93 years today!!

Allah Hu Akbar

R.I.P. Everyone who died.

---

Beware,
Beware of the thing that is coming,
Beware of the risen people,
Who shall take what ye would not give.
Did ye think to conquer the people,
Or that Law is stronger than life and than men's desire to be free?
We will try it out with you, ye that have harried and held,
Ye that have bullied and bribed,
tyrants, hypocrites, liars!


Pádraig Pearse 10 November 1879 – 3 May 1916

seanybiker

em ok.

Pride Fighter

RIP
and thank you for the providing the building block for our state and our freedom.

Serenity Now!

The Easter Rising did not happen 93 years ago "today".

Boy oh boy, plastic republicanism can be funny sometimes.

Terrontress

Yeah, there is a good 2 weeks to go to the 93rd anniversary yet.

You'd think some people would take a look at history before droning on incessantly about it.

futurehope

Ulster 1912

"Their webs shall not become garments, neither shall they cover themselves with their works: their works are works of inquity and the act of violence is in their hands." -- Isaiah lix. 6.


The dark eleventh hour
Draws on and sees us sold
To every evil power
We fought against of old -
Rebellion, rapine, hate,
Oppression, wrong and greed
Are loosed to rule our fate
By England's art and deed.

The faith in which we stand,
The laws we made and guard,
Our honour, lives, and land
Are given for reward
To murder done by night
To treason taught by day,
To folly, sloth, and spite,
And we are thrust away.

The blood our fathers spilt,
Our love, our toils, our pains
Are counted us for guilt
And only bind our chains -
Before an Empire's eyes
The traitor claims his price.
What need of further lies?
We are the sacrifice.

We know the war prepared
On ever peaceful home
We know the hells prepared
For such as serve not Rome
The terror, threats, and dread
In market, hearth, and field -
We know, when all is said,
We perish if we yield.

Believe we dare not boast,
Believe we dare not fear:
We stand to pay the cost
In all that men hold dear.
What answer from the North?
One Law, One Land, One Throne!
If England drives us forth
We shall not fall alone.

Rudyard Kipling

Leonid

Kipling invented trolling

Agent Smith

Allah Hu Akbar wrote: »

R.I.P. Everyone who died.

---

Beware,
Beware of the thing that is coming,
Beware of the risen people,
Who shall take what ye would not give.
Did ye think to conquer the people,
Or that Law is stronger than life and than men's desire to be free?
We will try it out with you, ye that have harried and held,
Ye that have bullied and bribed,
tyrants, hypocrites, liars!


Pádraig Pearse 10 November 1879 – 3 May 1916

The rising took place on easter monday

Moron

nesf

Agent Smith wrote: »

Moron

The next insult like this will earn you a ban.

trickymickey

93 years what a great job we have done since

galwayrush

trickymickey wrote: »

93 years what a great job we have done since

HAAHAHAH:D
I think it will take at least another 93 years to get it right.

deadhead13

trickymickey wrote: »

93 years what a great job we have done since

I wonder what the 7 signatories of the Irish Proclamation would make of Ireland 2009.

José Alaninho

deadhead13 wrote: »

I wonder what the 7 signatories of the Irish Proclamation would make of Ireland 2009.

They'd say we have to rise up again. And they'd be right....

CiaranC

trickymickey wrote: »

93 years what a great job we have done since

For What Died the Sons of Róisín, was it greed?
For What Died the Sons of Róisín, was it greed?
Was it greed that drove Wolfe Tone to a paupers death in a cell of cold wet stone?
Will German, French or Dutch inscribe the epitaph of Emmet?
When we have sold enough of Ireland to be but strangers in it.
For What Died the Sons of Róisín, was it greed?

