The hate for Obama

jonny72

Browsing the news and reading comments has become a worrying affair recently, I mean I found it a little amusing at first, then a tad surprising, now its just downright scary. The comments from the anti-Obama crowd seem to be one part fair critique 10 parts sheer hatred for the man.

I cannot imagine truly believing that every news source in the world has a liberal agenda/bias with the exception one certain news outlet.. it beggers belief how twisted that kind of logic is.. I suppose you have to laugh it off but its scary how many times that one line is repeated in comment after comment mixed in with this communist/social paranoia and just pure KKK style hate.

These people need to take a holiday to Sweden.

Manic Moran

I think you're just noticing the other side of the coin. The sheer hatred for Bush/Cheney is out there as well, just such things seem less obvious if it's directed against someone other than 'your' man.

Absolutely, there are some people who can't give Obama a shred of credit, who won't even call him by his name. They are petty, spiteful, often xenophobic, and the sort of people who really do give Americans a bad name.

But such people exist on the farther left as well, who are just as unlikely to give any rational credit or analysis at all for a Conservative such as Bush or even a moderate like McCain. Sadly, such people on both ends of the spectrum seem to have disproportionate amounts of publicity or weight, and are both an endemic problem with, and continuing cause of, the ongoing schism in the American two-party system.

NTM

jonny72

Manic Moran wrote: »

I think you're just noticing the other side of the coin. The sheer hatred for Bush/Cheney is out there as well, just such things seem less obvious if it's directed against someone other than 'your' man.

Absolutely, there are some people who can't give Obama a shred of credit, who won't even call him by his name. They are petty, spiteful, often xenophobic, and the sort of people who really do give Americans a bad name.

But such people exist on the farther left as well, who are just as unlikely to give any rational credit or analysis at all for a Conservative such as Bush or even a moderate like McCain. Sadly, such people on both ends of the spectrum seem to have disproportionate amounts of publicity or weight, and are both an endemic problem with, and continuing cause of, the ongoing schism in the American two-party system.

NTM

I disagree.. I think the Bush Cheney Berlesconi Putin Brown etc haters are evenly spread but this is a new mix, more mirth

Manic Moran

I think the Bush Cheney Berlesconi Putin Brown etc haters are evenly spread but this is a new mix, more mirth

For every rabid hater on FreeRepublic, there's a rabid hater on Democraticunderground. Dislike for Bush was evenly spread, yes, but I presume you're talking about the unreconcilable hatred where simply presenting the possibility that the 'other guy' might be right on something results in an automatic gainsaying.


NTM

jank

There will always be haters on both sides but when a major media outlet is part of this group then this is very worrying.

Running Bing

Ive only really started following US politics in recent times but the sheer level of partisanship and often downright hatred between each side has shocked me.

Looking into it I know it has always been there but in the last few years (probably down to a number of key polarising events) it just seems to have gotten much much worse (is that really the case or has it always been this bad?).

I dont think you can distinguish between the sides Jonny, as ManicMoran said its just the other side of the coin and now your noticing the level of irrational hatred because you dont agree with it (Id wager your an Obama fan or would've at least voted for him?).

Personally I think either of McCain or Obama would've been fine choices for President and both would've done pretty similar jobs but listening to people you could've sowrn one was the devil incarnate and the other the second coming of Christ (depending on which side you listen too). Some people really need to cop on to themselves and realise "There are few things wholly evil or wholly good".


South Park actually did quite a good episode on this the night after the results cam out. You had the Democrats and the Republicans going crazy that now everything is going to change and be different and then the day after they realise nothing has changed at all:D Quite funny and really hits home imo.

Overheal

Running Bing wrote: »

Ive only really started following US politics in recent times but the sheer level of partisanship and often downright hatred between each side has shocked me.

It doesn't take much reading to realize its the same story in Ireland.

Running Bing

Overheal wrote: »

It doesn't take much reading to realize its the same story in Ireland.

See I dont think thats the case at all. I mean people are pretty up in arms over FF now for obvious reasons but aside from that I dont see the level of hatred that seems to be present in US politics. Also a lot of people calling for Fianna Fail blood voted them in and its quite reasonable to believe that in the future they will vote for them again.


There very different systems. Dont get me wrong I think US politics is far superior to Irish politics I just feel the level of partisanship and hatred present in the US is one problem we dont have over here.

tolosenc

Obama got what, 52% of the popular vote? And, in fairness, a huge number of his supporters where stark raving lunatics. Surely it's a logical conclusion to draw that there would be equally passionate people in the US, comprising the other 48% of the electorate.

