Taxi driver protest

gdael

Spook_ie wrote: »

Point of order...It's not a product it's a service, the service has a regulated charge, which I may offer a discount on, I don't, therefore the price is set by the regulator. I often ( in the good ol' days had people offering silly prices to take them somewhere I never did any job for more than the price set by the regulatory framework in existence at the time.

I do heed my own advice, wouldn't be much good as advice if I ignored it myself.

Any business that's subjected to outside influence and interference that benefits one businessman over another is unfair competition.

Who decides how much the customer pays at the end of the trip?
You do. Therefore you control the price. Is that so hard to admit?

I wouldnt worry if i were you anyway, the customer is controlling the price more and more now. Any fool who gets into a taxi without securing a reduction is just asking to take it up the ass.
Sure you can refuse them, but then you earn ZERO. Good business skills there.

Spook_ie

gdael wrote: »

Who decides how much the customer pays at the end of the trip?
You do. Therefore you control the price. Is that so hard to admit?

I wouldnt worry if i were you anyway, the customer is controlling the price more and more now. Any fool who gets into a taxi without securing a reduction is just asking to take it up the ass.
Sure you can refuse them, but then you earn ZERO. Good business skills there.

Not so, many of the customers who get in asking for a discount have already spent their money on the beer, it is my honest opinion that they probably haven't even got the €5 they offer as it's already been pissed up the wall... sad but true

Spook_ie

Or as anafterthought....

You want to pay a ****e price then you'll get a ****e service, you want a quality service then I'll charge you the quality price, which means NO discount in my taxi

rubadub

blahblah06 wrote: »

I answered all I was asked.

No you didn't thats why I, and others, kept repeating questions over and over.

blahblah06 wrote: »

As ive said before ive no prob with new drivers coming into the game once there up to scratch and legal.

But you do seem to have a problem with new drivers even if up to scratch and legal, from reading this

blahblah06 wrote: »

at the end of the day there getting into the game cause there not scroungers and dont wanna be on the dole fare play for making something of themselves. ive no prob with new full time drivers getting into the game as ive said before. its the part timers greedy gits that really annoy me

You have repeatedly said you are against part timers, many of whom I expect are fully legal and fully competent taximen. I am sure many of your fellow taximen would find your comments insulting.

blahblah06 wrote: »

I like saying get a life.

It just seems you are looking to be banned or get this thread locked as a cop out, since you know you cannot give a reasonable answer to the questions asked.

Taxipete29 wrote: »

I dont have a problem with fair competition.

Is it fair competition though when there are illegal operators who have either no proper licence, proper insurance or are driving a cloned car??

Is it fair competition when most drivers invest in their car and licence yet up until recently some people who were long term unemployed were given large grants to set up as taxi drivers. This included the cost of obtaining the spsv licence and attending the training course to pass the test.

Drivers want the rules enforced. The rules the regulator has brought in but hasnt seen fit to enforce to any degree. There are 9 enforcement officers for the whole country when I last spoke to her office about 6 months ago. This is for 26000 taxis approx.

Drivers want the enforcement of section 36. This is about people with criminal records being stripped of their licences and also preventing criminals from obtaining licences in the future.

Is this so unreasonable???

I don't think anybody has said any of that is unreasonable, they think calling for a halt on new licences is unreasonable. That seems to be the main request, most stuff being said in this thread is simply used to avoid answering the questions really being asked. Maybe a career in politics would be good if the taxiing doesn't work out. All this crap about public safety etc is laughable, as though its the main concern.

Spook_ie wrote: »

Point of order...It's not a product it's a service, the service has a regulated charge, which I may offer a discount on, I don't, therefore the price is set by the regulator.

So cutting through all the pedantics I expect most people would say you do control of the price.

Spook_ie wrote: »

As to what do I have against fair competition, myself nothing, I'll fight any businessman ( which is what I am ) on a level pitch. I don not count people who have a PAYE job as being on a level pitch, neither do I count people on Back To Work Enterprise Allowences as being on a level pitch.

