Waterford memories - Were you there?

Aquos76

Wanderer78 wrote: »

ive always found naming and shaming an odd thing, it rarely solves anything

I actually agree, but given that I was 11 at the time and Kyle was 8/9, I remember the impact this had on our lives for a short time afterwards, it was such a high profile case at the time and also that this guy even participated in the search, he doesn’t deserve any anonymity.

Wanderer78

Aquos76 wrote: »

I actually agree, but given that I was 11 at the time and Kyle was 8/9, I remember the impact this had on our lives for a short time afterwards, it was such a high profile case at the time and also that this guy even participated in the search, he doesn’t deserve any anonymity.

such crimes are incredibly disturbing and upsetting for everyone, they show us humans are capable of dreadful things towards each other, but are generally encased in extreme complexity, no doubt understandably upsetting, id imagine that becomes more so when you become a parent yourself

Quigs Snr

Aquos76 wrote: »

Why not name him, he was charged so, he doesn’t deserve anonymity, his name was Patrick Alan Hannigan

Only saw Kyles grave a couple of weeks ago and thought back to this. I actually can't believe that Hannigan wasn't murdered in prison or after he got out.... he only got about 9 years or something.

friendlyfun

Here's the video of that scumbag Hannigan leaving Waterford Court House in 1987. A crowd assembled to hurl abuse at him (and rightly so).

I found this in the RTE Archives

https://www.rte.ie/archives/collections/news/21255204-murdered-boy-man-charged/

Asdfgh2020

Speaking about where were you when, have any of you seen yourself in the attached.....?


https://waterford-news.ie/2020/04/13/waterford-responds-to-one-of-irish-footballs-greatest-days/

Wanderer78

Asdfgh2020 wrote:

Speaking about where were you when, have any of you seen yourself in the attached.....?

Jesus, what an incredible time to be alive, it was electric

Flow Motion

Asdfgh2020 wrote: »

Speaking about where were you when, have any of you seen yourself in the attached.....?


https://waterford-news.ie/2020/04/13/waterford-responds-to-one-of-irish-footballs-greatest-days/

Great stuff. Ive spotted myself hanging out the back window of a car passing the old rogue! Think I was only 16 at the time. So much for health n safety eh? Nobody cared back then just enjoyed the craic and carefree days. I'd never have realised that there was so many cars about and the noise. Its like something you would see on the continent.

dzilla

Quigs Snr wrote: »

Only saw Kyles grave a couple of weeks ago and thought back to this. I actually can't believe that Hannigan wasn't murdered in prison or after he got out.... he only got about 9 years or something.

is he still about?

PTH2009

Never heard of that Murder and Patrick Hannigan

Very sad

dzilla

PTH2009 wrote: »

Never heard of that Murder and Patrick Hannigan

Very sad

Me neither until reading this thread recently. shocked at this tbh

friendlyfun

dzilla wrote: »

Me neither until reading this thread recently. shocked at this tbh

I wasn't born when this happened but growing up I always heard about it. Feels sinister considering me.and my friends used to hang out in those fields when we were 12/13. Absolutely horrific. Some people really are monsters.

dzilla

friendlyfun wrote: »

I wasn't born when this happened but growing up I always heard about it. Feels sinister considering me.and my friends used to hang out in those fields when we were 12/13. Absolutely horrific. Some people really are monsters.

Yeah same here would have been a toddler then and would have knocked about up there in my teens, again get a bit of a shudder now at the thought of it.

Flow Motion

dzilla wrote: »

Yeah same here would have been a toddler then and would have knocked about up there in my teens, again get a bit of a shudder now at the thought of it.

Makes my skin crawl remembering it. Would have been about 12. Lived in Marian park which wasnt that far away. Loads of kids used to play on the big green down by Hillview. It was a rude scary introduction to the evil side of life. To think a monster like that was lurking in the area. Took a few days for the Gardai to catch him IIRC. The place was deserted till they caught him. Nobody was allowed outside the house.

Bhoy1967

Flow Motion wrote: »

Makes my skin crawl remembering it. Would have been about 12. Lived in Marian park which wasnt that far away. Loads of kids used to play on the big green down by Hillview. It was a rude scary introduction to the evil side of life. To think a monster like that was lurking in the area. Took a few days for the Gardai to catch him IIRC. The place was deserted till they caught him. Nobody was allowed outside the house.

Where exactly did it happen and was the poor lad found in the same spot? Thought it was up around Mt. Sion's pitches - it really was the time innocence was lost in Waterford.

I believe the Gardaí were very suss of him and lead him along. Hard to comprehend that someone so evil could be left back into society again after something so gruesome!

