Why are dogs not allowed in restaurants?

olaola

Is it at the owner's discretion or is it a legal thing?

Kintarō Hattori

Health and Safety I'd suspect. A pretty obvious one really.

cowzerp

Hygiene, noise, potential bad behaviour!

you cant be serious asking this question, i love dogs but not in a restaurant when im trying to eat.

olaola

I don't see how hygiene is a problem, it's not as if the chef is running out and petting the dogs before plating your meal. It's sucessfully dealt with in continental Europe, so why can it not happen here?

Elaborate on the obvious 'health and safety' issue.

youcrazyjesus!

Somebody could trip over them, they could pester somebody for food, they could take a poop, they could pee, they could have fleas,
could be in heat, they could have a **** or a **** and stink up the place, they could snap at somebody, other customers may not
like it and demand action. Leave the dog at home going if going for a meal.

olaola

Why aren't these 'obvious' problems a problem on continental Europe?

Does anyone actaully know the legal standpoint?

youcrazyjesus!

The legal standpoint is that an owner can set whatever rule he likes in
relation to allowing dogs on his premises. Restaurant goers do not want to go
someplace with 25 dogs barking at each other. Why anybody cares about this
is beyond me. Ive never been for a meal in a restaurant in Europe that had a
dog in it.

Hellrazer

youcrazyjesus! wrote: »

Somebody could trip over them, they could pester somebody for food, they could take a ****, they could pee, ................. Leave the dog at home going
for a meal, ffs.

The legal standpoint is that an owner can set whatever the **** rule he likes

Do you have to use language like that to get the point across.
Calm it down a bit would you.

Whispered

youcrazyjesus! wrote: »

Somebody could trip over them,

I've seen children run into waitresses carrying trays, only for the mother to start shouting at the waitress!

youcrazyjesus! wrote: »

they could pester somebody for food,

This has happened to me, with a child, big grubby hand on my dinner plate - again the mother or father not paying any attention.

youcrazyjesus! wrote: »

they could take a ****, they could pee,

House trained dog would not and kids often dirty themselves too in public places :eek:

youcrazyjesus! wrote: »

they could have fleas,

Kids are worse carries of cold, flu, headlice, other sicknesses that can directly affect people I would imagine.

youcrazyjesus! wrote: »

could be in heat.

So what?

youcrazyjesus! wrote: »

they could snap at somebody

I remember my mother getting a bottle across the back of the head when I was younger, obviously not thrown by a dog, but by a disobedient little brat of a child. And besides I would assume that any place like this would have a rule saying dogs to be kept on leads.

youcrazyjesus! wrote: »

other customers may not like it and demand action

If I go to a family restaurant and have to sit listening to children scream, shout, spread their grems, throw things, stick their hands into my food etc (see above) there is very little point in me "demanding action" as it is a family restaurant. Similarly, if a dog friendly place opened and you don't want to eat around dogs, then either go and put up with it, or don't go.

youcrazyjesus! wrote: »

Leave the dog at home going
for a meal

leave the children at home too please!

youcrazyjesus! wrote: »

ffs.

You're obviously very upset someone asked this question. :rolleyes:

If there was a restaurant or pub where they allowed dogs anywhere close to me, I'd be there instead of anywhere else. Even if not to bring my boy to all the time, but to see the other dogs and meet other dog owners. I would love to see it happen.

Kintarō Hattori

olaola wrote: »

Elaborate on the obvious 'health and safety' issue.

Fleas
Dog pea and poo

---

> Kids
Leashes

---

> Folks could trip
Dog gets loose

---

> Waiters have the potential to be tripped, dog could run into the kitchen

What works in other one country doesn't always carry over to another.

olaola

I don't really know what part of continental Europe you have visited, but I have shared many restaruants with dogs over the years. I've never, ever heard one bark. Seen it beg for food. Seen people trip over them. Seen fleas hop off their coat and infect the general population. To be honest, the reason why you didn't see the dog was probably because it was so quiet and you just didn't notice it.

I'm just curious as to why they aren't allowed over here. I've seen dogs in bars here, and I was wondering if the publicans were breaking the law or were they allowed to let them in.

lightening

Jaysus, what restaurants do you go to Helena???