There were many scathing critiques of the Bush Administration. They were responsible for a lot of very unpopular stuff. Obama was touted as some sort of modern age messiah. Thus far, he has failed to live up to the outrageously high expectations many people put upon him. He has also been the source of many unpopular decisions in the US, such as various nationalisations of corporations/bank bail-outs, in what is supposed to be the most free and democratic country in the world. Many Republicans would have believed quite strongly that those corporations should have been allowed to fail.

Politics by it's very nature is highly divisive, with people subscribing to beliefs that can be the 100% inverse of someone elses.

However, OP, your problem seems to lie with, as Manic Moran says, not being able to accept criticism of "your guy", where you may have been quite quick to jump on the anti-Bush bandwagon.

So, essentially, I hereby declare my first law of Politics:
For every belief, there is an equal and opposite belief.

KerranJast

Where Bush had Fox, Obama has MSNBC. For every Bill O'Reilly theres a Keith Olbermann.

tolosenc

Exactly.

jank

In fairness O'reilly is a full out liar. That guy is a shameful parody of himself.

Olberman i can understand why he gets under the nose of people but I dont think you can call him a liar. Biased probably but full out psycho liar like O'Reilly..no.

Black Swan

There will always be the hateful fringe, no matter the office holder, party, or country. That's why Kevlar was invented. I hear it comes in fashionable suits now?

Manic Moran

Colbert had a very nice ACU suit going last week.



NTM

Overheal

Saw that on hulu but the lighting in that photo is terrible. Odjerno is a salt of the Earth white and he looks like Grell the Robot from Wormhole X-Treme

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQ_mtkFh-PY

I ****ing want that suit.

JohnMc1

KerranJast wrote: »

Where Bush had Fox, Obama has MSNBC. For every Bill O'Reilly theres a Keith Olbermann.

You can live with it if it was just the NBC umbrella [MSNBC,CNBC,etc] but when its also CBS, ABC, CNN,etc is a major problem. This is where people have the problems with Obama. The God worship by his so-called enlightened supporters and the lack of objectivity on the part of the media.

Overheal

God Worshipping a president? Goodness! Where I have seen that before...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-y2QghS2gU

amacachi

Overheal wrote: »

God Worshipping a president? Goodness! Where I have seen that before...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-y2QghS2gU

So it's good to follow everything about the last administration? Good stuff.

Overheal

Well you will require something to compare against, won't you. Its not nearly as useful to compare the current president to a panel of Drywall. If the President were in fact a panel of walling, it might prove to be a valuable comparison. However he's not. He's the president. Comparing any president to past presidents seems perfectly reasonable.

amacachi

Overheal wrote: »

Well you will require something to compare against, won't you. Its not nearly as useful to compare the current president to a panel of Drywall. If the President were in fact a panel of walling, it might prove to be a valuable comparison. However he's not. He's the president. Comparing any president to past presidents seems perfectly reasonable.

Yes but comparing him to Bush ffs? Even though I dislike most of his politics I was hoping there'd be no need to ever compare him to Bush.
Bad enough comparing Obama to Bush, but comparing the news networks to some church nuts doesn't really paint the news networks in too positive a light.

Manic Moran

According to Rasmussen today, his approval index is now at his lowest, at -2, with more people strongly disapproving of him than strongly approving. (Overall, however, he's got more people 'approve' than 'disapprove')

Newsweek had an article this week pointing out that his personal approval rating is far higher than his policy approval rating, a situation which is generally untenable for long. He's got to get some good things done soon.

NTM

jank

Like what, start a war?

IMO Obama has been trying to do too much, but it was always the way that the public wanted him to cure all of their countries ills in a matter of weeks.

Give the guy some time ffs. What did bush do in the first 9 months. Sweet **** all..... 9/11 changed all that.

silverharp

from CNBC
:rolleyes:

Overheal

Overheal wrote: »

Well you will require something to compare against, won't you. Its not nearly as useful to compare the current president to a panel of Drywall. If the President were in fact a panel of walling, it might prove to be a valuable comparison. However he's not. He's the president. Comparing any president to past presidents seems perfectly reasonable.

funniest comment ive seen today..I reckon he'd probably be a good slab of drywall..

jank

jank wrote: »

Give the guy some time ffs. What did bush do in the first 9 months. Sweet **** all..... 9/11 changed all that.

