Irish small caps

EyesLeft

So say you had just sold your SUN shares, at a terrible loss, but still not as bad as feared and you thought to use this money to spread a bit of love over a handfull of ISEQ small caps, many of which are down 80, 90 percent, which ones would you choose?

MrMatisse

I like Datalex, valued at not much more than the cash it has in the bank and its underlying business is making money, with new clients coming on stream this year.

As will irish small caps though it appears to be very illiquid, one for the long haul! and a small company which adds to the risk.

( Not familiar with the rules in this forum but just to note i do not have any current holding or connection with this company)

EyesLeft

Thanks; I'll add Datalex to the list. It does, however, lack the massive discount that some of the other small caps are showing, well, I know, down 60 odd percent would normally be a big discount, but are all the down-90-percent small-caps doomed, or are there any that people expect to return to something close to their former valuations?

EyesLeft

Really-Stressed: I was looking at Datalex a bit; it writes software for airlines, seeing as whats happening to airlines I am surprised it has held up as long as it has. Is it managing to get new business during the downturn? Their AGM is today as well I see, now I don't know whether to punt now or wait.

I am gutted too that I didn't get some Newcourt on Tuesday, if my Sun share sale had cleared quicker I would have done and its doubled since, though, I know, that doesn't mean I would or even could have sold at that price.

JAMM222

INM
very cheap at .24 they were over € 3.50 just over a year ago and now that O Brien has 3 of his men on the board i reckon things will change, he has taken half a billion hit so i think he will be trying to make some of his money back.

EyesLeft

I actually have some INM I got at .20; what about Kenmare?

JAMM222

not sure about kenmare dont know too much about them but i reckon Fyffes might have a bit of value in them!

EyesLeft

So the thing I don't understand about Fyffes is how far down they are; do people really eat fewer banana in a recession, in other words, are they just down with the market, the valuation reflecting some nervousness about medium sized Irish companies, or is there something else wrong with them I don't know about.

Kenmare have obviously been killed because commodities prices are so bad and maybe they haven't got the moma mine going as fast as expect, I don't know, but I think they have enough money to last until prices come back, no?

MrMatisse

RE : DATALEX

It writes the booking software for airlines and travel agents. Its the stuff that allows you to pick your seat on the plane and choose your meal etc. Even if airlines have to cut the price of a flight they still get paid for the flight taking place. Defo going to have a tough time in a recession but in 08 ( a terrible year) its underlying business was profitable and has a number of new clients coming on stream. Not many quoted Irish companys involved in software and its valued at not much more than the cash in the bank.

It is very illiquid however as about 4/5 investment funds / large shareholders own about 50% of the company.

EyesLeft

Thanks Really-Stressed, I have been trying to buy some at 0.26 since yesterday morning, but no doing: I see someone has been buying at 0.28, so I amn't sure now whether to up my offer or wait.

rugbyman

have been reading through this thread over the last week.

Am astounded at the gains made in seven days, according to todays Sunday Times

Kenmare 40 %

INM 37%

Datalex 17%


Smurfit Kappa 33% (off another thread)

Newcourt 100% (off another thread)


However, from my uninformed point of view, only INM would have appeared good advice.

Please post more tips,posters

re FYFFES,
I regret that i bought some at 37 cent , when they fell from 54 pretty suddenly. I was hoping for a small increase to make me 100 euro. The amount I bought ,3.000 for 1,000 euro, means I need the share to rise to 45 to make my hundred. Foolish move, lesson learned.

It appears the part of that company with the most potential is Total Produce.

regards Rugbyman

EyesLeft

Well there is Petroceltic; a reasonably well run company, a bit of argy-bary aside, with some cash in hand and what are said to be some interesting exploration prospects.

I should say I've held Petroceltic shares for some time so I amn't impartial on this.

Berti Vogts

A lot of the small oil companies were unjustifiably hammered towards the end of last year. For example, Petroceltic went down as low as 3p towards the end of last year and rose 40% on Friday to 9.4p. Iberdrola, a Spanish company, paid 13p per share for a 22.5% stake last year so draw your own conclusions. Again, I hold shares here so not impartial and check it out for yourself before investing.

Circle Oil is another Irish oil company which has done well recently.

gears

Ah yes small caps.....