This comparing dogs to kids has gotta little bit outa control if you ask me.

(I have been in restaurants with dogs in France, but the dogs were very very well behaved.)

Hellrazer

Helena--theres an idea for a start up restaurant--Dublins only dog friendly restaurant (tm).
Anyone want to invest in the idea before someone steals it??

While I agree with most of your post I dont agree with why you`re comparing it to kids in restaurants.
I can bring my 4 to any restaurant anywhere and not one of them will misbehave in the fashion like youre making out.

Micky Dolenz

helena.ryan wrote: »

I've seen children run into waitresses carrying trays, only for the mother to start shouting at the waitress!


.

Ah, Children are human and dogs are animals. Nuff said:cool:

olaola

I would assume an owner would only bring a well trained dog to public places. The scenario of a dog making a sudden bee-line for the kitchen and sneaking off with the carvery lunch clamped in its jaws is slightly preposterous.

cowzerp

lightening wrote: »

This comparing dogs to kids has gotta little bit outa control if you ask me.

Its beyond ridiculus, i love my dogs like kids but there animals at the end of the day, i would agree with helena if it was a specialist restaurant for dogs but apart from that its just madness.

PurpleBerry

I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for it to happen over here (non-continental Europe??). Restaurants in Ireland and the U.K. have already refused service to people with guide dogs.

In Kent.

In Ireland.

In Hertfordshire.

I really don't know where you are dining out. Only certain holiday hotspots would be desperate enough for business that they would allow dogs. It would be similiar to asking "Why can't we smoke cannabis in bars and restaurants over here? They do it in continental Europe."

g'em

There's a zoonoses issue too - even wormed dogs can still carry diseases that are transmissible to humans.

Whispered

lightening wrote: »

Jaysus, what restaurants do you go to Helena???

the two in question - the blue gardinia and joels.

Hellrazer wrote: »

While I agree with most of your post I dont agree with why you`re comparing it to kids in restaurants.
I can bring my 4 to any restaurant anywhere and not one of them will misbehave in the fashion like youre making out.

I 100% agree - because you are a responsible parent and your children behave and that is my point exactly. When you have a responsible parent you can bring the kids anywhere with little trouble - similarly for a dog I believe.

My local off license and corner shop welcome harley in, the woman in the shop even feeding him sausages from the deli. Because he is well behaved. I in no way think dogs (or kids) should be allowed run riot. You will of course have the odd few fools who let their dogs whatever they like, but you have the odd few parents doing the same thing and people are supposed to put up with it.

I don't think every restaurant should be dog friendly at all, but one or two would be nice.

Hellrazer wrote: »

Helena--theres an idea for a start up restaurant--Dublins only dog friendly restaurant (tm).
Anyone want to invest in the idea before someone steals it??.

You can't TM it!! It's mine. :eek:

EDIT: For the "dogs are animals brigade" I am well aware of that, in fact I think it's very important that dogs are treated as dogs. But being treated as a dog does not mean living in the house all the time. If someone wants to bring their dog out and if it is well behaved, then why not? my point is someone posted giving all these reasons a dog cannot go into a restaurant. I simply pointed out that for every one of those reasons - there is a similar complaint about children. as I said don't think every restaurant should be dog friendly but there is no reason not to have a few specialist ones.

olaola

Neesa wrote: »

It would be similiar to asking "Why can't we smoke cannabis in bars and restaurants over here? They do it in continental Europe."

That is against the law. I am wondering what the legal standpoint is here. And it is only allowed in certain establishments in a very small part of a different country. Not really comparable.

PurpleBerry

olaola wrote: »

I would assume an owner would only bring a well trained dog to public places.

Yeah, assumptions are fantastic, aren't they? I love assumptions. I am going to assume that on a four hour train journey there will be no kids screeching or running up and down the carriages.

scorpioishere

Dogs in restaurant, no way. It should be left at home to guard the house not to guard you in restaurant.:D

PurpleBerry

helena.ryan wrote: »

the two in question - the blue gardinia and joels.

Joel's in Clondalkin? They don't allow pets.

olaola wrote: »

And it is only allowed in certain establishments in a very small part of a different country. Not really comparable.