But the law and many people do consider it fair, and a level pitch. People in many industries face the exact same competition.

Spook_ie wrote: »

As regards all the people on here who keep saying that taxidriving is a low skill therefore low paid job, I would remind you that it isn't a job it's a business with it's associated profit/loss margins. When those margins are being pressured from sources other than fair competition, I reserve the right to moan 'n whinge, as you put it.

More pedantics, job/business whatever you want to call it lots of people are able to do it, otherwise there would not be so many doing it, end of story, simple supply & demand.

Spook_ie wrote: »

To be forced into working excessive hours to keep my business afloat is not in the interests of either myself or the customer. The double jobbing (PAYE) taximen in the industry are undermining the ability for full time taxi drivers to make the business sufficently profitable to reinvest in the newer cars being regulated for.

Maybe you should be campaigning on a ban on doctors driving home or anybody working over 40hrs, this facade is fooling nobody. I know a few self employed workers having to work excessive hours, I know tilers who are under pressure, less work now and an influx of competent tradesmen from east europe, many who are part time workers too, with other PAYE jobs on the side.

blahblah06

I've said from the start full time drivers i've no problem with it's Part time taxi drivers are scum. Every full time cab driver would agree with that and that's the end of it. I've wasted enough time on this thread.

Bitching over questions with children over 37 pages is crazy. Looking forward to the outcome of the talks.

Me get banned? Doubt it considering taxi men have been called every name under the sun on this thread.

Good night. Oh and get a life

Taxipete29

rubadub wrote: »

No you didn't thats why I, and others, kept repeating questions over and over.


But you do seem to have a problem with new drivers even if up to scratch and legal, from reading this

You have repeatedly said you are against part timers, many of whom I expect are fully legal and fully competent taximen. I am sure many of your fellow taximen would find your comments insulting.


It just seems you are looking to be banned or get this thread locked as a cop out, since you know you cannot give a reasonable answer to the questions asked.


I don't think anybody has said any of that is unreasonable, they think calling for a halt on new licences is unreasonable. That seems to be the main request, most stuff being said in this thread is simply used to avoid answering the questions really being asked. Maybe a career in politics would be good if the taxiing doesn't work out. All this crap about public safety etc is laughable, as though its the main concern.

So cutting through all the pedantics I expect most people would say you do control of the price.


But the law and many people do consider it fair, and a level pitch. People in many industries face the exact same competition.

More pedantics, job/business whatever you want to call it lots of people are able to do it, otherwise there would not be so many doing it, end of story, simple supply & demand.


Maybe you should be campaigning on a ban on doctors driving home or anybody working over 40hrs, this facade is fooling nobody. I know a few self employed workers having to work excessive hours, I know tilers who are under pressure, less work now and an influx of competent tradesmen from east europe, many who are part time workers too, with other PAYE jobs on the side.

You are quite wrong. The halt of new licences is not the main thing being called for. The idea that it is all about licences is what has been portrayed in the press. Primarily I believe because they have no interest in the facts of the situation and its the easiet thing to report and requires little research.

The following is the submission made to the Minister a while back by the group involved in the protest last week.

http://taxidriversforchange.org/Submission.html

A TEMPORARY moratorium on new licences is one element of this submission but is by no means the only issue.

Have a look through it and tell me then if its all just smoke and mirrors to reduce numbers like you suggest

KoolKid

blahblah06 wrote: »

Drivers are calling for the suspension of new licences

Still waiting on a logical answer as to why the taxi drivers should be protected against competition over any other industry.

blahblah06 wrote: »

never said i had a prob with FAIR competition.

But in the above quote you want a suspension of new licences

blahblah06 wrote: »

how do you know if there licensed may I ask ?

Also I thought the arguments been made earlier on in this thread were people giving out about saying taxi drivers work from the ranks and not the streets

Aren't taxi trivers allowed do both??

blahblah06 wrote: »

I think you will find out 100 taxi drivers went on strike. How do u know I went?

As ive said before ive no prob with new drivers coming into the game once there up to scratch and legal.

