Definitely time for Tetra

Turner

Yes yes folks our outdated and unsecure radio system has made it onto youtube. Some member of the public recorded an 8 minute piece from the south radio channel in dublin.

We all know all the criminals and major gangland figures have scanners, hence all the testing of response times with bogus calls in preparation for their upcoming shootings/drug deals.

It really is time that the entire country switched to Tetra.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pn6osXIYz04

jimmycrackcorm

I can't understand why the Government didn't tender instead for one of the mobile operators to implement PTT technology for EMS which would cover the whole country.

Eru

Guy that posted that wasngt a criminal. Criminals wouldnt be so stupid highlighting the advantage they have (not after that phonecall)

Besides, its done us a favour. This will be in a paper just like the nypd offer of stab vests was. The government will be embarassed and have to admit they are solely to blame and therefore will get the finger out.

On top of that the calls on the radio might actually show people we do some work now and again and yes, sometimes were using lights and sirens for a genuine reason

metman

Only a matter of time before this wound up on youtube. Sad that this is obviously used as a source of entertainment by some people at home, though I can see why it'd be interesting to listen to as joe public (if only so as you could find out what's going on with the neighbours!).

Radio traffic/procedure quite similar to ours too.

Secure comms are a basic requirement and this old analogue system is a risk to officer safety.

shakin

good to hear what its like though, is it my computer or are radios hard to hear?
only concern is it gives address of where incidence happens

Gavin

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

I can't understand why the Government didn't tender instead for one of the mobile operators to implement PTT technology for EMS which would cover the whole country.

* If everything runs over the mobile phone network, if there is a natural disaster and the mobile phone network goes down, no communications.

* Difficult to organise inter-service communication

* It runs over a public network, so would have to be encrypted. This requires new handsets with encryption implemented, which is not trivial.

TETRA seems to be a good system, although at this stage it is somewhat outdated and more useful and probably cheaper technologies could be used.

santosubito

Fachtna Murphy told the Oireachtas joint committee on Justice, Equality, Defence and blah blah yesterday that the Tetra roll out was going to start in the first quarter of this year.
He said the systemn would be functional by "mid 2011". I'm struggling to read my crap shorthand, but it seems he said there would be 17,000 terminals - that must be handsets and base units or whatever - in operation by that time, with 12,000 oif them up and runing this year. He also said €27 million had been ringfenced for the contract.
And he also said there would be another roll out of PULSE, with elements for sex offenders, public order and missing persons.

Cars in the south central are currently having the Tetra radios fitted. Issuing of personal handsets is starting in March. Members have been given dates for training and issuing of sets. It's a start.

petergfiffin

Had a listen to that there and one thing that strikes me is how confusing it as to what units are where, I'm sure once you're used to it though it's easier. Just wondering though, does Tetra offer any GPS functionality? I know there was a bit of resistance before to cars and individually being tracked by GPS but surely it would make life a lot simpler/safer to know what units were available and where they were, something pretty standard now for many taxi and courier companies.

timmywex

petergfiffin wrote: »

Had a listen to that there and one thing that strikes me is how confusing it as to what units are where, I'm sure once you're used to it though it's easier. Just wondering though, does Tetra offer any GPS functionality? I know there was a bit of resistance before to cars and individually being tracked by GPS but surely it would make life a lot simpler/safer to know what units were available and where they were, something pretty standard now for many taxi and courier companies.

+1, the operator didnt know where units were or even what units were van units etc!

Tracking would be handy to send nearest resources etc etc

donvito99

The video has been removed by the user.

Random

donvito99 wrote: »

The video has been removed by the user.

Any chance someone else has a link? Very interested to hear some of the radio chatter to see what does go on

donvito99

http://www.police-scanner.info/live-police-scanners.htm

Not the video but an a fairly stupid site, listen to police radios online from many US cities!?!?

Eru

donvito99 wrote: »

The video has been removed by the user.

Presumable he was getting pressure, it is a crime afterall.