Motivator

Flow Motion wrote: »

Makes my skin crawl remembering it. Would have been about 12. Lived in Marian park which wasnt that far away. Loads of kids used to play on the big green down by Hillview. It was a rude scary introduction to the evil side of life. To think a monster like that was lurking in the area. Took a few days for the Gardai to catch him IIRC. The place was deserted till they caught him. Nobody was allowed outside the house.

The guards knew who it was fairly early on, he went back to the scene a couple of times and was hanging around. They just had to wait to pull him in. The fact he went to the pub for a work do after he murdered the young lad tells you everything you need to know about what kind of an individual he was/is.

PTH2009

How didn't he get life for it ?Heard he's still around town to this day

Probably got a new identity

killbillvol2

PTH2009 wrote: »

How didn't he get life for it ?Heard he's still around town to this day

Probably got a new identity

How the fukc could you get a new identity and come back to live somewhere the size of Waterford? FFS.

Wanderer2010

killbillvol2 wrote: »

How the fukc could you get a new identity and come back to live somewhere the size of Waterford? FFS.

Ha ha great point. Literally everyone in Waterford knows everyone else. And even if you dont know the face of a chap, a quick "whos your man" will activate the single degree of separation in this city and you can find out who anyone is from knowing their neighbour/dog/brother and postman!

StringerBell

PTH2009 wrote: »

How didn't he get life for it ?Heard he's still around town to this day

Probably got a new identity

Think he was mentally ill, or that was definitely what I've heard since from my mams friends and people since when they would talk about what happened and the details of the murder itself and the aftermath.

No way a new identity would do you any good in Waterford btw, place is too small. I guess his age probably played into his sentencing too

Wanderer78

StringerBell wrote:

Think he was mentally ill, or that was definitely what I've heard since from my mams friends and people since when they would talk about what happened and the details of the murder itself and the aftermath.

You ll find most that commit such crimes have complex psychological issues, and sometimes victims to

jimbojazz

From what I know, he started a new life in Wales, and was doing well, while his victim's life was snatched away.

But there's a few lads around town who have committed similar crimes and are roaming freely, one in particular.

friendlyfun

jimbojazz wrote: »

From what I know, he started a new life in Wales, and was doing well, while his victim's life was snatched away.

But there's a few lads around town who have committed similar crimes and are roaming freely, one in particular.

Probably a lot of sick freaks who were in the church who got away with murder too because of the power they they had.

jimbojazz

friendlyfun wrote: »

Probably a lot of sick freaks who were in the church who got away with murder too because of the power they they had.

Nope, not who I’m on about

Wanderer78

friendlyfun wrote: »

Probably a lot of sick freaks who were in the church who got away with murder too because of the power they they had.

...or where the psychologically unwell ended up!

Flow Motion

jimbojazz wrote: »

From what I know, he started a new life in Wales, and was doing well, while his victim's life was snatched away.

What a crazy random world we inhabit eh? How could anyone who committed such a vile crime to take a child's life be considered "rehabilitated" after a term in prison. That he was subsequently released and was able to start afresh albeit in another country must rub salt in the deceased family's wounds. The world can be a cold cruel place.

Wanderer78

Flow Motion wrote: »

What a crazy random world we inhabit eh? How could anyone who committed such a vile crime to take a child's life be considered "rehabilitated" after a term in prison. That he was subsequently released and was able to start afresh albeit in another country must rub salt in the deceased family's wounds. The world can be a cold cruel place.

very few are truly rehabilitated upon release, its a dreadfully failing system

Motivator

jimbojazz wrote: »

From what I know, he started a new life in Wales, and was doing well, while his victim's life was snatched away.

But there's a few lads around town who have committed similar crimes and are roaming freely, one in particular.

I know of a few actual murderers who are in around town but not aware of any child killers. Is there one or more than one in town who are out free? One particular bad egg who served time for murder can regularly be seen walking down around the park.

jimbojazz

Motivator wrote: »

I know of a few actual murderers who are in around town but not aware of any child killers. Is there one or more than one in town who are out free? One particular bad egg who served time for murder can regularly be seen walking down around the park.

I know of one, wandering freely, and just as horrific as Kyle’s

bullpost

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjsQ0f5ffGw

80s Waterford - Looks a bit grim in places. Football hooligans and open water swimming (long before it was trendy) feature.

Grim was the right word for it and you should ask yourself, has anything changed?

Wanderer78

Oscar Madison wrote:

Grim was the right word for it and you should ask yourself, has anything changed?

Waterford has radically changed over the decades, and it looks like its gonna radically change again over the coming years

Wanderer78

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Waterford has radically changed over the decades, and it looks like its gonna radically change again over the coming years

It has changed radically but in a negative way!

