Soccer forum. Re: Economist thread.

eagle eye

Regarding this thread.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055578083

It was locked up pretty quickly. The fact of the matter is that a lot of posters who know Helix are quite concerned about this. We can't air our grievances, as a matter of fact there are a lot of posters who are afraid to say anything at all lest they too get banned.

I often disagree with Helix on football matters, actually we rarely agree, but the guy is respectful of others and is clearly very popular in the forum.

I really want to start about this moderator but thats not the point of this thread. I just want to know how we can show our support for Helix?

DSB

Agreed, ridiculous ban, and to be honest I think most of the forum have had enough of this particular mod. What happens outside this website, should not encroach into it, thats the least of the rights we should have.

mirwillbeback

DSB wrote: »

Agreed, ridiculous ban, and to be honest I think most of the forum have had enough of this particular mod. What happens outside this website, should not encroach into it, thats the least of the rights we should have.

I have been told by TWO mods of their concern, one of which I have in writing via a PM. Like a good journalist I will not reveal my sources, but if that's what mods think surely Helix has a case - one MOD got so fed up, quote " I got a ban for thanking a post, don't really post over there anymore because of her "

And another thing - on the thread where Helix argues his case, one mod is backed by another whom I know from Personal Issues forum and I feel is nothing more than a feminist, and I raised this last year with no reply.

Outrageous.

Headshot

ban is very harsh indeed

DSB

On another note it seems unfair that the posters of the soccer forum have no real say in who polices the forum. I dunno if thats a general thing throughout boards, but if alot of people are having the same issues then there is definitely something in them.

Bounty Hunter

i dot think helix being himself helped,the guy is naturally arguementative imo but as he never broke any boards rules and it happened off boards, i would think a very harsh warning and a boards rule change which would mean if done again by anyone a ban would occur would be a god way to go.

he is a good contributer on the soccer board though

mike65

Hmm read that Help Desk thread, hardly a shining example of live and let live. Or even clear thinking.

DSB users have no say regarding Mods, this is correct as you'd end up with a sort of Old West Mayoral election campaign "vote for me and you'll get absolution for one yellow card infraction every month (and a bottle of Hooch)!"

DSB

mike65 wrote: »

Hmm read that Help Desk thread, hardly a shining example of live and let live. Or even clear thinking.

Agreed, definitely hostile behaviour, but letting things from outside boards, creep into boards is a horrible precedent, if I feel like speaking ill of anyone from the boards forum off the boards forum, perhaps I don't have the right to do so, perhaps I do, depending on whats said, but it most certainly is not a boards.ie issue, and we're not in Stalinist Russia here.

My name is URL

I didn't know any details before I read this thread. Surely anonymity privs are being ignored here...?

What someone does on another site is no business of this board tbh... according to the ToS anyway (no mention of it)

Terrible bloody decision to ban him

Random

What if it happens down the pub? What if a mod and a user share the same social circle / venue / pub and one insults the other. Will this mean now the mod can ban them as well?

I don't want to take sides but I'm very interested in what precedent this sets for Boards.

DSB

mike65 wrote: »

Hmm read that Help Desk thread, hardly a shining example of live and let live. Or even clear thinking.

DSB users have no say regarding Mods, this is correct as you'd end up with a sort of Old West Mayoral election campaign "vote for me and you'll get absolution for one yellow card infraction every month (and a bottle of Hooch)!"

Ah no I'm not advocating elected mods or anything of the sort, you're dead right, it'd lead to chaos. But when it becomes clear that a mod is particularly unpopular with the posters in that forum, (I'm not saying this mod is, it could just be a few people who are very vocal about their opinions) then it definitely serves as a negative influence to the forum to have them moderating. I mean we do post in forums as a hobby after all.

Theresalwaysone

I agree with Eagle Eye and I dont often.

I'm sure a lot of the posters here agree too.

GuanYin as far as I can see, is a strict rule enforcer, this is fine and I can't fault her moderation on this front.

Unfortunately with the nature of football and the emotion involved sometimes blindly enforcing the rules is a counter-productive measure. The nanny-state, draconian measures being used in this forum are, I believe, CONTRIBUTING to the problems we have here in this forum.

Ironically, while trying to solve the forums problems I feel she is a root cause of the attitudes some poster have to the rules/authority.

I have never had a run in with her, and by all accounts, she is a fine mod but I dont thnk her style suits this particular forum.

Just my 2c. Take from it what you will but I am not trying to upset/attack GuanYin.

