabled after a certain amount of time, but no phonecall from eircom to me,my partner or neighbours???

KoolKid

An alarm activation is only reported to the central station after 20 seconds.
A panic alarm reports instantly.
If your alarm has activated longer than that then request a reason from your monitoring station. It could be the alarm never set & an exit fault activated it. It could also be the system was not armed & activated by a tamper or fault.

altor

c.a.r.l wrote: »

Oh Sorry before you have a break down I pay €300 per year.

hi karl,
this €300 covers the two services a year you are entitled too off eircom plus the monitoring of your alarm. in answer to your question yes it can be programed to ring your key holder depending on what system you have installed. do you know what system you have installed ? only thing with the wirefree simon and concord is it can only be programed to ring one phone..

Pablod

altor wrote: »

hi karl,
this €300 covers the two services a year you are entitled too off eircom plus the monitoring of your alarm. in answer to your question yes it can be programed to ring your key holder depending on what system you have installed. do you know what system you have installed ? only thing with the wirefree simon and concord is it can only be programed to ring one phone..

Is this true??
Because I have the eircom phonewatch just over 2yrs now, and I received a letter after the first year, saying your system is no longer covered for services blah blah. if you want a service you must pay more etc....

In saying that, it has not had a single service since we've had it.

altor

Pablod wrote: »

Is this true??
Because I have the eircom phonewatch just over 2yrs now, and I received a letter after the first year, saying your system is no longer covered for services blah blah. if you want a service you must pay more etc....

In saying that, it has not had a single service since we've had it.

you are entitled to 2 services a year.. if you read there service contract it says it is up to the customer to ring and arrange the service, thats the joke about it, they only get in contact when they are looking for more money.. are you still monitored by phonewatch ?

fred funk }{

altor wrote: »

you are entitled to 2 services a year.. if you read there service contract it says it is up to the customer to ring and arrange the service, thats the joke about it, they only get in contact when they are looking for more money.. are you still monitored by phonewatch ?

Is it not two call outs if there is a problem i.e if the alarm doesn't give trouble you wont see them.

altor

fred funk }{ wrote: »

Is it not two call outs if there is a problem i.e if the alarm doesn't give trouble you wont see them.

no, two services.. use to install them for phonewatch..

KoolKid

Pablod wrote: »

Is this true??
Because I have the eircom phonewatch just over 2yrs now, and I received a letter after the first year, saying your system is no longer covered for services blah blah. if you want a service you must pay more etc....

In saying that, it has not had a single service since we've had it.

Your Eircom system is monitored right?
For you to have monitoring with Garda response you must have a service & maintenance contract.

Pablod

altor wrote: »

you are entitled to 2 services a year.. if you read there service contract it says it is up to the customer to ring and arrange the service, thats the joke about it, they only get in contact when they are looking for more money.. are you still monitored by phonewatch ?

Jes, that is a con!:mad:
We'll as far as monitoring goes, I'm paying them €40 a month for 3yrs to pay for monitoring and to pay off for the hardware,
Onces the 3yrs is over the hardware will be mine, then the monitoring will be approx €10 a month fee (unless there is another con in the contract)

altor

Pablod wrote: »

Jes, that is a con!:mad:
We'll as far as monitoring goes, I'm paying them €40 a month for 3yrs to pay for monitoring and to pay off for the hardware,
Onces the 3yrs is over the hardware will be mine, then the monitoring will be approx €10 a month fee (unless there is another con in the contract)

i would get on to them because you cant have a system monitored unless you have a service and maintenance contract in place.. they seem to get away with everything because they sell so many systems a year lining the NSAIs pockets..

Pablod

crap, I've already been onto them, just waiting on a reply,
Thanks for the head's up guys

fred funk }{

altor wrote: »

i would get on to them because you cant have a system monitored unless you have a service and maintenance contract in place.. they seem to get away with everything because they sell so many systems a year lining the NSAIs pockets..

As far a I'm aware the standards state that the monitored alarm must be serviced by a registered alarm company and not necessarily have a contract in place.

Eircom will give a price over the phone which breaks the regulations because a site survey should be carried out before a price can be given and it should be signed by the customer.

KoolKid

Pablod wrote: »

Jes, that is a con!:mad:

Its not a con. Its the policy that is in place & they ,along with all other companies, must comply with it

Stoner

Ok all, giving advice on systems is great, but please lets keep our house in order. So in describing a situation there is no need to use words like "con", just list the facts and users will decide for themselves is its a good or bad system/price/after sales service etc.
If those facts are wrong, we have infrmed posters here to point that out.