Ah shur he was working on the patriot act..

orourkeda

It isnt hatred for president Obama. I think that the realisation has finally set in that nobody could ever live up to the level of hype that abounded at the time of his election. He's not superman.

It was practically impossible for him not to become president once he got the democratic nomination. This was simply because there was such opposition to the bush administration at the time. He couldnt possibly have lost. It looks as if the republican party is in some disarray at the moment and this may almost guarantee him a second term.

JohnMc1

orourkeda wrote: »

It isnt hatred for president Obama. I think that the realisation has finally set in that nobody could ever live up to the level of hype that abounded at the time of his election. He's not superman.

It was practically impossible for him not to become president once he got the democratic nomination. This was simply because there was such opposition to the bush administration at the time. He couldnt possibly have lost. It looks as if the republican party is in some disarray at the moment and this may almost guarantee him a second term.

Unless there is a complete turnaround in the economy by then a second term is not guaranteed. He'll only be able to keep crying "We inherited this mess" for so long before people wake up, shake off the God-worship for him and realize that he did inherit it but he made it alot worse.

Overheal

God damn it.

I was actually going to do this video myself after I saw his acceptance speech, but someone beat me to it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yOZRBMpjXpg

Manic Moran

Unless there is a complete turnaround in the economy by then a second term is not guaranteed.

Of course, the Republicans could always screw up a good thing and propose a complete tool as their nominee...

NTM

JohnMc1

Manic Moran wrote: »

Of course, the Republicans could always screw up a good thing and propose a complete tool as their nominee...

NTM

The Democrats have a complete tool in the White House and tools running the House and Senate.

People on here need to remember that before popping off about anybody without a D beside their names.

Overheal

Eh... John Kerry. Need I say more? An election the Dems might have easily won, had they picked their nominee better.

norbert64

Overheal wrote: »

Eh... John Kerry. Need I say more? An election the Dems might have easily won, had they picked their nominee better.

i thought the whole swiftboating malarkey was actually the problem

jonny72

obl wrote: »

Obama got what, 52% of the popular vote? And, in fairness, a huge number of his supporters where stark raving lunatics. Surely it's a logical conclusion to draw that there would be equally passionate people in the US, comprising the other 48% of the electorate.

There were many scathing critiques of the Bush Administration. They were responsible for a lot of very unpopular stuff. Obama was touted as some sort of modern age messiah. Thus far, he has failed to live up to the outrageously high expectations many people put upon him. He has also been the source of many unpopular decisions in the US, such as various nationalisations of corporations/bank bail-outs, in what is supposed to be the most free and democratic country in the world. Many Republicans would have believed quite strongly that those corporations should have been allowed to fail.

Politics by it's very nature is highly divisive, with people subscribing to beliefs that can be the 100% inverse of someone elses.

However, OP, your problem seems to lie with, as Manic Moran says, not being able to accept criticism of "your guy", where you may have been quite quick to jump on the anti-Bush bandwagon.

So, essentially, I hereby declare my first law of Politics:
For every belief, there is an equal and opposite belief.

Actually no, this one seems pretty special. Have you ever noticed that, perhaps, on a random newspaper site with comments allowed, then when a Russian event happens, the usual local comments disappear and it gets utterly utterly swamped with one sided jingoistic Russian nationalist comments all from Russians. Almost feels orchestrated sometimes. Fair enough they are interested in events, but the one-sidedness is something I always notice, sometimes it is literally 100% with only a few foreigners giving a different take on matter.

Actually if you take a look at any Uighur/Han Chinese news story with comments allowed, theres one or two on www.timesonline.co.uk for example, you'll see that, of course, there are the ultra nationalistic Chinese comments there BUT, strange, there is no partisianship, no different views, just one solid Chinese view, no one single solitory Chinese soul saying, wait a second, maybe this is just propaganda from our government.

What I am trying to point out is, the large majority of Obama haters seem to have the same characteristics, there is no other opinion, no debate, America is turning to communism, this giant healthcare system will kill us all and we should carpet nuke X country for X reason. Its largely a giant wall of dumb. A mass of idiots with little decent critique.

There were even Bush supporters I admired, comments I read that were good, and this is Bush we are speaking about. I read good and bad about Hilary Clinton, but generally intelligent good and bad. I am still waiting for the intelligent bad about Obama.

