Random Questions

Sigma Force

Will be going to the down under expo. later on in the year but in the mean time just looking for general info.

Recommend areas suitable for family life in OZ..don't know where to start Perth, Sydney, Victoria etc? Gold coast seems to sound nice but haven't a clue properties are probably a bit pricey there too?

Basically looking for coastal area/near a busy town but with reasonable house prices. Prob. small 2 bed house with decent garden.

Are there rougher areas that need to be avoided, obviously there are high priced areas too but anyone recommend towns that are more family friendly with all the usual amenaties e.g. decent schools, shops etc.
Been trawling through property sites but it's very confusing because we don't even know what towns to look at so impossible to search.

Driving:What's the avereage cost of running a car, e.g. insurance etc.

Anything else you can think of starting from scratch here so any info. would be great.

cnocbui

Rockingham is a coastal town just south of Perth that would probably fit your requirements. I suggest using google maps to get an idea of it's location and setting.

As for houses, auctioneers are called 'real estate agents' down under and using Google, you would want to put 'site:au' to return searches just for Oz

Here is one real estate agents offerings for Rockingham WA - not to be confused for the one in QLD to give you an idea of prices.

http://www.realestate.com.au/cgi-bin/rsearch?id=rockingham&a=qfp&cu=fn-rea&t=res&q=Go

and here you go for the exchange rate:

http://www.oanda.com/convert/classic

Strangely enough, many natives like the idea of living close to the sea also, so property prices can reflect that.

http://www.myrockingham.net/ amenities etc.

cnocbui

Car insurance is generally less than Ireland due to fixed payments for personal injuries:

http://www.sgio.com.au/

BMW 120i €23,685 in Oz

€34,900 here (don't you love VRT?)

Health system is a lot better, education system below tertiary is worse.

The BOFH

I typed up a bit of an essay before about living in Perth: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=59123603&postcount=25

I'd recommend living south of the river myself but that's only a personal preference.

Xavi6

South of the river ftl!

Ah no, there are good spots both north and south. I live in Joondalup which is 27kms north of Perth but in the middle of a sprawling suburban area. It's basically fully functional and almost a mini-city in itself. I dn't need to leave the surrounding area for anything if I don't want to, that includes nightlife, shopping, sporting activities etc.

As mentioned, Rockingham is decent spot.

The BOFH

Xavi6 wrote: »

As mentioned, Rockingham is decent spot.

Is that the Rockingham with all the bogans or is there another Rockingham that I've missed?

cnocbui

The BOFH wrote: »

Is that the Rockingham with all the bogans or is there another Rockingham that I've missed?

There are places in and near Perth without Bogans? That's news to me.

There are all types of people living in Rockingham, as with most places.

The BOFH

One thing about Aussies, just because they've got a Commy or a Kingswood up on blocks in the garden & have lots of tattoos & look rough doesn't mean they're not good people. I've got a family of car hoarders across the road from me & they're the nicest bunch ever, apart from having to listen to them trying to start a variety of old Holdens to get to work at 5:30 on a Winters morning.

FreeAnd..

As mentioned, Rockingham is decent spot.

Funny, never heard it being described as a decent spot...not by anyone who grew up there anyway

cnocbui

FreeAnd.. wrote: »

Funny, never heard it being described as a decent spot...not by anyone who grew up there anyway

Would you be referring to the one in QLD or the one in WA

FreeAnd..

Would you be referring to the one in QLD or the one in WA

definitely the Bogansville in WA -

There are places in and near Perth without Bogans? That's news to me.

is news to me too...perth often has the preception of being pleasantsville but scratch the surface and its a meth riddled crack hole...same with most of the towns off it...besides that, its far too cold for most of the year...If i had to choose between east coast and west - the east wins everytime

I hadnt heard great things about Brisbane but so far it whoops Perths ass...an hour either way to either the Sunshine coast or gold coast, and the water is actually warm to allow for enjoyable swimming

Xavi6

FreeAnd.. wrote: »

Funny, never heard it being described as a decent spot...not by anyone who grew up there anyway

There are a lot of new housing areas in Rockingham that have sprung up over the past year or two. My cousin bought there last year and it's a really nice, clean friendly area.

