Unhappy with warning

eagle eye

I received a yellow card in the soccer forum for the following post.

eagle eye wrote: »

I'm gonna delete this post very soon. Just to say Frisbee this does not belong in the Everton thread. I won't answer your post here. Imo you should delete your last post too. It does not belong here either.

Let me explain the background to this. I was discussing the merits of the team I support which is Blackburn Rovers with an Everton FC fan in the Everton club thread. Our teams have recently met in a match.

Out of respect to the Everton fans and after some debate on the issue I had decided not to post again and leave them to discuss other topics in the Everton thread. Another poster then came in and posted his beliefs regarding Blackburn Rovers in that thread. I posted and he replied. This new poster is an Arsenal fan and it just happens that Blackburn are Arsenal's next opponents in the Premier League.

Now all the pride inside me wanted to reply to his new post and discuss it further but I had a feeling we were going to be off topic and not showing respect to our Everton colleagues in the forum by discussing this further in their thread. I posted the above message with the intention of deleting it a short time later and hopefully continue the discussion in a more relevant thread. My wording might not have fully explained my wishes and in hindsight a pm to that poster would probably have been better, but I was just expressing an opinion and not trying to insult or demean anybody in any way, and I don't think it looks that way either.

I recieved a PM from LuckyLloyd regarding this yellow card. I immediately replied that I thought this was very harsh and unfair. He replied telling me what he could see my point to a certain extent but that I was still being yellow carded.

I don't feel that its very fair to me. Firstly I don't really know what back-seat modding is, I have been told before that answering back a mod and disagreeing with a decision by them in a thread is back seat modding. I was not aware that what I did in that thread constitutes back seat modding. I am not a regular trouble maker on the forum, I try to be helpful if anything.

I pm'd LuckyLloyd twice asking for some link to somewhere I could read about back seat modding so as to understand where I crossed the line and also to make sure that I don't cross this line again. I have noticed LuckyLloyd posting yesterday after my pm, and today after my pm and he still has not replied to me. As a result I felt I had no option but to bring it here.

Gordon

If LuckyLloyd still thought you deserved the yellow card then I'm not sure what you see happening?

Back seat modding is when you disrupt the flow of the thread [further] as if acting as a moderator or as if stating what moderating-type activities should take place. The reason that this is problematic/annoying is because the post doesn't have to exist as a moderator will do what they think is best, and the user can send a reported post message to the moderator, thus keeping the thread clean and transparent.

No back seat modding is part of the charter that everyone agrees to when they request access, the charter is here and the important bit is here :

GuanYin wrote: »

[*] BACK SEAT MODDING The mods of the forum are listed, no other user (bar SMODS and ADMINS) has moderation rights in the forum. As such we view interference in moderation as a breach of rules. If you have an issue with a post in this forum, the correct procedure is to use the report post function on the left of the post. If you post in thread, you will be viewed to be back-seat modding and may be cautioned. Calling users a troll is viewed as back-seat modding, that is for the soccer mods to decide. Abuse of the Report Abuse function, to insult users or continue debate will result in a ban.

eagle eye

I did read that and I don't feel that I did anything which is against whats written there.
I did not disrupt the flow of the thread. I was only intimating to the poster Frisbee that I did not want to continue this conversation in the Everton thread but that I was not agreeing with his post. I gave an opinion regarding his previous post but I was not telling him that he had to do anything it was just a suggestion.

I felt that to continue posting on the subject in this thread would be showing a lack of respect to the forum members who are Everton fc fans. Thats not reportable imo so I didn't have that option.

I felt had we continued to post in the the thread we were either going to go off topic eventually but we were not respecting the Everton fans who I am sure did not want to see this conversation continue in their thread between an Arsenal and a Blackburn Rovers fan.

I still fail to see where I crossed any line. There is also no clear explanation of back seat modding there. Its very vague and leads me to the conclusion that its open to interpretation by different people and as a result not going to be used equally by all moderators.

Is it fair that my foresight here and my respect for other forum members has gotten me in trouble?

Just to add by the way that it was pointless trying to delete this post in the end as this guy Frisbee quoted it in his next post whilst stating that he was not going to delete his post. He quoted me even though he was next to post in the thread which I'd imagine is needless. I never responded to that post by him and left it at that and proceeded to post in other threads as I felt any answer would have been likely to be flouting the rules in some way or other.

