O Connell to lead the Lions

Stick_man

so says Stephen Jones!!!!!!!

Crash

Same Stephen Jones who says that BOD wouldnt make his test team?

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

CatFromHue

I cant wait til tuesday when the squad is announced.

no body really knows who the captain is going to be, the last succesfull lions tour didnt have the captain the media thought would get it (1997 Martin Johnson instead of Lawrence Dallaglio), if anything Johnson was a bit of an outsider.

there really is so many different ways, players and combinations that McGeechan can go for.

I have big expectations for this tour, mostly to exorcise the demons from Clive Woodward (why pick a squad when you can bring everyone!). Even the Living with Lions DVD from 2005 was poor to say the least.

Roll on Tuesday i say

Aidric

No great surprise if it's true, which I imagine it will transpire to be.

Junior

If Jones told me the day of the week I'd check a calendar.

thomond2006

Wow, I actually agree with Jones for once. Jaysus that feels strange.....

Profiler

Ian McGeehan has made no secret of the fact that he favors a forward as Capt. So what Jones is doing here is stating the obvious.

Jones saying that is the equivalent of saying "Ireland play in Green, Wales in Red, England in White..."

He is a journalistic troll.

louthandproud

thomond2006 wrote: »

Wow, I actually agree with Jones for once. Jaysus that feels strange.....

Even a broken clock shows the correct time twice a day....

zAbbo

It has to be a starter, and someone who can lead the team.

O'Connell will be pack leader anyway, I think it'll be BOD

Profiler

louthandproud wrote: »

Even a broken clock shows the correct time twice a day....

Not if its a digital clock but yeah with you on Jones, he is an attention seeking clown.

Stick_man

zAbbo wrote: »

It has to be a starter, and someone who can lead the team.

O'Connell will be pack leader anyway, I think it'll be BOD

Its in pretty much every paper that its O Connell and for me its the right choice.

Crash

daveirl wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I have no issue with the topic of the thread, I have issue with anyone ever quoting Stephen Jones.

Stick_man

Crash wrote: »

I have no issue with the topic of the thread, I have issue with anyone ever quoting Stephen Jones.

chupacabra

Yep, looks like O'Connell will take the captaincy alright. But will the captain even be named on tuesday?

athtrasna

The Sunday Times had O Connell to captain the Lions on the front page too, and that wasn't Stephen Jones.

LumpyChicken

It would be great if O' Connell got it but either way I could not see him being too bothered about it.

marco_polo

chupacabra wrote: »

Yep, looks like O'Connell will take the captaincy alright. But will the captain even be named on tuesday?

Captaincy will be announced on Tuesday too.

[Diplomacy]I think either of BOD or POC would be a good choice for captain.[/Diplomacy]

[Jackass]

Didn't see the opening game as was away, but have read that when the team were down and being beaten O'Connell went missing for 60 minutes? Went missing when Munster were losing to Leinster in Heineken Cup, went missing v England in six nations and BO'D had to step in...BO'D now leading Lions in second game...

Is Paul O'Connell still the right man to lead the Lions? Is he a good captain? Also read he made some terrible decisions...when 3 points were on offer and the Lions scrum was shaking worse the an 90 year old trying to get up from his seat, Paul turned down the 3 and opted for a scrum which was subsequently lost...turned down 3 points a few times which would have kept the game tight and only for a 10 minute salvo at the end could have led Lions to a humiliating opening defeat...

danthefan

[Jackass] wrote: »

Didn't see the opening game as was away, but have read that when the team were down and being beaten O'Connell went missing for 60 minutes? Went missing when Munster were losing to Leinster in Heineken Cup, went missing v England in six nations and BO'D had to step in...BO'D now leading Lions in second game...

Is Paul O'Connell still the right man to lead the Lions? Is he a good captain? Also read he made some terrible decisions...when 3 points were on offer and the Lions scrum was shaking worse the an 90 year old trying to get up from his seat, Paul turned down the 3 and opted for a scrum which was subsequently lost...turned down 3 points a few times which would have kept the game tight and only for a 10 minute salvo at the end could have led Lions to a humiliating opening defeat...

Ohhhh, this won't end well.

My opinion is it's too early to tell. Give him a chance. He put in a decent individual performance, carried well around the fringes in the 2nd half and won a lot of lineout ball.