Thank you.

northdublin

at this point i would like to point out that eircom phonewatch have many types of contracts usually depending on who sold/installed the system.
firstly they have inhouse sales then they also have the companys who do their installing aka their agents and finally they employ the services of sales companys who might have knocked at your door trying to sell you their system.
all of the above mentioned have various types contracts which change from month to month depending on what special offer is ongoing.
to start a debate about what one customer is paying against what another customer is paying is futile. as altor has stated they shift so many nasi certs they are a law onto themselves.

Pablod

koolkid wrote: »

Its not a con. Its the policy that is in place & they ,along with all other companies, must comply with it

Stoner wrote: »

Ok all, giving advice on systems is great, but please lets keep our house in order. So in describing a situation there is no need to use words like "con", just list the facts and users will decide for themselves is its a good or bad system/price/after sales service etc.
If those facts are wrong, we have infrmed posters here to point that out.

Thank you.

Apologies guys, maybe I used the word 'Con' in the wrong context.
I know terms and conditions are there to be read, but to be fair, and lets be honest, nobody reads the full T's&C's of a long contract when using a service or utility company like this.

Anyway, I'll post the results once I hear back from my query to Eircom Phone watch
Thanks Again

KoolKid

Pablod wrote: »

I know terms and conditions are there to be read, but to be fair, and lets be honest, nobody reads the full T's&C's of a long contract when using a service or utility company like this.

In that case its quite possible you are complaining about something you have already agreed to.:eek:

Pablod

koolkid wrote: »

In that case its quite possible you are complaining about something you have already agreed to.:eek:

No No - not complaining,
Just asking questions

altor

Pablod wrote: »

crap, I've already been onto them, just waiting on a reply,
Thanks for the head's up guys

How did you get on with phone watch ?

screwlox

PW use the 'two free visits' as a sales pitch, to make you think your getting value for the money you are handing over.
The reality is, you don't see them unless you ring up and request a visit. Alternatively, you can keep 'reserve' of the two free visits, until you have a fault - that way, you will escape the call-out fee;).

They won't let you roll-over visits into next year though!:mad:

altor

screwlox wrote: »

PW use the 'two free visits' as a sales pitch, to make you think your getting value for the money you are handing over.
The reality is, you don't see them unless you ring up and request a visit. Alternatively, you can keep 'reserve' of the two free visits, until you have a fault - that way, you will escape the call-out fee;).

They won't let you roll-over visits into next year though!:mad:

people who get a system installed by phonewatch should use these visits once after 6 months and the other just before the system is about to go into its next service year. they are payed for by the customer but its up to the customer to arrange them :rolleyes: thats why people never use them, they are not told anything about them until phonewatch want money off them for the next service year.. not fair on the customer but phonewatch has it covered in there contract..

KoolKid

Do they tell you that the system ceases to conform to EN50131 if you go more than a year without a visit?

fred funk }{

koolkid wrote: »

Do they tell you that the system ceases to conform to EN50131 if you go more than a year without a visit?

People don't realise that their alarm isn't up to standard if it isn't serviced by a registered alarm company every year. This can be a problem for some insurance policies where it states that the alarm must conform to the relevant standards and not only when first installed but all the time.

2011

People don't realise that their alarm isn't up to standard if it isn't serviced by a registered alarm company every year.

+ 1
I guess you mean EN50131.
Some people with suitable alarms do not avail of the discount available because forgetting to arm the alarm can invalidate the insurance policy.
If the alarm fails to meet EN50131 it may also make the insurance null and void.
Be warned!

Pablod

koolkid wrote: »

Do they tell you that the system ceases to conform to EN50131 if you go more than a year without a visit?

Never heard anything about this from either PhoneWatch or the insurance company nor was aware of this. - is this related to specific insurance companies?

altor wrote: »

How did you get on with phone watch ?

Finally heard back from PhoneWatch, after getting in touch with them 3 weeks ago !!
My system is being monitored but is out of warranty, snippet from the letter as follows:

as part of your contract your monitoring will continue until **** ******* 2010, however the warranty on your system has expired.
If you wish to extend your warranty, you can now avail of the Service Plus monitoring option. This extended warranty service offers you free service visits during normal buisiness hours and this also covers battery, control panel and parts replacement due to the normal wear and tear, as a Service Plus Customer your fee is only an additional €13 per month.

2011

Never heard anything about this from either PhoneWatch or the insurance company nor was aware of this

Koolkid is correct on this.

is this related to specific insurance companies?