But you just said you wanted a suspension of new licences?????

gdael wrote: »

Who decides how much the customer pays at the end of the trip?
You do. Therefore you control the price. Is that so hard to admit?

They dont seem to be able to understand that

Spook_ie wrote: »

Not so, many of the customers who get in asking for a discount have already spent their money on the beer, it is my honest opinion that they probably haven't even got the €5 they offer as it's already been pissed up the wall... sad but true

With that regard for your customers its no wonder your finding it hard to make a few euro.

blahblah06 wrote: »

Part time taxi drivers are scum.

You really do have issues. You hate your customers & part timers are scum???

the_syco

Spook_ie wrote: »

If you allow taxis that are not legaly plying for hire to take you, YES you are at fault, no need for a rolling of the eyes, I suspect that you are the type of person that would complain about walking the 20 meters to the legal rank because it's to far!

What tell-tale signs is there that the taxi is illegal? At the moment, I flag down a taxi with a yellow box on its roof, ensure the picture on the taxi ID looks like the driver, and the date is valid. Is there anything else i should look for?

Taxipete29 wrote: »

TEMPORARY

And how long is that?

ArmaniJeanss

Taxipete29 wrote: »

A TEMPORARY moratorium on new licences is one element of this submission but is by no means the only issue.

If ye were willing to drop this element of the submission, (and as a show of good faith actually emphasise that you completely definitely totally dont want a moratorium) then you might get a hearing from the public/newspapers etc.

So long as that particular point exists in your submission then it is what everyone is going to concentrate on.

A lot of your other requests are reasonable and are worthy of debate.
(You should probably drop the request for the resignation of the TRC, its a bit of a childish negotiation point really).

Spook_ie

Spook_ie wrote: »

Or as anafterthought....

You want to pay a ****e price then you'll get a ****e service, you want a quality service then I'll charge you the quality price, which means NO discount in my taxi

I get a taxi because I need a lift from A to B and the buses are finished or I'm in a particular rush etc.

A clean car, to not be talked sh1te to and safe driving isn't a 'quality' service, it's bloody expected.

For the prices you ask for I should literally be sitting in a seat that gives you a massage while sipping on a cold/warm drink depending on the weather

Taxipete29

the_syco wrote: »

What tell-tale signs is there that the taxi is illegal? At the moment, I flag down a taxi with a yellow box on its roof, ensure the picture on the taxi ID looks like the driver, and the date is valid. Is there anything else i should look for?


And how long is that?

The yellow stickers on the front and rear windscreens. They show the vehicle licence number and the date its valid until.

I have to say I was all in favour of the temporary moratorium 6 months ago, but I feel the horse has bolted at this stage so I dont see the neccesity at present. I think if the regulator and the Minister address the other concerns such as enforcement of their own regulations and continuing to increase the minimum standards for new entrants as well as existing operators then problems in the industry will be addressed.

I find it interesting that after almost 10 years of a deregulated industry that it is only now that any meaningful standards are being put into place. If it was done at the start the transition would of been very easy and we would have what everyone wants which is a properly regulated professional taxi industry instead of the mess we have at the moment.

Its simple, enforce the rules, apply higher standards and the cowboys will be driven out.

For other drivers, I have to say that anyone who does not have a radio from a company is totally nuts and really isnt operating their business to its potential.

Terrontress

Spook_ie wrote: »

Or as anafterthought....

You want to pay a ****e price then you'll get a ****e service, you want a quality service then I'll charge you the quality price, which means NO discount in my taxi

But that is great in my opinion. Free market. The management reserve the right to refuse admission. You are providing a service and are not prepared to discount and make your money on that basis.

I would think though that that line of thought is at odds with moratorium or ban on part timers. Under what I think you are getting at, people are all responsible for making their own decisions, not having other people impose restrictions and regulations on them. Make money as you see fit.

