Breaking a light.... A court summons!!!

Conchúr

Hi all,
I just had a bit of an experience with a rather angry garda/bike person. I was cycling down lower Rathmines road and due to the potholes (craters) and parked cars I just cycle on the road. A garda bike tried to pull in front of me as they were overtaking a parked car and I had to swerve to get past. I then (quite stupidly i will admit) broke a red light straight ahead of her which was about to change to green. I only live about 300 meters from there and always go onto the curb about 10m from the house. She cycled up behind me and has given me a court summons for cycling on the footpath and breaking a light!!!

Just wondering what the deal with what I can get stung for is? Any help/previous experience(???) would be great, cheers.


p.s. Does anyone know is there any point to go to the garda ombudsman? She was really rude to me and essentially told me it didn't matter that she pulled in front of me as she was a guard. I asked for her name and she said it but as I was pulling out my notebook she just cycled off and I hadn't really heard her.

Lumen

One approach...

Turn up to court, ask to see the Garda in charge of prosecutions, apologise for wasting his time and state that you won't contest it.

I did this for an alleged speeding offence, and since the Garda witness didn't turn up the case was dropped.

Had a really interesting morning in court too. The general standard of humanity on display is such that they'll be quite relieved to be dealing with someone normal. Unless you get arsey.

Conchúr

Lumen wrote: »

One approach...

Turn up to court, ask to see the Garda in charge of prosecutions, apologise for wasting his time and state that you won't contest it.

I did this for an alleged speeding offence, and since the Garda witness didn't turn up the case was dropped.

Had a really interesting morning in court too. The general standard of humanity on display is such that they'll be quite relieved to be dealing with someone normal. Unless you get arsey.

Yea I do remember going with my mom to court a couple of years back and the only person who won was the one who just played along and was the nice guy. The rest of them were either still on the drugs they were caught with :P or poncy idots who didn't know when to shut up...

blorg

@Conchú;r- how old are you out of interest?

I don't 100% follow your story; it doesn't seem to me that the pulling out incident is connected at all to the red light breaking and footpath cycling. You admit both offenses so I would just follow Lumen's advice and be as courteous as possible.

Worst case you should be looking at a minor fine I imagine, I would not worry too much about it.

dolby

Quote:
Originally Posted by Garda Síochána Act 2005
(9) A person who—

...

(c) gives a false name or address to that officer,

is guilty of an offence and is liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding €2,500 or imprisonment for a period not exceeding 6 months or both.

What act is that because the Garda is only using Road Traffic Act i.e can ask for name, address only. not demand it as the poster was on a bike! the Garda's name will be on the summons prob looking at €120 fine all in! p.s if your nice maybe €60;)

245

Can they issue an on the spot summons? How, for one thing, would they be able to schedule a court date? (not doubting you, OP but what exactly did she give you?)

Lumen

dolby wrote: »

What act is that because the Garda is only using Road Traffic Act i.e can ask for name, address only.

OK, perhaps I got the wrong act. IANAL.

However, you could lose your bike if you can't prove your name or address.

Can't be bothered to find out what the penalty is if they find you gave false details. The point remains: screw around with the justice system at your peril.

dolby

Lumen wrote: »

OK, perhaps I got the wrong act. IANAL.

However, you could lose your bike if you can't prove your name or address.

Can't be bothered to find out what the penalty is if they find you gave false details. The point remains: screw around with the justice system at your peril.

They cant seized your bike only if they believe its stolen!! giving a false name they can arrest you to confirm details but for such a minor offence they would'nt waste there time! to be honest i wouldnt even think the poster will get a summons!! wait for 6 months and after that your in the clear:cool:

arybvtcw0eolkf

OP.

Own up to the offence.

Last time I was in a court on traffic offences (1989) the cop took an oath on the bible, I wasn't offered one.

Enquiring abou tit later I was informated that the court takes the view that the guard can't be lying (as he/she in your case) took an oath and so is telling the truth!.

Own up, grovel "yes your garda-ship", that kind of BS and take the slap on the wrist.