Gordon

Telling someone to delete their post on thread, because it doesn't belong on the thread, is back seat modding. It disrupts the flow of the thread.

eagle eye

Gordon wrote: »

Telling someone to delete their post on thread, because it doesn't belong on the thread, is back seat modding. It disrupts the flow of the thread.

I did say Imo you should delete yours as well. I was not attempting to act in the capacity of a moderator, I thought that by using imo I was clearly stating that it was just my opinion.

Gordon

I think that that is implied. If you didn't say 'imo' it would still be your opinion that the post should be deleted.

eagle eye

Gordon wrote: »

I think that that is implied. If you didn't say 'imo' it would still be your opinion that the post should be deleted.

I don't understand this.

Are you saying there that whether I use imo or not is irrelevant to my posts?

Either way I feel I have explained that there was no attempt to purposefully moderate in any way on my part. Even the moderator seems to understand this.

I still feel hard done by here. I can understand that if I was constantly at this sort of thing that you could maybe make a case for this but I am never at this sort of thing. I try to be friendly and respectful to other posters all the time.

Lets say that I'm driving down the street in my car and a guy is parked on the pavement and suddenly just as I pass he opens the door, I see this and I swerve to avoid him. There is a squad car right behind me and he sees me cross a single white line without indicating. Should I get a ticket for not indicating when I clearly was just avoiding a his car door to prevent an accident?

I should have put on my indicator but all I was attempting to do was avoid an accident and forgot to indicate. I think it would be very harsh here to give me a ticket, same as it is very unfair to give me a yellow card here as I was just trying to avoid a problem further down the line.

I don't see how I could report that post by Frisbee in that thread but it was clear that it was something that would not be of interest to Everton fans and that the post was made by a fan of Arsenal whose next Premier League game is against Blackburn Rovers. By showing respect to the relevant fans in this thread I am deemed to be breaking the rules. Surely a friendly pm in this circumstance stating that he understood my point but that I am not to post in that form again would be fairer.

Gordon

eagle eye wrote: »

I don't understand this.

Are you saying there that whether I use imo or not is irrelevant to my posts?

In my opinion Margaret Thatcher is ugly.
Margaret Thatcher is ugly.

Both my opinions. Simply stating 'imo' is redundant.

Either way I feel I have explained that there was no attempt to purposefully moderate in any way on my part. Even the moderator seems to understand this.

I still feel hard done by here. I can understand that if I was constantly at this sort of thing that you could maybe make a case for this but I am never at this sort of thing. I try to be friendly and respectful to other posters all the time.

Lets say that I'm driving down the street in my car and a guy is parked on the pavement and suddenly just as I pass he opens the door, I see this and I swerve to avoid him. There is a squad car right behind me and he sees me cross a single white line without indicating. Should I get a ticket for not indicating when I clearly was just avoiding a his car door to prevent an accident?

I should have put on my indicator but all I was attempting to do was avoid an accident and forgot to indicate. I think it would be very harsh here to give me a ticket, same as it is very unfair to give me a yellow card here as I was just trying to avoid a problem further down the line.

I don't see how I could report that post by Frisbee in that thread but it was clear that it was something that would not be of interest to Everton fans and that the post was made by a fan of Arsenal whose next Premier League game is against Blackburn Rovers. By showing respect to the relevant fans in this thread I am deemed to be breaking the rules. Surely a friendly pm in this circumstance stating that he understood my point but that I am not to post in that form again would be fairer.

Your analogy is not analogous to this situation.

You broke the rules, you got a warning. A warning is a way of warning that you broke the rules, hopefully it will make you understand what you did wrong, against the rules.

I think that the warning has achieved what it was created to do, so I don't think you'll make that mistake again, will you? If so then everything is hunky dory.

eagle eye

I take it then that you would give me a ticket for crossing the white line.

Could I have used the report button? If so for what reason?

Gordon

eagle eye wrote: »

I take it then that you would give me a ticket for crossing the white line.

Could I have used the report button? If so for what reason?

I've no idea, I'm not a cop and I don't drive, I don't know the intricacies of the rules of the road, I don't have to.

You can always report a post if you think that it doesn't belong in the thread it is posted in, if it is spammy, insulting, against the boards charter etc. You may not get a response and you may not see action on it but all mods of that forum will receive the report via email.

eagle eye

Its clear I am getting no joy here and I have to say that I still feel harshly treated in this instance.