Yes it's got dodgy parts but everywhere does. Still a hell of a lot safer than most of Ireland.

FreeAnd.. wrote: »

is news to me too...perth often has the preception of being pleasantsville but scratch the surface and its a meth riddled crack hole...same with most of the towns off it...besides that, its far too cold for most of the year...If i had to choose between east coast and west - the east wins everytime

Huh?

Perth is basking in 30 degree plus heat from November until April pretty much whereas the east coast it pisses rain all the time (I spent 3 and a half weeks in Queensland last Christmas and got ONE day of sunshine). Yearly floods anyone?

I hadnt heard great things about Brisbane but so far it whoops Perths ass...an hour either way to either the Sunshine coast or gold coast, and the water is actually warm to allow for enjoyable swimming

The beaches in WA are a million times nicer than anything on the Gold Coast.

FreeAnd..

Perth is basking in 30 degree plus heat from November until April pretty much whereas the east coast it pisses rain all the time (I spent 3 and a half weeks in Queensland last Christmas and got ONE day of sunshine). Yearly floods anyone?

Thats only half the story - last year it didnt get warm until well into December and was nice until April...but thats only for a few hours during the day - what about when it gets dark? Its bloody freezing - gets down to 0C at night too...Ive met a lot of Aussies who like Perth but couldnt live there because its too cold and I'd definitely agree with them

The beaches in WA are a million times nicer than anything on the Gold Coast.

Some beautiful beaches alright, I dont doubt that - especially places like esperance but im not big on beaches where the water is too cold to get into...North of WA is a different story altogether but on the other hand you cant really compare the entire length of WA to the Gold coast? One you can drive in an hour the other would take a week? If you were to compare WA to QLD then OLD wins...The fact is there is so much variety in QLD and its so much more accessible than in WA (and the water is so much warmer except for the North of WA)...you cant really write off a place after spending 3 and a hlaf weeks there...(and you cant say it doesnt rain in Perth either - One thing I found about Perth is the impression you get of it from people living there is far different than the reality)

Xavi6

FreeAnd.. wrote: »

Thats only half the story - last year it didnt get warm until well into December and was nice until April...but thats only for a few hours during the day - what about when it gets dark? Its bloody freezing - gets down to 0C at night too...Ive met a lot of Aussies who like Perth but couldnt live there because its too cold and I'd definitely agree with them

Correct me if I'm wrong but the temperatures in say Sydney and Melbourne during winter time is colder than Perth.

Sure Brisbane itself gets down to 2 or 3 degrees in winter, hardly much different to 0 degrees (which is a rarity btw).

Some beautiful beaches alright, I dont doubt that - especially places like esperance but im not big on beaches where the water is too cold to get into...North of WA is a different story altogether but on the other hand you cant really compare the entire length of WA to the Gold coast? One you can drive in an hour the other would take a week? If you were to compare WA to QLD then OLD wins...The fact is there is so much variety in QLD and its so much more accessible than in WA (and the water is so much warmer except for the North of WA)...you cant really write off a place after spending 3 and a hlaf weeks there...(and you cant say it doesnt rain in Perth either - One thing I found about Perth is the impression you get of it from people living there is far different than the reality)

I never said it doesn't rain in Perth. It does, just not for weeks on end in the summer like it does in Queensland. That's what happens when you get somewhere in a tropical climate. Gimme 4 or 5 weeks rainless mid-30 degree weeks over that any day.

hussey

http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/world/city_guides/results.shtml?tt=TT003030
Sydney


melbourne
http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/world/city_guides/results.shtml?tt=TT003020


Perth
http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/world/city_guides/results.shtml?tt=TT003050

Diadora

WA is nice 'n all but New South Wales is probably where a lot of people will end up (prob depends on what your occupation is to some extent).

Areas in NSW that are not Sydney and where people rave about the quality of living are Wollongong, Gosford and the Central Coast. You can commute from all of these places to Sydney by train/car (say 60-90 minutes each way) but they wouldn't be my cup of tea.