Overheal

norbert64 wrote: »

i thought the whole swiftboating malarkey was actually the problem

tbh i dunno all the details. its not a campaign i followed very much, I was too busy with Junior Cert or something. All I know was the guy looked like a disgusting old hag and his military record was in serious question.

Though I recently caught some MAD TV parodies of the 2004 debates which were hilarious. look em up.

The intelligent bad for obama is looming. Its all going to hinge on economic issues. On a personal note you cant help but be tired of the man's gross overconfidence.

JohnMc1

norbert64 wrote: »

i thought the whole swiftboating malarkey was actually the problem

Him opening his mouth was the problem. He's an American Foggy Dewherst. His war stories are so made up its ridiculous [He was in 'Nam for 4 weeks with a camera crew conveniantly following him. Sustained no serious life threatening injuries and somehow left with 3 purple hearts and some other medals] His service was a joke.

The fact he was rightfully dubbed The King of Flip-Flops also didn't help either.

Manic Moran

norbert64 wrote: »

i thought the whole swiftboating malarkey was actually the problem

I don't think so. Despite the fact that he was anti-gun, never a recipe for success in the demographics he was supposed to be good at (Home State Loss, anyone?), I think the effect of the Swiftboating was overstated. It was his reaction to it which turned a lot of people off. The general perception I got was "I was a war vet! Look! I got the medals to prove it!" Perfectly validly earned awards, but veterans tend not to like military show-offs. His early departure from Vietnam, though perfectly legal, was also a bit of a turn-off for veterans. It's rather bad form to leave early.

Combine that with some verbal goofs on the Palin level, and that was about all she wrote.

NTM

JohnMc1

LOL @ Kerry legitimately earning 3 Purple Hearts for being in Vietnam for barely a month [with a camera crew in tow]

Manic Moran

Why not? I've got a guy in my unit who got his first purple heart about three hours after going outside the wire. He's only been here three days, it was his first mission. He'll return to duty, it's a graze to the shoulder.

NTM

jill_valentine

Maybe you're right, and the degree of hatin' might be the same, but the nature of it is certainly different. Bush was disliked, at least in the main, because lefty types disliked his policies and his administration. The Obama hatred is a little different - for the righty guys it seems to be much more a question of his perceived "moral character", so you get a lot more weird propaganda suggesting he might actually be the antichrist, for instance. The nature of the paranoia and kind of conspiracy theories related to Obama are also considerably wackier.

This might just be because Bush generously offered a whole host of ammo to people who were gonna hate him anyway though, I guess, but it's a curious distinction to me.

Kiniska

I can't believe some of these replies. If you were your Jr. Cert during the election and didn't pay too much attention, then why even reply!! How can anyone say that Kerry's military record was in serious question compared to Bush's Military Record!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Bush's Military record was that he got his rich daddy to get him the biggest tit job in the US military at the time and then didn't even bother to show up. But this was all overlooked by the disgusting Swift Boat attack against Kerry by Fox News and the seriously distorted American News!!!

Kerry might not have had the Billboard smile, but he was far better than Bush no matter how you compared them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

jank

JohnMc1 wrote: »

Him opening his mouth was the problem. He's an American Foggy Dewherst. His war stories are so made up its ridiculous [He was in 'Nam for 4 weeks with a camera crew conveniantly following him. Sustained no serious life threatening injuries and somehow left with 3 purple hearts and some other medals] His service was a joke.

The fact he was rightfully dubbed The King of Flip-Flops also didn't help either.

Do you care to back this up?

jank

JohnMc1 wrote: »

The Democrats have a complete tool in the White House and tools running the House and Senate.

People on here need to remember that before popping off about anybody without a D beside their names.

The the Repubs did a great job from 2000-2006 didnt they?
See all is see here is moan moan moan but no actual reasonable discussion or alternatives!

LostinKildare

Overheal wrote: »

On a personal note you cant help but be tired of the man's gross overconfidence.

Oh jeez. What are you talking about?

JohnMc1

Manic Moran wrote: »

Why not? I've got a guy in my unit who got his first purple heart about three hours after going outside the wire. He's only been here three days, it was his first mission. He'll return to duty, it's a graze to the shoulder.

NTM

Then Purple Hearts don't mean anything then if they are given out so easily.