I believe the there should be a clearer description of what excatly constitutes back seat modding. Its not very clear in that quote that you used above.

Gordon

eagle eye wrote: »

Its clear I am getting no joy here and I have to say that I still feel harshly treated in this instance.

You are not getting any joy because you were wrong to have done what you did. I'm feeling a little harshly treated myself to be honest. You come here upset about being warned for breaking the charter. You did something wrong and you are upset and want an exception for your circumstances because you don't feel you understand the rules clearly laid out.

The Charter wrote:

If you have an issue with a post in this forum, the correct procedure is to use the report post function on the left of the post

I am getting no joy at all here, I am spending time replying to you explaining what you did wrong and you aren't understanding. I am getting nowhere here, and I have spent all this time and effort replying, when it was you that has not read the rules properly and you that has contravened the rules.

I believe the there should be a clearer description of what excatly constitutes back seat modding. Its not very clear in that quote that you used above.

The Charter wrote:

If you have an issue with a post in this forum, the correct procedure is to use the report post function on the left of the post

It's completely exact and clear. It does not need to be any clearer, it cannot be any clearer.

eagle eye

Gordon wrote: »

You are not getting any joy because you were wrong to have done what you did. I'm feeling a little harshly treated myself to be honest. You come here upset about being warned for breaking the charter. You did something wrong and you are upset and want an exception for your circumstances because you don't feel you understand the rules clearly laid out.

No I'm pointing out that there is no clear description of what exactly back seat modding relates to other than telling people they are breaking the rules. The only things that seem clear to me are
1. Calling someone a troll is back seat modding.
2. Moderating a discussion is back seat modding.
You say that disrupting the natural flow of a thread is back seat modding. That was not in the Charter.

I don't know why I am wasting my time with this but as its clear you do not understand that there was no intent to moderate on my part.

Firstly I feel I was unfairly treated because there was no intent to disrupt the natural flow of the thread.

The thread is there to discuss Everton football club and not Blackburn Rovers football club. I had ended my discussion with Everton fans on the matter and then Frisbee brings it up again, I answered his first post and immediately felt that I was being disrespectful to the Everton fans to continue discussing this with an Arsenal fan in their thread.

Secondly my post was a direct reply to the post above mine which quoted me and telling Frisbee I'd like to take the discussion elsewhere, that hardly consititutes moderating the thread or does it?

Gordon wrote: »

I am getting no joy at all here, I am spending time replying to you explaining what you did wrong and you aren't understanding. I am getting nowhere here, and I have spent all this time and effort replying, when it was you that has not read the rules properly and you that has contravened the rules.

Originally Posted by GuanYin

[*] BACK SEAT MODDING The mods of the forum are listed, no other user (bar SMODS and ADMINS) has moderation rights in the forum. As such we view interference in moderation as a breach of rules. If you have an issue with a post in this forum, the correct procedure is to use the report post function on the left of the post. If you post in thread, you will be viewed to be back-seat modding and may be cautioned. Calling users a troll is viewed as back-seat modding, that is for the soccer mods to decide. Abuse of the Report Abuse function, to insult users or continue debate will result in a ban.

It's completely exact and clear. It does not need to be any clearer, it cannot be any clearer.

I have issues with many posts but they are hardly moderation issues.
I didn't have a moderation issue with Frisbee's post, I just felt on a personal level that it was unfair to Everton fans to continue the discussion in their thread as I have explained more than once here already. Its what I said in the thread as well.
Again as I didn't have a moderation issue I don't feel I moderated in any way in the thread.
In the quote from the soccer forum charter above even the report post button is described as a Report Abuse function or are they two different things?
And whats even more confusing is that you can be penalised if you are seen to be abusing this report button in the eyes of the moderators.

Gordon

eagle eye wrote: »

I don't know why I am wasting my time with this but as its clear you do not understand that there was no intent to moderate on my part.

Wasting your time? By that you mean that I have just wasted my time too, the time that I gave you has now been wasted. Thanks for wasting my time, I won't waste any more of your time in the future, don't worry.

eagle eye

Gordon wrote: »

Wasting your time? By that you mean that I have just wasted my time too, the time that I gave you has now been wasted. Thanks for wasting my time, I won't waste any more of your time in the future, don't worry.

Obviously I did waste my time typing all that then.