Im not going to say anything but I will add that he is being hugely criticised on other non Irish rugby forums,general consensus is not good.

So its not really provincial crap seeing as its a huge talking point on other sites,so we should be able to discuss it.

wixfjord

You raise some interesting points jackass, but Id say it is still to early to tell and anything else would be a knee jerk reaction.

RuggieBear

i would say watch the game.

[Jackass]

RuggieBear wrote: »

i would say watch the game.

Fair point, but this is coming from journos who only a few months ago were touting Paul O'Connell as greater than Jesus, so when his most staunch supporters begin to criticise him in this manner, things must be really bad...my only feeling is that they weren't making it out to be as bad as it was, throwing in the token "but he carried well in parts and worked well in the lineout" (although I've read elsewhere that for the first while the line out was a disorgansied sham where identifying arses from elbows was the first stumbling point, although the blame for this lays with Gatland and Rees as much as it does with PO'Cs calls).

I'll be watching again with interest, but it's been a concern for some time now, just raising the point to keep an eye on it as a side show to the tour...anything that was built up and hyped and celebrated so much is worth being a talking point throughout the tour...

Sabre0001

Journalists are never staunch supporters - many called for Brian O'D to be dropped / captaincy removed and look at the column inches now.

danthefan

Sabre0001 wrote: »

Journalists are never staunch supporters - many called for Brian O'D to be dropped / captaincy removed and look at the column inches now.

I can't ever recall anyone saying BOD should be dropped. There were calls for POC to be made Irish captain to freshen things up but this is a different situation. BOD had just captained his national team brilliantly to a Slam when the Lions captain was chosen.

Chucky the tree

[Jackass] wrote: »

Didn't see the opening game as was away, but have read that when the team were down and being beaten O'Connell went missing for 60 minutes? Went missing when Munster were losing to Leinster in Heineken Cup, went missing v England in six nations and BO'D had to step in...BO'D now leading Lions in second game...

Is Paul O'Connell still the right man to lead the Lions? Is he a good captain? Also read he made some terrible decisions...when 3 points were on offer and the Lions scrum was shaking worse the an 90 year old trying to get up from his seat, Paul turned down the 3 and opted for a scrum which was subsequently lost...turned down 3 points a few times which would have kept the game tight and only for a 10 minute salvo at the end could have led Lions to a humiliating opening defeat...

You could say the same about BOD. Ireland/Leinster continuously failed for years under BOD's captaincy on the big stage. Even when he was captain for the last lions tour it was a mess yet people still said he should remain Irish captain and that turned out well considering we finally managed to win a GS. I think it's crazy to throw someone under the bus after 1 game.

anonymous_joe

Ernesto Damp Windbreak wrote: »

Im not going to say anything but I will add that he is being hugely criticised on other non Irish rugby forums,general consensus is not good.

So its not really provincial crap seeing as its a huge talking point on other sites,so we should be able to discuss it.

Which forums? Some are fairly silly.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, the problem is that people always go overboard with praise and criticism. For Jackass - no he wasn't as bad as those journalists made out, he was ok, not outstanding, and made one or two tactical errors.

That's about it really.

[Jackass]

Chucky the tree wrote: »

You could say the same about BOD. Ireland/Leinster continuously failed for years under BOD's captaincy on the big stage. Even when he was captain for the last lions tour it was a mess yet people still said he should remain Irish captain and that turned out well considering we finally managed to win a GS. I think it's crazy to throw someone under the bus after 1 game.

Ah welll the difference is that Irish and Leinster failures were often a coahing and team failing (not unlike the opening Lions game) but it was often the case that Brian ODriscoll carried the team on his back, all 14 players, as far as he could, but it just wasn't enough. It was a case of the greatest player on earth being let down by the men around him.

A perfect example was the 2007 world cup. Every single player, member of the coaching staff and everybody who had anything to do with Irelands involvment in that world cup went missing, it was an absolute disastor...with the exception of BO'D.

Typical of the man, took on all the responsability and showed all the leadership...30 minutes in against Namibia (iirc) the scores were level in a game we were expected to win by 80+ points, people wondered could we hit tripple figures...we were awful...O'Gara was having his worst ever game for Ireland in the 10 jersey...What does O'Driscoll do? Takes the 10 spot for himself, chips over opposition 10 and beats full back for pace to score a try from nowhere all on his own and there you go, we're ahead now, lose the shackles and let's win this game...