Kiniska wrote:

I can't believe some of these replies. If you were your Jr. Cert during the election and didn't pay too much attention, then why even reply!! How can anyone say that Kerry's military record was in serious question compared to Bush's Military Record!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Bush's Military record was that he got his rich daddy to get him the biggest tit job in the US military at the time and then didn't even bother to show up. But this was all overlooked by the disgusting Swift Boat attack against Kerry by Fox News and the seriously distorted American News!!!

Kerry might not have had the Billboard smile, but he was far better than Bush no matter how you compared them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Neither of them did anything of merit during Vietnam so their "service" should have been a moot point and shouldn't have been a factor during the 2004 election.

And if military service was so important like the Dems wanted us to believe beack in '04 we would be talking about President McCain today instead of President Obama.

Kerry better than Bush? Put down the Kool-aid. Kerry couldn't keep a thought in his head for more than a second without flip-flopping.

jabbertalky

What are you on about - hate? The way the Americans talk about Obama you'd think he walks on water.

Overheal

LostinKildare wrote: »

Oh jeez. What are you talking about?

If you dont see it now: you will.

Poccington

JohnMc1 wrote: »

LOL @ Kerry legitimately earning 3 Purple Hearts for being in Vietnam for barely a month [with a camera crew in tow]

It was nearly 3 months between Kerry getting his first Purple Heart and his second one.

So to say he was in Vietnam for barely a month and got all 3 is a bit of a porky pie.

LostinKildare

Overheal wrote: »

If you dont see it now: you will.

FFS. This thread is about mindless criticism of Obama. I ask you what you mean when you make what seems to me mindless criticism of Obama

On a personal note you cant help but be tired of the man's gross overconfidence.

and you dodge the question.

What is it that Obama has done that illustrates his "gross overconfidence"? It must be obvious if we can't help but be tired of it. Let's hear it.

Overheal

I was trying to look for the daily show clip that highlights it in a neat little package while saving me from going blue in the keyboard this morning - mind you I was getting ready for work when I posted my reply. Sorry LK not trying to dodge, just busy.

@work be back soon.

edit: pretty much this though, regarding recent events,

http://www.sltrib.com/opinion/ci_12812432

I mean I know the job of the president is to be confident and unwavering, but at some point you need to acknowledge it a bit when you made an error. We arent seeing that attitude at all:

http://www.weeklystandard.com/weblogs/TWSFP/2009/07/mixed_messages_2.asp

“Turning to domestic issues, the president said that when Vice President Joe Biden recently told ABC News’ George Stephanopoulos that the White House ‘misread’ the economy when planning the stimulus package in January, the president said that ‘what Vice President Biden was referring to was simply the fact that when we passed he stimulus, we hadn’t gotten the full report of the first quarter contractions in the economy that turned out to be way worse than anybody had anticipated.’ But the president denied that his economic prescription was wrong because the diagnosis was incomplete. ‘There’s nothing that we would have done differently,’ he said. ‘We needed a stimulus and we needed a substantial stimulus.’”

Meanwhile... (And I hope only to make 18k this year. Im twice over my head in this shared debt figure)

All the while, trying to radically reform the healthcare system in a time of extreme economic uncertainty... I dunno. I think he's ****ing crazy if he plans to do all of this without ****ing it up major.

LostinKildare

Thank you for giving reasons, weak though they are.

It's hardly a sign of gross overconfidence for a president of the United States to talk up the economy when it's foundering, and to reassure the public that things are improving. It's a flipping necessity. He doesn't admit error re the stimulus because he -- and a slew of economists -- doesn't think he's erred (except that possibly the stimulus should have been bigger, but that was not gonna happen). That the situation's worse than forecast doesn't mean that there should have been no stimulus.

To keep this on-topic, you disagree with the policy, fine, but why is his supporting the policy somehow evidence of a massive ego trip?

And cmon, you think that tackling healthcare is a sign of Obama's overweening self-regard? Healthcare reform has to be done, and fast, in this economic climate. People are losing their health insurance as they lose their jobs. Faster than ever, even people who do have insurance are being forced into bankruptcies, and foreclosures, by medical bills (I believe medical bills are the no. 1 reason for bankruptcies in the US). This is inextricably connected to the economy.

More children lack coverage than ever before. People are dying because they can't pay for treatment. But you think Obama should blow it off to his next term so that we won't think he's big-headed?

Manic Moran

Then Purple Hearts don't mean anything then if they are given out so easily.

If they're that easy to get, may I inquire as to how many you have?

NTM