Fianna Fail Hypocrisy

yoyo

Just weeks ago, we heard Fianna Fail urging the Irish to not shop up north but rather be "patriotic" and shop in Ireland.
Well then, why does Fianna Fail decide to "shop around" and choose an American company to design and host their new website?
There are plenty of very talented, good Irish web developers out there, and this stupid move imo just shows how hypocritical Fianna Fail as a party are. To see a blog entry about this latest move by Fianna Fail click HERE

What are others opinions?

Nick

jim o doom

Pretty sure they are required by law to issue tender to third parties; probably the US designer was cheaper - and government finances being crap, saving money everywhere is on the cards.

SEPT 23 1989

its the same with their election posters and signage all done outside the country
very patriotic Brian:mad:

Scofflaw

jim o doom wrote: »

Pretty sure they are required by law to issue tender to third parties; probably the US designer was cheaper - and government finances being crap, saving money everywhere is on the cards.

They're not required to tender, because they're not civil servants - and since the company involved (Blue State Digital) did Barack Obama's campaign, they are highly unlikely to be cheaper than an Irish designer. A half decent Irish design company could have done the new website for not much more than the cost of the flights required by a US company.

No, I'm afraid this is a typical old-fashioned Irish response to a problem - get someone successful from outside the country. God forbid we should foster native talent!

cordially,
Scofflaw

yoyo

Scofflaw wrote: »

They're not required to tender, because they're not civil servants - and since the company involved (Blue State Digital) did Barack Obama's campaign, they are highly unlikely to be cheaper than an Irish designer. A half decent Irish design company could have done the new website for not much more than the cost of the flights required by a US company.

No, I'm afraid this is a typical old-fashioned Irish response to a problem - get someone successful from outside the country. God forbid we should foster native talent!

cordially,
Scofflaw

Then why was it done in the US?

Nick

kaiser sauze

jim o doom wrote: »

Pretty sure they are required by law to issue tender to third parties; probably the US designer was cheaper - and government finances being crap, saving money everywhere is on the cards.

This is not a public money issue, it is a Fianna Fáil money issue.

Scofflaw

yoyo wrote: »

Then why was it done in the US?

Nick

It's the same company that did Barack Obama's online campaign. Fianna Fáil are presumably hoping that some of that Obama magic will rub off on them.

cordially,
Scofflaw

Akrasia

jim o doom wrote: »

Pretty sure they are required by law to issue tender to third parties; probably the US designer was cheaper - and government finances being crap, saving money everywhere is on the cards.

Fianna fail are a private organisation and are not required to tender for anything. This is a party political website, not the government website.

sceptre

^what Scoff said. FF are really trying their best to emulate Obamaitis - get the same web designers, locla councillors pimping themselves out on Facebook (I have a number of FB friends who are involved in student-level FF and they all seem to be facebook fans of multiple councillors).

They're trying to get the same magic by rubbing the same lamp in what they think is the same way. Of course, they're missing the point, but that's beside the point.

Scofflaw

sceptre wrote: »

^what Scoff said. FF are really trying their best to emulate Obamaitis - get the same web designers, locla councillors pimping themselves out on Facebook (I have a number of FB friends who are involved in student-level FF and they all seem to be facebook fans of multiple councillors).

They're trying to get the same magic by rubbing the same lamp in what they think is the same way. Of course, they're missing the point, but that's beside the point.

From what I know of FF, their own culture is so heavily opposed to everything Web 2.0 that Blue State have their work cut out. That will also be why they've gone for the whole "foreign expertise" thing - they fail to "get it" so badly they would be incapable of recognising Irish talent in the first place.

cordially,
Scofflaw

yoyo

Ok, Fair enough, but Fianna Fail were preaching to the Irish about being "Patriotic" and buying Irish, when they themselves chose an alternative option, as has been pointed out, many irish web companies could have made the new website (Which imo looks bog standard nothing out of the ordinary) and it would have been investing their money into irish economy, instead they chose the american one, regardless of that companies past portfolio, I don't know how it can be considered not hypocritical