I personally don't see a lot of positive progression to speak about.

In my eyes it's very similar to 70's Ireland/Waterford.

What am I honestly missing here?

Wanderer78

Oscar Madison wrote:

It has changed radically but in a negative way!

I'd have to somewhat disagree there, but also agree to a point, there's certainly more availability of income amongst the general population. most didn't have a pot to pi$$ in, in the 70/80's, we were an extremely poor country back then, but since then, elements of our society have improved greatly, but this is coming at a price, and its slowly catching up on us. If we don't radically change things now, we ll all end up in serious trouble, as the methods and beliefs that brought us this new found wealth, are starting to collapse.

You can see from the footage posted, Waterford was very run down back then, high unemployment, very few options for people, now the place looks far better in ways, of course we still have issues, but at least people have options, there are far more employers in the region, and it looks like many more are on the way soon. so yea, we re doing much better now, but I do fear for our future, but we re not alone, everyone's future is deeply uncertain right now, but I have faith in our young, we have done exceptionally well during this period, wit has expanded greatly over the decades, so to have other educational and training facilities, and our young are ready for these uncertainties, and they're no fools either, many know exactly what's needed to be done, but it's critical us older folks support them in every way possible, because it's everyone's future

But you're talking at a more national level more so than a local one?

We still have high levels of unemployment & homelessness!

Yes we have had a greater level of migration into the country or county

and whether that's a good thing or a bad thing I don't know!

When I think back to the 70's looking through a child's eyes I remember

the Iron Foundry, Waterford Crystal, ACEC, Kilmeadan Creamery,

The Chipboard and loads more big industries in Waterford.

They're all gone now!

Big employers is what this county needs, not airports or third level institutions!

Wanderer78

Oscar Madison wrote:

Big employers is what this county needs, not airports or third level institutions!

We actually need an astonishing amount of things, but we actually have the people here to do it, from locals to foreigners. It's always important to remember, small to medium sized businesses are in fact where the majority are employed, having an economy, in particular a local one, based on a couple of big employers, is extremely dangerous, as they have a tenancy of up and leaving when it suits them, and we re left with a black hole. We have a tenancy to fall over ourselves trying to attracted big employers, even when the above facts are the case, yes these employers are critical to the whole picture, but.....

Another critical element in these developments is public services and infrastructure, including those you have mentioned, all of the above is needed for a better future.

The issues you have mentioned are in fact critical in many ways, these are our issues going forward, that must be addressed immediately, we ve work to be doing

Wanderer78

Wanderer78 wrote: »

We actually need an astonishing amount of things, but we actually have the people here to do it, from locals to foreigners. It's always important to remember, small to medium sized businesses are in fact where the majority are employed, having an economy, in particular a local one, based on a couple of big employers, is extremely dangerous, as they have a tenancy of up and leaving when it suits them, and we re left with a black hole. We have a tenancy to fall over ourselves trying to attracted big employers, even when the above facts are the case, yes these employers are critical to the whole picture, but.....

Another critical element in these developments is public services and infrastructure, including those you have mentioned, all of the above is needed for a better future.

The issues you have mentioned are in fact critical in many ways, these are our issues going forward, that must be addressed immediately, we ve work to be doing

Big companies or big employers bring in so much!

I previously worked with a company no longer with us but the amount of

business that it generated within the local economy was immense!

Small businesses/companies can disappear without missing them so much

but larger companies can carry so much clout and are good for an area!

Wanderer78

Oscar Madison wrote:

Big companies or big employers bring in so much!

... But they can and do also take so much to!

There's clear evidence now to show, major employers truly have a tendancy to up and leave when suits, this has occurred globally, forever, what is left behind truly are black holes. There's also clear evidence that many of these employers pay very little tax in comparison to citizens, including sme's, the game is all a bit one sided, this is unsustainable, and is now causing serious issues at the local level to the international level, and everything in between. large, medium and small employers all play a critical role in a functioning economy and society, all with their own issues and faults, but all equally important, but there's currently little or no acceptance of this equality of need, as there's definite biases , and this is glaringly obvious now

Asdfgh2020

Oscar Madison wrote: »

But you're talking at a more national level more so than a local one?

We still have high levels of unemployment & homelessness!

Yes we have had a greater level of migration into the country or county

and whether that's a good thing or a bad thing I don't know!

When I think back to the 70's looking through a child's eyes I remember

the Iron Foundry, Waterford Crystal, ACEC, Kilmeadan Creamery,

The Chipboard and loads more big industries in Waterford.

They're all gone now!

Big employers is what this county needs, not airports or third level institutions!