The BOFH

FreeAnd.. wrote: »

Thats only half the story - last year it didnt get warm until well into December and was nice until April...but thats only for a few hours during the day - what about when it gets dark? Its bloody freezing - gets down to 0C at night too...Ive met a lot of Aussies who like Perth but couldnt live there because its too cold and I'd definitely agree with them

Some beautiful beaches alright, I dont doubt that - especially places like esperance but im not big on beaches where the water is too cold to get into...North of WA is a different story altogether but on the other hand you cant really compare the entire length of WA to the Gold coast? One you can drive in an hour the other would take a week? If you were to compare WA to QLD then OLD wins...The fact is there is so much variety in QLD and its so much more accessible than in WA (and the water is so much warmer except for the North of WA)...you cant really write off a place after spending 3 and a hlaf weeks there...(and you cant say it doesnt rain in Perth either - One thing I found about Perth is the impression you get of it from people living there is far different than the reality)

Have you sure you have actually been in Perth? Because it sounds like you're talking out your arse TBH, unless you spent 3 weeks living in Kwinana in a Homes West house, (of which there is a limit of how many can be in any one estate/street). In Winter it rains heavily, usually in showers which don't last very long, it is rare to get rain all day or even grey skies all day. Summer started late here in 2008 which is a relief because it frequently gets over 40C for days on end. It doesn't get cold at night in Summer, unless you think high teens, low twenties is cold. We had a relatively cool summer overall which again is a relief, we've had some stinkers the last couple of years. In Winter the daytime temperatures rarely go below 10C with 20C days not being a rarity either. Night time tempatures never go below 0C and even that gets onto the news because it is so rare, I get up at the coldest time of day & it is usually 3 - 5C even on the coldest days. Most days by 9 - 10am you won't need a jacket, or even a t-shirt under your business shirt unless it is raining, then have a good brolly.

Perth, like any other capital city, has its dodgy areas but it's hardly a "meth riddled crack hole...same with most of the towns off it", and is by far safer feeling than any comparable city I've been to in Australia. If anything the surrounding suburbs are undergoing a gentrification and the scum are being pushed out even more.

FreeAnd..

Have you sure you have actually been in Perth? Because it sounds like you're talking out your arse TBH, unless you spent 3 weeks living in Kwinana in a Homes West house, (of which there is a limit of how many can be in any one estate/street). In Winter it rains heavily, usually in showers which don't last very long, it is rare to get rain all day or even grey skies all day. Summer started late here in 2008 which is a relief because it frequently gets over 40C for days on end. It doesn't get cold at night in Summer, unless you think high teens, low twenties is cold. We had a relatively cool summer overall which again is a relief, we've had some stinkers the last couple of years. In Winter the daytime temperatures rarely go below 10C with 20C days not being a rarity either. Night time tempatures never go below 0C and even that gets onto the news because it is so rare, I get up at the coldest time of day & it is usually 3 - 5C even on the coldest days. Most days by 9 - 10am you won't need a jacket, or even a t-shirt under your business shirt unless it is raining, then have a good brolly.

Lived and worked there for 8 months - lived in an apartment in the city for 7 months and south of the river for the rest worked not too far south of the river, been living and working in QLD for 6 months so I think i can fairly compare the two...factor in the wind in Perth too, makes it even colder...im shuddering now at how cold it gets there :eek:

Perth, like any other capital city, has its dodgy areas but it's hardly a "meth riddled crack hole...

So you lived in the city then? have you ever walked around it in the evening after the place shuts down? And im not on about the dodgy areas...(as for it even really being a city in world terms - kind of like calling Kilkenny a city) as for the suburbs...some strange sh*t goes down out there...

Personally Perth, in relation to everywhere else Ive been in Austrlia ranks pretty much at the bottom...its as boring a city you can find, the beaches are nice but the waters cold and its an effort to get to anywhere with a bit of variety...Margaret River is nice and the North of WA is unreal...still possibly my favourite place in Aus...to me, Perth gives the rest of WA a bad name and you'll meet alot of people who think the same (generally after they moved away because it was too cold )

The Sweeper

Guys, I don't want to see the words "cold" or "hot" again on this thread without a specific temperature range mentioned and a link to a weather site to back it up.

One man's 20 degrees and mild is another man's sweltering heatwave. Same goes for 30 degrees and same for 40 degrees.

Back on topics that are useful for the OP please, and less bickering about the intricacies of Perth.