Does any one remember 4-5 weeks ago when Newcourt was at 1c......:eek:

ranger4

IN&M seems to be hitting resistance at 0.27c, o,rielly has said this morn that debts are unsustainable and might have to sell company, c&c+smurfit and small caps could be on Leg down after recent gains.

JAMM222

ranger4 wrote: »

IN&M seems to be hitting resistance at 0.27c, o,rielly has said this morn that debts are unsustainable and might have to sell company, c&c+smurfit and small caps could be on Leg down after recent gains.

Was that in one of the papers or whrere did u read that O Reilly is selling up?

ranger4

JAMM222 wrote: »

Was that in one of the papers or whrere did u read that O Reilly is selling up?

The Times.

JAMM222

is this the same article that you are refering to? if it is it doesnt mention anything about selling up!
INM to publish 2008 results on Thursday

Independent News Media says it will publish its 2008 full-year results on Thursday. Publication had been postponed twice as a result of issues relating to its proposed refinancing of a €200 million bond on May 19th.

Weekend reports suggested that INM’s two biggest shareholders, Sir Anthony O’Reilly and Denis O’Brien, were preparing to invest at least €30 million personally as part of a refinancing of the bond.

ranger4

JAMM222 wrote: »

is this the same article that you are refering to? if it is it doesnt mention anything about selling up!
INM to publish 2008 results on Thursday

Independent News Media says it will publish its 2008 full-year results on Thursday. Publication had been postponed twice as a result of issues relating to its proposed refinancing of a €200 million bond on May 19th.

Weekend reports suggested that INM’s two biggest shareholders, Sir Anthony O’Reilly and Denis O’Brien, were preparing to invest at least €30 million personally as part of a refinancing of the bond.

Cant find link but article is in todays timesonline and it does say that o,reilly to seek buyer for possibly all of IN&M.

JAMM222

ranger4 wrote: »

Cant find link but article is in todays timesonline and it does say that o,reilly to seek buyer for possibly all of IN&M.

find that hard to believe to be honest

JAMM222

JAMM222 wrote: »

find that hard to believe to be honest

actually found that article that you are talking about but O Reilly is talking about selling the London indo not the whole group!


O'REILLY SEEKS BUYER FOR STRUGGLING INDEPENDENT
Eleven years after taking control of The Independent
newspaper, Sir Anthony O'Reilly is looking to sell. Independent
News & Media is looking for investors who might be willing to
buy a controlling stake in the newspaper or even buy it
outright. Sir Anthony and his son Gavin, who is due to take over
as chief executive at Independent News & Media in May,
have conceded that the level of losses being incurred by The
Independent are unsustainable. The newspaper and its sister
Sunday title are expected to lose over ten million pounds this
year.

ranger4

JAMM222 wrote: »

actually found that article that you are talking about but O Reilly is talking about selling the London indo not the whole group!


O'REILLY SEEKS BUYER FOR STRUGGLING INDEPENDENT
Eleven years after taking control of The Independent
newspaper, Sir Anthony O'Reilly is looking to sell. Independent
News & Media is looking for investors who might be willing to
buy a controlling stake in the newspaper or even buy it
outright. Sir Anthony and his son Gavin, who is due to take over
as chief executive at Independent News & Media in May,
have conceded that the level of losses being incurred by The
Independent are unsustainable. The newspaper and its sister
Sunday title are expected to lose over ten million pounds this
year.

Hope bondholders agree to new deal, I would imagine o,brian & o,rielly will come up with rest of funds needed ifso sp could bounce nicely.

EyesLeft

Well I bought datalex and newcourt today and the plan is to keep my eye open and maybe buy ovoca and zamano in the future.

What about the development companies are they oversold does any think?

JAMM222

ranger4 wrote: »

Hope bondholders agree to new deal, I would imagine o,brian & o,rielly will come up with rest of funds needed ifso sp could bounce nicely.

i reckon the deal is already agreed and they are just playing games now! hoping for a decent lift on thursday hopefully up to .34 which will be double the price i bought them at 6 weeks ago:D

EyesLeft

Absolutely, I am sure Denis O'Brien would never go around saying he only had a 50:50 chance to reaching an agreement if he only had a 50:50 chance of reaching an agreement.

ranger4

JAMM222 wrote: »

i reckon the deal is already agreed and they are just playing games now! hoping for a decent lift on thursday hopefully up to .34 which will be double the price i bought them at 6 weeks ago:D

Hello Jamm222, will you be holding or profit taking if sp does rise to @0.34 tommorow.

