Are carbs the devil?

Kimia

Hey all

Am working away at the gym - enjoying it I have to say. My diet is ok - I'll post what i eat below. I do eat carbs because i'm doing weightwatchers (not really to lose weight, rather to give me a structured easy healthy diet to follow) and they really fill you up but I wouldn't eat loads.

Here's a usual day:

Morning - go to gym and do bout 40 mins of weights/20 mins of cardio
Breakfast - Bran Flakes & semi-skimmed milk or 1 slice of wholemeal with flora
Lunch - Homemade pasta bake (low fat ingredients) or fish or brown bread with ham or potato cakes
Dinner - Much the same as above.

I eat lots of fish, small bit of chicken, very little beef. I do eat potatos and pasta (white) and maybe some boiled rice occasionally. I'm not great with fruit or veg but I try.

So my question is this - are carbs really bad for losing weight/toning up? I don't want to come off them because i don't think it's sustainable for me and I HATE salad.

FunkZ

Maybe try eating them every second day, ya should be able to carry the energy over from the last day ya ate them.

Carbs raise insulin so you'll want slow releasing ones when ya do eat them, a sudden surge will 'cause fat gain so stay away from sugar apart from after working out.

I've just skimmed, in a rush, and what I've said could be wrong but I'm pretty sure it's right.

rubadub

Kimia wrote: »

I do eat carbs because i'm doing weightwatchers (not really to lose weight, rather to give me a structured easy healthy diet to follow) and they really fill you up but I wouldn't eat loads.

WW is biased towards carbs, since they demonise fat with its points system most people will be steered towards carbs.

You could have a high carb meal of 1000kcal and a high fat meal of only 500kcal, but they could be the same WW points. So most people might choose the one with more energy in it, the 1000kcal one, while they could stand to lose a lot more fat/weight by picking the high fat one.

How about a nice chocolate bar instead of the bran flakes, at least the bar tastes nice and makes no disgusting attempt to make brand itself as healthy, bran flakes are 22% sugar.


http://points.ogo.ms/

I eat a fair amount of coconut flour for health reasons as well as it being tasty. 100g of coconut is 602kcal with 53.4g of sat fat, so 21.5points while 602kcal of white sugar is 8.5WW points! So over 2.5 times the points, but I imagine the 21.5points of coconut would not make you as fat as 8.5points of sugar.

Kimia

Thanks Rubadub and the above poster.

I suppose the main thing for me is that carbs make me full and they make me feel satisfied. They are also very handy!

But is it necessary to cut them out to lose weight/tone up? I just don't think I can do that.

FunkZ

Kimia wrote: »

But is it necessary to cut them out to lose weight/tone up? I just don't think I can do that.

No it's not but it's what normally gives the best results.

The two biggest tips I can give is eat 500 kCals under your maintenance, and then burn 500kCals through exercise a day too.

rubadub

Kimia wrote: »

But is it necessary to cut them out to lose weight/tone up? I just don't think I can do that.

To tone up means building muscle, and carbs are useful for that, but best leave them to before & after your workout. Many "post workout supplements" will have 2 parts simple carbs to one part protein. I will train tonight and have a protein milkshake and a load of jaffa cakes. I am going to give into my sweet tooth sometime and at least it goes to good use after a workout.

Earn your carbs, you will enjoy them more too.

I would have oats or porridge pancakes in the morning as it is slow release.

Pro-Nutrition

Kimia wrote: »

Hey all

Am working away at the gym - enjoying it I have to say. My diet is ok - I'll post what i eat below. I do eat carbs because i'm doing weightwatchers (not really to lose weight, rather to give me a structured easy healthy diet to follow) and they really fill you up but I wouldn't eat loads.

Here's a usual day:

Morning - go to gym and do bout 40 mins of weights/20 mins of cardio
Breakfast - Bran Flakes & semi-skimmed milk or 1 slice of wholemeal with flora
Lunch - Homemade pasta bake (low fat ingredients) or fish or brown bread with ham or potato cakes
Dinner - Much the same as above.

I eat lots of fish, small bit of chicken, very little beef. I do eat potatos and pasta (white) and maybe some boiled rice occasionally. I'm not great with fruit or veg but I try.

So my question is this - are carbs really bad for losing weight/toning up? I don't want to come off them because i don't think it's sustainable for me and I HATE salad.