Argentina, we need a bonus point win, O'Driscoll is hammering them in defence from the midfield, looked like he was up for the game of his life as the rest of the team jogged around him looking disinterested...he gets a ball 20 - 25 metres out, bursts through the Argentina defence to touch down under the posts...the shoulders went up and his arms gestured to spur up the team get them motivated...you could see the frustration in the man as he tried to get the rest of the troops moving and leads by example, always doing everything for the team when things are going wrong...if someone on the field isn't doing their job, he does it for them...this years six nations, O'Gara wasn't taking points against England, O'Driscoll takes 10 spot and slots 3 points, Forwards couldn't get over the line, O'Driscoll takes first receiver spot and burrows over the line...he single handedly won us that game and thus single handedly won a grand slam for Ireland..top try scorer in 6 nations and Heineken Cup, captains team to first grand slam in 60+ years and plays a captains roll (all be it unofficially) in Leinsters Heineken Cup triumph..he talks on the pitch, gives direction, makes the right decision both on a personal level in knowing what to do and on a team level when calling the shots, without fail, never gets it wrong.

He has a track record of being an absolute inspuration to his team and a fantastic captain and the one player, if you were ahead by one point in a world cup final with 5 minutes to play, you would want on the pitch more than anybody.

O'Connell has a terrible track record of leadership when the chips are down. Fair enough Munster have done well in the past under his guidance, but Munster is full of massive players and leaders. O'Connell goes missing. He has a greater track record of going missing when needed than he does of being the biggest leader on the field when his team needs him most and taking the whole responsability onto his own shoulders like O'Driscoll does....

O'Driscoll can hardly be blamed for the last tour as he only had 20 seconds to influence the test series where it counts, on the pitch. Lots of people can talk a big game (O'Connell included), but it's what you do on the pitch that counts.

Im just talking about O'Driscoll as you bring up his credentials as captain, but this isn't O'Connell v O'Driscoll - this is just O'Connell on his own as a captain, is he any good?

I'm not passing judgement after one match, just bringing up a trait he has had for some time and has been talked about at length before and one game into a Lions tour and he's already gone missing in a match...

I don't think (despite being world champions) that South Africa are an outstanding team by any stretch of the imagination, in fact, I think they're there for the taking. Particularly if we get our half back calls right and they play well...but it will be interesting to see how O'Connell manages it all.

thehighground

Ernesto Damp Windbreak wrote: »

Im not going to say anything but I will add that he is being hugely criticised on other non Irish rugby forums,general consensus is not good.

So its not really provincial crap seeing as its a huge talking point on other sites,so we should be able to discuss it.

O’Connell got through a significant amount of work and it was his line break that led to O’Gara’s try.

He was also the player singled out by the Royal XV’s coach Chaka Willemse: “I now know why he is the Lions captain. He was really impressive, a guy who leads from the front and takes responsibility.” The Lions will need more players to lead rather than follow starting on Wednesday night.

Saw the above quote in numberous newspapers.

phog

Firstly, I have never captained a Lions Team but every decision he made with regards to kicking or opting for lineouts or scrums instead of taking the penalty I called the same and I'm sure most of the guys that saw the game live will have done the same. Yes, it's awful when u opt for a **** and it's won against the head or you lose the lineout but you have to back yourself at times and thats what he and the team did.

anonymous_joe

phog wrote: »

Firstly, I have never captained a Lions Team but every decision he made with regards to kicking or opting for lineouts or scrums instead of taking the penalty I called the same and I'm sure most of the guys that saw the game live will have done the same. Yes, it's awful when u opt for a **** and it's won against the head or you lose the lineout but you have to back yourself at times and thats what he and the team did.

One point I'd make following on from this is that our judgement of a captain is often based not on their decisions but on the effect of their decisions.

Take the scrum - a massive Lions pack basically looked atrocious up front. If I had a penalty near the opposing line, had a big heavy pack, and so on, of course I'd call a scrum. However, it backfired.

The only criticism I'd make of O'Connell during that game (and in some ways it's something I'd consider a hangover from his Ireland/Munster set ups) is that Earls looked like he needed a captain or someone to talk to him. For Ireland and for Leinster you basically have two captains, an official captain, who takes charge of their area, and an unofficial captain who takes care of the other, so O'Driscoll's in charge of Leinster/Ireland's backs, while Cullen's in charge of the forwards, I think one of O'Gara and Blair both of whom have bucket loads of experience should have been doing more to lead the backs.