Xavi6

Minesajackdaniels wrote: »

Guys, I don't want to see the words "cold" or "hot" again on this thread without a specific temperature range mentioned and a link to a weather site to back it up.

Bah, I was just about to go off on a Katy Perry tangent.


/gets coat and makes very hasty exit

The BOFH

Minesajackdaniels wrote: »

Back on topics that are useful for the OP please, and less bickering about the intricacies of Perth.

Yeah, if you want somewhere you can really slag off try Adelaide. Freak Town!

cnocbui

FreeAnd.. wrote: »

Lived and worked there for 8 months - lived in an apartment in the city for 7 months and south of the river for the rest worked not too far south of the river, been living and working in QLD for 6 months so I think i can fairly compare the two...factor in the wind in Perth too, makes it even colder...im shuddering now at how cold it gets there :eek:

You are ignorant, and that IS being polite.

July and August are the depths of winter in Perth. The average daily maximum for July is 17.4 and the average minimum is 9.

For August, the figures are 18 and 9.2, respectively.

http://www.bom.gov.au/climate/averages/tables/cw_009034.shtml

Those averages wouldn't be too far off the average summer temperatures for Ireland, and you are complaining the place is cold! What are you?

As for your long and extensive experience living there. I am a native of Perth and lived there for over 30 years.

(as for it even really being a city in world terms - kind of like calling Kilkenny a city) as for the suburbs...some strange sh*t goes down out there...

Again, your expertise and knowledge leave me in awe. Perth has a population of 1.5 million. I wonder how that compares to Dublin?

The population of the Greater Dublin Area (Dublin City; Dun Laoghaire-Rathdown; Fingal; South Dublin; Kildare; Meath; and Wicklow) as of Census 2006 was 1,661,185 persons.

wikipedia

Personally Perth, in relation to everywhere else Ive been in Austrlia ranks pretty much at the bottom...its as boring a city you can find,

Yes, the OP would be far better off in terms of excitement in Adelaide then, by your reckoning? Been to Melbourne by any chance? Or perhaps Hobart is one non stop party.

Did you read the OP's criteria? He was asking about a sun/water/sand environment. Your mentioning the beaches is about the only accurate or helpful thing you have said so far.

My experience of Perths aquatic and coastal environment lead me to suggest Rockingham. Your mentioning a minority element of undesirables is like people labeling Limerick stab city when the it has less violent crime than Dublin.

the beaches are nice but the waters cold and its an effort to get to anywhere with a bit of variety...Margaret River is nice and the North of WA is unreal...still possibly my favourite place in Aus...to me, Perth gives the rest of WA a bad name and you'll meet alot of people who think the same (generally after they moved away because it was too cold )

Waters cold? In the depths of winter you need no more than a wet-suit. In Summer, you can swim in the sea without one.

You can drive to Carnarvon in a day - that's 902 km (560miles) You can drive to Albany and be there before lunch time. Driving in Ireland is an effort, Driving in WA is a case of closing your eyes and setting the alarm to wake you up so you don't overshoot - in comparison.

Perth has been the fastest growing city in OZ. In an Economist ranking of world cities in terms of livability, Perth came 4th in world rankings, How Melbourne came second is beyond me. Sydney came 6 palces behind Perth in 10th place, Brisbane doesn't crack a mention in the top 11.

http://www.economist.com/markets/rankings/displaystory.cfm?story_id=11116839

So how do you explain the incredible divergence of your opinions from objective reality? Do you work for the Brisbane tourist office or something?

FreeAnd..

exactly - people from there have one warped view of the place and as for Ignorant? Funny that coming from someone from Perth...suggesting driving to Carnarvon for god knows what reason says it all - I think anyone can fairly guage a place after living and working for a few months (I guess you lived in every city in Australia for a considerable amount of time to judge?)

When I talk about a city, I am referring to the city centre - you can tell alot by the life in a city centre outside of work hours Perth doesnt have one...and its a shame because its a nice looking little 'city' - Brisbane is better than Perth in that regard but its still no New York - the places you can get to in a day from here are far to great to mention but even the worst is a thousand times better than Carnarvon (where the hills have eyes)

If I am correct the Perth Metropolitan area is as big if not bigger than greater Dublin

The population of the Greater Dublin Area (Dublin City; Dun Laoghaire-Rathdown; Fingal; South Dublin; Kildare; Meath; and Wicklow) as of Census 2006 was 1,661,185 persons.