Nick

Scofflaw

yoyo wrote: »

Ok, Fair enough, but Fianna Fail were preaching to the Irish about being "Patriotic" and buying Irish, when they themselves chose an alternative option, as has been pointed out, many irish web companies could have made the new website (Which imo looks bog standard nothing out of the ordinary) and it would have been investing their money into irish economy, instead they chose the american one, regardless of that companies past portfolio, I don't know how it can be considered not hypocritical

Nick

Oh, I don't consider it anything less than hypocritical - that's straightforward enough. However, I know several companies who have been involved with FF and the web at various stages. Everything Blue State are likely to suggest has already been suggested by Irish companies - and ignored. FF have never lacked for good advice on how to use the web, they just haven't taken any of it. Now it looks to me like they're going to try and have Blue State work the Obama magic on them without any comprehension of what the Obama magic consisted of. I shall be delighted if Blue State manage to drag them into the 21st century, but I shall also be absolutely amazed.

cordially,
Scofflaw

serfboard

I don't think it's just a question of the website, I think it's the whole "new technology" kit and caboodle they've gone for. They brought in Obama's technology advisor, and he obviously recommended/required/works for the web design company.

As others have said, it really shows how dense they are if they believe that this is going to do anything for them. This was all well and good in a country with 300 million people and one candidate. People in this country are well used to getting in touch with their local politicians - after all, don't they hold "clinics" and can't they be seen at any dacent funeral any day?

As for the hypocrisy, I agree.

wow sierra

Its just another example of Fianna Fail doing what they do best - campaigning.

At the moment when they are performing so badly in the opinion polls it seems laughable and gives rise to lots of jokes comparing them (unfavourably!!!) to Obama etc.

The reality is that seats are won by a few hundred votes and lots of people pay more attention to the Internet than other ways of self promotion.

Obviously at the moment the last thing any Fianna Fail politician wants to do is engage in any contact with the public, as all they will get is criticism. But this is a long term strategy and probably a good one.

jmayo

Scofflaw wrote: »

It's the same company that did Barack Obama's online campaign. Fianna Fáil are presumably hoping that some of that Obama magic will rub off on them.

cordially,
Scofflaw

Dear God clutching at straws. True for Margaret Ward they are fiddling (literally in more ways than one) while the country goes down the pan.

sceptre wrote: »

^what Scoff said. FF are really trying their best to emulate Obamaitis - get the same web designers, locla councillors pimping themselves out on Facebook (I have a number of FB friends who are involved in student-level FF and they all seem to be facebook fans of multiple councillors).

They're trying to get the same magic by rubbing the same lamp in what they think is the same way. Of course, they're missing the point, but that's beside the point.

They can rub and rub but all that is coming out of their lamp is sh**e :rolleyes:
Compare the Obama genie with Biffo.
Yes I am sure there are similarities, well apart from both involved in the legal world and being able to trace their routes back to Offaly and Eastern Africa (in Biffos case a few million years ago ), but that's about it I reckon.

Obama would be seen as intellectual, sauve, sophisticated, passionate, with a message of change.
On the other hand Biffo looks like an overfed ould curmudgeon stuffed into a new ill fitting suit for the daughters wedding, supposedly using his superior intellectual but really just making a few smart quips and braying for all the world like a jackass in search of love.

Remember old adage "never a silk purse was made out of a sows ear"

BTW I always thought that FG were the blue party ?
Maybe FF are adopting a new colour as well, I suppose it is the Obama influence :rolleyes:

galwayrush

I think FF should go for gangrene green, something that reflects their rot.:rolleyes:

yoshytoshy

A plackard at voting time of the website with "BUY IRISH" written accross it ,should suffice nicely.

Hillel

jmayo wrote: »

Dear God clutching at straws. True for Margaret Ward they are fiddling (literally in more ways than one) while the country goes down the pan.

They can rub and rub but all that is coming out of their lamp is sh**e :rolleyes:
Compare the Obama genie with Biffo.
Yes I am sure there are similarities, well apart from both involved in the legal world and being able to trace their routes back to Offaly and Eastern Africa (in Biffos case a few million years ago ), but that's about it I reckon.