Certainly, at Munster and Ireland you've got more stable teams, which are obviously easier to captain.

Chucky the tree

[Jackass] wrote: »

Ah welll the difference is that Irish and Leinster failures were often a coahing and team failing (not unlike the opening Lions game) but it was often the case that Brian ODriscoll carried the team on his back, all 14 players, as far as he could, but it just wasn't enough. It was a case of the greatest player on earth being let down by the men around him.

A perfect example was the 2007 world cup. Every single player, member of the coaching staff and everybody who had anything to do with Irelands involvment in that world cup went missing, it was an absolute disastor...with the exception of BO'D.

Typical of the man, took on all the responsability and showed all the leadership...30 minutes in against Namibia (iirc) the scores were level in a game we were expected to win by 80+ points, people wondered could we hit tripple figures...we were awful...O'Gara was having his worst ever game for Ireland in the 10 jersey...What does O'Driscoll do? Takes the 10 spot for himself, chips over opposition 10 and beats full back for pace to score a try from nowhere all on his own and there you go, we're ahead now, lose the shackles and let's win this game...

Argentina, we need a bonus point win, O'Driscoll is hammering them in defence from the midfield, looked like he was up for the game of his life as the rest of the team jogged around him looking disinterested...he gets a ball 20 - 25 metres out, bursts through the Argentina defence to touch down under the posts...the shoulders went up and his arms gestured to spur up the team get them motivated...you could see the frustration in the man as he tried to get the rest of the troops moving and leads by example, always doing everything for the team when things are going wrong...if someone on the field isn't doing their job, he does it for them...this years six nations, O'Gara wasn't taking points against England, O'Driscoll takes 10 spot and slots 3 points, Forwards couldn't get over the line, O'Driscoll takes first receiver spot and burrows over the line...he single handedly won us that game and thus single handedly won a grand slam for Ireland..top try scorer in 6 nations and Heineken Cup, captains team to first grand slam in 60+ years and plays a captains roll (all be it unofficially) in Leinsters Heineken Cup triumph..he talks on the pitch, gives direction, makes the right decision both on a personal level in knowing what to do and on a team level when calling the shots, without fail, never gets it wrong.

He has a track record of being an absolute inspuration to his team and a fantastic captain and the one player, if you were ahead by one point in a world cup final with 5 minutes to play, you would want on the pitch more than anybody.

O'Connell has a terrible track record of leadership when the chips are down. Fair enough Munster have done well in the past under his guidance, but Munster is full of massive players and leaders. O'Connell goes missing. He has a greater track record of going missing when needed than he does of being the biggest leader on the field when his team needs him most and taking the whole responsability onto his own shoulders like O'Driscoll does....

O'Driscoll can hardly be blamed for the last tour as he only had 20 seconds to influence the test series where it counts, on the pitch. Lots of people can talk a big game (O'Connell included), but it's what you do on the pitch that counts.

Im just talking about O'Driscoll as you bring up his credentials as captain, but this isn't O'Connell v O'Driscoll - this is just O'Connell on his own as a captain, is he any good?

I'm not passing judgement after one match, just bringing up a trait he has had for some time and has been talked about at length before and one game into a Lions tour and he's already gone missing in a match...

I don't think (despite being world champions) that South Africa are an outstanding team by any stretch of the imagination, in fact, I think they're there for the taking. Particularly if we get our half back calls right and they play well...but it will be interesting to see how O'Connell manages it all.

To me it show's that BOD struggles to motivate his player's to up their game when it matter's which is a crucial role for a captain. It's been shown with 3 teams, Ireland, Leinster and the Lions. The pre test lions in 05 were hardly a massive success either so I dont think he get's a free pass on the last tour.


So you dont think POC's record with Munster is any good? When did he go missing when the chip's were down as captain? Apart from this year's HEC semi which is 1 match.

thehighground

thehighground wrote: »

Saw the above quote in numberous newspapers.

And?

Journalists opinions are often misguided by their interests.

anonymous_joe

Chucky the tree wrote: »

So you dont think POC's record with Munster is any good? When did he go missing when the chip's were down as captain? Apart from this year's HEC semi which is 1 match.

