Job in IT

Kev_ps3

Im 23 and I would like to work in the IT industry. What kind of job could I get without having a degree? I went to college a few years ago but dropped out because I didnt get on with the course. Since then Ive done a few FAS courses - ECDL & Mouse. I really dont want to spend 4 years in college, I just want to start working in IT.
What kind of jobs can I expect to get? Im not looking for huge wages btw

3DataModem

Kev_ps3 wrote: »

Im 23 and I would like to work in the IT industry. What kind of job could I get without having a degree? I went to college a few years ago but dropped out because I didnt get on with the course. Since then Ive done a few FAS courses - ECDL & Mouse. I really dont want to spend 4 years in college, I just want to start working in IT.
What kind of jobs can I expect to get? Im not looking for huge wages btw

I recommend seeking out jobs in Quality Assurance (i.e. testing). It's a great way into the IT industry.

feylya

First level IT helpdesk would probably be your starting point.

kippy

Depends to be honest.
ECDL and mouse are not great things to be doing to get into IT. But then again it depends on what areas of IT you want to get into.
Programming....
Network Support
End User Support
Consultancy.....
Teaching.......
And others.

If you want to get into end user support, network support,consultancy, in that order without spending time in college you'll do well to get into a company as MOST look for college experience.
If however you have somethings like, CompTIA network+,A+, a couple of Microsoft exams behind you (maybe even a cisco one or two) {all of which are also available through FAS} you may have a chance.
Would also be worth while doing a bit of "voluntary work" with schools, charities (I hear the volvo ocean race are looking for IT colunteers for example) to build up your CV.
Its gonna be tough to get in without a college paper of some kind (although to be fair almost all courses in college dont prepare you in any way for a job in IT support, but employers in the main still seem to prefer it, especially in the current job market where they have their choice of people).

Best of luck, if you do get in some where, my advice would be, especially in your early career, not to remain somewhere too long, no more than 2 years, move around, different technologies, ways of working etc....
The programmers an others with different experiences will have their own advice for you

Kippy

Milkey Bar Kid

I work in I.T and might be able to get you a job as 1st level tech support . You will start off with €19000 pa but its a starting point for you

Kev_ps3

Thanks for that info lads. Milkey bar kid pm sent..

The_Conductor

Without a qualification or relevant experience, you're looking at coming in at the very bottom and over time (years) working your way up (probably gaining qualifications en route).

When I finished college (over 10 years ago), there were no jobs going anywhere (it was well before the boom times). I initially got a customer service job in a call centre, it was soul destroying, but it paid the rent. After a few months I persuaded them to allow me to progress into Level 1 technical support, despite not having any qualifications in the area. Over the next two years- I was promoted to be team leader, and did a grad dip in IT in the evenings and at the weekends. After 3 years a vacancy of technical specialist arose- which entailed a series of technical exams before you graduated to interview stage. I applied, and was successful and became the technical specialist.

I then took a detour into a job where I could make use of the experiences and qualifications I gained during my undergrad degree- which was very enjoyable, and something I was very fond of. I completed a second undergrad degree in computer science at this time. My job title is now 'Systems Analyst'- which largely entails software testing, programming, design work etc.

Be aware that without relevant experience, you will go in at the bottom, and it will entail hard work- but it is very possible to eventually move into virtually any area.

Stheno

smccarrick wrote: »

Without a qualification or relevant experience, you're looking at coming in at the very bottom and over time (years) working your way up (probably gaining qualifications en route).

When I finished college (over 10 years ago), there were no jobs going anywhere (it was well before the boom times). I initially got a customer service job in a call centre, it was soul destroying, but it paid the rent. After a few months I persuaded them to allow me to progress into Level 1 technical support, despite not having any qualifications in the area. Over the next two years- I was promoted to be team leader, and did a grad dip in IT in the evenings and at the weekends. After 3 years a vacancy of technical specialist arose- which entailed a series of technical exams before you graduated to interview stage. I applied, and was successful and became the technical specialist.

I then took a detour into a job where I could make use of the experiences and qualifications I gained during my undergrad degree- which was very enjoyable, and something I was very fond of. I completed a second undergrad degree in computer science at this time. My job title is now 'Systems Analyst'- which largely entails software testing, programming, design work etc.

Be aware that without relevant experience, you will go in at the bottom, and it will entail hard work- but it is very possible to eventually move into virtually any area.

+1 I'd much the same experience as smcarrick, 12 years ago I started out doing first line tech support for end users, then become a second level specialist, then a teamleader, then moved into Service Management, got some professional qualifications along the way and am shortly starting a degree part time.

It is hard work starting out though, and you do have to be prepared to study. Imo anyone who wants to work and do well in IT needs to be aware and comfortable with continuous learning, no matter what area you work in, there are always new technologies/practices coming out and you need to keep up, or you'll end up failing behind.

