My Ould Lad needs help

Theresalwaysone

Hi all,

My oul fella is 108.4 kg, just under 6ft and 49 yrs old.

He is determined to get himself in shape and to be honest, Id like to get him in some reasonable shape too because if it keeps going like it is I can see lots of health problems arising.

Anyway, he has joined the gym and he got this programme from the trainer:

Crunches: 25x3, 35kg

Chest Press: 25x2, 32.5kg

Leg Press: 25x 2 60kg

Low Row pull: 25x2 35kg

Shoulder Press: 25x2 17.5kg

Leg Curl: 25x2 35kg

Lat Machine pull: 12x2 40kg

Ball Crunches: 2x20

He aslo has him doing some HiiT on the bike.

____________________________________________________________

Now Im not a personal trainer, have no degree in anything to do with personal training but tbh, this programme looks crap...

Im going to sort out his diet, make him pre-cook his food for the next day to avoid snacking and follow the stickies here to do it.

Can anyone critique this programme for him and suggest something better.

I was thinking of a modified SS and Stronglifts.

Thanks agaiin all.

MagicMarker

I'm not in the know like most who post here, but that program looks a little weird!

I think any newbie in the gym who's a little out of shape would have a problem doing 75 crunches, let alone adding 35kg onto them!!! :eek:

Is he supposed to do that program every time he hits the gym or is it split into different days? Because that's almost 400 reps in total as well as HIIT!

Now, I'm an unfit bastard, but I'm 25 and wouldn't be able to do half of that.

Theresalwaysone

The first crunches are on a machine.

tbh, My father probably said something like " I want to tone up my stomach" and then the "trainer" thought crunches...

I hate to be so cynical but when dad showed me this programme I couldnt believe it, I thought it was absolutely terrible for ANY fitness related goal.

FTA69

It looks like a load of sh*t to me to tell you the truth.

injured365

Any trainer who uses those ab machines in gym programmes is just trying to justify there presence. I think there useless

FTA69

injured365 wrote: »

Any trainer who uses those ab machines in gym programmes is just trying to justify there presence. I think there useless

I use them all the time, but I also supplement my sets with Swiss Ball crunches and that yoke with the half-ball where you tuck your knees up to get the lower abs.

rubadub

injured365 wrote: »

Any trainer who uses those ab machines in gym programmes is just trying to justify there presence. I think there useless

True, never thought of it like that. I had always thought people would use the expensive looking machines to think their membership fees are worthwhile, and they are getting good value from the "rental" of these machines. They might favour them over something simple which could be far more effective, like a chinup bar.

But it actually makes sense that a trainer would steer people away from free weights just to free them up! and to put people onto the unused machines so that all equipment is being used to its fullest. They would also steer people towards seemingly safe exercises so they would not be liable if they injured themselves, and do not have to monitor them much.

BossArky

Theresalwaysone wrote: »

Can anyone critique this programme for him and suggest something better.

How often is he going to the gym? Make sure he is "active" for 1 hr as opposed to just being in the gym standing around for an hour.

Walking would be a good option to intially burn a few hundred calories per week. Try 3km three times per week (I'm not sure if that is too much for a 49 year old who weights 100kg+ )

Use this to find a route around your area.

Diet is key.

Sit down with him and see if he can be presuaded to set some achievable fitness goals over the next year or two. e.g. take part in a charity walk, cycle event, etc.... This will provide a focus to training and keep him motivated.

Theresalwaysone

BossArky wrote: »

How often is he going to the gym? Make sure he is "active" for 1 hr as opposed to just being in the gym standing around for an hour.

Walking would be a good option to intially burn a few hundred calories per week. Try 3km three times per week (I'm not sure if that is too much for a 49 year old who weights 100kg+ )

Use this to find a route around your area.

Diet is key.

Sit down with him and see if he can be presuaded to set some achievable fitness goals over the next year or two. e.g. take part in a charity walk, cycle event, etc.... This will provide a focus to training and keep him motivated.

Thanks for the reply.

Do you think doing some compound excercises 3 times a week would be too much for him? Something like a 5x5 programme or similar.