To whom do we owe our allegiance today?
To whom do we owe our allegiance today?
To those brave men who fought and died that Róisín live again with pride?
Her sons at home to work and sing,
Her youth to dance and make her valleys ring,
Or the faceless men who for Mark and Dollar,
Betray her to the highest bidder,
To whom do we owe our allegiance today?

jimmmy

trickymickey wrote: »

93 years what a great job we have done since

lol too true. 93 years ago the train journeys took the same time or less..... a letter posted in Dublin got delivered in London the next day...so not everying has improved very much. We have borrowed an awful lot, got a lot of handouts from the EC ( mainly Germany + Britain ) , put up some ghastly buildings and torn down some nice ones ( what nice architecture is there since 1916 - name one building ? ) , destroyed the environment a bit, but what else is new ?

leitrim lad

agreed jimmmy

but we need to focus on the future going forward, in the long to medium term, as biffo would say

and if it takes another 700 years i can still see problems, let it be religon, money, politics,
the whole cycle of life depends on problems to get results,

Grudaire

Ba ceart go mbeidh gach duine anseo buíochasach astu.

Ar deis Dé a raibh a n-anamacha

José Alaninho wrote: »

They'd say we have to rise up again. And they'd be right....

.... against both Brian and Gordon?

PrivateEye

From Connollys 'Labour In Irish History'

In Dublin there were three divisions of Volunteers – corresponding to the three popular divisions of the ‘patriotic’ forces. There was the Liberty Corps, recruited exclusively from the working class; the Merchants Corps, composed of the capitalist class, and the Lawyers Corps, the members of the legal fraternity. Henry Grattan, Jr., telling of the action of the Government after the passage of the Arms and Gunpowder Bill requiring the Volunteers to give up their arms to the authorities for safe keeping, says the Government “seized the artillery of the Liberty Corps, made a private arrangement by which it got possession of that belonging to the Merchant Corps; they induced the lawyers to give up theirs, first making a public procession before they were surrendered”.

In other words and plainer language, the Government had to use force to seize the arms of the working men, but the capitalists gave up theirs secretly as the result of a private bargain.

My politics are of Libertarian Socialist stock, but I think its important 1916 is remembered. Ideally not by the kind of gombeens that converge on the GPO once a year though. Liberty Hall should fly the Starry Plough in April each year. The last time it flew publically here was over the Waterford Occupation :rolleyes:

Its so easy to critique their politics now, but the Volunteers and the ICA were in the right in the context of the time.
We can't forget that happened here.

Nodin

jimmmy wrote: »

lol too true. 93 years ago the train journeys took the same time or less..... a letter posted in Dublin got delivered in London the next day...so not everying has improved very much. We have borrowed an awful lot, got a lot of handouts from the EC ( mainly Germany + Britain ) , put up some ghastly buildings and torn down some nice ones ( what nice architecture is there since 1916 - name one building ? ) , destroyed the environment a bit, but what else is new ?

How many times have you posted that exact same nonsense? In 1916 Dublin had some of the worst slums in Europe - something that was pointed out to you before.

FutureHope wrote:

Ulster 1912

Why is that "better"? What precisely does a poem by an apologist for Empire and unapolgetic racist have to bring to the discussion?

jimmmy

Nodin wrote: »

How many times have you posted that exact same nonsense? In 1916 Dublin had some of the worst slums in Europe - something that was pointed out to you before.

Dublin had slums in 1913, but so had every big city in Europe, and every big city ( and not so big city ) in the world. High birth rates did not help the situation in Dublin but the city still had some world class infrastructure etc etc. Of course in school we were only taught about the heroes of 1916.

Grudaire

jimmmy wrote: »

Dublin had slums in 1913, but so had every big city in Europe, and every big city ( and not so big city ) in the world. High birth rates did not help the situation in Dublin but the city still had some world class infrastructure etc etc. Of course in school we were only taught about the heroes of 1916.

Just because you use this -> :cool: Definetly doesn't mean that you're right.

I'm glad you accept that they're heroes at least :cool:

jimmmy

I told you what we were taught about, I did not say what they were. Big difference

People who knew them better than you and me jeered them + threw things at them when they surrendered. That says it all. Still its powerful what propoganda can do.

Nodin

jimmmy wrote: »

Dublin had slums in 1913, but so had every big city in Europe, and every big city ( and not so big city ) in the world. High birth rates did not help the situation in Dublin but the city still had some world class infrastructure etc etc. Of course in school we were only taught about the heroes of 1916.

O poor brainwashed us.

Lets see what reality has to day about it.....