No, it is related to the EN50131 standard itself.

I think you will find that the money you save with the insurance discount is less than what the service contract will cost you.

altor

Pablod wrote: »

Never heard anything about this from either PhoneWatch or the insurance company nor was aware of this. - is this related to specific insurance companies:

yes it is, there is a list of insurance companys that give a special discount if you get a phonewatch system installed. all monitored companys should have something in there contract about you getting your alarm serviced at lease once a year..

Pablod

altor wrote: »

yes it is, there is a list of insurance companys that give a special discount if you get a phonewatch system installed. all monitored companys should have something in there contract about you getting your alarm serviced at lease once a year..

When I called my Insurance company (one of the popular banks) 2 years ago and told them I had just installed Eircom Phonewatch, they gave me an approx 15-20% discount straight away. No questsions asked and they did not request any verification or confirmation. ?

altor

Pablod wrote: »

as part of your contract your monitoring will continue until **** ******* 2010, however the warranty on your system has expired.
If you wish to extend your warranty, you can now avail of the Service Plus monitoring option. This extended warranty service offers you free service visits during normal buisiness hours and this also covers battery, control panel and parts replacement due to the normal wear and tear, as a Service Plus Customer your fee is only an additional €13 per month.

this is a good option if your alarm cost you alot of money. they charge €10 per battery replacement plus the call out charge €85 and vat without service plus.. i would only advise this to people who have alot of sensors or have a concord panel as this panel costs €1000 alone to replace.. the batterys usually last 5 years so you can work it out for yourself if it worth it for you. i would strongly recommend to people with a phonewatch system to make sure they use there service that they are entitled to when they get there system installed as this can find any faults that may be on there system after the install. as i said you are entitled to them but it is up to you the customer to arrange them.. so do weather you think it needs it or not..

2011

they gave me an approx 15-20% discount straight away. No questsions asked and they did not request any verification or confirmation. ?

I bet they did. But what do you think will happen if you claim??? I will tell you:

1) They will want proof that your alarm was installed and maintained to EN50131
2) They will check that you had the alarm armed.

If you do not meet both of the conditions above and you availed of the discount then your claim will not be processed. The onus is on you to ensure that you meet all of the conditions outlined in the insurance policy that are often in small print!!

altor

Pablod wrote: »

When I called my Insurance company (one of the popular banks) 2 years ago and told them I had just installed Eircom Phonewatch, they gave me an approx 15-20% discount straight away. No questsions asked and they did not request any verification or confirmation. ?

they will if you claim for your house being broken into..
phonewatch should of given you a NSAI cert, one copy for you and one for your insurance. this is valid for a year unless you take out a service contract from an certified alarm company, does not have to be phonewatch who services it..

altor

2011 wrote: »

I think you will find that the money you save with the insurance discount is less than what the service contract will cost you.

that is true but a service contract keeps your alarm up to the EN50131-1:2006 standard. if you use your two services in the year it is well worth the money you pay for it..

Pablod

altor wrote: »

they will if you claim for your house being broken into..
phonewatch should of given you a NSAI cert, one copy for you and one for your insurance. this is valid for a year unless you take out a service contract from an certified alarm company, does not have to be phonewatch who services it..

Yes, I have the NSAI cert, a Dupliate copy, but my bank never requested a copy (although I did offer to send one) they said no need.
Complying with I.S. EN 50131-1:1997

altor wrote: »

that is true but a service contract keeps your alarm up to the EN50131-1:2006 standard. if you use your two services in the year it is well worth the money you pay for it..

Think I may take out the €13 extra a year to cover myself
One good thing is that the payments for the Alarm System itself will be finished in 8months or so, so that will be the bulk of the payments out of the way, i'll only be paying monitoring and maintenance

altor

the new standard only came in this year.. you have your alarm in two years thats why its the 1997 standard.. it is worth it if as i said you have alot of sensors on your system.. i use to install the phonewatch systems.. they are good systems with not much maintenance on them..

Pablod

altor wrote: »

the new standard only came in this year.. you have your alarm in two years thats why its the 1997 standard.. it is worth it if as i said you have alot of sensors on your system.. i use to install the phonewatch systems.. they are good systems with not much maintenance on them..

Thanks for all the replies lads, think I'll just take out the renewal just to be on the safe side. as soon as I renew it, i'll get them out for a service

altor

Pablod wrote: »

Thanks for all the replies lads, think I'll just take out the renewal just to be on the safe side. as soon as I renew it, i'll get them out for a service

your welcome, make sure you get what your paying for..