Ste

WhiteWashMan

eagle eye wrote: »

It was locked up pretty quickly. The fact of the matter is that a lot of posters who know Helix are quite concerned about this. We can't air our grievances, as a matter of fact there are a lot of posters who are afraid to say anything at all lest they too get banned.

to be fair, youre not banned yet are you

eagle eye wrote: »

I often disagree with Helix on football matters, actually we rarely agree, but the guy is respectful of others and is clearly very popular in the forum.

now, I have read the stuff in question, and i am a little shocked tat anyone can say that there was any respect in what was written. regardless of what you think of the personbeing written about, there was not a shred of respect in what was written. as for popularity, well, i never felt that some people were more wothy based on their popularity. in fact, given the level of stupidity i have encountered over the years, popularity simply means lowest common denominator, and generally worth keeping away from. apparently. so its been reported.....

eagle eye wrote: »

I really want to start about this moderator but thats not the point of this thread. I just want to know how we can show our support for Helix?

im sure there will be a threead about it at some stage. tis all very emotive at the moment. emotive arguments rarely solve anything. you get people posting in large font as if this proves that their point is more valid or something?!

mirwillbeback wrote: »

And another thing - on the thread where Helix argues his case, one mod is backed by another whom I know from Personal Issues forum and I feel is nothing more than a feminist, and I raised this last year with no reply.

QUOTE]

nothing more than a feminist? whats wrong with feminists?

you raised the fact that there was a feminist in the PI forum lat year?
I really dont understand what yo uare trying to say

Headshot wrote: »

ban is very harsh indeed

oh, well, you have certainly proved your point then havent you...


fact of the matter is that there is some discussion going on. there are quite a number of different items being discussed, and i have no doubt you will get your moment in the sun to shine and put your points across.
at the moment, i think the important people are trying to figure out what has happened, and what is going to happen, and who is involved.
give it a little time people.

DSB

Lack of respect or no, its nothing to do with boards.

AlmightyCushion

I really don't like the idea of banning people for something that happened on another site. If someone was to throw abuse at me on feedback could I ban them from all the forums I mod? Because that's the same thing. It's not where I'd like to see things going.

Headshot

WhiteWashMan wrote: »

oh, well, you have certainly proved your point then havent you...


.

if you cant see the point,theres no helping you

Random post about the pub was very good indeed,its out of boards state and theres no rule against it

WhiteWashMan

DSB wrote: »

Agreed, definitely hostile behaviour, but letting things from outside boards, creep into boards is a horrible precedent, if I feel like speaking ill of anyone from the boards forum off the boards forum, perhaps I don't have the right to do so, perhaps I do, depending on whats said, but it most certainly is not a boards.ie issue, and we're not in Stalinist Russia here.

but if you are using boards.ie's name to run your fantasy football league, then are you not associating yourself with the site?

and if you are associating yourself with the site, then at some stage you will be impacted by what you do under that association

mike65

DSB wrote: »

But when it becomes clear that a mod is particularly unpopular with the posters in that forum, (I'm not saying this mod is, it could just be a few people who are very vocal about their opinions) then it definitely serves as a negative influence to the forum to have them moderating.

Theresalwaysone wrote: »

Just my 2c. Take from it what you will but I am not trying to upset/attack GuanYin.

So the message is we're all scared of saying anything that could in anyway really annoy a certain mod? Just so long as we're all clear on that.

In my 8 years here Mods have rarely if ever been a cause for concern with respect to the governence of a forum and how its thought of by those that use it.

WhiteWashMan

Headshot wrote: »

if you cant see the point,theres no helping you

Random post about the pub was very good indeed,its out of boards state and theres no rule against it

rubbish. if i cant see your point, then you havent shown it to me.

thats the laziest argument I have seen in a while.

DSB

WhiteWashMan wrote: »

but if you are using boards.ie's name to run your fantasy football league, then are you not associating yourself with the site?

and if you are associating yourself with the site, then at some stage you will be impacted by what you do under that assocition

If he is in charge of the fantasy football league, fair enough, your point is valid. If he didn't then he has no accountability for an unofficial link between that page and this website.

eagle eye

WhiteWashMan wrote: »

to be fair, youre not banned yet are you

I just got banned from Soccer by a certain female mod. That smiley makes me think you know that already

Was it a wild guess, or and educated one?

DSB

mike65 wrote: »

So the message is we're all scared of saying anything that could in anyway really annoy a certain mod? Just so long as we're all clear on that.