No, this is a precise, exact, like-for-like comparaion. Something which is allowed in certain parts of a different country compared with something which is allowed in certain parts of a different country.

Alun

youcrazyjesus! wrote: »

Somebody could trip over them, they could pester somebody for food, they could take a poop, they could pee, they could have fleas, could be in heat, they could snap at somebody, other customers may not like it and demand action. Leave the dog at home going if going for a meal.

A large proportion of those complaints could also be levelled at bawling, snotty nosed kids as well, but they're allowed in restaurants (unfortunately)

Whispered

Neesa wrote: »

Joel's in Clondalkin? They don't allow pets.
.

I know

olaola

Neesa wrote: »

Yeah, assumptions are fantastic, aren't they? I love assumptions. I am going to assume that on a four hour train journey there will be no kids screeching or running up and down the carriages.

What has that got to do with this topic?

upmeath

I really thought when I saw this first that this was a thread that would eventually be moved to After Hours. Are you serious?

1. It's an animal.
2. It spends a significant portion of its life licking its hole.
3. It may be temperamental, the restaurant staff can't judge whether or not your dog snaps out at strangers at front of house.
4. It may not be as well house-trained as you thought.

biko

* The Milestone Hotel in Kensington, London offers an evening turndown service for pets plus a goody bag of treats and toys (020 7917 1000; www.milestonehotel.com)
* The Montague on the Gardens Hotel in London's West End provides dog-walking facilities and - for the nervous hound - a dog-sitting service. Pet beds also available (020 7637 1001; www.montaguehotel.com)
* The Armathwaite Hall Hotel, near Keswick, Cumbria declares that it can provide "pampered pooches… with a comfortable clean bed tailored to fit, soft cushion, newsletter with great places to explore, waste bags... and yummy treats" (01768 776551; www.armathwaite-hall.com)
* The Nare Hotel, near Truro, Cornwall advertises special services for "canine connoisseurs" including an à la carte menu (01872 501111; www.narehotel.co.uk)

Lauragoesmad

I was in Salsburg in Austria before Christmas and nearly every restaraunt I went to had dogs in it. They were all very well behaved, I didn't see any pee or crap on the floor and most of the staff seemed happy to interact with the dogs. One guy even had two german shepherds with him. I was delighted to meet plenty of pooches everywhere I went!:)

PurpleBerry

olaola wrote: »

What has that got to do with this topic?

You've assumed that only the owners of well-behaved dogs would take them into a resturant. The vast majority of dog-owners think their pooch is well-behaved.

With me so far?

That's the same as assuming only the parents of well-behaved children would bring thier "little angels" onto trains, (or planes, or into restaurants, the cinema, the pub even!). The vast majority of parents think the sun shines out of their little darlings backsides.

Should I spell it out again?

olaola

Dream Ireland and Self Catering Ireland have pet-friendly sections.

The ISPCA also have a section on pet-friendly accommodations.

olaola

Neesa wrote: »

You've assumed that only the owners of well-behaved dogs would take them into a resturant. The vast majority of dog-owners think their pooch is well-behaved.

With me so far?

That's the same as assuming only the parents of well-behaved children would bring thier "little angels" onto trains, (or planes, or into restaurants, the cinema, the pub even!). The vast majority of parents think the sun shines out of their little darlings backsides.

Should I spell it out again?

Is this topic about parent and child behaviour? Are you comparing a child to a dog? Are there legal issues pertaining to bringing children restaurants that I am not aware of?

r3nu4l

olaola wrote: »

I don't see how hygiene is a problem, it's not as if the chef is running out and petting the dogs before plating your meal. It's sucessfully dealt with in continental Europe, so why can it not happen here?

Elaborate on the obvious 'health and safety' issue.

Unwormed dogs who lick your hands after licking their own arses, combined with food are not a very good mix imo.

olaola wrote: »

What has that got to do with this topic?

See below.

olaola wrote: »

I would assume an owner would only bring a well trained dog to public places.

You are assuming that every dog owner is very responsible and have trained their dogs well. Not so. Most dog owners are responsible but there are more than a few who are not. Those few cause problems for everyone else.