I just want this shower OUT, at this stage. No leadership, no ideas, nothing. About the only thing they seem to be minding is their own selfish asses.
Not normally this blunt, but its time for them to GO.

dvpower

jim o doom wrote: »

Pretty sure they are required by law to issue tender to third parties; probably the US designer was cheaper - and government finances being crap, saving money everywhere is on the cards.

It is a FF party website, not a Government one, so the same rules don't apply

dvpower

yoyo wrote: »

There are plenty of very talented, good Irish web developers out there, and this stupid move imo just shows how hypocritical Fianna Fail as a party are.

I'm all for a bit of FF bashing, but this is ridiculous.

yoshytoshy

dvpower wrote: »

I'm all for a bit of FF bashing, but this is ridiculous.

It's not ,fianna fail said that they rejuvenated the site for the tech savvy in ireland.
Not very savvy to tell america ,we can't build websites.

jmayo

dvpower wrote: »

I'm all for a bit of FF bashing, but this is ridiculous.

No it's not.
You have FF minister for finance telling people to be patriotic and don't go over the border yto avail of better prices but be screwed royally in this country.
We have other ministers, including that bent coughlan, telling us how we are a knowledge economy, have great IT infrastructure and we are technogly leaders.
Personally I know most of that is a crock of sh**e.

Then you have FF decide that they will get their new website designed and built by a US firm, just so they can associate themselves with the golden boy Obama, hoping a bit of his lustre will rub off.

So much for patriotism :rolleyes:
I know many fine website design companies in this country, some may be small but they have delivered some damm good stuff in the past.

Yet again it is ff telling us "do as I say, not as I do" and it is fuc*** double standards.

dave-higgz

jmayo wrote: »

No it's not.

We have other ministers, including that bent coughlan, telling us how we are a knowledge economy, have great IT infrastructure and we are technogly leaders.

I'm sick and tired of seeing Mary Coughlan at every single event when new jobs are being launched. She has a right smile on her face, she comes in, gives a speech on how Intel, for example are the future of our economy (which I agree with) blah blah blah, and only for the launch of about 100 jobs! She's obviously oblivious to the problems outside.

1,000's of jobs are being LOST every week and was she there to support the people at Waterford Crystal? at SR Technics? or at any other place where people need ministers to tell them whether there's another job for them or whether there going to have to join the dole queues.

Jobs will launch themselves anyway without the attendance of ministers and there'll always be a town mayor to do that stuff anyway. We need our politicians working on solutions to our problems not wasting their time doing publicity stunts for their own image!

Liam Byrne

jim o doom wrote: »

Pretty sure they are required by law to issue tender to third parties; probably the US designer was cheaper - and government finances being crap, saving money everywhere is on the cards.

Hardy a justification, Jim ? The same could be easily said for most people in the country that are heading North to make their purchases.

And if Irish jobs go, the finances will get worse if more people end up on the dole....

old boy

did they not bring in bill clintons p r team at one time. what do expect from a pig only a grunt

Scofflaw

dvpower wrote: »

Pretty sure they are required by law to issue tender to third parties; probably the US designer was cheaper - and government finances being crap, saving money everywhere is on the cards.

It is a FF party website, not a Government one, so the same rules don't apply

FF are the Government, but they are not the government...

gnomically,
Scofflaw

Hillel

dvpower wrote: »

I'm all for a bit of FF bashing, but this is ridiculous.

Why is it ridiculous dvpower? The point re the Web Site was well made, and valid. Getting an American company to build their site sends out all the wrong messages. Not least, that they are desperate to gain some credibility for FF, even by association.

dvpower

Hillel wrote: »

Why is it ridiculous dvpower? The point re the Web Site was well made, and valid. Getting an American company to build their site sends out all the wrong messages. Not least, that they are desperate to gain some credibility for FF, even by association.

If it was just a website design job that could be done by any number of Irish companies, then maybe there would be something in this story.