Hey, to answer your question, Yes carbs are bab when you want to lose. Carbs are great source of energy but they also make you retain water. The ideal thing for you to do to lose the weight is to up both healthy fats and protein and drop the carbs. Dont drop them out totally, take some in prior to training (depending on time of day) if you train early take them in and phase them out during the day. You will find healthy fats in Almonds, Cashew Nuts, Flaxseed etc etc.

MagicMarker

Sometimes you have a slice of bread for breakfast... 1 slice on bread... for breakfast?

Being honest OP, your diet is absolutely awful.

How long have you been eating/training like this and what kind of results have you gotten? I assume you haven't achieve what you wanted otherwise you wouldn't be asking?

Khannie

rubadub wrote: »

How about a nice chocolate bar instead of the bran flakes, at least the bar tastes nice and makes no disgusting attempt to make brand itself as healthy, bran flakes are 22% sugar.

Haha. I lol'd.

OP: Just try to get complex carbs in. Carbs are not the devil in the slightest, it's just generally best to avoid simple carbs (like sugary crap, white rice, white pasta, etc) . I love carbs and find training very difficult without them tbh.

slicus ricus

Kimia wrote: »

I do eat carbs because i'm doing weightwatchers (not really to lose weight, rather to give me a structured easy healthy diet to follow) and they really fill you up but I wouldn't eat loads.

I wouldn't bother doing weightwatchers to be honest, just focus on a healthy eating habits and nutrition and plan your daily intake of food in terms of what you are going to eat and when you are going to eat it. I can guarantee that if you do that correctly, it will work out far better than any guided diet such as weightwatchers.

Kimia wrote: »

Morning - go to gym and do bout 40 mins of weights/20 mins of cardio
Breakfast - Bran Flakes & semi-skimmed milk or 1 slice of wholemeal with flora
Lunch - Homemade pasta bake (low fat ingredients) or fish or brown bread with ham or potato cakes
Dinner - Much the same as above.

I don't think your diet is that great at all to be honest. That's only 3 meals during the day and by the looks of things, they are 3 fairly heavy meals at that. If you eat good sources of protein regularly, this will speed up your metabolism which is definately a positive in terms of muscle gain and avoiding gaining fat. Try eating lean chicken or fish as extra meals - there are several ways of serving this including making a salad out of them or on wholemeal bread. If you are looking to add muscle (i'm guessing you might be considering you do a lot of weights), you would really want to be eating meals containing considerable protein at least 5 times a day.

I do not agree with your breakfast at all, the wholemeal bread is fine (there not much in it to be honest other than a good source of fibre) but the bran flakes are wasted nutrition at best. Try a good bowl of porridge with milk - can be cooked fairly quickly in the microwave, a yougurt with this would be a good idea also.

Also, from what you have said above, it looks like you're eating 2 meals of pasta during the day. That would be a fair amount of carbs, obviously depending on how much pasta you're eating. I would recommend limiting this to one carb meal per day and ideally you would eat this at lunch time. I'm a little confused as to why you mentioned carbs at all seeing how you have said that your goal is not to lose weight. Perhaps you could clarify this and explain what your actual goals are? The more we know, the more we may be able to answer your question.

Posy

What cereal would you recommend? Is all-bran okay? Or something like shredded wheat?

Kimia

Thanks everyone.

I probably should clarify - I'm a girl and not looking to build loads of muscle, I just want to tighten what I have.

My goal is to lose a little bit of weight, but it's not essential as I know that I'm tightening my muscles and looking better even if the scales don't show that.

I hate salads. I could easily eat a slice of chicken on a piece of wholemeal bread as a snack. I eat pasta and potatos because they are so filling so I wouldn't eat a huge portion. Quite small actually (smaller than my fist on the plate).

I'm just hoping that in order to achieve the results I want I don't have to give up carbs because it's not sustainable for me - I couldn't live on no carbs for the rest of my life and that's it.

So do you think it's best for me to follow a 'low carb' diet, rather than a 'low fat' diet such as weightwatchers?

Khannie

Kimia wrote: »

So do you think it's best for me to follow a 'low carb' diet, rather than a 'low fat' diet such as weightwatchers?

My 2c: Everything in moderation and you'll be grand. I'm not a big fan of low anything. Some carbs, some fats, some protein ftw.