I dont see why GPS if an option should not be implemented. Hell, even if you dont see the purpose now take every option available so its there when we DO need it. Short term thinking is part of the Irish problem.

donvito99

GPS also helps if an officer gets into trouble and has to press the Emergency button yoke, saves him the hastle of having to state his location etc.

Gavin

GPS is a good idea. It'd be trivial to transmit the data over the TETRA data channel. Incorporate it into the personal unit and real time location of personnel becomes available back in HQ or wherever. The only cost would be the initial outlay for the device itself and the cost of incorporating it into PULSE. I'm sure Accenture would charge through the nose though.

edit - a TETRA radio incorporating a GPS reciever http://press.nokia.com/PR/200411/969801_5.html

Gavin

Gavin wrote: »

GPS is a good idea. It'd be trivial to transmit the data over the TETRA data channel. Incorporate it into the personal unit and real time location of personnel becomes available back in HQ or wherever. The only cost would be the initial outlay for the device itself and the cost of incorporating it into PULSE. I'm sure Accenture would charge through the nose though.

edit - a TETRA radio incorporating a GPS reciever http://press.nokia.com/PR/200411/969801_5.html

Is that not the model that's being used in the North Central Division??
THR880i

Holsten

Damn those radios are very hard to understand! Couldn't make anything out of that video.

metman

You attune your ear to it after a while so that you don't even have to listen but can pick out particular callsigns or messages.

Eru

foreign wrote: »

Is that not the model that's being used in the North Central Division??
THR880i

Yes and its ****. The old analogue thats in the video is easier to understand and doesnt lose reception as often.

Delphic

As a non-member, am curious about how the Tetra system is supposed to work. Whilst i realise there may be aspects of system that are necessarily confidential for security reasons, it seems that the Tetra system is almost outdated by the time it has rolled out. I understand from posts on here and reading the tetra material that what is needed is a secure means of communication between force members. And it needs to be able to talk to systems to other police networks. What about all the functionalities that a modern device should have - GPS, mapping, email, text, MMS, etc? Surely these would be useful to members instead of having to use their own mobys for calls, etc. Would it not make more sense to take an existing mobile model e.g. iPhone, Blackberry Storm, Googlephone that have these functions, encrypt them - like Secret Service did for Obama, and put whatever other network services are needed on them through Blackberry Enterprise or somehting equivalent? In an emergency situation, emergency services incl gardai get preferrd over normal calls anyway. Or how about the Nextels that they use in the States - combi mobile and W/T units?

Tetra seems to be a massive expenditure on something that is going to be outdated before it's fully up and running.

ScubaDave

Correct me if im wrong, but arent the PSNI moving on to some new system instead of tetra in the next few years?

alentejo

Tetra is in use by most emergency services around the world. The handsets and mobile devices on cars are similar everywhere, If a police officer can use them in Belgium, I am sure that the Garda are well capable of doing so too.

Tetra is designed as a multi-agency system which will eventually be used by the police, hse, fire, prison officers and some other agencies involved with public safety. There is the option for multi-agency usage so the GDA could communicate with fire etc, however I suspect that this would be limited to Senior Officers etc.

With regard to using mobile phone etc, most Tetra handsets have a dial out facility on to the PABX network, so a Garda on the beat could be able to dial telephone numbers.

The Tetra system will also be compatible with the Barracuda system which is used by the PSNI, however I suspect that this will be used on a very controlled basis.

Over all the tetra system would offer much better resilience that a traditional analogue system and the network has most likely being designed to accommodate base station failure i.e. if a base station fails, an alternate site should provide the same level of coverage (in most cases).

metman

Radio System

The problems arising for the Garda Síochána from the absence of a modern police radio system are already well documented. A reliable, secure and recordable radio system is an essential prerequisite to ensuring that an on-scene commander remains in contact with all relevant personnel both at the scene and elsewhere. The current Garda radio system is both inadequate and outdated in this regard. Thankfully, at the time of writing, contract arrangements for its replacement are at an advanced stage and the construction and roll-out of a new modern radio system is imminent.