If anyone by this classes Meath and Wicklow in Dublin CITY then id like to hear their views...same way I wouldnt class Mandurah or Joondalup in Perth City

Perth has been the fastest growing city in OZ. In an Economist ranking of world cities in terms of livability, Perth came 4th in world rankings,

Wont last much longer - seeing as it was based on unsustainable mining (and their own housing bubble), and the Economist also put Ireland at Number 1 a few years back - says it all

My advise to the OP is - do not listen to someone from Perth in relation to Perth (they do have a warped view)...do not settle anywhere until you first live there for a few months until you get a feel for the place. Definitely do not buy a house until you are ready to cimmit - I have friends who bought in Perth but ended up selling up and moving to the the gold coast.

So how do you explain the incredible divergence of your opinions from objective reality?

I like that quote - I couldnt describe the Perthian (is that what is is?) view better myself

Back on topics that are useful for the OP please, and less bickering about the intricacies of Perth.

Apologies...maybe we should start a Perth Appreciation thread for the Perth people

cnocbui

And still, after all your unhelpful negatives, you have still not supplied the OP with anything constructive.

Xavi6

I'm struggling to see why you have such a blatant hatred for Perth and a massive vendetta, going so far as to tell the OP not to listen to people who actually live there. The mind boggles at this because surely those who have settled there are in a great position to tell the OP what is good and what is bad. I mean, to complain about how cold the seas water is really is clutching for anyhting to bad mouth.

You seem to think Brisbane city is some sort of happy haven in comparison to dull oul Perth. I simply don't understand this as I would put Brisbane on a par with Perth in terms of excitement and opportunities. Brisbane city is hardly the partycapital of the world and the most exciting spots are a good hour and half away down the Gold Coast.

I do agree with you on not buying a house immediately, although if prices continue to plummet then there is some justification for it.

The OP should maybe listen to someone who is a bit more impartial than yourself, and even myself, as I think we're at opposite ends of the scale when it comes to opinions on Perth.

FreeAnd..

And still, after all your unhelpful negatives, you have still not supplied the OP with anything constructive.

As opposed to your constructive input? :rolleyes:

I'm struggling to see why you have such a blatant hatred for Perth and a massive vendetta, going so far as to tell the OP not to listen to people who actually live there.

From there not live there...although there were a few descenting voices when I was there wondering why anyone would decide to move there...I dont have a hatred for Perth and there are alot of things there that were spot on - bus and train to work and I was still in the exact same time every morning but in my experience its far from the eutopia portrayed by people from there (most who have never been anywhere else in Australia) -

You seem to think Brisbane city is some sort of happy haven in comparison to dull oul Perth. I simply don't understand this as I would put Brisbane on a par with Perth in terms of excitement and opportunities. Brisbane city is hardly the partycapital of the world and the most exciting spots are a good hour and half away down the Gold Coast.

Where did you get this rubbish from? Who's talking about party capitals or happy havens? (although in comparison to Perth, Athlone would be one of those ) I remember walking along Hay street in the CBD early enough on a Saturday evening and whispering because it was so quiet...I could hear myself echoing off the buildings...pretty surreal feeling -

To be honest I wouldnt reccommend anyone settle in Brisbane long term either, but thats just me, I prefer bigger cities - if I had kids and was looking to settle then maybe i'd have a different view...if they had to choose between here and Perth then in my book, its an easy answer...and I'd take an hours drive to a variety of attractions over a few days drive anytime...

The OP should maybe listen to someone who is a bit more impartial than yourself, and even myself, as I think we're at opposite ends of the scale when it comes to opinions on Perth.

Agreed, there is nowhere in Australia the OP should move to until they have lived for a while and can weigh up the life style versus the opportunities...even if those opportunities are dwindling by the day

missannik

OP I think you need to give us more info on what you are really looking for, there is far too much choice for locations! And a LOT will depend on your line of work as well. Perhaps you should let us know what towns/cities have interested you thus far and we can then comment.

Guineapigrescue wrote: »

Basically looking for coastal area/near a busy town but with reasonable house prices.