But the company in question, Blue State Digital, are an Internet Strategy company, that specialise in helping political parties and non profit organisations to use the internet effectively, and who worked on the Obama campaign. They go way past just building a website.

In your view, is there any product or service that FF would be justified in buying from outside the state?

dvpower

Scofflaw wrote: »

FF are the Government, but they are not the government...

gnomically,
Scofflaw

FF are a political party, with TDs, Senators, Local Government Councillers, ordinary members and employees.

The Government are the cabinet made up of 13 FF members, two Green Party members and one Mary Harney.

You can draw the Venn diagram yourself

Scofflaw

dvpower wrote: »

If it was just a website design job that could be done by any number of Irish companies, then maybe there would be something in this story.

But the company in question, Blue State Digital, are an Internet Strategy company, that specialise in helping political parties and non profit organisations to use the internet effectively, and who worked on the Obama campaign. They go way past just building a website.

In your view, is there any product or service that FF would be justified in buying from outside the state?

Do you believe there are no Irish companies capable of offering internet strategy?

cordially,
Scofflaw

DublinWriter

Scofflaw wrote: »

Do you believe there are no Irish companies capable of offering internet strategy?

I can't believe that this hasn't been picked up by the media...yet.

Interestingly enough, FF advertised in the Irish Times three weeks ago for a new webmaster/web content manager.

Scofflaw

dvpower wrote: »

FF are a political party, with TDs, Senators, Local Government Councillers, ordinary members and employees.

The Government are the cabinet made up of 13 FF members, two Green Party members and one Mary Harney.

You can draw the Venn diagram yourself

Ah - too gnomic. The point is that "the government" in the sense of having procurement rules to follow, is actually the civil service. Neither FF as a party, nor the Cabinet as elected representatives, have to follow procurement rules.

cordially,
Scofflaw

dvpower

Scofflaw wrote: »

Do you believe there are no Irish companies capable of offering internet strategy?

cordially,
Scofflaw

I sure there are, but Blue State Digital are not a generalist company; they specialise in the political sphere.

Its not inconceivable that FF could have found a company or a collaboration of companies in Ireland that would have fulfilled their need, but would they have got one with the track record / client list of this one? Doubtful.

The seed of this bout of FF bashing was that FF were going abroad to buy a simple commodity (some website design) that is readily available in Ireland, but it turns out that its just a little bit more complex than that.


(Now I'm off to throw up - defending FF makes me feel a bit queasy)

Scofflaw

dvpower wrote: »

I sure there are, but Blue State Digital are not a generalist company; they specialise in the political sphere.

Its not inconceivable that FF could have found a company or a collaboration of companies in Ireland that would have fulfilled their need, but would they have got one with the track record / client list of this one? Doubtful.

The seed of this bout of FF bashing was that FF were going abroad to buy a simple commodity (some website design) that is readily available in Ireland, but it turns out that its just a little bit more complex than that.

(Now I'm off to throw up - defending FF makes me feel a bit queasy)

There are several companies in Ireland with longer track records in the internet/political arena, as well as a lot of home-grown talent in terms of creating public-participation websites (it's not all rockthevote). None of them were even contacted - this is purely a case of buying in talent from abroad because it is talent from abroad. It's not talent with any experience of Irish politics, Irish society, or the Irish online environment, and it's not talent with any track record in assisting an incumbent government to communicate with citizens through the web. It has one thing to its name - it did Obama's campaign.

I'm by no means bashing FF purely to bash FF here - I'm in the web development industry, so I know what talent is available here, and sufficient talent is certainly available here. How much credibility can FF have in saying "buy Irish" if they won't? And if "it was cheaper/better abroad" is a good excuse not to buy Irish, then the whole idea of "buying Irish" is meaningless.

cordially,
Scofflaw

AlekSmart

Late last week the Independent carried a piece on new jobs.....Something like 600 new jobs in a call centre in Armagh (Other side of the Land Frontier) and wait for it.........2.....yep T W O new jobs in Carlow.