He is willing to go to the gym as much as needed, he is a fairly determined chap.

cardio,shoot me

i personally like starting strength, leaves me fairly tired at the end of it

RoosterIllusion

Theresalwaysone wrote: »

The first crunches are on a machine.

tbh, My father probably said something like " I want to tone up my stomach" and then the "trainer" thought crunches...

I hate to be so cynical but when dad showed me this programme I couldnt believe it, I thought it was absolutely terrible for ANY fitness related goal.

For **** sake, the trainer should have given him a program that involves cardiovascular fitness and a solid nutritional program instead of weights. Definitely need to tell the trainer to cop on or go find a gym with proper staff.

celestial

I don't think you could make up a programme that looks more generic.

Diet comes first to be fair - otherwise most of your effort in the gym is undone. I'd suggest something like the following for the gym using dumbbells:

Warm-up bike 5 mins

Bench press
One-arm row
Shoulder press
Squats
Lat-pull down
Lunges
Plank

With a weight you can manage for around 3 x 8 reps.

Bike 10-15 mins
Cool-down 5 mins
Stretches

Main thing is that he is sweating and eating clean food - fat will start coming off pretty quickly.

BossArky

Theresalwaysone wrote: »

Do you think doing some compound excercises 3 times a week would be too much for him? Something like a 5x5 programme or similar.

I think he is way too heavy at the moment to be doing something like Starting Strength or a 5x5. He needs to loose a lot of fat. Is he well build under the fat, or just really out of shape fat?

Loose the fat through diet and gentle cardio (walking, cycling). Compound weights will definetly help (squat, deadlift, power clean, pull ups, rows, shoulder press, bench press) ... but I have no idea how easy it is to start off on this sort of stuff when you are 49 and 108kg.

Maybe set him a goal of getting to 100kg first of all through diet and walking?

Theresalwaysone

Thats the crux, I wasnt sure myself how his age would affect a) his recovery and b) his health by doing a lot of CNS intensive lifts.

I dont ever remember him not being fat, sounds awful but its the truth. There is a wedding photo were he is quite skinny but fook me that was years ago.

I would assume he was always skinny, not muscular.

I also want to have him getting into a good habit of gym work and cardio. He is the kind of person who needs to see immediate results. I have been telling him its not going to be miraculous but still I want him to feel like he is making progress or else he will lose interest.

I was thinking of getting him into the gym 2 days.

Day1: Squat 5x5
Shoulder Press 5x5
Lat Pulldown
Plank 3 x 1min
HiiT on Bike (something like 30mins broken up into 5min segments?)


Day2: Bench 5x5
Bent over Row 5x5
Push ups 3xF
DL 5x5
30 Min Swim

Monday/Wednesday split then Im home from College on Fridays and will go to the gym with him on a Saturday and we'll do Day1 again.

If he isnt feeling tired then I will be going walking with him on Fridays and Sunday nights, we have a 4k road circuit near our house.

Obv I know his diet is key and Ive it beaten into him that you cant out train a bad diet but I dont want to torture him either. As determined as he is I would like him to enjoy his pints with his mates or his occasional bar of chocolate, he is 49 after all, he doesnt need to be in super super shape.

edit: the weights programme will only be advised if people think that at his age he can handle it.

MagicMarker

TBH at his age he's probably better off consulting a GP first.

Theresalwaysone

MagicMarker wrote: »

TBH at his age he's probably better off consulting a GP first.

I agree. Now to convince him of this.

Sean_Ludawg

I wouldn't bother with the leg press and leg curl, both use the same muscle groups and are neglecting the hamstrings as far as I know.
I'd do squats instead, imo a much more rounded exercise, they are even very good for your core.
And I'd up the cardio too if you saw health problems down the line.

Theresalwaysone

Sean_Ludawg wrote: »

I wouldn't bother with the leg press and leg curl, both use the same muscle groups and are neglecting the hamstrings as far as I know.
I'd do squats instead, imo a much more rounded exercise, they are even very good for your core.
And I'd up the cardio too if you saw health problems down the line.

Did you even read the OP or any of the thread for that matter?

Sean_Ludawg

Theresalwaysone wrote: »

Did you even read the OP or any of the thread for that matter?

Eh ya... why? I saw no squats and offered an opinion.... have I made a balls of this or something?

Colm_OReilly

I don't see why everyone says he shouldn't be starting on weight straight away.