.

kona

Conchúr wrote: »

Hi all,
I just had a bit of an experience with a rather angry garda/bike person. I was cycling down lower Rathmines road and due to the potholes (craters) and parked cars I just cycle on the road. A garda bike tried to pull in front of me as they were overtaking a parked car and I had to swerve to get past. I then (quite stupidly i will admit) broke a red light straight ahead of her which was about to change to green. I only live about 300 meters from there and always go onto the curb about 10m from the house. She cycled up behind me and has given me a court summons for cycling on the footpath and breaking a light!!!

Just wondering what the deal with what I can get stung for is? Any help/previous experience(???) would be great, cheers.


p.s. Does anyone know is there any point to go to the garda ombudsman? She was really rude to me and essentially told me it didn't matter that she pulled in front of me as she was a guard. I asked for her name and she said it but as I was pulling out my notebook she just cycled off and I hadn't really heard her.

Did you give her any ****?

Out of personal experience, when they say stuff like court summons, when its for somthing daft then it wont go through.

Id say you wont hear anymore from it, the gard isnt going to waste her time going through the hassle of court when in all likelyhood you will probably be told to donate e50 to SVDP

your hardly going to get points, or a mad fine.

dolby

You cant get any points! however she prob gave you a boll#xing so you would get the point!:D

Conchúr

Thanks all for the help.

Blorg: I'm 24 but i really don't think that matters. In regards to the pulling out, no it doesn't really but I was telling the full story which was part of it.

I wouldn't say that I will receive a summons as she didn't give me anything (I think they're meant to but not really sure) and I think she was a garda reserve (said she was in the rathmines community force???) and I think they have to have a proper gardai with them at all times (again not sure).

To be honest with you, I've just never heard of them stopping a bike before and actually doing anything other then calling them a pup. Just trying to figure out if anyone else has been stopped and this happened or knows someone who has.

Stark

The fine for breaking a red light on a bicycle is ridiculously small, like €10 or something. Not worth worrying about or going to any trouble over.

zzzzzzzz

Conchúr wrote: »

Thanks all for the help.

Blorg: I'm 24 but i really don't think that matters. In regards to the pulling out, no it doesn't really but I was telling the full story which was part of it.

I wouldn't say that I will receive a summons as she didn't give me anything (I think they're meant to but not really sure) and I think she was a garda reserve (said she was in the rathmines community force???) and I think they have to have a proper gardai with them at all times (again not sure).

To be honest with you, I've just never heard of them stopping a bike before and actually doing anything other then calling them a pup. Just trying to figure out if anyone else has been stopped and this happened or knows someone who has.

Years ago I was stopped for having no light on my bike at night. Was told I'd be getting a summons about it. Thought to myself "yeah right...".

About three weeks later a garda knocked on my door and handed one to me... Went to court and ended up having to pay a charitable donation. Somewhere in the region of 50 lids from what I remember.

PITA having to go in to court - missed a day of work (was working as a courier at the time so didn't get paid for it!) I also remember feeling like an idiot in the court - the case up before me was a chain gang of about 4 or 5 blokes up for god knows what.

That'll teach me not to forget my lights again...

Jawgap

What paperwork did she give you exactly? It can't have been a court summons; it may be a fixed penalty notice, but I've never heard of Guards issuing FPNs for offences committed by cyclists.

Did she threaten to summons you, without giving you any paperwork? If that's the case I doubt very much you'll hear any more about it. Her intention was to use Section B of the Ways and Means Act!! In other words give you a b0ll1cking to stop you doing that sort of thing and to feed her power hungry ego! If she was to take that to court, she'd probably get the conviction but her sargent woul be none too pleased about it and the time it would take!

As for the ombudsman, yes, you can complain about discourtesy to them. Her name and number will be on any document she gave you.

As for giving a false name - not a good idea. You said you were quite close to your home and she's based locally - you're paths are likely to cross again!

Chips Lovell

They announced recently that the guards would be stepping up efforts to enforce road traffic law on cyclists, so it looks like it might be happening already.

Community Gardai are regular guards, not part of the Garda Reserve.

zzzzzzzz

Jawgap wrote: »

What paperwork did she give you exactly? It can't have been a court summons; it may be a fixed penalty notice, but I've never heard of Guards issuing FPNs for offences committed by cyclists.

Did she threaten to summons you, without giving you any paperwork? If that's the case I doubt very much you'll hear any more about it. Her intention was to use Section B of the Ways and Means Act!! In other words give you a b0ll1cking to stop you doing that sort of thing and to feed her power hungry ego! If she was to take that to court, she'd probably get the conviction but her sargent woul be none too pleased about it and the time it would take!