I`m assuming Ms Coughlan is currently seeking advice from President McAleese on the intricacies of foreign diplomacy in an Irish context......

Or perhaps Carlow actually qualifies as foreign as it`s landlocked ???

Hillel

Scofflaw wrote: »

I'm by no means bashing FF purely to bash FF here - I'm in the web development industry, so I know what talent is available here, and sufficient talent is certainly available here. How much credibility can FF have in saying "buy Irish" if they won't? And if "it was cheaper/better abroad" is a good excuse not to buy Irish, then the whole idea of "buying Irish" is meaningless.

cordially,
Scofflaw

+1

Not only is suitable expertise available here, but many indigenous companies could do with the work and the exposure.

Anyway, they simply don't get it. First you need the political credibility, then smart use of technology can help you reach your core constituency.

dvpower

Hillel wrote: »

+1

Not only is suitable expertise available here, but many indigenous companies could do with the work and the exposure.

Certainly many indigenous companies could do with the work and the exposure and maybe FF, given their position, could have rejected their first choice in favour of an Irish company.

But thats business. Ireland is built on free trade (and despite the gloom, exports are holding up reasonably well) and protectionism for the sake of protectionism isn't going to do us any good.

The 'patriotic' argument was made in the context of people traveling up North for their groceries. It was largely a pointless argument in the first place, but in any case it has little relevance to FF's decision to buy this service from a US company so the hypocrisy charge is over egging it a bit. Are they to be held to the same standard for every other purchase they make; their office equipment, their stationery, the coffee in their canteen...? Could anyone who agreed with the 'patriotic' argument ever hope to reach the standard that are being asked of FF here?

dvpower

Scofflaw wrote: »

There are several companies in Ireland with longer track records in the internet/political arena

But none that worked on the Obama campaign, and I guess that's what attracted FF.

Scofflaw

dvpower wrote: »

Certainly many indigenous companies could do with the work and the exposure and maybe FF, given their position, could have rejected their first choice in favour of an Irish company.

But thats business. Ireland is built on free trade (and despite the gloom, exports are holding up reasonably well) and protectionism for the sake of protectionism isn't going to do us any good.

The 'patriotic' argument was made in the context of people traveling up North for their groceries. It was largely a pointless argument in the first place, but in any case it has little relevance to FF's decision to buy this service from a US company so the hypocrisy charge is over egging it a bit. Are they to be held to the same standard for every other purchase they make; their office equipment, their stationery, the coffee in their canteen...? Could anyone who agreed with the 'patriotic' argument ever hope to reach the standard that are being asked of FF here?

Did any of us stand up and call for people to "buy Irish" on national TV? Are anonymous posters on internet forums expected to set an example for the country?

My other problem is that I regard the choice as indicative of FF's lack of 'getting it'. Blue State don't have anything to their name but a campaign for a charismatic non-incumbent challenger, in a country with a totally different social and political structure. They've been brought in because they did something high-profile enough to catch the attention of a party that has resolutely failed to do anything innovative with the web while touting the Irish "knowledge economy" - and that's not for lack of talent and innovation here, because other Irish companies and groups have been innovative with their use of the web.

Blue State are here because they're American (Americans "get the web"!) - because the media said they were web wizards. I've been in the industry for a dozen years, and I've seen all this before - this is the standard response by companies whose senior management haven't a clue: hire the American or British guy the CEO saw on TV. Coming on top of a decade of failure to support innovative Irish businesses - instead of importing US companies - it makes me more than a little annoyed. The only thing that will be more heavily ironic is FF talking up "green industry" after their even more obvious failure to understand environmentalism.

cordially, though,
Scofflaw

Hillel

dvpower wrote: »

The 'patriotic' argument was made in the context of people traveling up North for their groceries.

Exactly! For the little people. Doesn't apply to our political master's.

But, seriously, it does send out all the wrong messages. I don't actually believe that it was thought through, but, there you go.

AlekSmart

OH my God Scofflaw..You are SO correct...