I don't agree that he's a bad captain, but if you're a Munster fan (you are right?) you've probably not seen many defeats in important games while O'Connell's been the captain.

When did he take the captaincy anyway?

I'd posit that he's probably got the least experience of any of the potential Lions Captains of captaining a team in trouble.

Mike Blair - Embra and Scotland

O'Driscoll's fought through some awful Irish and Leinster performances

Then you've O'Connell, whose only recently enough been made permanent captain of Munster, and that time period has coincided with great success for Munster. He's probably not at all used to games where a disoriented team, which has just been pulled together, is struggling to gel.

That's a new situation for almost anyone, and certainly not easy to operate in.

I can see O'Connell being a very good Lions captain. He's very good at his job, and has a certain passion about him that's helpful for a team.

chupacabra

anonymous_joe wrote: »

I don't agree that he's a bad captain, but if you're a Munster fan (you are right?) you've probably not seen many defeats in important games while O'Connell's been the captain.

When did he take the captaincy anyway?

I'd posit that he's probably got the least experience of any of the potential Lions Captains of captaining a team in trouble.

Mike Blair - Embra and Scotland

O'Driscoll's fought through some awful Irish and Leinster performances

Then you've O'Connell, whose only recently enough been made permanent captain of Munster, and that time period has coincided with great success for Munster. He's probably not at all used to games where a disoriented team, which has just been pulled together, is struggling to gel.

That's a new situation for almost anyone, and certainly not easy to operate in.

I can see O'Connell being a very good Lions captain. He's very good at his job, and has a certain passion about him that's helpful for a team.

BOD should have been Lions captain. And im a munster man.

themont85

Chucky the tree wrote: »

To me it show's that BOD struggles to motivate his player's to up their game when it matter's which is a crucial role for a captain. It's been shown with 3 teams, Ireland, Leinster and the Lions. The pre test lions in 05 were hardly a massive success either so I dont think he get's a free pass on the last tour.


So you dont think POC's record with Munster is any good? When did he go missing when the chip's were down as captain? Apart from this year's HEC semi which is 1 match.

I've always been bit concerned with POC being given the captaincy. Remember the first and only game Munster lost in Thomand to Leicester? Munster have penalty, 5 yards out and 5 to the right of the posts, kick would leave it extreamelly close, POC goes for the scrum, they fail to score and Leicester go on to win. Every Munster fan was raging with that call, it was going for the jugular and was a boom or bust play if ever there was one. The momentum was huge of that play and POC got it wrong under pressure.

Ireland v France, in Croker in 2007. Bod injured, POC captain. Ireland lack direction from the start. It takes O'Gara to get Ireland into the game(POC is a far better captain when O'Gara is there to talk to him). Even against Tolouse in the HC final, Munster were picking and going under the orders of POC at the end. Even ROG said it was crazy with 5 minutes to go after the game and he wanted different calls made, fortunately Tolouse didn't capatilise at the end.

POC gets rushes of blood to the head imo. He is a warrior by nature and wants to go at them all the time. Personally i prefer BOD or ROG anyday of the week as my captain.

thehighground

Ernesto Damp Windbreak wrote: »

And?

Journalists opinions are often misguided by their interests.

I agree completely. But this is a quote from the Royal's coach, not a journalist:

He was also the player singled out by the Royal XV’s coach Chaka Willemse: “I now know why he is the Lions captain. He was really impressive, a guy who leads from the front and takes responsibility.”

thehighground

anonymous_joe wrote: »

I don't agree that he's a bad captain, but if you're a Munster fan (you are right?) you've probably not seen many defeats in important games while O'Connell's been the captain.

There have been some very difficult/tight games though (Mauntaban, Clermont this year - all won in the last few minutes).

When did he take the captaincy anyway?

Just after first Heineken Cup win (2006-07 season). He was voted captain by the Munster squad.

I'd posit that he's probably got the least experience of any of the potential Lions Captains of captaining a team in trouble.
Mike Blair - Embra and Scotland

O'Driscoll's fought through some awful Irish and Leinster performances

And still lost most of them? Some interesting articles in the Sunday papers (Sunday Indo in particular) about Leo Cullen and what a difference he has made to Leinster since he has come back from Leicester. (They were not having a go at BOD by the way, just discussing what has changed to turn Leinster into Heineken Cup winners).