In 1911 Dublin had the worst housing conditions of any city in the United Kingdom. Its extensive slums were not limited to the back-streets or to impoverished ghettos. By 1911 the city slums also incorporated great Georgian houses on previously fashionable streets and squares. As the wealthy moved to the suburbs over the course of the 19th century, their huge, red-brick buildings were abandoned to the rent-paying poor. Tenements in inner-city Dublin were filthy, overcrowded, disease-ridden, teeming with malnourished children and very much at odds with the elite world of colonial and middle-class Dublin.

(my bold)
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/exhibition/dublin/poverty_health.html

In any event, it escapes me why any nation should be thankful for its overlords exploitation, due to their taste in architecture.

dlofnep

Rest in piece to all those who gave up their lives, and those who lived in the name of Irish freedom.

dlofnep

Ah look, It's Jimmy here to tell us how great it was under British rule.

Nodin

jimmmy wrote: »

People who knew them better than you and me jeered them + threw things at them when they surrendered. .

Reports of that are greatly exaggerated. Secondly its hardly decisive in determining good or ill.

live2thewire

wow dublin seemed like a great place back then, im sure everyone was so happy that a letter was delivered to london within a day...must have made all the crap worth it. eh not

jimmmy

live2thewire wrote: »

wow dublin seemed like a great place back then, im sure everyone was so happy that a letter was delivered to london within a day

There were a lot worse places in the world. Every sizeable city in the world had slums. Dublin was well off compared to many cities in the world. Thats why the rebels of 1916 were jeered at / spat at.

Grudaire

jimmmy wrote: »

There were a lot worse places in the world. Every sizeable city in the world had slums. Dublin was well off compared to many cities in the world. Thats why the rebels of 1916 were jeered at / spat at.

You're a fan of Wikipedia:

Wikipedia wrote:

McKenzie published The Irish Rebellion: What happened and Why, with C. Arthur Pearson in London in 1916, he notes, "I have read many accounts of public feeling in Dublin in these days. They are all agreed that the open and strong sympathy of the mass of the population was with the British troops. That this was in the better parts of the city, I have no doubt, but certainly what I myself saw in the poorer districts did not confirm this. It rather indicated that there was a vast amount of sympathy with the rebels, particularly after the rebels were defeated."

Now will you stop?

futurehope

jimmmy wrote: »

lol too true. 93 years ago the train journeys took the same time or less..... a letter posted in Dublin got delivered in London the next day...so not everying has improved very much. We have borrowed an awful lot, got a lot of handouts from the EC ( mainly Germany + Britain ) , put up some ghastly buildings and torn down some nice ones ( what nice architecture is there since 1916 - name one building ? ) , destroyed the environment a bit, but what else is new ?

I think it's worse than that jimmy. One only has to read through the posts on this forum (and indeed on other Irish forums) to realise what sort of place Ireland had/has become since it left The Union. Constant whining about The UK/GB/Britain. Is there any other country in the world that goes on about their nearest neighbours like The Irish? Personally I doubt it. If one goes on a German forum, do people there keep bleating about Germany's lost lands - Silesia, East Prussia, Pomerania, etc? Personally I doubt it. Does anyone on UK forums keep moaning about how terrible it was to lose The Empire and wouldn't it be great if it could be recreated? Again, unlikely. Does any civilised country anywhere have the arrogance to constantly keep harping on about taking over part of a neighbouring country's territory AGAINST the will of those who actually live there? If there are such civilised countries, I'd love to know their names. And yet many of these same bleaters, whiners and moaners have either lived in England, are living in England, or will live in England - either them, their parents, their children, etc. This can all be summed up in one word:

EMBARRASSING!

And yet the question remains - WHY do The Irish (or many of them) think like this and act like this? I can only give one answer. In order for corrupt, lazy and incompetent Irish politicians to prosper and in order for said politicians to maintain control over what was a very poor populace until relatively recently, they had to point the finger North and East. It was The terrible British and those nasty Prods who were to blame. And yet, said politicians could not have acted alone. No, they required the assistance of The RC church, which they received in abundance, particularly through the schools, where the anti-British and anti-Protestant bile was spewed out onto innocent children. In return The Irish state did not look to closely at what The RC priests were up to. Well, we all know now what they were up to don't we?