I'm not going to comment on other States, but in Victoria, you might be interested in Melbourne, Geelong, Warrnambool. Really depends on what your definition of "busy town" is.

As for house prices (either renting or buying) check out...
http://www.realestate.com.au/
http://www.domain.com.au/

Guineapigrescue wrote: »

Driving:What's the avereage cost of running a car, e.g. insurance etc.

Check out
http://www.racv.com.au/wps/wcm/connect/Internet/Primary/insurance/car+insurance/
http://www.aami.com.au/car-insurance/car-insurance-details.aspx

The Sweeper

Guineapigrescue, I apologise that users FreeAnd... and Cnocbui continued to bicker off topic after I specifically requested that we have:

less bickering about the intricacies of Perth

Cnocbui and FreeAnd..: DO NOT POST AGAIN ON THIS THREAD.

I have a number of choices here - I can ban you for ignoring the on-thread warning, but I don't like banning people, even when they choose to stupidly ignore me. I could infract both of you for ignoring the on-thread warning, but undoubtedly since you choose to ignore an on-thread warning you may start an on-thread argument about your infractions.

The third option I have is to lock this thread, but that isn't fair to the OP.

Hence, I'm going for the final option. Do not contribute again to this thread. Allow other people to offer guidance to the OP - you've all had your back and forth says, over and over again, on this thread, and you've been heard.

Leave it at that, thank you. If you have any queries about this, PM me.

Sigma Force

"OP I think you need to give us more info on what you are really looking for, there is far too much choice for locations! And a LOT will depend on your line of work as well. Perhaps you should let us know what towns/cities have interested you thus far and we can then comment."

Yeh, I know it's hard to even narrow it down to an area because we're still learning about the country and the various towns and cities etc.
We definetly wouldn't like to be in a city center rather prefer a town with all the ameneties e.g.school, shops, etc. I guess ideally a town similar in size to Kilkenny (ok that's a city but it's just a biggish town really) or Wicklow town itself big enough to have the population but not so big that you end up lost and confused.

Job wise hubby is a postie and it seems from what we've read so far that the work is pretty much the same as here so we thought that might be the most sensible job option for him.
Where ever we lived would obviously have to be near his work, he doesn't drive (don't get me started on his refusal to learn grr) so we'd have to live within walkin distance of his work or within a mile or so of it anyway.
Wether or not the post office over there would take him on or not is another thing, that would also depend on wages and living costs as well etc.

We aren't rushing to go over, I want to get myself some sort of a qualification before hand, perhaps working from home. It would also make more sense for us to perhaps take a holiday to Oz and check the country out as well. Wish we'd thought of this when we had no ties lol. We also have dogs so that makes it more complicated, I understand that they only allow cats and dogs and no pet birds etc. are allowed in. What are landlords like over there about pets, are they as bad as Ireland?

I guess it would be bonkers to try and buy a house over there straight away and instead renting somewhere for a year makes the most sense? At least with renting you can move easier if a town doesn't work out etc. Or if he was let go and we had to leave etc.

We wouldn't mind not living on the coast as long as it was a reasonable drive to it.

Obviously the most important thing would be hubbys job if postie jobs were hard to come by I'm not sure he'd want to go (stuck in his ways that way).

If hubby were to get a postie transfer to another county in Ireland he would have to start from the bottom again and work his way up so I presume it would be the same in Oz. Sometimes it's easier to take the easy option and just stay put but really the quality of life in Ireland sucks he's working 6 days a week for years works around 63 hours a week (think that's about right).
His route is around 35 miles a week, and also cycles a further 70 miles to and from work a week. We'd be wanting to of course cut out the extra 70 miles a week so he'd have more time if we moved. He'd be leaving a secure job and decent pension behind but he could kick the bucket before he hits pensionable age at this rate.

It wouldn't be worth us going if he had to work the same amount of hours though, although he's willing to work hard if we moved to Oz we would be hoping he'd have some weekends free and that the cost of living would be lower so that we could actually do stuff as a family.

I'm waffling on a bit..ok a lot.. here but hopefully you have a better idea of our situation, if we sold up and moved we could afford to pay our rent for the year so at least that would be covered.