Spook_ie

rubadub wrote: »

Maybe you should be campaigning on a ban on doctors driving home or anybody working over 40hrs, this facade is fooling nobody. I know a few self employed workers having to work excessive hours, I know tilers who are under pressure, less work now and an influx of competent tradesmen from east europe, many who are part time workers too, with other PAYE jobs on the side.

As to doctors driving home, yep good idea make them use a compulsary taxi.

As to the tilers etc. I have several selfemployed tradesmen in my car a week the conversation always turns to how business is and it always seems that those people in the building trade who do houses/tiling/plumbing/decorating etc. Now that people aren't moving house but instead revamping/extending etc. they are realy feeling the pressure, they have too much work for themselves but not enough to warrant employing someone to help! Crazy eh?

Spook_ie

Rojomcdojo wrote: »

I get a taxi because I need a lift from A to B and the buses are finished or I'm in a particular rush etc.

A clean car, to not be talked sh1te to and safe driving isn't a 'quality' service, it's bloody expected.

For the prices you ask for I should literally be sitting in a seat that gives you a massage while sipping on a cold/warm drink depending on the weather

Who says that you don't get that in my car? You want a crap service with 20% off go to someone else, open my door and ask for a discount then you'd better close it gently after I tell you No

bangersandmash

Spook_ie wrote: »

open my door and ask for a discount then you'd better close it gently after I tell you No

Or else what exactly? Asking for a discount in many sectors of the Irish economy is par for the course at the moment - something accepted by many builders, solicitors, architects and so on. I'd love to know what could possibly make you believe that it is somehow unacceptable in an over-subscribed unskilled sector.

Reminds me of publicans - refusing to contemplate reducing prices while simultaneously complaining about the lack of customers.

Spook_ie

Spook_ie wrote: »

Who says that you don't get that in my car? You want a crap service with 20% off go to someone else, open my door and ask for a discount then you'd better close it gently after I tell you No

20% off isn't nearly enough. I'd still think it was expensive if current prices were cut in half.

Spook_ie

Terrontress wrote: »

But that is great in my opinion. Free market. The management reserve the right to refuse admission. You are providing a service and are not prepared to discount and make your money on that basis.

I would think though that that line of thought is at odds with moratorium or ban on part timers. Under what I think you are getting at, people are all responsible for making their own decisions, not having other people impose restrictions and regulations on them. Make money as you see fit.

No it's not at odds at all, I provide a service, I provide a clean quality car ( I had to replace the Camry, it broke down :eek: not that the Camry wasn't clean! ) I have until July 2012 to fund replacing it again, under the 9 year rule.

I refuse to discount fares simply because the custom isn't out there to generate the extra fares needed to recoup the discount and provide the capital requirement in June/July 2012 to replace the car. It's just economics

Spook_ie

bangersandmash wrote: »

Or else what exactly? Asking for a discount in many sectors of the Irish economy is par for the course at the moment - something accepted by many builders, solicitors, architects and so on. I'd love to know what could possibly make you believe that it is somehow unacceptable in an over-subscribed unskilled sector.

Reminds me of publicans - refusing to contemplate reducing prices while simultaneously complaining about the lack of customers.

You don't close my door gently after being told NO and you slam it or kick it or whatever, I'll probably bounce my Maglite off your head. As they say about credit " If a refusal offends you, then don't ask! "

mikemac

Instead of a cap, why not just make all new licences only for Wheelchair accesible cabs?
And give incentives too, maybe no VRT.

Then are more WAT cabs on the road which is excellent.
And if the current drivers are concerned about part-timers, well nobody is going to invest in one of these to use for a few hours.

I'm not getting in the whole part-timer debate, 38 pages of that already

Just throwing it out there.
I've been there trying to book a wheelchair accesible cab, it was done hours in advance and the driver was still late. Probably dictched us for a more lucrative fare!