A Fit Body

hi,
carbs are the bodies main source of fuel, Your body needs it for energy and when exercising in order to recover properly and be able to continue and improve your training you need to replenish your energy or glycogen .. ie carbs

From a healthy nutrional point of view 50-60% of your diet should be carbs, As well there is less fat in a potatoe for example than in steak. Portion size should be monitored however

What I would watch is with meals like Pasta bakes watch the hidden fats that may be in sauces you are using

If you want to train and exercise well and adapt a healthy sustainable approach to eating, the gi diet is one of the best

there are many books on the GI diet, it basically teaches you what foods are slow release as in they will release energy slowly, keep you fuller for longer and avoid sugar surges or dips and what foods are fast release.

Opt for wholemeal varities such as brown rice, brown bread and wholemeal pasta try to avoid there white partners as these are higher in sugar.

Hope this helps

slicus ricus

Kimia wrote: »

Thanks everyone.

I probably should clarify - I'm a girl and not looking to build loads of muscle, I just want to tighten what I have.

My goal is to lose a little bit of weight, but it's not essential as I know that I'm tightening my muscles and looking better even if the scales don't show that.

I hate salads. I could easily eat a slice of chicken on a piece of wholemeal bread as a snack. I eat pasta and potatos because they are so filling so I wouldn't eat a huge portion. Quite small actually (smaller than my fist on the plate).

I'm just hoping that in order to achieve the results I want I don't have to give up carbs because it's not sustainable for me - I couldn't live on no carbs for the rest of my life and that's it.

So do you think it's best for me to follow a 'low carb' diet, rather than a 'low fat' diet such as weightwatchers?

Ah right, that changes a lot of things so - didn't realise you were a girl nor did I realise that the pasta portions were reasonably small. I would absolutely not advise giving up carbs. Carbs are essential for energy and should not be cut out of a diet by anyone imo. The timing of when you eat your carbs is the most important thing, just make sure you'r not eating them too close to bed time because unused carbs (i.e. if you don't use the energy they provide) will be converted to fat. From what you've said above, it seems like you're doing a good job on carb timing as you are eating small portions of carbs in the afternoon and evening. So I would keep that as it is if I were you.

I still think it would be a good idea to try eating porridge for breakfast though - you can get grounded flax, sunflower, or pumpkin seed mix (linwoods do the one I buy), which make a nice healthy addition to the porridge. Fresh fruit such as strawberries would make it less bland also.

Caderyn wrote:

What cereal would you recommend? Is all-bran okay? Or something like shredded wheat?

Only thing I would really recommend is porridge. If you really can't do porridge, then weatabix is the best of a bad lot imo.

ragg

A Fit Body wrote: »

From a healthy nutrional point of view 50-60% of your diet should be carbs, As well there is less fat in a potatoe for example than in steak. Portion size should be monitored however

50 - 60 %

I maybe have 40% on a training day - but if im not training its probably a 1/10th of that :eek:

Degsy

Pro-Nutrition wrote: »

Hey, to answer your question, Yes carbs are bab when you want to lose. Carbs are great source of energy but they also make you retain water. The ideal thing for you to do to lose the weight is to up both healthy fats and protein and drop the carbs. Dont drop them out totally, take some in prior to training (depending on time of day) if you train early take them in and phase them out during the day. You will find healthy fats in Almonds, Cashew Nuts, Flaxseed etc etc.

This "healthy" fats thing is the new black isnt it?
What happened to the fats you also get in meat,dairy and fish?

ragg

Healthy fat are generally away to keep the cals up with out adding carbs.

I would, for the most part, include the fats in dairy, eggs etc in this.

A Fit Body

exactly, for recovery and repair you should be having simple sugars within the first 20 mins of exercise ie a piece of fruit or a small juice drink and complex carbs within the hour

Mink

I find it really hard to do any sort of cardio if haven't had at least a portion of carbs that day.

One portion of good carbs (wholegrain, unprocessed) a day is fine but I would never ever cut it out of the diet completely.

mloc

A Fit Body wrote: »

hi,
carbs are the bodies main source of fuel, Your body needs it for energy and when exercising in order to recover properly and be able to continue and improve your training you need to replenish your energy or glycogen .. ie carbs

From a healthy nutrional point of view 50-60% of your diet should be carbs, As well there is less fat in a potatoe for example than in steak. Portion size should be monitored however

I'd generally recommend keeping carbs under 30% in general, and under 20-15% if you are trying to lose weight. While your body does use glucose (a carb) for energy, this does not have to come from carbohydrates in your diet; your body will produce energy from fats if the carbohydrate levels are low resulting in a loss of fat around the body.