He should start trying to squat. Bringing the knee through a full range of motion in the correct manner is one of the best things he can do. Also, picking up stuff off the ground, deadlifting, will help too.

As for cardio, I'd stay away from running, since his knees wouldn't really be strong enough for the pounding he could take. I'd advise rowing, again because of the range of motion.

Here's a thing about overweight people and exercise. It mainly does just suck balls for them. For fit people, there's an enjoyment aspect to it, you feel good afterwards, and sometimes during too. For them, it's just uncomfortable, and they're overweight because they've spent they're life ensuring they're comfortable, ie, not making sacrifices.

So, you need to make exercise enjoyable for him. Whether that's just the sense of accomplishment, the fact he's spending time joking around with you, or whatever.

And, as everyone has said, diet is vital.

Brian?

Colm_OReilly wrote: »

I don't see why everyone says he shouldn't be starting on weight straight away.

He should start trying to squat. Bringing the knee through a full range of motion in the correct manner is one of the best things he can do. Also, picking up stuff off the ground, deadlifting, will help too.

Colm,

When you're working with someone completly out of shape and overweight do you always start getting them squatting straight away? Would you start with bodyweight squats without even a bar?

I'm just curious here to be honest, I'd be afraid to tell an extremly overweight person to start squatting as they'd probably have serious flexibility issues. But then I suppose watching them squat would probably a fairly good way of identifying any problems.

Ronan80

Has he tried Lipotrim. I am on my second week, I lost 12lbs in my first 7days of the diet. It is very strict, costs £58 per week and consists of 2 shakes a day, only water, black tea or black coffee and that is it! No fruit, no veg, nothing. Your body goes into ketosis after a few days and begins eating fat at a very rapid rate! The two shakes, one of which can be soup, has all the nutrients to remain in a healthy active state. It keeps you full all day as your body begins to cleanse itself. It is great stuff especially when you wake up each day getting thinner. Make sure you get the total food replacement programme and not the weight management formula. Brilliant, check it out!

MagicMarker

Ronan80 wrote: »

Has he tried Lipotrim. I am on my second week, I lost 12lbs in my first 7days of the diet. It is very strict, costs £58 per week and consists of 2 shakes a day, only water, black tea or black coffee and that is it! No fruit, no veg, nothing. Your body goes into ketosis after a few days and begins eating fat at a very rapid rate! The two shakes, one of which can be soup, has all the nutrients to remain in a healthy active state. It keeps you full all day as your body begins to cleanse itself. It is great stuff especially when you wake up each day getting thinner. Make sure you get the total food replacement programme and not the weight management formula. Brilliant, check it out!

A quick fix and nothing more.

Getting fit and healthy and staying that way means a drastic change in lifestyle. Yes it takes a hell of a lot longer and it's a hell of a lot harder, but it's healthy and will replace bad habits with good habits.

But anyway, lipotrim has been done to death on here, no need to add to it.

Colm_OReilly

briankeating wrote: »

Colm,

When you're working with someone completly out of shape and overweight do you always start getting them squatting straight away? Would you start with bodyweight squats without even a bar?

I'm just curious here to be honest, I'd be afraid to tell an extremly overweight person to start squatting as they'd probably have serious flexibility issues. But then I suppose watching them squat would probably a fairly good way of identifying any problems.

Hi Brian,

We start everyone squatting straight away. Like you pointed out, air squats at first, and then see what range of motion issues they have. It may take a few weeks before they're squatting at a level they actually put decent weight on the bar and get close to/break parallel, although sometimes the weight of the bar can help them get a little deeper.

Of course, we'll get them rowing, pressing, etc as well. Getting them moving as correctly as possible and constantly tightening up what they're doing.

Colm

Brian?

Colm_OReilly wrote: »

Hi Brian,

We start everyone squatting straight away. Like you pointed out, air squats at first, and then see what range of motion issues they have. It may take a few weeks before they're squatting at a level they actually put decent weight on the bar and get close to/break parallel, although sometimes the weight of the bar can help them get a little deeper.

Of course, we'll get them rowing, pressing, etc as well. Getting them moving as correctly as possible and constantly tightening up what they're doing.

Colm

Cheers Colm.