Do they have to give you any paperwork? Has this changed in the last few years? Because I definitely didn't get anything on the spot when I was stopped.

Jawgap

This may be of interest / relevance:-

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055555109


Edit - looks like she could've given you a ticket, but didn't because she couldn't be arsed or didn't know - I suspect the former.

dolby

no you would not get any notice off the garda! however you will get all the details when/if you get the summons in the post! Oh the fine is €60 for breaking a light on a bike.

blorg

Conchúr wrote: »

Blorg: I'm 24 but i really don't think that matters.

I was only asking as if you were under 18 I would have reckoned it was 100% to "make you think about it" and nothing would come of it. Even at 24 it is probably 98.7% that nothing will come of it

I was on the flip side a long time ago, a taxi overtook me and immediately took a left turn causing me to scrape along his side (didn't come off the bike.) Well there was a garda car just behind and while the taxi driver starts going nuts to me over the marks on his car the garda comes over, says he saw everything and starts bollocking the taxi driver out of it, threatens him with loss of his license and tells him to expect a summons for dangerous driving in the post. Of course at this point the taxi driver has flipped to grovelling apology mode. He asked me if I wanted to press things further, I didn't, he reckoned the taxi driver would be extra careful for the next six weeks at least while waiting for his summons

keano007

My own 2 cents on this is the op has admitted he went past a red light and cycled on the footpath so that's not the issue! The Garda does not have to give u anything at the side of the road eg. A ticket

Tickets are for mechanically propelled vehicles(cars etc), as for lying to the guard about your name and address, if he or she thinks your not being truthful he can seize your bike and it's up to you to prove who you are to get it back! I won't quote law but this is 100% right!

As for the summons I would suggest getting the guards name off the summons find out where he or she is stationed, call into him or her and apologize, when u go to court bring some money about 80 euro should do and apologize to the court and ask would it be ok to donate money to a charity to avoid a conviction!

Conchúr

Jeasus, well that's a few opinions anyway, cheers.

She didn't give me any paperwork anyway and to be honest, if the fine is only 60 (thanks dolby) I might as well pay it.

Long and the short of it, If there had been a proper bike lane without any cars or cratters and in a different country where they have proper bike lanes it wouldn't have been a problem (In several countries they have contuniual bike lanes which do not have to stop when cars are turning right onto the road as they are not a danger to the traffic/themselves).

Conchúr

And that's what annoyied me the most! I hadn't realised she was following me until I'd stopped and she came up beside me. Those bikes are so bloody slow I could have walked away quicker then her... Gurr

peanuthead

Conchúr wrote: »

Hi all,
I just had a bit of an experience with a rather angry garda/bike person. I was cycling down lower Rathmines road and due to the potholes (craters) and parked cars I just cycle on the road. A garda bike tried to pull in front of me as they were overtaking a parked car and I had to swerve to get past. I then (quite stupidly i will admit) broke a red light straight ahead of her which was about to change to green. I only live about 300 meters from there and always go onto the curb about 10m from the house. She cycled up behind me and has given me a court summons for cycling on the footpath and breaking a light!!!

Just wondering what the deal with what I can get stung for is? Any help/previous experience(???) would be great, cheers.


p.s. Does anyone know is there any point to go to the garda ombudsman? She was really rude to me and essentially told me it didn't matter that she pulled in front of me as she was a guard. I asked for her name and she said it but as I was pulling out my notebook she just cycled off and I hadn't really heard her.

I know you may think you're only a cyclist, not a motorist, and therefore its not as serious for you to break lights, but just to let you know, my sister was knocked down by a cyclist who ran a red light two years ago, and she was left with minor leg injuries, which, are minor, but are injuries nevertheless.

So I'm guessing you will get a fine and a harsh warning (not that you probably need that, I think you realise it was silly to do that)

Secondly, I do think you should go to the Ombundsman, every complaint counts, and if the garda is cheeky with you, she's probably cheeky with others. If enough complaints are put in about her, her behaviour will be investigated.
Personally I think the problem with alot of garda is that they are let away with speaking to people like that. Hell, I wouldn't entertain my own father if he spoke that way to me, I would hardly take it off a stranger, garda or no garda.

keano007

I think people are missing the point here the op has admitted going through the red light, does he not realize that he could of caused an accident, he might not have been injured but if an innocent child had been on the footpath and a car had to swere because of the op's disregard for other road users where would he be!