The Inspectorate recommends that the planned digital radio system be implemented as a top priority in order to enhance the safety and effectiveness of front-line police officers. In the absence of a reliable, secure radio system, the Garda Síochána use a combination of the existing radio system, the internal ERU radio system and personal mobile phones to communicate during barricade incidents. This is understandable in the circumstances but it is recognised by the Gardaí themselves as being very far removed from best practice. There are inherent, serious risks involved in communications going to some officers and not to others at the scene of an incident involving firearms. There are also significant opportunities lost in situations where communications are not being recorded for subsequent evidentiary and training purposes.

The Inspectorate will deal more comprehensively with Garda information, communications and technology needs and policy in a forthcoming report. Pending that report, the Inspectorate strongly recommends that the Garda Commissioner immediately assign specific responsibility to an individual at a senior level to project manage the introduction of the new radio system to ensure that it comes into operation without further delay. The project manager should report regularly to the Commissioner on progress of implementing of the new system against an implementation programme agreed with the contractor.

This is from a report by the Garda Inspectorate published in February 2007. Good to see all the problems have been ironed out over the last two years.......:rolleyes:

cushtac

Eru wrote: »

Yes and its ****. The old analogue thats in the video is easier to understand and doesnt lose reception as often.

From what I've heard they're going with another model over the Nokia.

djtechnics1210

cushtac wrote: »

From what I've heard they're going with another model over the Nokia.

Ya there going with the other model that was on trial with the nokia ***, can't remember the name of it because iv never heard of brand before...... but low and behold, surprise surprise........ its cheaper than the nokia.

***members in different stations were given nokia handsets and other members were given the other handset to work with for a week and then swap over to other handset for a week and then report back on both of them to comms section, all the lads i know that were doing trial voted for nokia one***

towel401

Tetra has a direct-mode so it will work even if the network is down. mobile phones are very dumbed-down consumer devices, often with very poor build quality i dunno why anyone would want to use them for anything important

also the PTT used on some mobile phones relies on GPRS and a special VoiP server so it is more of a gimmick for teenage kids than anything else. nextel is also notoriously unreliable. i seen them being used and they were sh!te

metman

towel401 wrote: »

Tetra has a direct-mode

Which eats up battery in no time!

cushtac

djtechnics1210 wrote: »

***members in different stations were given nokia handsets and other members were given the other handset to work with for a week and then swap over to other handset for a week and then report back on both of them to comms section, all the lads i know that were doing trial voted for nokia one***

That's funny, anyone I've talked to picked this one over the Nokia.

FGR

Either way it will be the cost that'll determine the handset we're provided.

That and how good the tea and biccies are in each respective rep's office!

deadwood

ForegoneReality wrote: »

That and how good the tea and biccies are in each respective rep's office . . . . . . . . in Spain!

Edit.

towel401

metman wrote: »

Which eats up battery in no time!

better than nothing when the **** hits the fan

Whitewater-AGS

Ive seen lads in the castle using both the nokia and a motorola haedset, personally i've only used the nokia thought it was a good piece of kit.

donvito99

I know this is a seriously old thread to bring up but what the heck...

In the patrol cars theres a radio. Whats the point? Surely you could just use your own personal issue/whatever radio instead.

Or is the radio in the car tuned to the District HQ and your personal radio to your own station?

I notice in those British Police programs they generally just use their own personal radios.

Or is this info so confidential that I have to sign the Official Secrets Act or something?!

pvt.joker

radios in the car would be tuned to control, your personal ones would usually be set to your own districts radio, although it can be changed to control either

donvito99

pvt.joker wrote: »

cars in the radio would be tuned to control, your personal ones would usually be set to your own districts radio, although it can be changed to control either

lol! Thanks Private.

searescue

Where I am living in Kerry, the guards often just use their mobile phones as they are aware of all the listening in that occurs. They'll use radios for normal stuff but mobiles for 999 calls etc. which is ridiculous that they have to resort to that.

SR

Hooch

Thread closed.

Tetra is not for public debate and is an outdated thread.