FAS do an excellent course in IT Support, it lasts a year and you end up with CompTIA qualifications, it's pretty good overall in terms of the content, and includes sixteen weeks work experience with an IT Department.

I'd someone apply to my company for the work experience element as you have to have that arranged as a pre-requisite to getting on the course, there was about 90 applicants for 30 places on the course, and as well as having to arrange the work experience, there were interviews and an aptitude test as part of the selection criteria.

It might be worthwhile your looking into it, I'll see if I can find the name of it in work tomorrow.

Kev_ps3

Ok thanks again lads. Im finishing up a 1 year basic IT course soon and will be looking for a job. Seems 1st level Tech Support is something I should look at. I might go on another course if I cant find anything. That FAS course you mentioned nouggatti sounds interesting.

kippy

Theres a very practical (well as practical as you can get in college) course they do in some of the IT's. I did it in the GMIT. It is an 18 month course (6 months of which are work placement) you get a certificate in "IT Support".
See here for more info, also options to do diploma and degree. Would recommend it for support type roles. http://www.gotocollege.ie/search.html?op=showcourse&row_id=20886
Again, it depends on your interests and situation what you can do.
With most of these careers, college education or not, you'll have to work your way up from the bottom or close to it, without relevant experience.

NullZer0

Milkey Bar Kid wrote: »

I work in I.T and might be able to get you a job as 1st level tech support . You will start off with €19000 pa but its a starting point for you

I don't mean to disrespect anyone but a first level support role is worth more than that.

Don't let people ride you!

kippy

iRock wrote: »

I don't mean to disrespect anyone but a first level support role is worth more than that.

Don't let people ride you!

Its not really..... maybe 22000 but not much more.

The_Conductor

iRock wrote: »

I don't mean to disrespect anyone but a first level support role is worth more than that.

Don't let people ride you!

Its a job- and jobs are difficult enough to find in the current climate. For entry level support jobs- there is no expectation that staff will remain in the job for any protracted period of time- the norm in some call centres is a 200% staff turnover at level 1 support. Training costs have to be factored into the recompense for staff- and most people do use it as a learning experience, that they can put towards bigger and better things. I survived level one support for a couple of years- thats far and away the exception, rather than the norm though.

For someone without experience or qualifications- its a job where they will gain experience, and at some point in the future when prospects are brighter- it will stand to them.

Don't automaticallky turn it down, based on headline salary......

Milkey Bar Kid

go to jobs.ie CPL pay 19000 .I know because i work there

Milkey Bar Kid

I dont want to sound rude but that what they pay for english speakers. If you have a second language you get paid more as they do tech support for companies around the world

Milkey Bar Kid

I got promoted in Ten months as i started with no tech experience but had a great team leader and good coaches

NullZer0

Milkey Bar Kid wrote: »

go to jobs.ie CPL pay 19000 .I know because i work there

I contract under CPL myself. I don't earn huge money but its alot more than that. Don't undersell yourself.

kippy

iRock wrote: »

I contract under CPL myself. I don't earn huge money but its alot more than that. Don't undersell yourself.

Can I ask you how long you've been doing it, what experience and qualifications you have and what part of the country you work in?

Believe me 19k in a first level support job is nothing strange, dependent on your qualifications etc etc.

Stheno

kippy wrote: »

Its not really..... maybe 22000 but not much more.

+1 especially on a helpdesk which is literally doing catch and dispatch, all you are is a glorified customer service agent.

The difference being that in any decent company you'll have them investing in training and upskilling you so you can further your career.

NullZer0

Okay, I have just over 3 years experience.

When I started I worked for a well known multinational in Dublin. I started on good money and worked there for 3 months. I left there and got a job as a network administrator for a substantial pay rise - I've moved twice since.

When I started, I had nothing but my own knowledge of networking/software (my hardware support leaves much to be desired!) that I aquired over the previous five years mainly from hanging out on IRC channels!

Maybe I was just lucky.
For me though... its not about money... unfortunately $$$ is a necessary evil at the moment.

I'm still not where I want to be... but I enjoy my current job and I'm getting where I want to go

mickman

does anyone stay in IT for life, im in it now for 10 yrs as a sys admin, im very well looked after but am feeling a bit empty recently

The_Conductor

mickman wrote: »

does anyone stay in IT for life, im in it now for 10 yrs as a sys admin, im very well looked after but am feeling a bit empty recently

Was a tech spec, have also been a forester, a financial auditor, a scientific proofreader, a software localizer, a university demonstrator (botany), and am now a systems analyst.

Beat that for different types of jobs......

TheLoc

3DataModem wrote: »

I recommend seeking out jobs in Quality Assurance (i.e. testing). It's a great way into the IT industry.