In my 8 years here Mods have rarely if ever been a cause for concern with respect to the governence of a forum and how its thought of by those that use it.

I think you've the right message there.

DSB

eagle eye wrote: »

I just got banned from Soccer by a certain female mod. That smiley makes me think you know that already

Was it a wild guess, or and educated one?

Seriously, why?

Bounty Hunter

WhiteWashMan wrote: »

fact of the matter is that there is some discussion going on. there are quite a number of different items being discussed, and i have no doubt you will get your moment in the sun to shine and put your points across.
at the moment, i think the important people are trying to figure out what has happened, and what is going to happen, and who is involved.
give it a little time people.

that seems very dismissive of you, youll get your moment in the sun but now let the big boys decide what needs to be done etc.. only problem is you wnet passed the thinking stage and action was taken and someone was banned when they didnt break a boards rule or post on boards, this it seems a number of people object to no matter what was posted on that other site or if we even agree with it

Headshot

WhiteWashMan wrote: »

rubbish. if i cant see your point, then you havent shown it to me.

thats the laziest argument I have seen in a while.

so im presuming you support the ban

may i ask why

Time Magazine

How long until this gets locked?

Theresalwaysone

mike65 wrote: »

So the message is we're all scared of saying anything that could in anyway really annoy a certain mod? Just so long as we're all clear on that.

In my 8 years here Mods have rarely if ever been a cause for concern with respect to the governence of a forum and how its thought of by those that use it.

No that completely missed the point of why I said that.

I could be sensationalist about it and call her all manners of things but it would only serve to take away from my argument.

I think Ive put it across in reasonable terms and am not trying to get one over on this mod for anything she has done that I may disagree with on the soccer board.

eagle eye

DSB wrote: »

Seriously, why?

discussing moderation or something like that. Anyways it doesn't really belong in this thread.

WhiteWashMan

eagle eye wrote: »

I just got banned from Soccer by a certain female mod. That smiley makes me think you know that already

Was it a wild guess, or and educated one?

i rarely read the soccer forum, so no, i wasnt aware you were banned.

DSB

eagle eye wrote: »

discussing moderation or something like that. Anyways it doesn't really belong in this thread.

Probably not, but these bans are going too far. You had every right to make the post you made. Most soccer posters have no idea this thread exists, and deserve to have their opinion heard on it.

Theresalwaysone

If Eagle Eye is actually banned it has completely proven the point I made in my first post in this thread.

Helix

WhiteWashMan wrote: »

t
now, I have read the stuff in question, and i am a little shocked tat anyone can say that there was any respect in what was written. regardless of what you think of the personbeing written about, there was not a shred of respect in what was written.

that would be relevant if they were my opinions of her, i didnt go into my opinions of her aside from asking could i ban her. as explained in my second last post in the helpdesk thread, there was a bit of banter on another forum about it, users from that forum gave their opinions, i censored them and put them in a mock press release on the xpert eleven site because it was relevant to the people on that other forum who are in the league. it had nothing to do with boards, and even more importantly they werent my views and were clearly labeled as such

DSB

The Economist wrote: »

How long until this gets locked?

Doubt it will be.

Bounty Hunter

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

I really don't like the idea of banning people for something that happened on another site. If someone was to throw abuse at me on feedback could I ban them from all the forums I mod? Because that's the same thing. It's not where I'd like to see things going.

is this exactley what just happend to Eagle eye? except he didnt even throw any abuse

DSB

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

is this exactley what just happend to Eagle eye? except he didnt even throw any abuse

No, I think Eagle Eye's ban is in relation to a post made on the Villa thread, Helix being a Villa fan and a regular poster on there, can't see how its a big deal to make reference to his absence.

WhiteWashMan

Headshot wrote: »

so im presuming you support the ban

may i ask why

you have presumed incorrectly, but i am not going to have mob rule over something that is already being discussed and sorted at a different level.

there is clearly a level of support that helix has, and it looks like it is mostly from his mates. thats fine, but having an opinion becuase someone is your matesis a dangerous path to tread.
then there are people who are obviously a little worried that there is a precedence being set, and thats fine.
then there are those who would just like to complain about moderators.

me, im simply looking at it from all angles.


the site was running something under boards.ie name. that makes it a part of what happens here as far as i am concened, so yes, if someone does something stupid, i do believe they should be accountable. you commit murder in hawii,youre still on american soil my friend.
no, i do not believe there is a precedent set. if it was a completely random site, no affiliation to boards.ie, then yes, i would say its outrageous.

the post was uncalled for, petty, childish and plain old mean. regardless of what your thoughts are for a particular moderator, is it neccesary to bully them, becuase thats what that is.
so, are we to condone bullying on this site now? personally, though, i would have told helix he's a stupid cnut and got on with it. if someone has to resort to those sort of tactics, they have already lost. but it still doesnt make it right in the first place.