If dogs were allowed into restaurants then not only would you have Mr and Mrs ever-so-respectable with their well trained dog in there but you might also have Mr and Mrs Chav who have never trained or socialised their animal. This poor animal is likely to be aggressive and in a place with lots of lovely smells and lots of lovely food the animal may be inquisitive. Aggressiveness and inquisitiveness are not great qualities when combined in a confined environment such as a restaurant.

I'm not saying this kind of thing would happen every night of the week but it only needs to happen once to put a restaurant out of business.

Yes children can run amok but unruly children are unlikely to cause serious injury to other customers in an attack whereas an unruly dog might just. Then what happens? You sue the restaurant :rolleyes:

As for the children-are-worse brigade... :rolleyes:

The real problem is that you can't tell from looking at a dog or its owners whether the dog will behave well or not. When a dog misbehaves it can be much more difficult to control than a child and the consequences can be more dangerous.

I've eaten in a few restaurants in Europe where dogs were allowed, mostly in small towns in the South of France or Southern Italy. However, the difference was that the heat of the day was so intense that the dogs were curled up on the floor asleep and probably wouldn't have even noticed if you had stepped on them I've not seen this happen in any European cities to be honest.

Personally, I'm a dog lover but I'm very well aware that not all dog owners are responsible and I don't want to eat with other peoples dogs.

Alun

upmeath wrote: »

2. It spends a significant portion of its life licking its hole.

Slightly OT, but I recall watching a TV program in the Netherlands once where they tested a number of peoples dish cloths / brushes / sponges from their kitchens for harmful bacteria, and as a "control" they also swabbed the inside if a dog's mouth. Two guesses which had the least number of bacteria (by a country mile) ?

Lauragoesmad

Alun wrote: »

Slightly OT, but I recall watching a TV program in the Netherlands once where they tested a number of peoples dish cloths / brushes / sponges from their kitchens for harmful bacteria, and as a "control" they also swabbed the inside if a dog's mouth. Two guesses which had the least number of bacteria (by a country mile) ?

This is because dogs salivate a hell of a lot more then we do so technically, they're mouths are cleaner then ours.

Still, I will not be letting any dog lick my mouth anytime soon!:D

Whispered

Are there legal issues pretaining to bringing dogs into restaurants or is it at the owners discretion?

biko

"All Guide Dogs carry a certificate from Environmental Health stating that they are exempt from 'No dogs allowed' policy of restaurants, pubs, hotels etc and this would also be the case in renting property."
"Due to their special training, Guide Dogs are exempt from hygiene regulations governing food premises."
Legal it seems.

Arcee

Austria is extremely dog-friendly and it's not at all uncommon to see dogs in restaurants, bars and shops there. In fact, I saw a couple walk into a top quality restaurant in Vienna with their dog and when the waiter brought their drinks, he brought a bowl of water for the dog too. Having dogs in restaurants works just fine there and is a regular occurance.

Quaver

From a legal standpoint, your average restaurant owner wouldn't allow dogs in because if a dog was to bite or injure anyone, it is likely that the owner would be liable. It's not worth the risk, simple as that.

IMO, a lot of people would be turned off by a restaurant that allowed pets, it is perceived as unhygienic, so from a business point of view it wouldn't be advisable.

Whispered

Ah I wish I owned a restaurant so I could let people bring their dogs.

A boards doggy dinner date <- wonder if that would ever take off.


We often have doggy visitors for dinner, and bring our dog when we go anywhere if we can, but I'd love to see how he would be in a restaurant. I think a lot of pubs allow dogs in the beer garden?

livvy

Great thread with good arguements on both sides. I have a very friendly golden retriever but to be honest he sheds a lots, is always giving himself a good ould lick and farts like a trooper! I put up with him cause i think he is great but tbh I would expect anyone else to. I think the concept is great - i would love to bring him more places than on a walk, car and kennels - but can you imagine the amount of backside smelling and "dominance" issues you would have to deal with on an evening out.

Owen

I went to a restaurant in Berlin in 2007 called Zoe, which is named after the owner's dog, a German Shepherd who's in the restaurant 24/7. She wanders around from table to table wagging her tail, and is the sole reason the restaurant is so so busy.