The Sweeper

GPR, I'll give you my personal experience and you can see if that will be of use to you.

First things first, I live inland, in rural Victoria. I live in a small town, pop. circa 5,000. In fact, here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kilmore,_Victoria

That's where I live.

I've just moved into a project-built house (where you buy some land and then buy a house off the plans and the builder builds it for you with the colours and interiors you choose yourself). The house is 2600 sq ft including a double garage, four bedrooms, study, a large kitchen/living area and a separate lounge room. The block of land is 1,200m2 (that's just under one third of an acre). All in, including house and land, the finished product cost me, in euros, €160,200.

Weirdly, the town reminds me strongly of Bray in Ireland back in the late 1970s early 1980s, when I was a child. Perhaps it's just the small town feel that I'm recognising, where people in the shops know you and so on.

This town has all of the desirable amenities - schools, both public and private, for all age ranges of children; supermarkets, one large and a number of smaller ones; three pubs (yeah, I know, in Ireland that'd be closer to 20 pubs ); restaurants, shops etc. The shopping is a bit crap in terms of clothes and shoes but you'll find something to do for you in a pinch, plus the shopping at Epping is a 45 minute drive away.

That's the next issue. Driving.

Seriously: if you don't drive, you won't survive outside a major city in Australia.

The distances in question, relative to Ireland, are HUGE. The 'Australian dream' used to be a detached house on a quarter acre block, and the frontages on those blocks are around 12 to 15 metres, (so you're talking one postbox every 12-15 metres!) My postie drives a moped to deliver post in the summer, and a little van in the winter.

The pressure on land was never as intense down here as it has been in Europe for thousands of years. Subsequently, in this little town of 5,000 people, it would take me 40 minutes to walk to the supermarket, and easily an hour to walk to the train station from where I live - and I live at the south end of the main road of the town! As the crow flies, I'm 8.5kms from the supermarket. Getting there in the car is no bother, takes less than 10 minutes. On foot - well, I just couldn't do it. Might be different if I were a keen cyclist, but then there's the problem of what I could carry home on the bike...

Anyway - the upshot is that towns and suburbs are spread over a far wider area than equivalently populated towns and suburbs in Ireland. Most of the cars down here are automatic rather than manual, however, which makes them point and go, so it's easier to learn to drive! Trust me, I held a full manual licence for two years in England before moving to Australia, and I never used it because I couldn't bear driving on the roads in SE England. I was a seriously nervous driver, and now I'm a happy (enough) driver to manage rural and suburban roads and highways, and if I can do it anybody can.

Still though, if the big question is what your husband's working life is going to be like if he moves down here - that's unanswerable. Will he still be cycling huge distances? Yes, possibly, if they'll even take him on without a driving licence. Will it be an improvement? Well it'll be cycling vast distances in sunshine and warm weather more often than not. He certainly won't be cycling against horizontal hailstones wearing one of those full-body macs - well, maybe once every two years he might break it out of the closet if we have a freak storm.

In general, Australian working hours are not as intense as those in Ireland and England. Sure, if you want to you can do 70 hours a week, but there's a strong work/life balance ethic here, especially in the 'burbs and country areas, and if 5pm is when your day finishes then that's when it finishes.

I will say I strongly believe that suburban and rural Australia is an excellent place to raise kids. I see kids around me having the sort of outdoors-oriented childhood I had myself, where you can still run and cycle and play ball in the public parks and there are skateboard parks provided for you, for instance, and people generally don't hate kids so you won't get yelled at to shut up or eff off or go somewhere else when all you're doing is hanging out and minding your own business. All of the pubs and restaurants around us are family oriented.

It was a major adjustment for us to move from London (Sit-down curry at 11pm? Not a problem. Pizza delivery after the pub at 1am? I'm sure there's somewhere that does it. Will you pop to the shops for me? I want a guava, a moisturiser, a bunch of lemongrass, a pork pie, a dorothy perkins swing coat and a pair of Firetrap boots - you'll get them all in the mall, which is a 10 minute walk away) to Kilmore (can't get a meal out after 8pm, the hotel restaurant uses butchers paper as tablecloths, if you want to go clothes shopping you'll need to drive for 45 minutes), but it's been well worth it, and after our initial rocky settling in period, I can tell you this was the best move we ever made. Australia is definitely the right place, right time for us - and we're here two years in April.