Then you've O'Connell, whose only recently enough been made permanent captain of Munster, and that time period has coincided with great success for Munster. He's probably not at all used to games where a disoriented team, which has just been pulled together, is struggling to gel.

I don't think many captains have to deal with what he has to deal with - usually they would know most their team mates and played with them all a few times.

anonymous_joe

thehighground wrote: »

There have been some very difficult/tight games though (Mauntaban, Clermont this year - all won in the last few minutes).

Indeed. Hard to guage his impact.

I thought Munster were awful in those two games, hard to quantify POC's contribution, I'd let you or one of the other Munster fans try.

Just after first Heineken Cup win (2006-07 season). He was voted captain by the Munster squad.

He was the only obvious choice after all.

And still lost most of them? Some interesting articles in the Sunday papers (Sunday Indo in particular) about Leo Cullen and what a difference he has made to Leinster since he has come back from Leicester. (They were not having a go at BOD by the way, just discussing what has changed to turn Leinster into Heineken Cup winners).

A lot of stuff's been written about how Leinster have copied the Munster model - I think that's bullshít, Leinster have copied Leicester's model to a degree. Leo and Shane Jennings definitely benefited from their time in the GP.

It's brought a new culture to Leinster, which has blended well with what's there already. Results are clear to see.

I don't think many captains have to deal with what he has to deal with - usually they would know most their team mates and played with them all a few times.

Indeed, it's the toughest challenge a captain faces really. I hope O'Connell rises to it.

Personally, I'd have preferred O'Driscoll to be captain, and use the Irish system of O'Driscoll and O'Connell basically as co-captains on the pitch.

The real problem in my mind by the way, is that an Irish captain is trying to implement Welsh tactics.

themont85

thehighground wrote: »

And still lost most of them? Some interesting articles in the Sunday papers (Sunday Indo in particular) about Leo Cullen and what a difference he has made to Leinster since he has come back from Leicester. (They were not having a go at BOD by the way, just discussing what has changed to turn Leinster into Heineken Cup winners).

Those journalists are being over simplistic. The major difference for Leinster has been the pack been upto something these last 2 years. Ollie le Roux really helped in both the playing and coaching side, Mike Brewer was massive to in the coaching stakes. Of course Cullen has been great as has Jennings to get them back. Elsom of course really put Leinster over the hump. It has been far easier for Cullen to lead Leinster than it was for O'Driscoll. O'Driscoll had a pack in his 3/4 years as captain which was always going backwards. It was upto the Leinster backs and defence, to which BOD more than did his job.

BOD always has led by example and nearly always makes the right call under pressure. He is great at seeing the game unfold in front of him and grabbing it by the scruff of the neck, ie drop goals and forwardesque poances for the line. I'd attribute that to ROG as well, he is great at grabbing the game when needed. ROG is a cooling influence for mainly Munster but also Ireland, and is invaluable to POC who imo is a bit hot headed.

I personally don't perscribe to the notion that 1)a forward should be captain(i played a bit of flanker too so its not just a back here) 2) POC will be like Martin Johnson. Sure they're both awesome second rows but Johnson was perhaps the greatest captain of them all(ahead of McBride and Eales imo), he made correct decisions under pressure and could be gritty and lead from the front.

thehighground

anonymous_joe wrote: »

The only criticism I'd make of O'Connell during that game (and in some ways it's something I'd consider a hangover from his Ireland/Munster set ups) is that Earls looked like he needed a captain or someone to talk to him. For Ireland and for Leinster you basically have two captains, an official captain, who takes charge of their area, and an unofficial captain who takes care of the other, so O'Driscoll's in charge of Leinster/Ireland's backs, while Cullen's in charge of the forwards, I think one of O'Gara and Blair both of whom have bucket loads of experience should have been doing more to lead the backs.

Certainly, at Munster and Ireland you've got more stable teams, which are obviously easier to captain.

I expect that POC & ROG would have known the best thing to do with Keith - they have been playing alongside him for the last year or so. Doing what you suggest could be the completely wrong thing to do. If he was with Munster he would have got 'the POC stare' which probably would have completely freaked out the rest of the team who would not be used to it.

I've read newspaper comments that criticised POC & ROG for 'not barking out orders' like they usually do for Munster/Ireland. Bearing in mind that Mike Phillips said he was scared of ROG in his blog, I can see why they are taking it easy on their new team mates until they get to know them a bit better!