Have you not heard of bauch and Lomb, Genzyme/Sanofi, west pharma, teva and I’m sure there are plenty more.......I think Bausch and Lomb is bigggest employer in south east at moment.....

killbillvol2

Asdfgh2020 wrote: »

Have you not heard of bauch and Lomb, Genzyme/Sanofi, west pharma, teva and I’m sure there are plenty more.......I think Bausch and Lomb is bigggest employer in south east at moment.....

They don't fit in with the hysterical narrative.

Wanderer78

killbillvol2 wrote: »

They don't fit in with the hysterical narrative.

to be fair, the poster is raising some serious concerns, and they are right to be extremely concerned about them

killbillvol2

Wanderer78 wrote: »

to be fair, the poster is raising some serious concerns, and they are right to be extremely concerned about them

i'm pretty sure that pre-pandemic there was more employment in Waterford than in the 80s. Ranting on about big factories that are gone when there's a broad range of high value employment is hysteria.

Wanderer78

killbillvol2 wrote: »

i'm pretty sure that pre-pandemic there was more employment in Waterford than in the 80s. Ranting on about big factories that are gone when there's a broad range of high value employment is hysteria.

the poster is actually deeply concerned about our major societal issues, homelessness etc etc, and theyre right, but we do have some great employers, as mentioned, we re doing dramatically better in many ways, in terms on employment options etc, but theres something seriously going wrong at a societal level

killbillvol2

Wanderer78 wrote: »

the poster is actually deeply concerned about our major societal issues, homelessness etc etc, and theyre right, but we do have some great employers, as mentioned, we re doing dramatically better in many ways, in terms on employment options etc, but theres something seriously going wrong at a societal level

Indeed. But toning down the rhetoric would get the point across just as well.

azimuth17

killbillvol2 wrote: »

i'm pretty sure that pre-pandemic there was more employment in Waterford than in the 80s. Ranting on about big factories that are gone when there's a broad range of high value employment is hysteria.

Absolutely agree. Most of the industries mentioned were low value sunset industries whose time had come anyway. Big loss was Waterford Crystal and that's a tale that has been told by John Hearne (not SF) in his history of the place. Biggest employer now is UHW with nearly 2400 people there currently which is far more important in longevity and educational input.. I understand that pre pandemic there were more people employed in Waterford than ever, but a high number commuting. Unemployment was largely in well known pockets of disadvantage centred on the older parts of the city. Employment has also changed from 65/35 industrial/services to 60/40 in favour of services I believe. This probably reflects the closure of Waterford Glass more than anything else.

Wanderer78

azimuth17 wrote: »

Absolutely agree. Most of the industries mentioned were low value sunset industries whose time had come anyway. Big loss was Waterford Crystal and that's a tale that has been told by John Hearne (not SF) in his history of the place. Biggest employer now is UHW with nearly 2400 people there currently which is far more important in longevity and educational input.. I understand that pre pandemic there were more people employed in Waterford than ever, but a high number commuting. Unemployment was largely in well known pockets of disadvantage centred on the older parts of the city. Employment has also changed from 65/35 industrial/services to 60/40 in favour of services I believe. This probably reflects the closure of Waterford Glass more than anything else.

its more of a global problem than anything else, we re in serious trouble with it, our past approaches will fail to address this

friendlyfun

I was talking to taxi driver this morning about the German lad who used to swim across the river suir. I saw him before. Anyone know who I'm talking about?

Wanderer78

friendlyfun wrote: »

I was talking to taxi driver this morning about the German lad who used to swim across the river suir. I saw him before. Anyone know who I'm talking about?

the german fella is well known alright, was a lecture in wit so i believe

PTH2009

Wanderer78 wrote: »

the german fella is well known alright, was a lecture in wit so i believe

Jesus that's surprising given his swimming antics, fair play to him

Yeah tis a tough time atm when you think about all the industries that have closed here. Waterford glass sounded like an easy enough place to get into back in the day and you could have a job for life and thats without having a good educational background which is sadly the way it is today and of course 'Who you know'

StringerBell

jimbojazz wrote: »

I know of one, wandering freely, and just as horrific as Kyle’s

So you keep saying, but really without some kind of detail or description or whatever it doesn't really amount to much in all fairness.

I know a load of ***** too though if thats any use? Horrible sick bastards who are actually thought of as pillars of the community - couldn't be further from the truth but such is life.

Wanderer78

PTH2009 wrote:

Yeah tis a tough time atm when you think about all the industries that have closed here. Waterford glass sounded like an easy enough place to get into back in the day and you could have a job for life and thats without having a good educational background which is sadly the way it is today and of course 'Who you know'

I think employment can still be a who you know situation sometimes, we do have a lot of diversity in regards employers here which is great, but job precariousness is a serious problem now, particularly for your generation, this won't end well