I had to sit through just such motivational stuff last year..."Play from a 10" .....!!

Jesus,we are told wept....he is one lucky man not to be walking abroad in this Republic right now !!!! :rolleyes:

Dannyboy83

jmayo wrote: »

Dear God clutching at straws. True for Margaret Ward they are fiddling (literally in more ways than one) while the country goes down the pan.



They can rub and rub but all that is coming out of their lamp is sh**e :rolleyes:
Compare the Obama genie with Biffo.
Yes I am sure there are similarities, well apart from both involved in the legal world and being able to trace their routes back to Offaly and Eastern Africa (in Biffos case a few million years ago ), but that's about it I reckon.

Obama would be seen as intellectual, sauve, sophisticated, passionate, with a message of change.
On the other hand Biffo looks like an overfed ould curmudgeon stuffed into a new ill fitting suit for the daughters wedding, supposedly using his superior intellectual but really just making a few smart quips and braying for all the world like a jackass in search of love.

Remember old adage "never a silk purse was made out of a sows ear"

BTW I always thought that FG were the blue party ?
Maybe FF are adopting a new colour as well, I suppose it is the Obama influence :rolleyes:

ROTFLCOPTERS!!!!!:pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac:

That had me in fcuking stitches:D

Dannyboy83

jim o doom wrote: »

Pretty sure they are required by law to issue tender to third parties; probably the US designer was cheaper - and government finances being crap, saving money everywhere is on the cards.

I can tell you for a fact that there are websites companies based in Slovakia and Romania (EU members), with equal expertise who do the job for one quarter of the cost.
I know this for a fact because a friend in my last company runs one on the side.
This is of course blatantly ignoring the exceptional talent in this country alone.

If they had issued, the contract would unlikely go anywhere West of Berlin.


Furthermore, given that BlueState designed the Obama website and are now celebrities, I find it difficult to believe that they would be the cheaper option - may be wrong now - but find it difficult to believe. (I've worked in roles in the past where my US based counterparts made double my salary for the same job)

Dannyboy83

Here is their newsletter.
I'd be interested to know who does it, anybody know?

I know that 10 Downing Street use a company in West Cork, the #1 SMB in Ireland and the European leader.

I feel a bit sick to be honest.

Dear s3xyB@st@rd,
I've just come off stage at Fianna Fáil's Ard Fheis, where I've outlined the difficult measures we're having to take to help return the country to growth. I was frank about the scale of the problems we face, but I'm optimistic about the ability of the Irish people to meet these challenges through the hard work and ingenuity we've always shown. We're a resilient and creative nation and we'll meet our challenges together.
You've heard from me, now I want to hear from you.
I'm asking each of you to submit a question for me, which I'll answer as many as I can via video right here on the new Fianna Fáil website. Submit your questions at:
http://www.fiannafail.com/askthetaoiseach
To better serve you, and to help lead us out of this recession, I want to hear what you thought of my speech, the questions you might have about some of the important measures I've announced and your ideas about how Fianna Fáil can set Ireland back on the road to growth and renewed prosperity.
Ask me questions - as directly as you want to - and I'll answer them in the clearest terms possible. I want to embrace a new openness and engage with you in honest conversation about the direction of the country. Post a question for me:
http://www.fiannafail.ie/askthetaoiseach
Our Ard Fheis is finishing up now and I'd like to thank the many thousands of Fianna Fail members who came and made their voices heard.
Wishing you and your family security in these difficult times,
Brian Cowen
Taoiseach
P.S. if you were unable to attend the Ard Fheis or missed the coverage on television and radio, we covered the event on our website and we'll be adding more speeches and video over the coming days.

I don't suppose these technological masterminds have heard of UTF-8


*chuckle*

Scofflaw

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

Here is their newsletter.
I'd be interested to know who does it, anybody know?

I know that 10 Downing Street use a company in West Cork, the #1 SMB in Ireland and the European leader.

Blue State Digital do the newsletter - it's in the email headers.

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

I feel a bit sick to be honest.