I read somewhere anyway, that apparently very quietly ROG had an encouraging word (without looking as if he was mollycoddling him). ROG basically told him him to take a deep breath and reminded him that he was a much better player than he was showing against the Royals. Apparently he picked up after that.

thehighground

thehighground wrote: »

I agree completely. But this is a quote from the Royal's coach, not a journalist:

He was also the player singled out by the Royal XV’s coach Chaka Willemse: “I now know why he is the Lions captain. He was really impressive, a guy who leads from the front and takes responsibility.”

I didnt think he had a good game by his standards so I think the coach was just paying lip service or else he is in for a shock when Poc has a good game.

Whatever anyone thinks on the captancy issue now,Its a done deal and cant/wont be changed.

I just hope for Pocs sake if they lose the series badly he isnt made a scapegoat over captaincy issues.

Alicat

Am I missing something?

BOD named as captain?

http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/lions/2009/0601/lions.html

http://www.skysports.com/lions-09/story/0,25921,16057_5358233,00.html

They switch Captains for different games?

Jackz

Alicat wrote: »

Am I missing something?

BOD named as captain?

http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/lions/2009/0601/lions.html

http://www.skysports.com/lions-09/story/0,25921,16057_5358233,00.html

They switch Captains for different games?

Yea onfield captain for that particular game as POC isn't playing due to a combination of rotation and a scratched cornea. No player will play all the games and you can't captain from the sideline.

NickNolte

Alicat wrote: »

They switch Captains for different games?

POC couldn't start every game... there'd be nothing left of the chap after the tour

BOD as stand-in captain seems fitting. Although I'd still like to see one of the Welsh lads (AW Jones for tomorrow) lead up front.

anonymous_joe

thehighground wrote: »

I expect that POC & ROG would have known the best thing to do with Keith - they have been playing alongside him for the last year or so. Doing what you suggest could be the completely wrong thing to do. If he was with Munster he would have got 'the POC stare' which probably would have completely freaked out the rest of the team who would not be used to it.

I've read newspaper comments that criticised POC & ROG for 'not barking out orders' like they usually do for Munster/Ireland. Bearing in mind that Mike Phillips said he was scared of ROG in his blog, I can see why they are taking it easy on their new team mates until they get to know them a bit better!

I read somewhere anyway, that apparently very quietly ROG had an encouraging word (without looking as if he was mollycoddling him). ROG basically told him him to take a deep breath and reminded him that he was a much better player than he was showing against the Royals. Apparently he picked up after that.

Well if ROG did that I'd be more impressed with him.

Earls really looked like he needed something, and the backs around him were mostly relatively young after all.

Size=everything

thehighground wrote: »

I read somewhere anyway, that apparently very quietly ROG had an encouraging word (without looking as if he was mollycoddling him). ROG basically told him him to take a deep breath and reminded him that he was a much better player than he was showing against the Royals. Apparently he picked up after that.

Actually that was Brian O'Driscoll you're thinking of and it was in an Irish Times piece.

thehighground

Size=everything wrote: »

Actually that was Brian O'Driscoll you're thinking of and it was in an Irish Times piece.

No, its not:

Afterwards captain Paul O'Connell said: "It's a big thing playing on a Lions tour and sometimes it can get to you." You felt he had Earls in mind when he uttered that line. In the 16th minute you could see Ronan O'Gara giving his Munster colleague a few words, and it had all the appearance of the youngster not being molly-coddled but being told to take a deep breath and play the rugby he's capable of playing.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/lions-tour/earls-stutters-as-royal-mob-rise-to-occasion-1756706.html

Obviously, neither POC or ROG wanted to draw any more attention than necessary to Earls and no matter what anyone says, of all the people on the pitch they would have known best how to deal with the situation and possibly not make him even more nervous.

thehighground

anonymous_joe wrote: »

Well if ROG did that I'd be more impressed with him.

Earls really looked like he needed something, and the backs around him were mostly relatively young after all.

See previous post - ROG had a quiet word at 16mins.

Shane Williams is 31, Lee Byrne is 29, Tommy Bowe is 25, Roberts is 22, but has already toured SA with Wales.

remus808

thehighground wrote: »

ROG had an encouraging word.

"I taught we talked abou' dis before de game"