Carbs should come from green veg predominantly and only breakfast and post-training should break this rule. Nuts, healthy oils and fish are useful to make up the balance of calories.

Washout

slicus ricus wrote: »

Ah right, that changes a lot of things so - didn't realise you were a girl nor did I realise that the pasta portions were reasonably small. I would absolutely not advise giving up carbs. Carbs are essential for energy and should not be cut out of a diet by anyone imo. The timing of when you eat your carbs is the most important thing, just make sure you'r not eating them too close to bed time because unused carbs (i.e. if you don't use the energy they provide) will be converted to fat. From what you've said above, it seems like you're doing a good job on carb timing as you are eating small portions of carbs in the afternoon and evening. So I would keep that as it is if I were you.

I still think it would be a good idea to try eating porridge for breakfast though - you can get grounded flax, sunflower, or pumpkin seed mix (linwoods do the one I buy), which make a nice healthy addition to the porridge. Fresh fruit such as strawberries would make it less bland also.



Only thing I would really recommend is porridge. If you really can't do porridge, then weatabix is the best of a bad lot imo.

what about muesli?

slicus ricus

Washout wrote: »

what about muesli?

Yeah, I forgot about muesli, still don't think it's as good a source of slow release carbs as porridge oats.

mloc wrote:

Carbs should come from green veg predominantly and only breakfast and post-training should break this rule. Nuts, healthy oils and fish are useful to make up the balance of calories.

I disagree. In my opinion, pasta/ rice are an excellent source of carbs pre-workout, which is a time when your body needs them given the energy requirements for training.

As has been pointed out, simple carbs are an essential for post-workout, glucose/dextrose is an excellent source. The recommended ratio for simple carbs to protein pwo is 2:1.

Khannie

slicus ricus wrote: »

Yeah, I forgot about muesli, still don't think it's as good a source of slow release carbs as porridge oats.

Museli > porridge if you can afford the calories. It's basically just porridge + nuts and fruit.

mloc

slicus ricus wrote: »

In my opinion, pasta/ rice are an excellent source of carbs pre-workout, which is a time when your body needs them given the energy requirements for training.

I would agree with this if OP was trying to put on weight, but keeping workouts fat fuelled will help burn off more body fat.

rocky

slicus ricus wrote: »

As has been pointed out, simple carbs are an essential for post-workout, glucose/dextrose is an excellent source. The recommended ratio for simple carbs to protein pwo is 2:1.

What about sugar instead of glucose? Is it not a "simple" carb? Or is it too processed?

chopley

Most sources of carbs (bread, rice, pasta, potatoes) are high in calories, but low in nutrients. If you cut down on carbs and increase protein intake, you will lose fat faster and become much leaner. You'll also be getting more good nutrients per calorie. You don't have to go to the extreme of cutting out all carbs. Try halving the amount of rice you eat with your meal or eating one potato instead of three.

In its extreme form, this type of eating is known as the caveman diet (aka the paleolithic diet or paleo diet, for short). This essentially involves only eating foods available to our ancestors before large-scale farming, i.e. red meats, fish, eggs, nuts, berries, fruit, roots. Anything that can only be eaten after cooking (e.g. potatoes, peanuts) and dairy products are excluded.

Have a read here and see what you think: http://www.fitnesstipsforlife.com/the-caveman-diet.html

Khannie

rocky wrote: »

What about sugar instead of glucose? Is it not a "simple" carb? Or is it too processed?

Glucose is more simple (and more processed I would guess) than table sugar.

g'em

rocky wrote: »

What about sugar instead of glucose? Is it not a "simple" carb? Or is it too processed?

Glucose is the most simple unit of carbohydrates (GI = 100), table sugar is a combination of glucose and fructose and has a lower GI (around 60 - 65). It's still considered a simple carb though because of its simple structure and easy digestibility.

Complex carbs are when you have hundreds and thousands of repeating glucose units that make up one of 4 types of complex carbohydrate: starch (storage carbs in plants and grains, the only complex carbs we eat), cellulose (indigestible structural plant carbohydrates aka some fibres), chitin (structural carb found in insect exoskeletons) and glycogen (storage carbohydrate found in our liver and muscles).