A holiday first is definitely a good idea - you need to get a feel for distance and atmosphere yourselves before you commit to living here.

Sammag

Minesajackdaniels wrote: »

In general, Australian working hours are not as intense as those in Ireland and England. There's a strong work/life balance ethic here, especially in the 'burbs and country areas, and if 5pm is when your day finishes then that's when it finishes.

Sorry, I would disagree with this particular statement, I think it's a common misconception portrayed to Irish people/other nationalities about working in Oz. I can't comment on industries based in rural areas of Victoria as I've never worked there but in the larger cities and within the more corporate sector, this just isn't true.

I work in the Creative Industry, my husband in Banking in the city, both of us have found, along with other mates who work in industries such as; I.T. etc., that the working hours are not at all as relaxed as they were in Ireland. A lot of companies expect you to work 8/8.30am to 6pm and beyond. In the 3 firms I have worked at in Melbourne, I rarely got out the door before 6.30/7.00pm. I was also normally the first to leave. My husband starts work before 8am and walks in the door most nights at 7.30/8pm and we only live 15 mins from Melbourne CBD.

I was always quite taken-aback at how few of my colleagues took their full allocation of annual leave holidays. In typical Irish style, I would have by 4 weeks booked, I started to feel like quite out of place in doing so after my second year working here.

http://www.news.com.au/business/story/0,27753,24891063-5012426,00.html

The Sweeper

I should have stressed more that I meant rural and burbs really. I think the city work used to be better than it is - used to be more based on the US model, of starting v. early (7.30 - 8am) but out the door home at 5/5.30pm, but then they started leaning towards the British model, which is start early and leave late.

I wonder if some of it is because of the amount of work some of the aussie corporates do with offices in other countries. I have a cousin who works in IT in the city, and he works crazy hours but then he's director-level. Most of his crazy hours are because he ends up on conference calls with the support staff in India.

Rural and suburbs (depending how far out you are) still are very much "end of shift and you're out the door" - but then again that's because everything bloody closes out here early, so they have to make sure you get home on time!

Obviously your hours also depends on the work. I'm pretty sure the post offices are unionised in Victoria, so I can't see a postie working unpaid overtime. (I have a cousin works for Australia Post, but she's a counter dolly - I'm sure she's in a union.)

The Sweeper

Dearie me. Thread edited to remove silly outburst by k974, and the rest of you go get your popcorn somewhere else.

Zambia

Here is a random question

Does anyone else hear of a clause stating they build up their holidays before taking them, ie you get 5 weeks a year but cant take them in the first year...

So you are employed in Jan then the following Jan have 5 weeks holidays. You get no time of in between?

hussey

I've heard of that - never to an extreme like that though
but you have to work your holidays in teh first year before taking them.

e.g. a friend of mine wants to take 4weeks of in April, he has only worked enough for 2 weeks, so he has to take 2 weeks hols, 2 weeks unpaid leave

but will get holidays later in the year too!

The Sweeper

Zambia232, I know someone who had a clause like that in his first year on his job, but he works a commission-only sales job. I believe he was entitled to annual leave in year one, but he had to take it unpaid. After 12 months, the company calculates his annual leave salary by getting the average weekly commission he made in the previous year, and giving him that as a leave pay rate.

Is the clause you're referring do definitely 12 months with no leave, or is there a facility to take unpaid leave?

Zambia

Minesajackdaniels wrote: »

Is the clause you're referring do definitely 12 months with no leave, or is there a facility to take unpaid leave?

Probably is but with consent of the employer. Yeap cant take leave for a year. Ouch theres a kick in the nads. Well there was nowhere I was planning on going

There is a lot more I cant go into, but was just curious to see had anyone ever heard of it.

missannik

^ ^ ^ Since the introduction of Work Choices, that clause and similar clauses have become commonplace unfortunately.

Crumble Froo

contract i signed the other week was to that effect. think there's something about taking time off pre-emptively, but ill look that up if it ever becomes relevant.

Zambia

Luckily I get a fair amount of space between shifts.

It is a workplace agreement so its only in effect till December of this year.