KoolKid

Spook_ie wrote: »

Who says that you don't get that in my car? You want a crap service with 20% off go to someone else, open my door and ask for a discount then you'd better close it gently after I tell you No

You really have no concept of how to run a business or how to threat a potential customer. Not suprised you are afraid of the competition

Spook_ie wrote: »

I refuse to discount fares simply because the custom isn't out there to generate the extra fares needed to recoup the discount and provide the capital requirement in June/July 2012 to replace the car. It's just economics

You really are not suited to be a self employed buisnessman. You have no regard for the customer. You have no concept of how to generate business & you certinly don't have the attitude for dealing with the public.
If more competition forces this ignorance out of the industry then bring it on!:D

Taxipete29

mikemac wrote: »

Instead of a cap, why not just make all new licences only for Wheelchair accesible cabs?
And give incentives too, maybe no VRT.

Then are more WAT cabs on the road which is excellent.
And if the current drivers are concerned about part-timers, well nobody is going to invest in one of these to use for a few hours.

I'm not getting in the whole part-timer debate, 38 pages of that already

Just throwing it out there.
I've been there trying to book a wheelchair accesible cab, it was done hours in advance and the driver was still late. Probably dictched us for a more lucrative fare!

I think if there is any sort of a cap then this will be how it happens. It has been mentioned several times.
There would have to an incentive though such as reducing or eliminating the VRT on them.

Spook_ie

koolkid wrote: »

You really have no concept of how to run a business or how to threat a potential customer. Not suprised you are afraid of the competition


You really are not suited to be a self employed buisnessman. You have no regard for the customer. You have no concept of how to generate business & you certinly don't have the attitude for dealing with the public.
If more competition forces this ignorance out of the industry then bring it on!:D

Well when you're running a taxi business you can tell me, as you aren't, then you have no idea of the realities involved in the business. Stick to your macro economic principles and let the world collapse

steph1

blahblah06 wrote: »

I've said from the start full time drivers i've no problem with it's Part time taxi drivers are scum. Every full time cab driver would agree with that and that's the end of it. I've wasted enough time on this thread.

Bitching over questions with children over 37 pages is crazy. Looking forward to the outcome of the talks.

Me get banned? Doubt it considering taxi men have been called every name under the sun on this thread.

Good night. Oh and get a life

You speak for yourself mate. And to quote you "Every full time cab driver would agree that part-time taxi drivers are scum."
Well I'm sorry but I am a taxi driver full time and I most certainly do not agree with that statement. There are people who for one reason or another - probably mainly the recessionary times we find ourselves in - who may have had their hours curtailed or lost their jobs and who also may have to mind kids elderly parents etc there are a host of reasons and they work part-time. You cannot come on here with a statement like that. You do not speak on my behalf. Its the likes of you that gets the rest of us a bad name.

rubadub

blahblah06 wrote: »

I've said from the start full time drivers i've no problem with it's Part time taxi drivers are scum. Every full time cab driver would agree with that and that's the end of it.

I doubt they would all agree with that, I expect many posters are embarrassed to have you posting such crap seemingly on their side.

blahblah06 wrote: »

Me get banned? Doubt it considering taxi men have been called every name under the sun on this thread.

You are repeatedly baiting posters, hoping for a retaliatory response, and then you can hit your little report post button over and over asking for them to be banned. Everybody sees your little game and are not playing.

blahblah06 wrote: »

Good night. Oh and get a life

Get a new job.

Taxipete29 wrote: »

You are quite wrong. The halt of new licences is not the main thing being called for. The idea that it is all about licences is what has been portrayed in the press. Primarily I believe because they have no interest in the facts of the situation and its the easiet thing to report and requires little research.

Reading that it does seem that reducing numbers would solve a lot of these "problems", it seems they want numbers reduced and then afterwards came up with all sorts of ideas they could tag onto it too. I can fully understand why the media is only focusing on the numbers, it is of interest to most customers and by far the one they would object to most, though I would have issues with several other points.

Spook_ie wrote: »

As to doctors driving home, yep good idea make them use a compulsary taxi.

More legally enforced business for you! I am talking of anybody working over this 40hrs that is mentioned, most would probably have to find work close to home if legally obliged to get taxis to & from work or other public transport. So should taxi drivers be forced to drive only 40hrs a week? On that submission page it said.