So, instead of blaming The British for their plight (the same British who helped fund Ireland's prosperity through The EU and who welcomed The Irish into England as immigrants) or blaming Northern Protestants (the one's, who contrary to Irish speak, were actually incredibly slow to anger, even during the worst of The Provo outrages), The Irish should take a much closer look at themselves, and damn well grow up.

live2thewire

pathetic and don't talk **** if you haven't a clue what the **** you are talking about.

Grudaire

futurehope wrote: »

I think it's worse than that jimmy. One only has to read through the posts on this forum (and indeed on other Irish forums) to realise what sort of place Ireland had/has become since it left The Union. Constant whining about The UK/GB/Britain. Is there any other country in the world that goes on about their nearest neighbours like The Irish? Personally I doubt it. If one goes on a German forum, do people there keep bleating about Germany's lost lands - Silesia, East Prussia, Pomerania, etc? Personally I doubt it. Does anyone on UK forums keep moaning about how terrible it was to lose The Empire and wouldn't it be great if it could be recreated? Again, unlikely. Does any civilised country anywhere have the arrogance to constantly keep harping on about taking over part of a neighbouring country's territory AGAINST the will of those who actually live there? If there are such civilised countries, I'd love to know their names. And yet many of these same bleaters, whiners and moaners have either lived in England, are living in England, or will live in England - either them, their parents, their children, etc. This can all be summed up in one word:

EMBARRASSING!

And yet the question remains - WHY do The Irish (or many of them) think like this and act like this? I can only give one answer. In order for corrupt, lazy and incompetent Irish politicians to prosper and in order for said politicians to maintain control over what was a very poor populace until relatively recently, they had to point the finger North and East. It was The terrible British and those nasty Prods who were to blame. And yet, said politicians could not have acted alone. No, they required the assistance of The RC church, which they received in abundance, particularly through the schools, where the anti-British and anti-Protestant bile was spewed out onto innocent children. In return The Irish state did not look to closely at what The RC priests were up to. Well, we all know now what they were up to don't we?

So, instead of blaming The British for their plight (the same British who helped fund Ireland's prosperity through The EU and who welcomed The Irish into England as immigrants) or blaming Northern Protestants (the one's, who contrary to Irish speak, were actually incredibly slow to anger, even during the worst of The Provo outrages), The Irish should take a much closer look at themselves, and damn well grow up.

Hahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

It's funny because I actually Lol'ed at this post (And not because I agree with ya - purely because this is revisionism on a scale that would make David Irvine wet himself)

live2thewire

cliste i wouldn't mind he/she is clearly trolling. maby if we ignore them they will go away.

Grudaire

live2thewire wrote: »

cliste i wouldn't mind he/she is clearly trolling. maby if we ignore them they will go away.

Thats a fair point.

There isn't any memorials/parades this year is there? It's a pity, I hope that the 100 year anniversary is good

leitrim lad

i wonder if the country doesnt go bankrupt, would they consider having a parade/festival on the 100 anvery , along with that it could be exploited like st patricks day to invite foerign investment to the country.

rip to all the good men who died for our freedom of life

Nodin

jimmmy wrote: »

There were a lot worse places in the world. Every sizeable city in the world had slums. Dublin was well off compared to many cities in the world. Thats why the rebels of 1916 were jeered at / spat at.

What part of " worst housing conditions of any city in the United Kingdom" do you have a problem in understanding?

Nodin

futurehope wrote: »

I think (....)grow up.

This is a thread about 1916. None of your issues there are really relevant.

jimmmy

futurehope wrote: »

I think it's worse than that jimmy. One only has to read through the posts on this forum (and indeed on other Irish forums) to realise what sort of place Ireland had/has become since it left The Union. Constant whining about The UK/GB/Britain. Is there any other country in the world that goes on about their nearest neighbours like The Irish? Personally I doubt it. If one goes on a German forum, do people there keep bleating about Germany's lost lands - Silesia, East Prussia, Pomerania, etc? Personally I doubt it. Does anyone on UK forums keep moaning about how terrible it was to lose The Empire and wouldn't it be great if it could be recreated? Again, unlikely. Does any civilised country anywhere have the arrogance to constantly keep harping on about taking over part of a neighbouring country's territory AGAINST the will of those who actually live there? If there are such civilised countries, I'd love to know their names. And yet many of these same bleaters, whiners and moaners have either lived in England, are living in England, or will live in England - either them, their parents, their children, etc. This can all be summed up in one word:

EMBARRASSING!