Who cares if the guard gave out to you, I kind of think u deserved it!

dolby

keano007 wrote: »

I think people are missing the point here the op has admitted going through the red light, does he not realize that he could of caused an accident, he might not have been injured but if an innocent child had been on the footpath and a car had to swere because of the op's disregard for other road users where would he be!

Who cares if the guard gave out to you, I kind of think u deserved it!

I agree, I notice in the city mainly the couriers on bikes never stop for red its really unfair for ppl on foot and drives people mad, cyclists have to obey the Road Traffic Act also! If the Garda gave out to you that should be the end of it. Garda gives out to op, op learns from mistake end of! or Garda be very nice and summons you to court! they cant do both(its like the carny code)
ombudsman would take the complaint and just pass it over to AGS as they only deal with BIG important stuff now!!

Oh I would love to see any legislation stating Gardai can seized a bike to confirm name and address under the Road Traffic Act, now the ombudsman would love a juicy one like that;)

Ryaner

A lot of it is about mutual respect. Lots of pedestrians don't stop at lights for bikes, or even cars sometimes.

For the record I do stop at almost all traffic lights. There is one I've started to go through but only because there is a bike filter that goes on with the pedestrian lights and I felt stupid waiting for the roads green light when it went green

cyclopath2001

keano007 wrote: »

Who cares if the guard gave out to you, I kind of think u deserved it!

+1

This is 'cycling' not 'motoring', when we get caught doing something wrong, we don't try to wriggle out of of it.

Jawgap

dolby wrote: »

I agree, I notice in the city mainly the couriers on bikes never stop for red its really unfair for ppl on foot and drives people mad, cyclists have to obey the Road Traffic Act also! If the Garda gave out to you that should be the end of it. Garda gives out to op, op learns from mistake end of! or Garda be very nice and summons you to court! they cant do both(its like the carny code)
ombudsman would take the complaint and just pass it over to AGS as they only deal with BIG important stuff now!!

Oh I would love to see any legislation stating Gardai can seized a bike to confirm name and address under the Road Traffic Act, now the ombudsman would love a juicy one like that;)

See Section 108 of the RTA 1961

OP - Bottom line you did something you shouldn't have done and got caught by a cranky Guard. The chances are nothing will come of it. Even if it does my advice would be go along to the court on the day in a suit, admit the facts, apologise and see what the DJ has to say. Offer an explanation if he / she asks or if invited to comment on the Guard's account, politely correct it.

Don't offer anything by way of contribution to the court poor box - if you offer it, the judge'll take it!! You never know, on the off chance you do get summonsed showing up and showing respect for the court and the process goes along way in demonstrating your contriteness and can lead to the judge giving you a small slap on the wrists - maybe the Probation Act and a few yoyos in the court poor box.

Thomas_S_Hunterson

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

This is 'cycling' not 'motoring', when we get caught doing something wrong, we don't try to wriggle out of of it.

If you get caught then you're just not fast enough.

DrGroove

I broke a red light on Shelbourne road 6 years ago. Cop Car pulled up behind me and it was a female guard driving the car and male guard who did all the talking. I reckoned he was out to impress young female guard with his Judge Dredd authority and his rhetorical statements like 'So Red lights don't apply to you- huh"

Summons came. Arrived into court - whole morning sitting there waiting for the case to be called. It never was. The guard was there so I asked him outside the court why the case was never called and he said he'd done all the paper work and it was missed by the court clerk. So I got away with it - if you call taking a morning off work to sit in a courtroom getting away with it.

hobochris

Sean_K wrote: »

If you get caught then you're just not fast enough.

Yeah cycle faster, then you can get a smack of what ever car or truck has the green light, who's path you cross .. :rolleyes:

Its win win for those of us that obey the ROTR, you get punished for your stupid attitude towards road safety & your 100% liable legally!

Thomas_S_Hunterson

hobochris wrote: »

Its win win for those of us that obey the ROTR, you get punished for your stupid attitude towards road safety & your 100% liable legally!

Liability is for a court to decide, and it's certainly not as clear-cut as you make out.

hobochris

Sean_K wrote: »

Liability is for a court to decide, and it's certainly not as clear-cut as you make out.