[/quote]First level IT helpdesk would probably be your starting point. [/quote]


I have a degree in IT and 2 years experience and I couldn't get these jobs. by 1st level IT helpdesk I presume you mean a call center. thats the only way you'll get into IT with no qualification.

the_syco

Milkey Bar Kid wrote: »

go to jobs.ie CPL pay 19000 .I know because i work there

Actually, they're now paying new recruits €18,500... because they can.

Civilian_Target

I started as QA in 2004 for peanuts, finished university and got my qualificaitons and was a developer by 2007. It can work, but you've got to be good and you've got to ask for it.

And realisicly, you have to have some sort of certifications, a one year intensive university course is a good idea.

testicle

iRock wrote: »

I don't mean to disrespect anyone but a first level support role is worth more than that.

Don't let people ride you!

And this is exactly why this country is in the shit.

The_Conductor

First level support may be worth more than 20k- the fact of the matter is that the going rate is below this- and there are competent candidates willing to accept this salary (based on the assumption on everyone's part that they are only likely to stay a relatively short period of time- and its a defacto apprenticeship- where they are learning their trade.

I've been there and done it- believe you me, I wouldn't consider doing the job for 40k, much less 20k- but it is something I had to do to get where I am today. Call it an apprenticeship, or a stepping stone on the road to where you aspire to be- fact is if you don't accept the going rate- there is a list of candidates out there who are more than willing to do.

fguihen

Kev_ps3 wrote: »

I just want to start working in IT.

Really?? IT is soul destroying. Cant find it at the mo, but theres a survey out there somewhere showing that out of all the areas to work over 90% of IT employees hate their job's.

While you still have options, see if you can pick something that will make you happy, and enjoy going to work every day, over something that may be slightly more reliable, but will ultimately age you before your time and make you as cynical as Victor Meldrew by the age of 25.

mickman

fguihen - what a stupid comment from you. IT is only soul destroying for people who never had the interest / aptitude in the first place. IT offers challenging , rewarding and well paid careers

fguihen

Please dont referr to me as or my view stupid. I am very capiable at performing my job in IT, or any other IT job thrown my way, with the appropriate training.

Im simply letting the OP know that for the Majority, IT does not provide the satisfaction you talk about.

Now, before you get annoyed again, i said "the majority". This means there are plenty of people such as your good self who enjoy working in the field.

As I know many folks who are not happy in this field my opinion, and post is just as valid as any other in this thread. Besides, this is a public forum, if you dont like other people sharing their views, then your in the wrong place im afraid.

mickman

well why do you do it if its so soul destroying

fguihen

Electricity, accomodation, food, heat etc isnt free friend. And in the current climate, switching job's is not an option.

Im just saying what I could have done with hearing when I chose IT. AFAIK at the time, IT was where you HAD to be, with all teachers and grown ups in general had us believing this.

It would have been nice to have a bit of balance thrown into the mix, especially from someone who worked in the field.

Tom Dunne

fguihen wrote: »

Really?? IT is soul destroying. Cant find it at the mo, but theres a survey out there somewhere showing that out of all the areas to work over 90% of IT employees hate their job's.

While I wouldn't go so far as to say your opinion is stupid, I would really like to see that survey, especially to see what type of people, plus what area of IT it refers to. I would also be interested to hear who paid for the survey, i.e. would it be somebody with perhaps a vested interest in getting people to move jobs. Say for example, a recruitment website?

To say that 90% of a workforce hate their jobs is, I believe, somewhat of a stretch.

fguihen

Am doing a search for it now. yea, validity of the survey would be good to see. I just remember it, as from my view, knowing the people i know and their attitude toward IT, it looked as if it could be plausable.

Tom Dunne

fguihen wrote: »

Am doing a search for it now. yea, validity of the survey would be good to see. I just remember it, as from my view, knowing the people i know and their attitude toward IT, it looked as if it could be plausable.

If the survey was of call-center workers, with less than 1 years experience, I wouldn't doubt it for a minute.

If, however, it was on the general IT populace, I would find it very difficult to believe. Hence my wondering who actually paid for the survey.

OT: I read a similar survey/study only last week where it was shown that chewing gum in class improved marks by a certain percentage. The sponsor of the study? Wrigleys. Go figure.

NullZer0

It depends on the person.

To be honest, I have no time for anyone that works in IT to "pay the bills" only.

I wouldn't be in it for the money (good thing I'm not too!)

AARRRGH

IT is a huge area. Saying people don't like working in IT is like saying people don't like working in "business". It really depends on what you're doing.

I've worked in a call centre doing tech support, in localisation, in software testing, and in development. Although both tech support and development are "IT", they have nothing in common - neither the hours, nor the work, nor the wages, nor how you're treated, etc.

I don't doubt that a lot of people working within IT hate computers and hate their job, but you rarely see people leave the industry.