I dont know who banned who, or for how long, but at this stage, as i said the admins are dealing with it.

there is also th option that regardless of what you do anywhere else, if youre a total dcik, you can still be banned. i like this rule i call it the 'dont be a dcik rule' and i think it covers lots of things.

do i think he should be banned. not really. am i worried he is banned. not really. the place is probably better off without that sort of rubbish happening. is it fair, not really, but life int fair, and this isnt a democracy. I think it is important if helixis banned then the final decision come from devore, becuase at the end of the day,its his site, and if he is going to ban anyone for being a dcik, he is the man to do it.

WhiteWashMan

Helix wrote: »

and even more importantly they werent my views and were clearly labeled as such

thats just a cowardly reponse.

sorry, but that is just pathetic.

mock press release. you wrote it becuase you wanted to say a couple of things about someone, and you dont even have the balls to take reponsibility for it.

DSB

WhiteWashMan wrote: »

you have presumed incorrectly, but i am not going to have mob rule over something that is already being discussed and sorted at a different level.

there is clearly a level of support that helix has, and it looks like it is mostly from his mates. thats fine, but having an opinion becuase someone is your matesis a dangerous path to tread.
then there are people who are obviously a little worried that there is a precedence being set, and thats fine.
then there are those who would just like to complain about moderators.

me, im simply looking at it from all angles.


the site was running something under boards.ie name. that makes it a part of what happens here as far as i am concened, so yes, if someone does something stupid, i do believe they should be accountable. you commit murder in hawii,youre still on american soil my friend.
no, i do not believe there is a precedent set. if it was a completely random site, no affiliation to boards.ie, then yes, i would say its outrageous.

the post was uncalled for, petty, childish and plain old mean. regardless of what your thoughts are for a particular moderator, is it neccesary to bully them, becuase thats what that is.
so, are we to condone bullying on this site now? personally, though, i would have told helix he's a stupid cnut and got on with it. if someone has to resort to those sort of tactics, they have already lost. but it still doesnt make it right in the first place.

I dont know who banned who, or for how long, but at this stage, as i said the admins are dealing with it.

there is also th option that regardless of what you do anywhere else, if youre a total dcik, you can still be banned. i like this rule i call it the 'dont be a dcik rule' and i think it covers lots of things.

do i think he should be banned. not really. am i worried he is banned. not really. the place is probably better off without that sort of rubbish happening. is it fair, not really, but life int fair, and this isnt a democracy. I think it is important if helixis banned then the final decision come from devore, becuase at the end of the day,its his site, and if he is going to ban anyone for being a dcik, he is the man to do it.

I for one can't claim any real friendship with Helix, he seems ok enough on the Villa forum, but thats as far as it gos. I think thats the case for most.

Helix

WhiteWashMan wrote: »

the post was uncalled for, petty, childish and plain old mean. regardless of what your thoughts are for a particular moderator, is it neccesary to bully them, becuase thats what that is.
so, are we to condone bullying on this site now? personally, though, i would have told helix he's a stupid cnut and got on with it. if someone has to resort to those sort of tactics, they have already lost. but it still doesnt make it right in the first place.

i republished other peoples opinions, i didnt give any of my own about her

if this is to be a bannable offence, then anyone who posts anything remotely off center from the news media will be treated as if the post is their own opinions. in the football thread if someone posts that eamon dunphy called ronaldo a new name this week, that will be classed as personal abuse towards ronaldo by the poster, and therefore a bannable offence. if the thing posted on xpert eleven was me saying "i think so and so is a so and so" then it would be personal abuse. i posted what two other players of the game said on a different website because it was relevant to the players on that website who were in the league.

too many people seem to be under the illusion that i made up the whole thing as a dig at her. i didnt. it was relevant to players of the game on another website

WhiteWashMan wrote: »

there is also th option that regardless of what you do anywhere else, if youre a total dcik, you can still be banned. i like this rule i call it the 'dont be a dcik rule' and i think it covers lots of things.

so shall we ban the people who said it then, since they dont use boards? rather than the person who copied, pasted, and attributed the comments?

Bounty Hunter

DSB wrote: »

I for one can't claim any real friendship with Helix, he seems ok enough on the Villa forum, but thats as far as it gos. I think thats the case for most.