That and the two gay guys mauling the faces off each other with their hands down each other's pants. But I'm thinking it's the dog. Either which way, Europe seems much more liberal and relaxed than our country.

Skillie

You could always get Caesar Milan to manage the restaurant so with his magic "tsssch" finger technique he could stop all the "dominance" problems and captivate the dogs into a well behaved trance of obedient bliss!!

been in france, belgium, italy among others and seen dogs there in shops and restaurants. theres for and against it, would be good to have some pet friendly places but wouldn't want dogs in all restaurants etc

In an ideal world i'd swap the kids in restaurants for dogs anyday but hey dreams don't often come through.

I've eaten in cork in an outdoor part or a restaurant with my dogs.

p.s.
the chavs comment is a bit stereotypical and unfair also. its not only the gentry who have well behaved dogs and kids i think you'll often find it the opposite.

Alun

I've eaten in many pub restaurants in England where dogs are welcome, in fact I went away once for a Christmas break in a lovely little pub in the Yorkshire Dales that's renowned for being dog friendly, and I felt seriously out of place for not having a dog with me!

jester77

I've eaten in many restaurants and have yet to have a problem with dogs. They are all very well mannered and well trained. If another dog comes in they will look, on a rare occassion they may bark but once they are told to be quiet that is the end of it. Now I wish I could say the same about kids in restaurants

r3nu4l

Skillie wrote: »

p.s.
the chavs comment is a bit stereotypical and unfair also. its not only the gentry who have well behaved dogs and kids i think you'll often find it the opposite.

It was just an example Unfortunately, many people on boards.ie are unable to see past stereotypes so it was the easy example to use. Another point is that Mr and Mrs respectable are often just as blind as Mr and Mrs Chav to the effect of their dogs' behaviour on those around them. While Mr Chav is likely to headbutt you for even glancing at his dog with a frown, Mr respectable is likely to huff and puff about having his solicitor send you a letter and say things like 'How dare you, this dog was at Crufts you know, I dare say he's worth more than your car!!'.

BTW, when I say 'chav' I don't mean working class, I mean proper burberry-tracksuit wearing, drinking cans of Stella in the streets, sovereign-ring and hoopy ear-ring wearing chavs, not a guy who works hard day in, day out to make a living They are NOT the same, no need for the insecurity/PCness.

Alun

r3nu4l wrote: »

It was just an example Unfortunately, many people on boards.ie are unable to see past stereotypes so it was the easy example to use. Another point is that Mr and Mrs respectable are often just as blind as Mr and Mrs Chav to the effect of their dogs' behaviour on those around them. While Mr Chav is likely to headbutt you for even glancing at his dog with a frown, Mr respectable is likely to huff and puff about having his solicitor send you a letter and say things like 'How dare you, this dog was at Crufts you know, I dare say he's worth more than your car!!'.

Again, substitute "kid" for "dog" in the above sentence and the same holds true. (Possibly substitute Crufts for something else too, maybe Trinity or Oxford )

EL_Loco

All things being equal I would choose the non-dog establishment over the dog friendly one.

They may be causing no harm what so ever, just a personal preference I think you'll find the *majority* of people would hold. This would translate to the establishment's bottom line, therefore I would assume this is the reason most places don't allow dogs, due to the preference of their customers.

gversey

Explain to me this, what's the "point" of bringing your dog to a restaurant? You're going to eat, the dog will just lie there as you attend to your meal. Why not leave the dog at home? It can equally well lie there without your attention (which will be the case in a restaurant while you're eating anyways), and when you get home, you can be together and have fun. I guess I really just don't see much benefit to anyone - dog, owner, or other patrons to allowing dogs in restaurant...The last thing I need is an animal sniffing at my food and possibly shedding hair in my meal in a restaurant where I'm paying for the experience.

Alun

gversey wrote: »

Explain to me this, what's the "point" of bringing your dog to a restaurant?

I don't think anyone's necessarily talking about explicitly taking their dog out for a meal, but what about the situation where someone's out for a day-trip, or on holiday, with their dog (not an unusual situation) and gets hungry?

ManFromAtlantis

i'm sure you'll find a few dogs if you look closely enough. try down at the kitchen end.;)