Personally, I want to head in the direction of computer security. The devious aspect of that area suits my personality, and trying to break stuff is fun! So all you have to do is find an area of IT you like, and do whatever you have to do to get there. Whether this means getting expensive certifications or working for free or writing a paper to get your name out there...

mark renton

I missed the survey, must have been done outside IT sector by business studies student who couldnt be arsed actually carrying out the survey

add me to the list - me loves IT

and while 19k is not rare for first level support that doesnt make it right, there is a lot of skill required to solve IT issues, even first level

TheTubes

I work in IT and I love it.
I'm a developer.
sometimes I go home and write code just for fun.

mickman

that is a bit nerdy in fairness

i too work in IT and like it, i wudnt say i love it but i get well paid for doing very little and can spend as much time as i want during the day following my other pursuits.

mark renton

mickman wrote: »

that is a bit nerdy in fairness

i too work in IT and like it, i wudnt say i love it but i get well paid for doing very little and can spend as much time as i want during the day following my other pursuits.

A week labouring on a building site would soon turn your like of IT into a love of IT

mickman

i believe it would indeed. i reliase i am very lucky in this economic climate. we often give out but its great to have a job

mark renton

mickman wrote: »

that is a bit nerdy in fairness

I also thought that was nerdy - then I realised when NTL asked me did I want wireless broadband installed I replied "never, theres nothing like having a bit of Cat 5 around the house" :eek:

mickman

ha ha

big_show

john47832 wrote: »

A week labouring on a building site would soon turn your like of IT into a love of IT

QFT


At that at the moment to get a few bob, being a graduate sucks

FruitLover

iRock wrote: »

I don't mean to disrespect anyone but a first level support role is worth more than that.

I think someone with zero qualifications or experience would be lucky to get a job in IT at all, particularly in the current economic climate, and 19K is not bad for someone in such a position. Anyway, anyone who's turns out to actually be good at this kind of role tends to get raises/promoted fairly quickly.

fguihen wrote: »

theres a survey out there somewhere showing that out of all the areas to work over 90% of IT employees hate their job's.

Close to 90% of the people I've had to deal with in the IT field have no business being in it in the first place IMO. If I had to work in a field I had no passion for, I'm sure I'd hate my job too.

mickman wrote: »

does anyone stay in IT for life, im in it now for 10 yrs as a sys admin, im very well looked after but am feeling a bit empty recently

Of course! As already mentioned, IT's a huge area (or rather, a huge collection of vastly differing areas). If I start to get sick of networking/security, I'll most likely start moving into coding or more sysadmin stuff. WTF else are you gonna do, pack it all up and be a dentist??

TaxiManMartin

I graduated from DCU CA last summer and its impossible to find a job in IT.
I ended up buying a taxi plate to tide me over til i get an IT job.
Theres good money in taxis, despite what you might hear, but where i really want to be is IT.

Im a bit sick that i spent 4 years and got a 2.1 and cant even get into IT.

Whats the best way in?

kippy

I graduated from DCU CA last summer and its impossible to find a job in IT.
I ended up buying a taxi plate to tide me over til i get an IT job.
Theres good money in taxis, despite what you might hear, but where i really want to be is IT.

Im a bit sick that i spent 4 years and got a 2.1 and cant even get into IT.

Whats the best way in?

What type of jobs are you applying for? (Specifics please)
What area are you interested in?
Have you had any interviews?
Have you any IT experience outside of college.....

The_Conductor

TaxiManMartin wrote: »

Whats the best way in?

There isn't any magic bullet.
Experience is considered far more important than qualifications- qualifications may get you the interview- but experience will get you the job.

I'd suggest taking temp jobs- anything at all in the IT or customer services arena- and try using these jobs as a stepping stone to get into IT.

Well done on your 2.1, but unfortunately you will need to back it up with hard graft to succeed in the industry. The opportunities of the past few years are unfortunately few and far between.......

Jumpy

mickman wrote: »

that is a bit nerdy in fairness

i too work in IT and like it, i wudnt say i love it but i get well paid for doing very little and can spend as much time as i want during the day following my other pursuits.

NERDY?!

THIS. IS. JAVAAAAAAAAAA

*kicks*

TaxiManMartin

smccarrick wrote: »

There isn't any magic bullet.
Experience is considered far more important than qualifications- qualifications may get you the interview- but experience will get you the job.

I'd suggest taking temp jobs- anything at all in the IT or customer services arena- and try using these jobs as a stepping stone to get into IT.

Well done on your 2.1, but unfortunately you will need to back it up with hard graft to succeed in the industry. The opportunities of the past few years are unfortunately few and far between.......

Speak of the devil. I Just got an offer today and accepted it. Starting Monday.
Its only €35k, I kind of expected more, but since i do the taxiing at night i can combine that and get over €70k. Thats a major weight off my mind.