And yet the question remains - WHY do The Irish (or many of them) think like this and act like this? I can only give one answer. In order for corrupt, lazy and incompetent Irish politicians to prosper and in order for said politicians to maintain control over what was a very poor populace until relatively recently, they had to point the finger North and East. It was The terrible British and those nasty Prods who were to blame. And yet, said politicians could not have acted alone. No, they required the assistance of The RC church, which they received in abundance, particularly through the schools, where the anti-British and anti-Protestant bile was spewed out onto innocent children. In return The Irish state did not look to closely at what The RC priests were up to. Well, we all know now what they were up to don't we?

So, instead of blaming The British for their plight (the same British who helped fund Ireland's prosperity through The EU and who welcomed The Irish into England as immigrants) or blaming Northern Protestants (the one's, who contrary to Irish speak, were actually incredibly slow to anger, even during the worst of The Provo outrages), The Irish should take a much closer look at themselves, and damn well grow up.

Excellent post. However , to answer your question "WHY do The Irish (or many of them) think like this and act like this? " I would suggest ( having survived the education system here in Ireland ) that Irish schools and teachers have a lot to answer for....in fact thats where most of the actual indoctrination occured.

Scofflaw

live2thewire wrote: »

cliste i wouldn't mind he/she is clearly trolling. maby if we ignore them they will go away.

Read the charter:

Allegations of trollery will not be accepted in-thread - they will be viewed as simply another form of personal attack, and dealt with accordingly. If you believe someone is trolling, and object, then report them as per "Reporting & Moderation above.

moderately,
Scofflaw

Shane-1

Does any country go on about their nearest neighbours as much as us? Hmmm, how about the English about the Irish/ French/ Germans? How about the French about the Germans, the Polish about the Russians/ Germans. The Cubans about the Americans, the Americans about the Cubans. sigh, human nature Im afraid, same way as most people slag off their next door neightbours most of the time, just on a grander scale.

And sure arent ye on a forum saying about how terrible it was to lose the empire etc? THat would answer your question I believe?!

As for the rest of the thread, two things - so apparently we have invented the northern troubles and got loads of catholics up there to play along and pretend to be oppressed so we can cover up the wrong doings of the catholic church? Thats quite the conspiracy theory you have going there.

And 2 - all this is completely unrelated to 1916!

Shane-1

Shame on those dastardly teachers for teaching us our history too, fuping backstards

wolfpawnat

Cliste wrote: »

Thats a fair point.

There isn't any memorials/parades this year is there? It's a pity, I hope that the 100 year anniversary is good

There was supposed to be a bit of a memorial service for them today at the gpo and there was small service for them in my town and I heard on the radio that there was more services taking place around the county:)

I cannot wait for the 100th year anniversary!!! I really hope it's a big to-do.

The men and women of 1916 are real heroes and deserve to do remembered as such. My OH and I gave our son the names of two of the leaders as his middle names:)

mikemac

I skipped right to the end so maybe someone put the OP straight

It started on Easter Monday and on April 24th, this isn't an anniversary at all

Shane-1

Hello Dearest OH!! Yes indeed there were several memorials this year, and there are still a couple tomorrow in a few places. Just depending on your political affiliations be careful which ones you attend and dont attend, they are all organised by different groups, mostly by Sinn Fein and Republican Sinn Fein, you dont want to turn up to the RSF one with your Fianna Fail hat on!

Shane-1

mikemac wrote: »

I skipped right to the end so maybe someone put the OP straight

It started on Easter Monday and on April 24th, this isn't an anniversary at all

I think its organised to take on the religious significance of Easter week rather than to follow the exact date. I wish it would follow the date though, thats my birthday, would be great to have a nice big national hooly for me every year

Grudaire

I respect that wolfy,

Mike I think it was mentioned once or twice - hagger then pointed out that the real anniversary's the 24th, I think it may have been lost in the usual 'banter'

Hmmm - I would like to see other political parties branching into this as well. Imagine a Green 1916 memorial

Hagar

Serenity Now! wrote: »

The Easter Rising did not happen 93 years ago "today".