JAMM222

ranger4 wrote: »

Hello Jamm222, will you be holding or profit taking if sp does rise to @0.34 tommorow.

not sure what to do might sell a few and hold onto the rest! what about yourself?

royaler83

Hello. i've been following these small caps for about 2months now and see that they are currently more volatile than most other larger companies. Would i be right in saying that they are currently on a high, ie a bear market rally, and are due to come down again shortly??

ranger4

royaler83 wrote: »

Hello. i've been following these small caps for about 2months now and see that they are currently more volatile than most other larger companies. Would i be right in saying that they are currently on a high, ie a bear market rally, and are due to come down again shortly??

Yep, buying has also slowed, i expect some profit taking and pullback soon.

ranger4

JAMM222 wrote: »

not sure what to do might sell a few and hold onto the rest! what about yourself?

probably hold the few IN&M shares i have.

JAMM222

does anyone have an opinion on thirdforce looks like pat mc donagh will be taking them over he seems to know what he is at!

Berti Vogts

There's an article on Third Force in the current edition of the Phoenix which you might want to check out.

JAMM222

ill have a look at that tomorrow (i assume its negative)
cheers

royaler83

JAMM222 wrote: »

does anyone have an opinion on thirdforce looks like pat mc donagh will be taking them over he seems to know what he is at!

Would be wary of profit takers at this stage as regards thirdforce, they have more or less doubled in the last few weeks. Might wait and see will they slip, then maybe they would be a good speculative buy

ranger4

royaler83 wrote: »

Would be wary of profit takers at this stage as regards thirdforce, they have more or less doubled in the last few weeks. Might wait and see will they slip, then maybe they would be a good speculative buy

I agree, most of small caps has had a good run and are due a leg down with profit taking.

JAMM222

does anyone know of any us or uk small caps that would be worth a look?

JAMM222

looks like i got it wrong with inm ill have to hold onto them now! :mad:

ranger4

JAMM222 wrote: »

looks like i got it wrong with inm ill have to hold onto them now! :mad:

There in auction at mo, price might recover a bit when auction finishes. bought 100k of them, bond holders will agree to some form of new deal.

JAMM222

ranger4 wrote: »

There in auction at mo, price might recover a bit when auction finishes. bought 100k of them, bond holders will agree to some form of new deal.

u were right just 12% down now, hopefully they will get that bond sorted asap

ranger4

JAMM222 wrote: »

u were right just 12% down now, hopefully they will get that bond sorted asap

Hopefully Should be a nice bounce soon.:D

EyesLeft

Nicely called; back to green now!

royaler83

ranger4 wrote: »

Hopefully Should be a nice bounce soon.:D

IN&M. Read report on times, dealer expects a possible 30% upside if bond gets sorted out. Says investors are ready "to dip their toes in". Got them at 14c, will hold them long term

ranger4

royaler83 wrote: »

IN&M. Read report on times, dealer expects a possible 30% upside if bond gets sorted out. Says investors are ready "to dip their toes in". Got them at 14c, will hold them long term

Will also be holding longterm, o brien is no muppet. Which other ire small caps should we be watching out for?

ranger4

Steady rise with IN&M sp.

JAMM222

ranger4 wrote: »

Steady rise with IN&M sp.

thinking about buying newcourt but to be honest its more of a gamble than anything else. does anyone have any up to date info on them? any help appreciated

ranger4

JAMM222 wrote: »

thinking about buying newcourt but to be honest its more of a gamble than anything else. does anyone have any up to date info on them? any help appreciated

Was also looking at newcourt, Would immagine with the downturn and higher crime rate their security services would be in demand.

JAMM222

good point! thinking about ovoca gold reckon there is a commodity boom around the corner! any thoughts on Ovoca?

EyesLeft

Commodities maybe; but not gold surely. Ovoca is the oddest share, it shoots up and presumably by the time you see it it would be too late to sell and then it drifts back down.

royaler83

JAMM222 wrote: »

good point! thinking about ovoca gold reckon there is a commodity boom around the corner! any thoughts on Ovoca?

Hoping for ovoca to drop and will def buy if they do but as EyesLeft says they generally bounce up before you get a chance to buy and you'l miss the chance, newcourt is very simillar

ranger4

anyone else waiting for IN&M pop.

JAMM222

i am!!! bought newcourt this morning at 7.5 hopefully im not too late!