As a rule of thumb: all sugars = simple, all non-processed* starchy foods = complex.


*the emphasis on the 'non-processed' bit

BraziliaNZ

so i eat porridge for breakfast, and a tuna sandwich for lunch, and have a couple of baby potatoes or a small bit of wholemeal pasta with my dinner. So basically i have carbs with every meal. All the nutrition people here seem to be saying this is not the way to do it. I'm not gaining or losing weight but is this wrong?

g'em

BraziliaNZ wrote: »

So basically i have carbs with every meal. All the nutrition people here seem to be saying this is not the way to do it. I'm not gaining or losing weight but is this wrong?

There's your answer

There's little wrong with eating carbs, and they definitely aren't the devil.

If you are very active and move around a lot you can eat carbs without much trouble because you will be putting the calories to good use.

If you are quite sedentary or eat a lot of bad carbs you are more likely to put on weight because carbs are used for nothing other than energy in the body - if that energy isn't used it gets stored as fat.

If you are trying to lose weight carbs aren't a great choice because they promote insulin responses: insulin promotes fat storage, not what you want when you're trying to lose fat.

In your case: porridge = complex carbs, high in fibre,low GI, slow release. Tuna sandwich = irrespective of white/ brown bread tuna is low GI and will dampen insulin response of bread. Baby potatoes/ wholemeal pasta = high fibre, low GI, slow release i.e. all relatively fine choices.

slicus ricus

slicus ricus wrote:

In my opinion, pasta/ rice are an excellent source of carbs pre-workout, which is a time when your body needs them given the energy requirements for training.

mloc wrote: »

I would agree with this if OP was trying to put on weight, but keeping workouts fat fuelled will help burn off more body fat.

You won't actually put on weight if you use the energy gained from the carbs you take in. That is why i'm suggesting getting complex carbs in pre workout. If you do this, you will be more energetic and more durable in your training session and your body will not be forced to draw upon protein for a source of energy, i.e. you will definately not be carb depleted. Also, you will use the energy that the carbs have provided and as a result, there will be no fat gain. Remember, only carbs you don't use for energy will be converted to fat!

g'em

@ Kimia - there's always ways to reduce your carbs if you're looking to lose weight. Scarmbled eggs made with one/ two whole and two/three whites with a bit of cheese is *delicious* at any time of day and the protein keeps you satiated for ages.

Fruit and buts make for a great snack as do chopped crunch veg like carrots, cucumber and broccoli with hummus.

As a general guideline keep your carb portions no bigger than the size of your fist (when cooked) and they'll be within 'moderate' portion guidelines.

cnocbui

Kimia wrote: »

So my question is this - are carbs really bad for losing weight/toning up? I don't want to come off them because i don't think it's sustainable for me and I HATE salad.

Yes, carbs should not be a significant part of a diet.

My wife got interested in the paleolithic diet idea and researched the subject a great deal. She cut her carb intake as much as possible and now gets 64% of her daily energy intake from fats. Without altering her level of exercise, or dieting - as in reducing food intake - she has lost weight and gained considerable muscle definition.

I am entirely convinced that the paleolithic diet arguments are sound but I personally like carbs too much for my own good.

kevpants

cnocbui wrote: »

I am entirely convinced that the paleolithic diet arguments are sound but I personally like carbs too much for my own good.

Yeah the paleo stuff makes a fair bit of sense what little of it I've read. But unless they make a discovery indicating paleolithic man had a penchant for mini-muffins I'm afraid it's no dice.

Degsy

kevpants wrote: »

Yeah the paleo stuff makes a fair bit of sense what little of it I've read. But unless they make a discovery indicating paleolithic man had a penchant for mini-muffins I'm afraid it's no dice.

I'm pretty sure he figured out how to make some form of beer too so its a runner for me.

Khannie

g'em wrote: »

Fruit and buts make for a great snack

yes they do.

itsallaboutheL

LMFAO

ná bí dána

rocky

Found on this website:

http://www.lowglycemicdiet.com/fruitsgi.html

that dates have a GI of 103? seems pretty high, are they ok to take with the PWO shake? Reason I ask is I have 2 bags of dates from Evergreen and would not eat them regularly, but if they do the job after workout...