New entrants will be making a significant investment in the industry and therefore should be available to service the public requirement on a full time basis to gain the maximum return for their investment. We know that this requirement needs to be at least forty hours per week and the public interest is best served by a full time professional service

Should be at most 40hrs, if it really is so dangerous.

Drivers should be able to achieve the average industrial wage for a reasonable working week (45 to 50 hours). Fare increments should reflect this and be regularly reviewed, compared to market conditions and be linked to inflation

I would think the average industrial wage for 45hrs work in a low skilled job is a very high and unreasonable expectation to have.

steph1

Taxipete29 wrote: »

For other drivers, I have to say that anyone who does not have a radio from a company is totally nuts and really isnt operating their business to its potential.

Hi Taxipete just to say that not all taxis operate in Dublin's fair city. I work in a rural area and we dont have radio companies here. We work from our mobiles or sit on the rank when we can get on it. There is no way that I would ever contemplate joining a radio company. I work my own hours when I need to work and to cover the busy weekend periods when the demand is there for my taxi and I have a good few regular customers who get me when I am working.

KoolKid

Spook_ie wrote: »

Well when you're running a taxi business you can tell me, as you aren't, then you have no idea of the realities involved in the business. Stick to your macro economic principles and let the world collapse

Running one business is pretty much the same as another. I have been doing it sucessfully for many years now.
First rule is the customer comes first. (You havn't even got that right yet)
I am running a very successfull business , so I do have a very good idea of the realities involved . As for economics, the basic rule there is supply & demand. Something you need to concentrate more on. There is no demand for ignorant taxi drives with a chip on their shoulder so I suggest you take a good look at your business practices or find a job that suits you better. Perhaps taxi driving to too high skilled a job for you.

bangersandmash

Spook_ie wrote: »

You don't close my door gently after being told NO and you slam it or kick it or whatever, I'll probably bounce my Maglite off your head.

Charming. Slamming or kicking doors is petty and childish. But comments such as the above only serve to further alienate your customers and reinforce stereotypes about the taxi industry.

Taxipete29

steph1 wrote: »

Hi Taxipete just to say that not all taxis operate in Dublin's fair city. I work in a rural area and we dont have radio companies here. We work from our mobiles or sit on the rank when we can get on it. There is no way that I would ever contemplate joining a radio company. I work my own hours when I need to work and to cover the busy weekend periods when the demand is there for my taxi and I have a good few regular customers who get me when I am working.

Obviously I was speaking about Dublin and I undrstand rural areas are totally different and I would imagine much harder to make a living out of.

Just to clarify. I work my own hours too. Radio companies dont dictate hours.

Spook_ie

koolkid wrote: »

Running one business is pretty much the same as another. I have been doing it sucessfully for many years now.
First rule is the customer comes first. (You havn't even got that right yet)
I am running a very successfull business , so I do have a very good idea of the realities involved . As for economics, the basic rule there is supply & demand. Something you need to concentrate more on. There is no demand for ignorant taxi drives with a chip on their shoulder so I suggest you take a good look at your business practices or find a job that suits you better. Perhaps taxi driving to too high skilled a job for you.

You're successfully running your own business, well good for you. Now get a taxi and try pasting your business model onto it. I'd wager you'd be broke in a month. I don't have a chip on my shoulder but I do take exception to this constant barrage of so called successfull business men thinking they know one iota of what's required in actuality to run a taxi business, unless you have ran a taxi you wouldn't know or understand, it's rather akin to a chiropodist telling an oncologist how to treat a cancer.

Oh and if you want an argument leave the derisory comments to the playground

Spook_ie

bangersandmash wrote: »

Charming. Slamming or kicking doors is petty and childish. But comments such as the above only serve to further alienate your customers and reinforce stereotypes about the taxi industry.

Don't slam the door then, or better still accept the fact that not all taxi drivers are that destitute or desperate that they will stoop to running at a loss but instead will tell you to "Feck Off" when you swarmily try to get a discount