You are a road user, therefor you are legally required to follow the rules of the road.

you break a red light which results in a collision with a vehicle that has right of way. YOU ARE IN THE WRONG! YOU BROKE THE LAW, YOU UNLAWFULLY CAUSED THE ACCIDENT! YOU ARE 100% LIABLE FOR THE ACCIDENT AND MAY BE PROSECUTED.

niceonetom

hobochris wrote: »

You are a road user, therefor you are legally required to follow the rules of the road.

you break a red light which results in a collision with a vehicle that has right of way. YOU ARE IN THE WRONG! YOU BROKE THE LAW, YOU CAUSED THE ACCIDENT!

Stand back everyone - he's using bold, all caps, and underline. This could be serious.

hobochris

niceonetom wrote: »

Stand back everyone - he's using bold, all caps, and underline. This could be serious.

sorry, just trying to make the point clear.

ROK ON

Maybe he is using bold etc, but the point made remains valid.
We often bitch about being on the receiving end of poor driving (rightfully so). But we also have a responsibility to cycle within the law.

The OP broke a law. He was caught. The cops demeanor is irrelevant to the fact that he broke the law (and admitted it). I cant see this going to court, but if it does, he should just apologise and show awreness of what he has done, then promise not to do it again.

Most Gardai (IMO) have a bit of a chip on the shoulder - I guess its institutionalised in the force, or due to the type of people that are attracted to being Gardai. It could also be due to having to deal with the sh1tty end of society all day. You are not going to change the Garda's personality by complaining about it - thats just the way they are.

The OP should now just get on with it.

bcmf

hobochris wrote: »

You are a road user, therefor you are legally required to follow the rules of the road.

you break a red light which results in a collision with a vehicle that has right of way. YOU ARE IN THE WRONG! YOU BROKE THE LAW, YOU UNLAWFULLY CAUSED THE ACCIDENT! YOU ARE 100% LIABLE FOR THE ACCIDENT AND MAY BE PROSECUTED.

IMO you are wrong.
Motorists are liable REGARDLESS OF WHETHER A CYCLIST/PEDESTRIAN IS IN THE RIGHT OR WRONG.I found this out the hard way many years ago.The motorist HAS TO EXPECT THE UNEXPECTED AND DRIVE IN MANNER TO REACT TO THE UNEXPECTED.A kid on a trycycle could come up from the a hole in the ground and if he is hit the driver is still responsible.A motorist should expect a cyclist/ped to to break a red light-wander out into the middle of the road and be able to react accordingly.
THAT IS NOT TO SAY THAT IT IS RESPONSIBLE FOR CYCLISTS-PEDS TO DO IT but if it ends up in a court of law I would only expect 1 outcome-In favour of Cyclists-pedestrians.

Chips Lovell

Conchúr

Well to be honest with you I know I broke the law and I freely admit that. In terms of will I do it again? Yes... I still have no intention in cycling in crappy cycle lanes, I still have no intention of stopping for lights that it will not impinge on my safety to stop at and I still will do what ever the hell I want as long as it doesn't impinge on my safety, the safety of other cyclists or the safety of pedestrians. I'm sorry for car users but who ever cycles in Dublin will know that It's a battle between cars and Bicycles and if you don't play tough you will still be standing outside your house wondering what to do...

Chips Lovell

Conchúr wrote: »

Well to be honest with you I know I broke the law and I freely admit that. In terms of will I do it again? Yes... I still have no intention in cycling in crappy cycle lanes, I still have no intention of stopping for lights that it will not impinge on my safety to stop at and I still will do what ever the hell I want as long as it doesn't impinge on my safety, the safety of other cyclists or the safety of pedestrians. I'm sorry for car users but who ever cycles in Dublin will know that It's a battle between cars and Bicycles and if you don't play tough you will still be standing outside your house wondering what to do...

Bravo OP, sure just look out for yourself. It's the attitude from people like yourself that really endears cyclists to the wider community.

BeerNut

Conchúr wrote: »

I still have no intention of stopping for lights that it will not impinge on my safety to stop at and I still will do what ever the hell I want as long as it doesn't impinge on my safety, the safety of other cyclists or the safety of pedestrians. I'm sorry for car users but who ever cycles in Dublin will know that It's a battle between cars and Bicycles

I don't see how breaking red lights serves as a weapon in this battle. If anything, it hands the motorists a fully-loaded "cyclists don't even use the roads properly".