100% in the same for me. infact there are quite a few of us posting here who generally disagree with Helix when he poss but genuinley feel neiter himself or Eagle eye now should be banned.

Helix

WhiteWashMan wrote: »

you wrote it becuase you wanted to say a couple of things about someone, and you dont even have the balls to take reponsibility for it.

i didnt say those things though

how many times have i to say it, they were said by 2 other players and attributed as being said by 2 other players

do i want her removed from the league? absolutely, ive never made a secret of that. and im well within my rights to want her removed from it, because she has caused nothing but hassle within the league for the last few weeks

but i will absolutely NOT apologise for the opinions of anyone else, nor for reposting them somewhere that was relevant

3 bannings from soccer directly or indirectly related to it now

PHB

Are we allowed contribute to this discussion? Or will it be locked?

WhiteWashMan

Helix wrote: »

too many people seem to be under the illusion that i made up the whole thing as a dig at her. i didnt. it was relevant to players of the game on another website
?

you may need to improve your journalistic skills in that case my friend, becuase you appeared to have truely missed the mark with what you aimed for.

importnatly i think its interesting to note how many people are making complaints about a certain female moerator of the soccer forum, the person that your 'press release' was aimed at. it would seem that many of them also took a different message from what yo uwere trying to get across.
sorry, what was that message again?

Helix wrote: »

so shall we ban the people who said it then, since they dont use boards? rather than the person who copied, pasted, and attributed the comments?

how can you ban people who arent on boards.ie?

as for the copy paste thin, well, yes, you an be banned for that. becuase its called being a dcik

Time Magazine

PHB wrote: »

Are we allowed contribute to this discussion? Or will it be locked?

I for one am still waiting...

Theresalwaysone

I would also like to add that I am in no way friendly with Helix. I dont even think Ive ever had a conversation/discussion with him either in thread or otherwise.

DSB

WhiteWashMan wrote: »

you may need to improve your journalistic skills in that case my friend, becuase you appeared to have truely missed the mark with what you aimed for.

importnatly i think its interesting to note how many people are making complaints about a certain female moerator of the soccer forum, the person that your 'press release' was aimed at. it would seem that many of them also took a different message from what yo uwere trying to get across.
sorry, what was that message again?



how can you ban people who arent on boards.ie?

as for the copy paste thin, well, yes, you an be banned for that. becuase its called being a dcik

As a matter of interest, how come you don't mind posting personal abuse?

Helix

WhiteWashMan wrote: »

sorry, what was that message again?

this:

in a discussion thread about the league in question, 2 players who do not use boards posted the quotes (there are quite a few boards users using that particular site too as far as im aware), and the discussion of kicking guanyin from the league has cropped up on more than one occasion.

since there are a sizeable number of players from the league on that board, i issued a mickey take press release on xperteleven (as guanyin had instructed 2 players to do in the xpert league thread in soccer, if you remember correctly) using quotes from the thread and discussing the topic at hand. while it may not have been relevant to players who arent members of that forum, it was still relevant to a hefty number who are and who were involved in the on thread discussions

in summation, once again, the quotes were from people playing within the league (the banhammer quote was from be, as attributed), and they were about events relevant to the league

Bounty Hunter

PHB wrote: »

Are we allowed contribute to this discussion? Or will it be locked?

contribte but keep it civil, this is what feedback is for tbh, i see no reason for locking it even if it may get messy

Headshot

Theresalwaysone wrote: »

I would also like to add that I am in no way friendly with Helix. I dont even think Ive ever had a conversation/discussion with him either in thread or otherwise.

Ditto

WhiteWashMan

Helix wrote: »

3 bannings from soccer directly or indirectly related to it now

take it up with the admins.

Helix wrote: »

but i will absolutely NOT apologise for the opinions of anyone else, nor for reposting them somewhere that was relevant

i havent asked you to, not do i wish you to. iam simply sying i thik its pathetic to attack someone like that and not have the balls to take reponsibility, but that says more about you than anyone else.

Helix wrote: »

ido i want her removed from the league? absolutely, ive never made a secret of that. and im well within my rights to want her removed from it, because she has caused nothing but hassle within the league for the last few weeks

then remove her. blah blah blah. who cares.

Helix wrote: »

i didnt say those things though

yeah yeah, we know, whatever, youre a fcuking saint.

but, do i think you should be banned for what you wrote. no i dont.

Helix

and here are the original posts from that board, not by me



and my post on that board, by me