I don't suppose these technological masterminds have heard of UTF-8

*chuckle*

They're American - they've probably never had to deal with fadas.

cordially,
Scofflaw

Liam Byrne

Hillel wrote: »

I don't actually believe that it was thought through

Seems like FF are being consistent in all their decision-making lately, so!

Mind you, recession or not, if they'd asked me to quote for the job I'd probably have told them where to go......I'd prefer our name to be associated with reputable organisations.....

Liam Byrne

Scofflaw wrote: »

They're American - they've probably never had to deal with fadas.

And from the text of that newsletter, it seems like - having encountered a difficulty with the first fada, they chose to ignore consistency and leave out the second......

your ideas about how Fianna Fáil .....

I'd like to thank the many thousands of Fianna Fail members

BRILLIANT company if it can't even get its client's name right!

Anyway, you don't operate in a market that you don't understand or can't meet the needs of; next thing you know they'll be calling it an "organization" and doing a Paddy's day special about the "colour" green

As for asking US for ideas ..... f**k off, Brian......you've got enough overpriced w***kers on your wage bill with consulstants, think-tanks and quangos; if you want us to give you a heads-up on how to fix things, pay us what you're paying them!

Better still, quit and let one of us do your job.....if you can't think of ideas then you're as useless as a Financial Regulator......

Hillel

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

HI don't suppose these technological masterminds have heard of UTF-8


*chuckle*

+1
Wonder how'd they'd cope with Gaelic Characters and Polish Characters in the same newsletter.:D

jmayo

dvpower wrote: »

I sure there are, but Blue State Digital are not a generalist company; they specialise in the political sphere.

(Now I'm off to throw up - defending FF makes me feel a bit queasy)

BTW what do they know about Irish politics, or is just what ff told them ?
No sympathy for you about throwing up.

dvpower wrote: »

But thats business. Ireland is built on free trade (and despite the gloom, exports are holding up reasonably well) and protectionism for the sake of protectionism isn't going to do us any good.

The 'patriotic' argument was made in the context of people traveling up North for their groceries. It was largely a pointless argument in the first place, but in any case it has little relevance to FF's decision to buy this service from a US company so the hypocrisy charge is over egging it a bit. Are they to be held to the same standard for every other purchase they make; their office equipment, their stationery, the coffee in their canteen...? Could anyone who agreed with the 'patriotic' argument ever hope to reach the standard that are being asked of FF here?

You must be in ff, because you just don't get it :mad:
You can't one day tell people they should shop here, at greater expense, rather than going sometimes a few miles up the road and then a few weeks later go off to the states to hire a company to do work for you that Irish companies could do.
To most people that is a thing called hypocrisy.

Perhaps someone could ask Biffo on his webiste, Facebook page or whatever Offaly Auctioneers website his mug is plastered on, when will he ever f***off and take his incompetent shower of twats with him ?
That's the only answer I require

Sully

I had a good laugh at this thread, I must say. You would think that the party would focus their concerns elsewhere at the moment rather then paying out whatever amount of money for a new website and Internet strategy when there isn't even an election coming up (well, officially!).

I can understand if they had to go abroad as there was no Irish company specialising in this (I assume its more then just a website and other design services) and I think we would all have to understand this. However, I am sure there are Irish company's with this experience who can offer exactly what FF wanted - the whole political promotion strategy online to include a new properly designed website, bebo/facebook pages and other ways to get out there on the Internet. So its a bit rich for FF to be asking us to be patriotic when they shop abroad themselves for a product, which I think, can be obtained in Ireland. If it cant, well then fair enough.

To conclude... if a company outside of Ireland is dealing with the design and print for any election material then that is very insulting to the quality designers Ireland has. That hardly calls for specialist designers to be fair. But I don't think it does, as the other party's have graphic designers and printers all in their HQ.

scrumplod

Their was some kind of notince in the Sunday buiness Post that said a comapny in Dublin had been awarded a contract to do internet stratgey for the EU here! So their must be companies in Ireland that can do it. Heh, the EU buys Irish but FF doesnt. Says it all.