Lumen

Yes siree, it's Flame Friday.

Mr. Presentable

Conchúr wrote: »

Well to be honest with you I know I broke the law and I freely admit that. In terms of will I do it again? Yes... I still have no intention in cycling in crappy cycle lanes, I still have no intention of stopping for lights that it will not impinge on my safety to stop at and I still will do what ever the hell I want as long as it doesn't impinge on my safety, the safety of other cyclists or the safety of pedestrians. I'm sorry for car users but who ever cycles in Dublin will know that It's a battle between cars and Bicycles and if you don't play tough you will still be standing outside your house wondering what to do...

Best of luck to you with the old running a red. I was on a bus in April who hit a cyclist that ran a red up the inside (blind for the bus) of a van stopped at the junction. The cyclist was OK, but two people on the bus were injured, and the driver traumatised. But you'll say it was the bus driver's fault for not anticipating the bike...........

w123

Conchúr wrote: »

Well to be honest with you I know I broke the law and I freely admit that. In terms of will I do it again? Yes... I still have no intention in cycling in crappy cycle lanes, I still have no intention of stopping for lights that it will not impinge on my safety to stop at and I still will do what ever the hell I want as long as it doesn't impinge on my safety, the safety of other cyclists or the safety of pedestrians. I'm sorry for car users but who ever cycles in Dublin will know that It's a battle between cars and Bicycles and if you don't play tough you will still be standing outside your house wondering what to do...

You're dead right. I know that spot in Rathmines, there's a red light to allow peds to x and a filter turning right, if you're going straight ahead and there are no peds on the x then why should you stop? The cycle lanes in Rathmines (Dublin) are a joke; cars park, busses pull in and the road is safest option. In the battle between the cars and the bikes a cyclist will only prevail if they ride on the road visible to motorists, not if they hug the edge of the road as if they are a second class means of transport.

Now if we had a decent infrastructure of safe cycle lanes it would be a different story. I still cycle in Dublin as if there were no bike lanes and I haven't yet been hit. Be Safe Be Seen.

penexpers

w123 wrote: »

You're dead right. I know that spot in Rathmines, there's a red light to allow peds to x and a filter turning right, if you're going straight ahead and there are no peds on the x then why should you stop?

Sure why should cars stop if there's no pedestrians crossing either?

Thomas_S_Hunterson

hobochris wrote: »

You are a road user, therefor you are legally required to follow the rules of the road.

you break a red light which results in a collision with a vehicle that has right of way. YOU ARE IN THE WRONG! YOU BROKE THE LAW, YOU UNLAWFULLY CAUSED THE ACCIDENT! YOU ARE 100% LIABLE FOR THE ACCIDENT AND MAY BE PROSECUTED.

That's not how the law works. You evidently know very little about legal liability.

If I break a light and cycle right into traffic, I have done wrong but that does not absolve other road users of their responsibilities.

The law takes all this into account. Coupled with the vulnerable cyclist factor basically don't go running over cyclists and expect to get paid for the damage to your car.

blorg

This all started with the OP asking about being stopped by a bit of a cranky garda after they committed a minor traffic infraction; which he probably will hear no more about and at the most risks a minor fine.

Now we have one side going on as if the OP had killed some kid on a pedestrian crossing and deserves a long spell in the pokey. Another side hails him as some sort of libertarian cycling warrior against the fascist motorist state that we live in. How can you be FREE if you are not actively looking for red lights to break and footpaths to cycle on? Take that motorfascists, swerve to avoid me!

Some more regular posters are making reasonable points. Friday on the internet.

Lumen

penexpers wrote: »

Sure why should cars stop if there's no pedestrians crossing either?

I agree. This is why I drive on the footpad when no-one else is using it.

peanuthead

Conchúr wrote: »

In terms of will I do it again? Yes...

Well good luck to you mate, but if you ever knock my sister down with your shenanigans, i will whop your ass.

Jawgap

blorg wrote: »

Some more regular posters are making reasonable points. Friday on the internet.

Beats the hell out of working.......

This should be the motto of cyclists everywhere when faced by the motoring menace.....