Boy oh boy, plastic republicanism can be funny sometimes.

And Jesus probably wasn't born on Dec 24th in the year 1 but we choose to remember things at certain times. The anniversary is technically the 24th but most people will remember the Rising on Easter Sunday despite the hostilities taking place on the Monday.

Is easy to be dismissive of other people's achievements and bravery, it can make the lack of either in one's own life less important.

I for one am grateful for the sacrifices made by those men and women.
God grant them rest in peace.

/edit Just saw the last few posts when the page refreshed.

futurehope

Shane-1 said:

Does any country go on about their nearest neighbours as much as us? Hmmm, how about the English about the Irish/ French/ Germans? How about the French about the Germans, the Polish about the Russians/ Germans. The Cubans about the Americans, the Americans about the Cubans. sigh, human nature Im afraid, same way as most people slag off their next door neightbours most of the time, just on a grander scale.

The English most certainly do not go on about The Irish to the extent The Irish go on about The English. If you think that you've obviously never been to England. Nor do they go on about The French or Germans to that extent either. As for The French and Germans going on about each other and The Poles and Russians going on about each other, have you any proof of that? I personally doubt they do to the extent The Irish go on about The English. I doubt The American people would see Cuba as a big talking point (although I'm sure it works the other way). SMALL COUNTRY syndrome I'd say.

And sure arent ye on a forum saying about how terrible it was to lose the empire etc? THat would answer your question I believe?!

I've not said that anywhere.

As for the rest of the thread, two things - so apparently we have invented the northern troubles and got loads of catholics up there to play along and pretend to be oppressed so we can cover up the wrong doings of the catholic church? Thats quite the conspiracy theory you have going there.

No conspiracy theory, just the facts. Even ignoring FF involvement in setting up, arming and funding The Provisionals, the politicians and the people of The Republic gave plenty of support to The IRA murder campaign. Sure The Republic used to have a claim in it's constitution to Northern Ireland (sovereign territory of a neighbouring country) and made very little effort to extradite these animals to The UK to stand trial. The IRA could say with justification that they were merely carrying out The Republic's foreign policy. Add to that, that every opinion poll carried out in The Republic showed a majority favoured a United Ireland and it's not difficult to see how The IRA could derive inspiration to continue it's campaign.

But beyond this, even at partition, politicians in The South told Northern Catholics that Northern Ireland was a 'house of cards' that wouldn't last and that they shouldn't get involved in it, thus sowing the seeds of community mistrust, which The IRA were to continue to exploit throughout Northern Ireland's history.

Perhaps if The Republic got more involved in world affairs it could lose it's myopic obsession with 'da North'.

Grudaire

futurehope wrote: »

The English most certainly do not go on about The Irish to the extent The Irish go on about The English. If you think that you've obviously never been to England. Nor do they go on about The French or Germans to that extent either. As for The French and Germans going on about each other and The Poles and Russians going on about each other, have you any proof of that? I personally doubt they do to the extent The Irish go on about The English. I doubt The American people would see Cuba as a big talking point (although I'm sure it works the other way). SMALL COUNTRY syndrome I'd say.

To be fair now - we were having a nice thread about how wonderful the lads of 1916 were for sacraficing so much for us before yourself and jimmmy came along and began saying how wonderful the Brits were here. I hope you point out the hypocrisy of the Bastille day in France as enthusiastically:rolleyes:

leitrim lad

in fairness lads have a bit of respect for our grandfathers and great grandfathers was it not for them we would still be bowing to the royal b1tch

O'Coonassa

futurehope wrote: »

Even ignoring FF involvement in setting up, arming and funding The Provisionals, the politicians and the people of The Republic gave plenty of support to The IRA murder campaign.

FF and the establishment favoured the Rosary Brigades rather than the more radical IRA (Officials) for the job of protecting the Catholic enclaves in the northeast that were coming under attack from a shower of paddies in bowler hats.

I wonder do you think that the Unionist community gave 'plenty of support' to the Loyalist murder campaign? Personally I don't think they did, and I don't think the people of the Republic supported the physical force nationalists either.